What if this is as good as it gets ????

Here is my last thread:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2309850&page=1

Hey all been a while since I been here. You all know we spent Xmas together it didn�t lead to much. She also came to my brothers house on New Years Eve with me but at midnight she ran in the other room so fast and completely ignored me for the rest of night.

Things have been friendly at home � but still this horrible lonely emptiness � she is still on the couch � still going out very late. Still smoking up a storm.

I have been working out very hard, working very hard, taking good care of my son and the house as much as I can anyway. I am working 2 jobs.

I go out on weekends to � I hate doing it but I won�t just sit around waiting for her anymore.

I mentioned I go to therapy (not my DB coach who I haven�t used since Oct) and my therapist wants me to start addressing the relationship I told her it is against DB principles but she said I agree with a lot of it � it is not working.

There are 3 things my therapist wants me to address
1- She got a wedding invitation from her cousin it was addressed Mrs. XXXXX XXXXX & Guest � she thinks this is rude and inappropriate since we are still married. Her parents, her sister and her husband and her other sister are coming up the last week of March and staying in the house to go to the wedding they are going to the wedding in New Jersey and staying at the hotel the wedding is at overnight she told me I have to stay home to watch our son.

2- She also just ordered 1500 checks for our joint checking account we pay 98% of our bills online � so why so many checks.

3 - We are looking at new furniture.

Like I said I don�t want to address these things and just act like everything is normal. She feels that me taking this abusive behavior is very bad and I have to start standing up for myself.

Is it time for a new therapist � I pray all the time in October I prayed to God that He guide her and I would do whatever she tells me � I needed one person to listen to and I was getting to confused � is God telling me to address these things through her ??? I tell her this is all from the MLC play book but she says you can�t use that stuff for everything.

Thanks for listening I appreciate any advice,

Sunny

Hey Sunny!
I do have to agree w/your therapist that is extremely rude to address a wedding invitation to your wife and guest, especially when you are still married and living under the same roof.

If her family didn't want you at the wedding in Florida, why are they now coming to the home and staying there? Is she planning for you to stay in a hotel or what? When did she become your mother and tell you that you have to stay home and watch your son? I realize you love being w/your son, but your wife shouldn't dictate what you should or shouldn't do. I think I would have had to call her on that one.

Well, it's interesting that she's ordered that many checks since you do most of your bill paying on line. Maybe she's forgotten that you do that or maybe she's planning an escape and is going to use checks. You know, when they act like teenagers, they tend to forget that you have to have money in the account and writing checks doesn't mean it's a bottomless money pit.

Why are you looking at new furniture right now? Don't you want to be sure that the two of you are going to be living under the same roof for while? Many times the mlcer wants to go on shopping sprees and then ups and leaves. I don't know about this one, but if you are working two jobs, this little venture would be put on the back burner for a while to see how things go.

I do have to agree w/your therapist...you do not need to be your wife's punching bag, i.e., the abusive behavior. I do think you need to do some 180's and just let her know that enough is enough.

Sunny, there comes a time when you do have to take a stand and if money is tight, you shouldn't go along w/her idea of purchasing furniture and I would definitely question her about the check order. As for her family coming to stay in your home...a hotel would be where they would stay after what happened with the Florida wedding.

If something isn't working, try something else. The most damage you can do is she move out. Right now, that probably wouldn't be such a bad idea because she's got it made in the shade while you are doing all of the work. She's cake eating.

Hi Sunny! I'd like to start by saying Snodderly always gives good advice, also I think you need to take a moment and breath.

You said that you have been praying for guidance, like with your counselor/therapist, and who to listen to.... I wonder if you are listening to the answers you are getting from God. I say this because I know EXACTLY what you mean, I've prayed the same things. You will know when the answers truly come from God, you will feel it.

Sometimes in conversations with H I may have not been very DB, or did/said exactly what my counselor said to, but I always did the best I could and what I felt I needed to. Yeah, I may have yelled at him a few times, and that might not have been the best, but I'm human and well, sometimes they need a reality check, they sometimes need to see we are NOT as ok as it appears all the time, this does affect us, and it freaking svcks.

I remember knowing H was going to want to have a talk several months ago, I remember praying in the shower, asking God to give me the words to say, and he did, because without His guidance, I have NO idea what I would have said, but it just came to me.

Also, sometimes we have to be still and wait, that's a hard one, and one I have to do a lot of right now, it really is a balancing act sometimes Sunny.

I agree with Snodderly, the issues you pointed out need to be addressed, you just need to remember she will get pissed, probably even super pissed, but that's ok. Teenagers don't like to think about other people, so it's expected.

Just keep breathing Sunny, and being the best you for you! You Rock!!!

>>>>>>>>>>>Hey Sunny!
I do have to agree w/your therapist that is extremely rude to address a wedding invitation to your wife and guest, especially when you are still married and living under the same roof.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Thanks Snodderly but how do I address this ???

>>>>>>>>>>If her family didn't want you at the wedding in Florida, why are they now coming to the home and staying there? Is she planning for you to stay in a hotel or what? When did she become your mother and tell you that you have to stay home and watch your son? I realize you love being w/your son, but your wife shouldn't dictate what you should or shouldn't do. I think I would have had to call her on that one.<<<<<<<<<<

No actually they are all staying out our house but the night of the wedding they are all staying at the hotel the wedding is at � they want me to stay home with my son. Her family staying over without me making a big stink is a huge 180 for me I would carry on like a butthead whenever they would stay so it�s something that really hurt her.

>>>>>>>>>>>Why are you looking at new furniture right now? Don't you want to be sure that the two of you are going to be living under the same roof for while? Many times the mlcer wants to go on shopping sprees and then ups and leaves. I don't know about this one, but if you are working two jobs, this little venture would be put on the back burner for a while to see how things go.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

I agree I just told her we spent so much money already I need to wait a while but I want to say why did we put in the kitchen and looking at furniture if we are splittling up � also not sure what to say to address this ---

>>>>>>>>>I do have to agree w/your therapist...you do not need to be your wife's punching bag, i.e., the abusive behavior. I do think you need to do some 180's and just let her know that enough is enough. Sunny, there comes a time when you do have to take a stand and if money is tight, you shouldn't go along w/her idea of purchasing furniture and I would definitely question her about the check order. As for her family coming to stay in your home...a hotel would be where they would stay after what happened with the Florida wedding. If something isn't working, try something else. The most damage you can do is she move out. Right now, that probably wouldn't be such a bad idea because she's got it made in the shade while you are doing all of the work. She's cake eating. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

I find it funny that when I came here I couldn�t keep my mouth shut now I am afraid to say anything � and I am SCARED OUT OF MY MIND to address her on this stuff. I just don�t know how to approach any of this � she was outside on the phone last night at 11:30 last night � so prolly now there is another man involved to � I am just so sick of this $hit already � thanks for any advice you can lend.

Sunny

Originally Posted By: hrm134

Hi Sunny! I'd like to start by saying Snodderly always gives good advice, also I think you need to take a moment and breath.

You said that you have been praying for guidance, like with your counselor/therapist, and who to listen to.... I wonder if you are listening to the answers you are getting from God. I say this because I know EXACTLY what you mean, I've prayed the same things. You will know when the answers truly come from God, you will feel it.
Sometimes in conversations with H I may have not been very DB, or did/said exactly what my counselor said to, but I always did the best I could and what I felt I needed to. Yeah, I may have yelled at him a few times, and that might not have been the best, but I'm human and well, sometimes they need a reality check, they sometimes need to see we are NOT as ok as it appears all the time, this does affect us, and it freaking svcks.

I remember knowing H was going to want to have a talk several months ago, I remember praying in the shower, asking God to give me the words to say, and he did, because without His guidance, I have NO idea what I would have said, but it just came to me.

Also, sometimes we have to be still and wait, that's a hard one, and one I have to do a lot of right now, it really is a balancing act sometimes Sunny.

I agree with Snodderly, the issues you pointed out need to be addressed, you just need to remember she will get pissed, probably even super pissed, but that's ok. Teenagers don't like to think about other people, so it's expected.

Just keep breathing Sunny, and being the best you for you! You Rock!!!

Thanks HRM - I guess it's time to address things but I have gotten so good at just ignoring her - now that I press her she might run away and I am afraid of that I don't want to get divorced I want to stay married and I want to see my son everyday. I have been lacking in my praying too stupid me I just start to feel so hopeless sometimes I am busy and stuff making a life but I still feel like I want my wife back really bad. Thank you for your help I appreciate it

Sunny

Sunny,
Whether you say something or not, if she opts to run away, she will. She's using all of her "tools" to keep you hoping and doing what she wants because she knows that you'll do everything humanly possible to keep her happy and in the home.

You need to think about when is a good time to just sit down and have a nice chat. I would start out discussing the check order. I would thank her for ordering checks, but why did she order so many and then point out that you aren't using many checks these days because of online bill payment. Be sure to acknowledge that she order them and thank her for it.

As for her family. If they are staying at a hotel, that's one thing, but I would tell her that as much as you love to spend time w/your son, you thought it would nice if your family had some time w/him while they were in town. You'll have to be creative on this one. But I would let her know that you may have plans yourself and a sitter would need to be arranged or she take the child with her. You do not want to be the "babysitter" every time she decides she's going out.

Pray on this before you do it. God always has a way of openning the door so that you can have the conversation. Remain cool, calm and collected and no arguing. State the facts and go from there. Do not allow her to goad you into an argument. Man up, back straight and it's a business negotiation going on. Keep the emotions out of it.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Whether you say something or not, if she opts to run away, she will. She's using all of her "tools" to keep you hoping and doing what she wants because she knows that you'll do everything humanly possible to keep her happy and in the home.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Oh is that what it is I was wondering why she is not leaving she obviously doesn't love me anymore

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>You need to think about when is a good time to just sit down and have a nice chat. I would start out discussing the check order. I would thank her for ordering checks, but why did she order so many and then point out that you aren't using many checks these days because of online bill payment. Be sure to acknowledge that she order them and thank her for it.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Ok thanks

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>As for her family. If they are staying at a hotel, that's one thing, but I would tell her that as much as you love to spend time w/your son, you thought it would nice if your family had some time w/him while they were in town. You'll have to be creative on this one. But I would let her know that you may have plans yourself and a sitter would need to be arranged or she take the child with her. You do not want to be the "babysitter" every time she decides she's going out.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

I never used to let her spend time with her family without me being there I would give her a hard time - but this is a wedding and I feel like I should be going with her - I don't understand why she continues to have no problem embarassing me.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Pray on this before you do it. God always has a way of openning the door so that you can have the conversation. Remain cool, calm and collected and no arguing. State the facts and go from there. Do not allow her to goad you into an argument. Man up, back straight and it's a business negotiation going on. Keep the emotions out of it.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

MAN UP - geezz I went from being Atilla the Hun to Pocahontas don't understand why I am so afraid to speak up thanks

You are afraid that she will bolt. It's understandable. However, you can't allow her to treat you like the bug exterminator either. Pick a time that appears good to have a chat and do it. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. At least she'll become aware of how you feel about things. Don't be surprised if she gets angry or acts all defensive...it's the normal behavior for mlcers. Stay cool, calm and collected. Do not raise your voice...keep your voice even and calm.

Originally Posted By: snodderly

You are afraid that she will bolt. It's understandable. However, you can't allow her to treat you like the bug exterminator either. Pick a time that appears good to have a chat and do it. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. At least she'll become aware of how you feel about things. Don't be surprised if she gets angry or acts all defensive...it's the normal behavior for mlcers. Stay cool, calm and collected. Do not raise your voice...keep your voice even and calm.

Do you think I should say $hit or get off the pot - why are you planning a future with me when you want to seperate ??? This is what I was thinking.

No, you do not want to say those things. If you do, you are setting yourself up for disappointment and she will then really think about bolting. Keep to the facts 1) ordering a large number of checks; 2) furniture purchase; and 3) the wedding and you being told that you are to babysit son.

Nothing more than those things right now.

Originally Posted By: snodderly

No, you do not want to say those things. If you do, you are setting yourself up for disappointment and she will then really think about bolting. Keep to the facts 1) ordering a large number of checks;

Glad I checked with you because thats what my therapist told me to do she said tell her no more working on the house or spending money unless you want to work on the marriage

[/quote]2) furniture purchase and 3) the wedding and you being told that you are to babysit son. [/quote]

the furniture is taken care of

Me watching my son doesn't bother me so much her getting an invitation with GUEST bothers me - I already asked her if I was invited she just didn't answer me - so I need to bring it up again

I am unsure how to approach it

You'll find a way to broach the subject of the "guest" invitation. God always gives up a way to do so. It may come when you least expect it.

Mlcer do not do well w/ultimatums Had you given her one about the furniture and house, she very well may have chosen to walk rather than work on the marriage. They always take the easiest way out of things.

Spend time w/your son and enjoy him as long as you can. They grow up so quickly.

Sunny
I have not been around in a while but I do check in from time to time. You continue to get some very good advice for Snodderly and others.

Quote:

I go out on weekends to � I hate doing it but I won�t just sit around waiting for her anymore

Why do you �hate doing it�? Why do you feel like you are sitting around waiting for her?
Standing is not about standing still! Personally, you should not be sitting around waiting for her. You should be figuring out what you want in YOUR life. You should be doing things that bring you closer to YOUR dreams. Things to do not involve your W. Oh�if you hate going out, then don�t.
Sunny, your post screams FEAR, which I totally understand. You are praying but do YOU trust God? Do you think God wants you to feel the way you are feeling? I would bet not � that said, what are doing to not feel this way?

Quote:

Do you think I should say $hit or get off the pot

Personally, I think you want to say this but your not ready�not yet. Never ask a question that you are not ready for the answer to. Are you really ready for her to say..�yeah..F it, I�m outta here�? I bet not. Think for a second here�.are you asking HER to make the CHOICE for you?
Before you ask a question�before you talk to your W..even if it is to discussion the issues you want to talk about, consider this�
1) What is your goal of the conversation?
2) Are you having the conversation, so that you can try to manipulate, persuade, control or guilt her?
3) Are you skimping on your ability to make a choice and putting the pressure on her to make on?
4) Does this conversation align with YOUR goals (note � not HERS � YOURS!)
5) Deep down inside are you afraid of the answer you will receive?
6) Do you really need an answer from her?
7) Is the conversation worthwhile � will it add to your stress or reduce it?
Sunny � we cannot control or change someone. We can only control and change ourselves. Life is short buddy�.try and spend it happy.
God Bless,
Eric

Thank you for all your help my worst fear has come true my wife met a new guy on Sat and called him 44 times during the week and had sex with him - told her its over - we spoke this morning and she told me she was lonely - she said I asked you almost a year ago to move out - so I told her to get her attorney and I made an appointment with a lawyer. God Bless those of you who have hung in there so long but after 2 years of being the best I can possibly be she can do this and still tell me I am the worst husband in the world I don't get - I thank you for all your help and I will keep you posted on the progress.

DB is to pain full a way to live for me I see no progress or changes I think its time for me to go.

Sunny

I am so sorry for you and your son. Don't move out. She should be the one to leave the home since she's the one having the affair and can't seem to find herself.

You have to do what is right for you. We will stand behind you in whatever you opt to do.

Sunny,

Just saw your post and wanted to say I am so sorry for the whole situation.

Those who are more knowledgable than I will come along and offer advice. Try to sit quietly for a few minutes and let it all sink in and formulate your plan.

We are here for you.

Sunny, I'm so sorry to hear of the recent events and all the pain you are in. I agree with snodderly, whatever you do, don't move out of your home. It will be even more painful if you do.

I'm sending strength your way...

Quote:

Don't move out. She should be the one to leave the home since she's the one having the affair and can't seem to find herself.

I agree, especially since you just re-did the kitchen and all. I'm sorry you have to go through this.

You have to do what you need to do, SB...and DB isn't just for trying to restore your M, it's also for you and you going forward. Heck, I use DB with co-workers, bosses, customers...its a part of life now.

Hang in there for you and your son during this next phase!

T^2

Sunny, I hope you don't leave the home or this board. You have friends. I know you have to do what's right for you, but remember this whole MLC thing can change on a dime. Read my recent events!

Your W sounds like a very sad, lonely lady. Your son is lucky to have you--and so is W even though she can't see it right now.

Let her do the work. If she wants the big D, then let her move out. The reality of doing something is very different than fantasizing about it.

Since you told her it's over, don't let her think otherwise even if you begin to reconsider.

I made a bucket list this weekend and it really helped my frame of mind. I began to remember things I WANT to do with MY LIFE.

Hang in there,

Heather

Sunny, I am sorry for your recent events as well. Please don't move out, you have done nothing wrong. This stuff takes time to process and it is painful, I have cried rivers on this trip but you'll be a better person for having having to go through it. Trust me. I remember this Thanksgiving sitting with friends and they asked what I was thankful for, I replied:
"My family, my friends, and the challenges that God gives us, for without them we will never grow."

Trust yourself. You are the lighthouse.

Thanks to all I have never felt this dead inside before - seeing lawyer Friday 2/1 soonest appointment I can get -

Originally Posted By: ericmsant2

Sunny
1) What is your goal of the conversation?
2) Are you having the conversation, so that you can try to manipulate, persuade, control or guilt her?
3) Are you skimping on your ability to make a choice and putting the pressure on her to make on?
4) Does this conversation align with YOUR goals (note � not HERS � YOURS!)
5) Deep down inside are you afraid of the answer you will receive?
6) Do you really need an answer from her?
7) Is the conversation worthwhile � will it add to your stress or reduce it?
Sunny � we cannot control or change someone. We can only control and change ourselves. Life is short buddy�.try and spend it happy. God Bless, Eric

Didn't mean to ignore you eric but in my church your spouse has to cheat or leave - I can't do it so I had to sit and wait now that she has had an affair I can part.

i also established boundaries - I told her that if she wants to date and have sex she has to leave the house. And I told her her family can not stay in the house for the cousins wedding

Keep to your boundaries and do not waiver. If you do, she will know that you are bluffing.

Hang in there!

She told me she will date and f$ck anyone she wants she said boundries what am i a child she has no problem sleeping around and stsying here what do i do.
We had words last night I didn't do so well lost all the D B ing I did since Oct in one night questioned about the kit cell phone check books she told me that since we were living here we May as well be comfortable.
She left her phone open with the messages right there that talked about the affair and berated me for looking at them I told her ur my wife I have a right to oh big mistake she is seeing her lawyer tomorrow texted the guy over 300 times in a week and over 60 phone calls she tells me she did it because she was lonely like I'm not pfffft

Sunny,
I know you are spinning from what she's said and done, but you need to put your foot on the floor and stop spinning. She's baiting you so that you'll do or say something that she can use against you. She's hoping you'll get so angry and leave...don't do it.

If she's staying in the house, there's nothing you can do, but ensure that you and your son are okay. There's nothing you can do about her being there. However, you do not need to be footing her spending sprees, etc.

Contact your lawyer asap and see what your options are and do not discuss them with her.

I am seeing lawyer but she is like you can't keep me locked up so do I back pedal now and let her go out ??? She said if I can't go out u can't either so do I stay and watch my son and let her run
Wish I hadn't said I saw the messages what a mess I created should have come here first but can't go back now

You don't have any control over your wife and if she wants to go out, she's going to do it. Step back and cease trying to tell her what to do because it's only going to make things worse. You only have control over you and your son.

Let her go, but document everything because you may need that documentation down the road.

However, I would not back down about the inlaws...they should still stay in a hotel.

If you need to go out, get a babysitter and do not rely on her.

We talked about going to a mediator so we don't run up insane fees so I think we are going Friday she is in love with this guy

Make a list of the questions you need answers to for Friday. Well, if she thinks she's in love w/the man, there's nothing you can do but let her go and sit on the curb w/a bag of popcorn and watch the parade go by. I'm so sorry that things are going badly for you. On another note, if they get enough of each other, the affair may just die a natural death for them.

Hang in there. I know it's scary and you are disgusted, but take it one day at a time.

Originally Posted By: SunnyBurst

We talked about going to a mediator so we don't run up insane fees so I think we are going Friday she is in love with this guy

Just got cuaght up on your sitch Sunny. I am so sorry. I know how painful this is. Yes, try a mediator first if you can. I wanted that route but my W wants litigation and it is getting uglier and the fees are indeed insane. Just don't let her bully though through this process because she will try just as she has been and a good mediator should not let that happen. If you feel a sense of that then you may need another route.
She may believe she is in love with this guy because it is all new, like it was with you years ago. What she does not know is that this wll go away and she will carry her issues well into this R or any others she has. You look after yourself, keep BDing. Her issues are hers to deal with. We are with you pal.

Originally Posted By: snodderly

Make a list of the questions you need answers to for Friday. Well, if she thinks she's in love w/the man, there's nothing you can do but let her go and sit on the curb w/a bag of popcorn and watch the parade go by. I'm so sorry that things are going badly for you. On another note, if they get enough of each other, the affair may just die a natural death for them.Hang in there. I know it's scary and you are disgusted, but take it one day at a time.

Thanks Snod I think they are gonna end up married though she is so in love I can see it - she used to look that way for me -- Mediator Tuesday 10:00am please pray for me all

I just wanted to add to the above great advice to look at this as pure "business"...keep the emotions, anger, etc in check...hard in check. You're a businessman Sunny, try to treat it as as former customer taking you to court or something like that...she knows you and how to push your buttons, don't let her do that.

Tsquares thank you for not reprimanding for bringing up the affair I know I should have let it play out because now once we go to the lawyer it's pretty much a done deal
I have trouble reconciling the fact of how much to take though adultery is part of the process this is so far off from her normal behavior
I asked her stupidly does you having sex while married in the back of a car sound like something you would do she said its the 20th century I don't consider myself married to u anymore no remorse like she just went out and had a cup of coffee
I think if I could go back to yesterday morning I would have waited to spring it on her but I have been holding so much in part of me still wants to reconcile my therapist told me you want to reconcile with the person ur wife was not what she is now
I can't believe I still care but I freakin still do

Hi Sunny,

I didn't bring up the affair because her OTHER actions (or desired actions) you reported really put the affair as a secondary concern in my mind.

-The check order, and "might as well have fun" statement
-The new furniture thing
-This whole wedding, in-laws thing
-etc, etc

All that while "I don't consider myself married to u anymore"...oh, so she wants new furniture, and yet still wants to kick you out of the house with that new furniture for her enjoyment? This kind of stuff would be more problematic for me than the affairs at this point, no one wants to be used so blatantly, know what I mean?

There is a pattern there, imo. I can't blame you at all for reaching your limit, and maybe your sitch is one that the mlc'er needs reality to bite them hard. Idk.

In answer to your post on Hopper's thread, you aren't a meddling fool, you are doing the best you can, and add in the above stuff, well...

We are here to support you, I can't judge another for their "enough" decision, and now that you are there, I want you to be the best you can be and get what is right and fair for you and your son.

Hang in there, remember, with D, anything you say or do can/will be used against you...calm, cool, collected business man from here on out...don't play into her games and manipulations...you are better than that, and she WILL try everything in her arsenal most likely....I hope I am wrong though.

T^2

We talked this morning about custody etc. I am kinda lucky she wants out FAST - this thing with the other guy is high power they text appx 70 - 80 times a day and speak a few times ( I have access to the cell phone account I can't see what she is saying but I can see how many texts they send ) she want out fast cuz she want to be with this man.

We live in a state where everthing is mandated so we both get what we get - there really is no other way in my state.

BTW we were also redoing the bathroom in March - not anymore LOL

I think she was unsure she could find anyone or anyone better - this man is divorced with 4 kids so she ain't with him for the money.

She is not gonna have it easy my child support payment won't be anything huge - she is gonna have to pay rent, utilies etc.

I just know NOW that I should have let it play out cuz now the ball is rolling extremely fast !!!

Sunny

Originally Posted By: TSquared2

All that while "I don't consider myself married to u anymore"...oh, so she wants new furniture, and yet still wants to kick you out of the house with that new furniture for her enjoyment? This kind of stuff would be more problematic for me than the affairs at this point, no one wants to be used so blatantly, know what I mean?

She told me this morning you made me screw you because you didn't move out in March when I asked you too. -

Like you said what is done is done !! -- But T2 - the best way to save the marriage would have been to ignore it.

Quote:

She told me this morning you made me screw you because you didn't move out in March when I asked you too. -

Complete, utter, BS...do not believe this for a nanosecond...she had a choice, she chose to use you, Sunny...just say, "That was your choice to use me, W" if it comes up again.

Keep your character, Sunny...keep to the high road. For YOU and your son.

Quote:

the best way to save the marriage would have been to ignore it.

Just thinking on this...here are my reasons to ignore (as much as possible) W's affair behavior:
-For my own mental health
-To keep to the high road
-To not push them to the OP
-To allow time for the OP to show their true colors
-Take some of the "forbidden excitement" out
-To confuse them <evil grin> lol
-Then maybe, maybe, it just might help save the marriage

I am sure there are other reasons...

Just philosophizing here...

Sunny
Man I am so sorry. I can only imagine the pain you are feeling. It is like being punched in the gut.
You have received some very good advice for many people.

I want you to stop for a second and just breath. I know how hard it is...but please�just stop for one second as you continue to read this.

��breath�.

��breath�..

�.breath�.

Okay, now I want you to take a step back and as hard as it is, think of SUNNY...and SUNNY Jr.
Just the two of you. Think happy thought�.okay breath again�. Sunny, it will be okay! It really will be bro�It may not feel like it right now but it will. You my man, will GET THROUGH this.

Okay, I hope now you have a ton of happy thoughts going around in your head�.cause I want you to be in the right frame of mind for this next topic.

Divorce

First off, I want you to consider a few things right now.

She is not your friend. The woman that you married no longer exists � she MAY be in there but who knows.

She does not have YOUR best interest in mind. She may or may not have your son best interest in mind.

She is not going to think of herself or her actions as selfish.

Trying to talk reasonably to her is NOT going to help.

VERY IMPORTANT � Stop talking to her. You can listen�but if asked for your response�a simple �I need to think about it�. My point DO NOT COMMIT to anything. When I say stop talking to her...I mean totally. This is not the time to be nice and friendly. A business like attitude is a MUST.

Quote:

remember, with D, anything you say or do can/will be used against you...calm, cool, collected business man from here on out...don't play into her games and manipulations...you are better than that, and she WILL try everything in her arsenal most likely....I hope I am wrong though

Read this ^^^^ over and over again.

Do you know what �dying on a sword�, �Martyr�, �subtle manipulation� means?

I say this because as much as you may feel that if you cave and give her everything that she just may wake up�it ain�t happening � at least not now. You really need to think about YOUR life after this. You need to think about YOUR son and YOU � NOT her.

I am not saying that you need to be an as*hole. Nope. As a matter of fact, if you think about it�by not saying a word�and I mean not one word� you can�t be a hole.
I would not leave the house. Under no circumstances. That home is the home of you and your son. If you want to sell it after she leaves, fine, but not now.

Sunny, what is it that you want or better said what is it that you are willing to live with right now?
Do you want 50/50 custody of your son?

If so, then how will you achieve this? How will you deal with after school stuff, day care, doctor visits�.you need to have these answers READY for the mediator. The most important person here is not YOU and not HER�it is YOUR SON. FTR, I have my daughter about 55-60% of the time (she is 11), I have my middle son about 65% of the time (he is 17) and I have my oldest 100% of the time (he is 19). I say this because I am for the most part the primary care giver for the kids. It can be done. It may not feel like that right now �but it can be done. You just need to plan for it.

What days do you want your son. Personally, I would suggest that you pick two days during the week that are consistent and then every other full weekend (Friday � Mon morning). Whatever you do it needs to work for YOU and HIM. Remember these words�.

�What is in the best interest of little Sunny�?

Every action you take, every decision you make�should be with �what is in the best interest of little sunny� in mind. The second decision factor should be �what is in the best interest of ME�. This should drive your choices.

Right now as hard as it will feel�.�FU*K her�. That�s right�.�F*ck her�. She should not matter. Her needs/wants�they should not matter. What matters is what is best for YOU and YOUR SON.
You really need a plan my friend. The parent plan should be the first thing. If you need to put your son in day care, well then she should pay for half of the cost, If you want to keep your son in the home that he is in, well then she should have to pay for it (or better said, your son should not have to change his life because of HER choices).
So sunny here are few questions for you�
1) What is your parenting plan?
2) What times are drop off and pick up?
3) What are your plans for the holidays? Who has your son on x-mas, x-mas eve, etc.
4) What are your plans for early dismissal from school?
5) What are you plans for after school care?
6) Birthdays?
7) Who will carry medical insurance for your son?
8) College � who will pay for it?
9) Housing, where will your son live. FTR, PLEASE DO NOT GIVE UP PRIMARY RESIDENCE (a legal term) UNLESS it is in the best interest of YOUR SON.
10) What about household furniture?
11) What about clothing for your son
I know this may seem like a lot buddy�.but if you have a sit down on Tuesday, then you need to know what you are going to want.
Finally � I would NOT agree to anything unless it is truly what you want. For example, she says�I don�t want my son, you can have him. Well then your next question/comment should be�okay draft it, sign it and file it.
Are you on the alt?
Eric

Sunny, while I was typing my response you posted...so I have a few more questions.

1) What state are you in?

2) When you say everything is mandated...what does that mean?

3) No fault state or fault state

Oh...one more comment....do NOT allow HER to RUSH YOU. YOu take your time and think thing through. She wants out to be with OM, well she can pack up and leave today. Her needs are NOT your problem or issue anymore.

Eric

Originally Posted By: ericmsant2

Sunny, while I was typing my response you posted...so I have a few more questions.
1) What state are you in? 2) When you say everything is mandated...what does that mean? 3) No fault state or fault state Oh...one more comment....do NOT allow HER to RUSH YOU. YOu take your time and think thing through. She wants out to be with OM, well she can pack up and leave today. Her needs are NOT your problem or issue anymore. Eric

Actually I am rushing her -- LOL --- she is getting residence I will see SUNNY JR one night a week for dinner and do to my work schedule I will get him every other Saturday night and pick drop him off Sunday night. She gets 17% of my salaries for child support thats mandated. We sell the house pay off our credit card debt and split the proceeds - we split our 401k's pretty much simple stuff really. I think one of the reasons I stayed in this sitch so long was my guilty of being such a selfish controlling husband but I know I really stepped up to the plate and did as well as I could - for 24 months is the best I can do she must be on the 5 year MLC she is deep in the tunnel and I can't be the best me living with her.
T squared the ONLY regret I have is not keeping this affair thing to myslef - we had an arguement on Tuesday night about dating with my son in the house and guess what - she ran out the door and into his arms -- so I should have kept the info cloase to the vest - maybe the affair would have ended and she would have seen something - don't know - the thing is me getting angry and saying get a lawyer made it happen immediately - I didn't take time to think it through - and that is a problem for me as a person - it's a weakness and
I gave into it - I tend to make things huge in my head and go over them again and again.

Now we go forward all hope and prayers - trusing in the bigman up there and I can' not tell you ALL what your love - support and words have done for me -

Much Much Love,

Sunny

is that the worst job of spelling, grammer and punctuation I have ever seen !!

that is -- oye !!!

Quote:

she is getting residence I will see SUNNY JR one night a week for dinner and do to my work schedule I will get him every other Saturday night and pick drop him off Sunday night.

Is this ^^^ what You want?

Originally Posted By: ericmsant2

Quote:

she is getting residence I will see SUNNY JR one night a week for dinner and do to my work schedule I will get him every other Saturday night and pick drop him off Sunday night.

Is this ^^^ what You want?

With my 2 jobs and work schedule its the best I can do - good point to make some flexibility in it I will think of a strategy or some kind of flexibility in it.

I am such an ass - she told me she was going out tomorrow and I asked her with who - she said none of your business and I asked what the name of the guy she was having the affair withs name was she told me none of your business
She said we are not married it's just a piece of paper I don't love you we are done - let both get on with our lives I am not putting a relationship on hold just because of a peice of paper - date whoever you want I don't care -
I am just making everything worse I don't know what I think I will accomplish by grilling her but I am so pissed off that she would do something like this - but how am I surprised
Is there something wrong with me I mean I STILL want to reconcile - REALLY - WTF is that about !!! -- How could I possibly still care - but I f'in do !!!

Sunny

Just saw my therapist she thinks it is imperative that I call her parents who live 1500 miles away tell them about my wifes erratic behavior and explain the meeting of the guy in the car and why I am going forward with the divorce - I know this is against DB principles what do you think I should do.

Sunny

Sunny:

I am sorry you are going through this. I'd take your therapists advice, what can it hurt. They need to know why, and you will be telling them the facts. The other thing to do is reread ericmsant2's reply to you a few entries back;

1. Breathe
2. Stop talking to her, she is not your friend.

You will get through this. Trust me. One day at a time. Surprises, good and bad abound. Focus on you and little sunny.

Sunny

Quote:

The other thing to do is reread ericmsant2's reply to you a few entries back

I agree!

Quote:

why I am going forward with the divorce

Why are you going through with the D? Oh�I know, you are pissed off that she is with an OM. I get it I totally do. I agree with your position of�.no contacting OM while you are in the house, etc. That said, IMO, you rang the divorce bell thinking it would �shake her as* back to reality�, which I understand; however at the core it is manipulation on your part. Why? You are spinning right now�.you keep thinking that somehow you can talk your way out of this, that somehow you can TELL HER what she can and can not do. FTR, IMO, you cannot TELL HER. Your actions should be doing all of the talking � not your words.
That is why I said ealier STFU. Stop talking to her. Right now, you are not in an emotional place to have a conversation with you. Consider this�1) chances are she is going to LIE to your face, which is going to piss you off even more. 2) She has told you how she felt, which is that she is no longer in love with you. So do you think you are going to be able to talk her back into being in love with you?

As for telling her parents, that is your call. I not saying NOT to nor am I saying to do it. My only comment would be�.if you are gonna do it YOU better be in the position of �holding on to your nuts and standing your ground�.

Who filed for the divorce? Who contacted the mediator?

You are at a crossroads buddy�.personally I would do the following, but that is me and you are not me...so you need to do what works for YOU:

1) If you pay for her cell phone � cut it off. Period. Just turn it off. If she does not like it she can purchase her own plan.

2) Set up a parenting schedule with your son and start to follow it NOW.

3) Why are you working 2 jobs? Why? Do you really need to? If you do, why do you, is it because she does not make enough�because your combined expenses are more than you can cover? If so, then cut your expenses. Stop trying to be Mr wonderful with her (that is not saying be an as*).

4) If you really do not want the house, put it on the market � NOW.

5) Do you have joint credit cards and/or bank accounts? If so, close them if possible or open your own.

6) Are you paying bills in her name? If so, stop it. She can pay for them herself.

7) You can tell her parents if you so choose but I would not expect anything different. Why? Cause think about it for a sec�it is almost like �going to mom to complain about your big brother�. If you want her to stop the A, then let your actions do the talking i.e. show her what life will be like when you are not around.

8) You talk about little sunny, yet you will only see him one day a week and every other Saturday night. Is that what you want for little sunny�is that the R you want with him? If not, then DO NOT agree to it!

9) Stop snooping, stop treating her like your property. If you do not want something done i.e. no texting OM while she is in the house � then cut off the phone! My point, say what you need to say ONCE and then act on it!

10) Finally��.you are afraid right now�.it is all over your post. Stop being afraid! You will survive this�how though�is all up to you.

Now�what is the game plan?

Are you in the garden state?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Why are you going through with the D? Oh�I know, you are pissed off that she is with an OM. I get it I totally do. I agree with your position of�.no contacting OM while you are in the house, etc. That said, IMO, you rang the divorce bell thinking it would �shake her as* back to reality�, which I understand; however at the core it is manipulation on your part. Why? You are spinning right now�.you keep thinking that somehow you can talk your way out of this, that somehow you can TELL HER what she can and can not do. FTR, IMO, you cannot TELL HER. Your actions should be doing all of the talking � not your words. That is why I said ealier STFU. Stop talking to her. Right now, you are not in an emotional place to have a conversation with you. Consider this�1) chances are she is going to LIE to your face, which is going to piss you off even more. 2) She has told you how she felt, which is that she is no longer in love with you. So do you think you are going to be able to talk her back into being in love with you? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Yes you're right I am trying to get her to look at her behavior Eric believe me - I wish I could go back to Monday I wish I could go back for a lot of things but I can't and I can't keep beating myself up for it now
She made an appointment with a lawyer I suggested a mediator so she cancelled her appointment with the lawyer and we are going to the mediator Tuesday - you keep talking about my actions what should my actions be - act like I won't go to the mediator - Act like I will take whatever u dishes out ??

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>As for telling her parents, that is your call. I not saying NOT to nor am I saying to do it. My only comment would be�.if you are gonna do it YOU better be in the position of �holding on to your nuts and standing your ground�. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Not gonna do it.

>>>>>>>>Who filed for the divorce? Who contacted the mediator? <<<<<<<< answered above.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>You are at a crossroads buddy�.personally I would do the following, but that is me and you are not me...so you need to do what works for YOU:
1) If you pay for her cell phone � cut it off. Period. Just turn it off. If she does not like it she can purchase her own plan.<<<<<<<<<

I don't she does.

>>>>>>>>>>>>9) Stop snooping, stop treating her like your property. If you do not want something done i.e. no texting OM while she is in the house � then cut off the phone! My point, say what you need to say ONCE and then act on it!<<<<<<<<<<<

I can't cut off the phone

>>>>>>>>10) Finally��.you are afraid right now�.it is all over your post. Stop being afraid! You will survive this�how though�is all up to you. <<<<<<<<

I am trying Eric - I blew this up into the sky now I sit in the wake - my familu and marriage is gone because I lost my temper now I have to live with that how can I not be afraid

>>>>>>>Now�what is the game plan?<<<<<<<<<<

Mediator Tuesday I will keep you posted

>>>>>>>>Are you in the garden state?<<<<<<<<

No

Eric do you suggest I postpone the mediator appointment ???

Sunny

Quote:

I wish I could go back to Monday I wish I could go back for a lot of things but I can't and I can't keep beating myself up for it now

You can�t change the past BUT you can CHANGE YOUR future. To do so, you must LEARN from the past. Notice that YOUR anger wrote a check that you�re a*s is not ready to cash. So do yourself and favor and learn from it! Remember Sunny, the only one YOU can control is YOU. That includes your anger, your words and YOUR ACTIONS. Stop beating yourself up over the past. Ya can�t redo it! So as much as it may suck to hear this..err read this�. � GET OVER IT! Forgive yourself and cut yourself a little slack�.just don�t do it again. The time for you to speak will come�right now is not that time.

Quote:

Yes you're right I am trying to get her to look at her behavior

I get that�your words cannot make her look at her behavior, YOUR actions though CAN! The first action is to please stop talking to her about the D.

Quote:

She made an appointment with a lawyer I suggested a mediator so she cancelled her appointment with the lawyer and we are going to the mediator Tuesday

IMO, you can�t �stop� going to the mediator. You can though be very clear on what it is that YOU want. You can try and delay this. For example, plan to be at work on the mediation appt day and reschedule it. Bottom line, the more you try to stop her the more she will want to move forward. Think of it this way, YOU do not want a divorce � that is how YOU FEEL, it is what YOU want. She on the other hands WANTS a divorce. She wants something different from what you want. Who is right? Personally, both of you in a way. She is right to FEEL the way she FEELS and YOU are RIGHT for feeling the way you FEEL. IMO, you need to figure out what it is that YOU can live with and WHY. So Sunny�.WHY do you want to remain married to her?

Quote:

you keep talking about my actions what should my actions be - act like I won't go to the mediator - Act like I will take whatever u dishes out ??

IMO, your actions should be of a man that respects himself, his wife and his family. I am not here to tell you what to do. That is your call. I can point out what I see in your post but everyone sitch is different. That said, I�ll try to answer your question with a little more detail. First, a man that respects himself would not even consider�.. �act like I will take whatever u dish out�. You are not a victim unless you want to be one. You can always leave or throw her as* out (regardless of what the laws are � you may have consequences but it is still YOUR choice). So respect yourself and HER. Firm boundaries. Clear accountability. Second, ��a man that respects his wife�. I am not suggesting that you sit back while she is f*cking billy bob. Nope. I am though saying that you can be clear on what you will allow in YOUR life in a respectful way. For example: A comment like �while you are in a relationship with another man � you will not have one with me. Please pack your belonging and leave. This is not a healthy enviornment for this family, especially Sunny Jr�. Saying this in a firm yet calm tone is very different than telling her � you CAN�T go OUT� or screaming at her. Finally, � a man respects his family��. IMO, in order to respect your family you must first respect yourself and your W. Your actions should be that of confidence, of conviction over what YOU will and WILL NOT allow in your life. It should not matter what I say or anyone else. So Sunny, my point is that your actions should speak. You should not be afraid to go to the mediator!

I asked you in an earlier post questions� what is your plan. Do you really want to keep working two jobs? Do you really want to move out of your house?

You are operating in fear � complete and utter fear, which I understand having been there myself. Until you can face the fear, which means face the fact that your W may divorce you � you will continue to act in a manner that is fearful. Dude, my heart aches for you man because I know how you feel and what you are going through��I wish I can shake you and get you to realize that you really will be okay that the only way to get her back is to really let her go and focus on you. Let her go Sunny�be firm on what it is that you want and RESPECT her choices. She wants to be with OM � fine. You focus on what you want in your life. You want to keep standing for your M. Then do it. Why change what you want for her.

Quote:

Eric do you suggest I postpone the mediator appointment

You can try...but the reason, at least what you should tell her, is that you need to gather some additional info in order to make the meeting as useful as possible. If she says "no"...well then please don't go begging - nope - a simple fine. I will see you Tuesday will suffice. Please Sunny....keep your mouth and emotions under control.

What state are you in?

Eric

Sunny:

I agree. I FEEL for you man I really do, but take some breaths. Quit beating yourself up over things you have done or not done in the past, you can't change them and you need to move forward. I did not say "move on" (which you may have to do anyway), but "move forward" - work on yourself and take care of little sunny. The only thing you can control is your reaction to things that happen. You are on a tightrope and every so often you'll lose balance and fall off. It's OK, just dust yourself off, get back on, and learn from the experience, however, don't beat yourself up over it - Move Forward!

You really think just because you became upset and vented at her she decided that this was it. You're on the crazy train and you are not driving.

You are in a personal crisis, I would suggest a therapist for just you, weekly if not more until this sitch subsides or you can deal with it from strength. Therapy should be focused on you, not the marriage. You need to mend you.

What state are you in anyway (as in location, not mental)?

New York

I don't think I want to postpone this as much as I don't want a divorce I feel for myself I need to make a decision.
Last night she met with the OM and she didn't hide the fact last night i walked in she told me our son is at the top of his class i saud great she said XXXX is still awake i went up to say goodnight she said i am gonna i am not really speaking with her I think what she is doing is disgusting
So I am gonna go to the mediator and I am not gonna fight this anymore I told her I don't think it's good for our son for her to be dating calmly and I asked her if she wants to continue this I think she should leave calmly and nicely
She told me go f myself soooo
Lets face it what's left she has no feeling respect kindness or compassion for me I would love to reconcile but I don't see the point anymore what else can I do at this point
I have GAL look great feel great my son now wakes up at 1:30 every night and comes into bed with me asking where is mommy
Eric we can not keep the house because we both need a place to live plus I don't want to sell it but since we are divorcing we can not
I don't think anything will be signed or finalized at the mediators office so I will just go and discuss seperation for now I hate that I couldn't keep my mouth shut
But like u said Eric it's too late for that now the check I don't want to cash has been written

Tomorrow is the mediator appointment - I decided not to change it - Eric you said something that hit me VERY hard - FEAR - DON'T BE AFRAID OF GOING TO THE MEDIATOR - you are right I am SOOO TIRED of being afraid - I will face this head on - make the plan that I think works bust for little Sunny and we will see - when you finally start making decisions instead of living in limbo things seem to feel better - facing tomorrow with peace in my heart and my head held high.

Mediator just called to cancel appt got called into court - will call next week to reschedule oye

Sunny,
Sorry to hear that the meeting has been canceleld, but it gives you another week to calm down and put your business hat on.

I know it's tough, but you've got to go into that meeting wearing your business hat....emotions can't enter that room while you are discussing settlement, funds, child custody issues, etc.

Hang in there!

Sunny:

Have a plan together for the mediator, at least get a list together, it will help you focus better. Keep annotating the list when you think of something, the better prepared you are the better you will be. Fear is your enemy. Shoulder's back and head high! One day at a time.

You can do this, focus on you!

Sunny

Everyone is suggesting the same thing...have a game plan. Know what you are asking for or not willing to give whatever it is.

Going in with anger (although totally understandable) is not going to help you or little sunny. Remember buddy, this is YOUR life. Be honest, firm and direct. No more no less.

So what is your plan?

Eric

Originally Posted By: ericmsant2

Sunny
Everyone is suggesting the same thing...have a game plan. Know what you are asking for or not willing to give whatever it is.
Going in with anger (although totally understandable) is not going to help you or little sunny. Remember buddy, this is YOUR life. Be honest, firm and direct. No more no less.
So what is your plan? Eric

I thought I told you my plan already - everything is decided

and yes it's what I want for now

Sunny

Was checking in....how are you?

Hey Eric - I haven't been on here since February - I am on the other side of the mountain - not all the way down - we are divorced - still in the house but we should be out by the middle of January - I disappeared because - as much as this place helped me - I thought that hoping for a reconciliation was not in my and my son's best interest -

I will post an update as soon as I can -

Love all you guys/gals !!!

Peace

Sunny

Sunny - if you get this...I hope all is well on your end.