First Post might as well jump in the water.
I have read DR and started DB and been reading threads on here.
I'm a 40 M she is 34 F
Been together 7 years married for 2.
I had a severe depression and MLC for the last 3 years Job burnout and then quitting job being unemployed. Before I quit Job found out Step father had Cancer (he died over last summer) and very close Aunt had cancer and she also died last summer. I feel that my being depressed is understandable given circumstances.
Wife and I started arguing for the first time really ever in our relationship (had been really good up til then spend 24/7 together for the 7 years). My depression became total generalized Anxiety disorder in Sept. Wife came at me first time with dissatisfaction in marriage and with me beginning of Nov. said I was Fat and that she wasn't attracted to me, this obviously destroyed my already broken self confidence. We kept arguing until she went on trip to Mexico in beginning Feb while she was there my step brother died in an auto accident ugh.
When she came back we started reading "getting the love you want" together and were arguing with each other as we tried to use communication techniques from the book on the way to and back from the funeral. t
Two days later she said she couldn't do this anymore and wanted out she then stayed at friends houses and got an apartment immediately and moved out and took literally everything BUT she left her furniture and her pets as the apartment wouldn't allow them (year lease). In her moving out she said she just needed some time and that in 3 months she would be open to doing some counseling. We didn't talk for a month on her direction and then one of the pets got sick and so she has been back in our house for the past week.
After the second day of being here she said although she had enjoyed the time with me that she had no interest in ever doing counseling and she wanted a divorce but wanted to remain friends. I asked if she was seeing some one else she said no that is was an ILYBNILWY anymore situation and that she had no interest in being in any relationship with anyone and that she feels she will probably never be in another relationship ever again. That she should never have gotten married in the first place that she thought getting married and having a house would satisfy her. But now that she had found herself and the space time to write and think clearly etc. (she has also been totally overwhelmed by work and work burnout...she is also acting like a MLC). SHe is still here at the house sleeping on the air mattress and helping to take care of the very sick pet. I have also over heard two of her work calls while she has been here talking (almost bragging about how she is getting divorced) and that things were ok between us while she is here but that its the final stretch etc.
In the month she was gone I finally went to see a shrink (and do 12 step group) which is helping I am no longer depressed or anxious thank god. I started working out and eating right and I lost 20lbs. I have not been arguing with her at all. However, upon having the bomb dropped I begged and pleaded saying that I love her and we are a good couple etc. I finally said yesterday that after the inital date of the 3 months I would talk to her about getting a divorce. Obviously I do not want this and think she is being extremely rash. I am also doing and fixing all the things she said was wrong...and more so learning to do them for myself not just to get her back. But this really feels hopeless she is very stubborn and is prone to stick to her decisions good or bad. I do still love her and think that this is a MLC for her. Oh she also started seeing a shrink. I also started wearing my wedding ring when she moved out ( I had never worn it before) so my first question is should I still wear it during this time or is it a passive aggressive move? I am trying to remain consistent in what I do. I feel that going dark is hard for me because it is more of the same when I was depressed but when I interact with her she is real cold and irritated by literally everything I do. I have remained as positive as possible and been working on detachment techniques. Also I have started a journal of which actions work and which don't...so far eye contact has been positive as I never use eye contact when talking with people. I guess I am at the LRT and need some clear guidance as to what to do. Please ask me for any clarification as to help me. I love my wife still I have been loyal and honest since day one I feel blindsided but own my accountability and can see how this happened.
Welcome to the board
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
Yes first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htmYou may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH. Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Hello and welcome! Honestly she doesn't sound MLC to me, just sounds done. Sounds like you two have been through a lot of stress with deaths in the family, your depression and weight gain, sick pet, difficult work for her, no work for you, etc. etc. You said you read DR so I assume you're familiar with the basics of DB'ing. That's your roadmap back. Let her go. Give her time and space. Work on yourself. Get in shape, lose that weight, revamp your wardrobe, find a job. In short, make yourself attractive again. Don't talk about the M, ever! If she brings it up then listen and validate (read Cadet's threads for more on validation). Good luck!
WHen you say Cadet’s thread do you mean the links posted or is there another thread I should be reading? Ugh just had a big blow out conversation...I guess it needed to happen? Will post details
Feeling completely hopeless here...should I feel hopeless?
WHen you say Cadet’s thread do you mean the links posted or is there another thread I should be reading? Ugh just had a big blow out conversation...I guess it needed to happen? Will post details
Feeling completely hopeless here...should I feel hopeless?
The one right above
AnotherStander What is a “done” wife is this a type or just another name for WAW?
Also thanks for responding
Ok so I blew it on day one of being here...I dont even know how the conversation got started but we had a long one about the divorce...I guess I am glad it happened because it at least allows me to acept this and start making changes for mysef vs doing them for her. “Done” is the right word...She is done completely I dont really know how I come back from this. What she said is that this isnt about me but a pattern for her. She has been a serial dater her life had 3 long term 5 year relationships before we met...and she ended them the exact same way. She said that this is something she just does and is not interested in another relationship with anyone that her friends and colleagues probide her with enough live to sustain herself. More importantly that she has a “process” she is working through to fix herself from doing this again. OK that is good that she is trying to fix herself but she is doing by totally being done with me. I dont really see her changing her mind is 2 months when she wants to file. 2 months to give me time to process my feelings. I guess I pushed her on the subject because I was really hurting...and needed to be set free myself. I cant sit around and pine for her and wait for her...which I was doing during the month seperation. Ok so here we go Rope Drop and work on me. But man acceptance of this is really hard, I still love her and hope that we both can fix ourselves and get back together. But I dont see that happening in 2 months. Am I delusional to think that this marriage can be saved? Am I a lighthouse in this scenario is it her or me who is seeing things clearly?
Learn quickly to BACKOFF, shut up walk away when you want to speak out.
Ok this is my mantra today.
3 questions
I have a day of rest as W wont be back til tomorrow afternoon to deal with pet.
Not sure if I should be here while she is here? I do have tons of work to do at the house, and wonder if my ability to be present but completely detached wil help against my backsliding yesterday?
Also curious if conversation yeaterday is actually a good thing because it eatabliahed a breaking point where I can start acting “as if” and in her eyes my actions can now be seen as not just to get her back?
Can acting “as if” be seen as a 180? Can this be a smallest consistant action?
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
WHen you say Cadet’s thread do you mean the links posted or is there another thread I should be reading?
The links he posted up above. Read all of them, but especially the ones addressing validation.
AnotherStander What is a “done” wife is this a type or just another name for WAW?
Also thanks for responding
No I just meant done, as in, well... done
Reading all of the issues you posted in your first post, it just does not sound like an appealing marriage at all. She wants out of it. She's not attracted to you, and that coupled with all the other stuff that's been going wrong adds up to an unpleasant situation that she wants out of. So your goal shouldn't be to bring her back into that M, but remake yourself into a strong, independent, good-looking, in-shape you that she might be attracted to and start a new R with her.
“Done” is the right word...She is done completely I dont really know how I come back from this. What she said is that this isnt about me but a pattern for her. She has been a serial dater her life had 3 long term 5 year relationships before we met...and she ended them the exact same way. She said that this is something she just does and is not interested in another relationship with anyone that her friends and colleagues probide her with enough live to sustain herself.
Do you know Sandi's rules?
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2777879#Post2777879Don't believe anything she says right now and only half of what she does. She's confused and in turmoil and her mind is a whirlwind of crazy thoughts. Whatever she tells you is how she feels THAT SECOND and could change in a minute or hour or day or month. This is why we say back off and give her time and space, because talks like this GO NOWHERE.
I guess I pushed her on the subject because I was really hurting...and needed to be set free myself.
If you push a WAS it will never go how you want it to. So DON'T.
I cant sit around and pine for her and wait for her...which I was doing during the month seperation.
MOVE FORWARD. Have you read DR?
Am I delusional to think that this marriage can be saved?
In a few days or week or month? Yes, that's delusional. In many months or a year or possibly several years? No, that is a very reasonable expectation.
Am I a lighthouse in this scenario is it her or me who is seeing things clearly?
You sound desperate and needy and clingy. That is NOT being a lighthouse. You've got to get past that phase and start working on yourself.
Not sure if I should be here while she is here? I do have tons of work to do at the house, and wonder if my ability to be present but completely detached wil help against my backsliding yesterday?
Live your life. If you have things to do around the house then do them. Don't concern yourself with what time she'll be there, or if she'll be there. It doesn't matter. People come here with so much fear that if they do this or that it'll ruin their recon chances. You didn't end up here because of one little act, it was the result of many, many bad things that happened over a long period of time. Reversing it will take many, many good things over a long period of time.
Also curious if conversation yeaterday is actually a good thing because it eatabliahed a breaking point where I can start acting “as if” and in her eyes my actions can now be seen as not just to get her back?
No, she will still see it all as an act. And it probably is right now. You've got to do 180's and do them for months or even years before she'll believe you really have changed. What is your list of 180's?
Can acting “as if” be seen as a 180? Can this be a smallest consistant action?
You're dropping a lot of words from DR but it doesn't sound like you really know what they mean. Did you read it? If so, all in an evening? SLOW DOWN, READ, UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE READING. There is no quick fix here, just settle in and take a deep breath. PATIENCE.
Many thanks for the real talk responses, they are helpful.
Yes read the DR book but should probably read it again slower and let the info sink in...Im a pretty smart guy and because of that don’t listen or read in a way that lets things really sink in...I think I already know the answers but clearly that is a character fault I need to 180 because it is not helping me at all.
No I have not made a 180 list yet but that sounds like a great place to start! Is there a good reference or chapter in DR for identifying which things need a 180?
And yes I admit I am needy and clingy ... add that to my 180 list...and also admit that although W and I are great together as people the OR did become miserable.
Are there any good 180 threads on here I should read?
Are there any good 180 threads on here I should read?
Have you read all of the links Cadet sent in his first response? If not that is the best place to start.
No I have not made a 180 list yet but that sounds like a great place to start! Is there a good reference or chapter in DR for identifying which things need a 180?
The 180's are different from person to person. Basically it is identifying where you want to improve yourself. If you're always 5 minutes late, start showing up 5 minutes early. If you've got bad breath, start eating tic tacs or whatever. If you have anger issues, start working on that. Since your improvement areas are different from mine for instance, we cannot provide you with a list.
180s are for you and not your W. But you are using what your W has told as a starting point and goal post.
They are called 180s because will do the exact opposite of what your W said she didn't like.
Read cadet post there is A lot of jewels in his post.
For me a few 180s were.
Helping out more with our kids unprompted. My W complained that I was an absent father.
My W complained I didn't help her around the house. I started helping out around the house unprompted.
My W said I was very selfish. I worked on caring for others before myself.
I also learned my W love languages(LL), I studied exactly what it meant to love in her languages.
I hope this help. My 180s will be different from yours. I was also a true A hole to my W. I 180 that as well.
Thanks for the replies so far.
Well after my losing my way yesterday and feeling really stupid about having done so and having to start over again today I can see how every move I made will not get me any sort of result I am looking for and not make that mistake again. I just wish I would have listened to what I had read and not acted.
So back again at day one I feel like I did really good today and was totally detached (although I only had to deal with one quick text message echange about the sick pet) and focused on myself and the changes I need to make.
Im a musician and booked a concert later in the month which will be the first time Ive played out in 3 and half years. Also booked a vacation for myself which is a big deal as I have a severe fear of flying which was a serious problem in the relationship. But I guess most importantly I did these things for my own self worth as these are problems I was unhappy in myself about not actualizing...its a bit of a win win that these are things I know W was disappointed in me about. I still love her but learning how to love myself...started to recognize some codependent behaviors I was in denial about or just couldn’t see from my previous vantage. Any tips on nuturing patience?
Ok reread abunch of DR over the last few days and am figuring it out better.
Yesterday was actually really good W came over about 6 hours before I was expecting her. I was luckily in a really good mood and we had a pretty fun conversation about her night before laughing etc.
I also caught the point where the conversation could have started to lag and excused myself to mow the lawn. Right when I was finishing she was leaving so things ended on a good note.
Im starting to understand detachment better...I just need to detach from my feelings of desire not detach from the person.
She came over today and is currently at the house and as soon as she arrived I said I had to go out and was running late. I will monitor if my absense has any effect? Really trying to GAL here joined meet up and signed up for some stuff etc.
Also made a first pass at a 180 list and put down 20 things...what I noticed was that most of the items were Action oriented items which are things I can tangibly monitor as either I am doing them or not...but some things were Emotion oriented items like stop being needy or stop being controlling. Not sure exactly how to monitor these?
Ok don’t know how to perceive this result?
I stayed away from house for 5 hours...came back she was still at the house watching tv in bed with sick pet. I asked her if she wanted to share steak I was making, she said yes then said she had to leave in 10 minutes? We talked and joked a bit about her new neighbors kids, all quite pleasant. I really had to muster some strength to be pleasant and remember to do eye contact as I am exhausted from my day out. She then said that she wants to take the sick pet to her house and would be back by later to pick it up. I didn’t argue about it and just said ok.
I guess its a good thing because it will give me a break from having to take care of it for awhile, and will be good to be able to go dark and totally give W space which I havent been able to do with her coming by everyday and staying last week. But I do have to admit I really do not like going dark because I donenjou her company. Just wish that she enjoyed mine.
So back to monitoring I cant tell if going out today gave me a result positive or negative? Was she waiting on me to return, perhaps curious how long I was out (note ahe never asked me where I was going) or did my absence push her away that she wants to take the pet?
Ok 2 weks later.
The pet died and it was very sad, W and I were both here and we went to her parents house to bury it and stayed the night there in seperate beds. Some of her girlfriends came over and despite the sad event we all had a good time and I kept my mood positive but I did cry pretty hard in front of W when I buried the pet. Which could be seen as a 180 because I had previously stifled my emotions over my family members who died last year...but it could also have made me look weak and needy...got to just own it as an authentic expression. W did commend me on doing a great job of taking care of sick pet. And I swear there was a point in the long drive where I could feel W staring at me in a peculiar way.
When we got home she initiated a “know that ILY” and gave me a hug before she left.
I then left out of town for a couple days to get some mental clarity myself. W stayed at my house and watched the pets she also texted me 5 days in a row with what felt like little temp checks. I responded briefly to each and even left one unanswered for 6 hours.
Monday I texted her to ask how she was doing emotionally over the pet (realized W had asked me about how I was and in my quasi darkness and positivity of where I was at neglected to ask ker) we then engaged in about 20 texts back and forth jokingly about stuff and I ended the conversation with arranging getting her money for my half the vet bills.
She left yesterday for a week with her girlfriends in Mexico and I am going dark.
I guess despite all the communication I really dont feel like things are mending. And despite all the GAL I am doing things still seem bleak.
I read all 5 threads of Sandis on the WW and am pretty sure mine is just a WAW who is just done. Need some hope to hang in there myself.
On a side note one of her close girlfriends and her bf reached out to me to hangout with them? Not sure if I should or not.
I also took the advice to get a haircut and started getting a new wardrobe for what its worth
Hi everyone,I am newbie here.
Welcome
I suggest you start your own thread, with your own story!
Well that was a weird post above?
Anyway I would love if some other members could chime in on what I am going through. All the support right now would be very helpful.
Getting a new haircut and wardrobe is a start. It's important to not be a slob - take care of your physical appearance, grooming, and hygiene. First things women notice. You will also feel better when you look fresh and clean, so it's good for your mental pick-me-up. Just that change started to make me feel like a million bucks, and then the rest slowly followed because internal work is hard and you need to be persistent at it.
Going dark while she is Mexico is great. Now fill that time with a complete focus on YOU. Keep GAL, find areas that you need to improve to be a better person, and start making goals.
Nothing is going to turn around fast. So, even if you've had some good texts, that stuff is really superficial. Don't analyze it. Don't stress over it. Just let it roll off your shoulders.
Good to hang on to some hope, but it's best that you come to a place of acceptance that this is over. Is there a new MR in the cards in the future? Maybe. But, if you can't get yourself correct, you won't have a shot at recon that will be meaningful.
Don't hang out with her girlfriends and bfs. They are a straight pipeline to your W. Find your own group of social friends and stay out of her social network. She needs to see you strong and empowered and confident. Get working on that!
Ste7e, all I can say is hang in there. Keep DBing. She will either stay or go, but all you can control is you.
So keep detaching. It is a long, hard process. Keep GAL. Keep being the best you that you can be.
It may save your MR, it may not, but doing what you did before didn't work. So keep finding ways to 180, and be consistent.
Awesome response maika just the kind of reinforcement I need.
It is really hard to find my own life as our MR life was completely intermingled.
But I can see how creating my own keeps me out of the fray.
I am moving towards acceptance of the end but not quite there yet.
As a lot of others on here I fear that if I accept it over I fear that I will lose hope. It seems like balancing the two are in opposition to one another.
It is really hard to find my own life as our MR life was completely intermingled.
Yes, and that is not a healthy sign. I was there too. It's complete co-dependency if things are super intermingled. Where is your identity and you as a person? Now is the perfect time to figure that out and see where it goes. After BD, I had 2 people in my social network in my town. I started new GAL activities and started meeting people. And now I am slowly building my own network that is completely outside of W. Look at Meetups. You can do it, no problem.
I am moving towards acceptance of the end but not quite there yet.
Don't fret over that. Acceptance and detachment take time. Take the time to grieve the end of your relationship and accept that it is truly over. But don't stay there forever, and make sure you're doing positive things so that you're pulled out of your grief. Now start building yourself up.
As a lot of others on here I fear that if I accept it over I fear that I will lose hope. It seems like balancing the two are in opposition to one another.
It is perfectly fine to have a small piece of hope tucked away in your heart. But, that hope has to be centered around you being a full and happy person. And that hope has to be about finding the person that will enrich your life - maybe it's your W, or maybe it's someone else.
What are some things your W has done that contributed to the demise of your MR? Where did she fail you as a partner? Dig deep and find answers to those questions, and then think of what you need in a partner. When you find out what you need in a partner, add that to your cup of hope. Now your hope is about positivity, happiness, and flourishing in life.
I know this isn't easy. trust me I know. But, I can guarantee you that the other side of the tunnel isn't scary and that this internal work will make you hella attractive to others.
But I do have to admit I really do not like going dark because I donenjou her company. Just wish that she enjoyed mine.
Sorry you're here, man. Here's the thing - nobody likes going dark. It is incredibly hard in the beginning. But you have to remember that in the end this is about you. Do you enjoy your own company? You should. If you don't enjoy being with you, then who will? Split your time between social events and solitary activities - you are an interesting person with a lot to offer and you enjoy the company of others without needing their constant presence for validation. If your wife disagrees, then it is HER loss.
So back to monitoring I cant tell if going out today gave me a result positive or negative? Was she waiting on me to return, perhaps curious how long I was out (note ahe never asked me where I was going) or did my absence push her away that she wants to take the pet?
I struggled with this too, and in the end was all more the fool for it. Stop over-analyzing. You SHOULD monitor results, but when it comes to you getting out and having a life, she does not get the right to have a negative reaction. That is simply the consequence of her choosing to leave. If she does not want you to move on, it is on her to say something. Unless you are sleeping around, she cannot complain.
I am definately not sleeping around...and never have in this relationship.
Also I have been 100% honest the whole time which all makes this the harder to understand?
I am definately not sleeping around...and never have in this relationship.
Also I have been 100% honest the whole time which all makes this the harder to understand?
See! Then what right has she to be upset with you living a little? Your world no longer revolves around her. She made that choice when she walked out.
Saw your post in ballast's thread. There is no such thing as too much time. Find ItHurts current thread. Been divorced for 4 years with NC and now she's pursuing him. It's never too late.
I hope this posts...I am seeing W for first time in a month tomorrow night. She said she wanted to get some in person time? No idea if that is a good or bad thing. What do I need to do?
I hope this posts...I am seeing W for first time in a month tomorrow night. She said she wanted to get some in person time? No idea if that is a good or bad thing. What do I need to do?
Mirror her,
mostly listen, validate, and let her set the pace.
You didnt break her and you cant fix her.
I hope this posts...I am seeing W for first time in a month tomorrow night. She said she wanted to get some in person time? No idea if that is a good or bad thing. What do I need to do?
Cadet's response is spot-on. Don't assume anything, and don't be surprised if she cancels or just doesn't even show up. This happens so much it's crazy, a WAW will say she wants to talk about something and may even set a date for it, and then NO FOLLOW-THROUGH AT ALL.
Ha yeah she actually scheduled for last Wed and no called no showed. Texted the next morning said she fell asleep at 7pm and slept through. She tried to schedule for last night but I told her I was busy.
More about mirroring?
Well she did come over...it was not with good news.
She wanted to make arrangements to get the rest of her stuff from the house and set a date for getting and signing divorce papers.
I validated like crazy...but she is hell bent on divorce.
I am crushed now what do I do?
The worst part about the night was that she came over and we went and had dinner and it was a very pleasant evening until we got back to the house and she ripped into her desires to completely seperate and fast track things. She wants the divorce to be finalized and to coencide with her starting a new job in 3 months.
What do I do now?
Anyone please help
You let her do what she's going to do. You don't have to help her, but you shouldn't try to make her stop or slow down. You can't talk your way back into a happy R with her. It will just look and feel like pursuit to her if you do, and that will push her further away.
{Aside: you don't need to concern yourself with her job change timetable and desire/demand that the D be complete then. Not even remotely your concern.}
Just keep doing what everyone's been telling you to do: cease all pursuit, go dark(er), GAL like your life depends on it (it does, at least a happy life), get into IC if you're not already in it, get fit, eat right, be pleasant but distant if you have to interact, like you'll be doing something incredibly interesting as soon as she's gone, get out of the house as much as you can, learn to meditate, read.
And, as much as you don't want a D, get a lawyer so you don't get boned or railroaded if she does file.
I guess I have been doing a terrible job of LRT thinking that things were better than they are. Also kept thinking I was dealing more with a WAW than a WW although with no known EA or PA?
Well in a total moment of weakness yesterday after a terrible experience with my shrink (I immediately got a new one booked for next week who is an actual marriage counseler) I called the W and we had a pretty decent talk and she opened up ever so slightly.
The dynamic between us is so weird as she is somewhat caring when I am weak but when I am assertive and strong she is a brick wall. Not sure how to process that and use in a constructive way?
Well you are still too focused on her and her reactions. You will not be successful with that focus. Do what you feel is right, and her reaction is meaningless. You are trying to mind read her.
You are right Steve : ( My thoughts are obssessively about her and I am so scared about letting go as I fear dropping into depression and codependent withdrawal.
Man it hit me hard tonight. I should have just done nothing earlier. I kept reaching out to W and saying I love you for the past 2 and a half months. Now it just feels like she is never coming back. It feels like it is too late to LRT I showed my hand.
It will hit hard. And a day later you will be like, do what you want.
It's not too late it just seems beyond your control. Fact is it was always beyond your control.
Stay strong.
I will mirror what RR said, it is never too late. I'm in the same boat as you, i have days where i feel hopeless and I'm consumed by my emotions, other days i go about my business and have no thoughts on my wife. Focus on yourself, get into the best shape of your life, get out with friends, improve yourself at work! Anything but focusing on your W.
You didn't mention any kids, going DARK/NC should be easier for you. Here's the thing sometimes we forget, our wives did not fall in love with us overnight, and they didn't fall out of love from one day to the next! It will take time for them to see any changes and actually believe them. We cannot control them, Be the best Ste7e you can be, if recon happens great! If not, her loss and something better will come along at the right time. Stay strong
Newly20 great advice...yeah the idea that they didnt fall in love with us overnight is helpful. Really trying to finally focus on me. It is hard as I can get into obsessive compulsive headspace where I just focus on her ... any tips on getting out if OCD
Advice? Get busy.
If it is not possible. A cold shower will give you something else to think about. Read about cold showers. Many positive benefits. Turn that sucker on cold and you will break that ruminating loop.
Ok round 2...W is coming by today to sort all her remaining possessions from mine. I know I need to validate and mirror and I think I did a good job of that the other night. But I really need to detach and not say ILY even if I get pulled into a conversation about R.
I need to act as if I already decided that I will be ok without her in my life im any capacity moving forward. There is nothing I want or need from her. I will be ok I will not need control over anything but my emotions and pain. I need a good day today with a step forward to not pursueing. I only need this one day now and when I come to tomorrow I will need that day then. Dont get ahead of myself or the situation. Any other pointers or encouragement?
Ok W came over yesterday to sort her remaining possessions from mine. I was positive talked about job interviews I had coming up and mutual friends kept it pretty light. I walked through house with her and we sorted stuff pretty quickly. She was still moving stuff and after her being there for 30 mins I said I had to go.
I feel good that I avoided any conflict in a very emotionally loaded situation and have decided to go completely dark until she reaches out to see me. Lets see how long this takes.
Good for you. We all screw up and some even admit it. We need to acknowledge when we do well, especially in tence anticipated situations.
Watch the small talk and following. I'm sure it is all in good context but stay aware.
Saying ILY in the context of a R talk is not the same as the persuasive ILY in hopes of getting a response. Do you see the difference?
Maybe others will chime in.
Yeah thanks for the tip on being mindful of the small talk and following.
I would also like to know about saying ILY in R talks being ok...seemed like in the context I needed to say it to make my stance. But at this point I have said all I had to say now I wait.
Let me try to explain as I see it.
W on her way to work. H says ILY, there is an implied need for a response.(Pursuing)
H and W having a R talk. H in the context of the discussion says "ILY but I'm not going to ......whatever."
That is simply a profession. As long as it is not pursuing and that obviously means infrequent. It is said as a disclosure. If this is confusing, just don't say it.
Let me try to explain as I see it.
W on her way to work. H says ILY, there is an implied need for a response.(Pursuing)
H and W having a R talk. H in the context of the discussion says "ILY but I'm not going to ......whatever."
That is simply a profession. As long as it is not pursuing and that obviously means infrequent. It is said as a disclosure. If this is confusing, just don't say it.
The confusing part can be for the WAS/WS. The problem with saying ILY isn't just the implication of looking for a response, but also it reminds the WAS that they don't love you, at least they don't think they do in their WA state.
The best rule of thumb is to just not say it. Whether it is pursuing or not it is pressure, and you want to alleviate as much pressure on the WAS as possible.
Well either way, in my monitoring of results saying ILY has not brought me closer to my goal.
Ste7e, how would you even know? You have been here but a few days.
If you say or do anything in an attempt to get results. That is called controlling.
I have been here for a couple months now. Rr17 you make a good point about controlling but I thought my goal was to not get D?
We are getting into semantics here. IMO, we are here to give our M/R the best possible chance at being saved.
Intuitive measures tend to be counterproductive. (Chasing and being needy and pathetic)
Nothing you say can change W.
To oversimplify the process. I believe the key is to remove all of this strangers pressure.
Work on yourself to become a better you and to prepare yourself for whatever lies ahead.
Demonstrate that you are not going to be jerked around and that you are prepared to go on with or without W. (regaining the power you lost at BD.)Detachment
Controlling is both adding pressure and pursuing. IMO
Argh need to get to a laptop
Ste7e,
I am a newbie here as well, and I was struck by the similarities of our situations. I am 41, my wife 33. It looks like she is stuck in the throes of a MLC and is WAW. I left the house to give her space a month ago and am struggling with the exact same emotions as you are. I have only text/email communication with her for the most part, only met once in 4 weeks to talk. It is really hard. I don't know how much advice I can give you as I am living the same roller-coaster of pain as you are. For me it has been a revelation to realize that this is all about her MLC and the only thing I can do is try to hang on for the ride, give her the space she needs, make the changes to myself and hope that she realizes her mistake at some point.
Most all LBS initially think it is an MLC.
MLC is a just a great excuse for a lot of LBS to stay stuck in limbo and not make decisions. They think they can just ride this out and excuse all type of horrendous behavior. It's a soothing thought to think your partner is now an alien and they'll come back to you at some point if you just stick it out. That just sounds like self-punishment. Don't make excuses for their behavior, and get some self-respect to know that you won't be treated like this.
Well I received some quite flattering attention from another woman recently and it made me feel very good about myself. I am really torn here because I know for my own codependency entering into any new relationship is not the healthy thing to do. And I know if my W came back I would drop and hurt whoever I was seeing which is a terrible thing to do to someone else. I am just confused about how I interpret the advances from OW? How are we as DB supposed to deal with these types of situations? I am letting go of W and focusing on ME but what if focusing on me brings someone new into my life at this time?
Really? Are you asking how to handle attention from an OW?
Enjoy the flattery and keep to your self. It may not even be real. Either way, who cares? Learn how to feel good about yourself regardless.
I would never act on anything. It just made me feel really weird as the space in my mind occupied by my WAW I am trying to free and this OW started to fit in to the void
Read Sandi's rules.
36. It is best to stay away from the bar scenes where other problems easily arise.
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