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Husband cheated, trying 180 (3)Ready2change,
I hope you’re there and read my last post on previous thread. He just texted me and said “I’m sorry, give me time to acclimate”. Any suggestions on what to respond??
There are no guaranties in any of this. That is the hard part. The good news is you will have skills to rebuild the relationship. Letting go of trying to control/manipulate someone and setting boundaries to protect yourself. All while trying to attract them back. Hopefully H sees the changes and likes what he sees.
Hopefully you can find success stories here. The ones that turned there wayward around.
This is tough love.
He just texted me and said “I’m sorry, give me time to acclimate”. Any suggestions on what to respond??
I still think no response is the best response.
Other options:
"Acclimate to what?"
or
"I am sorry that you feel I should accommodate your poor choices. I have been extremely patient. I want our family to be healthy. "
I will try to find success stories of people who have turned their wayward around. I cant even fathom him changing at this point. I dont even think he remembers ME. Its been so long since he has tried to make an effort in OUR relationship.
He just texted me this morning asking if the baby needs anything. I dont really understand why when he lived here he made no effort at all and now that Ive made him leave he all of a sudden wants to make a big effort for her. I think its great and I think he should, I just dont know what he is trying to prove.
And of course I wish he was putting this kind of effort into our relationship also, but I know that isnt what he wants. I hope if he is seeing someone else (UGH) that he will think of me and eventually try to rebuild us. But he would have to be the one to put the effort in, and i dont see that happening anytime soon.
Just realized the type on this thread name. Oops. Husband Cheated, not aged
I will try to find success stories of people who have turned their wayward around. I cant even fathom him changing at this point. I dont even think he remembers ME. Its been so long since he has tried to make an effort in OUR relationship.
He just texted me this morning asking if the baby needs anything. I dont really understand why when he lived here he made no effort at all and now that Ive made him leave he all of a sudden wants to make a big effort for her. I think its great and I think he should, I just dont know what he is trying to prove.
And of course I wish he was putting this kind of effort into our relationship also, but I know that isnt what he wants. I hope if he is seeing someone else (UGH) that he will think of me and eventually try to rebuild us. But he would have to be the one to put the effort in, and i dont see that happening anytime soon.
Of course he is more engaged. Whether he is willing to admit it or not right now verbally, deep down he understands what he stands to lose. This is what tough love is all about! Now, remember, a lot of this might be just try to weasel back into the house. But eventually, if you can stick to your guns, he will get to a pivot point....where he knows he stands to lose everything permanently, and he'll have a decision to make.
kech, LBSs struggle because they CAN'T control and CAN'T change their spouse. Your goal isn't to control or change him because YOU CANNOT do that. Your goal is to show him that his decisions have consequences, and the consequences of having an OW are that he doesn't get his family. This is tough, the LBS' instincts are that by being loving and nice they can "win" back the WAS. But this hardly ever works. In fact, if it did, the divorce rate would plummet because almost all LBS go that route.
Waywards especially need tough love. sandi talks about this, that a sense of loss is the only thing that can wake them up from their fog. Doing whatever he wants but still having you on the hook means he doesn't have to change anything. Doing whatever he wants and potentially losing you is the only thing that can make him want to change what he is doing.
Kech,
Sorry that you are here. I have been quietly reading your sitch for a while now.
Your posts are all focused on HIM. What are you doing? How are your 180s going? Are you GALing? What goals are you setting for yourself? The only thing you can control in this sitch is yourself.
Hang in there. It will get easier with time and detachment.
Steve & Davide,
Thanks so much, I have been dying for something from someone to get me through another day. I am staying busy, working, trying to keep moving forward. As I stated he texted me last night that he was sorry and needed time to acclimate. He then sent me a video of a song and said that the baby is everything to him. I told him that he is everything to her as well and that I understand the acclimating thing..
He then sent 2 more texts about the baby and how she smiles at him and is the only woman to ever love his beard. I didnt respond to those. And then he texted this morning asking what she needs. I struggle with the fact that I am here mourning our marriage and he doesnt seem at all affected by that. He is sad to lose time with the baby, but he was spending no time with her prior to this due to his lifestyle. I am glad he is now making an effort to see her and I dread the days he starts taking her for periods of time, etc. But in the meantime I am continuing to stay busy, GAL. I am trying to 180 but I find I have the hardest time doing that.
When he texted last night about acclimating to all of this, I thought to myself how would I normally respond, how could I be different. But I ended up just saying I understand, which is probably what I would have said before if I responded at all. WE ARE ALL acclimating to this, doesnt he see that?
I want him to WANT to come back so bad. Him crying yesterday confuses me, yet he is the one filing for divorce, etc. Is he extremely confused or was me giving him his stuff yesterday and discussing a schedule with the baby just too much?
I dont know, I need to work on not nicing him to death. I want to be understanding and loving but also firm on my boundaries and respected.
He just messaged me again that he got the wall stuff to fix the walls. Should I just say Thanks? Id really like to say "teach a man to fish, he eats for a lifetime"....in other words, teach me so I dont need you to fix it. But thats probably too much
Kech,
Who knows what is going on in his head. That's exactly the point. You can't mindread, so don't try. You need to get out of his head and into your own. Looking for signs and signals in everything he says and does is a cheeseless tunnel. It won't get you anywhere, other than worked-up and stressed-out.
Good job not responding to the further texts of his. You say you are struggling with 180s. Wouldn't it be a 180 not to respond to the initial text? I didn't see anything in it which required a response. Keep your communication with him as to-the-point as possible. They say to treat the WAS like a cashier at the store. You aren't rude or mean to them, but nor are you going to engage them in personal conversation, or eagerly await their communication.
What do you mean when you say that you stay busy and GAL. What are you doing? What are your goals? How are you working on yourself? What are you doing to take care of yourself?
You are at the beginning of a long process, so have patience. (It is hard, trust me, I know.) You are stronger than you know, and there is a bright future waiting for you at the other end.
I have started redoing the house, so a lot of my time lately has been spent out looking for different pieces and putting things together. I exercise a lot. I also work full time and have the baby. I went out with friends this past Friday which was a big change for me, as I hadnt done that in a while.
Youre right, I am trying to look for signs and signals in EVERYTHING he says. It makes me crazy. I dont know how to respond to anything at all. Its so hard
I have decided to make this (that we just bought together a yr and a half ago), into the most zen, comfortable, happy place for my daughter and I. It hasnt felt like home for a while so im going room by room redoing them.
Im determined to love living here, whether if he ends up here or not.
That is a great way to take charge of your life and your space! What an excellent project!
I am not into decorating or decor at all, but I am trying to at least put up all new artwork (mainly my own photography from my summer trip as well as some nice posters of cities that are dear to me) to replace the stuff the W took with her, and to take down the stuff she left.
Hi Kech,
I posted this on your last thread and was hoping you would think about these questions and post a response:
What Goals do you have for this week?
What do you want to have accomplished by Friday?
How many Lawyers do you plan on meeting with? I believe 3 should be the MINIMUM. I still like the idea of meeting with the TOP, BEST lawyers in your area.
Free consults, fact gathering meetings. Have a list of questions drawn up on a piece of paper. Take notes during meeting.
Hey Ready2Change,
I know I should meet with lawyers, I havent brought myself to even start that process. My personal goals for the week are to have stuck to my workout regimen, cook healthy meals every night, get the living room redo completed (which makes me feel very good in my own home), and get organized with my plans for the month, get my calendar filled out, etc.
Another goal is to finish DB book and purchase DR. I would like to start journaling again, which is something I have done my whole life and seems to help through tough times. After my dad passed away from cancer it really helped me get through, and when this whole thing started, journaling REALLY helped me through the remainder of my pregnancy because I was hanging on by a thread there.
On top of my full time job, I have an etsy shop where I make wood signs, etc. And I absolutely love doing it, so I think it would be good for me to throw myself into that a bit. I have 3 orders right now I need to get done, so I should make it a goal to get them all completed. I think 1 night this week while H is here with D I will go get a pedicure. I also have had massage gift cards for a while now that I should put to use.
I know the more things I change in the house, the less he is going to feel like it is home. And thats not what I want, but I want to feel really good every single day when I walk into the house. He knows I have always loved to switch things up in our homes, and with being pregnant and having the baby within a year after buying the home, we never really got the chance to create a home. But I guess at this juncture I cant do things based off of what im afraid his reaction will be. I have to do things for me and for the baby. And I want to feel good.
Fall is around the corner and it is my favorite season. It was the WORST last year, I did not enjoy one ounce of it, even though I was pregnant and it should have been the best time ever. I am so afraid that I will be so sad this year I wont enjoy any of it again, and with a baby we should be having so much fun, going to pumpkin patches, enjoying the season. I am determined to still do those things with her. Of course I would LOVE for him to be a part of it all, but clearly that isnt looking like the case. I just hope I can keep a happy mindset and not miss out on fun things with my daughter.
I have allowed myself to miss out on so much already due to being so sad. I dont want to anymore. And I know if the divorce starts to happen it is going to REALLY do a number on me.
Its like I try to prepare myself for all the bad to come so it isnt so much of a blow. The BD was almost a year ago and it was truly the most earth shattering time in my life. I dont want that to happen again. I am a mom now, I have to be able to pick myself up. I want him to WANT to be with me and want to be my partner still, but I guess right now he just wants to live his own life and still be a dad, and I have to accept that.
I know I should meet with lawyers, I havent brought myself to even start that process.
Meeting with the lawyers is to get yourself educated. It is also about keeping your H from retaining the best lawyers. Please make some calls today.
He says we can do all of this without lawyers, so I dont think he will be retaining anyone yet. But I could be wrong, you are right.
Its been about 5 days since he has been out of the house. But he has still been here 4 out of those 5 days, which is why I would like to make a schedule. The only day/night he didnt come was Saturday. I guess partying was more important that night.
But thats okay, I have to get used to that because that is how it is going to be from now on.
I know the more things I change in the house, the less he is going to feel like it is home.
Who cares? it is no longer his home.
But I guess at this juncture I cant do things based off of what im afraid his reaction will be. I have to do things for me and for the baby. And I want to feel good.
A much better way to look at it!
I am so afraid that I will be so sad this year I wont enjoy any of it again, and with a baby we should be having so much fun, going to pumpkin patches, enjoying the season. I am determined to still do those things with her.
Choose happiness over sadness! Doing those things will MAKE you happy. Sitting home being sad will MAKE you sad. Choose happiness!
Of course I would LOVE for him to be a part of it all, but clearly that isnt looking like the case.
Why at this point? Every interaction with him sets you back. Plan these fun things for you and your D! You are never going to make progress by focusing on him.
I have allowed myself to miss out on so much already due to being so sad. I dont want to anymore. And I know if the divorce starts to happen it is going to REALLY do a number on me.
See my choose happiness comment above. Believe it or not this is MORE in your control than you think! Is it hard? Yes. But choosing happiness eventually becomes true happiness. If you let it.
Its like I try to prepare myself for all the bad to come so it isnt so much of a blow. The BD was almost a year ago and it was truly the most earth shattering time in my life. I dont want that to happen again. I am a mom now, I have to be able to pick myself up. I want him to WANT to be with me and want to be my partner still, but I guess right now he just wants to live his own life and still be a dad, and I have to accept that.
Sometimes I feel like you don't really let the words we type sink in. That you pick and choose the ones you want to hear. kech you will never get over him by focusing him on him. You will never get him back if you don't get over him. Here is the kicker. Once you get over him, he may come crawling back. However, you may not want to accept him back at that point. Happens all the time.
Now I know your next reaction: "Not wanting him back scares me!" It shouldn't. Your goal should be to move on with or without him. If you cannot entertain moving on without him you are setting yourself up for a lot of pain and sadness.
CHOOSE HAPPINESS.
He says we can do all of this without lawyers, so I dont think he will be retaining anyone yet. But I could be wrong, you are right.
They all say this. Eventually it ends up with lawyers. D is a legal process, you have to have a lawyer for legal processes.
Steve,
Thanks for that. I need tough love myself I guess. I think I read and reread everything you guys write to me and I do take it all in, and I try to follow it all, but this is the only place for me to really vent so I just continue venting all these fears I have because I have no other outlet.
I do not want to get our families involved yet, and I have only confided in 1 friend about everything because I already know everyone else will have opinions and strong ones at that. When this all first happened I confided in a few close friends and some family members and H and I were so back and forth it got to the point where I just decided to keep it to myself and tell them all we will figure it out. So I come here with all my worries while taking the advice you guys are giving.
I am a very task oriented person, so its like I want to be told "do this, do that" and i know thats not how this necessarily works, but he makes it REALLY hard. Its like he wants responses from me just so he can feel okay and move on with his life. I dont know. But regardless, I am trying to detach. I just dont know how you detach yourself. Thats a feeling, inside you. How do I force my feelings to detach from his actions? I keep thinking to myself "Ok, if you were detached from this person, how would you respond to this".
What I am showing him and what I am typing here are 2 different things. I am showing him upbeat, happiness, okay me. Doing things, keeping busy. On here I am falling apart, in the car I am melting down, in the shower, at night alone I am yelling into a pillow. But to his face I am not doing that. He was crying yesterday and I paid it no mind. When he left I didnt reach out to ask why. He eventually contacted me about it. I am trying to fake it to him, detachment, as I am trying to really accomplish it somehow in real life and not sure how.
Thanks for that. I need tough love myself I guess. I think I read and reread everything you guys write to me and I do take it all in, and I try to follow it all, but this is the only place for me to really vent so I just continue venting all these fears I have because I have no other outlet.
This is fair! I've heard this from other posters and still need to be reminded of that occasionally. Please, by all means, view this as a safe place to journal. But also be open to the feedback of when you are focusing on him too much. If you want him back focus on you and D.
Detachment is hard. But trust me, when you get there you will know it. The night my W cried that she knew D was wrong and she wanted to want to stay.....and I had no reaction. Not just outward but inwardly too. I was like "Ok." She got clingy and wanted my reassurance. She got nothing. It felt so good. I didn't get happy. I didn't get sad. I just was.
She took a couple of steps back after that (in fact that week was when I found a full dating profile on dating site with a picture and everything, but even with that I was more worried about my daughter finding out about it then being mad or sad about her doing it). But the point was detachment started to become easier as I worked at it. It sounds like you are on the right road towards true detachment.
The question of how do you detach and act all happy when inside you are falling apart is one of the difficult ones to master. It is one I struggle with every day. My H left 6 months ago and each day I want to send him a text saying "I miss you" or "I hate you for doing this to me" (it really depends on what has been going on in my mind). I think it is a matter of stopping yourself when the thoughts come, taking a breath or two, then getting on with whatever you were doing before the thoughts filtered in.
It is more difficult when you actually have to interact with your spouse, which in my case is often, because of the kids. I try and treat him like a casual work acquaintance. Friendly but not overly familiar, so non children/logistic related topics tend to be casual pleasantries, weather, daily commute etc. Nothing too personal. It is hard to do but with practice it can be done. When he leaves I go and sit in my room for five minutes, have a cry, wash my face and come back down to the children. Although frequent, these interactions are fairly short in duration, because he feels as awkward as me. 16 years together, and your reduced to talking about the weather. It is safe ground though. I hear you, putting on a fake smile is heartbreakingly difficult at first, but I am hopeful, that it eventually just becomes habit.
Kech,
You can do this without lawyers. But first YOU have to understand the process. YOU have to fill out the forms. YOU have to submit them. Lawyers can explain your rights. They can explain your state laws. They can explain the process.
Or you can wait for H to do it. That option never works out well.
Lawyers can also be a crazy financial drain on your family. They nickel and dime you to death. They ask for a retainer. Then they use all that money and are not done with the process. Then they ask for more.
I think the biggest question right now: Are you in a fault or no fault state?
Flysolo,
Thank you, it really is so difficult. And at this point I truly am still doing all of this in hopes to get him back. "Let him go to get him back", and i know it doesnt work that way. But I am just being honest. I am still in hopes we can work, so I will fake it til I make it for sure because I do want a positive outcome.
Maybe in the meantime I will actually become detached and eventually feel better off without him. But for now, I sure do want him to feel some remorse and regret and try to get his life back. Maybe one day
Actually - forgot to say what the benefit of 'pretending' is. For me, it is a positive outcome from the interaction. However mundane, neither of us is coming out of the interaction angry (him) or trying to dissect every word, every nuance, every look (me). Each positive outcome, I believe, will eventually create a positive picture. Maybe not enough to bring us back together, but one that at the very least, we can use as the basis to co-parent our children.
Also, we all started out as casual acquaintances with our spouses and built from there. It may not erase all the negative memories they've cherry picked during their MLC, but it might just diminish them.
Just saw his truck at the bar on my way home. I have a question about this. Is it better for me to avoid this and go a different way or is it better for me to see it and get angry? He MUST be seeing someone who works there, he must. Which makes me want to vomit and tell him to leave me alone for the rest of my life. He KNOWS I have to drive by there. I cannot believe the nerve he has!! It blows my mind.
I am being tested in so many ways here. I know he is going to be at my house later and I really want nothing to do with him. But if I leave and show my anger that’s probably not smart right? So I will fake pleasant and leave. I’m so annoyed. I HAVE to leave my home because of his poor choices and because he changed his mind and doesn’t want a family. It’s absurd. He can’t keep coming here as he pleases. I don’t care if a schedule makes him upset, we have to do it. I can’t do this every night with him and then him take weekends off, please.
I hope any other relationship he is starting up crashes and burns in his face and he loses me in the process. I’m too good for this bull****. He married up with me, why don’t I see that and MOVE ON. I love him so much and he’s just crushing me DAILY. Daily.
Fly solo,
You’re right. I do feel better when we leave pleasant. And I would hope it would start to paint a positive picture instead of the negative one he painted by cherry picking. You nailed it. Is it possibly my husband has had some sort of MLC, I’ve always wondered it but he is 29, which I would assume is too young.
But he’s definitely confused and I can tell. But one day I will be done caring about his confusion. He needs to get his act together! He has become so irresponsible, and he doesn’t think it’s a bad thing. He thinks he should lead whatever life makes him happy even if it means not paying certain bills (his own), all of a sudden owning a home means nothing to him, a marriage means nothing to him. And he looks at it like everyone else is crazy for living and working for the man. It’s like he wants to be free from responsibility and live this free life all of a sudden. But when I say go do it, he goes as far as the bar and then complains it’s everyone else’s fault he can’t travel or do all these things. No one is stopping him!
I don’t know where my husband went but he’s gone.
He just came to the house, I was pleasant. He did the work on the drilled holes I had messed up and offered to redrill them for me and I said that’s ok but thank you. I was pleasant. I wasn’t cold like I’m feeling. I said I was going to the gym and he said ok and then told me how he dropped something on his foot at work and showed me his hurt toe.
I think I said oh that’s not good! And then I left For the gym. I am feeling totally helpless at this point. I feel like he is really just living the life outside our home and I’m making this effort to leave the house when he comes in hopes he will miss me over time. I know I have to be patient but I’m so scared he enjoys his life too much outside our marriage to even think about missing me.
I’m venting. I’m angry. I’m angry he is probably seeing someone else and I can’t get him to change his perception of me. This was a man who wanted nothing more than to be with me and just settle down and have a family and now it’s like he doesn’t even remember wanting any of that. I feel so far from him.
I know I did the right thing by being pleasant and leaving the house. I will continue doing this, continue GAL, continue attempting to detach, but certain things really trigger strong feelings.
Anyone out there?
I handled the evening fine. I said it was time to put the baby to bed and for me to go to sleep. He said he had to change the ac filter for me before he left, I never asked him to. When he left he didn’t mention coming by tomorrow which is weird for him.
After he left he sent a text saying he’d like to do something with the baby this weekend. I am livid. He NEVER spent any time with us on the weekends for the last 6 months, and recently he “had to work every weekend”. he never has taken her anywhere on his own. He has never tried to! And now all of a sudden after kicking him out he wants to do something with her this weekend. I am SO UPSET. Everything he does is self serving. All this time he could have spent time with us and always pretended to be busy and all of a sudden he is free and wants to take her.
I know I have to let him but I am just so upset by this. When will he get his karma for all of this? I have to lose time with her because of HIS choices?! I want to tell him he better not dare have her around some other woman. I know I need to breathe but he knows this is going to kill me more than any of this.
And why is he trying to do all these things around the house, like he’s taking care of us in some way! I don’t need him to take care of us! It’s all to feed his own ego. I’m certain he has OW. I’m certain she is telling him things to do and say. And I’m certain he is testing me every chance he gets. I hate this man right now
... I want to tell him he better not dare have her around some other woman....
Another good legal question.
The good thing is he wants to spend time with D. I think this is one thing you have going for you.
His real motivation may be child support obligations.
Either way, as long as he is being a responsible dad, I would be grateful. It is all how you look at it. That is how detachment works.
In your first post, you stated that H wanted to be appreciated. Possible place for 180 is appreciate him stepping up as a dad.
He just randomly texted me a picture of him and our D. Do I respond to this?
I didn’t respond. It’s late. It literally hurts my stomach to think I’m hurting his feelings to not respond to a picture he sends, but I’m too heartbroken tonight. And I think that’s ok
((hugs))
Hopefully HE realizes what he is loosing.
It is very important for you to work on your "conditions" for you to even "consider" working on the R.
Most successful people have a statement with conditions. One of the big ones is IC for WAS.
Do you have plans to see an IC?
Yes I have plans for IC for sure. He refuses to see a MC or IC, he doesn’t believe in it. I will have to think of my conditions to consider working on the R, Incase we were to ever get there. Doesn’t seem like it anytime soon.
I’m starting to really see where patience comes in. This is so hard, it’s veey hard to not react in certain ways. Especially when it comes to him asking for our daughter. It was a 180 for me to respond the way I did last night. I will stick to this and see how it works, but I do see how hard it is. And how patient I will have to be to even possibly one day see a change. And it may never come but I’ll keep trying
kech you are doing fine. My only criticism is do not keep her up for him. This is the way to handle it:
Him: I want to see D tonight.
You: Okay, her bedtime is xpm, as long as you are here by then you will have time to spend with her tonight.
When you bend to him, ie "I will keep her up until you get here" he knows he still has you on the hook.
Remember, you are living your life. He can choose to be part of that or not, but you are not going to make changes to accommodate him.
I am with you, I think he is at least into (even if it isn't reciprocated) someone at this bar. But yes, I would purposely NOT drive by that bar anymore. You can't stop focusing on him so much until you make changes to stop focusing on him so much.
Steve,
You are right, thanks so much. Sometimes I think he purposely makes it hard for me not to focus on him. Him sending me that picture last night of him and our daughter was out of nowhere and it was late, hes usually asleep pretty early. I dont know what kind of response he wanted from me, but I chose to not respond at all.
But again, this is me focusing on him.
Thanks
I wish I knew what he was thinking and feeling right now. If it wasnt for this platform I honestly think I would have already given in, talked to him about things, and possibly asked him to move back in or something because I am struggling. It has been a week since I kicked him out and today feels awful.
Throwing myself into work for now, but I can feel my head going through all our good memories, us laughing, trips weve taken. I dont want to backslide from my hard work but how is this how I feel after only a week?
Goodness
Nothing worthwhile is easy. The easy path will not get you where you want to be.
Compare to your business. You said you had 3 orders. The easy thing would be to not work on them, take your time. And get to them when you feel like it. Or, get in and work and get them done and shipped. That last one is harder. But the harder path will make your costumers happy, get you more word of mouth, move your business forward, and in general just be better all around.
Same in your sitch. The fact that this is hard is how you know what you are doing will end up being the better outcome.
Thanks Steve,I will keep telling myself that.
I am curious to hear if you, or anyone else that has read my sitch, has any opinion of what is happening. Is it normal how he is acting after being kicked out? One day mad, one day nice, one day crying, etc.
And is it normal for me, the LBS, to feel this low and lost after only a week of him being out? Today feels the worst so far, all of a sudden thinking of all our good times together, etc.
kech, we always talk about the emotional roller-coaster. We usually talk about it in terms of the LBS. However, it is important to remember that the WAS also is on their own emotional roller-coaster.
So yes, this is all normal. However, a lot of times the WAS will hide their emotions. They want the LBS to think they are sure and confident in their decision to leave. When they do show their emotions it is usually to manipulate the LBS. Likely he is trying to weasel back home. Don't fall for it.
So yes, this is all normal. However, a lot of times the WAS will hide their emotions. They want the LBS to think they are sure and confident in their decision to leave. When they do show their emotions it is usually to manipulate the LBS. Likely he is trying to weasel back home. Don't fall for it.
This describes my WAW. Not to hijack, but is the only suggestion to keep DBing and let the WAS make the determination of the next steps?
How do we know what is manipulation and what is sincere?
So yes, this is all normal. However, a lot of times the WAS will hide their emotions. They want the LBS to think they are sure and confident in their decision to leave. When they do show their emotions it is usually to manipulate the LBS. Likely he is trying to weasel back home. Don't fall for it.
This describes my WAW. Not to hijack, but is the only suggestion to keep DBing and let the WAS make the determination of the next steps?
How do we know what is manipulation and what is sincere?
Believe nothing they say and only half of what they do.
You will know when they are sincere when their ACTIONS are consistent over a long period of time.
From what ive learned throughout my sitch is that everything that is done by WAS/WW is for their own best interest. Its true that you should believe nothing they say, and only 50% of what they do.
Likely he is trying to weasel back home. Don't fall for it.
This again is where detachment comes in.
Detach from the outcome.
Ketch, it is critical that you can look at your interactions with H as if you were watching two other people. Then you advise yourself on what the "Right thing to do".
Take me for example. You have questions. I have to think about your questions. I have to evaluate many responses. I pick one (or two). I post my response. Let's say somewhere in my future, I learn my partner has been unfaithful. My work here makes it easier for me to respond (logically) the right way even though it might be emotionally devastating. Same thing for you. Thinking about things now makes it easier to make better choices in the future.
If you have time, go read this thread:
KiwiCan you relate? Can you offer her any words of wisdom? Is the advise others giving good?
My moto:
Pass out what you want to receive.
Ready2Change,
Thanks, I have been trying to read more stories of others and chime in. I am so all over the place emotionally I dont know I have any advice to give but I will try. I keep telling myself if he brings up divorce again, thats really the bottom for me. Divorce and custody will be rock bottom for me. And If I can handle my reactions to those conversations, then I can handle anything.
My goals right now are to get through our interactions pleasantly, not to nice him to death but to just try to be me, but brief, and slightly aloof. Ignoring him when he texts sometimes feels like the wrong thing to do. If I want to come off as being okay, isnt ignoring him defeating that? I question this. I ignored the picture he sent last night and today is the first day I havent heard from him at all. Does ignoring him give off the vibe that I am upset?
...If I can handle my reactions to those conversations, then I can handle anything.
I have seen many variations to this:
H "I want a divorce"
W "I am sorry you feel that way. I see many options to solving our problems. but if D is THE ONLY way for you to be happy, I will not stand in your way"
or
W "I am sorry you feel that way. I see many options to solving our problems. but having relationships with other women before the D is finalized.....
There are lots of other things that can be said with this statement.
Draft up your response. We can help. The key is to Think about your response beforehand.
My goals right now are to get through our interactions pleasantly, not to nice him to death but to just try to be me, but brief, and slightly aloof.
Good goals. Strong confident women are attractive.
Ignoring him when he texts sometimes feels like the wrong thing to do.
You are in a difficult spot with daughter being so young. I believe it is important for you not to stand in the way of H relationship with D. Most WAS do that on their own.
If I want to come off as being okay, isn't ignoring him defeating that? I question this.
I don't know if ignoring things works. Projecting that you will be OK either way is good. Calling him on his disrespectful behavior is good.
I believe when he cross your boundaries, you enforce.
"H:When you come into the house to spend time with D and your attention is on your phone, I question your real motivation to be here. I am sure who ever it is, can wait until you are done spending time with D.
I ignored the picture he sent last night and today is the first day I haven't heard from him at all. Does ignoring him give off the vibe that I am upset?
Who knows. He want's to behave like a single man. Hopefully he continues to put being Dad ahead of other distractions.
You do not need to respond to ANYTHING immediately. Next time in person:
W "I like the picture you sent" (Short and sweet)
Ready2Change,
Thanks. Ya I would not ignore any texts he sends regarding D, but sometimes he will text with small statements or like last night randomly sending me a picture..I of course want to respond but I wonder if he has any clue what he is doing to me sometimes. He is very aware Ive been trying to save our marriage, its been a week since I said "show me your phone or I will assume you are with OW and I cant have you live here". Of course I still want to save our marriage, but he is gone now, I havent just magically stopped loving him. And everytime he texts me and its like he doesnt even see what he is doing to me.
I am so lost without him, and I need to detach, and he makes it very hard sometimes because I feel like he will do anything to get a response from me. When really I just want to tell him "I am not ignoring you. I am just trying to find my place as a single mom and tackle everyday the best I can moving forward. Ive been trying so hard to fix our marriage..that is clearly not happening so now I just need some time to figure out what it is that I WANT."
Its like yes I want him to text me, absolutely. But its never what I want to hear. I will always be open when it comes to coparenting and I will always respond about D for sure, but other things right now I just dont know the right things to say because my emotions are EVERYWHERE. And sometimes I feel like his texts are an attempt to pull me into a conversation, just to know he still has me on the hook. And then he will pull me down the emotional rabbit hole of things like "we love eachother" just to let me down with "but it isnt the same". Or something along those lines.
I wish I could get a grip on my own emotions, Im mad, im sad, im struggling alone. One minute I know I am a catch, the next im thinking im about to be a divorced single mom at the age of 31, only married 3 short years to the man Ive been with 9 years, who just a year ago confessed how every year it gets better and better. I become SO angry with him sometimes I swear I could drive up to the bar I KNOW HES IN and pull his no good a** out of there! I want to say to him WHAT ARE YOU DOING?! Throwing our lives away FOR THIS?! Any woman he has met there is not half the woman I am. Gosh if I met him now I would stay far far away.
But thats not the case.So I hold on the amazing man I fell in love with and built a life with who now seems to want none of it. Do men normally have successful relationships when staying with OW? He once told me last time I made him leave, that he was continuing to talk to OW bc why wouldnt he if I wouldnt talk to him.....The knowledge behind that is just absolutely ridiculous, but he said it. I hold on to the fact that he has ended it repeatedly with her through this process. Yes, he goes back to her it seems, but I worry it could be something he truly tries to have as his future.
Again, IM ALL OVER THE PLACE, bc if he is seeing someone at the bar he is always at here, then that is not the original OW. But at this point, im sure he has multiple. Especially now that he doesnt have to sleep here every night like he was.
kech at this point only answer texts that have a direct question in them. And answer as short as possible. Yes and no questions should get yes or no answers.
kech at this point only answer texts that have a direct question in them. And answer as short as possible. Yes and no questions should get yes or no answers.
Take all the time you need to decide how to respond. When in doubt, do not respond. Run as much by us as you need. Do not answer R questions.
At some point in the future, here are some words that may be useful:
"I am not sure how I feel about that"
"I need time to think about that"
"I will let you know"
Steve is wise. He followed the process.
Thanks to you both, those were really helpful responses and ones I now know to follow. Like I said I am task oriented, so not to only answer texts that are direct questions shouldnt be too hard.
When he left last night he didnt say his usual "ill be by tomorrow", and IMMEDIATELY I knew he wasnt going to show tonight, even though when I asked to make a schedule he said he wanted to come every day and then cried and left. So, today, not one text all day. I just KNEW he wouldnt show tonight. And theres no reason he wouldnt show besides having plans of some sort. And my husband NEVER makes plans. EVER. Which means if he is, it is with OW. Makes me literally sick to my stomach as I sit here in our living room, nursing our daughter, and he is no doubt having some sort of date or something.
Never before would he do this. He is skipping a night with his daughter because he made plans with someone else. I saw his truck at another bar around 4:30pm. I know I wasnt supposed to take that street but I did. And there his truck was. He either has brought original OW into town for the night, or there is someone else he has made plans with. And all I can say is what a piece of s*** he is. An absolute piece of s***.
In OUR city, where people could see him, he is so disrespectful its unbelievable. I try to make a schedule with him and he cries and gets upset, but then he can decide he isnt coming one night and not even inform me because he knows whatever his other plans are are WRONG.
Im disgusted that this is all continuing to be on his terms somehow. I do not get it.I kicked him out like I needed to do. I tried to make a schedule with him like I needed to do. and yet he continues to just show up whatever time he wants, and now NOT come when hes made other plans. And then he will want to come tomorrow and he will be livid if I say no. AND he wants to have her to do something this weekend! How is this fair? How is everything just so easy and works out so simple for him?
Its a Wednesday night, he literally has MADE PLANS to be with OW and I know it. He hasnt planned any type of date for him and I in months and here he is making plans with someone else instead of coming to see his daughter. This is a first and I want to throw up. Should I text him? I mean this is SO unfair that he can come and see her as he pleases and doesnt feel the need to inform me of any of it. I feel like daily its a new low. I think I cant be hurt anymore and I am. I knew when he left last night he wasnt going to come today, and then he texted that he wanted to do something with her this weekend. I KNEW that was because he was going to skip a day during the week. I know him SO well. Yet im SO upset by this. Im sick to my stomach.
Do I text him and say something like "are you not coming by to see her tonight?" or do I say nothing
Do not initiate text conversation about tonight.
Do you have a set time for him to visit D this weekend? Focus on that.
W "H you stated that you would like to see D this weekend but did not state a time. Does Friday from 5p to 12p work for you? If I do not hear from you before Friday, I will make other arrangements."
I know I should meet with lawyers, I havent brought myself to even start that process.
Meeting with the lawyers is to get yourself educated. It is also about keeping your H from retaining the best lawyers. Please make some calls today.
You don't need to rush into the legal process. If he has met with a lawyer, then you should definitely meet with a lawyer promptly. If he is only threatening to file (as so many people are), he is making the threat in order to control the process and keep you locked in fear. And he is doing that because he is afraid of the legal process. In many legal situations, there is a party who has an incentive to move through the legal process quickly and a party that does not have that incentive. Determine whether that applies to your situation. If you are in a financially stable situation and he is in a less financially stable situation, then you should the process forward slowly.
As for the advice of meeting with the best lawyers in town, that only works if you live in a small town and can conflict out all of the top lawyers. Otherwise, you are wasting your time. Most divorces are very easy to handle from a legal perspective. It is the emotions that complicate things and you are in control of your own emotions.
I understand that all of this is easier said than done, but it is true. The primary skill that lawyers bring to the table is the ability to see things from a neutral and detached perspective.
And if he says he wants a divorce, I would simply say "okay."
I won’t text, thanks for the response. He said last night he would like to do something with her this weekend. I said ok and asked what day and he responded “whatever works”. I never responded and 2 hours later he sent me a picture of him and her. I never responded and then haven’t heard from him at all today.
I know he will expect to see her tomorrow, Thursday. He will skip tonight as if no one notices, bc it’s convenient for him and his plans. It’s very frustrating. I’m sure I will hear from him tomorrow. He will feel some guilt about skipping tonight but will not say it. And I will not bring it up bc then that shows I’m focusing on him.
Tomorrow when he is here I will discuss this weekend I guess and tell him what day he can take her and times.
URE,
Thank you so much for the feedback. When I kicked him out last week he said he was going to go forward with a divorce. A day or 2 later he told me he started applying for one, he said he was sorry and that our marriage is done. He hasn’t brought it up since then but I am sure he will.
I so not want a divorce, I would like us to try to work through this. But if he goes forward with a divorce I guess I will not really have that choice. I think financially I am in a better position a bit, but he has always said we don’t need lawyers etc.
He is really doing a number on me emotionally, and no matter how much I try to get control of the situation, it seems like he continues to run the show. I don’t know how.
When I kicked him out last week
You gave him a choice. He chose to leave rather than be open and honest with his wife.
Ready2change,
You are right. It has been a week since then and my gut tells me he is on a date of some sort with OW tonight. Really taking everything in me to keep it together tonight. No contact from him today whatsoever, I really wish I could go dark for like a month from him. Obviously I cant because of our daughter, but I just feel so hurt and angry with how things are unfolding.
He seems all over the place and then all of a sudden no contact and doesnt come see D. I feel like if he wasnt able to see me AT ALL he would feel the loss. But it cant be done that way in our situation. I will stick to doing this. Steve said trust the process. I will continue to do what I can, GAL, 180, wake up and read Sandi's rules.
I have been reading a lot of threads from Bluwave and wow. She started off by explaining how her and her H are back together and working on things, so it is a feeling of hope to read that. Her very first post sounds verbatim like my H. Her posts were back in 2016, I am only to her 2nd thread now, but I enjoy reading her words of wisdom. She reiterates how she wishes she had gotten out of her own head and stopped worrying so much about what her husband was doing and thinking. She also said her H told her that when she was herself and cordial towards him it made him feel much more guilty about what he was doing and pulled him in a little more, and when she lashed out and was angry or ignored him he would justify what he was doing and become more angry.
Just good things to know, although everyone is different. I dont know what my H wants from me, or needs from me in order to come out of this fog and want to work on our M, but I guess that isnt where my focus is supposed to be because he is not opening up to me about that. I need to really focus on myself and i know that. I get very upset because our D is so young, discussing sharing time is very difficult, and the anticipation of that is really painful for me. but I am trying.
I want him to regret these decisions he is making, but hes having NO consequences whatsoever from them. The only consequence he has felt so far is not being able to live here, and thats part of his doing. But no other consequences so he will continue to live this way which is very sad. VERY sad. Bc this bar life he is choosing with OW and whoever else will never compare to a family life he could be living.
Kech, his bar lifestyle will never last. It's fun for a while but it all starts to wear down sooner than later. My suggestion to you is to some how some way hit your breaking point. Like I've told another poster. You're better than this! I have also talked to a lady I know. She went through it twice with 2 different men. As soon as she was done, and I mean her mind was made up done. The dude came crawling and crying back. But here's the other part. Her mind was made up. She wanted nothing to do with him. Same story, hanging out at the bars with OW. It got old and he thought "oh she will be there no matter what." She has my kids"...Nope...too late. So just like everyone has told me and told you. You need to let him go so you can be free! Dont use the daughter as an excuse to have interactions. Of course he wants to see her when its conveinant for him. But dont you sit and wait for it to happen. You get your self busy being the freaking Wonder Woman for the D. No kid wants to see their mom or dad all depressed, stressed, unhappy all the time,worrying about every little thing. They want happiness and joy no matter what. Get yourself to that point. To the point you dont need him. Someone told me. Why are you chasing someone who dumped you and is cheating on you? Hell ,I dont know!
The sooner you can get there the sooner you'll be happy. And dont you dare let him back easy if you even want him back at that point, cause he will do it again. Good luck. Stay super positive.
URE,
Thank you so much for the feedback. When I kicked him out last week he said he was going to go forward with a divorce. A day or 2 later he told me he started applying for one, he said he was sorry and that our marriage is done. He hasn’t brought it up since then but I am sure he will.
I so not want a divorce, I would like us to try to work through this. But if he goes forward with a divorce I guess I will not really have that choice. I think financially I am in a better position a bit, but he has always said we don’t need lawyers etc.
He is really doing a number on me emotionally, and no matter how much I try to get control of the situation, it seems like he continues to run the show. I don’t know how.
If he files for divorce, you need to retain a lawyer so that your spouse does not take advantage of you or manipulate you. And if your goal is to save your marriage, your hiring a lawyer to draw out the process as long as possible, your making it as expensive as possible for your husband, and your taking aggressive positions will likely further those goals. From what I've read it seems like your husband is afraid of the legal process and is lying in order to control that process. That is a common tactic and a common reason why a spouse threatens, but doesn't file for divorce. As the legal process unfolds, your husband may change his mind and soften his position.
You don't need to rush into the legal process.
Completely agree. Just get yourself educated. The fear goes away.
If he has met with a lawyer, then you should definitely meet with a lawyer promptly.
Since he is a lier and deceptive, no way to know if he has or not. Idol threats or real? You know your H best. Even if he is in the fog.
If he is only threatening to file (as so many people are), he is making the threat in order to control the process and keep you locked in fear. And he is doing that because he is afraid of the legal process. In many legal situations, there is a party who has an incentive to move through the legal process quickly and a party that does not have that incentive. Determine whether that applies to your situation. If you are in a financially stable situation and he is in a less financially stable situation, then you should the process forward slowly.
wise words.
Most divorces are very easy to handle from a legal perspective. It is the emotions that complicate things and you are in control of your own emotions.
I am sure you can DIY divorce. I gave my divorce paperwork to a friend. He used it as an outline for his. Not complicated. My state has a flow diagram of the process on its website.
A mediator can help two people work out details they disagree on. I was in one room with my lawyer. Ex wife in the other with her lawyer. Mediator went back and forth between the rooms. I got "pro-se" written into the contract. IE any future issues are addressed with lawyers.
Lawyers drain the family financially.
And if he says he wants a divorce, I would simply say "okay."
This stops the arguing.
Kech I suggest you get very strong. Are you wanting to save your relationship? Or is it done? What do you really want?
Steve is wise. He followed the process.
Thank you. Though for kech's sake I must point out that I struggled with the process at times too. kech, what DB espouses is counter-intuitive. All of your instincts will buck against it. You will want to call/text/be with him to tell him how important he is to you. How you don't want D. How you want your D to have both parents in the home. etc.......
The problem is, and I had to learn this the hard way, is that none of that has much chance of working. And even if you could guilt him into staying, in a short amount of time you'd be right back where you are. That is why I say TRUST the process. While it will feel like the wrong thing to do, in the end it gives you the best chance of saving your MR.
Ready2Change & URE,
I know youre right. I know I need to contact a lawyer, it is very scary. But it needs to happen. I have a feeling he is going through with filing possibly, while in this fog. He hasnt brought it up but I am just WAITING for that bomb drop because I feel it coming.
Kech, his bar lifestyle will never last. It's fun for a while but it all starts to wear down sooner than later. My suggestion to you is to some how some way hit your breaking point. Like I've told another poster. You're better than this! I have also talked to a lady I know. She went through it twice with 2 different men. As soon as she was done, and I mean her mind was made up done. The dude came crawling and crying back. But here's the other part. Her mind was made up. She wanted nothing to do with him. Same story, hanging out at the bars with OW. It got old and he thought "oh she will be there no matter what." She has my kids"...Nope...too late.
Lane, thank you so much. This was very helpful. I hope the lifestyle doesnt last but hes been living it almost a year now. When he first started doing all this he was working in another city and living there during the week, and in the end of September he came home, BD, told me he wasnt in love with me, etc. He went back to the other city and he came home about 3 weeks later a TOTAL mess. He was crying, he told me he hasnt been living healthy and hes been drinking and smoking too much and he felt like a mess and that he just wanted his healthy life back. He said he wasnt ready to say he wanted to be divorced, he wasnt sure what he wanted but that he wanted to be home with me and get his life back.
I thought to myself okay hes coming around, hes realizing he wants to be here. (It had only been 3 weeks since BD but it felt like a lifetime, and i have NO idea about OW at this time). I think that lasted about a week before he was right back to the bar, confused, not sure what he wants, etc etc. The cycle began.
He seems to think that he will always be the type of person who wants to go to the bar after work and have a few beers. He says thats not a big deal and since im not okay with it he says our characters just dont mesh. I have been willing to compromise, but when you had an affair and then you want to go spend everyday in the bar, its normal for a W to feel uneasy, when that wasnt at ALL his lifestyle before. This man who used to look down on men who werent with their wives and family for the most part, has now completely justified not ever being with his wife and family. It blows my mind.
I guess I have to get to point where im done, like your friend. But I am not there yet, I can say that I am, but it would be a lie. I cant imagine ever feeling done. I know im fed up but im trying to DB so I know im not supposed to be aggressive and mean or cold. This is VERY hard. He texted me this morning already asking if he could come see D tonight. I knew he would do that because he skipped last night to do God knows what. Disgusting. I told him yes about tonight. I will never use our D as a pawn, I will never keep her from him. But I just need him to make a schedule with me, it isnt fair for me to have to wait around for him and not know if and when he is coming.
Kech I suggest you get very strong. Are you wanting to save your relationship? Or is it done? What do you really want?
Paul, I want to save my relationship, that is what I want. I am trying to get strong in order to DB without going crazy, but it is hard. Any suggestions?
Steve is wise. He followed the process.
Thank you. Though for kech's sake I must point out that I struggled with the process at times too. kech, what DB espouses is counter-intuitive. All of your instincts will buck against it. You will want to call/text/be with him to tell him how important he is to you. How you don't want D. How you want your D to have both parents in the home. etc.......
The problem is, and I had to learn this the hard way, is that none of that has much chance of working. And even if you could guilt him into staying, in a short amount of time you'd be right back where you are. That is why I say TRUST the process. While it will feel like the wrong thing to do, in the end it gives you the best chance of saving your MR.
Thanks Steve, You are right, I would love to call text and be with him, but I know I cant. I cant guilt him into staying. SOmetimes I feel like he wants to be here, but obviously not enough. And if he is out entertaining other women, thats exciting and fun, and I cannot compete with that. Thats where I feel broken. How does a W compete with an A?
With me he has responsibility, a R to fix, work to do. With an A its fun, exciting, new, adventurous. Who in their right mind would want to come back to their W and put in all the hard work it would take to fix M when theyre enjoying their life so much? I feel totally hopeless. Yes I am GAL, but thats not with him. He doesnt even seem to remember what its like to have fun with me. He doesnt want to. He comes here and stays with the baby for a few hours and I go live my life and then come home and he doesnt see any of what happens. He isnt enjoying those times with me. He has NO idea how much fun him me and the baby could have doing things together. Taking her to do things.
About 2 months ago he was very sad bc I told him he couldnt live here. He was saying he was scared, etc. So after a few days of him being out of the house, I missed him, I knew how much he missed us, So I sent him a text and said "would you like to go do something with the baby and I?" and he said yes and I said okay, pack a bag for the night, grab your bathing suit. He joked and asked if I was going to kill him and I said "not this time". I packed a bag for the baby and I, booked a hotel room at the beach for the night, and dropped our dog off to my moms. When he got to the house he was like so whats going on? I said "were going to go experience our baby's first time at the beach together.
(we live close to the beach)
So we drove the 30 minutes to the beach together and got there just around sunset and we took the baby into the water, and then into the hotel pool, and we had a great night. The next morning I dropped him off and he gave me a kiss and we both went to work. He texted me later thanking me for it. It was a great experience and I am glad I did it, but by the next day I let him come hang out with us again, and then he moved back in, and things were going well for a while that time actually but its only a matter of time before he took advantage and started right back on his other lifestyle.
The hardest part about all of this is sticking to DB'ing when you dont feel like its doing anything. He left the house a week ago and ive been doing my best at DBing and it seems like hes just out living whatever life he wants to. And I fear that he is just having the opportunity to build a relationship with OW. He will never miss me if he is getting his emotional and physical needs met by someone else. I used to feel so confident in our relationship, I felt like there is NO way he would ever find someone and want them over me because him and I were SO strong. Now, this limbo has been going on for almost a year, I dont think he has ANY idea how great our relationship was anymore. Any comparison ill come up short because weve been living in limbo hell. All while I was pregnant, giving birth, and raising a newborn.
Admittedly, I know much less about WHs than I do WWs. With WWs sometimes "okaying" the A will make it lose it's romance. Some WWs get a thrill out of the taboo of it all. When you take that away the spice of the A fades pretty quickly. Sometimes it can open their eyes to the truth: that the A is purely physical and they stand to lose everything else.
Not sure any of that works ever with WH. Men are so physically motivated. However, men also like variety. So for a WH eventually the thrill of the A fades as it is with the same person over and over again. Maybe your WH has has more than one OW. Maybe not. It is hard to say what will eventually wake him up, if anything ever can. Who knows. This is all very complex stuff.
This is why DB is about focusing you yourself. GAL, 180ing, detaching. Is all for you. To save yourself. To be ready to move on. To be emotionally okay with whatever happens. Sometimes that has the side benefit of getting the WAS interested in coming back. Sometimes not. You just never really know what the outcome will be with the WAS. But if you DB and stick to it you know the outcome will be a stronger, better, and happy kech. Even when you don't see that as possibility in the thick of the sitch.
I wish I was better at using this site and could figure out how to read peoples stories of WH in an affair that eventually came back. I have found Bluewave, but her posts are older so im not sure she is still around.
I wish it was easier to just focus on myself. The thought of OW and all that REALLY takes over and is so hard to push out of my mind. Knowing he was doing something last night with someone else and then texts me first thing this morning to see D just disgusts me. He really is just living it up and getting to have the best of both worlds. And I cant do anything about it. I wish I could tell him whats on my mind, but that would be against DB. I would LOVE to give him my 2 cents about the type of man he has turned into. Sickening, disappointing, heart breaking. I would love to know if he has ANY clue what hes done to me, or if he just believes this fake facade I put on when he is around.
Question,
When he comes over most nights to spend time with D, I am cordial. Do I always need to leave the house? it is kind of frustrating to always have to leave. But I am willing to do it if it is what DB would call for. I have been leaving everytime so far.
There are just so many things I could be getting done around the house as well. But if being completely out of site is better I would rather do that. Just hoping for some advice on that front. And being "cordial", not too talkative, talk if he starts the convo right? He normally does, but it depends on his mood. Id LOVE to put him in his place for skipping last for undoubtedly hanging with OW, but I wont.
Better if you leave the house. He is less likely to engage you that way.
Next time you should be all dolled up. Looking great, maybe a cute little dress. Make-up, hair done, the whole 9 yards.
He'll be all like "Where are you going?"
"Out."
"With whom?"
"No one."
When he really starts grilling you, stop him, and say "When you decided to stop being my H you lost the right to ask me about where I am going."
... Do I always need to leave the house?
No. You need to do what works.
I will elaborate more later.
H:"Hi Wife, I waited to the last minute to ask if I can come over to see the baby."
I would have responded:
W:"H, I asked about a schedule the other day and you did not ask about tonight. I already have plans with D to go here, here and here. You are free to join us."
Next time you should be all dolled up. Looking great, maybe a cute little dress. Make-up, hair done, the whole 9 yards.
He'll be all like "Where are you going?"
"Out."
"With whom?"
"No one."
When he really starts grilling you, stop him, and say "When you decided to stop being my H you lost the right to ask me about where I am going."
This is what you do.
New perfume. New outfits. New style. New hair cut. (What ever makes you feel good and sexy)
You are COMPETING with a fantasy. Kick her ***.
I was doing that for a while when he was still living here, but it didnt seem to do much. He did initiate sex a few times but nothing in the case of reconciling or even really asking many questions.
He mentioned a few times I was being vague with my plans so he doesnt want to pry, which frustrates me because I want him to try and pry. Although he seems very confused about life, he seems very level headed when it comes to certain things. He knows it is no longer his place to ask me questions when I go places alone, but if I am with the baby he will ask anything he wants because he says he has the right to know where his D is. which I get.
He seems to understand that me moving on means I might meet someone else, and I think that bothers him yes, but he wont really know how much until I actually do it. Which I have no desire to anytime soon.
When he gets angry he will ALWAYS say things like "I hope you find the man you are looking for. And theyll probably be a better dad". He is ALWAYS making comments like that, like in mean ways as if our M is ending because IM LOOKING for a different type of man. He doesnt acknowledge the A in that sense, he just says he never felt like he could live up to what I wanted and I didnt appreciate him or show him love and I wasnt intimate enough with him.
He resorts back to these issues EVERYTIME we argue, even though he states he knows I have worked on things and I have changed things, he feels like its fake because it took him leaving in order for me to make these changes. Then he will usually apologize and say he feels bad for putting things on me and that he should have stuck up for himself in our M more and that he should have never entertained another woman and its all his fault, etc etc. Back and forth, back and forth.
Ready2Change,
I already responded "yes" to him about coming to see her tonight and he responded "Thanks". I will keep your suggestion in mind for next time. But I do think if I were to say "you are welcome to join us" he would take that as me trying to spend time with him and thats not what I want right now I wouldnt think. My H is VERY aware that ive wanted nothing more than to save our M. He knows that im heartbroken about all of this, but I dont think he even knows what that entails. But regardless of that, he pulls away big time as SOON as I push forward. So to tell him he can join us would probably be a recipe for disaster.
Throughout this process, as soon as I would start to pull away, even just slightly, he would hold on tight and become worried. I could tell through his actions and texts etc. And as soon as he gave me an inch I would jump right back on board with him. WHich was stupid, I see that now. This is the first time I have really pulled away from him that he doesnt seem to be getting worried or holding on tight. Which is scary for me. Seems like he has made up his mind that the S is what he wants, and Divorce is what he is going for. Although his actions seem a bit all over the place, he doesnt seem concerned with if im pulling away foreal or not. And this is a first.
I slightly expected to tell him to leave and him try to come home. I know Steve has mentioned some of his actions can be seen as him weaseling his way back in, which is definitely possible, but I guess i just wish he was trying to figure out how im feeling and be nervous. And clearly he isnt.
He is STILL going to the bar daily, which shows me how little he cares. It used to just make me feel like he was a mess and numbing his pain, and now I just see it as he is just really going forward living his life and he doesnt really care how it looks to me or what I think. He always respected my opinion enough before to never want me to be disappointed in him, now he definitely could care less. Yet the night I asked him to leave he said to me "Im going to quit drinking and smoking so I can have rights to my daughter"....which I never even mentioned drinking and smoking and any custody situations or ANYTHING like that.
He is so afraid I am going to take her from him. He wont even stop and think how well he knows me and how he knows I will not do that. Hes on his own rollercoaster in my mind, but it seems like for him he is just going through life being a good dad and doing what he wants to do everyday. He sees nothing wrong with it. When I asked him the other day when we talked when he said he knew he needed to put more effort in to spending time with D and I, I asked him "are you ok? Genuinely, are you ok? Do you need to talk to me, are you on your feet and doing ok? I am raising a baby with you and I need you to talk to me about things if you feel like you are not doing alright." and his response was "no im not okay but yes I am."
Hes just SO far off from who I used to know, I feel like he is struggling internally sometimes but will not speak to me about it. He doesnt want us to have our emotional connection anymore. He wants to pull away from me as much as he can. Im rambling, sorry. I hope you guys can find any questions I have asked in this entry. Thanks
Admittedly, I know much less about WHs than I do WWs.
I am in the same boat. Most of my time here was 2x4 to the LBH with wifes actively cheating on them. Teaching them how to man-up.
Not too much of a difference here with you Ketch.
It is all about not letting this man walk all over you. It is about you being a strong, confident, independent, beautiful and sexy woman.
You are co-dependent. The goal is to be interdependent.
First, become interdependent parents. Get the CURRENT standard parenting times nailed down. Exceptions will happen, and can be negotiated.
Right now, you are nursing a baby. This alone should dictate the parenting time.
Stop believing what he says!!
Remember believe 0% of what the WAS says and only 50% of what they do. You are still putting way too much stock in his words. Like you say, he is all over the place. You are only going to torture yourself by allowing your moods to fluctuate to the rhythm of his words and actions. Be the lighthouse (have you read the lighthouse post?) He doesn't seem to have any idea what he is doing, so you need to be the solid one, the one who has their sh#t together.
You have DBing since when, August? It is still really early in your sitch. As Steve always says it is a marathon, not a sprint. Don't expect to see instantaneous results, and if you do, don't trust them. It is a long process and you need to ready yourself for that. You already see that quick results don't last. Your H has to make some big changes if the MR is going to work.
In the meantime, you need to keep working on yourself and focusing on your D. Did you come up with any goals?
Hang in there. It really s@cks, but it will get better if you work at it.
...I do think if I were to say "you are welcome to join us" he would take that as me trying to spend time with him and thats not what I want right now...
We are trying to get him to stop asking to see baby at last minute. You are not waiting around for him. You made plans. He can't interrupt your plans.
If he wants to see the baby last minute, it is under YOUR conditions.
I set up appoint for her to get her picture taken.
Going to the zoo
to the park
to the swimming pool
to grand-moms house
to my friends house
the choices are endless.....
Ready2change,
THANK YOU. Those responses were So helpful. I wish I could read these all day long over and over. I need to remember to say these things, I just am so afraid of pissing him off, I dont even know why! Its like im so afraid if I do something that upsets him hes going to finish filing for D and then it will have been my fault for pushing him to that and I lose out on having more time.
Im constantly thinking about the future and making myself anxious. I need to stop.
Davide,
Thank you thank you thank you. Youre right, it is a marathon. Our situation started almost a year ago but I did not start actively DB'ing until about a week and a half ago. I know it is early but I am so afraid since its been so long since BD he is just going to give up. In the last year we have been on and off, working on our R, not working on it, living together, not living together. Its been crazy. Its funny you bring up the lighthouse because I was thinking earlier today I need to ask about that. I have heard so many people reference it in here and i have no read it.
I am definitely the one that has my S*** together and he knows it. He keeps saying hes going to get his together, which part of me wants him to and part of me doesnt. If getting his S*** together means him starting a new life like we used to have with someone else, then that will devastate me. Part of me feels like he needs to hit rock bottom in order to see that his new found lifestyle is no way to live. But he has surrounded himself with people who live that lifestyle, so all he sees is acceptance to that and people boosting his ego etc. Crazy. I would think he would take one look at the older men he is surrounding himself with that spend all their time in the bars and go home to twin sized beds all alone, drunk, and think Wow I dont want to be like that. But instead he just thinks he is smarter than that and it wont happen to him.
He is creating this life and bringing people into it with him to make himself feel justified in it. But here I am focusing on him. I would love to read the lighthouse thread, bc I do feel thats what I am and have been, if I am assuming I know the idea behind it.
You guys have no idea how much I appreciate the responses you give. They really clear my worries and make me feel confident. I took a break from work and got dressed to the 9's, makeup on, and I will leave for a bit when he arrives to the house.
I took a break from work and got dressed to the 9's, makeup on, and I will leave for a bit when he arrives to the house.
You go girl!
Kech. I know exactly how you feel when you say you are afraid to say anything. You're afraid of pushing them further away. I think its the same for you as me. Silence can speak louder than words and it doesn't get you in as much trouble.
Since you just started the DB. I think you just get some time under your belt. He needs to go have his new found freedoms and experience the so called wonderful life of being in a bar. Those bar girls just bounce around from guy to guy without a thought. You said he came home from out of town all down and out. That just goes to show he is not cut out for that lifestyle. He is trying so hard to fit in, but give it time. So, just so you know. I thought my sitch would be over by now and life would be back to normal...lol. It is a marathon. It will take way longer than you think. And so don't get discouraged. I know you want to save your M. The only way is for you to change. He already knows what he would be coming back to. So for now, don't talk...take action on yourself. You said yourself talking would push him..so don't talk anymore about anything about your M or R. Keep your answers short and don't act all sweet all the time. Once he realizes he's losing you he will start to wonder whats been going on. Right now, he knows where you are and knows your not going anywhere. Its such a stupid game to play, but it is what it is. Set that dude free so you can get your confidence back. Go out with friends and talk to people. You don't need to go chase other men. Just get out and breath. Don't wait another second for him to call or decide to come see D whenever he wants. Dont keep her from him but set a schedule that works for both of you. Remember, the sooner you start making changes for you the sooner you will see changes in your whole sitch. Stay silent for as long as you can. He will start to wonder. Stay strong and make yourself look good for you, not him. Trust me, he will notice. Hes not cut out for bar life..that life gets old fast. But dont let him back easy...or he will do it again. Make him work for it. But for now...work on yourself!!!
... Silence can speak louder than words and it doesn't get you in as much trouble.
Since you just started the DB. I think you just get some time under your belt....I thought my sitch would be over by now and life would be back to normal...lol. It is a marathon. It will take way longer than you think. And so don't get discouraged. I know you want to save your M. The only way is for you to change. He already knows what he would be coming back to. So for now, don't talk...take action on yourself. ...and don't act all sweet all the time. Once he realizes he's losing you he will start to wonder whats been going on. ....Set that dude free so you can get your confidence back. Go out with friends and talk to people. You don't need to go chase other men. Just get out and breath. Don't wait another second for him to call or decide to come see D whenever he wants. Dont keep her from him but set a schedule that works for both of you. Remember, the sooner you start making changes for you the sooner you will see changes in your whole sitch. Stay silent for as long as you can. He will start to wonder. Stay strong and make yourself look good for you, not him. Trust me, he will notice....dont let him back easy...or he will do it again. Make him work for it. But for now...work on yourself!!!
Wise words.
Extremely wise words. I seriously feel like I need to read them daily. Multiple times daily. Here I am at home with D at 7:30 pm and he hasn’t come to see her like he asked if he could. I fed her, bathed her, and will put her to bed soon regardless of if/when he decides to show up. But I won’t reach out to him, sticking to the silence. If he chooses to make these awful decisions it his loss, not mine.
I fed her, bathed her, and will put her to bed soon regardless of if/when he decides to show up. But I won’t reach out to him, sticking to the silence. If he chooses to make these awful decisions it his loss, not mine.
Hugs.
If he does show up, Get a firm agreement on his next parenting time.
Date, start time end time.
And if possible, get two blocks set.
He just texted and asked if it is too late. I don’t even know how to respond
I'd say. Yeah it's fine but we need to try and make a schedule.
I told him it was ok and he came and I said I was going to hop in the shower and then she needed to go to bed. And he said ok but was definitely annoyed with me. So when I got out of the shower I was nice to him and tried to get the baby to laugh with him. And then I asked him when he planning on coming next and he asked if I had plans this weekend and I said no but that we should just make a schedule and I could tell he was trying to get out of the discussion and I said “basically we need to discuss times. You could have texted me earlier tonight to let me know you would be so late.”
He said he could have texted a little earlier and told me how he almost got in an accident and then I said when we talked last you said you wanted to see her every night. So then you not showing up last night I didn’t know about. And you were here Friday with her when I went out and then no show Saturday, so I just want to get days and times figured out so we can both have our own lives and also figure out what times work best with her.....
And I asked if that made sense to him and he said yes. He was definitely trying to get out of coming this weekend and then saying he wants her during the day Sunday, and I said “ok so you’re not coming tomorrow night” and he said” no I can come tomorrow.... I’ll Be here by the time you get off work”
I don’t know it’s all very weird. He has an agenda FOR SURE. Without a doubt.
When he left he texted me saying “leaving her s*cks”.
That was good. You showed some strength. Now, that he knows you want a schedule. I'd sit down and write one down on a note pad. When he shows up, be nice and say "I spent some time putting together a schedule for us ". See what he says and then stick to your guns. If he starts making excuses why it won't work for him, you need to be firm with him on the importance of having structure in your D life. Plus let him know that you might have plans once in a while and will need to know if arrangements will need to be made etc. I don't think you will have any problems if you plan it out in your mind. And it's all about your child, not about your R or M. And you definitely rattled his cage when he left. So, now it's time to kick it into gear and dont set yourself back by reaching out by texting etc. Just be silent and watch from a distance. Keep it up.
Lane. Thank you! I saw your response too late oops. He texted me that leaving the baby s*cks. I sat and stared at the phone wondering how I could validate him on that. Before I could figure it out he texted me again and said “I’m glad you don’t have to know how it feels”
So I responded “I can’t imagine, I’m sure it’s not easy” and he responded “it tears me up every time”
Here’s where I may have messed up. But I was trying to come off as strong. I said to him that I’m sorry he’s sad and that one day we will have coparenting all figured out and that him and I will figure out how to do it right.
He responded ya and asked if he could come by in the morning to see the baby. (Odd request, that’s a first) I said yes and can we nail down a time. So he asked if 6:30 works and I said “perfect.” Which I believe was one of Steve’s favorite responses he mentioned.
I hope none of that was too bad. I’m sick of being the sad one. I’m trying to come off as strong, confident and assertive. I hope I’ve accomplished that.
You did good.
When he shows up, be nice and say "I spent some time putting together a schedule for us ". See what he says and then stick to your guns. If he starts making excuses why it won't work for him, you need to be firm with him on the importance of having structure in your D life.
Personally, I would have him watching D every Friday from 5-12 in your first draft of the schedule.
If he complains about it, you can flip his words and use truth darts.
I think you did alright. I think maybe not feel so sorry for him. I would have been silent. Especially since hes the one that brought this whole thing on to himself. But the rest was good. But definitely get a schedule put together. It will be so helpful. It shows you're being the responsible one. Oh , he will try to bend the rules, but just relax and stand firm. Make sure you're showing change. Part of that is not being so sweet and nice. Oh and if he tries to make the moves on you to be intimate, put that to a screeching halt. No more from here on out. That's more of a man need. Keep your conversation short and to the point. I know you have a baby together, but hes living a double life. Dont be the enabler, it just makes life easier for him. The changes you make wont happen over night. It will take a few weeks to months. But start the mindset now. You know you're a strong woman, a great mom, you know you deserve better than this. I know you love him. But your best chance of anything is to save yourself first. Stay positive. Hes all depressed and can't decide anything. I can remember back in my early days of going to bars all the time. It was fun and depressing all at the same time. You cant find wholesome companion there. As soon as I stopped, it took a while but I finally found my wife.
Anyways, back to you. He wont find a wholesome gal there. And if there is one, she wont want a bar fly. Right now, he thinks it's cool and fun, but I see signs of guilt for not seeing his D. So be the stronger person, hes certainly not. Hes not thinking clearly at all. But you need to be a boss and put your foot down from a distance...silently.
Lane. Thank you! I saw your response too late oops. He texted me that leaving the baby s*cks. I sat and stared at the phone wondering how I could validate him on that. Before I could figure it out he texted me again and said “I’m glad you don’t have to know how it feels”
So I responded “I can’t imagine, I’m sure it’s not easy” and he responded “it tears me up every time”
Here’s where I may have messed up. But I was trying to come off as strong. I said to him that I’m sorry he’s sad and that one day we will have coparenting all figured out and that him and I will figure out how to do it right.
He responded ya and asked if he could come by in the morning to see the baby. (Odd request, that’s a first) I said yes and can we nail down a time. So he asked if 6:30 works and I said “perfect.” Which I believe was one of Steve’s favorite responses he mentioned.
I hope none of that was too bad. I’m sick of being the sad one. I’m trying to come off as strong, confident and assertive. I hope I’ve accomplished that.
kech, remember:
Do not respond to informational texts/messages. "leaving her stinks" is informational.......
If he asks a direct question, answer in as few words as possible. Yes or no questions should get a yes or no only.
I know you are going on instincts. "But won't it upset him if I ignore his texts?" Reading them is not ignore them. If he ever says "did you see my text on how it stinks to leave her?" You say "yes".
Also, this too falls into the "believe nothing he says category". If something tore me up every time I WOULD NOT KEEP DOING IT! And I would do whatever was required of me so I didn't have to get tore up! IE, give up OW, recommit to the MR, etc.
Likely he is saying that to tug on your heard strings. And to be frank with you it appears to work. Which means you need to keep working on detachment.
Hey everyone,
Thanks for the feedback, I do need to detach. I know I do because he pulls me right back in. Theres been some new developments.
He came over this morning before work, the dog heard the door open, jumped and spilled my coffee all over the brand new white rug I just bought. Normally, this is something I would get so angry about, but I stayed calm. He tried to help clean it up and I said not to worry about it, spend time with the baby, ill handle it.
So I cleaned it and he played with the baby. We had pleasant convo as always and then he said "when I come Sunday to hang out with her, ill mow the yard"..I responded, You dont have to do that. And he said no I will its okay. Then he started talking about how when he builds the shed in the backyard for me hes going to move the dirt to the other side of the yard where we get puddles from rain. I was shocked by this because he hasnt discussed building that shed for me in over 2 months.
He stayed for a while and then left and about 2 minutes after he left I received a text from him. I will put our text convo below:
H: I hope it gets easier
W: It will. With time we will all get used to it.
H: I tear up everytime
W: Shes your baby girl, leaving her seems unimaginable. Its a hard situation, in time we will have it down.
H: It s*cks more because of you
W: What do you mean?
H: The things youve changed just hurt my feelings
W: like what?
H: Everything
H: It all f*cking s*cks
W: Its not easy, I think were just both doing the best we can and focusing on the baby
H: Im sorry
H:For everything
H: I should have address the unhappiness I felt a lot differently
H: Have a good day
W: I appreciate that and i appreciate you being a good dad through all of it. You have a good day too
H:Im trying
Now, when he says the thing about the things ive changed hurt his feelings, he has said this to me before. He says it upsets him that it took him being half way out the door before I would change certain things about myself. So I am assuming that is what he means by that comment.
So this is where it gets hard because normally after he says things like that I would start to feel like he is feeling remorse and i would try to talk about R with him. And I know not to do that now. But he came by the house again a little bit ago because something happened with work and he was venting to me about it, and he had on the hat of the OW bar in the other city, that I have repeatedly asked him not to wear in our home.
In the middle of him venting I said to him "H, GET RID OF THE HAT."
He said "Look, Ill throw it away right now. I dont care about it, its just a hat" and i said "I know you dont, but I DO, and thats the point."
He threw it away in the trash and we went on talking about his work situation and things were fine and then he went back to work. I hope I didnt mess up my progress with the hat situation, but I REFUSE to be disrespected like that in our home. Him wearing that hat AT ALL is hurtful because I know she gave it to him.
When he left we were fine and he didnt make it a big thing. He said he will be back later to see the baby.
This is where I have to work hard because part of me thinks hes feeling low and for once hes feeling low about our R and where it is right now. But I know I have to stick to what im doing. He usually feels remorse for a bit and then things go right back to how they were and he reverts right back to this lifestyle hes been living. What to do? How to act? suggestions?
Now, when he says the thing about the things ive changed hurt his feelings, he has said this to me before. He says it upsets him that it took him being half way out the door before I would change certain things about myself. So I am assuming that is what he means by that comment.
Very typical of a WAS. They all say things like this. Usually it is worded more like "Why did it take my wanting a D for you to change? The changes are too late."
This is why you need to be consistent. And over time the WAS begins to trust that the changes are real and lasting.
On the hat, yeah you probably should have ignored it. Likely he wore BECAUSE he knew you would react. This is where 180s come in. 180ing means you ignore the hat. Look, others here deal with disrespect way worse than a bar hat. Plus, maybe he was wearing a shirt you didn't even know she gave him. See? But the overall point is he wore it knowing it would bug you. The fact it did gives him that old "yep, still have her hooked" feeling that is counter to what you want him to feel. You want him to feel you are moving on.
And I will repeat, you are better off NOT responding to his texts unless there is a direct question. Again, when he texts 2 minutes after leaving, and you respond, he gets that same old "still got her" feeling.
e usually feels remorse for a bit and then things go right back to how they were and he reverts right back to this lifestyle hes been living. What to do? How to act? suggestions?
This is exactly what I am talking about. His sadness. His "this s*cks" texts. Are all to try to get back to what he wants. He wants his cake and eat it too. You took the cake away. He is trying to manipulate you to get it back. Quite being so available. Quit responding to every text. Quit reacting to hats. Stick to your guns with not letting him move back. Keep DBing!
I mentioned the coffee spilling on the rug thing because normally, he knows thats something that would make me so mad. And I was super calm and cleaned it up and handled it just really calmly. So I think its me doing things like that and how I am being towards him that is making him see changes in me.
Steve, thanks for the quick response. So you think what hes doing right now isnt really remorse, its more of him just wanting to feel like he has me on the hook?
i am glad he is feeling some sadness from all of this, because I have felt like only I have been mourning our R, and hes been living it up. But it seems like he is sad as well. no?
And with the hat, I know you are right, and you make a good point about how that would be a good 180 for me. I didnt think of it like that. I thought of it more as im trying to be assertive, valued, respected, and if I continue to let him break my boundaries, he will always walk all over me. A Very clear boundary I have set is for him to NOT wear that d*mn hat in this house.
I dont think he was even thinking about it honestly, he wears a million hats, but hes told me he would burn it in the past and clearly its still here. Now its in our garbage can outside and im tempted to walk out, get it, and set it on fire.
But now I regret that I didnt ignore it. Do you think that is a big setback from the progress I felt like I was making. I get VERY mixed up here when he starts to say things like "im sorry for everything. I should have handled it better" and talking about our R. I can talk about our D all day and be very assertive and short and to the point. But he starts to talk about R and I immediately get happy thinking he is going to turn this around.
How do I keep myself from doing that? I need to stay on this path. 2x4s welcome
So this is where it gets hard because normally after he says things like that I would start to feel like he is feeling remorse and i would try to talk about R with him. And I know not to do that now. But he came by the house again a little bit ago because something happened with work and he was venting to me about it, and he had on the hat of the OW bar in the other city, that I have repeatedly asked him not to wear in our home.
Ketch, forget about the hat for a second. Why is he coming by your house to vent to you? You are letting him get exactly what he wants out of the relationship without actually committing to the relationship. Why are you still the person he turns to when he needs to vent? That's the role that a spouse should have, but he fired you from that role when he walked away. If you keep letting him eat cake like that, and keep responding to all of his "woe is me" texts, and keep letting him drop by the house whenever he feels like it, you aren't going to get anywhere. He'll keep doing that and carrying on like he is. Are you okay with that long-term? What boundaries do you have? You aren't going to get to R by being "nice" to him.
I dont think he came by to vent, I think he was putting a company card in the mailbox for his coworker to pick up, but he was in the middle of an argument on the phone with a coworker in the driveway and then came in to tell me about it. You are right. I dont know why I allow this.
When he comes tonight I need to leave, normally at this stage with him opening up more, I would stay and hang out with him and the baby, and I know I dont need to do that.
Is it possible that all those sad texts he sends are forgotten as soon as I make a mistake like the hat situation? From an outsiders perspective can someone tell me if my marriage seems like something thats salvageable if I stick to DBing? Because I want to stick to it. I just hope it gets the M back on track, and if not then I hope it gets ME where I need to be.
If it wasnt for you guys, I would be handling this ALL wrong over and over
Steve, thanks for the quick response. So you think what hes doing right now isnt really remorse, its more of him just wanting to feel like he has me on the hook?
Yes. It is kind of like in my sitch, my W wasn't sorry she was having an EA, she was sorry she got caught.
LBSs are notorious for being the most selfish creatures on the planet. Do not believe for a moment that his "it is so hard to leave her" texts are anything more than manipulations attempts. Even if the underlying feelings are real (he really does hate leaving her), but think about this morning. He was leaving for work. He would have had to leave her this morning even if he was still in the house!
As far as the hat:
dont think he was even thinking about it honestly, he wears a million hats, but hes told me he would burn it in the past and clearly its still here.
He told he would burn it. Clearly the hat has been a point of contention before. You honestly don't believe that he didn't think about that when he put that hat on as he was getting ready to come to see you (and D)?? Sorry not buying it. I have a ton of hats too, and I always think about the hat I am putting on my head, where I am going. etc.
But no the hat thing was more of a missed opportunity (not to react) than a real setback. More of a holding serve rather than gaining ground.
ANyway, keep DBing.........but please consider my advice about not responding to every single one of his texts.
you are right. Thank you! My plan for tonight is to go get a nice long spa pedicure tonight while he is here and read DR which I bought this week and am really enjoying reading.
Great plan! I think ready2change would highly approve.
One thing I did notice, my husband was venting to me about an argument with his business partner. His business partner is actually a very good friend of ours, and normally I would try to calm him down and tell him to handle it in a good way and remember the friendship comes first, etc etc. But for the first time ever I had no desire to say anything like that.
I didnt even realize until after. All I did was validate his anger and say things like "wow ya thats frustrating". I have no desire to try to "fix" it for him or help make sure it smoothes over or even give advice on how to handle it, because ultimately I am detached from that portion of his life at the moment. I dont really have a concern if he keeps up a friendship with someone who has been one of his closest friends for 15 years, because it is no longer my place to save him.
Am I detached from HIM? not at all clearly. But it does feel as though I am detaching from the problems in his life I would normally take on and help him with. If only I could detach from him and the thought of the OW. One day maybe
He is trying to manipulate you to get it back. Quite being so available. Quit responding to every text. Quit reacting to hats. Stick to your guns with not letting him move back. Keep DBing!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^
If you do not hear what Steve is saying and change your interactions with H, you will end up divorced.
. Now its in our garbage can outside and im tempted to walk out, get it, and set it on fire.
Great idea! Do it.
But now I regret that I didnt ignore it. Do you think that is a big setback from the progress I felt like I was making
No it is a learning experience. Everything is a learning experience.
But he starts to talk about R and I immediately get happy thinking he is going to turn this around. How do I keep myself from doing that? I need to stay on this path. 2x4s welcome
This is poker. Feel happy on the inside (or later).....Make him feel like he is loosing you.
Great plan! I think ready2change would highly approve.
I highly approve.
He is trying to manipulate you to get it back. Quite being so available. Quit responding to every text. Quit reacting to hats. Stick to your guns with not letting him move back. Keep DBing!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^
If you do not hear what Steve is saying and change your interactions with H, you will end up divorced.
This is definitely enough to scare me. I dont want to end up divorced obviously. I plan to stick to my guns. I feel like im finally in a better position, I want to keep this position. I just dont know how to do it necessarily. But i believe we have a plan in place for the weekend so I will hold him to it, and keep myself busy. He made a comment the other day talking to the baby and he said "Your moms always so busy doing a million things". And I hate when he says things like that because hes not here during all the hours Im just hanging out with her playing and stuff. He makes it like Im too busy doing things to slow down and enjoy her. ALL I do is enjoy her. Hes not here.
And im obviously trying to be busy and leave when he is here. So I dont know if its backfiring but I also dont care. I will continue to be the lighthouse. I think some things might be starting to catch up to him in his own life, business wise, money wise, etc, I dont know. We will see.
Kech,
At some point, this should be stated:
"I need to know when you plan on having a stable place to live so I can start dropping D off for your parenting time"
Do you have any thoughts on why I believe this is important?
R2C
I am scared for when he gets a place because I will lose time with her. But I know it has to happen. Why do you believe it is important?
Kech,
At some point, this should be stated:
"I need to know when you plan on having a stable place to live so I can start dropping D off for your parenting time"
Do you have any thoughts on why I believe this is important?
R2C
Oh this is sooooooo good!!
kech, you need to do this....soon.
I am scared for when he gets a place because I will lose time with her. But I know it has to happen. Why do you believe it is important?
For one, it will signify to him that this current arrangement (him coming and going from YOUR place) will eventually come to a halt.
Second, it shows him that this "move out" is not temporary. That you meant what you said when you said he can't "bunk" there but be living a life completely separately, and with an OW in his life.
ready might have some other reasons too, but those were the two that stuck out to me.
Right now he is thinking that he will eventually "sad" you into letting him move back in.
I honestly do not know if he would be able to afford a place of his own, he is still paying half the mortgage at our home. But I know if I were to say something to him about his own place he would be SHOCKED. Total 180. My only fear with stuff like that is me acting like im okay with it and then he actually does it and ill be devastated I think.
When I think of him being sad, I want to save him. But then when I think that hes possibly speaking to OW, I become angry, hurt, heartbroken, disgusted, absolutely so sick to my stomach, and I think to myself WHY am I so scared of making him mad when he should be worried about making me mad just as much.
If he brings up Divorce again, do I pretend to agree or do I just say ok?I feel like I will be tested soon by him trying to get a rise out of me since I havent been giving him much on the R front and ive been speaking to talk about our daughter. So I want to be prepared for my responses. Do I continue to validate? I have noticed some success with the validating.
Oh this is sooooooo good!!
kech, you need to do this....soon.
Most LBS do this TOO LATE. They do not understand that this is shock and aww.
It is always okay to say "That (D) is not what I want. But it isn't up to me. It takes two to make a marriage, but only takes one to make a D."
That is what I would say to my W. That way she knew I was still against the D, but that there was nothing I could do to stop her. And it also conveys to the WAS that all of the work for the D is going to fall to them. The filing, the paperwork, etc.
When it comes to D, if you are opposed, then you do nothing to help it move forward. Don't actively hinder it though.
If he brings up Divorce again, do I pretend to agree or do I just say ok?
I like the suggestion of "OK".
or
H:"I want a D"
W:"I am glad you brought that up. I have actually downloaded the forms and have begun filling them out. When I am done, I will let you review them."
CAREFULLY watch his reaction.
Do I continue to validate? I have noticed some success with the validating.
YES. Agreeing is even more powerful.
I do not share my woman with any man. I do not control her. If I am not meeting her needs, I am not paying enough attention. If she desires, other men and acts on it, I will happily help her move out. I do not want to be with a woman who is does not want to be with me exclusively.