Devastated

[pie51]

My wife of 28 years and lover of 32 left me one month ago. I am devastated and don't know what to do. My heart and soul was ripped out the day she walked out the door. she sat me down on the couch and told me one Saturday morning that she was leaving and wanted a divorce. I was crushed - we both sat there and cried for 4 hours . She stated that she doesn't want to hurt me and that she wants nothing from me - no house no 401k just that she is not happy and has not been for a long time and she just wants to leave and she can't stay any longer. I was in total shock. She said that I shouldn't be that she has dropped hints several times over the years - I just didn't hear them. She left and my son who came in town that day because she told him that she was leaving - we have 4 kids all adults now . Everyone knew but me. I have to admit that I have not been the husband that I should have been or father for that matter. I have been suffering from depression for most my adult life mainly from a sexual assault when I was 18. I meet my wife when I was 19 and we both fell in love and I thought that I could put this behind me and that my new found love would get me through . I never said it out loud in 32 years , in fact i thought that if I didn't admit that it had happened that it didn't but over the years it ate me up inside and I have had anger issues all of my adult life which wasn't present my first 18. I have lashed out over the years - verbally abused my wife and kids - I'd say mean hurtful things that I didn't mean but it was the only way i could deal with it inside. Over the years other set backs happened - losing a business , going bankrupt, losing our house death of family members and everything we owned. I grew deeper into my depression and my wife also became depressed . I started self medicating myself and over the years so did my wife sometime with me . Over the last several months she decided to better herself and stopped - lost weight , started going out with friends more often but I was not there yet I dove deeper into self medication and depression until I could not go out in public without mean angry feelings and had no filter on what I said in public. I understand that my wife could not stand to be around me in public any longer - I really couldn't stand myself either but didn't know how to stop. My wife and I have always had the best sex life and i kept telling myself that everything was OK and that she would never leave me . When we first got together we both made a commitment that the ONE thing that would set either of us out the door was if either of us cheated on the other so I never even thought about it and never put myself in that position so I thought to myself that if i hadn't done that she would always be there beside me and we could work out anything . so when she left I was shocked even thought she dropped hints they were always after an episode of mine or after a fight . She never looked me in the eye when we were having good times or sat me down and said that she was this unhappy and that I needed to fix myself or she was leaving we just didn't communicate that way. In my state of mind I didn't think that anyone really loved me . I know that I should have heard and seen the signs but I guess I was waiting for someone to put their arms around me and tell me that I need help and needed to change but never got that . I don;t blame my wife she tried in her own way I just didn't see it . One good thing is that there is NO other man - never has been and she even stated that the thought of that was gross. I asked her if she still loved me and she said yes but just can't live with me any longer like this she needed to move forward not move on and that I also needed to move forward and get myself better . I know that my wife loves me she has proven it - we made love the night before she left and we have seen each other 8 time since she left and have made love all 8 times - I know my wife and I think women in general and can't imagine a women that walks out the door would do that if she didn't really love that person. currently I'm in counseling for my anger issues and past experience but my wife has not yet gone to get help herself. I'm so confused and hurt that she didn't after 32 years with me sit me down and tell me how unhappy she really was and that instead of going to counseling together to work on our marriage she just left. I know I've really hurt my wife but after all those years together I can't imagine that she is not willing to work together on this. She made no promises and told me that the only way that we could ever be together again was I had to let her go totally to ever have a chance to get her back. I've read Michelle's book The Divorce Remedy and am trying to put one foot in front of the other and try the Last Resort but it is so hard . I love my wife more than life it'self and am wiling to do anything to have her back in my life. I'm just afraid that nothing will work and if we actually have to dissolve the marriage i may never get her back. I always dreamed of us growing old together and helping raise our grandchildren when we have them- celebrating our 50th wedding anniversary together was a dream - we had made it this far and it was a dream that was in sight but now if we sign the papers it will never happen . She actually admitted that I have totally shocked her in how I have handled this so far - she stated that she thought I would blow up and tell her to leave and become angry and hateful and that she would be the only one changing . But I have not, I am broken and have no anger left in me . I'm ashamed of my behavior over the years and that I could not tell my wife what happened to me _ I just couldn't admit it to myself . I did finally tell her about 2 weeks after she left and we sat on the couch and both cried for hours she stated that allot of things over the years made sense to her now . She is living at her fathers now but we talk allot and she is coming over again next week. Does she really still love me - does she just need her space . In my mind she has proven to me that she does but I am just confused.. I am on the way to recovery and have not used since she left - that was never really an issue for me it was a way I believed that I could numb my pain all these years from my experience. when I finally admitted it to her and myself a thousand pound weight that was hanging over me left and I have no anger any more I just cant feel anything without my wife she is my world , my love and best friend.

[job]

I am posting Cadet's Welcome Thread here for you:

Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

Yes first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.

Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forum...ain=57819&Number=2578224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-64, D32,S31

[Cadet]

Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.

[Ready2Change]

Welcome,


You have found a great place for support.

This is a journey of personal growth. You have a lot of issues to deal with. People here can help.

Your W is right. You have to set her free to get her back.

Put all the focus on you and make any and all positive changes you want.


Do not talk about these changes. Just do them. A man of action.

Time is on your side. Use it wisely.

[Jim1234]

It stinks, and we're all there with you, in one way or another.

Honestly, in a lot of ways, you seem to be much better off than most of us on this forum. She still loves you, and you understand a lot of your issues. She hasn't seen a lawyer. She's talking to you. Ready2Change is right. Let her go. You need to focus on you, and make positive changes, but DO THEM FOR YOU, NOT TO GET YOUR WIFE BACK. She is gone. She might come back, but these changes need to make you a better person, and as a side benefit, make you become someone she WANTS to get back together with.

In some ways, you're worse off. You are a mess. You have addiction problems. Get help with that. Seriously, if you were a woman, would you want to be with you?

Show her through you actions that you are taking charge of your life and getting it straightened out. It doesn't matter that she doesn't live with you; she'll know.

[FlySolo]

I will read your sitch a little more fully later, but just wanted to say you've come to the right place. You will find people here who are, or have gone through, what you are going through. Some have been here a while and will offer sound advice. Listen to them even when what they tell you is hard to take.

Others, like me are new but will, where we can, offer encouragement and support and perhaps a different perspective on your sitch.

I am sorry you find yourself here.

[crofton]

Not a nice sich but you are in a much better place than most of us as seems your wife still loves you. So think if you can sort your personal issues out you have a chance of R.

[SteveLW]

pie51, sorry you are here, but as others have said you have come to the right place.

pie. I need to level with you. My sitch was very similar to yours in what your W said. Though mine never left, she said a lot of the same things your W said almost verbatim.

The most concerning to me is that she 'wants nothing from you". This was my W as well. "I don't want any of your money. I want you to keep the house. Etc." Most of the time Ws take that route is due to guilt. So what could she feel guilty about?

Let's look at some other markers: "Over the last several months she decided to better herself and stopped - lost weight , started going out with friends more often"

pie, likely, despite what she says and you believe, there is someone else. Whether it is just an EA, or a full blown PA, we have a saying around here: a monkey doesn't jump from one branch until they've identified another one that can support them.

So the bad news is that there is likely an OM. The good news is that it change nothing that you should be doing.

I like the advice above from Jim, you have to get yourself healthy first and foremost. The biggest 180 you need to make is to address your own addiction and depression. Without doing that nothing else you try to do will really matter.

Let her go to get her back. Nothing turned my sitch around more than this. When I started to let go of the rope and drop it, that's when my W started to question the edict she has issued on bomb day. The harder I held on the more she struggled to get away. Once I let go she stopped of her own volition.

Detachment. So important. You have to learn to be lovingly detached. Do all of cadet's readings and focus on detaching. Letting her go is almost impossible without this.

GAL. For you this is an easy one! Get mentally, emotionally, spiritually and physically healthy. Working on all of that will keep you pretty busy. Remember, a busy pie will be a happy pie. Most people that are unhappy and depressed are sitting around stewing in their own juices too much. So get up and get active in all 4 areas I mentioned above.

And of course 180s. For you doing all of the above will be full of 180s for you! Just keep working on being the best pie you can be. Be the H only a fool would leave!

Hang in there, it will get easier with time. We often say around here that you need to focus on saving yourself. In that process you just might save your marriage too.

[MoveFrwd]

Pie - Im sorry for what youve had to go through. I can only imagine the relief you must have felt to get that 1000lb monkey off your back and really start to look at yourself as a person. Sometimes, it takes getting to rock bottom to really be able to see and feel and understand yourself. I know that had your wife "sat you down" while you were in "good times" you wouldnt have seen it or been open to it. I said the same thing about my XW....that if she had just talked to me, we would have figured it out. But really, I wasnt able to hear those things because I didnt realize "how serious" she ever was. It took her getting to the point that she wants to walk away for you to wake up. How many years of frustration must she have gone through before reaching that point? I know mine went through several. In any case, let me give some other comments below.

I grew deeper into my depression. I started self medicating myself

So what are you doing for yourself now? You said you were "on the way to recovery". But what does that mean, specifically? Are you seeing a counselor? Do you have a clear plan for how to face your demons and overcome them?

One good thing is that there is NO other man - never has been and she even stated that the thought of that was gross.

Steve is more confident than I would be that there is someone else. BUT...it clearly isnt 'gross' to her as she is still sleeping with you fairly regularly.

I think it is VERY important to not confuse this with love. My guess is that this is fulfilling some physical need for her. For example, if she is chatting with some other guy online somewhere but cant or doesnt want to meet up with him, she could be using you for that physical release without that emotional connection. Or maybe shes meeting him occasionally and is "more turned on" and knows you are available. Theres not really any way to know at this point. All I know is that it may not be about her emotional connection with you, so pinning your hopes and expectations of that onto the act is probably going to wind up hurting you later.

So my question to you is what you want. Without having her committed to the relationship or you, can you continue to see her and sleep with her without any expectations? without attaching any other emotions to those meetings? I would also recommend being SAFE and SMART. I know it's your wife, but use protection if you do continue on.

I know my wife and I think women in general and can't imagine a women that walks out the door would do that if she didn't really love that person.

I would say you have a LOT to learn. Please read on here. There are so many instances of women doing exactly as you describe.

I've read Michelle's book The Divorce Remedy and am trying to put one foot in front of the other and try the Last Resort but it is so hard

Look....if youve seen your wife 8 times and youre having regular sex with her, you are NOT in the last resort. That technique is essentially dropping off the face of the earth to her. How about focusing less on that chapter of the book and really digging in to the process.

What are your goals?
How is your GAL going?

I am broken

I know this is cliche. But you really cant work on repairing your marriage until you work on repairing yourself. You need to regain your self-esteem, your excitement for life, your inner strength. All of it. Until you can stand on your own two feet, you cant expect your wife to want to come stand next to you.

I know it's all a lot to take in. Take your time. READ. POST.
You can do it. One foot in front of the other.

[SteveLW]

Steve is more confident than I would be that there is someone else. BUT...it clearly isnt 'gross' to her as she is still sleeping with you fairly regularly.

Yeah the gross comment leaped off the screen at me. You know, the old "Me thinks the lady doth protest too much" Shakespeare thing.

When I initiated BD in my sitch, I had a message exchange between my W and her EA OM. She was telling him how she felt she needed to step away from him because his GF wouldn't appreciate the things they'd discussed, and the pictures she shared. (Note, the talk about "stepping away" is my W's classic manipulation, reverse-psychology method of getting someone to say "no no, I want you!", so no one should read too much into that.)

When I confronted her and she immediately said "I don't want to be married anymore", I eventually got back to the topic of OM (I really think looking back that hitting me over the head with the "I want a D" thing was to divert attention away from her A.), and when I did I mentioned the thing about pictures. She claimed they had only exchanged face pictures. I wasn't buying it, so I said, "It sure sounds like the the picture more erotic than that. At least nudes." Her response was immediate and emphatic "Ewwwww, no!"

4 weeks later I discovered the nudes she had sent to him.

To me, one of the ways someone caught responds is a key indicator. If pie's wife had simply said "no, there is no one else, I'm just unhappy and want out", then I would think it less likely there was someone else. But her saying "Gross!" suggests to me a level of diversion. As if it is out of the question, why even suggest it?! See the Shakespeare line above.

[SteveLW]

I think it is VERY important to not confuse this with love. My guess is that this is fulfilling some physical need for her. For example, if she is chatting with some other guy online somewhere but cant or doesnt want to meet up with him, she could be using you for that physical release without that emotional connection. Or maybe shes meeting him occasionally and is "more turned on" and knows you are available. Theres not really any way to know at this point. All I know is that it may not be about her emotional connection with you, so pinning your hopes and expectations of that onto the act is probably going to wind up hurting you later.

THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

pie, women, unlike men, do not equate love and sex. Men, as seen in this quote from you:

I asked her if she still loved me and she said yes but just can't live with me any longer like this she needed to move forward not move on and that I also needed to move forward and get myself better . I know that my wife loves me she has proven it - we made love the night before she left and we have seen each other 8 time since she left and have made love all 8 times - I know my wife and I think women in general and can't imagine a women that walks out the door would do that if she didn't really love that person.

equate the two. "If she has sex with me she must love me."

I am guessing you haven't read too many relationship books, or done much research on male-female relationships. Women know within the first minute of meeting a man whether or not she'd ever be willing to have sex with him. Are you going to argue that a woman falls in love with a man in the first minute of having met him? I do not think so.

Woman equate love to other things. Is he kind and gentle with me? Does he take care of me? Does he do things for me?

You should read 5 Love Languages. Almost every guy has Physical Touch as either his primary or secondary love language.

Women typically have the other 4 above physical touch. Their LL is typically words of affirmation, or acts of service, or quality time or receiving gifts.

Look up the 5 love languages, and you can take the test.

Anyway, Amoafwl is giving you some great advice here. Most women only fall in love with men they respect. Respect breeds attraction which breeds love for most women. Do you think she respects you right now?

[AnotherStander]

She said that I shouldn't be that she has dropped hints several times over the years - I just didn't hear them.

Probably true, you probably read about that in DR. Please understand one thing- you need abundant patience right now. She clearly did not get to this point quickly, it's been years in the making. And reversing it will likely take a year or more as well. Give her time and space. Respect her wishes. You've got a lot to work on, so get busy!

I have to admit that I have not been the husband that I should have been or father for that matter. I have been suffering from depression for most my adult life mainly from a sexual assault when I was 18. I meet my wife when I was 19 and we both fell in love and I thought that I could put this behind me and that my new found love would get me through . I never said it out loud in 32 years , in fact i thought that if I didn't admit that it had happened that it didn't but over the years it ate me up inside and I have had anger issues all of my adult life which wasn't present my first 18. I have lashed out over the years - verbally abused my wife and kids - I'd say mean hurtful things that I didn't mean but it was the only way i could deal with it inside.

Sounds to me like you have been mean and abusive, and have been that way a long time. I wouldn't try to "explain it away" as being because of something that happened way back when you were 18 because you're making it sound like you are not responsible for your actions. But you are, and you are also responsible for correcting your faults (doing 180's in DB terms). I was physically, verbally and mentally abused by my father throughout my life until I finally cut all contact with him in adulthood. It was traumatic, but I have never blamed any of my personal shortfalls on that because I make my own decisions. In fact I have gone out of my way to rise up and be better than that, especially with my kids.

losing a business , going bankrupt, losing our house death of family members and everything we owned. I grew deeper into my depression and my wife also became depressed . I started self medicating myself and over the years so did my wife sometime with me . Over the last several months she decided to better herself and stopped - lost weight , started going out with friends more often but I was not there yet I dove deeper into self medication and depression until I could not go out in public without mean angry feelings and had no filter on what I said in public.

Kudos to your W for rising above that mess and making something better of herself! You should be very proud of her. Now it's your turn, and you have a great example to follow!

I know that I should have heard and seen the signs but I guess I was waiting for someone to put their arms around me and tell me that I need help and needed to change but never got that .

But even if she had done that I doubt you would have done anything other than shut down on her. Unfortunately it takes BD for most of us to get about the business of fixing our issues.

I know that my wife loves me she has proven it - we made love the night before she left and we have seen each other 8 time since she left and have made love all 8 times - I know my wife and I think women in general and can't imagine a women that walks out the door would do that if she didn't really love that person.

You'd be surprised. She loves you, but she's not "in love" with you. And there's the problem. She's got to fall back in love, and that's going to take time, and it's going to take a lot of effort on your part changing your bad behavior. You've got to change, and you've got to show her consistent changes over a long period of time for her to change her mind.

I'm so confused and hurt that she didn't after 32 years with me sit me down and tell me how unhappy she really was

She did. She tried telling you for years, and that didn't work so BD is the ultimate form of telling you.

I know I've really hurt my wife but after all those years together I can't imagine that she is not willing to work together on this.

Again, she tried. In her own way she tried. She didn't try in your way, she tried in her way and you didn't recognize it. BD for her is the absolute last resort. She is so desperate to get out of what she sees as a horrible, abusive marriage that she had no other choice. Try and see it from HER point of view. Even now you're still looking at it only in terms of what YOU want and need.

She made no promises and told me that the only way that we could ever be together again was I had to let her go totally to ever have a chance to get her back.

She's right.

I've read Michelle's book The Divorce Remedy and am trying to put one foot in front of the other and try the Last Resort but it is so hard .

DB'ing will be the hardest thing you've ever done in your life. But it is your best chance.There's no easy way out of this. There are no magic tricks. It's just good old fashioned hard work and dedication.

[pie51]

Thanks everyone for all your comments and advise . I am going to counselling and will be continuing for a long time.
I have not used since she left Cold turkey as they say is the only way in my opinion. On the OM - I am 100% positive that is not the case in my situation- I know most are not going to believe it but really that is not the issue here. I'm also reading several anger management books an i have read the 5 love languages also. and your right BD that is her last resort so I'm going to keep reading and moving forward myself and become that man she fell in love with . Letting her go will be the hardest thing I've ever done but I understand that is the only way and since I do love her and am in love with her I only want her to be happy - I just can't let my anger hurt her or my family any longer.

[AnotherStander]

Pie, that sounds great, you're on the right path! Next I would suggest coming up with a list of GAL activities you want to try and make yourself do those things. It is very, very difficult at first. I know right now you'd rather curl up in a corner but you've got to get out and GAL to help yourself recuperate and get your mind off of things. Each time you go do something it gets easier and easier. Get in touch with old friends. Make new ones. Lift weights. Run. Play golf. Fly a kite, fly an R/C plane, build a model, volunteer at a food bank, join a poetry club, build houses with Habitat for Humanity. In short do anything... except make excuses!

Next make a list of 180's. This list is only for you, don't let anyone else see it. Refer to it as a reminder of what your goals are so you can keep working on them.

One critical thing Michele mentions in her books is the importance of actions. WAS simply do not believe anything you say. It all sounds like empty promises that they've heard a thousand times before. So don't SAY, DO. At first your 180's will seem to her like "tricks to get her back", so that's why it's important to stick with them. Over time she will come to believe your changes are real.

Good luck and keep posting!

[FlySolo]

Hi Pie

I can see you've received some good advice. I would second the advice to concentrate on healing yourself. That is something you have control over. Your W does not sound like a monster. But, it would have taken a lot of courage on her part to leave, and now that she has done it, she has momentum. Any pursuit on your part will fuel that momentum.

Use this time to work on you. Maybe, she will see the positive changes ... though she will want to know that its permanent ... and you can only show her that through consistency ... and she may come back. But she might not. Either way you will be a better version of you.

One good thing is that there is NO other man - never has been and she even stated that the thought of that was gross. I asked her if she still loved me and she said yes but just can't live with me any longer like this she needed to move forward not move on and that I also needed to move forward and get myself better . I know that my wife loves me she has proven it - we made love the night before she left and we have seen each other 8 time since she left and have made love all 8 times

I would like to put a slightly different perspective on this. Many years ago, after D8 was born, I went into what I can only describe as a kind of functional post natal depression. On the face of it we led a near perfect life. But simmering under the surface, I was questioning nearly all my life choices. How did I end up living in the suburb? How did I end up working in a cubicle when I wanted to be an artist? How did I end up, how did I end up, how did I end up ...

During this time, I would sometimes initiate intimacy (out guilt for the things I was thinking, to check if there was still a spark, and yes, just to make sure he was still attached to me). Throughout all this, I knew I loved him and that I loved our life. It was just sadness and I got over it eventually.

In any case, a slightly different view. I don't think your W is having a PA, though there may be an EA - a person she shares her thoughts with who has enabled her leaving because it suits their own agenda. In the end it doesn't matter though. She has left, and you now have to get on with the business of getting stronger.

Detach, 180, GAL. You will hear that mantra repeated again and again because it really is the only way to get through this.

Good luck.