Hello everyone,
10 days ago, my wife told me "I don't know if I can do this anymore", packed some clothes and went to her parent's house.
We have been married for 11 years and are both in our 30's. Our relationship has mostly been amazing. The last year and a half has been challenging with her slowly pulling away.
My initial reaction to her announcement was shock. It completely blindsided me and I started shaking and crying, pleading her to stay and give us another chance (I know, big mistake!).
I am currently staying in our home, by myself (we do not have kids). Mornings and evenings are the hardest. I am not sleeping, barely eating and waking up in our bed by myself every single day is excruciating. I do not have any family in this country, so I am all alone.
During the three following days, we saw each other and had a good long discussion. She told me that she had love for me but was probably no longer "in love" with me. I acknowledged and apologized for all the things she said had been frustrating her more and more.
She is very social, I am an introvert. I admitted I should have made more effort to meet her in the middle. I was very adamant that I was willing to go to therapy, work on myself and our relationship. She said she wished she could believe me but wasn't sure she wanted to give me another chance. She ultimately kept saying she needed "time and space".
Now here's the thing. She has been hanging out more and more with a male friend over the last couple of months. I brought up to her that it made me uncomfortable but she reassured me that there was nothing to worry about. I think she's been having an emotional (hopefully) affair with the guy.
I want to get my wife back. I am devastated. I am mourning the loss of the person I once knew and have shared so many memories with. The past 10 days have undoubtedly been the hardest of my entire life. The emotional and physical stress this has taken on me is indescribable. I am a shell of the person I once was.
I am slowly realizing that I have been co-dependent on her emotionally. I am a very sensitive person and although most people couldn't tell, I have anxiety and confidence issues and she was my rock. I want to say that I have also been hers many many times. Losing my emotional support, my spouse, my partner overnight has been completely debilitating. We had always been extremely close, both physically and mentally, so the abrupt change has been a total shock.
We were also making projects for the future just a week or two prior to her leaving.
While she has expressed not wanting to hurt me and has checked in a me a couple of times, she has been fairly cold and distant. The way she looks at me has changed.
After day 4, I made the decision to go no contact. I told her I was available if she needed me but that I needed to focus on myself. She replied that she understood and was also available if I needed her.
I know the chances may be slim, but I am hoping she has a moment of clarity and realize what she is throwing away. I want to try and do everything in my power to regain her respect, trust and love. I know it starts with doing a 180, focusing on myself and emotionally detaching from her, but it is HARD!
Today, she texted me asking if she could come over to pick up some more stuff.
I am strongly considering going back home to my country for the holidays even though I know it will be hard because we have so many memories there together
Any advice on how to handle myself, the situation and how to maximize my chances of saving my marriage would be appreciated.
Looking forward to interacting with the community for some much needed support!
Welcome! I am pasting in Cadet's Welcome Thread. Please read all of the links and if you have any questions, please feel free to ask.
If she comes over to pick up some belongings, be in another room and find something to do. Treat her like a roommate who is moving out. Do not ask her anything. If she wants you to know something, she will tell you. I know that this is very, very difficult right now, but you will survive and you will get stronger as time rolls along. Be kind and patient with yourself. You are going to make some mistakes along the way, but all you need to do is pick yourself up, dust yourself off and start again. For now, keep the focus on you. Take care of yourself. I would go to your country for the holidays and leave her here to miss what she once enjoyed.
Final thing....breathe!
Welcome to the board.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by Michele Weiner-Davis. The following link is the first chapter:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/sb_the_divorce_remedy.htmA few other books by MWD:
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htmAnd Michele's articles.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htmOnce your registration to the site has been completed you can post and start a thread. Please have only one thread active at a time (per forum); it keeps your situation organized and is easier for those following along and posting to you. There are a few forums which help categorize posters’ situations.
When your thread reaches 100 posts, it will be time for you to start a new thread. It is a good idea to link your old thread to your new one, and even link the new one back to the previous one. That makes it easier for the folks following your story. (There is a help thread on linking in the sticky threads at the top section of the forum’s display.) A moderator will “close” your full thread which prevents further posting to it. It is still available to read.
Post in small frequent replies on your thread. Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity can be very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Post on other people’s thread to give support.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forum...ain=57819&Number=2578224#Post2578224Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
I’d happily wager $1000 she’s having an affair. That is the reality here.
Go through recent posts from the last few years. Nearly every LBS who comes here eventually discovers an affair.
Forget winning her back. She’s emotionally checked out, and she needs to work out for herself that staying with you is the right decision. There’s no way you can talk, act or convince her that she’s making a mistake.
What you really need to do is win YOURSELF back. The biggest challenge for the next two years will be to rebuild your self-love, self worth and confidence.
You said how you’re a gentle man and co-dependent on her. This is a very common theme at this site. Women say they want emotionally available men who are sympathetic and in touch with their feelings, but they divorce those sort of men at incredibly high rates.
Your best chance of winning her back is becoming strong. Every day you beg or plead or behave like losing her is the end of your happiness, she will be repulsed by you and move further away.
If she sees you thriving, becoming confident and almost happy to see the back of her, she will question her decision and think she’s giving up something good.
Best move you can make from here on;
1. Read DB boom several times, front to back
2. Throw her stuff to the curb and tell her she’s not coming back to the house
3. Zero contact
4. Help with your mental health to be reborn as a confident, outgoing and single man
This is a 3-5 year minimum commitment while she has her mid life crisis affair. You’ll need a lot of staying power, and you’ll also need to acknowledge that it’s likely by the time she wakes up and realises what she has lost, you’ll likely despise her and not want her back anyway.
I’m so sorry mate. There isn’t a person here who doesn’t know how much it hurts. If nothing else, this site can offer understanding and compassion. You must feel like your whole heart has been ripped out.
Millions of people have been through this. While it feels like your life is ending, know that you’re going to be okay. Hugs!
Also, get a sleep app, start three new hobbies, and get a dog.
They’re called men’s best friend for a reason. Will give you purpose (daily walks and training), gives you a happy reason (rather than sad memories) to return to your house each day, and comfort at night when lonely.
Thank you all for the support and kind words, it is helping a lot!
She came over. I was distant and did not talk to her, until she asked if we could talk. She was already asking about next steps. The house, assets, etc... Her cold demeanor is what still shocks me the most. It's like we were never in love, never a couple, never shared anything.
I said, I was likely going to go away for the next month or so and that I needed to take some time away to reflect on everything. She was OK with it and said she wasn't trying to rush anything.
When I said I probably won't see you again before I leave she started crying and asked if we could hug. I politely declined and said I hope she finds what she's looking for.
It hurt like hell but I held it together. It's still completely surreal to me that my wife seems gone. I guess it somehow made it slightly easier. It was like a different person was in front of me.
I'm rambling, but I have no one else to talk to at the moment, so it feels therapeutic. I'm not sure how to process all of my emotions. Sadness, fear, anxiety, confusion, anger. It's all too much in such a short timespan
She came over. I was distant and did not talk to her, until she asked if we could talk. She was already asking about next steps. The house, assets, etc... Her cold demeanor is what still shocks me the most. It's like we were never in love, never a couple, never shared anything.
I said, I was likely going to go away for the next month or so and that I needed to take some time away to reflect on everything. She was OK with it and said she wasn't trying to rush anything.
When I said I probably won't see you again before I leave she started crying and asked if we could hug. I politely declined and said I hope she finds what she's looking for.
Wow. Just wow!
You played that like an absolute boss. Text book DBing.
The key to your success is making decisions with your brain and not your emotions. Some people can do that better than others. As a beaten down, emotional man - you’re used to making decisions to try and keep her happy.
You need to ignore those instincts. Generally, the angrier she is the better you are DBing.
You will have slip ups, where you’ll get teary or say something about still loving her. That’s completely normal. Inevitably, you will feel rubbish and regretful afterwards.
Therapy can help you with making decisions with the reasoning part of your brain, and not with the fight/flight reflex or emotional part of your brain.
Stay strong. It’s most definitely the best way forward.
Thank you Kind18!
I've been mostly OK today. For the first time since BD 10 days ago I felt like I had finally reached acceptance, but I knew it wouldn't last.
This evening I am getting hit with a wave of nostalgia, remembering the person I have shared so many memories with, including our silly moments and the side of her personality that only I know. I miss my partner in crime and best friend
The sudden switch in her personality towards me is soul crushing.
Any suggestions on how to deal with emotional setbacks? I can't help but hold on to hope that someday that person will come back to me.
Thank you all for letting me rent and providing feedback and support!
Thank you Kind18!
I've been mostly OK today. For the first time since BD 10 days ago I felt like I had finally reached acceptance, but I knew it wouldn't last.
This evening I am getting hit with a wave of nostalgia, remembering the person I have shared so many memories with, including our silly moments and the side of her personality that only I know. I miss my partner in crime and best friend
The sudden switch in her personality towards me is soul crushing.
Any suggestions on how to deal with emotional setbacks? I can't help but hold on to hope that someday that person will come back to me.
Thank you all for letting me rent and providing feedback and support!
The emotional feelings are normal... make space to grief the loss. Do this in private or with close friends. Do NOT do this with your w.
The setback happens when you act on them by sending a "miss you" text or by trying to nice your way back.
Stay the course. She has fired you as her husband. Treat her as a stranger. Not overly friend, yet not rude. Not willing to help her with her issues yet not punishing her either.
One day at a time... sometimes one hour at a time.
Hello broken89
I’m sorry you find yourself in this situation. Having the rug pulled out from under you is quite a shock. And I well know how devastating it all feels. Hang in there.
Have you read Divorce Remedy by MWD? It’s a really good resource. Highly recommended.
Do keep the DBing books, site, and techniques close to your chest. Do not tell W. She will see it as insincere manipulation in an attempt to win her back. Best to keep all this to yourself.
I know the chances may be slim, but I am hoping she has a moment of clarity and realize what she is throwing away. I want to try and do everything in my power to regain her respect, trust and love. I know it starts with doing a 180, focusing on myself and emotionally detaching from her, but it is HARD!
Yes, it is very hard!
This path is highly counterintuitive. It will feel wrong.
Any advice on how to handle myself, the situation and how to maximize my chances of saving my marriage would be appreciated.
Focus on you. Make changes, for you! That way those changes are permanent. GAL.
Realize before W can have any moment(s) of realization of what she is throwing away, she needs to feel it. To feel the loss.
Time and space. Give her plenty of each. Let her feel it.
W will be projecting upon you, and justifying her leaving by your actions. When she starts to feel doubts she will bait you into arguments and such to resupply her “reasoning”. Do not take the bait. And no R-talks!
Time and space. Minimize the target she is painting upon you. In time, hopefully, W will realize that “hey, b89 hasn’t been bothering me lately
and I’m still unhappy.” Then, with some luck, she will consider/realize that you aren’t cause and she will look inward.
Giving time and space is within your power. Within your control.
DBing will save you, and gives you the best chance at saving your marriage.
Any suggestions on how to deal with emotional setbacks?
You bet.
Realize setbacks are perfectly normal and healthy. In my view, setbacks are misnamed. We have to revisit, to re-feel, as we move forward and heal. So setbacks are actually forward movement.
Finding detachment is the single best thing you can do for yourself. Detachment is when your emotions are no longer uncontrollably dragged about by W’s words and/or behaviours. You will still feel, just not uncontrollably. You will be able to exert influence upon your emotions.
Do feel your emotions. Find safe secure times and places to feel your pain, loss, anger, grief, and so on. Lean into them. Let them wash over you. Embrace your feelings, and release them.
Feelings are fleeting, unless reinforced. Let them flit.
The more you embrace and feel, the more you rationalize your feelings. The more you rationalize, the more you cleave/uncouple those triggers, and events, and associated feelings. Less triggering, yields more influence and control, which yields less emotional setbacks. All positive emotional growth.
When first starting out, this is all very difficult and quite out of control. Don’t fret. Perfect normal. Keep at it. In time you will get better and better.
I look forward to speaking with you.
Hang in there.
DnJ
Hi, and welcome. Although sorry that you're here.
I never realized how big of an epidemic this situation is becoming: 'unhappy' wives leaving their husbands. There are literally tens of thousands of articles, message board posts, podcasts, videos, etc of this exact thing. And yes, it's sometimes (but rarely) men that up and leave.
As Kind said, it's a guarantee that she is having an affair. Even if it's not physical (yet), it will be soon.
As hard as it is, now is not the time to reminisce about all the good times. You need to focus 100% of your thoughts and energy on you, and your direction moving forward. Fortunately you don't have kids together, so that will make things like 'no contact' a lot easier.
Stay strong and move forward with purpose.
Thank you all again for the support!
Time and space. Give her plenty of each. Let her feel it.
I have been no contact with her for 5 days. By no contact, I mean I am no longer initiating any contact with her. She has contacted me a couple of times since, once to let me know she was sorry I was spending Thanksgiving alone, and the other time to ask if she could come over to pick up belongings. My responses have been polite but short.
I know I am still in the early phase, but I was not expecting her to bring up asset division so soon.
In time, hopefully, W will realize that “hey, b89 hasn’t been bothering me lately and I’m still unhappy.” Then, with some luck, she will consider/realize that you aren’t cause and she will look inward.
I hope so, but I feel like for the time being, she seems to have blinders on. Her behavior is simply unrecognizable to me, and I know she was having an EA before leaving.
I think she maybe having some sort of MLC. She turned 30, lost her job earlier this year and was stuck in a sort of depressed state where she wasn't sure what her (professional) future might look like. She seems to be looking for an escape and trying to find herself along the way.
My point is (at least on the outside), she seems to be perfectly happy with her decision. She has not been angry at me. She has been emotional a few times, saying she did not want to hurt me and she wished me nothing but the best. Initially, in the 2-4 days post BD, she said she had a lot of "emotions to sort through and it was really overwhelming".
My other fear is that she is currently staying with her mom, who had the exact same phase around the same age and divorced her dad to be wild and free and had a series of PA's. I am afraid that her mom is totally going along with what her daughter is going through and enabling her on that path while not truly helping her find real answers, which she will have to find for herself.
Having zero control over this is driving me nuts! I am just left here wondering what can possibly going on in her head, trying to make sense of it all and rationalize everything.
Thank you all for listening and sharing your wisdom to help me stay strong.
Hello b89
Everyone goes through transitions from one life stage to another. Around late twenties, early thirties, one shifts/settles into a “long haul” mindset of family and career. That realization, accepting, and embracing of such responsibility is significantly different from the young adult stage and the newly found freedoms and experiences of exited adolescence.
All life transitions are significant. And for some folks those shifts are more troubling and harder to accept. A crisis is when a transition goes awry.
A midlife crisis happens at midlife, when the pressures of mortality and empty nest press. When life’s accolades and regrets stand starkly against the inescapable fact that there is less time to do what one has put off for another day. That particular time - midlife - has the singular power to break someone.
The seeds for such a midlife crisis would have been planted long ago, during one’s formative years. Abuses, torments, etc. from someone in a position of authority. There those seeds lay dormant, unrealized, unrecognized, and buried, until midlife. Such torment and pain buried from so long ago. And things buried alive will haunt later.
Is your W having a crisis or more a difficult transition. Both have emotional turmoil. Yet a crisis is much worse. There is a consuming, a confusion, an utter need and being driven to some very extreme behaviours as they attempt to run from their freshly uncovered and unknown feelings. It’s a fate I’d not wish upon anyone. MLC is absolutely horrible!
Your W is in her thirties. There may be a crisis element to her transition, for a quarter life crisis is also a thing. However, for most, QLC is not as consuming as MLC. For unlike midlife, at quarter life, one can indeed re-bury those haunts. Of course, that is not healthy nor wanted. And some do indeed face their pains and work through them.
Be W’s journey a crisis or emotional turmoil or difficult transition, or WAS, or WW, your path is the same. Time and space. She is on her path, and you thankfully were not invited.
You are correct, you do not, and cannot, control this. You can only control you. Your thoughts, actions, and reactions.
You can, through that which you do control, exert influence upon W and the situation. Letting your actions speak. Allowing W to see and choose to alter her path. Interestingly, that is best accomplished when you don’t try to display the new and improved you. You just live it and become it.
D
Hello everyone,
10 days ago, my wife told me "I don't know if I can do this anymore", packed some clothes and went to her parent's house.
...
She is very social, I am an introvert. I admitted I should have made more effort to meet her in the middle. I was very adamant that I was willing to go to therapy, work on myself and our relationship. She said she wished she could believe me but wasn't sure she wanted to give me another chance. She ultimately kept saying she needed "time and space".
Now here's the thing. She has been hanging out more and more with a male friend over the last couple of months. I brought up to her that it made me uncomfortable but she reassured me that there was nothing to worry about. I think she's been having an emotional (hopefully) affair with the guy.
I want to get my wife back. I am devastated. I am mourning the loss of the person I once knew and have shared so many memories with. The past 10 days have undoubtedly been the hardest of my entire life. The emotional and physical stress this has taken on me is indescribable. I am a shell of the person I once was.
I am slowly realizing that I have been co-dependent on her emotionally. I am a very sensitive person and although most people couldn't tell, I have anxiety and confidence issues and she was my rock. I want to say that I have also been hers many many times. Losing my emotional support, my spouse, my partner overnight has been completely debilitating. We had always been extremely close, both physically and mentally, so the abrupt change has been a total shock.
Hello b89:
I am very sorry to read of your situation. I wanted to reply to you because of all the stories I have read here, yours is probably the closest to mine. There are almost eerie parallels, although my W has not moved out.
Like you, I am an introvert and my W is an extrovert. It never seemed to be a problem; we seemed to complement each other until she wanted to divorce, at which time my introversion became "rudeness" and "standoffishness."
The male friend is a red flag. As others have said, it is likely there will be an affair if there isn't one already. My W is in an affair (although I don't think she sees it that way; since she wants a divorce, she no doubt sees this as merely the next chapter in her life). My W was one of those who always said she hated cheaters and liars, yet here she is. She has been sloppy about covering up the affair, but she continues to act as if I know nothing.
I also feel there was an element of co-dependency in our relationship. She has long standing body image issues and was very overweight when we met, but I accepted her as she was. I feel as though she may have been afraid she wouldn't find someone else who would, so perhaps she latched onto me despite having some unstated reservations about how suitable I was for her. I had some insecurities of my own back then, and she made me feel good about myself so that may have been the "drug" I took from her.
I called her "my rock" too, just like you. Through major life changes (the deaths of my parents, the births of our children) she was the one constant.
You will indeed feel as though you don't recognize her. She will probably reveal many painful thoughts as time goes on. You need to prepare for that. A few years ago, I could do no wrong in my wife's eyes. I was kind, gentle, gracious, giving, a wonderful father, beautiful, and more. Now I am uncaring, narcissistic, secretive, and a lousy parent, to name only a few. This is known as rewriting history. Be ready for her to emphasize all your bad qualities, and even make a few up that you didn't know you had. She will do her best to convince herself that getting rid of you is in her best interest, and that she has not contributed to the current situation, only you.
You are already getting good advice. Paying attention to where you have gone wrong, and improving that, will only benefit your future. It is a struggle to let go of her; I know from experience how hard it is. But she is not controllable. She may light quite a few fires before she is done. You just need to stay out of the flames.
My other fear is that she is currently staying with her mom, who had the exact same phase around the same age and divorced her dad to be wild and free and had a series of PA's. I am afraid that her mom is totally going along with what her daughter is going through and enabling her on that path while not truly helping her find real answers, which she will have to find for herself.
I would not be surprised by this at all. She will probably embrace anyone who will reinforce her opinion and if anyone tries to challenge her, she will reject them as wrong. My wife's parents completely support her decision, not just to divorce but also have accepted her affair partner as "family." (I know this through overheard phone conversations; I told you she was sloppy).
Thank DnJ for the detailed explanation.
Sunflyer, it does sound like our stories share a lot of similarities.
Are you making any progress at all with DB? How long have you been separated?
Thank DnJ for the detailed explanation.
Sunflyer, it does sound like our stories share a lot of similarities.
Are you making any progress at all with DB? How long have you been separated?
I am making progress with DB, in the sense that I am more and more focusing on my own life and my future. I like the progress I am making. My self confidence has improved, and I have identified things that need fixing and am trying to address them. It is a piece-by-piece process.
In the sense of saving the marriage, I've basically accepted that it is toast. She is fully entrenched in her affair, and as I've mentioned it appears that to her family he is not an "affair partner" but a "boyfriend."
She seems to be betting on a future with him at this point.
We are not yet physically separated. Most likely that will happen within the next few months. She filed for divorce quickly but has been dragging her feet on the financial paperwork.
Hi Broken
I am so sorry to hear your story. It amazes me how many start to come out at this time of year leading into the holidays. MLC absolutely is horrible. I would absolutely go back to your home away from her for the holidays. Go and have fun smile laugh. The emotional roller coaster you are on is absolutely horrible but you will be ok. You only control you. You can’t control her. Let her be, pull away let her realise the reality of losing you and your worth. And I agree there is definitely an affair. We have all been in denial and it comes out later. I feel your pain. I am almost at a year since Bd when my H dropped the bomb. I wished I could have got away I think I would have healed better and quicker but I had to step up and be the best mum to my kids. try not to dwell on the affair partner. It will serve you no good. You control where your mind and thoughts go and keep them far away from the OM. He is just a blanket for her he is nothing. She obviously needed somethinf( to feel young and feel like she still has it maybe) and found someone who is saying the right things to make her feel good. They forget about their family their spouse their stability. Let the affair run its course. Hardly any of them last. Go on living and have fun if she sees you having fun she will feel what she has lost and she will hate it.
Keep on going, reading, it does get easier it just takes time
Thank you for the support Pattnee5!
It is indeed a rollercoaster of emotions. It is very difficult for me to focus on anything else. I will be seemingly OK one minute and crying the next. I can't stop my brain from trying to find a logical answer and wanting to "fix" it.
The last 2 nights have been particularly difficult. I have been wanting to reach out to her but resisted the urge. I know it would only make me feel worse and be counterproductive.
I have this strange need inside of me to make her feel and realize how much pain and trauma she has put me through. I really do not think I deserve this. I know the person I loved and cared for would've been devastated to see me like this.
Hi broken,
I'm going through my second divorce. Thankfully found DB the first time 9 years ago as that one was much more traumatic to me, similar to how you're feeling. I lost 30 lbs (I only weighed 160 when it started, so it was a lot), didn't see how my life could continue, etc. Kind's original post to you hits all of the nails on the head. I made new friends, started going to the gym and lifting weights, started new activities. It was still a roller coaster for many months, but eventually I had a eureka moment and knew I was completely over xW. I happily moved on with my life. About a year later, with her affair having fallen apart, she confessed the affair to me (I had already learned about it but never told her I knew) and she asked if I wanted to try again with her. As Kind described, she finally wanted me back when I was truly happily moving on from her, not even acting. And also as Kind says, I didn't want her back at that point.
Now it [censored] I'm going through this again, but I think I just have a poor choice in wives, women that seemingly needed me to be happy. Eventually their anxiety, depression or other internal issues overwhelm them and I'm not enough to mask it anymore. They found a new flame that gave them the addictive escape and happiness. I wish I'd learned that the first time, but maybe I at least learn it the second time. Be thankful you don't have kids with your W. I have a kid with each of my ex's now, so moving away from my city is not an option.
Keep learning this road. Yes you want to save your M, but the best way to do that is to detach and save yourself. Don't get discouraged by hard days/weeks or DB slip-ups. Just keep moving forward. Find new activities, but also don't run from your feelings too much. You do need to feel them in order to process them. Don't cover them up by constantly being busy, and especially not with drugs/alcohol/food/sex. It will just delay your grief process or even make it impossible to really get over it. So while you're doing new things, also find some time each day for self reflection and feeling whatever emotions you have (good or bad). Stick with this, and you will eventually get to the point where you are happily moving on with your life. That will be the best chance for your W to reconsider, and it will also be the version of you that doesn't care much if she does try to come back.
Thank you Card29 for sharing your experience and wisdom! It really helps learning that others have been through hell and back before me and that I am not alone. I am sorry you find yourself having to go through it again.
I think I am especially struggling because I am an introvert with no social circle around me. I do not socialize or make friends easily. I think going away for a bit to be with my family will hopefully help.
I am also self-employed which makes the situation more uncertain. I have been able to sustain a good income over the years, but it does ebb and flow. We always made sure all of our bills were covered on her income. Thankfully, we never lived beyond our means and have a decent amount of savings, but the unknown is really adding to my anxiety.
I know I need to take this opportunity to double down on the business and channel my energy into it. It hasn't even been two weeks since she left, so I think maybe I just need a bit more time to be able to fully focus.
If you're an introvert, then that's who you are. I'm somewhere in between, so I enjoyed meeting lots of new people and making new friends, but I still enjoy my alone time. Maybe for you the time with family and a new hobby or two will be the keys to pulling you through this. Maybe through some activity you make 1 or 2 new friends. Don't be afraid to try some different things and see what you like.
One other tip I got this time around is find a new scent. If you never wear cologne, maybe just try one. If you already use something, go buy something completely different. Smell is strongly tied to memory. If whatever products you use remind you of date nights etc with your W, shelve that stuff and go get something different. If you hate anything scented, then disregard this idea haha. For me, it's been the easiest but most effective tool I've used to pick myself up when I'm in a hole emotionally.
I've seen some financial planners giving advice to people who have fluctuating income to make their budgets based on the lowest rolling 12 month income totals that you've had in the last 5 years, but it might be good to do some research on that. YouTube is obviously a great resource. Financial stress is a super common component in divorce, so if you can gain some confidence there with a solid plan, it's one less thing you have on your plate.
And yes, 2 weeks is a blink in this process. It's hard to hear, but this is just the beginning. The good news is the beginning is usually the hardest part emotionally. You're in fight or flight. Sleep can be impossible, appetite is minimal, nausea loves to rear its ugly head, the future seems impossible to face. Your journey, and your W's journey, through this is going to take minimum 2 years, but I promise it won't be this traumatic that whole time. People use the roller coaster analogy a lot on here. Like real roller coasters, the biggest ups and downs are usually at the beginning of the ride. They will turn more into smaller, rolling hills as time goes on. The good days will start outnumbering the bad. It will get easier. You're in survival mode for now, and that's normal. Post here frequently if you need (I know I have over the years, just look at my # of posts - lots of dark days!) and take it one day at a time.
I really really appreciate you sharing all of this with me! Just being able to vent and talk to people who have been through it is immensely helpful.
I love your idea about finding a new scent! I do wear cologne, and like you said, smelling it reminds me of date nights and my W telling me I smell good. I may just have to pick a new one.
Hm that is a great idea also, I will be sure to look into that. I know I am more than capable to make it on my own, it's just that my confidence was definitely knocked down a few pegs and all that self-doubt coupled with anxiety and uncertainty is making it hard to stay focus.
Today has already been a lot better than the past two days though, so there is that. I hope your journey is a bit smoother this time around.
Now it [censored] I'm going through this again, but I think I just have a poor choice in wives, women that seemingly needed me to be happy. Eventually their anxiety, depression or other internal issues overwhelm them and I'm not enough to mask it anymore. They found a new flame that gave them the addictive escape and happiness. I wish I'd learned that the first time, but maybe I at least learn it the second time.
This resonates with me very much. My wife seems to like jumping into relationships. I think one of the reasons she moved into an affair so quickly after deciding to leave me is that she feels she needs a man to keep her happy. Almost like she thinks, "I don't want H anymore; let's see who I can snag next."
I tend to be more cautious in the early stages. I met my wife online while I was in graduate school. I was in a busy period at the time I met her, so we didn't meet face to face for at least a month. First date went very well. She later told me she knew I was "it" right then.
At the end of the night, she kissed me on the cheek. I liked her but had mixed feelings about returning that kiss.
I probably didn't kiss her romantically for at least a few dates more. Once I did, her response was, "I've been waiting to do that for a while!"
Women who move impulsively like this do seem to be filling some hole with romantic involvement.
It is indeed a rollercoaster of emotions. It is very difficult for me to focus on anything else. I will be seemingly OK one minute and crying the next. I can't stop my brain from trying to find a logical answer and wanting to "fix" it.
Completely normal. When a spouse decides to quit a marriage, the person left behind quickly adopts the fix-it mentality. There are problems, so what is the solution? That is only logical.
The spouse leaving, however, isn't being dominated by logic. They are being dominated by emotion. They have a well of resentment toward the person they left. They evoke all the bad qualities of that person so they can identify them as the root of their unhappiness. They forget all the good memories. They are immune to logic.
An article I read recently put it quite well. It is as if they have undergone a "personality transplant." It's why you look at her and don't recognize her at all.
I love your idea about finding a new scent! I do wear cologne, and like you said, smelling it reminds me of date nights and my W telling me I smell good. I may just have to pick a new one.
b89:
Absolutely, 100% do this.
My experience:I have never been a big cologne or aftershave user. I used to wear it occasionally when W and I went out, because she asked me to.
I changed that up a while ago.
After BD, I noticed a lot of people on here recommending to find a new cologne, aftershave, etc. I went to the store and checked out some aftershaves. Found one I liked. I had already started using a body wash whose scent appealed to me, that I had tried previously but not used in a while.
For good measure, I even changed the toothpaste I used. I didn't feel the one she bought for the house made me feel clean enough.
This made quite a difference in how I felt about myself. One day, I heard W say, "I smelled something like cologne in the bathroom this morning. He didn't used to wear that."
To make clear, you don't do this to impress anyone but yourself. But if my W noticed it, I can bet other people did too. There's a young lady where I work who knows me but has recently started talking to me on a regular basis. (No, I will NOT go there, but like I said, people will notice).
Do it!
The scent thing is so interesting. I think I'll definitely start looking at new body wash and toothpaste too. Sounds silly, but I think it can definitely be helpful.
Yesterday was probably my best day in the last two weeks. The evenings have been particularly difficult. I was already accustomed to being home alone during the day since I work from home, but the loneliness in the evening is palpable. No one to talk to, no one to share your feelings with.
Yesterday, I decided to rekindle my love of indie movies instead of moping around. I made some dinner, poured myself a drink and watched a movie. Baby steps, but it felt like a huge win.
Welcome to a great place for support while you go through this most challenging phase of your life.
I skimmed your sitch.
Going through this process was the best worst thing that I have ever experienced. Looking back, I am glad I was "Forced" to go through it. I hope you will be able to go through the personal growth I have experienced.
"Benjamin Button: For what it's worth: it's never too late or, in my case, too early to be whoever you want to be. There's no time limit, stop whenever you want. You can change or stay the same, there are no rules to this thing. We can make the best or the worst of it. I hope you make the best of it."
Changing your behaviors is like peeling an onion. Many layers. One layer at a time.
Here is an opportunity to peel off a layer:
...I am especially struggling because I am an introvert with no social circle around me. I do not socialize or make friends easily...
So I challenge you to learn new skills and be able to be an extrovert when needed. Find books (or videos on youtube) that will help in this. It is a learned skill. Might want to start out your quest here:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2061094#Post2061094My first friend group after BD was made at starbucks. Went every day. One of the keys is to focus on the other persons story. Every person I interact with, I focus on remembering their name, and their story, what ever that may be. Most people love to talk, so all I have to do is focus on listening. The person in front of me, the person behind me, the person taking my order, the person handing my drink.
Example:
This morning, met a local "regular" at my coffee shop. Forgot his name, but he plays in a band. I am sure I will bump into him again. I will just ask his name, and try harder to remember it.
New DBer: Broken89-No kids-wife moved out-needs new attractive ways to interact with his wife.
Most of us arrive here with very similar beliefs,thought process and behaviors. Challenging those and making the 180's michelle speaks of is very important, especially early on.
Adding attractive male behaviors and stopping the unattractive is not natural. If feels wrong. Most of our behaviors are habit and subconscious.
Most of us think we should talk our way out of this. It is the opposite. STFU and listen. Be the first to leave. Always be on your purpose (your wife is a distraction). As a man, you lead. If she follows, then you are behaving the way that is attractive to her. If not, keep focusing on improving your attractive male behavior.
Fight every instinct you have to pursue her. Woman need a challenge. They want to tame the man. Most of us were way to easy to tame.
The less you interact with her right now, the more she will miss you. The less you say to her, the more she will wonder what you are thinking.
Wake up in the morning, clean yourself up, dress sharp, smell good, go out and enjoy every minute of your day. Do not think about the past or worry about the future. Be in the moment. Be on purpose.
Do not be boring.
Broken, the thing that concerns me the most is your insistence that you "have to get your wife back". That kind of insistence makes you very unattractive to her. We've had a long time saying around here: "you'll never look more attractive than when you're walking away". That doesn't mean that you can't want her back, but it means you have to control yourself and show yourself (and her by proxy) that you are going to be good, no great, no matter what happens in your marriage. Being so dependent on one person is a dangerous way to live. The reason? We live in an imperfect world. People in your life today may be gone tomorrow. Whether that's due to accident or disease, or of their own volition.
So focus on what YOU can control. And that's you. That's what divorce busting is about. Letting go and moving forward with your life. Sometimes the walkaway likes the new you and wants to come along for the ride. Sometimes not. But either way you'll be the best version of yourself that you can be!!
Broken, the thing that concerns me the most is your insistence that you "have to get your wife back".
I would be lying if I said I wasn't hoping for a turnaround, but I am not actively pursuing or showing desperation. I did initially for the two to three days following BD but I have since done a complete 180 to focus on myself. I have not contacted my wife since.
I'm also trying to make peace with recognizing that my W and our old relationship is gone forever, as much as it hurts to think about.
Being so dependent on one person is a dangerous way to live. The reason? We live in an imperfect world. People in your life today may be gone tomorrow. Whether that's due to accident or disease, or of their own volition.
Believe me, I am learning this the hard way.
I would be lying if I said I wasn't hoping for a turnaround
Keeping hope and faith alive is perfectly fine. Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. Have faith in the process.
(Go read Rockon's thead and take notes of all the advise that has been given to him.)
Implement as many of your changes as quickly as you can. The longer you stay the same, the less chance of busting the divorce. She lost her attraction for you. Only way to gain that back is becoming more attractive to women in general.
Nothing is more unattractive than a needy man.
A woman can't love a man that she does not respect.
She needs to miss you before she will have a change of heart.
She thinks she knows you. Prove her wrong. This will take significant, permanent changes to your behavior. Every time you interact with her, she should be surprised by your new behavior. You want her to question her decision.
The less you explain yourself to her, the better. Do not answer questions. The less you say, the more she is thinking about you. This is type of stuff you need to get burned into your brain ASAP.
Be vague. Be content. Be happy. Be excited.
Do not be boring.
Implement as many of your changes as quickly as you can. The longer you stay the same, the less chance of busting the divorce.
I totally understand the need to focus on myself and learn to be emotionally independent from my W and also re-learn who I am as a person without her. I am however struggling with finding the balance between needing to experience new things and step outside of my comfort zone while also not necessarily wanting to completely change who I am as a person if that makes sense.
I mentioned that I am an introvert at heart. I've always been OK with it, it's not like it feels like I am missing something. Socializing has always been emotionally draining to me. I get trying to better myself as a person, but I am also comfortable with who I am and want someone who will love me for who I am if that makes sense.
I'm not sure I see the appeal in trying to become someone completely different just to get my wife's (or other women) attention. Maybe I'm thinking of this the wrong way? Curious to get everybody's thoughts on this.
Good Morning b89
Absolutely! Do not try to become someone you are not in attempt to woo W back, or attract someone new.
Dig into yourself. What makes you tick. Then consider those deeply held convictions and values. Do they work for you? Do they foster peace and joy and contentment? Are those tenets actually what you are after?
Most folks get a bit stagnated in work and marriage. Kids, work, spouse, etc. Life gets in a groove. Like a song on repeat. Stepping out of that well worn groove is a positive thing. A 180. For you.
Pick up an old hobby you set aside. Do some things you’ve wanted to do. Do some things you’ve been to scared or timid to do. Do some things that push your comfort zone. This is not stuff to go against your core self, nor go against your moral self.
Go out for diner to a nice restaurant, alone. Sit there, by yourself. Order, and enjoy, your meal.
Things like that. For years we spouses defined ourselves by our marriage and coupling. Husband and father. We further define ourselves by our occupation. Find you. Discover and define who b89 is.
Counterintuitively, finding your definition free from marriage, kids, work, etc, strengthens those very convictions you hold dear.
Of course, a lifetime of bias and prejudice has some ugly baggage too. Examine that as well.
Organize and categorize yourself. Strengthen that which serves. Craft that which you aspire to. And discard or alter that which does not serve.
In this manner, any changes you want are because of you. Those changes will have a much higher probability of becoming permanent because of a deep connection to self rather than some attempt or win affection. It’s more growth, than a complete makeover.
Yes, we all want someone to love us for who we are. First, you need to know who you are.
D
B89, I understand what you mean about not changing who you are as a person. It might help to think about doing the things that are the "best" of you in some cases. MWD talks about the "you" that your spouse was originally attracted to. What are the things that bring you the most joy, fun, and pleasure (w/o your spouse)? In some cases, it can also mean what new interests might you try to also generate similar feelings? Or feelings like peace, relaxation, and contentment.
For me, (an ambi-vert who has to be extroverted for work but inherently introverted), going to different public libraries for HOURS is one of my favorite personal things to do. I also have a long overdue comic book grading and selling project that I've picked back up. Long walks in some public parks I'm less familiar with are another favorite. I'll take in a sports game at a local bar crowded with people I don't know, at least for a beer and a meal. Try to mix it up while you get a sense for what you're enjoying.
And, if you're W asks where you're heading, you simply say "Out" or "To run a few personal errands". As little as possible because this is 1) all yours and 2) meant to get her wondering.
Good luck. Welcome to this community. It is as you likely already see one of great help and care.
What are the things that bring you the most joy, fun, and pleasure (w/o your spouse)? In some cases, it can also mean what new interests might you try to also generate similar feelings? Or feelings like peace, relaxation, and contentment.
I am somewhat struggling with this because my equilibrium in life was always my W and my work and building our life together. That made me 100% fulfilled. We both grew into adults together.
I have to learn who I am without her and this is so difficult to do. I think the best answer for me is to rediscover creative endeavors. It has always helped me process and sort through my feelings.
And, if you're W asks where you're heading.
That won't happened. She moved out 2 weeks ago and isn't showing any interest in me.
I can't help but resent the fact that she walked out on me knowing damn well that I have nobody else around and that my family is 6,000 miles away. Something I would have never done to her.
I am not sure what she has told her family, but that same family who had been mine for the last 12+ years and welcomed me with opened arms has not checked in on me once since then. The abrupt change in normalcy and realization that my life is changed forever is so hard for me to process.
I had a good 3 day streak this week, but the last two have been really really tough. I am feeling sad and still looking for answers. How can she not care? How is she so insensitive?
I would also like to bring up a point that I have seen many bring up that doesn't quite seem to apply to my sitch. There seem to be a common theme that a lot of men were too easy going and always trying to please their W in the relationship and that a man is only attractive when he leads. I think the opposite is true for me. I have always been strong willed (and unfortunately a bit selfish at times). I know what I want and I can be a bit of a control freak. I have obviously acknowledged it many times and tried to work on myself, but too little too late. Not sure how I can turn this around and how she would even notice.
Having this community to vent and get thoughtful feedback from has been tremendously helpful. I can't thank y'all enough for sharing your own experiences and helping me through this. I know it feels like I'm dwelling on things, but I'm trying not too. As you all know, some days are inevitably harder than others and I'm still early in this journey.
Strong willed, selfish, and a control freak are not positive traits of a good leader. Sounds like delving into the differences can be a positive next step. The first question I also ask to a “control freak” is what are you afraid of happening if you don’t have control?
Strong willed, selfish, and a control freak are not positive traits of a good leader. Sounds like delving into the differences can be a positive next step. The first question I also ask to a “control freak” is what are you afraid of happening if you don’t have control?
Fair point Boat14. Not having control of a situation brings me lots of anxiety.
So I’m guessing here so it’s up to you to decide if I’m onto something or I’m wrong. Since your entire life revolved around here you were afraid of her leaving so you tried to control who she hung out with, where she went and what she did?
So I’m guessing here so it’s up to you to decide if I’m onto something or I’m wrong. Since your entire life revolved around here you were afraid of her leaving so you tried to control who she hung out with, where she went and what she did?
Yes and no. I was never afraid of her leaving me because I never thought this would be a possibility. I will admit that when she hung out with other people I took it personally (as in she would rather do something with somebody else).
I am well aware that this is wrong and something I need to work on. Highlighting my bad traits and shortcomings can make it seem like we had a toxic relationship but it was far from it. We always had a fantastic emotional and physical connection (although this did erode in the last 1.5 year) and were very supportive of each other. I had her back at all times. I never tried to control her dreams, career choices, or anything like that. I think it was more the small everyday life things. She was always easy going and up for anything to please me and I was not
She grew tired of that and I wish I would have seen how much it affected her sooner.
I guess the silver lining is that I am very introspective, well aware of where I went wrong and do want to work on becoming a better person.
Yeah so being someone’s sole support system in every avenue of life can be a lot of pressure on a person. She probably started venting to OM and one thing led to another and a full blown affair is born.
Unfortunately in life there often time’s consequences to our mistakes. That is what this board is about, to learn from them and move forward.
Hey Broken,
I'm so sorry you are going through this.
Please understand that your focus, counterintuitive as it may seem, should not be on fixing your marriage. That relationship is gone (along with your wife, replaced by the alien before you).
It should be on fixing yourself.
I hear many opportunities for growth. You've touched on several of them:
1. Anxiety (about?)
2. Co-dependent on WAW for sense of self and emotional equilibrium
3. Insecure/sensitive/took personally when significant other wanted to do stuff with other people
4. Isolated with no other social network/support system here
5. Low self confidence
6. Controlling
7. Selfish
8. Strong willed/stubborn
9. Stagnated in some ways exploring your self and creativity
What is your plan to work on each of these?
Also, in your introspection, go a bit deeper -- you said -- "I had her back at all times." But, did you really -- if you did not have her back for the "everyday small things"? They may have been small to you, but they were every day to her. It's important to accept the full magnitude of where we went wrong in order to change them for future relationships.
And, while it seems to you that she changed overnight, have no doubt that she did not. There were months or possibly years of her feeling mistreated. She may not have voiced it, or maybe you did not hear it.
Also consider that your very desire to get back together at this time is also selfish and controlling, since she is not showing the same interest. It's about what you want. Would you want another loved one of yours (daughter, mother, friend) to rejoin a relationship that she was trying to escape from?
You also mention resentment that she walked out and left you high and dry, that her family has not checked in on you once, that how can she be so caring and insensitive, and that you want to turn this around and have her notice.
Do you see how all of these are about how YOU feel and what YOU would like to happen? We ALL came here for that selfish reason -- hurt and wanting to stay married, when our spouses no longer wanted us. I get that it can be so hard not to indulge these negative feelings, because they feel suffocating -- such profound loss and traumatic breaking of a self-defining attachment.
A big part of healing from the bomb is not indulging these feelings because they can interfere with us moving on and growing. Setting them aside helps us to more clearly see our part in breaking the relationship and also to understand, accept, and validate our WAWs POV. And, we can then be more honest to change ourselves through action.
While I get that it can leave you feeling more drained than when you started, one of the useful aspects of developing new relationships and getting a life with others outside the home is that it not only distracts you from the setbacks and negative emotions, but it also will allow you to work on the above aspects of yourself. Consider that many of the weaknesses that you have identified in yourself relate to the way that you relate to others (many coming from a place of anxiety or low-self esteem).
It will be hard to work on these weaknesses alone when many of them are in how you relate to close others.
You can work alone to understand your sources of anxiety and alternative ways to cope. But, in order to prevail in your circumstance you ultimately will need to change your ways of relating as well.
And that takes practice.
Also consider that you have no social network/support system here because you have avoided building one due to your introversion and co-dependent relationship with your WAW. So, it seems that working to build a social network would be a 180 that would address a weakness you've identified. It does not mean that you need to become an extrovert. In fact, there are Meetups and Facebook groups dedicated to introverts.
You can do great things to better yourself now. Go deeper than a different scent. A different self.
You can do this.
For me, (an ambi-vert who has to be extroverted for work but inherently introverted), going to different public libraries for HOURS is one of my favorite personal things to do.
Man, I used to do this all the time as a kid and a teenager and completely forgot about it, Chalk up another way to spend time out of the house!
Thank you for the thoughtful reply Bustorama! You've definitely hit the nail on the issues I need to work on.
W came over on Saturday to pick up some stuff. We had a nice friendly conversation. I know this isn't textbook DBing, but it was nice seeing her act a bit more normal around me. She wasn't sure if I wanted to speak to her since I haven't initiated contact at all in the past 14+ days.
She mentioned that the situation has been challenging for her as well and that not talking to me for this long felt weird. She said she wanted to keep the communication open and that it was nice talking to me.
I enjoyed being honest and friendly with her, but I'm also trying to remind myself that this does not change her decision in any way.
I have mixed emotions, but trying to stay focus on myself and the path forward.
Friendly and honest is better than many alternatives.
A positive result of low contact as you saw is that the hot stove of the WAS cools off some, so their tension reduces. And they may find, like yours did, that they miss talking to you and even get a bit unsettled that maybe you do not want to anymore.
A great thing about Getting a Life, doing 180s, rediscovering old loves/hobbies, and trying out new ones is when these contacts with WAS happen, you have more to share than just, 'I've been here kind of having a hard time with things.'
There might be a project you've started (or completed). New artwork you've done. A new outing you did and might share a quick story about. Some funny character you met. Or something you're headed out to do or someone/group you are headed out to meet. Cause you're a busy, interesting guy, not a sad sack pining away. But, give just a whiff of you and your connection - like catnip. Then ya gotta go, cause you don't give yourself away.
Warm, positive, fun, mysteriously and newly busy -- "Hey, it was great seeing you and catching up, W, but I gotta go XXXX. I'll see you later! Thanks for coming by."
And you don't wanna talk about the sad state of things/the relationship (unless they initiate it of course). Cause that is not a fun topic. No one talks about stuff like that when they are dating or connecting. So don't go there for reconnecting either.
When she told you that the situation has been challenging for her, did you validate and invite her to share more? 'Yeah, I can imagine it's been hard. Tell me how it's been for you." If one of your challenges was listening to her about her every day things, listening to her, inviting her to share more, and validating when she makes a statement like that might be a 180 for you.
Remember, believe NOTHING she says. And only half of what she does. Walkaway spouses will say whatever is expedient in the moment. Some of their motivations include making themselves feel less guilty, manipulating their left-behind spouse, or getting something they want.
Almost all WASs at some point express a desire to remain friends with their LBS. LBS have to be careful that they don't end up in the friendzone. That's why I'm not a fan of "friendly". Honest? Absolutely. Upbeat and fulfilled, even pleased? Absolutely. But be careful with "friendly". That doesn't mean to be unkind in any way, but it means to keep your interactions short, concise and businesslike.
Remember, you're out GAL! Be busy. Be the one that ends the discussion, and fairly quickly too. "I have to go, I have somewhere to be." Or something similar. Important! Do not apologize for being busy. Avoid "Sorry, I have to go." Just stick to the fact that you are busy and need to end the interaction. Also do not divulge what you are going to do. Being a little mysterious is a powerful tactic.
I like that you are reminding yourself that it doesn't change anything. But that is the danger in interactions. We as LBSs start thinking romantically. "Things must be better because we had a positive interaction!" This is why you should be avoiding interactions, not encouraging them and certainly never initiating them!
When she told you that the situation has been challenging for her, did you validate and invite her to share more? 'Yeah, I can imagine it's been hard. Tell me how it's been for you." If one of your challenges was listening to her about her every day things, listening to her, inviting her to share more, and validating when she makes a statement like that might be a 180 for you.
I did. I was trying to focus more on her than myself and validate her feelings while keeping things short and concise. She also asked me how I'd been feeling, so I was honest but ultimately said I was "OK" and would be OK. This is very hard for me because my instinct is to let her know how traumatic this entire experience has been, but I am trying not to do that.
I like that you are reminding yourself that it doesn't change anything. But that is the danger in interactions. We as LBSs start thinking romantically. "Things must be better because we had a positive interaction!" This is why you should be avoiding interactions, not encouraging them and certainly never initiating them!
Definitely! I have not and will not be initiating these interactions unless absolutely necessary. I felt a weird boost of energy after she left because I couldn't help myself but feel positive about the friendly interaction even though we clearly discussed asset division and there were no indication of her backtracking in any way. It's like my mind was tricking me into thinking that "maybe there's a chance!" which I know is the wrong way of thinking.
Overall, I'm happy I've been able to stick with my no contact rule. It hasn't been easy, but I know it's the best thing to do. I think she may be a bit surprised that I haven't been chasing her more, but I can't say for sure.
I'm back to working out every day and focusing on work as much as possible. I'm starting to explore ways to meet new people. Unfortunately I'm still having trouble sleeping and the constant nightmares are messing with me when I first wake up.
I can't thank y'all enough for the support!
Does anybody have any tips on how to improve sleep quality and bad dreams? Waking up in the morning is perhaps the worst part of my day because I dream about my W every single night. It is mentally exhausting. I try to move forward with my day but I miss her so much.
All I can say is that when I had trouble sleeping I chalked it up to allergies and took Benadryl.
As far as dreams, I'm not sure there is anything that can be done. Dreams are caused by the subconscious. Maybe try focusing on other things while awake and the dreams about your wife will lessen. Are you in IC? If not, why not?
Good Morning b89
Sleep quality and quantity does suffer quite a bit at first. Don’t worry, perfectly normal and healthy reaction.
Exercise helps with finding better sleep. Go for a walk before bed.
Shutting off those devices, lessening the visual and auditory stimulation before slumber is also beneficial.
A neat little tidbit, what you think of the five minutes before falling asleep is what you’ll likely dream of. It’s not the only thing you’ll dream of, just one of them. Program your subconsciousness a little before bed.
Detachment is the single best thing you can do for yourself. It helps with sleep and dreams. Let’s explore a bit.
There is a lull, between feeling your feelings - letting them wash over you and allowing them to extinguish/flit - and when they rise up again. That lull increases as you become more and more detached.
Schedule a time to feel. Allow, purposefully, your feelings to be heard and experienced. Your emotions need to be expressed and acknowledged. That is your subconscious’ need. At first our emotions are all over the place, and spring up at all manner of times. Exert your control of self. Schedule 5 or 10 minutes when you wake, actually set an alarm, to feel your emotions. When alarm goes off, a few deep breaths, wipe your eyes, and get on about your day.
You will likely need a few times during the day to allow processing when first starting out. Schedule convenient times, less those feelings come out at inopportune moments. As you progress, less and less scheduled times will be required. Ramp down the number of times per day. Eventually reaching one. Then ramp that last time down 5, 3, 1 minutes and eventually to zero.
This is detachment. Not being uncontrollably emotionally dragged around by W’s words and behaviours. The key thing: Uncontrollably. Being detached, you still feel hurt, just not dragged about. You will find you can postpone feeling your feelings for later. Ensure you do allow those postponed emotions to speak; don’t want them to build up.
Indifference is the absence of feelings. A numbness towards W. It will come later and after detachment.
Detachment brings your first real taste of peace. And will significantly help with sleep and those dreams.
Let go the rope, or be dragged. Rationalize this. Let it in to your subconscious. The more you let go in the waking world, the more it reflects in the sleeping world.
Hope you have a good day, and a good night sleep.
D
Exercise helps with finding better sleep. Go for a walk before bed.
Exercise can be a a magic elixir. Mood lifting, mind clearing, sleep promoting. People say this all the time, but LBS often don't buy into it enough. And it improves your appearance, health, and energy.
Exercise also promotes neuroplasticity, which can help us if we are stuck in a rut, or with inflexible thinking or actions. It can help us to try new ways of being. Help us implement 180s.
I got back into long distance running and hiking as part of my sitch. Some by myself and some with meetups/local groups to meet other people and socialize. Are you exercising regularly outside of the house, building89?
What type of exercise have you done in the past and what do you do now?
What type of exercise have you done in the past and what do you do now?
I've always been pretty active. I normally lift weights at least 3 times a week, go on 30+ minute walks every day, I used to play basketball or pickleball several times of week with my W. I sometime swim as well. I've been back to lifting weights everyday in the last week but I'll admit I've been doing it from home. I'm planning on going back to the gym this evening.
Yesterday was a rough day. It marked three weeks since she left and I broke down after going to the grocery store. I just had flashbacks of being out with her. I miss her so much. I felt an urge to text or call her but I didn't. I managed to get a good night of sleep, so I'm feeling a bit better today.
The grieving process is really getting to me though. I'm having a hard time fully letting go of the past.
Hey B89. I wanted to share a few thoughts on sleeping. I just got over a bad virus of some kind and the doctor I saw recommended using some melatonin to help me sleep. A few years back during my first go-round with DBing, my doc prescribed Trazodone which originally was an anti-depressive but they've more wildly been prescribing it as an effective sleep aid. I took it when I wasn't naturally falling asleep and then worked my way off of it. Even some of the OTC sleep aids can be fine if exercise, decreasing blue light devices before bed, and other methods don't work.
Letting go of the past, memories, and experiences is almost always tough. I wish you didn't have to endure it. You did great by not calling her, no good would've come from it. Just do what you need to do to get through the day, try some things that reliably lift your spirits, and practice whatever self-care you need so that your health doesn't start to steadily slip by you. We're here as needed too.
I'd recommend not taking melatonin. He's already having vivid dreams/nightmares and melatonin is known to cause that.
Good note, Steve. It takes a village (of us). Another good reason to always consult with your physician or otherwise keep them in the loop.
Thank you all for the recommendations. I tried ZzzQuil the last couple of nights and it worked surprisingly well. I'm not sure if it's a coincidence, but I had fewer dreams and better quality sleep.
I've been thinking of making a doctor's appointment. I'm not entirely sure I would want to get on SSRI's. I've tried them before and never liked the way they made me feel.
I unfortunately broke my no contact rule last night. I'm not proud of it, but I was having a breakdown and couldn't resist calling her. She was nice enough, said she had a rough day as well a couple of days ago. She said she was about to leave but she would check in on me tomorrow (today).
She did text me this morning to say she was sorry she couldn't talk last night and asked me how I was today. I haven't responded yet. I'm not sure what to do, as I want to stick with DBing and not depend on her for support. I'm mad at myself because I was doing so well with no contact...
Hi broken... Dont be too hard on yourself. There is no perfect science to this. Try not to fix problems when going to sleep. Cause you cant.
She did text me this morning to say she was sorry she couldn't talk last night and asked me how I was today. I haven't responded yet. I'm not sure what to do, as I want to stick with DBing and not depend on her for support. I'm mad at myself because I was doing so well with no contact...
It happens. Dust off, regroup, and make improvements going forward. In terms of responding, I'd borrow a page from the Validation thread and keep it short and simple. Something like "Good. Thanks" and that's it. Or, you might toss in something that validates you heard she was having a tough time too like "It's understandable you felt bad too" or something similar that shows you heard her. I recommend reviewing the validation thread or Googling empathy and validation statements. Good luck. Thoughtfulness and practice, practice, practice until these things become new habits.
Forgive yourself. It's in the past, can't control it -- so you have to let it go.
Resolve now to choose differently for yourself in the future.
What other things will you do next time if you feel that 'irresistible' or suffocating need to reach out. Plan for your alternative actions NOW, while your mind is in a better space. And commit to do those things instead.
If you haven't yet responded to her, something like, 'Hey, thanks for reaching out. I'm doing good! About to go X, Y, Z (fun activity you used to always do and are getting back into or new thing you are trying -- because you are getting a life, right?). Sorry to hear you were having some rough days. I hope you have a better one today! '
I agree. Mistakes happen and your shouldn't beat yourself up. We have all done it.
However, own it. "I couldn't resist" isn't accurate. You didn't resist, but yes, you could have. Framing it as outside of your control sets you up for another incident. Just own it. And resolve to do better.
Hi Friends! I haven't posted in a while and a lot has happened in the past 4 months, so I thought I would give an update and get some feedback from all the great people on here, who helped me tremendously in the early stages.
I took a lot of great advice from you all and managed to disconnect completely from my wife. I do not contact her ever and only respond to texts pertaining to the divorce filing. I have focused on work, exercising, and tried to get back into the dating scene. The good news is that I no longer care or think about my soon to be ex-wife. I have moved on (I think) and am okay with the divorce. The bad news is the main reason why.
I started using dating apps and matched with a woman who had also just gotten out of a long term relationship. She was in my area briefly and headed back home for the holidays, so we did not have time to meet in person initially. We texted / called every single day for the last four months and developed in a very strong connection. I finally flew to meet her last week and spent 3 days with her.
We had a great time together. She initiated physical touch, kissing and we ended up having sex multiple times throughout the weekend. She is an extremely compassionate and caring person and showed me more attention and affection in 3 days than I got in my 12 year marriage. She opened my eyes to a completely new dynamic, something I know I needed and craved for so long. Long story short, I got way too attached too quickly and started developing strong feelings for her. I know this is all because of my co-dependent ways and trying to fill a void in my heart.
Here's where it gets messy and I need some much needed life advice. Please keep in mind that I got married in my early 20's and am now in my mid 30's and hadn't had much dating experience prior to meeting my wife. We never truly discussed what we "were" or wanted from each other throughout the past four months. I told her last weekend in person that I cared about her a lot and wanted to know how she felt about this. She told me she liked me a lot and definitely cared about me a lot but wasn't ready for a relationship with anyone at the moment as she just got out of a relationship that "messed her up". She said that it was just bad timing.
She still initiated cuddling, making out and sex after we had that conversation. Our chemistry was very passionate and loving and not just purely physical, which really messed with me more. She is very busy with her career and trying to figure out where to move to next. She is an extremely independent person and totally fine with being on her own for a while. She also has a lot more dating experience than I have.
I am rambling but I feel like I invested so much time and energy in her over the last four months, and she emotionally helped me through so much, and I definitely thought we could ease into a relationship together. I feel like I am going through a second bout of heartache. I know this is all mostly my fault for not dealing with my emotions the right way and trying to replace something that is terribly missing in my life. She admittedly said that neither of us were ready to be in a relationship at this time and I think she is probably right.
She is still initiating conversations (texting) with me and while I have no doubt she truly cares about me, I am not sure where we stand moving forward other than being friends. I am finding myself in the same cycle as after my separation with my wife, which is to prepare for the worst but hope for the best. I don't want to lose her as a friend, but I am definitely hurting at the thought of not having something more with her. It is so difficult for me to find this level of comfort and trust with another person. Do I just give it time or simply move on for my sake?
I'd like to add my two cents in this. It seems you tried to cope with the impending divorce with your stbxw by filling that void, that need for intimate and personal connection. You likely missed the feeling you had with your wife and the closeness and projected these feelings and desires into another person, she likely did the same with you, sort of testing the waters. You probably have not fully healed from the hurt of your marriage and haven't looked inward and put in as much work as possible into your own self building and reflecting on who you are as a person. Think of it this way imagine your wife doing the same thing and bonding/connecting with a new person, this is purely coping and trying to remove a piece from the puzzle that is you and your identity and slotting a new puzzle piece hoping it fits perfectly and keeps the puzzle intact as if it was never broken or scrambled in the first place. While the feelings and connection made you feel alive again, this was a temporary fix, like putting duct tape on a broken bumper of your car hoping the car stays intact and whole.
Sometimes in these situations it's best to build the puzzle from the ground up and start with the pieces that are the most important, and when you are ready to finish the puzzle put in the pieces that complete your life puzzle only if they fit correctly.
I too thought going on dating apps and trying to connect with someone new in the immediate aftermath would bring me happiness and although many people will casually say you'll find someone new, you're still young, there's plenty of fish in the sea, etc. The truth is life and desires, emotions and personal relationships are much more complex than that. You need to start from the ground up and develop ways to find long term solutions for what you want your life to be, whether you still have hope of your ex or with someone new. Never has God given us such a glaring and obvious opportunity to look inward and improve ourselves and try to fix what is lacking in our character and work on truly finding out what we want of ourselves and from our life.
Once we have done this hard work only then can we truly move on, in one direction or another. I know all this sounds cliche but the road we travel to reach our destination is not always best approached with shortcuts, we are only cheating ourselves and delaying the journey by adding obstacles
Good luck in whatever path you choose
She is still initiating conversations (texting) with me and while I have no doubt she truly cares about me, I am not sure where we stand moving forward other than being friends. I am finding myself in the same cycle as after my separation with my wife, which is to prepare for the worst but hope for the best. I don't want to lose her as a friend, but I am definitely hurting at the thought of not having something more with her. It is so difficult for me to find this level of comfort and trust with another person. Do I just give it time or simply move on for my sake?
So based on your timeline - your BD was 5 months ago and you have been speaking to this woman for 4 months of it. Your problem isn't your lack of dating... your problem is you being uncomfortable with being alone.
IF you truly want to learn from your mistakes. IF you truly want to learn how to cope with heart break and failure. IF you truly want to grow in a way to not repeat behavior - you need to stop dating for now and learn to sit in your emotions. You need to not look comfort in the arms of someone else.
The cycle you mentioned is the one you created. If you want to break it - let this new girl go and be alone for awhile.
So based on your timeline - your BD was 5 months ago and you have been speaking to this woman for 4 months of it. Your problem isn't your lack of dating... your problem is you being uncomfortable with being alone.
IF you truly want to learn from your mistakes. IF you truly want to learn how to cope with heart break and failure. IF you truly want to grow in a way to not repeat behavior - you need to stop dating for now and learn to sit in your emotions. You need to not look comfort in the arms of someone else.
The cycle you mentioned is the one you created. If you want to break it - let this new girl go and be alone for awhile.
Wish I could like this 100 times. Valeska is correct. This is the exact unhealthy pattern embraced by many who walk out on their marriages and/or have affairs. My W went from having sex with me to AP #1 within weeks and after that ended, on to AP #2 within three months, tops. The key to happiness is not found externally, or with someone else. It's found within you.
I understand the temptation. I've had no romantic involvements with anyone for 14 months, and I anticipate that I won't even start looking for at least another year. Certainly not doing anything until after the D is final. Not only am I fine with it, I'm enjoying indulging my likes and interests very much. I don't have to worry about what W thinks of it.
Certainly you have some interests, hobbies, whatever, that you put aside during your marriage. Something you want to devote yourself to again. Or something new that you never started. Now is the time. Don't be addicted to female companionship. Be addicted to you and what you want for yourself.
Good Morning b
I thought I would give an update and get some feedback from all the great people on here, who helped me tremendously in the early stages.
This is still the early stages. One of which is indifference. A time when one’s feelings towards their spouse become muted or attenuated.
Caution is needed during indifference as other feelings and temptations will loom much larger than they truly are while contrasted against the void of one’s temporary numbness. Nature abhors a vacuum and temptations can fill that void rather quickly when one is not diligent.
One of the basics of DB principles is taking rational actions based upon logic and reason. Following one’s mind instead of feelings. Feelings are fleeting and decisions made based upon emotions usually lead to regret.
I no longer care or think about my soon to be ex-wife. I have moved on (I think) and am okay with the divorce.
I would venture that you are feeling quite indifferent. This period of calm and numbness is an excellent opportunity to look inward towards one’s self free from all the cacophony of the situation and spouse.
Realize indifference does unwind. It is temporary. Feelings do return. Best to have done a pile of inner work before then.
To the current events:
Do I just give it time or simply move on for my sake?
She admittedly said that neither of us were ready to be in a relationship at this time and I think she is probably right.
You know what you should do. And should not have done.
I agree with her, neither of you were likely ready to be in a relationship at this time.
My two cents regarding dating. IMHO
.
No dating until at least one year after the divorce has been finalized. That’s signed and gone through the courts. Not separated, or pending, or any other “justified” condition. People have an incredible capacity for reason and we can/will craft justifications for any course we’d like to take. Stick to the path.
Become healed and whole before you date. Not date in an attempt to become whole and healed.
Time to dig into you. You are worth that investment.
D
Thank you all for sharing your wisdom and experience. It really helps to hear your perspectives to re-focus myself on the work and introspection I should be doing. I think the biggest thing for me is to learn to be okay with being alone and find who I am as a single person, not in a relationship. This is all new to me and perhaps the most difficult part of this journey. It's so much easier to seek intimacy and affection to fill that void.