Time for a new thread.
My old one:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2227973&page=12I am muddling through my paperwork and phone calls this morning. Read everyones comments. I am wishing and hoping that it is sinking in.
OW is hurt, sad and alone, too. She is a bit scary in her current abilities to manipulate. I am more and more seeing my H as a person who seems to take pleasure in hurting both OW and I. He is messing up all our lives. He is only seeing himself and not concerned at all about me, our kids, our grandkids, our friends, and even OW.
Whatever happens, happens. I will take back my bedroom. Last night I caved and asked him a question about the texts. And he responded so much like a child. I reacted like a child. He stormed off to bed, and I followed him and told him to at least tell me he was sorry I was being harrassed.
He said he had said that. He hadn't! I told him that, and then he did say it. I also reiterated that I feel there is only one person who would have any reason to send me these messages. And that I wanted him to admit it. He then said he still couldn't do anything about it.
I was way off DB track. I told him off about a few other things. But he can do something about the texts. He won't. He told me he asked her did she do it and she said no. (That settles it!)
I haven't had any yet today. I sent an email to the parent company and asked them to block my number. Of course there are many other companies out there that allow you to send anonomyous texts and emails.
The carper cleaner is scheduled for the master bedroom. I'm going to buy a bunch of boxes and pack away all of my priceless antiques. So when people look at the house they see the house, not all the stuff in it!
I better get busy!
Aloha,
Wendy
I posted this on your old thread as well by mistake - darn edit button.
Please do not take this as criticism, because the hardest thing is having to share your living space with a MLCer. Those that take off do us a favour.
OK, you are still very involved with your xh. Yes, you were married a long time, and it takes a while to detach, but you MUST detach. It isn't an option but a necessity.
I have come to see MLC rather differently these days. They are living in an altered reality which makes perfect sense to them, but not to anyone else much. The OW is a part of this altered reality, but in no way guarantees that she will be treated well. Your h might spend money on her, and time with her, but she is a puppet in his strange twilight MLC world. I don't mean this to sound patronising. it is sad actually.
Arguing is utterly pointless. They cannot budge an inch in their current belief. And one of the weird things about MLC is that something that insist on one day they will even deny having said the next.
Comments like never riding in a car with you again are so MLC. There is not externally rational reason for this, but it will make perfect sense to your h not to do this.
Seriously, you cannot argue with a MLCer. Their world is closed, coherent and consistent to them. I think it might actually make them feel unsafe to have it challenged. They survive in the larger world by following the rules that are imposed on them, so they can go on functioning in their jobs, although over times they may become less functional and productive, at least that is what people have reported to me.
The more rule based their employment the better they feel. But if those rules change it is like the end of the world.
I don't think there is anything we can do except state our own boundaries and refrain from arguing. It is not only pointless but it entrenches them in their position. They cannot be wrong. It isn't like with us - 'OK so I made a mistake, sorry' It is fundamental to them that they are right about all they do and say.
It does get better, and the more we see they really are not on the mother ship, and quit trying to bring them aboard, the better we get on.
Your getting the house termite treated is a case in point. There is no reasonableness in his request, and you can say firmly that you are not doing it alone [your boundar
As I am in a decision making mode things are happening for me.
My friend from the Netherlands, who I met in Bali 9 years ago, wants me to come to Langkawi Island where she lives now. She promises I can learn how to heal my broken heart. (Meditation)
I helped her in Bali after she had been robbed. She says I am an earth-bound angel and that I am not living up to my full potential. I think a month away from everything and everyone would be a nice thing.......
And I might learn something from her. Her fiance committed suicide 3 years ago. She went through some tough times.
As far as moving bedrooms, I laid the groundwork for that with H today. I said he could have steaks at home or take me to dinner, even though he had made the bold statement that he would never ride in a car with me again.
He choose dinner out. So over dinner I told him I was going to pack up a bunch of knick-knacks and re-arrange the house while he was gone. Told him I was putting some stuff in storage, too.
And I left it at that. He will figure it out. He was being nice tonight. He again wanted to watch TV with me. I was able to not have any R talk.
I got very little sleep for the past week. H has had many early morning VTC meetings, they hold them on Wash DC time, hard on the Hawaii folks. When he starts up his truck it is about 6 feet from my head. It is a big loud truck. Yet another reason to switch bedrooms......
So I am off to bed. Yoga in the morning then sailing on Kaneohe Bay with my best friend.
Hi Wendy,
My son did a meditation retreat when he was 17,it changed his outlook on life. He still does Vipassana meditation. He is the nicest,most balanced, most sane person I know. I have my own meditation retreat booked, in Thailand, for June this year!
I have sailed from Langkawi to the Southern Thai Islands. Fantastic scenery, just check the monsoon season for the winds. We can suffer from the 'doldrums' here in Asia, (I suspect you have had enough of being in them already!).
Regarding DB techniques, in my experience they will do what they will do and very little we say or do other than filing for divorce or walking away makes any difference (in my opinion).
He is the one who has done the 'dirty' on you he MUST take some of the consequences. If he has an affair he has no right to be in the marital bed. You preserve that right. End of story.
Go for the trip to Langkawi - and the meditation which is a right brain activity, and unlocks all kind of stuff for us, including new ways of seeing the world.
A months away there while your h remains crazy. What is there not to like? Just make sure you have secure financial arrangement in place before you go though. Just sayin'.
Yes, I have an appointment with a lawyer. (Again) Hopefully I like this one. I plan to have some papers drawn up that state what we will be doing while we are waiting for the house to sell. Like not changing anything, like life insurance, not buying new cars, not moving money around. I'm sure the lawyer will explain to me a little better how this goes.
Our tax refund is big enough for us each to get a lawyer. So be it.
And the Realtor told me that we don't need the house tented for the kind of termites we have. (Furniture eating ones.....) So H spot treated them himself. We pay a fortune every year for the subterranian termite defense system. Those are not active. And are the ones you really have to be afraid of!
When I travel to places like Bali I carry a money belt and take cash with me. You can still get robbed that way. But you don't have to give up a credit card number. If you do need a cash advance you take the credit card directly to the bank.
I am off to yoga. Hope you all have nice days!
Hi there, Wendy. I was away for a week, so wasn't on DB for that time. But, I got your new thread. I see you are doing well, except for that li'l old slip. We all do that, then we just have to reorganize our heads, and try and do better.
Take care.
My H is off island for a week. And I don't know why this has OW spinning up so much. She sent anonomyous texts to make sure I looked at her FB, and now is posting stuff about everything I say. (I know, just don't look.....)
Pretty much she seems mad that if I post something fairly boring, like: "Hey to all my Facebook Friends and Family: Just want you all to know that I love you all! I've been having a bad year and just don't know where I would be without the encouragement I get from you all."
I get 22 likes and 19 comments. I do have a lot of good people in my world.
And it is pretty funny, I think she will be headed back into the psych ward soon. Her stuff sounds a little manic, and has some very convoluted reasoning. I am not writing anything about her, 99% of my FB friends don't even know her name.
I said before, I think she is having a MLC too. It was so hard not to really mess with her today, then say: "April Fool's!" I restrained myself.
Today I worked hard on my house rearranging. What a huge mess I have going on. I got the curtains all nice in the "Man Cave" I am making for my H. Got part of the bathroom stuff switched. Had to pause and go to a beach BBQ.....
Now I must get some sleep.
Goodnight All!
Hi - detach. She is pressing your buttons. Why give her the power.
There is a reason these guys are with someone crazy . . ...
Seriously, the less you think about and involve yourself in the madness the better you will feel.
I often think facebook is a menace for those dealing with MLC. So often either the WAS or OW or some combination thereof use it to spy on you and/or to post things that are upsetting, and meant to be.
Thanks Beatrice.....
I'm having a moment of just feeling crazy. OW posted about getting a great price on plane tickets to see a friend. I figured she would go to DC to see him.
I need to not look at her page and let them have each other.
I don't know why it hurts so much. He is a dope, and I am sure I can live a more enjoyable life without him.
Yes, I keep forgetting the DETACH part.
Maybe part of my problem is that I just feel alone. Everywhere I go, everything I do, I am surrounded by happy couples. I was reading about lost love, and comically it puts the brain into a place simular to being newly in love. In other words crazy!
This is a chapter out of the book "Cut Loose", it talks about lost love.
http://www.helenfisher.com/downloads/articles/16cutloose.pdf I also read somewhere that it takes 5-7 years to get over a long term marriage. Well I don't have time for that. I'm going to
put a rubber band on my wrist and start snapping it when ever I think of my H and wishing things could be magically repaired.
I really don't want him back. I know that MLC is a problem, maybe even an illness. Well maybe it isn't my problem.
Maybe my problem is how to have what I want and need, and not have an anchor dragging me down!
Wendy,
Please do not look at her FB page again. It is causing you a lot of sorrow and you do not need that. She is very much aware that you are looking at it and that's why she's not blocked you yet. She wants you to feel miserable.
As for the 5-7 year comment about getting over a long term marriage...well, I was married for 25 years and it took me approximately 2.5 years to get over it. Why? Because my xh was the horse's @ss in mlc and I had enough of his bs. Also, my xh was not the poster boy for being a husband either, however, I accepted him for who he was and we did have a good life, but my life got even better once we were divorced and I had recovered my balance. I never knew just how often I was making excuses for his behavior or the "walking on eggshells" that I did. The divorce took a huge burden off of my shoulders and I have never looked back.
Hang in there and please don't allow the ow to push your buttons this week. This is your week to do whatever you want and enjoy your time while your h is away.
Why are you fixing him up a man cave?
You are doing beyond great for the most part, but I still think you're doing way too much for him...
Andabelle: I am switching the bedrooms, taking back the master bedroom. I am putting in that room all that he has said he wanted. Which isn't much. Since I'm suppused to be getting the house ready to go on the market, I'm trying to make it all look nice. Not slapped together.
I have been sleeping in that room, and I was waking up every morning feeling pushed out of place. I slept in my bed the last 2 nights, and woke up feeling much better.
Snodderly: My sister keeps telling me the same thing, that a burden will be lifted and I will feel better. And I know OW is a trouble causing drama queen, for all her claims to the contrary.
I have not bothered her, harassed her, done anything to her. Yet she keeps all this stuff up. Every step I take to get out of her way causes another reaction. I would be in jail if I was doing to her what she has done to me. People who have the training she has can get in big trouble for mis-using their computer knowledge.
Me getting control back over my computer seems to be one of the things that got her going here recently. Now she is doing other things to engage with me. And I can't possibly stay married to a man dumb enough to say to me that he doesn't know who is sending me the texts.
So I will wake up every morning from now on, with a beautiful sunrise out my window, and enjoy the time I have left living as a princess in my beautiful bedroom.
I am sorting out all the closets, and being in the right mood, I have filled several large boxes with misc. junk. Clothes are going too. If it doesn't look good on me, into the donate pile it goes.
Have a nice day everyone.
It was really bugging me, him calling it "His" bedroom, "His" bathroom. I don't know why. Maybe it was the loss of the word "OUR".
How long does it take? Well it depends, I believe in part, on the quality of the marriage. My xh was a sweetie, and I was a lucky woman. He was a lucky man, let's not forget that bit!
So I had a very happy 30+ years, and I am grateful for that. had my marriage been less happy I might have 'got over it' as the saying goes, faster. So there you are.
We can control our conscious minds, and restructure our thinking, and do everything to help ourselves. Detachment is crucial. Our memories are something else.
You will be fine. As for the world being full of couples. Well I had that sense for the longest time, and now I don't so much. There are a lot of happy singles and a lot of not so hot relationships, and whether your first marriage was great, or not, we certainly don't want less if there is to be another time!
Hi Wendy! So glad you're in your own bedroom. I never left mine, and even redecorated it. H moved into the spare room. I refer to 'our' room, as 'my' room now. The "our" thing was hard to lose, and I kept correcting myself (felt guilty for some reason), but I don't anymore. He made his choice. I am pretty detached now, and expect to get over my M quickly since the last 26 years has been very rocky. We had lots of good times, but far more bad times. I felt that my whole married life, I was waiting around for him ... to come home, to do right, to hear me, etc. Never happened, except on the rare occasion.
Anyway, don't let the OW get to you. Perhaps you should report her to whatever authority she reports to, but only if you have evidence.
Take care.
Hi Wendy, as I read your posts it's so clear that you are living a very beautiful, fun life except for that one pesky fly in the ointment, H.
You are headed for a charmed life!
Thanks Beatrice, Labug and BeingMe!
I found out the quilt guild where I want to move is a very active one. They hold a big annual show. Now to make sure there is a bowling alley still in operation nearby!
OW doesn't have a job. But she is darn good with computers.... If my computer gets hacked again I will go to the police. And if the anomoyous texts and emails continue I will get a no contact order against her.
For some odd reason they have reached a point where they make me laugh. Detachment is kind of a fun thing.
Okay, incoming grandkids. Gotta go cook some food and hide the breakables!
Love you all!
Wendy
Just venting a bit...... My meeting with the lawyer left me feeling a bit down. I am going to plan for the worst and just see where I end up.
I am really sad that for all the years I could have worked and instead worked on all the family stuff that I didn't. I should have put myself first. H always told me I didn't have to work, I could if I wanted to. What ever would make me happy.
Which I realize now was just his way of makeing sure he never had to do any housework or shopping or anything else. Oh well.
My switching the bedrooms project is in full swing. WHAT A MESS! My kids all converged here last night and we had a nice family game of Scrabble. My oldest son always wins.
But last night my younger son pulled out a 72 point play and won by 5 points. We keep a notebook with the games in it and the date. Also little notes about what happens that is funny. I love looking at that notebook.
We can all move to CA. We can figure it out. I love my family and when we are all together like last night it is beautiful.
So back to tossing crap. I need to donate/sell everything I don't need.
And I work up this morning and watched a beautiful sunrise out my window. I bet I can find a house with a bedroom that gets the sunrise...... since I am a morning person and love that!
I also am getting detachment from some of my furniture. As I'm building his man cave I decided to give him the antique asian nightstands that we bought together. He said he wanted them. It is just furniture. And all they would ever be to me is a reminder of us having picked them out together.
Well! I got the man cave done. My 4 year old granddaughter went in and looked around and said: "It looks very comfy in here." To me it looks like a motel room. I hung one thing up for him, a photo of him in college when he wrestled.
My DIL thought it was the perfect finishing touch for the room. I was pondering should I put a sign on the door saying: ______'s Room and a sign on the door of my room saying: Wendy's Room.
DIL said, no, the picture of him tells it all......
My living room, family room and office have stuff piled everywhere. I am trying to do one room at a time. And need to figure out why it is that I have so much stuff.
I did realize that I used to have a lot more parties. I have a lot of serving platters, fancy serving dishes, more than I can ever use. I need to pare it down to what I actually use.
I was down lower than a snakes belly earlier. I was grumpy and snapping at people. I decided to just not let this all bother me. My boys were helping move big stuff. My oldest son and I are the only ones not sick. There was a lot of grumbling.
I finally told them all that I rarely ask for help. And that I really wanted to get the stuff moved. It is helping me visualize a different future. And maybe they can't see how that is important to me.
But it is. I wanted things to be different when H returns from his trip. And they will be. I want him to walk in here and see that we are separated. He will have his part of the house, I will have mine.
I also want him to have that strange feeling of being in the same old house, but having to say, wait, that isn't where my clothes are. Wait, that isn't my bathroom. I have been thrown for a loop, and want a little bit of normalcy back.
And sleeping in the same bedroom, same bed, same dressers is helping me. I still feel a little panicy, but it is getting easier to think about the future.
And when I think about H and wonder how it is so easy for him to go days and days without even texting me, I start saying silly things in my head.
Here are my top 10:
We're separated, We're separated, We're separated, etc.
I'm a page he has turned, I'm no longer his concern.
Detach, Detach, Detach.....
Going thru the Big D and don't mean Dallas. (Sorry, but it makes me laugh. I was asking some insurance questions and the gal couldn't even say divorce, she said Big D.)
I sing songs in my head, like Tammy Wynette's D-I-V-O-R-C-E,
Rodney Crowell's "If Looks Could Kill", Jon Anderson's "Let Go of the Stone".
I turn on the "Traditional Country" station on Direct TV. Dang, are all old counry songs about broken hearts? It makes me feel worse, then soon I'm laughing at myself. There are as many broken hearts out there as there are stars in the sky.
I know I will get over this. I know there will be a new and interesting chapter in my life. So I just need to get through this boring, tedious and sad chapter!
Tomorrow I will power through the pile in the master bathroom. The bedroom turned out great. I put some things back where I had them when we fIrst moved in. And tried out a whole new look for nightstands.
Both boys reported that they each got one text from their father in the 5 days he has been gone. Believe it or not, that is more than he has ever done before.
I think my favourite is 'The Divorce Song' Liz Phair.
But the idea that any of the changes will bring him up with any kind of jolt is mistaken. It seems there is a bit of you that perhaps still does not 'get' MLC. He is SURE in his head that he is doing the right thing. And that feeling usually lasts a long long time. I am talking years here, not months. There are a few people whose spouses 'wake up' in a shorter period and get therapy/counselling/meds to restore normalcy. But most of them barrel along through their crisis with little apparent regret for all they have thrown away. They see it as liberation for a new and better life. Although I do think there is pain there, they blame that on their life with us.
I think the lack of regret was the thing that threw me the most. What you are feeling is normal. What your h is doing isn't, by any standards. You do not walk away from a long marriage and your kids and all of that, on a whim, if all is well in your world. We persist in applying the standards of normality to them [I did it too, for a long time] It isn't until we realise they really are on another planet and see things quite differently from the rest of us, that it becomes less painful, and oddly enough, easier to understand. There is a weird logic to it, but it like trying to compare apples and cabbages. [Much less similar than apples and pears!]
Wendy sounds like things are moving along. Each step along your path, though painful now, will be worth it.
Are you a Country fan?
How about Thank God and Greyhound You're Gone?
Hey Labug! I am an on again/off again country fan. So there are a lot of songs I don't know. I'll look for that one.
My steps are funny right now!
Beatrice: I am getting the MLC thing. I am just making him a space separate from mine. I am trying to do this in a loving way. Get the distance and elbow room I need, without being mean to him.
I am trying to protect myself. I can't keep on with the farce of sitting and watching TV with him. I don't want to eat meals with him. He puts me in a postion of me having to tell him to leave. Which seems odd after he has told me so many times that we are done.
So now I will be watching TV in the formal living room. I get that he doesn't give a rats a$$ about anything. If he cared at all then he wouldn't have done the hundreds of mean, thoughless things he has done in the past 18 months.
The way it was before each morning I was in the place where he needed to be to get ready for work. I tend to wake up earlier than him. So this way I can get up when I normally do, get my tea, and then go back upstairs to my room and completely not see him. I felt like a puppy dog just watching him get ready for work.
I don't think he will have an awakening. Each of the 7 times he has "come back" to me it seems to get easier for him to switch back. I do one thing he doesn't like, and BAM, back to her.
He doesn't have any conflict resolution skills, he doesn't know how to even have a discussion. He really is emotionally and socailly very stunted. I always thought he would grow up and become more like his father. He really never did grow since the day we married.
I remember when we were dating teaching him how to have a conversation. I told him it is like a came of catch. You catch the ball then throw it back. With him it is a game of throw.
And when we are in a group of people having a talk, even if he has something to say, it always is that he rarely gets any words out. He has a look on his face, he wants to say something, but he doesn't know how to enter the conversation.
So he is in love with OW. And doesn't even know how to have a conversation. I give up. Yes, we can do a lot of stuff non-verbally. But to ever get our relationship fixed, at some point some words would have to transpire.
And if EVERYTIME we do talk he views it as an evil horrible thing, then we will never fix this.
So I am not putting myself through that wringer again. He doesn't know what he wants. He wants both me and her. And her T.T. Fairy Dust is some strong stuff. So, I might sound like I have hope, but I really don't.
I don't think it is that they don't care, but they can't care. The effect is the same, but it is less personal.
It is hard, and a lot of it only drops into place over time. I can now see how damaged my h is, and how good my life is. Doesn't mean that after all this time I don't still sometimes miss him, but the intense pain is gone. I think it still feels very personal to you - and it did to me for a long time. When that feeling goes it really helps everything to drop into perspective. He won't be happier or healthier, but he won't see it that way for a long long time. To him it is just a few moments in fairyland, but the outside world moves on at its own pace, and when and if they do wake, well it is like Rip Van Winkle. All they have known has moved on without them, and they are superfluous in the world they once cherished. No winners in the MLC game, sadly. But we turn turn our loss into real gain.
There is nothing wrong with having hope. For most people MLC takes a long long time. A good friend of mine's xh is starting to see he has problems, and getting therapy, and talking to her properly for the first time in six years.
I don't think it is that they don't care, but they can't care. The effect is the same, but it is less personal.
yes... back to that discussion on their apparent lack of empathy... it's just gone... for some reason and who knows when it will ever return...
Ive been following this website for months and ive never posted anything. Ive been getting a life acting happy leaving him alone since summer, he still moved out in feb. Have no idea what happened i know hes in a midlife crisis, he just says he cant be close to me, we get along, discuss nothing but son and animals. The only thing i can think i could of done wrong is not expect enough and gave him too much space idk. I think it would hurt less if he did just hate me. Im 41 hes 46. I have no idea where this message is gona end up if any where, sorry ahead if it turns up in an inappropriate spot. Im just at my wits end nothing changes just feel like just waiting til hes ready to take the next step in the wrong direction. Ive been pretty confident have kept my sense of humor, today i feel like im losing my grip.
I am trying not to take it personal. And I find it very hard to watch him being so darn strange.
But somehow this week I feel like I have moved on. I actually feel like I have closed a door behind me. I am sleeping great back in the master bedroom. I quit taking Ambien 10 days ago. I haven't taken the anti-anxiety stuff they gave me during the day, and plan to start taking 1/2 of one for the next few nights.
I am waking up feeling like I used to, with the "Hey I's Morning!". I still have a bit of a hurt in my chest. But it isn't as bad as it was. The bad parts seem to go away faster. I try to make myself laugh.
I realize I have all I will ever need to make myself happy. Kids, grandkids, sewing machines, friends, and more ideas in my head for quilts I want to make than I will ever have time to create.
So I will head to Northern California (Where the girls are warmer....) and find my place in this world. Meanwhile I will enjoy being here in Hawaii and the time with my friends and family.
So if he can't care, then I shouldn't let it bother me. Got it!
Happy Easter All!
Let go or be dragged. I think you have within you all the abilities for a bright future, and your H will either follow after you - or not. You'll be good either way.
"But to ever get our relationship fixed, at some point some words would have to transpire."
This is just like my H. Which is why our R isn't fixed either. And, won't ever be, unless there's is some cosmic miracle.
Keep on moving forward, Wendy, one day at a time.
Today is my friends double mastectomy and repair. I am headed out to do some errands, then over to sit with her family. She asked me to not leave her husband sitting alone too long.
I spent last night tidying up all the loose bits from the big room switcheroo. The master bathroom looks like a heath and beauty disaster. I need to get back into "Discard" mood mode. And there is no sense in trying to do it in the wrong mood.
My bedroom looks beautiful, like a magazine. The formal living and dining room also look magazine pretty. Tomorrow I will do yard work and mop. So H will come home to everything all pretty. And his new bedroom, and me away at a movie.
So maybe we can list the house by the 15th. That is my goal. The big quilt show I'm in charge of is the middle of May. So after that I am a free agent with no commitments.
Everyone who feels like it please say a prayer, and or send good thought for my friend today.
Aloha,
Wendy
Wendy,
I am keeping your friend in my thoughts and prayers. I do hope that her surgery goes well and she will be up and about in no time.
I'm sure your home looks beautiful. You've been on a cleaning spree for a few days and there can't be much left to move and/or pick up.
Please let us know how your friend is doing.
My friend made it through the surgery. She took a long time to wake up after. Several extra hours.
When we were following them pushing her to her room, I told a little joke. She said: "Ha Ha" and I felt good that she is going to be ok.
Wendy,
That is good news...now the battle of recovery will begin. She is going to need a lot of TLC and prayers in the days ahead. I will keep her in my thoughts and prayers. She is going to need you for support in the days ahead.
Wendy, please be sure to take some time and pamper yourself so that you remain in good health.
So this is directed mostly at KML (Ellie). My random thread hopping got me to read a whole bunch of your threads. And Starting back at the beginning, I was so happy for you.
And it has taken me several days to plow through your posts. And I realized that there were a lot of themes we had in common. Like health issues, taking on huge projects to do something monumental with H, and so on. You climbed Mt. Whitney with your guy, I crossed the Pacific Ocean in a 36' catamaran with mine.
Anyway, I got sad and had to quit reading for now. But I'm up to 2010. You sound happy and together. I appreciate your posts to me.
Heck, everyone knows I appreciate all their posts. I ordered a book called Cut Loose. Because I need to get over, through, beyond this!
I had put a rubber band on my wrist to snap if I thought wistful thought about my H and my former imaginary great life. Ironically all it did was give me the giggles, because I decided I wasn't going to punish myself over him. I more wished I could snap him with it. (More giggles....)
Then I remembered he and I used to have EPIC rubberband ambush battles. We would shoot them for the cats to play with, and when I vacuumed I would put them in a bowl. Then we would go crazy shooting them at each other.
I'm going to keep all my good memories of him, and just let the nut job who lives in his body now go.
I hadn't heard a peep out of him all week. Got a text in the wee hours asking was someone going to pick him up at the airport. I almost responded "Who are you and how did you get this number?" but restrained myself.
Instead I texted back that S22 would pick him up. (Just like we discussed before he left....) I plan to be out at the movies when he gets home.
Hope he likes his new room.
Hmmmm....2010, huh? I'm trying to remember what was happening then.
That was the year my first post-separation boyfriend dumped me for his long-lost college love, I believe. (No worries - he and I are still best friends, and he seems happy with her, so I am happy for him.) Also the year I went on my first tour playing glockenspiel and percussion for my best friend who is a professional musician. And the year my divorce was finalized.
2011 was the Year of the Cougar. I had some....interesting....dating experiences.
I bought my house, sold my mom's house, and went on tour again.
Life hasn't all been a bowl of cherries, but I have to say, my life has generally been much more relaxed, happy, and relatively free of drama without my ex. I really have no complaints about the adventures I've had so far.
Hi All! I wrote a long post about the room switch and the computer ate it. I'll try again.
I picked H up at airport due to S22 being in the ER earlier in the day with Migraine, sinus infection, broncitis, asthma and allergic reaction causing his eye lids to swell up. (He just started a new job, something there triggered this....)
When I told H about the room he was angry. He threatned to move money. I told him to do what he has to, we will see lawyers, get the divorce rolling. Much more nastiness. I heard about his hard earned money, how I'm trying to control him, how he wants the master bedroom.
When I reminded him he said he would swith rooms he didn't remember that conversation. When I told him that if OW started back up with the texting/emailing me over this I would contact police he informed me that she broke up with him.
I told him I had made "HIS" bedroom nice for him and he exploded with rage that it wasn't "HIS" bedroom. I responded that it was now, he made the choice to leave the marraige, he get the guest room.
Then as I was pulling into driveway he said not to park straight, because he was leaving to stay on the boat. I got out, he jumped into the drivers seat and roared away. I sent a text reminding him to turn the wind genertor on for power.
I came up to bed. About 10 minutes later he came home and went to bed in his new room. I stayed out of the way.
One of the things he said on the ride was how he was looking forward to doing Easter with the family in the morning. I told him we were not doing it til later due to my DIL's work schedule.
I refrained from telling him that for any such plans to have been made he would have to have TALKED to someone, not just assume status quo.
I also made it plain that I am done and moving on. Very plain.
So - OW breaks up with him, and he comes home to find things have shifted there too. This sends him spinning like a top. Very predictable.
I might just recommend here, that whether you want him back or not, you stick to the high road. You didn't boot him to the guest room to stick it to him, you did it because you needed the comfort of your old room during these painful times. It's ok to tell him that.
Thanks KML, I did tell him that. I said I have been feeling displaced and uncomfortable.
It is just past 7:30 here in Hawaii. I got up once in the middle of the night, when I posted. But slept fairly well, considering.
I just started messing with the Easter stuff, since the kids are coming this evening for an egg hunt. We always hide the baskets, too.
I have plans to wash the dogs, clean out the office closet and other busy work to stay out of his way today.
The book I ordered, "Cut Loose, Mostly Older Women Talk about Ending Mostly Long Term Relationships" came in the mail yesterday. Hopefully reading it will help me with my perspective over the next few weeks.
Happy Easter!
Wow, Wendy. Your H knows how to do a homecoming. I wonder if OW did break up with him. Mmmm! Sounds like he wanted your shoulder to cry on, and you gave him "I'm done" and "I'm claiming back the main bedroom". Sad for him, but good for you.
So at 9:30 he emerged from his man cave, gulped down a cup of OJ and left. I caught him going out the door and asked was he planning on being back in time for the grandkids this evening.
He said he didn't know, his life is shattered. I said "I don't know what to say except I'm sorry to hear that." Then he said he would probably be back by then.
He took off with no reguard to the fact that my older son is driving my car, which he will give back this evening. Guess I didn't want to go anywhere today! (Maybe I'll drive the motorcycle my son left here..........NOT!)
I do get total anxiety around my H. So I'm glad he took off. I can play loud music while I wash dogs and finish turning my office into a Woman Cave.
I decided the formal living room is too open, I would rather sit in a room where I can close the door for privacy. I would just sit up in the master bedroom, but my wireless doesn't reach there. Well sometimes, if you hold your mouth right!
I suppose this day will get more, not less interesting!
He said he didn't know, his life is shattered. I said "I don't know what to say except I'm sorry to hear that."
Good job. Validate, but don't rescue him from this process. High road.
You are the kind and loving goddess that he was foolish enough to leave. You can afford to be generous and benevolent.
And truth be told - he's in a sad, painful place. He set a bomb off in his life, and now he has to face the wreckage without the dopamine high of the affair. This is a very painful, confusing place for the WAS to be - and they often really have no idea how they ended up there.
Oh boy Wendy!
This is quite interesting!
I know Im being a smart A$$, but i can't help it. Gee IT [censored] TO BE HIM RIGHT NOW DOESN'T IT?
You know I was looking over a book called the Goddess Queen or Queen Goddess and how to be one. My Dear Wendy, you really are the Queen Goddess. You have held your head up high, kept moving forward, kept doing positive and productive things, and have treated him kindly, but firmly. You truly are a wonderful role model for all of us!
This will be an interesting show as to how he acts now. I agree with kml, he is in a painful and confusing place. I just hope he can get smart, and work on figuring out how he got there.
My daughter and I came up with a sad but true saying: " The pain helps you learn".
If that isn't the truth I don't know what is!
Take care, and Happy Easter!
Wendy,
I'm not surprised to read about your h's reaction to the shift in rooms/possessions. His world is rocking back and forth and I don't believe the ow has totally booted him to the curb.
You validated his feelings, but now you need to stick to the high road and let him fume and sulk for a while. Don't back down.
It is easy to let him sulk, because he does it so well. He came home at 1:30 pm and went straight to his man cave and shut the door. I asked was he okay and he said he was napping.
I had planned to sew in the room beside his, but decided to wait til later. My woman cave is coming along. I am sitting in a comfy chair with my feet on an ottoman. There are three different textures and fabrics represented right now. So I will have to find some fabric to make it all match. I can make cushion covers!
I have no doubt OW isn't done with him yet. She probably just wanted to go out on a few dates, and this way she can use the "But we were on a break" excuse. Or she is tired of him not spending any money on her.
I did notice they fight at EVERY holiday. Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's Day, Valentines day last year and thia year, Easter. I should be a freakin' marriage counselor!
My big challange today is going to be not being snarky. No snide comments. Just have a nice evening with the kids!
My big challange today is going to be not being snarky. No snide comments. Just have a nice evening with the kids!
Good plan.
I did notice they fight at EVERY holiday. Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's Day, Valentines day last year and thia year, Easter.
Of course, they're fighting because he's not spending them with her. Good - let her hang herself. You don't want him to end up with her, even if you don't want to keep him yourself.
Funny KML, I have said many times to my sister that I don't care who he marries, EXCEPT he cannot marry her. She is a special class of bimbo, stealing a friends husband. I know he gets plenty of blame, but so does she!
Heck I get plenty of blame, too. But at least I am trying to work on me. I am changing so much, it is funny. The kids are pretty late. I just dyed the eggs without them, the girls are 2 and 4 they won't know the difference.
In the old days I would have been beside myself over it, and been grumpy to all! Now I'm channeling the Meatballs Mantra: "It Just Doesn't Matter! It Just Doesn't Matter! It Just Doesn't Matter!"
My H got up from his nap and watched TV. I was making dinner, cookies and such. He went into "HIS" room and was grumbling, slamming and banging. I went to the door, it is right off the family room, and asked what was the matter.
He was all upset because he couldn't get the power cords all situated to his liking. I went and took a good extension cord out of my travel sewing machine bag and handed it to him. He still wasn't happy. So I fixed it all up for him. He was still grumpy.
I made no comments. He then said he was tired and was going to bed early. He said he slept badly and that from midnight to 8:30 wasn't enough sleep. He always has been one to need more sleep......
Yea! The kids just arrived. I'll get out of my Woman Cave!
OW was on the phone with H before the day was over......
Good call Snodderly!
OW posted something on her FB about a neighbor calling for help, and she and her adult son did CPR, but the guy didn't make it. Massive heart attack.
I am sure H had to console her over this. I am not checking her page, but my sister is. And being the psychopath that OW is I almost think this was a way to get a rise out of my sister.
My sister's H died 7 months ago of a massive heart attack. My sister found her h in the garage, called for help and she and a neighbor did CPR til help arrived.
My H never spoke one word to my sister. Never. No condolances, no how ya doin?, no nothing. And then he was suprised when she didn't give him a gift for Christmas.....
Or maybe it is just another one of life's strange twists!
The kids cleared out and my H was off to bed by 8:15.
I think you are doing really well. And yes, OW is still playing around. I can't tell you how many times OW and xh broke up, and always got back together again. It appears to be over now, but I am not putting money on it. fortunately he is not in my life at all any more, except for a few stray financial dealings.
One suggestion. You do seem to be after him, asking him what the matter is, how he is etc. I suspect to a MLCer that does not come across as concern, but interference, which he resents. Remember back to your teenage kids? 'Are you OK' can be sooo misinterpreted by them.
Just leave him alone, and do not speak unless he speaks to you, and then reply as briefly as possible. Most of the time they want to pick a fight about something. If you do need to talk, keep it factual, with no emotive overtones/content at all. 'How are you' is not only intrusive to them, but it is asking a question they can't even answer!
You can't fix him, and the best thing for most MLCers is to leave well alone, to the point of ignoring them. This will sound hard to you, I suspect, and somewhat uncaring, but it is part of your disengagement from him. Imho he has a long way to go before he sorts himself out. The OW, remember, is a symptom, not a cause.
Many people go on believing that once OW is out of the picture normality stands a chance of being restored. But this is often not the case . . . If he finishes with her, he will likely still be crazy!
The only thing I can say is that it does get better, much much better. I can now clearly see that my xh is a sad messed up person, and I am so much better off without him in my life. Since I had a long and happy marriage this took a bit of getting used to. The change that MLC can exact is extraordinary. But it took a very long time to reach that total acceptance, and for it not to be a daily struggle.
Wen,
I agree with Beatrice you are doing very well with all of this.
While it is understandable that you are concerned for your H, please try to remember that this is the result of his choices and he has to learn to live with that.
He is angry and frustrated right now because he is beginning to see the results of what he has done. And it isn't as rosy as he pictured it.
Let him deal with this on his own.
I know it is hard to share a house with an MLCer. Having space of your own is going to be good for you.
My X moved into the spare room. He told me for weeks that he wanted me to clean it so he could move in there and I wouldn't do it. I had offered to move in there myself, and he said no he wanted to. So I left it for him to take care of. A little over a year later, after I had made "our room" into my room, he told me that he couldn't wait for me to move out so he could take that room back since he had only moved into the spare because I wouldn't. Didn't even remember that I had offered. Such is the way of MLC.
Keep enjoying your children and grandchildren and make good memories with them.
And enjoy your Woman Cave.
Wen,
He is a mess and will continue to be for a while. I agree with Beatrice in regards to leaving him a lone. He will eventually resent your attempts to "help" him and it will only explode in your face. Let him be with no assistance from you. Mid life crisis is about lessons learned. He needs to learn his. The sooner you detach and move out of his way, the sooner those lessons become a reality.
Hey All!
I have a slightly different take on his struggle with power cords yesterday. I set that room up so nice, there was nothing for him to complain about. Seriously. So he found something.
I had no intention of even talking to him this morning. But he didn't leave for work on time, and I finally came downstairs and I guess he was waiting for me, to talk/spew a bit.
It was funny. He said: "I need to apologise in advance. You are probably going to get a bunch of those anonomyous texts and emails from (OW's Name).
She is done with me and broke things off completely. Funny thing is it was because of you taking the master bedroom. She is mad at me because I'm not man enough to make you move out of that bedroom.
She said I could never be man enough for her if I can't control you. So again, I'm sorry if you get those messages today. Also your predictions of my ending up alone seems to be coming true. You were right."
I said to him I was sorry. I told him OW was stirring stuff up on FB. And for some odd reason, with tears running down my face I grumbled at him for feeling sorry for OW having to do CPR on her neighbor, but never saying one word to my poor sister when her H died and she had to find him in the garage and do CPR on him.
I didn't bring up our relationship issues at all. I didn't try and talk about us. I said goodby, and tried not to laugh at his parting shot as he walked out the door.
He said: "I will probably get fired from my job today for the trifecta of failure."
OH MY! Poor, poor, pitiful him! I am not backing down. I am keeping us separate. I do see how much work he has to do.
I will see the positive things:
HE admitted she was behind the anonymous crap.
He said more words to me this morning than in awhile.
He might be seeing results from his own actions.
He seemed concerned about her actions to me.
My current plan:
Not speak unless spoken to.
Keep on making plans for my future alone.
Finish staging house/get it on market.
Be out at night more than in.
Aloha,
Wendy
But, ummm, wait a minute.....
When I told H about the room he was angry. He threatned to move money. I told him to do what he has to, we will see lawyers, get the divorce rolling. Much more nastiness. I heard about his hard earned money, how I'm trying to control him, how he wants the master bedroom.
When I reminded him he said he would swith rooms he didn't remember that conversation. When I told him that if OW started back up with the texting/emailing me over this I would contact police he informed me that she broke up with him.
How could OW break up with him over the room, when you just told him about it and in the same convo he told you she broke up with him??? LOL
The craziness in their minds with the MLC depression is sometimes not to be believed.
And IF OW actually said that (you can't actually believe anything coming out of your H's mouth right now, you know) - then she really is an incredible whack job. Which we already knew.
It's a good thing though that he is finally admitting that she is behind the emails. And probably that's the real reason for the breakup, cuz he finally called her on that - which is good.
He may not be able to hear it from you, but if there is anybody else in his life who can suggest antidepressants to him, now would be a good time.
(And you're right, he complained about the power cords cuz he couldn't find anything else wrong to complain about.)
My current plan:
Not speak unless spoken to.
Keep on making plans for my future alone.
Finish staging house/get it on market.
Be out at night more than in.
And if you happen to be out at night dressed up all cute and wearing a little too much perfume.....all the better
But, ummm, wait a minute.....
When I told H about the room he was angry. He threatned to move money. I told him to do what he has to, we will see lawyers, get the divorce rolling. Much more nastiness. I heard about his hard earned money, how I'm trying to control him, how he wants the master bedroom.
When I reminded him he said he would swith rooms he didn't remember that conversation. When I told him that if OW started back up with the texting/emailing me over this I would contact police he informed me that she broke up with him.
How could OW break up with him over the room, when you just told him about it and in the same convo he told you she broke up with him??? LOL
The craziness in their minds with the MLC depression is sometimes not to be believed.
And IF OW actually said that (you can't actually believe anything coming out of your H's mouth right now, you know) - then she really is an incredible whack job. Which we already knew.
It's a good thing though that he is finally admitting that she is behind the emails. And probably that's the real reason for the breakup, cuz he finally called her on that - which is good.
He may not be able to hear it from you, but if there is anybody else in his life who can suggest antidepressants to him, now would be a good time.
(And you're right, he complained about the power cords cuz he couldn't find anything else wrong to complain about.)
I think she has broke up with him at least twice in the past 3 days..... It is very confusing
H talked to OW last night for awhile while the kids were here. And I think in the manner of 8th Graders she REALLY Broke UP with him, at least in his mind, this time. I have heard it so many times from him.
I just get that old song "Breakup to Makeup" in my head with all the gyrations those two have been through. And I thought more about her saying she was breaking up with him for sure because he didn't make me move out of the master bedroom.
She is a nut and wants to punish me. I have said from the start that she decided she wanted my life and it sure seems she is trying to get it. Sometimes I'm not even sure what this is all about. Except it comes with a large side order of CRAZY!
But I believe she wants him to fight with me more. Which I don't and never have. My mom was a fighter and a screamer. Still is...... I think I based my marriage and life on being the opposite. All well and good except the part where he and I don't know how to get over problems except by ignoring them....
KML: You suggested a book to someone called : "The Sociopath Next Door". I think OW is a sociopath. Other friends of mine told me they hated her on sight.
I said to one friend I felt dumb for missing it. (This is a smart friend, BTW) My friend told me that OW seemed to act differently towards me, she was kinder and nicer to me. My friend felt like she (OW) liked me and was therefore nicer to me than to my friends.
OW (Posing as my friend) also started cutting me off from my friends. Classic sociopath behaviour. And towards the end of our friendship I caught her in several lies. If I ahd used the 3 strike rule I would have had her out of my life sooner. I think she already had her hooks into my H by then.
I am ordering that book. I clearly need to work on my boundaries! And if I'm going to re-enter the dating world I should be learning how to protect against that sort of person.
I wonder if maybe one of my sons could bring up antidepressants with my H? I've thought he was depressed for awhile, but he is one of those genuine pill hating people. He is pretty healthy, other than his back. He takes only a few vitamins and no perscription meds.
I know from reading some of your early posts that I can't just slip them in his OJ! Too bad!
Hi, ADs might help, but he is still in MLC. And I also sense that a bit of you feels it was the OW. My take on this, is if not this one, someone else. A lot of LBS in the early stages tend to think, 'If only they hadn't met OP' What I see now much later on, is that someone or something would have found these MCLers.
My xh's OW definitely wanted my life, hated me etc etc. But he is done with her, and STILL in MLC [took 6 years to finally end, and a gazillion break-ups] Even now I wouldn't put it past either of them to hook up again. Crazy seeks out crazy.
People say 5-7 years. I thin if it is a real MLC rather than a 'difficult transition' it takes all of that, and some of them are stuck forever.
But if you h is 'simply' having a hard transition from one part of his life to another, and depressed about it, he may well work through it much sooner. He is still in the same house and still speaks to you. Mine took off, and only contacted me sporadically to spew. I haven't seen him [apart from briefly in Court 15 months ago], for two years now.
There are degrees of MLC I believe, although they share many of the same characteristics in the earlier stages. The hard cases just cannot face their issues. The old ties and loves seem eventually to pull the less severe cases back to their loved ones. It is a good sign that your husband still loves his grandkids, some don't even care about them!!
Hi Beatrice!
I know I shouldn't put so much blame on OW. She is for sure in her own MLC and crazy to boot.
I really feel my H has been in MLC since first OW back in 2000. The one I only found out about 2 months ago. Although if I had found this site sooner I would have know there was an OW, because it seems men don't leave unless they have a woman to leave to.
So he might be stuck forever. I am still trying to DB, because otherwise I might get really nasty. I am sticking to the rules, but really am making my path to my own future. I see my H and it is like I'm talking to a stranger.
I'm no longer planning on eating with him. I have been cooking like I'm cooking for 6, making plenty of left-overs. I thought this would bother me more. But so far it hasn't.
Sitting with him, watching TV, eating together those things bother me. Heading out the door to do something else doesn't bother me. Makes me feel like my own person.
I'm glad my H still loves his grandkids. Of course they lived less than a mile away for the first 18 months, and in our house for the next 18 months. We have been pretty involved in their lives. Right now they are here several days a week, all day.
I am trying to keep loving my H. I am just trying to not let it kill me! He is still acting put out about the room switch. But I am standing my ground. He also was sort of worrying over not having any dogs to sleep with. I just ignored that comment.
I was passing by getting boxes and tape, because I am sorting out every closet and anything that hasn't been used in 2 years just goes into a get rid of it box. Shocking how much stuff can be hidden in closets! I'm going to need more boxes.
I'm going to take a big load to the Swap Meet. I was going to donate it, but would rather have cash!
I really appreciate the views of you all on this board. I am turning into quite a philosopher thru this experience. A good thing, I think!
You are an inspiration, Wendy, with the way you have dealt with all this madness. I am sure you have your down days, but in general, you have kept upbeat, and positive.
Keep with your plans.
Thanks BeingMe!
This morning I was sitting at the kitchen table doing bills when H got up. I should have been hiding in my Woman Cave, but am following my instincts on this. If ever H talks about things it is first thing in the morning.
I was fully dressed, I have a full day today, my friend needs me to sit with her today, as her whole family has to go back to work or back to where they live on the mainland. Someone has to make sure she doesn't try to over do it, because she will!
Anyway, He said "Good Morning" when he emerged from his room. I replied with "Good Morning". He went out got his breakfast, complained that the glass he got out of the cupboard had mold in it. (I keep telling you all that living in the tropics isn't for sissies!) I said to sit it beside the sink and I would scrub it later.....
I asked him could he take care of our S22's insurance stuff today. He said yes, S22 is still sick, hopefully it takes effect right away. Then he askked was I getting any mmean texts or emails. I told him no.
He said that he is. He calls it her "Blowing UP His Phone". So OW is giving him spew like he has never seen. He is really hurt, by it. I just told him I was sorry she was being so mean. He went on to tell me all the stuff she is saying.
I was trying to stay out of it, but did have to tell him I don't think his next lover will be a man. I told him I was pretty sure he would move on to another woman. (Hardest part, was not laughing at how darn juvenile it all is.)
I was asked to apply for a job yesterday by my friend who is married to a 4 star. And she reminded me to watch for the invitation to their retirement ceremony this summer. So I brought this stuff up to my H, as everytime she and I make plans my H runs into her H within a few days.....
Anyway, my H said he couldn't go to the retirement ceremony because he is worthless, a coward, weak etc. (stuff OW said to him, I guess.) I sang a line out of Twisted Sister's classic "We're Not Gonna Take it!". The line:
No, We Ain't Gonna Take It
you're All Worthless And Weak
He wasn't amused. I told him he needs to play some different songs in his truck and learn to laugh at this. He just grumbled and left for work.
I'm sorry, but it is pretty darn funny. He doesn't know how to deal with this level of crazy/mean. And everyone here has said to let him and his affair run its course. And the fact that he wants to talk to me about it upsets some people.
I have been his best friend since Jan 1979. That is a long time. He doesn't have friends. He only has me and then her. And she isn't me and will never be me. And I'm pretty sure he and I are done with our marriage.
And he needs to work this all out in his own head. But I also think that sometimes saying things out loud helps with the process of what is going through someones head. He said he will never find an other woman. (Love that Black and White thinking!) I laughed and said that I was sure he would.
He went to work, and I gave him a hug on his way out the door. That is one hurt confused man. Wonder how long 'til she decides she wants him back?
He hasn't said another word to me about me who is in what bedroom. I will continue to be gone at night, and if I get home when he is still up, I will repair to my Woman Cave and continue my sorting of crap!
Breaking News! OW sent me multiple texts with photos attached. Screen shots of maps. My old phone is so crappy I can't see what they are. But the one message I can read says "By the way, I don't want your spineless man, keep him, you deserve each other" (sic)
I'm guessing there will be more to follow....... I'm not responding to her texts!
Screen shots of maps? What possible significance there?
You should simply keep pointing out to H that hers is not the behavior of a mature thoughtful kind human being, and he will be better off without her.
Then keep behaving like the mature thoughtful kind human being you are.
Well, the plot thickens. Evidently my H did go see OW while he was in DC. The screen shots are of maps from some program called Latitudes where you share your location with your "Friends". Great blackmail tool.
So now I know where in Arkansas he was. And why after 7 years of him refusing to travel for work he has started up again. (For the extra money that I would not know about.) He has it sent to his new account he set up. So he can pay his new credit card.
So he has been spending money on OW. His extra travel money he gets is his "Budget". Because yes I called him. And I know we are done, but why does he keep lying when the truth would suit better.
It made no sense to me that he would go clear to DC and not get in a side trip to OW. Does he really think I'm that stupid? And he may not know this, but his extra travel money is still income.
And her breaking up with him because I took the master bedroom while he was off seeing her? Whatever. That will never be her bedroom. It is mine. I am who he bought this house for, I am the one who wakes up with a panoramic view of Kaneohe Bay every morning.
And when I wake up alone in my bed now days and look out at the beauty before me I drink it in and know that I am special enough to deserve it! And someday I might wake up with someone special enough to share the beauty of the day with, but for right now I am okay with being alone and being myself.
Okay off to take care of my friend!
Aloha,
Wendy
lol Wendy... I don't think the MLCer is capable of recognizing good natured sarcasm from the LBS... even less likely to get the message from it as they most likely just block it or see it as a form of attack...
It's not really a surprise to you, is it, that he saw her on this last trip?
Good to know the financial information for your divorce, but don't let her manipulate her - she sent you that stuff precisely because she wanted you to fight with him, and you kinda fell into her trap.
Stick to the high road. Don't get into the crazy gutter with her. Be the calm rational contrast to her lunacy. If only for the sake of reassuring your H that he can find a non-crazy woman in the future, even if you don't want him. God forbid he ends up with her and your kids and grandkids have to deal with her.
She is truly a lunatic and she has nothing on you. One day your ex will be kicking his arse non stop.
Wendy,
The ow is not as crazy as you think...she knows exactly what she is doing and she also knows that if she created doubt and anger between you and your h, the better it will be for her. File the messages away and try not to discuss them w/your h. You just may need those messages for documentation in the future.
How is your friend doing?
I am sitting with my friend now. She is sleeping soundly. She wants to sew, but I think sleep is better. They put a little saline in her implants yesterday, pretty painful for her.
About all the texts and emails. It is funny, how it didn't upset me. It was just, yep, more crap from the crapmaster!
Soon this will all be history.
Remember Wendy,
You can't fix stupid, and you can't fix crazy either. I find it comical that this woman is behaving like this....it really is so "high school".
Wow...it's amazing these Ow the MLCers get involved with huh? I mean I always figured if H was going to leave me, may as well upgrade and find someone that would be considered much more outgoing and out shine me in many things. His OW... Are you kidding me?
Let alone your H OW....I don't get it! Don't get what he see's in her either!
They see what they want to see in the OW. Their fantasy of their soulmate and a woman who will truly love them for who they are..... My Ml'er wanted to "rescue" his damsel in distress. He got his damsel and now he is in distress.
I mean I always figured if H was going to leave me, may as well upgrade and find someone that would be considered much more outgoing and out shine me in many things. His OW... Are you kidding me?
Oh man, do I know this!!! I don't know why they downgrade...maybe is some inferiority complex within the R with us that they are running from?
They have very low self-esteem
I went to the dark side and asked my H a few questions this morning. He talked a bit, openly about what is happening. Then he got angry and told me this was a very painful period for him and he was too hurt to talk.
My answer to him was that he would feel better in about a year.
It was funny, because last night when we went off to our separate bedrooms he made it plain he wanted to talk in the morning. I guess he ran out of words. Or like my one theory, when you hear things out loud they sound different. (CRAZY)
What he wanted to talk about was that when he left her everything was sunshine and roses. By the time he landed she had done a 180 and hated him and they were through. He thinks her neighbor's death sent her over the edge.
But when I asked about how many days he was in Arkansas he got mad. I only asked because I had asked him to take some leave to work on the house and he just couldn't spare any leave.
And him wanting me to tent the house while he was planning to be with OW? He is just as crazy as she is.
The highlights of the 20+ texts and 5 emails I got from OW yesterday are this: He hates me more than he hates her, I'm ungrateful and so our my (Our) sons, I only want my H because he is my meal ticket, my H is a big baby who can't separate from me because I do everything for him.
She also sent several that were just personal attacks on him. A couple were pretty funny. Maybe not to him, but I was laughing. My personal favorite was when she accused me of just becoming her friend so that H could seduce he and that he and I could play with her emotions. She wondered how many other women we had done this with.
Oh the spew! And I didn't get mad about it. It was like water off a ducks back. Detachment is a wonderful thing!
I also got a text from OW telling me to ask my friends to stop sending her the anonomyous texts and emails. And the emails I got from her? They are again to the same email account that only 3 contacts have. Seriously. I gave it to her when we became friends because I did listen to the voice inside me a little bit. I wasn't sure I could trust her then.
Oh and who are the other 2 with that email? Best Buy and Macy's. I'm pretty sure they aren't sending me the anonomyous nasty personal emails!
Off to my day. I have errands and then over to sit with my friend. And it might make you all laugh, but it is COLD here. I might have to go find some socks and a sweater!
Aloha,
Wendy
My answer to him was that he would feel better in about a year.
LOL...nice one!
GOOD.FOR.YOU!!!
I honestly do not know how you have put up your sitch for so long...
T^2
You just have to laugh at this stuff, just laugh.
So funny, Wendy. "Your" OW is so much weirder than mine. She actually thinks that she has more rights to your H, than you, his wife, who he made vows to. I bet he wasn't rich when you married him, and not now either, so the "meal ticket" comment is just helium in her brain. You have been through thick and thin with your H, and now, after many years, he thinks it's okay to just dump you and go with someone else without so much as a "thanks for the good times". And OW thinks you did this on purpose ... what a dill head. Hilarious!!!!
Detachment is good, isn't it?!
I am not even going to give you a 2x4 re the asking H a "few questions". Since you're not standing per se, it may be a good idea to ask them while you still have him in the house. His comment about this being a "very painful period for him and too hurt to talk" underlines his MLC status. He has no inkling of the hurt and pain you experienced when he dumped you. I bet it was tempting to tell him, "s*cks, doesn't it?"
It is funny, I will tell you my H makes decent money. But we have a huge mortgage, so we are house poor. And it sure doesn't look like we will make any money when we sell it.
I worked for years. I have moved 13 times in the past 32 years. Remodeled 5 houses while we lived in them, in addition to us both holding jobs. Kids, scouts, church, volunteer work, and life. All I did helped him to get in that wonderful job he has now.
I was his meal ticket when we ment. He followed me to ROTC in college. I was making more money and handled all the details! Oh well! I think she says that because she is the one who has never supported herself, but has lived off one man or another her whole life! He will figure it out when she bleeds him dry!
Wendy,
I can't believe how you handle this so smoothly. Him talking to you about his problems with OW? I swear I don't think I could stop at just flipping him off from the other room. Things would be thrown.
But Wendy you couldn't handle this any more perfectly. And if you're not trying to DB, why the heck not ask questions?
but why does he keep lying when the truth would suit better.
Same reason my 14 year old son does, BECAUSE HE'S A TEENAGER!
You will see the different aged children within them throughout this. My XW lies about everything. Even stuff she doesn't need to lie about.
I got to see like a 6 year old version of XW this past weekend. We were leaving Church and I was walking to my car with my fiance and 3 kids, my XW came out to the parking lot and was skipping and yelling that she was getting a dinosaur for Christmas. My kids just looked at me like "What was that?!"
Just when you think it can't get any crazier, it will.
Oh Goody! I barely survived my two boys teen years....
I was re-reading the spew emailed to me today by OW. One thing is clear. She really wants me to know my H hates me. And the other thing that isn't clear is why she keeps giving me advise on moving on, letting go, blah, blah, blah.....
Clearly my H is not communicating to her what I am telling him. Which at this point is plainly me accepting that our marriage is over. Me not pursuing him in any way. Me pointedly sitting in a different room from him at night.
I do still eat some meals with him, but have cut way back on that. I am easing out of the picture. Maybe I should be more dramatic, but why? I am pretty much doing what I want.
Tonight, with all the breakup songs on American Idol I was glad I was a couple rooms away. That kind of thing is when I go into complete snarky comment mode. I probably couldn't have contained myself when they were singing "Somebody That I Used to Know".
Gosh! Your M sounds like mine, Wendy. I also worked for years to supplement our income, moved many times, even immigrated to two different countries. Brought up our 4 children, involved in Girl Guides, school trips, took care of our houses, spent a lot of time alone in new strange cities, while he went on extended business trips, yadda yadda yadda ... life in a busy family. We also have a largish mortgage. We are not wealthy by any standard, but there is enough money to put me and D19 through university. I see this as my time to study and start a new career.
I still cook for my H when he's home, but that is so rare, that it's almost not worth mentioning. I do what I want, and don't care if he has anything to say, which is never. He doesn't care. Sorry, don't want to hijack ... just commenting on the similarities between us. It's what keeps me coming back, that there so many people so similar to me, and my history, and also fighting this WAS/MLC war.
You can't get it right - I worked, raised a family, ran a successful business, made money. That was also WRONG.
According to him I neglected him and put my career first - not true. If I had done that I would have a LOT more money. It was a balancing act like everyone here - we all made different choices, and we all did our best. But not good enough for a MLCer. So goodness me, they run off with a crazy bimbetto!! And tell us solemnly that they are in lerve
You have to laugh as it is so pathetic and so untrue.
I am reading a book right now called "Cut Loose: (Mostly) Older Women Talk About the End of (Mostly) Long-Term Relationships"
Short horrer stories, okay really essays, about different womens experiences in being broken up with. Sadly it is helping me, a lot. So far only one of the stories ends with the couple getting back together years later and being happier than ever. Which I have come to view as the Holy Grail of getting dumped.
Anyway, just like reading our forums here, it is the same story over and over. Which is helping me to accept the inevidable.
I did grumble to H last night and this morning about OW and her crazy stuff. I told him if I'm not privy to what is going on in his life, he needs to quit sharing what is going on in mine with OW.
I was writing in my journal, and I realized that I need to get more separated. I don't know how. I might start spending weekends on the boat. Somethings gotta give!
Beatrice,
Your post reminded me of an interesting Hawaiian term: Kina'ole.
Kina’ole means “doing the right thing, in the right way, at the right time, in the right place, to the right person, for the right reason, with the right feeling…the first time.”
And most of us do live our lives that way. We try to do the best we can. But there are some who never get this concept. So MLC aside, I am feeling like maybe some people around me have missed this concept. They just don't care.
So I am seeking to surround myself with people who do care!
Okay, off to Power Yoga!
Warning: what follows is venting, whining and just crap!
I am actually pretty calm, just need to get this out of my system so I can sleep.
So H and OW were on the phone for about 2 hours this evening. I guess they made up.
Which is good, her emails are annoying. She needs to quit telling me how to move on with my life. I don't understand why she keeps telling me my H hates me, or doesn't care for me, or any of the other meaan stuff she keeps spouting.
And today my H said something about her to me and I said: yesterday you said she was crazy, today everything is fine? I really don't want to hear anymore. Then he goes on to say she is really a redhead. I look confused. She is blond. He explains that she has a bad temper. No honey, she is bat chit crazy! (I kept that thought to myself)
So I told him that I didn't understand why he was so mad about the room switch. He said he had a bad day he was up for 24 hours flying, then she was going nuts and I moved him to a different room.
Well I am sorry it is so much harder to find a flight out of Arkansas back to Hawaii most likely via DC. I'm pretty sure his difficult travel schedule was his own darn fault.
I told him that it was a comfortable room and he certainly couldn't have any complaints about it. He said he likes that it is darker than the master bedroom. But that he still can't find all his stuff.
I said that I hadn't liked waking up in the wrong bed, wrong room, everything changed. He said he doesn't like it either. I didn't say anything, but was thinking really loud. He has made his choices, now I am making mine.
And I said to him that I had just this morning put all my stuff back where it was originally before I moved out in October. And that I was going to enjoy not having to try and remember where my socks were.
He said again he doesn't like things being different. I told him everything was going to be different from now on.
I also told him I didn't like what mean things OW said to me, that for her to call me names is unacceptable. I reminded him I don't call names. And in addition to all the other things I have had to deal with over the years I resent anyone acting like I haven't pulled my fair share of the load.
I reminded my H that I had been the main caregiver for the many years of our boys and their bad asthma. Both boys had breathing treatments 4 times a day for many years. I know where every rest stop was that had electrical outlets so when we traveled I could get a machine running.
I have slept on the floor beside their beds to make sure they were breathing okay, I have done more time at ER's and even now deal with their asthma as adults. My oldest son spent last Christmas in the ER with his asthma. And I was there with him, because he wanted me there. Because he knows I know when to complain and when to sit and wait.
My H was special ops and was gone at least 50% of the time. And when he was around they worked some long hours. They flew a lot of nights and that ment being quiet during the day. So often we would just go out so he could get is crew rest.
A big part in my decision to get out of the reserves was how sickly my kids were. And I was also in a special ops unit, and we all know how that goes.
And to have OW, who was a WAW in her first marriage and who LEFT BEHIND her 9 year old son tell me I an an ungrateful user is just about too much crap. And not to beat a dead horse, but I have worked enough to earn social security benefits. She is 54 and hasn't. It is like she is projecting her bad stuff on me.
I am putting this whole scene in my rearview mirror as soon as I can. I don't know how a person could ever get past all the mean being handed to them. And H is so good at handing mean out.
If this is his true self coming out, it is darn scary.
OKAY! Enough of the complaining!
I have one or another of my old friends write something nice on my alt universe page about once a day. Things about me being positive, or just that they miss me. I know I am not a bad person. I can happily figure out my new place in the world.
And most of all I can let go or that anchor who is dragging me down!
Wendy,
I am so sorry that she's still texting you. She is trying to bring you down and make you so angry that you will pick a fight w/your h and/or you leave. It's very childish, but that's what she's doing. She knows that your h isn't doing much in the way of arguing w/you or making you angry, so she's going to help the situation along. Please, please do not allow what she is sending you to get under your skin. She shouldn't be hurling rocks at anyone...she needs to take a good, long, hard look in the mirror at what she's done. She's certainly not mother of the year by any means.
As for your h, everything has changed and nothing will ever be the same again...and who is at fault for this change taking place? No one, but him. So, now he has to live w/it or start making the right decisions that will involve both you and him and not the ow.
Please take care of yourself.
Thanks Snodderly!
I have my weekend planned. I am going to sew all day tomorrow with my bee. It was supposed to be a marathon, but will be from 10 am to 7 pm. I'm sure I will be tired of sewing by then....
And I told H I was going to sleep on the boat for the weekends. There are movie theaters and resturants and a mall all right across the street from the boat. I'm sure I can occupy myself.
I have noticed that when ever I am making my plans and moving on it is when H gets agitated, then OW gets agitated, then she starts on me. She posts stuff on FB and then texts me to look at it. Or she sends me emails and when I don't respond she texts me to look at them.
I don't have a smart phone, I don't have my life electronically all hooked together. I think she has me so monitored that if I sneeze she knows it. For sure she looks at my FB all the time.
I am taking care of myself. I won't miss yoga. I am sleeping the right hours. I am eating well. I have stopped losing weight. Haven't gained any back. I need to lose about 30 more pounds, but the stress of dieting is not what I need right now.
I really appreciate hearing back from you. It is nice to hear the voice of reason, amongst all the crazy!
Anyone who wants to play that new game Scramble with Friends should try it. It is a fun game and since you play in 2 minute rounds it doesn't eat up your time! My game name is easy to guess, someone challange me!
Oh Boy, did my day take a turn for the weird! I went to Sprint and finally got my new phone. And a young man approached me trying to buy my old phone for $50. He lost his out drinking last night, it seems. I asked him was he a marine, he said yes. I asked how old he was, he said 22.
His contract renews in 2 weeks. Meanwhile he is out of luck.
I told him he could have my old phone, after the guy transferred my data off, then whiped it to factory condition for me. (The front touch screen no longer cares if you touch it, the volume switch works when it wants too and the ringer speaker is intermittant. It is a red fold in half girl looking phone.)
He must have been deprarate.....
Anyway, I gave him my number, to give back my micro SD card when he gets his new phone. He walks out of the building with me and asks me out. I say no, I've got plans. He tells me I sure don't look 52 and could we get together tonight and hang out.
As ammusing as all that is, I really don't feel like dating 22 year olds. And my friend who just had surgery needed me for the afternoon. I told him maybe he could hang out with my kids. He made it plain he wanted to hang out with their mom.
Anyway, 6 texts and 2 phone calls later, I'm still laughing. I'mm invite him over next time my son has all his pottery friends over. But isn't my ego getting a boost!?!
My boat plans are getting ruined. My son decided the weather conditions are right, so he is trying to head out to Molakai. Wish I could go, but he needs help babysitting.
I'm just staying flexible!
Aloha,
Wendy
PS KML I was thinking about your cougar posts.....
I had a little awakening yesterday. At the bee I got roped into doing someone else's crazy project that they volunteered for. (Hand sewing 40 curtins for a historical project.) I don't want anyone to know I was involved, because the only thing authenic about this was that they are badly done. No self respecting missionary woman ever made such horrid curtins for her windows.
At the end of the day, I asked myself why I , once again, let someone step on me and push me around. My quilt for the quilt show isn't finishing itself. Everyone seems to think I can just drop my plans and do theirs.
And this is because I LET THEM!
I went out to a place last on Pearl Harbor Base called "The Country Bar". Didn't dance, need to freshen up my line dancing skills. I didn't stay long, but chatted with a few nice couples. I'm going to bring my kids with me next time, I think they woyld have fun.
Today my H and I went to breakfast at Denny's. I may be saying I'm done with him, but I am still doing my best to not talk, keep up my changes, and move on gracefully. Like some on here say, I can do what I need to do for me. And leave room for him to catch up later. Later might be in 10 years. Or I might be married to the nicest guy in the world by then. Time will tell.
But right now I am just considering him to be a feral cat. I'll keep putting out the food bowls for now. And not make any sudden moves toward him. I don't know what to say or do about OW. I need to ignore her, and all her crap.
Today the kids and I went to see the Dalai Lama. He spoke here in Honolulu today. I loved hearing him speak. Even better was listening to my kids talk about what they heard him say. I have some smart kids!
Anyway, what I took away from what I heard today from the Dalai Lama was to love EVERYONE, even our enemies. Forgive, but don't forget. You get what you give. And he spoke about perspective. And I realized that is what detachment is, putting things into perspective.
The Dalai Lama spoke about how when we focus on a problem it obscures our whole field of vision. But if we back away and look at the problem differently, further away and from a different angle we can see that the problem isn't as big or horrible as we thought.
He is a pretty funny guy. Told a few funny stories.
Anyway, I will continue to detach, get my house ready to sell, but I'm not filing any paperwork. The lawyer I spoke to told me that at this point I gain nothing by filing now. She said keep all my financial records. If the house gets under contract, she says that is when I need to get more serious.
I still want to be/feel more separated from my H. He still wants to act like all is okay, 'til we go to bed in our serarate bedrooms. I spent a lot of time away from him this weekend. And right now, this very minute, I feel him trying to feel closer to me. Sharing meaningful glances over a TV show we are watching together. He asked me to watch TV with him. But made sure I knew he was calling OW, asked for a few minutes.....
I am just going to keep playing things by ear. Op Feral Cat will be going on here, too.
Aloha,
Wendy
PS KML I was thinking about your cougar posts.....
LOL! See, it's not just me! There's a whole weird zeitgeist out there, with young men pursuing US. Who'd a thunk it???? It NEVER happened to me in my 30's and 40's.
As for your H - that's fine that he invited you to watch TV with him, but the second he got on the phone to OW, I would be out the door.
KML
He excused himself to the other room to make a call. I went into my Woman Cave and was busy. He then came to my door and asked me if I wanted to watch TV. Then shared meaningful glances.
GOD ONLY KNOWS what he is thinking.
Ha ha - you assume he's THINKING????
BTW - why on earth don't you change your privacy settings so OW can't see your FB?
yes Wendy,
that's what I was going to say. You can change your privacy settings to where nobody can look at your facebook unless you friend them.
That's what I did, was curious if OW was checking me FB out.
I changed my settings and she friended a friend of mine, local dj who accepts all friend requests. Then she was able to see because I had it set to friends of friends or something like that.
I private messaged to dj friend and asked her to unfriend OW. She did. I like leaving it on friends of friends because I do my class reunions and want my extended network, who I don't want to friend all of the,m to be able to see what they want.
I just find it silly that she persists in the spying, text messaging, emailing. She has stopped for right now. I told my H that I see when he tells her stuff about what is happening in our house that is when I get the hate. I told him to quit telling her my stuff. I know he won't stop. But at least then he can notice the cause and effect!
Went for nice long walk, 4.26 miles according to my log your run computer. Don't leave out that .26! Anyway it was a good walk. I did discover the Hawaii equivalent of Black Ice. How about black mold growing on black asphalt roads?
I walked to the side of the road where big trees grow, about a mile from home. I hit that black mold and I'm sliding like crazy! I ended up in a skating stop right foot planted in front knee bent, top of left foot, shin and knee sliding down the little hill I was on.
Used my toe brake to stop. Beautiful form, only the toe of my shoe, the knot in my shoe lace, my shin and my knee were dirty. I got a road burn on my knee, but didn't even end up bleeding!
Thank goodness for the flexibility I've gained from Yoga!
So aside from that, while on my walk I said hi to one of the security guards over at the community college. I used to walk through there pretty often. I hadn't been walking for a couple months, been doing yoga and weights. I decided to put walking back in my workout routine, it is one of the best things for the stressed brain.
Anyway, the security gueard said Hi back, then he said: "You look nice!" I keep saying I don't know what it is about yoga, but I swear it really does help with the reshaping after/during weight loss! So with that compliment in my head, I will get some work done around here!
Wow... I think I need to start yoga!
I thought on FB if anyone had mutual friends it would alert you. I know OW and I had about 3 or 4 mutual friends. Oddly enough, her ex SIL be friended me. Her Ex SIL's son used to go to preschool with my D9. Now why on earth her SIL would want to friend me when we're not hardly aquaintences???? What even blew me away is she befriended one of my friends from HIGH SCHOOL??? This woman is 8 years older than me and she befriended someone from my High School about 2 months after I found out about them. I too had things set that friends of friends could see me. Then I decided to delete our mutual friends and re set it to friend only invite.
You'll have to excuse me Wendy, but did you ever feel like this OW wanted YOUR LIFE and did all she could to weasel her way into it, weave her tangled web she weaved and then take it from you?
LOl... and they say the MLCer places blame... listen to me talk.
No but really....XH's OW used to sit and stare at me alot, and never talk. She once told me how beautiful I was and that the girls looked just like me and they were so lucky because of that. Then she'd sit there and stare at me some more! I remember being weirded out back then!
Kimmerz, I KNOW OW is trying to steal my life. She wants it all. I think she is a sociopath. I think she couldn't tell the truth if you paid her. Too bad what she is going to end up with will be the bad half.
OW claims to have been kidnapped when hitchhiking while running away from the childrens home her folks put her in. She claims to have jumped from the kidnappers car and has a scar under her neck from where the knofe wqas held.
She claims she was in the hospital for 2 weeks, never spoke and no one ever figured out who she was......
She also claims to have been shot in the leg while a store she was in was being robbed.
I have never met someone who started off so charming and who went into crazy so well.
I had switched my FB to the new timeline, and hadn't noticed the mutual friend thing. I actually didn't even know she had a page 'til she texted me to go look at it. She didn't text me, it was one of those anonomyous ones.
She also has my H convinced I gave out her phone number and house number and all my friends were harassing her. When I asked to see some proof of this, like phone records, they wern't available. Funny thing. Well she is in Arkansas now.
I am doing my level best to just not engage her, and ignore her crap. Although I did start doing screen captures of the crazy stuff she writes on FB. She deleted most of it. But I got the last little bit of lunacy.
All is quiet right now, the love birds must be back on their honeymoon. They do great apart, and everytime they see each other all hell breaks loose......
Oh My Word Wendy!!
Oh Wendy Im speechless. Just speechless.
How long were you friends with her before she starting making a play for your H?
Oh she is hands down sociopath/borderline crazy. They really come across as charming, engaging, your best friend, and will make damn sure that what is all yours will be taken away some way or another. People like her are drawn to caring, compassionate, trusting, loving, fun, smart, and wonderful people, and feed off it. Wonderful people like you Wendy.
So tell me this. If our husbands were smart enough people at one time to see the good things in us, how on earth can they be brainwashed by these sociopath OW? Sorry, here I am thinking rationally again....MLC= irriationality. I guess it's two wrongs thinking they're making a right? Seriously, just how do they entrap these men? I guess they just pump their heads full of everything they want to hear. I firmly believe that XH's point of view on me was radically altered by her pumping him full of lies and ideas. His mother caught this going on at Thanksgiving and pulled him aside and tried to talk sense into him, bless her heart.
I know it sounds so long ago, but I had a girl that did this to me in Junior High and even tried in HIgh School. This girl did her best to ruin me, aliente my friends, spread rumors, you name it, she did it. I hated her so bad, but then after time marched on I felt sorry for her. And boy oh boy did Karma catch up with her. I just kept on being me, and everyone soon knew the stuff she was saying was wrong.
So Wendy you just keep on being the wonderful you. Everyone see's it...especially those young guys trying to pick you up needing a cell phone...and of course the security guard. You're emulating the true beauty within!
I will keep being the wonderful me.
To say that this is "sad" that this has happened to our H is an understatement. But in the wake of all this pain, maybe this is our chance for our good Karma to come to us. I think we should give ourselves some credit and remember all the wonderful things we did for our H out of love, and how we just loved them and accepted them anyway. How we strived to stand and still love them when they're not loveable at all. How we took this oppurtunity to re discover ourselves, and how it will only enrich our lives from here on out.
And upon looking at ourselves like this, it's not to look down upon our H's and all the wrong they've done and that we're above or superior. But still making the choice to try in the wake of all this madness. gee... I think we're beautiful and brave souls to even try.
I've been very inpatient with myself for my huge waves of frustration, anger and resentment towards H lately. It's only normal and by golly I have a right to feel this way. I've been so mad at myself for even trying to stand and hope to outlast the MLC, and hope he comes back to us. My pride has taken a beating.
But Im not too proud to admit that I tried my very best. Just because it didn't come out the way I wanted it, doesn't mean I failed or Im a failure.
I swear Kimmerz, I have reach some weird point where stuff just isn't bothering me. H was getting texts while we were eating. So was I. We neither picked up phones. I said "Oh busy phones!" He said OW is sending him philosophical questions to answer.
I said, Really? He said I can't share them with you, if you write about it on FB she will get mad. I then asked when I had written anything on Fb to make her mad. I also told him he can look at my FB anytime he wants. I don't write anything on there I have to worry about.
Kimmerz, you come across as a wonmderful person. I'm sure we both will have nice things happen in our futures!
Heck, so many people on here say how things always turn out. Many of them seem to have an uncanny ability to predict the future, so I will believe them on that, too!
Hey Wendy! Teach me Yoga! lol
I just wanted to jump in here and say that when xh left and I was doing all the questioning. I said to him I thought he was Happy at home, intimate life included.
He said yes he was BUT he wanted to try something different, something challanging.
Now I know they lie but I think he was being pretty honest.
It was like he craved challange.
He told one of my good friends husband that he wanted to have twin girls! He said he needed a change and a challange.
We could not have stopped them if we were made of gold!
They think they missed out on something and are willing to take the risk (he said that too), of losing everything for the rush.
By everything, I mean family, kids, job.....even personal belongings and favorite hobbies.
Unreal!
What is funny about the security guard saying I looked nice was that he was also a 20 something guy. Funnier is I started wearing only things that look attractive on me. I tossed out heaps of clothes. I bought more of the things I was getting compliments in.
One of those things was golf skirts. I wear those to walk in. I look great in them. H had made the bold statement on one of his brief "We are getting back together" spells that I was to never wear skirts or dresses again.
He thinks I look awful in them. I think he has my flaws under a microscope, and they look 100X's worse to him than to normal people. I have slightly heavy legs, even when I loose weight. And for some odd reason he gets all weird about it.
I will tell you all that he has big solid legs of his own. He lifts weights and looks great. But if he is standing with a group of men all in shorts, he has the heaviest legs. I sometimes think he is projecting that self-loathing onto me.
Oddly, when we were leaving Tampa I had a huge yard sale and he went into my closet and brought out all my dresses and hung them on the sale rack. This was around the time he had decided to leave me the first time, them begged me to take him back.
I should have realized then that that sort of action requires therapy. Anyway, I shy away from dresses and skirts due to his weirdness. I did buy 4 dresses this year and have started wearing them. I have decided I am what I am and what you see s what you get.
HOWEVER, I am grumpy as heck. SOMEONE ate all the ice cream. That is so mean. I have been wanting something all day, finally went to the freezer, and GONE, BABY, GONE.....
My H also brought up with me that I said I would have the whole house staged and ready to go on the market by the time he got back from DC. I bit my tounge and didn't say that he told me he wasn't seeing OW on his trip, too.
Guess we are both big fat liars!
Hi Wendy. Just wondering ... did you say you would have the house ready to be staged, or did he tell you to have it staged, and somehow it's been twisted?
It seems to be his MO ... leaving you with all the work, while he goes off somewhere.
PS I like the Operation Feral Cat idea. I also put the bowl out every night. So far, nothing solid yet.
Oddly, when we were leaving Tampa I had a huge yard sale and he went into my closet and brought out all my dresses and hung them on the sale rack. This was around the time he had decided to leave me the first time, them begged me to take him back.
Ahh, this sounds so familiar! My ex had issues with my figure even when I was a too-skinny 5'6" 125 lbs (with a killer figure, I might add).
Fortunately, even though I weigh quite a bit more now, I have found that men I have dated since my divorce LOVE my figure and find no fault with it!
When it came to "Operation Room Switch" I did tell my H that he wouldn't recognise the place when he got home. That I was working on staging the house. How he choose to interpert that is his own problem. I think the 4 rooms I got staged look wonderful. And when I get a storage unit and haul the boxes I packed out the whole house will look great.
He is still a little grumpy about the room switch. I'm a little grumpy about him lies about where he was for 4 days. So it all works out. I still tell him when I will be gone and where I'm going. He gets very upset if he doesn't know exactly where I am.
But when he decides to go out he gets mad if I ask what movie he plans to see, or where he is eating. I actually realized it is me being controlling. He went to the movies the other night. I didn't ask him what he saw or where he ate. Because I really don't care. Funny how once you notice your behaviour, you can change it.
And the next time I plan to go out, I am going to start answering his questions the way he answers mine. He always says "That is my private business." So my whereabouts and activities need to be my private business.
Autonomy is what I need!
I also quit hugging H hello and goodbye. We are separated, he said so! So I am trying to be serarated. It hurts me to not have the hugs, but I need real hugs from someone who cares, not scraps thrown to me!
Standing on my own two feet, I will be the one wearing a dress!
And the next time I plan to go out, I am going to start answering his questions the way he answers mine. He always says "That is my private business." So my whereabouts and activities need to be my private business.
Bravo! Sauce for the gander, sauce for the goose!
Plus - should you be going out in a hot dress wearing new perfume and nice makeup - he can wonder about where you might be going and who you might be meeting. It is a good thing for them to think about whether you might interest another man - sometimes that's when their brains snap back into reality, so better for him to experience that NOW, than when you are long gone and into some other guy.
I'm not suggesting you lie - just give the APPEARANCE (later totally deniable) that you MIGHT be out there available to other men. And if a nice bouquet of flowers mysteriously appears in your living room - and if he asks about them, you say "Oh, they're from a "friend" and leave it at that - so much the better
Operation Feral Cat is going on here, too. I keep doing the gone gray thing, but I also haven't slammed all the doors shut.
When I stepped through the door after yoga last night H said: "Good timing, I just started watching House." So I watch that show with him. I had been gone all day, I could have come home between my appointment and yoga, but choose to be away, went to the beach until it got too dark to look for shells!
This morning H did something he hasn't been doing. He came over and sat with me while he ate his breakfast. In the past few months he has developed this bad habit of eating his breakfast standing in the kitchen. And I found it hurtful. He also initiated a conversation. About a game on his phone, but anyway it was a conversation.
I'm not holding out a whole lot of hope for he and I. But sometimes I see old him lurking there. I will continue to keep my detachment and work my what is next for me plan. And I will keep putting the food bowl out for that cat!
On a happy, happy, joy, joy note: Yesterday I got a call from Pepsi Company. I entered a contest and won the regional grand prize. Which was a $600 gift card to Best Buy. It was the Mountain Dew Fuel the Frenzy Sweepstakes. Anyway, I will save the card for something special for myself.
Life is funny!
I'm off for another long thinking walk!
Congratulations on winning! Don't hold that gift card too long....some of the Best Buys are closing and I don't know if they are on your island. You might want to check that out!
Hang in there!
Nice! You could get a new laptop for that. Or a video camera. Or an iPhone.
Congrats on the win, Wendy! Oh, I wish I had a proper beach to walk on and collect shells. Our beaches here are all pebbles. But, I am grateful that I'm by the ocean.
"Operation Feral Cat" is on the go here too. I am pleasant, but distant. I, too, am not sure about our staying together.
Life is VERY funny.
I have had a deep love for the ocean and shell collecting since I was an 8 year old and my dad got stationed in Okinawa. It is my true grounding activity. Leaving Hawaii will be hardest because of the ocean.
And my favorite beach here is also where my son got married. I made him get married on the end of the beach where there is a circle of rocks, sort of a natural gathering area. My son later thanked me for being a brat about which spot they stood on the beach. It was funny, but heck I used to go to that beach 6 days a week. I only go once a month now, I realized it was an obsession!
My H continues to be pleasant to me. I'm not sure what to make of it. Just continuing the putting out the food bowls.
He enjoys a beer now and then. I noticed there was none left, so I stocked his beer fridge for him, bought his favorite ice cream and bananas, and put a candy bar on his nightstand. (Our granddaughters ate all his easter candy.... and I know he was looking forward to the Reeces bunnies!)
But I made sure I was out again last night. My friends had a BBQ on the beach.
I wanted to update you all on my friends recovery from her double masectomy. First nothing in the one lymph node they took.
Second, it looked pretty horrifying at first, but looks better every day. Right now it looks very good, mormal, perkier than before. And yes, as BFF my job was to stand beside her when she took the wrappings off and looked.
You all would have been very proud of me last week. I never cried in front of her, I have been upbeat and just givimg her lots of hugs and forehead kisses if she is laying down when I leave. The second day, the first time she had to look in the mirror I did cry the whole way home.
I can't wait for the tatttoo part. Bet I end up with a tattoo just to keep her company. I am not a big tattoo fan, and as an artist could never be happy with someone elses work on my body..... ;-)
Today after my yoga class I'm taking her bra shopping. And we plaqn a little time on the beach getting some sun. She can't go in the water yet, though.
Aloha,
Wendy
Today was sort of a bittersweet day. About 9 years ago the diamond ring that my MIL gave me after I cared for her with her initial bout with cancer was stolen. Insurance only paid $1,000 because somehow when we moved and changed policies around the ring rider was dropped.
About 2 years ago I asked H could I replace the ring, same setting, only with a Moissanite stone. I ordered the seting and the stone. Spent $1,500. (The ring with real diamond would have been $6,000) then the jeweler said he couldn't set it, wrong size stone, blah, blah, blah) I studied a bit of that in college, and thought he was being silly.
And not long after that my happy marriage went on the rocks. I put away the setting and stone, not really worried about it. Recently my S22 got an aprenticeship with a jeweler. I sent in the setting and the stone and my suggestion as to how to make it work.
Today my son brought in the ring, very beautiful, set perfectly. My H had this huge smirk on his face. My son and I had already discussed this. I have lost so much weight that the ring is way too big. It fits perfectly on my middle finger, though. I said not to size it, I would wear it there.
I figured at this point, what is the sense of getting a ring made for my ring finger of my left hand? To me it would seem like persuing him. My son left the room, and I kept the ring on my middle finger. I am just happy to have back a reminder of my MIL.
Shortly after H said he was tired and went to his bedroom. He did look tired.
I would have liked it better if my son had not brought the ring in so dramatically. But he had just got off work, he was proud to show it off, and he had just got paid, and was excited about that. (They gave him cash, somehow that was more fun than a paycheck.)
Wendy,
I am so happy to see that the reminder of your MIL is right back were it should be...on your finger. I'm glad you waited to have it set because it sounds like this jeweler didn't have an issue w/doing it the way you had wanted it.
BTW, be sure to hug your son...he was very happy, excited and proud to do this for his mother.
I hope today is a good one for you!
Had another slew of texts from Bat Chit Crazy OW. H got home from work and didn't see my car here. (Because my DIL took mine and left hers for my son to take later.) I also have the granddaughters for the night.
So he walks into the house chatting away on his bluetooth to OW. Pretty funny look on his face when he saw me. He waves his phone at me. I was pretty sure he wasn't talking to me, because well heck he sounded pleasant. He asked me about the car, I told him I had the girls for the night. He went into his room and closed his door behind him.
About the time he walks out of his room my phone gets 4 texts. Which was just one long spew from OW. Pretty much she thinks if my friends knew the real me they wouldn't be my friends anymore. Which is irritating, because it sounds to me like she wants to spew to my friend, who she hated the first time they met. (Actually they both disliked each other on sight....)
I am trying my best to just ignore her and her crap. It is pretty funny that just the sound of my voice sent her into such a rage. I thought H was not talking to her ever in our house out of respect. Silly me, he is afraid of setting her off.
I will state for the record that if she contacts my friend who just had a double masectomy, there will be trouble.....
Can you not bar her number? It is possible in most parts of the world. Is there is problem with this where you are - I know they can always get another number, but eventually they stop . . ..
Also how can she talk on the phone and text simultaneously?
I am sure you do not have to put up with unwanted texts. It must be awful for you. And sad that our spouses allow someone to do this abuse without any kind of check on them or thinking it is a bit weird.
LOl....ok hit the return button too soon!
BLOCK HER NUMBER!
Wendy, these two are on planet Junior High School! Sending nasty texts to the wife of her affair partner? Starting stuff with your friend that just had the surgery? Well like we say alot here...you can't make this stuff up! Oh ya, if someone did that to my friend that had just gone through surgery like that, there would be some trouble from me too.
Welcome to planet alienator! He jumped on the mother ship and she's the alien driving...I can't believe this stuff!
You are handling it with such dignity and grace. I admire you Wendy. I mean really they're acting like children. I can't say that I personally would handle the situation with such dignity and grace if OW was doing that to me. Luckily OW has stayed far away from me since her Xh tried to kill my XH.
Oh how....Gerry Springer my life has become. Just disgusting really.
You know Wendy, we really deserve better than this.
@Beatrice: She has a smart phone, and you can text/talk at the same time. I know because I ended up getting the same phone as she had. I only know this because H told me...... (Mine is the newer white one, way prettier!)
I just blocked her from texting or calling me. I had to call the phone company, as I couldn't do it from my smart phone. Because my H still has control of my account.
I think he and I need to go to the phone place in person and sever out accounts. I have avoided taking these steps, but what does it matter?
@Kimmerz: Yes, we deserve better than this!
Oh, this gets sillier and sillier. My sister called me and asked me had I looked at OW's FB page. I said no, I don't look at it. Well, my sister had recently posted a song on her own page, trying to get her point across to me to dump the loser and move on. It just said someone I know needs to listen to this.
Within an hour of me blocking OW's texts and phone calls OW goes on her own FB page and posts the exact same video as my sister, from 1992. Hardly a coincidense. And then posts some more of her inane philosophy about who your friends are and who they aren't.
So my sister posts a parody of OW's philosophy, it reads sorta the same only with an entirely different meaning. (My sister is not one to cross....)
Withing one hour of my sister posting that, and I asked her to quit poking that bear, H gets an urgent phone call which he takes in his bedroom. I continue on sewing, and after the call went on over 30 minutes I ordered a pizza and went and picked it up.
When I got back we ate and he asked me if I wanted to watch a movie with him. I am working like crazy on finishing a quilt, and have many hours of hand sewing to finish, so I listened to my gut and said yes. We ate our pizza and I kept it zipped. We watched "Water for Elephants".
At one point I handed H something and he said: "Thanks Babe". I kept it to a "You're Welcome". He looked funny when he said it, but I kept on my Yoga Smile.
I am holding out ZERO hope for my relationship. But find the slip of the tounge pretty funny. And that was after he listened to OW spew for at least 45 minutes.
OKAY, I need some sleep. I almost hate to wonder what the next move will be. My sister is not a woman to mess with. She was a cheerleader in high school and has been president of her quilt guild.......
So my point above is that OW isn't getting reactions out of me, so she moves on to my sister? Am I reading it wrong?
Thanks for setting me straight about smart phones [which I avoid as I am technologically challenged !!] But the point I was also trying to make was that if I were talking to the 'man of my dreams' I would not be simultaneously sending nasty texts to his wife!! Heck I find texting a full time occupation in itself, requiring my attention.
My xh has forgotten how to text btw. Really strange - we used to text all the time, and he said to me a couple of years back 'I can't text, and never have done' Hmmm
Anyway, glad you have blocked nutster woman.
I would separate everything. Even if I ever got together with someone else in a serous way, I would be much more separate in my financial life. I love having my own bank account, credit card and so on. Makes me feel like a grown up! Done with sharing my financial life with ANYONE
Wendy,
How is it the ow can see your sister's FB page? Was she friended there? If not, your sister needs to "unfriend" her. Poking the enemy isn't a good thing and because the ow is so nutty, you don't know what she'll do next.
I'm right there w/Bea...how can you concentrate having an oral conversation w/someone and texting his wife at the same time? She is way out there and I don't trust her one bit. There may come a time that you have to file a restraining order to get her to stop the nonsense on the phone and/or notify the phone service so that they do something about her.
I hope things settle down for you, but I seriously doubt that the ow will let the dust settle for very long. Please be careful.
My sister leaves her page wide open. (Like I used to do, too.) We are military brats who were military wives and I also was in the service for about 10 years. I never cared if any random stranger, or even some old friend wanted to look at my photos.
OW is nuttier than a fruitcake. I already told the story about how back when we were still friends, she and H wanted us to all go on a hike. And I got the craziest BAD feeling about it and begged off and stayed home. It sounds crazy, but I still think someone was going to push me off a cliff that day.
I think OW had sent that text in the time it took my H to change out of his work clothes after he got off the phone with OW. I just think she heard my voice and it set her off. She knew he was hanging up with her and then coming out to eat dinner with me and the granddaughters.
But I have seen her text and talk at the same time. And just to see if it worked, I got a text from someone while on the phone with my sister, and I was able to send back a one word reply. I certainly couldn't do both well at the same time, mentally.
Let us see what fun today brings.....
How much longer before you kick him out of the house Wen?
That OW? Nice. Very classy of her. But I would expect she'll keep that up for a while. She isn't going to be very secure in the relationship while he is on the fence like that. Living in your house but pursuing her...
The question becomes how long you'll put up with it?
Songs can be interesting sometimes. Heard this one?
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/sugarland/stay.htmlAJ
Hey AJ!
I am afraid to kick him out. I think he would then start doing nutty things with the money. We have a huge mortgage and currently a bit too much on credit cards.
I pay the bills, and I know where we stand. We let out kids move back in and we went from breaking even to in debt. And just haven't recovered. I should have kept my job and never bought that boat. Hindsight is 20/20!
The way I see it is we will list the house, looks like next week. Sell it in the next couple months, and go on then to live apart. He can have her and all her drama.
He could be living away from me, he could stay on the boat. But he won't. And I really don't want to go down and live in the heart of Waikiki on the boat myself. It isn't like regular docks. There are no security gates and a TON of homeless people live down there. (Homeless tweakers.....)
That is a nice Sugarland song. I won't post it on FB, though.
The drama is getting over-the-top! I just want to make quilts and play with my grandkids!
Aloha,
Wendy
So - once you list the house, should you be filing? I just hate to see the house sell without you having some kind of legal protection in place. And I'd be worried about him spending his half and leaving you holding the bag for the credit card debts or whatever.
OW is a crazy whack job and I agree with everyone else - your sister should block her on FB. No need for ANY contact, it just gets her wired up. And I have no idea how dangerous she might be.
It's interesting that you had that scary intuition about the possibility of her pushing you from a cliff. That IS weird that they invited you on a hike before you knew about their affair. And she sounds just loony enough. Watch your back.
For some odd reason, today was the day. You know, the day I just had enough. H and I worked on the yard together. We came in and I started dinner. He asked what I wanted to watch on TV. He starts a show on the DVR. Then he gets and takes an hour long call with OW.
I switched the DVR over to watch somthing I like and he doesn't. (Nurse Jackie) He comes back from his bedroom and his call. Dinner came out of the oven about then, chicken enchillatas with green sauce. And I just was done.
I confronted him about him skipping a planned on talk we were supposed to have yesterday. I went over everything I've been wondering, worrying about. I told him how I felt about OW and her games. And he is just steadfast in his desire to end our marriage. He said it isn't about OW, it is about me. And if that is true, then I am not hanging in there anymore, to wait and see.
There is no easy way out. And until he lives with crazy and gets all that will come with that, I'm not changing his mind. And I pressed him hard, because our conversations always end with him just saying we are getting divorced. I asked him to tell me exactly how that works. He says well we get divorced. I aid, no, I wanted details. He didn't have any.
I said how much money was he going to give me for spousal support and for how long? Anyway, we hammered out all the details, I told him what I want, what I think is fair. He actually named a number higher than I was looking for.
Now some of you are going to say to not work it out, to go to court. I am looking at how things go here in Hawaii. And it is a crapshoot. It depends on the judge, your lawyer and maybe which way the wind is blowing. Many people have told me the best way to go in Hawaii is with a mediator.
The uncertainty of it has been killing me. So I need to go in, get this all written up and we will proceed from there. H is evidently being driven more by the fact that he "Isn't getting any younger." To which I say "AMEN".
His main worry is that he won't be able to buy a house. He also really wants to keep the boat. And it pains me terribly that the one thing I worked so hard on will end up being enjoyed by OW. But I need to just let go of that dream. I guess I'll give her my foul weather gear, since she seems to like my stuff.
Actually, I'd better keep it. Who knows, a better boat might be in my future.
Anyway, we covered medical, dental and life insurance, retirement, future retirement, spousal support, and all our assets. I also told him I didn't think his IRA's should have OW's name on them, that he should put our sons names on them. I reminded him how much that hurt his and his brother and sister's feeling to find that their dad had given so much money to his new wife. (My MIL passed away pretty young)
As we finished our discussion I did feel a great sense of relief. I guess I just don't need to worry about all this anymore. Let us see how I sleep tonight.
@KML: H and OW were always acting like I was so weak and couldn't do things. Funny, because I workout more than them combined. I have come to realize it was just part of the highly effective brainwashing OW did on H.
Sad and funny how we let other people get in our heads.
Aloha,
Wendy
Well - IF he's offering you more than the courts would give you, get him to get it in writing ASAP! But honestly - you should NOT be having those financial discussions without legal advice. And anything he says now isn't worth the paper it isn't written on.
I do recommend mediation as a less expensive and combative way of doing things. You should have your own outside lawyer too, though, in addition to the mediator, and you should meet with them first so that you have a really clear notion of what is fair and appropriate. You also need to give yourself some negotiating wiggle room, so it's good to ask for a little more than what you are aiming for.
If he plans to keep the boat, how will he be paying you for your share of that asset? Or is there no equity in it?
I have talked to 4 different lawyers. One I went in with a list of questions and the answers weren't very helpful.
Right now he says to get it written up the way we discussed and he will sign. As I have said all along I will end up doing the paperwork. I would keep waiting to see if he will come back around, but it seems like if I keep waiting I will end up getting screwed over by the court system. And I need to know what I will have so I can make concrete plans.
The IRA's and boat value work out to about the equity in the house. So this is all contingent on selling the house.
I gave myself wiggle room, in my discussions with him. He is the one who started naming numbers. So let's see how good his memory is when it is all written up.
If you opt to just write up the agreement, be sure to get it notarized! It is important to do this as it will become a binding agreement between the two of you.
Look into the tax consequences of your choices, too.
For instance - have you been in the house over two years? Would the proceeds from the sale exceed the $250,000 tax limit? You don't want to take all your share in house equity then get socked for a big tax bill.
In that case, you would be better off splitting up the house proceeds and taking some of the IRAs.
Also - don't sell yourself short. Remember you have to pay taxes on the alimony you receive, while he gets a tax break. Might you be better off to take a lump sum (like the IRAs) than to receive alimony? These are the kinds of questions you need to ask yourself. And make sure you are receiving alimony for at least 1/2 the number of years you have been married - that is the formula in my state, anyway. Also - in my state, at least, the alimony always remains open to renegotiation (for instance, if my ex became unemployed, he could go back to court and petition to have the alimony reduced or stopped). A lump sum would protect you against this eventuality. (But usually it needs to be a pretty big lump to account for years and years of alimony).
Also make sure any alimony comes directly from his paycheck. It's a pain to have to wait around for your ex to write a check every month, and it kinda pisses them off every month. Better to have direct deposit.
P.S. wife.org has a lot of good financial info for divorcing women.
He only has 11 more years he plans on working. He agreed to pay spousal support until he retires. Then I get 1/6 of that rertirement, too. In theory social security will kick in some time around then. (Not counting on that, tho...)
I get half the military retirement. The money we are calling equity in our house is the down payment, so we don't have to worry about that for capital gains.
I know to never say never, but my H is in a key position where he works. I can't see him changing what he is doing. He has a sweet deal with a boss who really appreciates him, and a bunch of other people who depend on him. When ever the boss goes out of town, my H is in charge, even though technically other people should be.
I was running the tax numbers and trying to figure it all out. I need more time in my day!
But I think it will all work out.
Wendy PLEASE just get ALL your ducks in a row.
I let my xh talk me into using the same lawyer and we worked things out ourselves also.
BIG MISTAKE! I let him bully me for one thing and I had NO CLUE what I was doing.
People tried to tell me to get my own lawyer. BUT I didnt listen, imagine that, me not listening. lol
Anyway, I didnt have the money to get one so I used his.
I am paying for my mistatkes. So just be careful.
I am so sorry he is a jerk! You are so understanding. I was ONE bitter wife. I actually wanted to hurt my husband. Yep I was bitter.
Hugs,
Renee