There is your reason. GROWTH! You nailed it, buddy...
I hear ya VAPS....what a price to pay for GROWTH so I better make good use of it!!
Well.... I had the house appraisal done today so I should find out tomorrow what it's worth and how much I will need to give my W. My fear is that I won't be able to afford to stay in the house. I don't feel sad being here and personally would rather stay although I know in the future, in my next R, whoever I meet is probably not going to want to live in the same house that my W did.
I guess the biggest reason I want to stay is for my kids. I feel like as they have gone through these changes over the past year they have always had this as their home. In some ways I feel like me being in the house has helped them with getting through this. If I sell it I will be moving to an apartment as well which for me is not the end of the world but then I think about my girls, not having the neighborhood kids to play with and going from my apt to my W's every other week.
I hate it for them....Am I projecting? Does anyone have a read on this?
J,
I think staying in the M home is great for the kids because with everything changing in the family structure at least their home remains the same. I also insisted that we do not touch their rooms when dividing furniture.
Your W seems pretty reasonable, maybe she will work with you to allow you to keep the family home.
I am with you on not feeling sad about it. It feels great to not have to go through the stress of finding a new home!
My W is so stressed about finding a new home.
I hate it for them....Am I projecting? Does anyone have a read on this?
Joseph9,
I think you're spot-on. My sons were born and raised in my house (my wife and I bought it shortly after we married). They love the house and the neighborhood. Keeping the house was important to me because I knew it would provide some stability for my sons during a difficult time.
I was very lucky. During mediation, I discovered that my wife didn't co-sign on the bank note so I didn't have to refinance the house. There's more to the story, but needless to say, it was a good day for doodler.
I hope you're able to work something out with your wife. I think it makes a big difference for the children.
Ok cool,, thanks guys. I didn't think I was too far off. The kids rooms are still intact as they were when the W left. She went out and bought new stuff for their rooms in her apartment.
I think she we will work with me but I am going to need to get creative. I have enough money in the 401 to cover but she wants cash on hand to pay off debt and to have some money in the bank.
My mortgage guy is checking with the title company to see if her name is on the loan if it is I think the only way to get her off of the loan is to refi. If I have to go that route maybe I can get around refi-ing all of her portion of the equity.
I was fine going to an apartment until yesterday. It was a beautiful day outside and after we got home from church the girls went outside and played with the neighbors all afternoon. They rode bikes to the park and it just reminded me of how it would really stink if we had to move. They still call our house their home and they refer to the W's apartment as such.
If she won't budge and I have to refi half the amount it is really going to be a struggle.
Have you talked to your kids? They are a bit young, yet, but mine were very understanding about the possibility of moving, and very supportive. I was lucky in that I was able to stay in the house, and happy that I was able to provide some stability and security for them, but they both said that I didn't have to, and they would understand.
One thing I was able to do was refi with the same loan (term and amount), in a package that eliminated all of the closing costs. It just basically restarted the same loan seven years later. I'll have to pay her half the equity out of other assets.
One thing, though, is to be careful about which assets you give her in the D. If you give her all cash and equities, and are credited the same amount in your retirement account, when you cash out your retirement, you will be taxed at around 30%, whereas your W will only be taxed at the long term cap gains rate of around 10%, so you will have given her almost 20% more after tax money than you received.
Hi Jim the current plan was to split the house 50/50, split the 401 50/50, we would not touch our pensions (they are almost equal in value) and the money set aside for the kids would not be touched.
Depending on the amount of equity we have in the house I was going to propose to her that I give her a specific dollar amount of the equity and I would make the difference by giving her a larger portion of the 401.
This way it would reduce the amount that I need to refi and hopefully put me in a position financially to keep the house.
If it was just me I would sell the house, take my portion of the money and take a vacation
. I am struggling with the decision though due to my kids.
Hi J9,
I just wanted to pop in and say hello. You have such an active thread so I may have lost track of some of it. I am sorry to hear about the pending D and possibly losing your home. That is hard stuff. Really though, I only see good things for you. You are a model DBer, a wonderful dad, and you have handled your sitch so elegantly from day one. I have no doubt that one day you will meet a lovely woman who can truly appreciate you the way you deserve.
Blu
J9, I maneuvered hard to keep the family home for my kids. I want them to have some stability in their lives. I worry about affording it in the long run, but I know if I want it enough, I'll find a way to make it happen. If not, I can sell it all on my own, at my own pace.
I was able to buy my XW out of the house by subtracting her equity (50% of shared equity) from the amount she owed me from her 401k.
Hi Blu....I am glad you returned, your writing and insight you provide others is priceless. I was happy to read about you and your H, you deserve it!
I always thought I did a good job with DBing however my W never moved in my direction. She never once showed an interest in what I was doing, when she left she was done. I battle periods of sadness more about what could have been vs what was lost and what my children won't get to experience. With that said I feel good with who I am, what I have to offer, I am a proud father of two amazing little girls and I know my story is not over.
I appreciate your kind words and positive re-enforcement. It means a lot!
H - I am going to need to do the same and hopefully she will work with me on it. I do know my W wants cash on hand to pay off the vehicle she is getting and to pay off her portion of debt. I can stand to refi a portion of the equity just not all of it so if she will agree to only take 1/2 of her portion I am willing to make up for it out of my 401.
My fingers are crossed......if nothing else maybe my loving detachment and model DBing efforts will pay off in the D settlement
Be proud of your walk J9! And keep the head up. Sure your Ds are proud of who you are. All my respect to you man.
Thanks N....I appreciate it, it means a lot. You and Vaps always lurking! I obviously always knew I loved my D's but going through this ordeal has taken it to a completely different level. When it comes to them and myself I will not waiver.
I am sad, happy, proud and excited all at the same time. You really find out what your made of though when you go through something like this. I am more confident now than I have ever been before in my life. I have also realized I am a better man that I ever thought I was.
You really find out what your made of though when you go through something like this. I am more confident now than I have ever been before in my life.
It changes you forever! In a good way. Once you have been through h$ll, you are not afraid of anything anymore.
Amen...LH......I will never be the same!
Wow, i get so much from reading other's threads, in reviewing to provide my opinion on the house sitch, i ran across the quotes below that really helped me. This, from your last thread really helped me define my XW:
Temp checking is very different, the wayward wants plan A and to keep the other as Plan B.
The walkaway has no plan A.
Just saying
My (X)W behavior was/is very similar. During Marriage counseling, she had no idea what she was going to do outside moving in with Mom. Now i know the causes even if it doesn't change what i need to do. Thanks Vanilla/Joseph9
The pursuit and distance concept did not workout for me. It might have brought her closer to the extent the pressure was removed but it did not bring her closer wanting to know about my life, what I was doing, it never caused her to ask more questions or to show an interest in my comings and goings. I do know that it helped me heal which is more important.
Same here on my sitch. I think you have detached a whole lot better than i. Kuddos to you.
Hi Jim the current plan was to split the house 50/50, split the 401 50/50, we would not touch our pensions (they are almost equal in value) and the money set aside for the kids would not be touched.
Depending on the amount of equity we have in the house I was going to propose to her that I give her a specific dollar amount of the equity and I would make the difference by giving her a larger portion of the 401.
This way it would reduce the amount that I need to refi and hopefully put me in a position financially to keep the house.
If it was just me I would sell the house, take my portion of the money and take a vacation
. I am struggling with the decision though due to my kids.
Anyway, this is what i was wanting to reply to throw my $0.02 in before i went into your last very (off track) helpful thread. Sorry for the rewind hijack.
In the D, I got the house in the divorce and planned to keep it for the same reasons as you want to. I went back and forth with this decision, and that position was fortified back then when my IC mentioned she sold her family house because of the memories of her late husband in it (other input had been "thats sounds good"). She later regretted moving out of the house her kids had grown up in because she thought she had not taken them into account fully when making the decision. However, her kids were older.
All was going according to this plan until i got laid off recently. This has forced me to re-look at that decision. Like Holding i could probably make it happen with the help from family, but I'm considering taking some advice on the forum and now selling it and rearrange my assets to ultimately get something new. As was pointed out, the kids would most likely like something new and it would be a "new beginning" both for the kids and myself.
After reflection, i now am thinking keeping my house may also be my way of holding onto the (old) MR and this would give me the opportunity to make some changes for me (and the kids) as well. My W had wanted to get out of the house anyway and would not want to move back in if we were to reconcile. You seem better detached than i though, so this might not be the case with you. Getting something new that is tailored towards me and the kids may bring the focus on the other constant in their lives. I'm still on the fence though, but now leaning towards selling. Like Holding, i have some time to make that decision. The other thing that was brought up to me was that if i keep the house and find someone new, i may just be filling the EXs role in the house. How would you feel if you found someone else and stayed in your house? Would they just be filling a role there?
From personal experience, it if pretty effin weird having some else in the same house you shared with the significant other. Esp. having sex with some one new. It feels like cheating and it is an awful feeling.
But perhaps it's just me...
Me too......
The house needs a new stamp.
Besides it's all theoretical at this stage so no use speculating how it will be.
When WH left I revamped and made a different bedroom the new MBR. I have had visitors to stay but even at 3 years in still have not dated. My clever nephew lived in the old MBR and its become his room in my mind. I am still healing but nearly there. So will have to face these questions one day I think so.
That bridge to be crossed when I reach it.
V
I was able to buy my XW out of the house by subtracting her equity (50% of shared equity) from the amount she owed me from her 401k.
I admit I may have it backwards, but I don't think so....
I think this is the right way to go, if possible, Holding. You have after tax money, and she has before tax money. Say you both got $50K out of the split; you truly have $25K, but she's only going to get 19K after taxes are paid when she takes the money out.
From personal experience, it if pretty effin weird having some else in the same house you shared with the significant other. Esp. having sex with some one new. It feels like cheating and it is an awful feeling.
But perhaps it's just me...
It's not just you. And it's not just in the same house, either. And on occasion, it really... interferes... with the flow of things.
I think she we will work with me but I am going to need to get creative. I have enough money in the 401 to cover but she wants cash on hand to pay off debt and to have some money in the bank.
My mortgage guy is checking with the title company to see if her name is on the loan if it is I think the only way to get her off of the loan is to refi. If I have to go that route maybe I can get around refi-ing all of her portion of the equity.
If she won't budge and I have to refi half the amount it is really going to be a struggle.
I think she can sign a release of the loan to you without you refinancing (a quit claim deed or something like that), but she would still be liable for the loan if she is on it. If you fell behind, she could foreclose on you. Thats what i did, but the W wasn't concerned about her liabilities at the time. Assuming you bought the house during the marriage, i don't see why she wouldn't be on the loan.
I was fine going to an apartment until yesterday. It was a beautiful day outside and after we got home from church the girls went outside and played with the neighbors all afternoon. They rode bikes to the park and it just reminded me of how it would really stink if we had to move. They still call our house their home and they refer to the W's apartment as such.
Sounds like they feel the way i had thought my kids felt about my house. With that in mind, i'd be leaning towards keeping it if you can. As Vanilla points out, you can always make a different decision later if you decide its too much, meanwhile the property values might increase where you'd do better at that time.
One thing, though, is to be careful about which assets you give her in the D. If you give her all cash and equities, and are credited the same amount in your retirement account, when you cash out your retirement, you will be taxed at around 30%, whereas your W will only be taxed at the long term cap gains rate of around 10%, so you will have given her almost 20% more after tax money than you received.
If she wants only the cash, you'll have to pay not only the taxes (the 30% mentioned or whatever your bracket is) but also a penalty (I think its 10%) on the 401k. the penalties and taxes may shoot yourself in the foot here. I agree with Jim, make sure you don't lose too much here. On the other hand, you could just negotiate with her. At first offer like amounts and let her transfer the assets and deal with all that herself.
Thanks all it sounds like a very personal decision of which is not going to be an easy one. My oldest told me this morning that she loved her room....uggh. At my W's apartment she shares a room with our youngest since it is only a two bedroom and I know as she gets older she is going to want her own space.
I know first world problems.....right
I do know my W wants cash in her savings account and I would only be willing to give her more of the 401 if she didn't want to cash that out because me paying the taxes on it would not be financially smart. So here are my options.
1. Sell the house, we each walk away with our 1/2 of the equity and I go buy a smaller house. It would not be our family home but it would be a fresh start, each would have their own bedrooms and our dogs would still have a home. Also a smarter investment that an apartment.
2. Ask her if she is willing to take her portion of the equity and split it between cash on hand and the rest from additional 401k money with the intent that she will use that portion for retirement and not cash it out. She would then still have half of her portion of the equity in cash. This way I would only be refi half of her portion of the equity and not all of it
3. Move to an apartment, take my equity and live the single life!
Faced with the same sitch as you after getting the house, i am going with your option 1 after some time in the house to reflect. I need to do some work to get that done though. It sounds like your D's biggest issues is that she wants her own room which would apply in a smaller house as well. Involving the kiddo in the house selection would be a fun thing as well.
Option 2 requires the most interaction and negotiation with the W. For me, i would avoid it, but you sound like you have a better talking relationship with your W than i (me and the W don't talk at all except for issues related to the children)
You can still do option 3 more financially responsible in option 1
Thanks.....the appraisal came back and it high like I expected it to be. I am currently leaning towards selling it and buying something smaller in our same town. In the grand scheme of things asking my W to take less equity en lieu of 401k is not going to impact the monthly payment that much.
The more I thought about it I do agree with a fresh start and a house that my STBXW can't lay claim over. I can also see how another lady that I meet is probably not going to want to live in a house that I had with my STBXW.
Mortgage guy is currently running the numbers and I will know for sure.
So now you are mind reading what another woman you haven't yet met might want!
That is some mind reading error.....
V
Hi everyone, still undecided on the house thing. Got some new home owners insurance quotes that will help reduce my monthly payments and looking everywhere else I can in my budget to adjust and see if I can afford to stay. So we shall see how it pans out.
Had the kids all last week and took them to the W's place last night. My youngest got to me when she said good bye to me, she is so sweet. I told them I loved them in the car and she told me she would see me next week. I told her I would see her at soccer on Tuesday then as she was walking away with the W, going into the gate that leads into her apartment, she turned back around and said "Good Bye Daddy". I held it together in the moment but lost it on the way home.
I hadn't cried in quite some time and then I felt my blood start to boil. I got really angry but I feel better today. I will never understand any of this. I went to the gym this morning and got a good workout in so I feel better.
Nothing new on the W front. No contact outside of kid coordination stuff, finances and D logistics. A little over a month to go before we see the judge on 4/11 and it should be final. Her parents came to town this weekend, the ones she doesn't speak to. The flew in from CA and told my W's brother to let me W know as she doesn't speak to them. Last time they came to town we were still together and they just randomly showed up at our doorstep one afternoon. Anyway, she sent me a text to let me know so I would be aware if they randomly showed up at the house. I said if they did I would handle it. I guess she ended up going to meet them at their hotel however I don't know what transpired, I didn't ask. None of my business any more.
Other than that still trucking along, I am able to focus more at work these days. Looking forward to the first soccer games of the season ( I am helping coach ) and I will have them all next week for Spring Break. We rented a cabin and are going camping for a couple of days.
My W is off all next week but she made it a point to remind me that it is my week. I have no idea what she is doing but obviously she doesn't want to spend it with her kids. I am trying really hard not to judge but it definitely gives me some insight on where her head is at.
Anyway all for now, still feeling strong, I still feel she is a fool and I know in my heart I will never pursue or chase her. There is not much desire to do that any more. I will not waiver and am still very confident with who I am, what I have to offer and the man I have become over the past 9 months. I always knew I was a good man but now I feel like a good man on steroids
Sorry you had a down day man. Maybe this article will cheer you up:
Boys learn to chase girls in high school and college. Those early teen experiences shape much of the way men think about relationships. For many men, they find themselves married, with children, a job and the game is over. But for other men, those who have either not been married by their 40s or are facing a post divorce life in their 40s, there’s a lot of good news that they need to know about.
In youth, the game of sexual relationships is played according to the rules dictated by women. That’s mostly a matter of biology to be honest. Young women of child bearing age have a clock ticking and they know that they need to find the most suitable father for their children. They withhold their sexual favors while they are wooed by men. In the calculus of relationships, people figure out their own worth, and then effectively try to engage with someone of equivalent or better value.
This works quite well for the procreation of the species. But we were not necessarily built for relationships that last forever. People grow and change. So often these days men find themselves single again in their late 30s or early 40s. They come to me and share their pain and concerns that they have to start dating again.
This is when I get to share with them the good news. For men, the game has changed in our favor. A 45-year-old-man is now a target, not the hunter. It is much easier for a man in his 40s to find desirable dating partners of the female persuasion.
I say this because it is true. You need only look at the numbers to figure out why. To begin with, there are more women than men in society. It’s about a 60/40 split, and the women live longer than the men. In later years, the gender gap becomes even wider as men tend to die earlier than women..
The other factor that many men forget about is that many of the guys they used to compete with, are now out of the game. Either they are married, or gay. Some have just given up on relationships after being burned a couple of times. So there’s less competition, and more hunters.
Finally the biggest factor that an older man has in his favor is that he can now date easily 20 years below him and few people think there is anything wrong with it. So a 45-year-old-man dating a 25-year-old-woman is cool. Which means that a man gets the entire pool of women from 25-60 to date and he can have his pick.
For women, it’s a rough road. I am convinced that what drives so much of the hurt and anger in divorces is the knowledge, whether conscious or subconscious, that she’s competing with all the other women from 25 – 60. A woman who is divorced at 45 has a slim chance of finding another husband because a 45-year-old-man, can and likely will be dating a 35- or 25-year-old-woman.
But for guys who are facing a new life of dating post divorce – the options are many, and the joys are plentiful. You’re much more attractive to women, and those hotties that ignored you 20 years ago, they’d kill for you now.
So to the men I say, hit the gym, drop a few, increase the cardio (you’ll need it!) and get ready for a new lease on life. You’ve got some serious dating to do to make up for lost time.
LH. You brought a smile to my face. I am looking forward to the post D life. Been noticed by a few women already and I know that when I am ready to be out in the dating world, it's going to be aiight!!!
Thanks L....that made me smile as well! Not sure why it hit me yesterday but it just did. Not because of her but because of my kids. I know it could be so much worse but it was rough.
On a positive note.......I got the numbers back from my mortgage guy and I am going to stay in our home. I should be ok with the money I will be saving on insurance and a few other things so I am excited about that!! It will be a little tight however if I budget properly and stick to it I should be good!
I am here to make you smile.
I saw my IC on Saturday for the first time since November. The first thing she said was your smiling you must be in acceptance.
You're probably not quite there yet but it's understandable you are not even at a year yet. You did the right thing by waiting to you left and then just working through it.
It's probably gonna hit me to when my kids move out.
Lastly, have you watched Californication on Netflix yet? Picture yourself as Hank Moody. That's what I do lol!
Well....you do a good job of it in many ways
I have not seen my IC since November as well, probably something I need to think about also.
My oldest is such a champ. Happy, go lucky, always in a good mood, a non-stop chatter box. My youngest is the lover, still walks around with her blankets and a stuffed bunny, still [censored] her thumb. It was something about the way she said it. It just hit me hard.
It will. No matter how detached you are with your W I imagine you will still feel emotion with your children. The pain I feel for them far outweighs any sort of pain or sympathy I feel towards my W. The two are not even comparable. I just want this over with.
You know, I watched Californication on Showtime when it was in production. I got through the first 4 seasons I think and eventually lost interest. Maybe it was timing in my life but yes HM had himself a ton of fun
. That guy couldn't help himself.
Maybe I will start from the beginning and watch it over but right now my guilty pleasure is the Walking Dead.
I bet it was timing. Hank is not a good role model for married men lol! If you watch it again notice the chemistry with Hank and Karen. It's real, even though he fuchs up all the time, the chemistry is amazing. I didn't have that ever with my W. I want that someday.
As for Walking Dead, Rick's a bad a$$ alpha! I pick up on the $hit now while watching shows and movies. I don't get AMC (on a budget lol) so I have to wait for season 8 I believe to come to netflix.
Hank didn't give a crap but she kept on coming back and couldn't let him go. Hank was an Alpha in his own way.
I didn't have the chemistry either, I agree.
I don't have AMC as well due to my budget
. I just stream it on-line and watch it on my ipad.
Yep Hank's an alpha and Runkel is his beta. Took a bullet for him lol!
On a side not Kawahi should be back soon. Need him bad!
On a positive note.......I got the numbers back from my mortgage guy and I am going to stay in our home. I should be ok with the money I will be saving on insurance and a few other things so I am excited about that!! It will be a little tight however if I budget properly and stick to it I should be good!
Excellent news. I still keep going back and forth on what my final decision will be on the house situation.
You are still standing J9. You can cry whenever you want. But there you are. Lighthouse keeps shinning.
KG.....I thought about downsizing to a smaller house but I would have to downgrade neighborhoods as well. Where I live houses are flying off the market and people are not accepting contingency offers so I would have had to move into an apartment first and with my 2 dogs it wasn't really going to work.
My payments are going up $500/mth but if I move some stuff around I should be ok.
I think it is good for my girls as they know the neighbors, they are comfortable as well, etc. When I told my W she was happy I was staying. If it wasn't going to work financially obviously I wouldn't of had a choice.
N.....Yes, I am. It felt good to let it out. Hadn't cried in a while, not ashamed but my youngest really got to me. She is so sweet. Lighthouse is still shining and as I continue to get stronger I feel the mental shift within myself. Now that I feel really good about all aspects of my life, physically, spiritually and mentally it helps reaffirm my value and confidence.
J9, I'm happy you'll be able to keep the house. It'll provide some stability for your kids. If you do need to sell later, you can do it on your own terms and at your own pace.
Crying is a mixed blessing in my book. It totally [censored] and it hurts. But it's good to be in touch with your feelings and acknowledge them. I recently read that people who are emotionally the healthiest are those who experience a wide range of emotions.
I recently read that people who are emotionally the healthiest are those who experience a wide range of emotions.
Well I am pretty healthy then!
Good to hear about your house situation J. Looks like you got some good information to make an informed decision for your girls.
I second what about being emotionally healthy and being able to express a wide range of emotions. I have slowly been able to do that over time too and still get choked up for my kids.
Good updates man! 2018 is getting brighter.
Hey M....for the most part doing well all things considered. Paying a little more for the house then what I would like but staying far outweighed the alternatives. The W is paying for the 1/2 the closing costs so at minimum I will stay a few more years, build up some additional equity and look to sell if I am struggling financially. It does provide continued stability for the girls which is good and I don't feel sad in the place which is cool.
My W was never happy homemaker. I say this in a non judging manner but she was not the type to have a home cooked meal on the table every night, wasn't big on the holidays or birthdays and really valued/wanted her time alone to herself whether it was out with friends or going to a room where the kids were not located to get some quiet time. So truthfully the memories of her and living this magical life in the house are very minimal.
All in all though things are getting easier, should close on the house in the next week or so and then it is just the count down until 4/11 and we go before the judge. While it is very surreal (I still will never understand why this happened) I am very much looking forward to the next chapter in my life and having the house for me and the girls all to ourselves.
I am still hitting the gym 6 days a week, playing basketball 3 days a week, going to church, meeting buddies out here and there for some drinks after work, hanging out with friends and soccer season starts tonight so I am looking forward to watching the girls play. I went out and bought a video camera at lunch so I can record their games, edit them and post them on the team site. That should help keep me occupied as well
Joseph
Awesome dad stuff.
Truly your girls are your girls and being a great dad is the most important thing you can do.
I do hope there are lots of hugs for this one great dad.
V
That's great news about being able to stay in your home.
As someone on here said, it's not a linear process, some days you're doing great, then you regress a little. We can all relate. You hit some trigger, and bam! on go the waterworks.
V......thanks
. I got some hugs and kisses last night at soccer so that stirred my emotions
(In a good way)
I never really took a deep look at myself before I started on this journey but as I have continued down the path I realized a lot of things about myself. About 2 months after this went down my neighbor came over and he was just lending an ear as I was venting to him, struggling to make sense of it all. He told me that I was a great man, far better than him, and if something ever happened to him he would want his W to be with a man like me. I was kind of embarrassed at first, didn't know what to say (it felt kinda awkward :)) but I drew strength from that as I continued down this path and it helped me realize that I will be ok and that I am a great dad and person.
J....it does feel good to stay. It feels right, hard to explain. It is my D's home, the only one they have ever known and if I have to struggle a bit financially to keep them in it then that is what I have to do. Maybe not forever but at least until things calm down and they get more comfortable with the situation.
The only trigger for me is my girls
. My W no longer has that effect. Every time I think about them and the love that I have for them it moves me every time. You see Jim, you just did it to me again
Well just found out from the W that she sold her engagement ring....at first she lied but then came clean. It came up because I have insurance on it that gets auto deducted. I just said ok cool you didn't have to lie about it and left it at that. Disappointed but not much else emotion
Subtract how much you paid for that insurance from the $500 extra on the house. See, the extra difference paid for the house is getting smaller!
No much else emotion o the ring sale says worlds about how detached you are. Excellent!
Ha! Yeah good point. Maybe it will be easier than I anticipate
I think my biggest emotion with the ring is disappointment in her, just the feeling of easy she can erase the memory of us together. She loved that ring and to just go sell it for some cash to me just shows how selfish and irresponsible she currently is in this state of mind. I guess that makes me feel a little sad. While my W was never over the top disrespectful with yelling, screaming, etc. it is my belief that it burns inside of her.
I will say though everything this site has taught me and with following Sandis rules has got me to this point of it really not having much of a effect on me.
Finally the biggest factor that an older man has in his favor is that he can now date easily 20 years below him and few people think there is anything wrong with it. So a 45-year-old-man dating a 25-year-old-woman is cool. Which means that a man gets the entire pool of women from 25-60 to date and he can have his pick.
Man have I ever been living this scenario, except the age gap between my GF and me is even more than that. And yes, people think it's cool (except older women, LOL!) And she wasn't the exception, when I started dating, I dated several women that were also in their 20's. That article doesn't mention it but another factor is women in their 40's and 50's that find themselves in the dating pool seem to be really jaded. Maybe it's because they've been burned in previous relationships, but their walls are high and their skepticism runs deep. I started out trying to date in my age group but just could not get anyone to progress beyond texting! They would ask question after question but if I brought up meeting I got never-ending excuses. But the pool of available younger women is huge and many of them actually will not date younger guys. And they wanted to meet right away, many of them I met the same day as first contact. I can't tell you how many stories I heard about immature BF's they ditched because their idea of sex was receiving oral while playing a video game in the living room (no I'm not joking). BF's that wouldn't open a door for them, never complimented them, and never even freakin' paid for a movie or dinner for their GF. Suddenly here comes this older, educated, mature gentleman that flirts, holds doors, pulls out chairs, pays without comment and makes them feel like they are the only attractive woman in the room. Well you can imagine how that goes, it's like handing an ice-cold frosty drink to someone that's been trekking through the desert for days. Of course a lot of young women think dating an older guy is "icky" because of the stigma society places on it. So don't expect EVERY young woman to fall all over herself around you. But a lot more of them do than you might expect.
So how hard is it to date someone with an age gap of decades? Well it's not always easy street but is any relationship? When we're together I don't feel like I'm with someone half my age, we relate on a lot of different levels and have many common interests. Sometimes people stare at us, that's usually my reminder that we are not a "conventional" couple :-) We both have a lot of tattoos and she always has crazy colors in her hair (blonde with purple/ blue/ red tips) so we're kind of hard to miss even without the age difference. I love her to pieces though, we have so much fun and we actually both like the attention so it's all good! We've been talking about the "M" word, never thought I would again but hey, who knows.
Anyway I've preached this before but any of you reading this that feel sad, depressed, alone and that your life is over; I WAS YOU. I really was, I can't stress it enough. I never thought I would date again, or that anything else significant would ever happen. I thought I was on autopilot to the end. But it wasn't my life that was over, it was that PHASE of my life that was over. Just like yours is. But what you don't know is something I didn't either but do now- the next phase is going to blow your mind.
I don't know if this is the appropriate thread to debate this on and I don't want to hijack but I also don't agree - at least not fully - and at least not for me. I'm a few years younger than AS but I could never imagine dating someone in her 20s. I'm not even sure I could do a hookup that young. Let's start with the fact my step daughter is 31. What would she say or think? Now I don't need her approval but I don't think I could argue with her points either. In fact I'd make them for her. Now 20 years younger, perhaps but are we talking a real R here?
What does the average 28 year old have in common with the average 55 or even 50 year old? Does she have daddy issues? I'd certainly wonder. What do we have in common? I remember hearing about a friend of a friend, he's near 60 who took some one older than his own D to the Chicago concert. They had front row seats. She asked him who these guys are!!!!! Flipping Chicago - just fresh into the Rock and roll HOF and still out touring, yet... Is that not a microcosm of the issue?
But much deeper, what 25 or even 35 year old does not want kids? Do I? HEII TO THE NO. How does that work and would I not be robbing her? What does meeting the parents go like? Who got their ARP card first? What about friends? Have a dinner party with her 25 year old couple friends and my 50 year old couple friends? And then marriage? I have several friends who married women in their 20s while they were in their 40s as well as women in their 30s and guys in their 50s. The guys are now in their 70s and the women have all left as 70 and 50 looked way different than 50/30 did.
I just really struggle with all of this. In many ways it's like another discussion going on here about dating someone who is a regular pot smoker. It's not that it's that bad, it's more that it's just not me. Someone I look up to, respect, feel is my equal would not want to do either - smoke pot or date 25 years up or down. It's who we are - or are not.
Clearly I'm different. Not better, not worse, just different. I have no tattoos and don't want any. I've never dated anyone with pink hair, etc. I guess it all comes down to the fact that dating someone half your age works for some, a few. It's just not the answer for the average guy. It's more a fringe thing. It's awesome if it works for two people and I really do mean AWESOME. But to try to say it's a winning strategy for the average 45 year old is like saying on line dating is the best way to meet someone. HARDLY! It works for some but not the masses.
That's my input.
You guys hijack all you want
. All of this talk about dating got me motivated yesterday to create my first on-line dating profile. Now before you all jump in and tell me it's too early, your right it is. However in roughly one month we go to court and the D will be final so once that is complete and considering we have been separated for almost a year I think I will be ready. I will admit I did a brief search last night and initially I liked what possibilities I saw. My STBXW has just made the biggest mistake of her life and she has no idea how big the fire inside me burns
With that said I have rebounded from the engagement ring thing and now I don't really give a [censored]. Just another step in the process. Met some friends out for dinner last night, played basketball this week, got a lift in this morning and got elbowed in the mouth yesterday that did not feel good while going up for a rebound. Not sure what I am doing tonight but my girls have soccer tomorrow so that will be fun. Need to get some yard work done so I will probably tackle that this weekend as well.
I have my girls all next week for Spring Break so I got some fun activities planned for them highlighted by going camping Wed thru Fri.
Saw the STBXW yesterday at open house for our D's school. It was cool, she called me honey once which was funny but outside of that I was as cool as the other side of the pillow. She is a weak individual and my views on her have changed drastically. I really find myself not giving a crap around her any more so while I still DB for myself I no longer watch everything I say and honestly I could really care less what she thinks. She made a comment about getting a boob job with some of her equity proceeds from the house and I just laughed and said stop by when they are healed so you can show them to me. I know it's pursuing but I don't give a flip.
I am really starting to feel what everyone has said along about finding happiness through the pain, seeing the sunshine on the other side of the storm, feeling that sense of accomplishment as I have no regrets about how I have conducted myself and how I have held strong to my vows until the end. I can finally start to see the fog lift.
I have my house, my girls, my two 14 yr old dogs, my friends, my family, my health and finding someone to share my life with would just be icing on the cake.
Ok, you know it is too early. But your post focuses an awful lot on the STBXW. Which tells me you are no where ready to start dating. Anyone you meet will be simply a rebound and that isn't fair to her (the new GF).
DBing is about taking care of yourself, getting over the hurt, and being in the best place to move forward in a new relationship.
She made a comment about getting a boob job with some of her equity proceeds from the house and I just laughed and said stop by when they are healed so you can show them to me. I know it's pursuing but I don't give a flip.
Dude that was a great comeback to her comment! Just so you know, my W got them 7 years ago and they are over rated.
I think your ready to date. if you want to date fuching date! It doesn't have to be anything serious. You are pretty close to ware I am at and you are ready to take on the world.
Your W selling the ring, and not wanting the kids on break is a big turn off for me. You are going to get someone way better.
Keep doing what your doing man!
L....it was a huge, I mean huge turn off for me as well. I see her becoming more and more like her mother every day and her mom is a complete nut job. Selfish, self-centered a real narcissist and you are right I am going to find someone way better and it will probably blow my mind.
You know when someone says something and they act like they are joking there is some truth to what they are saying. If she wants to get them good on her I just wasn't about her to hang that over my head and not step into the conversation. F-that. Do I think she needs them, "no" but if it helps with her confidence then do what you need to do. Overrated, probably not at first
.....over time I see where you are coming from.
I feel I am getting close....want the D to be final first then I will evaluate where I am at emotionally. I definitely don't want to rush it and just because I meet some ladies out for coffee etc. doesn't mean it has to be serious to your point. I am sure it will be a little awkward at first but at some point in time it is going to happen and how do you know when you are truly ready any way you know?
I have a buddy that I play basketball with who went through the same things as us a couple of years ago. He said it took him about a year before he felt comfortable and when he stepped out he said it was awesome. The funny thing is he told me yesterday that his XW reached out to him and told him she is asking her live in boyfriend to move out because it wasn't working and he said she is starting to contact him more for stupid reasons.
I told him where I thought it was leading to.....he just laughed, smiled and said absolutely no way he was going back because the woman he was currently with was so awesome.
J - your thread has had some awesome hijacks in the past and it's been fun and deep. Imma put some of my own 2 cents in the pot here.
DonH
I see your points. But lets say a 70 year old wanted to date you and said some $hit like how your generation is just so dumb and doesn't know this music, and this history, and this awesome $hit that got lost blah blah blah.. how would that make you feel? Are you some piece of crap because you're 50 and in a different generation? I doubt that.
It's all about self-confidence and how you carry yourself and what you want out of your relationship. Do I care if someone 10-15 years younger than me likes the same music as I do? Definitely not. But, are they smart, funny, into being fit and having fun, and they find those same things in me that work for them, then why the hell not date someone younger?
If someone younger wants kids and start a family and all of that, be upfront about what your stance is on that and see if it's a deal breaker or not. Whatever! I don't think dating someone younger is a fringe thing - I see it all over the place. It may not be something for you, but it doesn't mean that it's shallow and cannot have deep meaning. I've met some women in their 20s who had their $hit together.
Steve85
Welcome to the forum bro! Looks like you've been on here recently. I appreciate you trynna give J some 2x4s, but you best go read back on his threads before trynna give advice. I am not berating you, but if you knew J's story, you wouldn't have said what you said. I am all for people giving advice to other people, but if your sitch is new, I'd hold off on giving advice and just absorbing everything and sharing what's happening with you.
J - love the comeback comment about the boob job too. lol.
What M....good to here from ya, I like the silent lurkers
. Hijack away the more the merrier!
So how are you? How are you progressing? Are you feeling strong and confident? You know you have no reason not to correct??
Initially I thought about just letting the comment go but my brain just kicked in and it came out. I was like F it....I know who I am and I just need to own it. She knows who I am too and I said it from a place of confidence. I know who I am and I am not chopped liver so there ya go and you know where to find me.
I also have this gut feeling that what she has done is really going to hit her when I put myself out there and start to date again. I don't know why I have that feeling but I just do. I could be wrong but for some reason I feel it.
I have not put my dating profile out for public viewing but my current age limit has been set to 35. If I follow AS I need to lower it down to 25
Things are good J. I'll update my thread soon.
I can just picture how you might have said it and be a baller.
It's definitely going to hit her, whether she shows it to you or not. All that $hit they thought you didn't have to offer, now other women will all over that.
Well, follow AS's logic and bring it to 25. Just might be fun to see what happens with that and who is out there. You have to share your dating adventures here when you dip your toes in. I am still a few months out from that reality, so will need some pointers
I will share......creating a profile was harder than I imagined. I felt some pressure. I still have to add some pictures so it's not public yet however I did make it public for a few minutes and took a brief look at some of my possibilities and I liked what I saw
.
Writing the profile also gave me some confidence as well....I mean there is no reason why any of us should not be confident if we have put in the work. Right???
Then I started to think a little deeper last night about one of the books I recently read that talks about your sex rank. Essentially if your spouse has a perceived higher sex rank than you your going to be in trouble. It's all about emotions, it's all about creating that dynamic between you and your spouse or you and a new partner. Once your spouse gets that view of you it's very hard to turn the ship. It's not a speed boat its like turning the Titanic. Especially in our culture where we place a high priority on personal appearance.
Thanks M. I am finding that helping others is helping me in my sitch. I've avoided R talks for over 2 weeks now. Maybe I projected a bit there, so Joseph just ignore my above post!
I have not put my dating profile out for public viewing but my current age limit has been set to 35. If I follow AS I need to lower it down to 25
J, You can lower it to 19 if you want but I doubt you will recieve any messages from 19 year olds. Simply because they don't look for 44 year old guys. I dont remember anyone younger than 10 years my junior having even looked at my profile. And I had 1800 women checking it out before I decided to cancel it. Still I have dated a 35 year old (12 years my junior) and also done some foolin' around with a 29 year old.
Age gap relationships are born in real life. And off course they can work out. I do however hope that my 41 year old XW and her 59 year old OM doesn't, though ;-)
My XW also recently had a boob job. I'm going in the opposite direction than you, and will not give her the satisfaction of even looking at her chest.
Stupid mid life women LOL
J, I started dating again, probably WAY too early, but it was nice to just go out and enjoy some adult company. I found that as long as I was up front about what I wanted, the women I dated were very understanding. Some were interested in casual dating, some not, but on the whole it's been fun.
Well J9, when the wind blows...you have to sail!
Good for you!
Thanks BT.....I think I will just leave it at 35 for now and go with it. The first lady that popped up was 40 so I can handle that. If my W does ever get them done I probably won't end up giving her the satisfaction either. By that time I will probably be dating someone and would have had some many awesome experiences I wouldn't even be interested. I still need to add a couple more pictures to my profile and I should be good to go come 4/11.
J....go to hear. Everyone that I have talked to has indicated that they have really enjoyed the dating experience again so I am looking forward to it. I went out with some friends last night and my neighbors W asked when it was going live. I told her in one month and she asked why in a month and I told her that is when the D will be final. I had her proof my BIO as well and she gave it a thumbs up. For some reason being Divorced first is something that is important to me before I put myself out there again.
But like you said as long as your open and honest to each their own. Good for you, I am glad you are enjoying the interaction!!
N....the wind is starting to blow. I have no clue if my W and I will ever find our way back to each other but I do know that once the D is final going out and meeting other women is something that I am going to experience. I feel good about myself, I am confident, have a lot to offer and have no expectations. I am approaching it from an open mind. I feel like a horse in the gate ready for the race to start. It's been a long journey of growth, self discovery, looking inward and realizing I have a long life to live and it's time I get off the sidelines. I didn't ask for it but I am prepared to make the most of it. A little nervous but trying really hard to only look out the front window. This is not punitive towards my W and wanting to show her what she is missing, this is about me taking another step forward to continue forging my new life.
Hi all, on vacation this week and leave today to go camping with the girls for a couple of days so it should be an interesting experience. Went golfing yesterday with some buddies, hit the gym, played basketball and did some spring yard work as well so needless to say I have been pretty busy.
Closing on the house is this Friday and then I will be the proud owner of our family home. Mixed emotions as you can imagine but excited it will be all mine and the girls. Wife should get her portion of the equity some time next week and then the last piece should be the 401k division. Looks like May will be the first month of my new expenses kicking in and the first month I will pay her support. Crazy how far this has come. Still no movement on her part.
I still have it done anything with dating yet. I got my profile written up now I. Am just working my pictures. I have had a few people review to give me some feedback so I have a few changes to make. My buddy the got D two years ago gave me some good advice and has been my online dating, profile mentor.
Other than that the girls are good, soccer has started so it is a fun time of the year. No games or practices this week because of Spring Break however they will start back up next week. Last week I realized how perceptive they are. My W and I traded cars last week as the car she is getting in the D has a lower payment. When we traded the girls were very interested in the reason why. You would think trading vehicles would not be a big deal to them but it was. Once we explained the reason why they were tine but they just wanted an explanation. They are way more preceptive than I ever realized. Hopefully this will help anyone reading with young kids to be more cognistant of how you handle yourself and how you and your wife interact with each other.
All for now! Have a great day and I wish you all peace.
Well we had a great time camping, the girls had an awesome time! They even cried when we left so I knew I had done good. Took a lot of pictures and made incredible memories. They are already asking when we can go back.
Then this afternoon my W and signed all the refi papers so the house will officially be mine when the loan is funded on Wed. My W then asked me if I would be willing to go look at a condo with her. It didn’t bother me in the slightest. So together we went and picked up our girls and scouted the place out. She asked me for advice and thoughts on it. At times she was acting like we were buying it together which was funny. It was the first time we were together as a family doing something in quite some time and It was really great to have our girls present. Afterwards I asked her if she wanted to get some dinner and discuss further so we did. Again it was nice to have our girls sitting with us as a family eating. I didn’t read anything else into it and took it as an opportunity for our girls to have some family time with mommy and daddy together interacting positively. I guess some may call it cake eating or enabling her to have the best of both worlds but I feel like I am detached enough and emotionally stable to the point to where it has no impact on me. Honestly I still feel an obligation to look out for her best interests and provide what I can to help. I am secure with where the switch is at, am not looking for anything else and did it because to me it felt like the right thing to do. She offered to pay for her meal but I didn’t accept her money. In my mind we will always be a family even though we are no longer together and as the leader I still have a role to play.
It is a beautiful day here today and my girls are now outside playing with the neighbor kids. That brings a smile to my face and I feel like things are starting to come together. I feel at peace.
I think it's really great that you can spend time together like that. I think it shows your girls that even though you can't live together, they won't lose either one of you.
Keep up the good work.
Thanks Jim....I think it is easier since it appears there is no OM in the picture. I also think that over time these types of meetings will get less and less but who knows? I realize though that I can't predict the future or have any insight into it so I just need to roll with it and not overanalyze it. If nothing else I think it is really great for our kids.
The closer this gets to be final I find the thoughts of initiating a R talk creeping into my head. I am not sure why, I guess it has been so long since it has happened sometimes I wonder if she is afraid to bring them up herself for fear of me rejecting her. At times I feel she is feeling me out to get an idea of what I am willing and not willing to do. IDK. I guess I am finding it harder to continue sitting back, not initiating anything with her and watching the date of D inching closer.
I know doing what I am doing is the right thing but it's hard to hold the line as I see this coming to a close.
What would you have to lose by confirming R isn't possible?
I don't mean past R but a future one.
Constantly examining what went wrong might be different from what might go right.
Those are my views
V
V....I guess at this point in time nothing outside of I think deep in my heart I know she is not ready to have that conversation. While she has shown signs of warming up to me it I don't know that it feels enough for me to initiate a conversation. IDK I guess I need to think about it some more but I see where you are coming from. My mom has suggested the same thing.
At the end of the day she would have to be willing to do some work on herself as well. When she first walked out she told me she was broken and would need years of intense therapy to overcome.
When we went out to dinner we sat next to each other (initiated by her) and I did initiate some touching just to test the waters. She didn't pull away, didn't give me dirty looks or acted like it bothered her. However she didn't give me any signs that she wanted it to progress or she wanted anything more.
Warming up...maybe but I don't know about anything else.
Joseph,
I have followed your journey for the time I´ve been around the forum and wanted to say it´s great to see how you have been able to detach and feeling good about your life even without the wife.
It´s bringing me hope that some day also I will feel the same.
Seems that you have gained your wife´s respect and even if you would not become a couple again, it will make your and your kids life better in the long run.
J,
I believe everything happens exactly the way it is supposed to happened. If she changes her mind you will know. Just remember that when she does, she needs to earn another chance with you.
Just keep doing what you’re doing.
J9,
Remember the saying, "do what works". I dont see any harm in having a conversation. You have learned how to validate and learned how to stay calm in those convos.
You won't be approaching this conversation with any expectations, so don't over think it. If you still are standing for the M, don't stop.
Like V said, what do you have to lose. If you are approaching D, how will a conversation impact that if she is dead set on it. But, what if you are right in your assessment of her waiting for you to start the convo, because she might feel rejected if she does? Some things for you to think about.
You have do really hard work to get where you are at, and I know you W sees the improvements.
Good job J9.
Live the present, keep walking.
Whatever will be will be.
You are doing great. Be proud of it.
The closer this gets to be final I find the thoughts of initiating a R talk creeping into my head. I am not sure why, I guess it has been so long since it has happened sometimes I wonder if she is afraid to bring them up herself for fear of me rejecting her. At times I feel she is feeling me out to get an idea of what I am willing and not willing to do. IDK. I guess I am finding it harder to continue sitting back, not initiating anything with her and watching the date of D inching closer.
I was feeling quite a lot the same way. The other day, I got together with W to discuss a lot of things, like taxes, schedule for the kids, moving forward with D, etc. I said something like "I had hoped for R, but you obviously are happy and moving on, so my hopes have waned. I guess I'm ready to move forward with the D." I am ready to move on, but figured I'd open that door a little and see if she'd open it. She didn't, and that's ok.
Thanks everyone for the input.....I thought about and I am not going to do a thing. I see signs but nothing over the top that would indicate her mind has changed. We were going over finances today and she is very happy with how much she is going to be getting and made a comment about how awesome it is. I just responded with good, I am a bad man (I handled all of our money and the investing). She responded back with a smiley face (I didn't respond back). So I get little stuff like that but nothing that is going to make me take the first step.
I do agree her respect is coming or has come back but I still think she has a long way to go. Which further affirms that it is more about her than it is about me and what I did or didn't do.
Anyway...after a few weak days I am back on the horse.
You own a stable? Sheesh, you were not kidding, when you said you were well off...
Lol....no stable and no horses I do have two 15 yr old dogs though but they don’t like to be rode
Hi all.....back on track and things are going great. Meeting a buddy tonight after work and bought concert tickets with some friends to see one of my favorite bands of all time in July. I am really excited! I have also started to dive in deep on my calorie intake and have been tracking them daily, along with my macros as I want to drop about 15 lbs and get down to around 220. That has really got me focused and dedicated.
Soccer is starting back up this week since Spring Break is over with so I took my youngest to practice last night and will get to see my oldest tomorrow at her practice. It is nice being able to see them during the week so even then though this is not my week I get to stay in touch with them even if it is just for a few minutes. I also enjoy watching them play which is just an extra bonus. Games this weekend on Saturday morning so looking forward to that as well.
The W is still reaching out to me daily, asking my opinions on condos, finances, sending me smiley faces, making jokes, being all upbeat and sometimes for no reason. She sent me a note out of blue "Thanking" me for giving her an advance (for money) on what I send her each month. She has never done that before ever. Anyway, sometimes I feel like I am observing wild animals at a zoo and their behaviors. I find it very interesting at times. Obviously my WW is the wild animal being observed
We got a note from our L today asking about how much support we wanted me to pay for our youngest after our oldest turns 18. My W sent me a note, asking me to explain so I did. I then suggested we just 1/2 the amount of what I will currently being paying for those 2 years and she immediately agreed. Just that easy.
As my W has started to be nicer I have found myself thinking to be careful to not get sucked back in to the tempest. Obviously I have no clue why all of this is happening but I need to remain detached and not let myself get too close to the fire. With time and distance everything has become more clear and easier to diagnose.
The W is still reaching out to me daily, asking my opinions on condos, finances, sending me smiley faces, making jokes, being all upbeat and sometimes for no reason. She sent me a note out of blue "Thanking" me for giving her an advance (for money) on what I send her each month. She has never done that before ever.
IMO it's because you are not trying to prevent her from what she wants and that is to be free. Also, she doesn't have to feel guilty because she knows you and your Ds are ok.
It's going to take a long time before she realizes she fuched up big time. My guess is you will have moved on by then.
Hi all.....back on track and things are going great. Meeting a buddy tonight after work and bought concert tickets with some friends to see one of my favorite bands of all time in July. I am really excited! I have also started to dive in deep on my calorie intake and have been tracking them daily, along with my macros as I want to drop about 15 lbs and get down to around 220. That has really got me focused and dedicated
That's awesome. love this update. Are you using MFP or something else to track calories and macros? Those 15 lbs will come off in no time.
As my W has started to be nicer I have found myself thinking to be careful to not get sucked back in to the tempest. Obviously I have no clue why all of this is happening but I need to remain detached and not let myself get too close to the fire. With time and distance everything has become more clear and easier to diagnose.
Yeah, but I think with what you've gone through, it would be difficult for you to get sucked back in. You've spent so much time and energy into thinking about it and acting on what you need from life, that it won't be easy for her to just snatch you back into her world. If this niceness leads to a better co-parenting relationship, then it's all good. She'll realize over time how she f$@ked up. I bet you that will happen as soon as you go out in the dating pool.
L - I believe you are right. I think she feels completely comfortable letting me in on these types of things now and being even more nice because the Divorce is close and the cage door is open. I also know if I brought up anything related to us she would squash it in a heartbeat. I have not made this process difficult for her at all.
M - I just use my Fit Bit, scan my labels and use measuring cups to portion out my servings. If I go out for lunch I just search for the menu item search and most restaurants pull up. I didn't do any cardio this morning so I had to make an adjustment to my lunch today so I could stay around 2400 calories. So far I have a calorie deficit of about 2800 for the week.
Your also right it would take a lot for me to drop my guard and get sucked back in. Once the D is final I think she might have a different idea of what our R will look like than I do. I don't know if this a really sunk in for her yet and has thought about me moving on and dating. It could be me but I just get the impression.
J9,
From what you right, I agree with you, that your W has really taken stock of what reality will look like after D. I really wonder if she has really taken account that you will be dating other women. I don't know, but her highs might turn into lows after the D is final. IMO
Thanks JJ I don't really know what to expect. I am trying really hard to stay out of her head space and keep her at arms length.
I know what LH said is completely accurate I just don't know yet how far she is wanting to take it. With that said it is not going to stop me from moving forward. If she thinks that by being nicer, wanting to do more things together as a family, and warming up to me in general, etc. that it will stop me then she is mistaken. I just try to take it day by day and leave it at that. Continue to be a good co-parent and keep it to finances and kid related conversations.
Our Daughters are singing in Church this Sunday and she wants to attend. Last time she did not. I gave her a couple of different options of what she could do, 1 of which was show up, watch them sing and leave. She chose the option of watching them sing and staying for Church as a family (even included a smiley face at the end). I just responded with an Ok sounds good.
If she is trying to bait me or test me it won't work. I won't break rank. I am not that weak any more.
I have been away for almost a week so I thought I would give an update.
I continue to be in a good place. Still continue to hit the gym almost daily, planning a paintball outing with my buddies in the next several weeks, created a Flickr account for all my photos of me and the girls (and my other outings) and recently got turned onto Spotify so I have been working on my music! The girls had soccer games over the weekend so it was fun to watch. My oldest had 2 goals, my youngest had 3...both teams won so it was a good day! Went to church on Sunday, both girls sang in the choir for both services and got some good video for Grandma and Grandpa. Did some yard work, got stuff for their Easter baskets, etc. so all in all things are really good! I am seeing the finish line in sight!
On the W front.....we go back to court 4/11 so in two weeks our D will be final. She got the condo she wanted and will close on it 5/1. My refi went through last Wednesday so it is now officially mine and the girls.
My W has been reaching out to me almost daily for various different things. Yesterday she just wanted me to know that there was a gas leak in the neighborhood of her school but classes where not cancelled and she was mad that she had to go to school. Then she called me at lunch to tell me she was going to Wendy's to get a hamburger and asked me a question about what she needed to bring to her closing on 5/1. So just stupid crap like that. I don't read into any more and just keep the convo light, etc.
I also saw her BFF at the gym on Sunday morning and she asked me how the camping trip went with me and the girls. I just kept it short and said we had a lot of fun. The only way she would have known is if my W told her so whatever.
She also asked me if I could hold onto her half of the house equity money for her in my savings account (I agreed). She thought it would be easier for her to manage getting bills paid off etc. and TBH she is also horrible with money (she knows this). So needless to say I don't think trust is an issue with her or respect any more. It is a large sum so if it helps her not squander it all away and get her 1/2 of the bills paid which are currently in my name I was willing (I do have a vested interest).
We went to Church together on Sunday, she sent me a picture of the girls eating doughnuts and told me she was getting them game ready. I was like whatever and then when she got to church acted like she didn't want to be there. She is all over the board.
With that said though she is still the same broken person. Now that I have had time and distance I can see clearly. She is all over the place emotionally, seemingly happy one moment and disturbed the next. I can really see her more objectively and can really see her lack of contentment. She has gained some weight and just looks exhausted. Everything in her life has to be a project, she always has to have something to occupy her mental space...she just can't be still. Don't get me wrong I am all for hobbies, interests, etc. but she takes it to a whole new level and constantly bounces from one thing to another (like she is searching). It has to be exhausting and is almost manic. I think I just got used to it or became numb to it over the years but I see it very clearly now that I got some space.
I think what has made this easier for me as I now realize my W was a horrible spouse (heck maybe we both were). Most men probably would not have put up with it as long as I did. One of our really close family friends told me that any man married to my W would be in this position, even Brad Pitt. I did get lazy but I wonder if I got lazy because I wasn't getting from my W what I needed and instead of communicating to her what I needed and working on it I just shut down. I need to think on this one some more.
She is all over the board.
With that said though she is still the same broken person. Now that I have had time and distance I can see clearly. She is all over the place emotionally, seemingly happy one moment and disturbed the next. I can really see her more objectively and can really see her lack of contentment....I think I just got used to it or became numb to it over the years but I see it very clearly now that I got some space.
I think what has made this easier for me as I now realize my W was a horrible spouse (heck maybe we both were). Most men probably would not have put up with it as long as I did.
It's kind of funny, isn't it, that with time and space, we start to see the flaws more clearly? I was not the perfect husband I thought I was, but I'm realizing she was a pretty terrible W. She's personable, and I like her, but unless there is some serious commitment on her part, I don't want to go back.
Just keep the light on, J9, keep it flashing...
I also echo what you and Jim have said. W has a lot of terrible flaws and I can see them more clearly now. She wasn't the supportive spouse that I needed and she didn't have my back.
She's got a lot of work to do on herself, including what I can clearly now see as crippling anxiety resulting in serious conflict avoidance. It took her 3 years to tell her parents something - it was a big thing, but it took her that long to bring herself to do it.
And that was because of the anxiety and conflict avoidance traits. I don't have the years that it would take for her to work on herself and get to a place of confidence and calmness.
That's why I am good with D because I am not waiting around for years. My life is improving and I want to be with someone to have a fun filled life. I know what I want. Can she give me what I want? Maybe, but it might take years and even then I am not sure.
As Jim said, there needs to be some serious commitment on her part, which I am not seeing and I might have to wait around for a few years for even just that. So, I am not going back.
J - glad to see where you're at mentally and emotionally with D. I am also getting there. Getting more comfortable with filing for D.
M - Before my W moved out she told me she was broken and it would take her years of intensive therapy for her to be right, something she wasn't willing to do. She also told me she knew I would love her for the rest of her life, that I was a good provider, etc. She still left. When you talk about the changes your W would need to make I understand completely.
N - The light is on and I find myself being very supportive of her throughout this D process. I don't do it as a manipulation tool to get her to return however I do it as I am being true to who I am and my character. I will not turn into some angry, hateful person because she rejected me.
J - I think the best you can hope for is that with time and distance the both of you can recognize your short comings and be willing to work together towards a better MR. That's assuming that the time and distance has not had the adverse effect and you realize that your spouse is not someone who is capable of change and you no longer desire to be with them
Updates are getting less and less but as I started my sitch in June of 2017 I want to continue updating until the D is final.
Had a good week with the girls last week. Nothing earth shattering just school, practices and soccer games. Friday night they wanted to bake a cake so we did that and then we had soccer on Saturday. Went over to a buddy of mine's house on Saturday night who is divorced. He had his kid for the weekend so the kids played while we just sat around and chatted. Took the girls shopping for their Easter dresses as well and put together their baskets for yesterday morning. I don't have them this week but will get to see them on Tuesday and Thursday as they have soccer games.
Easter went well, they woke up at 5 am yesterday morning excited to see if the Easter bunny had came. So needless to say they filled up on a bunch of junk! Our neighbor came over and took some pictures of us before church so that was cool and then we went to church. After church we went to a big Easter egg hunt and then over to a friends house for Easter dinner and then the W picked then up last night around 7.
I sent the W an email about a week ago letting her know what the plans were for Easter and she was welcome to join us if she wanted. She never responded or acknowledged what I sent. Yesterday morning she texted some Easter picture to me and I sent her back a picture of the girls dressed up in their dresses I had bought and then we coordinated pick up times for yesterday. I thought about inviting her again but decided not to. She knew what we were doing and if she really wanted to be a part of it all she had to do was ask. It didn't bother me in the slightest but I was disappointed for my girls. The W ended up going shopping all day looking for items for her new condo.
Other than that things are calm between us. We go back to court on 4/12, which is next Thursday and then our D will be final. I am excited for this to be over with and my W is excited about her new condo. The dialogue between my W and I is still very cordial, I never pry into what she is doing and only know what she is willing to share which is whatever she brings up in conversation.
I wish she was more involved with the girls than what she is. She showed up 30 min late to our oldest daughters game on Saturday. She sent me a text letting me know which was cool but I didn't say anything to her about it as it's not my place. I have also started to notice that the oldest is starting to ask me if mommy will be coming or attending certain activities. When it is my week to have them she generally doesn't see them, she does go to their games but never attends their practices. If there is a school function then we attend together but that doesn't happen all the time. She didn't have them on Thanksgiving, Christmas Eve or Day, New Years and now Easter either. Obviously I will take my girls whenever I can get them but it does concern me that they have not been with her for a holiday. Her choice and it's not because she didn't have an opportunity to do so.
I am probably projecting some but I know it is not my place to say anything to her so I will just continue to provide all the support I can. My girls need their mom and I just hope they are getting what they need.
While I am down about this overall I am feeling great. Still hitting the gym, exercising, eating right, feeling healthy, meeting friends out when I can, still reading, attending church, looking forward to the summer for boating season and in general in a really good place physically, spiritually and emotionally.
I know their has been a lot of discussion lately about people being disappointed with DBing. I thought for sure if anyone was going to save their MR it was going to be me. Unfortunately I was not able to save it but I did something else which was save myself. Some where on this journey that became more important to me.
She is not my possession, I don't own her, I don't control her, she is free to do whatever she wants. I let my W go with love and peace, not in hate, anger or bitterness. We can only control ourselves and can't force anyone back into a MR that they don't want to be in. Turn yourself into a spouse that only a fool would leave but do it for yourself with no expectations. Dbing is for us the LBS, maybe you save your MR maybe you don't but hopefully you save yourself and you just don't survive but you thrive.
Do the right thing, stick to your values, your beliefs. Don't be hateful, react out of anger, be vindictive. The battle is not with your spouse but rather with yourself.
Peace to you all.
Awesome update J.
She is not my possession, I don't own her, I don't control her, she is free to do whatever she wants. I let my W go with love and peace, not in hate, anger or bitterness. We can only control ourselves and can't force anyone back into a MR that they don't want to be in. Turn yourself into a spouse that only a fool would leave but do it for yourself with no expectations. Dbing is for us the LBS, maybe you save your MR maybe you don't but hopefully you save yourself and you just don't survive but you thrive.
You basically summed up what I was trying to say in my thread in this nice paragraph lol. I need to learn how to be brief.
So, now that you have the D date kinda set, any plans for what you might be doing next? Is that online profile going up after that?
D date is definitely set, I will have the decree in hand and will file with the clerk before we leave the courtroom. Not sure if it is immediately at that time but in my mind once I leave the courtroom on 4/12 it is a done deal.
For the most part my profile is ready to do. I need to add 3 more pictures and I should be good. The biggest dilemma I have had is whether or not to include my kids and me as one of the pictures. I have read a lot on the subject and asked around as well. I think it comes down to personal preference. When I first thought about my initial stance was I would not include my kids. Over time though I have started to warm up to it simply because they are a large part of my life and anyone I meet in the future is obviously going to need to be onboard with it as I will be assuming she has kids as well.
I am also a little nervous about how the dynamic will change between my W and I when start dating as well. Only because I don't want a good co-parenting relationship to go south when a new person is introduced. I have friends that had a very amicable D go in the toilet once they started dating. IMO my W asks my opinion (she just sent me an email asking me who her renters insurance was through) and relies on me way too much for someone who is Ding me. Not sure how she is going to react.
So I guess I don't know when I will put myself out there again but I think it will happen some time before summer starts.
Nice. sounds like you have a good plan in place - mentally and emotionally.
Just my 2 cents - I really limit my kids photos online just to not have them overexposed at such a young age. They can decide their online footprint when they're older and I don't want their photos and business to be all over the internet and social media.
I know being a dad is an important part of your life and you'd want that to be known in your online profile - why don't you write something nice about being a dad and your girls in the profile rather than add a pic of them for now.
This way you get to still show that being a parent is a key part of your identity and keep the girls pics offline. Just a thought!!!
I wish I could come and see you and we could go get a brew on the 12th. I am excited for you
Yeah, I am fine. I feel calm and in control. At times my mind still wonders to the past or thinks about what could have been but those thoughts are getting less and less.
We have never been real sticklers on posting the girls pictures on the various different social media sights. I assume most people (especially women) do some online research to see what else they can find out about a guy before agreeing to a date and if they do I am sure pictures of my daughters will be available. The site I am going to use also has an option to link up your Instagram account as well so those types of pictures would be available any way. The problem is I have a really great picture of me and the girls that I know the ladies will love
I am excited as well, ready for the next phase. Life is too short and it's time to get back into the game. I am sure I will have a few cocktails on 4/12 to celebrate but that would be cool!
I will have a drink on your behalf on 4/12 - tell me what's your fave and I will have it in your honor.
Gotta celebrate the good and the bad, but especially the ones that are mixed with both
I am a big fan of Bourbon so pick your favorite, pour one for yourself and then another for J9
Maybe after it is over with on 4/12 I'll ask my EW if she wants to go out and celebrate....
I have the kids that week so unfortunately I won't be able to go too crazy. However if I active my online profile on 4/13 I can get some dates set up for the week of 4/15.....hmmm
I know being a dad is an important part of your life and you'd want that to be known in your online profile - why don't you write something nice about being a dad and your girls in the profile rather than add a pic of them for now.
)
I think like you said, it comes down to personal preference, but I'd leave the pics of you and the girls off your profile.
Glad you seem to be in a really great place, and I'll raise one to you on the 12th, too
J9,
Man if you want we can try to have a meet up sometime soon. I'm in SA you are in Dallas. You are doing great.
hat article doesn't mention it but another factor is women in their 40's and 50's that find themselves in the dating pool seem to be really jaded. Maybe it's because they've been burned in previous relationships, but their walls are high and their skepticism runs deep.
I find this so sad. I know that if H and I end up divorced, he would end up marrying someone 10 years younger than me and probably have more kids. I think he'd have to marry that much younger honestly bc any woman my age would see through him in an instant. Women in their 40s have been through enough to know what they do and don't want.
I also read a post here, I can't remember who it was that set their age limit on their dating profile to 35. It's a very sad day to realize that at 43, I wouldn't even come up in that data set. Ugh.
Well....I just got a copy of our Divorce decree.......reading through it is a very surreal moment.
I feel for you. I suspect I'll be doing that myself soon enough.
Oh wow!!! Hope you're alright. Take whatever you're feeling out - gym and boxing gloves, throw down some 3 point J's
Who cares about papers J9? Just papers.
I only care to make sure it is what my W and I agreed on
but outside of that I agree. Just papers.
I'm cool I just had a moment, a millisecond when I first opened the document
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http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2784346#Post2784346