Long time reader, first time poster pt.4

My old thread:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2744146&page=11

Pew
thank you for coming back to the board. Reacquainting myself with your sitch has been a revelation with what I need to do. Had my second session today with a new IC. She is all about "having the review conversation". We agreed that an appropriate time would be over the Christmas break (there has been little point of late as she is normally too tired to discuss anything).

Every situation is different and nuanced. However I would hope to start mine off by saying "it has been an interesting year". At some point the pain caused to me has to come in. But as Sandi2 indicates, there is little point in designing a conversation that could go in any direction. But in my case I would want to address my own sitch dynamics:
(a) how she feels about "us" (regardless of what is still going on, I have no real way of knowing as I don't check anymore, but there have certainly been pointers, e.g. remaining in contact with OM after many MC ssessions - I did a one off check to confirm this - evidence of new lingerie etc.)
(b) everything appears "normal", close intimacy (in all senses, this is down presumably to cake eating as opposed to temp checking to maintain the plan B status, even though I am plan B), booking next year's holidays etc.
(c) yet at the same time I will have to act once and for all if things suddenly take a turn (of whatever complexion)
(d) the lack of respect for me (clearly) but being oblivious to the disrespect to her family unit (I don't count her livein mother in this equation, just DD)

it is unlikely that all these points would be reflected in the conversation but they have to frame it

all the best

Pew,

Are you m to my w? Just kidding.

I just read your entire thread and wow, have experienced so many of the same things.

In the last week, I have gotten the vague apology and trying to act normal and approaches for physical intimacy (I rejected her).

This is a tricky place to be, good to know I�m not alone.

Sandi2 and arista,

Thanks for the invaluable comments. I won�t hijack but your comments to pew have been great for me too.

Thanks, Gordie.

CW I have to read up on your stitch. These women are so confusing in their actions but I can see why sandi2 and artista are correct. All the changes that I have seen but I don�t see a woman who is truly remorseful. I can see without this s properly getting addressed it possibly happening again in the future or worse continuing indefinitely in the shadows.

Gordie please don�t tell me there is someone out there exactly like my W lol. That was good that you were wise enough to turn down her bs advances. Sure wish I would have been. Now I can totally see this as her way of sweeping everything under the rug and not having to face her actions.

So what happened after you turned her down? Did she show the typical anger and why do you think she is acting this way towards you at this point in your stitch?

She was sad after I rejected her, not angry.

Why is she acting the way she is? She says she wants me and OM2.

How are you doing?

So my W went to do a little Christmas shopping yesterday afternoon but I felt something was off with the whole thing. So I kept to myself and was just processIng all these feelings that came over me.

I got up this morning at 5:30 and made coffee and sat on the couch knowing in my mind full well that she met up with OM yesterday. My W gets up and sits on the couch and asks me what is wrong. So I proceed to tell her I was angry and upset about what happened yesterday. She then asks why because she met up with her girlfriend and I looked at her and calmly said don�t treat me like an idiot. I know what you did yesterday.

Then I got up and went back to bed. A few minutes later she came into the bedroom and said he is just a friend and i don�t want to lose you. I replied that seeing him is not going to keep me here. She then asked me do I want her to stop talking to him. So I said you are old enough to figure out what you need and want to do.

She then asked to snuggle with her and I said I can�t. I have a lot on my mind and I am trying to process it all. She then started crying. So I just layed there with my back to her and let her cry. I wasn�t going to cave anymore. When I didn�t respond to her tears she tried bringing up things up from the past apparently as reasoning for her affair.. I told her I own up to my shortcomings of what got us here but taking things into an affair was all her choice.

She tried to hold me but I got up and went out to my sons room because I heard him waking up. I was hopeful no to make it through the holidays before this talk but it just happened and like sandi2 and artista said, I can�t back away from having it. So we will see how the holidays go from here.

Meet Christmas to all. I hope we all find peace in the new year.

So what�s the plan now?

TBH I am not sure. All I know is I need some space to get my head straight. Just trying to make it through the holidays as best as possible for my children.

Sounds like a good plan to get the holidays.

Come January 2nd IMO things need to change. Einstein said �the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result �.

Right now she sees you as being weak for tolerating her BS. You need to change that starting 2018.

She came up to me again and told me that she wants to be with me and doesn�t want to lose me. I told her that I can not and will not be in an open relationship and that she needs to figure out what she wants to do. I said we both need to think about things. I then left to go food shopping. I am trying my hardest to keep my composure but I am really struggling at the moment.

All I know is Have made many mistakes in this journey but I am going to try to do what is needed and not what my heart is telling me to do. I can�t help but feel like a failure at this point. I can and will do better.

LH, I just want to say thank you four your wisdom and support even when I just couldn�t listen. I am trying to be strong this time. I am listening you your advice.

You�re welcome. Look man, don�t be hard on yourself this $hit ain�t easy.

2018 is your fuching year and the BS stops!

If you�re strong and confident and communicate to her that the bs stops, She�ll pick you.

Funny thing is you will become so awesome that may not want her back!

Happy holidays man!

Happy holidays to you too brotha.

She is going to continue to play, "He's just a friend", until you finally get enough. When you get fed up, you'll see how simple it is to tell her that you have decided you don't want to be with a woman who thinks it's appropriate in a MR to have private friendships with members of the opposite sex. It does not matter what she calls the relationship, if her H doesn't like it.....that should settle it. There should be no argument or pleas. The spouse takes priority over all other relationships.

Look, you know good & well she would not stand for you having a chummy friendship with some woman. You would not get away with telling her the OW was just a friend. So, why put up with her playing you for a fool? That's what she does every time she plays oh so innocent and asks, "What's wrong", and turns around and offers to cuddle with you. You would be the biggest chump ever.....to let her think you are putty in her hand. The man that attracts a woman is the man who she can't work like putty.

Pew, I played my H for a fool. Every WW does it. But I was the fool....and so is your WW. She just won't see it until you stop letting her have the best of both worlds.

You have a good support team here on the board. Sometimes we hit hard, but it's b/c we know you have a shot at turning things around for the better, if you'll stop playing her games and waiting to see if she'll change. You just haven't been able to fully trust in yourself, yet. I hope one of your goals is to build up your self esteem, and know that you can learn skills that will attract your W back into the M.

Please stick with us, Pew. ((hugs))

Thanks sandi2, I am not accepting the he is just a friend bs. I told her she needs to be honest with me and right now I know she is telljing me lies. I will need as much support as you guys can give. Thank you all.

PEW - I liked how you handled it.

Just after BD, W told me she had gone on a coffee date with someone from her work. At that time I hadn't come across DB and I didn't know how to react to that. She told me like I was one of her friends.

Fast forward few months and she went to his place for a BBQ. She told me that he is only a friend and she would never ever date him or wants to be with him.

What did I do - I told her that I don't care any more. She can do whatever she wants. Also, that I am not her friend, and that only place our life intersects is being co-parents.

I didn't believe her then and I surely do not believe her now. Unless and until there is absolute remorse and wanting to work on the MR, I wouldn't believe a thing.

Maika, I have followed your stitch as with a few others. I have been very impressed with your self improvement and the handling of your children. After that temp check you gave your W you have really worked hard at sticking by your principles. You can definitely walk holding your head up high. I need to find that inner strength that you have. I am getting there.

Just before my W came downstairs where I was wrapping presents and wanted a hug. I just looked at her and said I can�t do that. I said I can�t keep living like this and she needs to make a choice. She can�t have it both ways. She shook her head and said I know and then walked away. This is so damn hard but I can feel things changing in me. I am slowly finding the courage.

Pew!

I think your new attitude is awesome. Way to go. And yes, I understand not wanting to do this at Christmas but you are doing great. Feeling like a failure? I know that feeling but dust ourself off and move forward. One day at a time. Today, you are not a failure.

Quote:

Just before my W came downstairs where I was wrapping presents and wanted a hug. I just looked at her and said I can�t do that. I said I can�t keep living like this and she needs to make a choice.

So............now, you'll probably be tested by her not doing much of anything that actually tells you she is taking steps to get a D nor end the A and commit to the M. If you push for an answer, she'll probably say she doesn't know what she wants. But actually, she will try to maintain things as they currently stand. I doubt she took what you said very seriously, and expects you to continue being available to her.....and waiting on the sidelines.

Remember, whenever you make statements of this nature, be prepared to follow through.

((hugs))

sandi2, I am ready to back up these words with actions but TBH I am still figuring what that entails. I don't want to be the one to leave the house but I haven't been able to get her to move out either. She has tried to act like everything is fine. She has tried to give me hugs but I all I say is I can't and walk away. She has also tried to cuddle with me in bed but I just roll over and keep my back to her.

I am unsure how to act without being too cold and angry. I could use some advice in this area. Do I confront her again about a decision at some point or just keep doing my own thing. Trying to figure out what I should be doing at this point. Thank you for sticking with me. I know I haven't been good at what I need to do but I am ready. I do not want to live another year like last year.

PEW,

How is doing your own thing working for you?

Direct and to the point. I love you and I adore you but I will not continue live in an open marriage. We can either work on this together or you can pack up your $hit and get it out of the house.

LH, I do understand what you are saying. I know I will have to put a final ultimatum of either him or us. I know she will not move out of the house so do I just proceed with filing myself. I don't want to the divorce proceedings on my hands. What would be the follow through?

Hi, I only think you should file if you are truly ready to end the marriage yourself. Don't file because you hope it will 'wake her up' or have some effect on her. Do it only because it is the right path for you. You will need to live with and be at peace with that decision. You don't sound ready at this point?

So, she isn't going to leave the house by choice? There are other options. You may choose not to share the MBR for example and move her stuff into another room - letting her know that you aren't willing to share the MBR with her if she is choosing not to be in this relationship.

You may also choose to move out yourself. People tend to advise against this on the forum and sometimes there may be legal considerations to that option. I left the marital home at BD and (in a way) I never regretted that decision - though it left me in a financially precarious situation for a good while.

I think the key question is - given that she is doing what she is doing - what do you want/need to do to look after yourself and your own interests?

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

I don't want to the divorce proceedings on my hands.

Why would it be? Shes in an affair and you asked her to stop it. She chose no to end it. Case closed.

DO NOT BE DRIVEN BY FEAR.

Sotto, thank you for taking the time to help me. I believe that ultimately I will be the one to have to move out if and when it comes to that. I am trying to find peace in this decision. There is a major conflict deep down in my soul right now but I do know what path I must follow even though my heart is telling me otherwise. I know I am not ready to file for divorce myself although I do think that I am going to have to head in this direction. I would do it because I do not see a continuation of the current situation as a healthy alternative and not to just get a reaction out of my W.

The funny thing is that if I had moved out right after BD around march, my W would have been fine with it. Financially, moving out is going to be very difficult but the emotional toll right now is costing me more.

I am trying to accept the situation I am in and not be driven by fear. It is a struggle that I am working on.

May I suggest that instead of telling her, "I can't".......you begin using two other words that are much more effective with a WW. "No thanks" sounds so much stronger than "I can't".

Throughout this entire situation, you have waited on your WW....hoping her actions would change. Have you considered that it is your actions that need to seen in a much stronger light?

Don't offer ultimatums to a WW. They seldom work. Ultimatums are not boundaries. A boundary would be, "I will not stay in a M of three". If she doesn't make an about face immediately, then you proceed to back up your word.....which is not staying in a M of three.

You aren't going to be able to play soft Mr. Nice Guy and have your WW "choose" you over the OM. You are using the same behavior that helped cause this mess....to get you out of it. How much sense does that make? When you get enough, then you won't worry if you appear cold or angry. And, why should you? When a man has a W who is involved with OM, then he should be angry. I can't imagine not being angry and cold. Those are natural feelings. Don't confuse this with the advice of other interactions with your W.

You are wanting her to make decisions that will let you off the hook of doing something that requires you to take action that may be unpleasant. For example, you are still sleeping in the same bed with a woman who desires another man instead of her H.

I think it's best when the H stays in the MBR and the marital home. However, I have been introduced to some WW's who will physically fight the H in order to remain in the bedroom. When that's the case, then the H needs to consider which is more important......physically separating from his WW and gaining perspective and inner strength, or continue to suffer every day he has to be near her. Clearly, a woman like this does not want to be in the same bed so she can be near him. She feels entitled and uses it for manipulative purposes. Same as not leaving the house, she feels entitled to having the best of both worlds....therefore, she won't leave.

What I'm trying to say here is that you have to make some decisions and show some actions, Pew. So far, you have waited on her to make the decisions......and all she has to say is "no", and you are stuck in the same place. You will continue to be stuck, until you start acting like a man who has had enough and start making decisions on what is best for you, instead of hoping she'll make them for you.

I've tried to tell you what works and doesn't work to draw a WW back into the MR. I am trying to help you save your M, believe it or not. She has to see that you will not compromise your integrity just to have her in the same room/house. She has to see that you aren't afraid to dump her. Right now, she has no worries about losing you. The H who has a WW, has to apply tough love to save his M. Strength is the one thing the WW respects. That's why the H is told to do things that show his inner male strength that she can't manipulate. I wonder if you can't separate that type of strength from a man who is angry & cold.

When I was the WW, I thought my H would love me....regardless of how I treated him. Some people in the position of my H would call that unconditional love. I don't think it exists in M.....nor should it, b/c each spouse should be held accountable for their actions and treatment toward the other one. When we can treat a person so badly without any consequences, it does not build our loving feelings....but destroys it. That's just how bad human nature can become when that person's code of decency is messed up.

So, I think you need to come to terms that you will probably be required to do something unpleasant.....even at the risk of being labeled the bad guy. (However, she's already labeled you the bad guy, so nothing new there.)

Originally Posted By: sandi2

So, I think you need to come to terms that you will probably be required to do something unpleasant.....even at the risk of being labeled the bad guy.

Pew,

It's time to do the bean thing. Eat lots and lots of beans all day long. At bedtime, hop in your bed and let a nasty one escape under the covers. When your wife starts to get into bed you say, "I'm having some gastrointestinal distress and I think I might mess-up the bed in my sleep tonight." Then, rollover and go to sleep.

With a name like Pew, it's your destiny.

sandi2, I really took my time digesting your thoughts and comments and realize you are correct in that the time is coming for me to make an uncomfortable decision. I have been feeling very low the past few days as the realization of this has become more tangible.

I am not going to lie to myself. I am scared. I still love my W and I am trying to table those feelings as to not cloud what I need to do. Even after 9 months I am feeling the struggle to let go. I need to work on that and I will work on that.

Doodler, I appreciate the humor. It is always good for oneself to laugh. Thanks.

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

I am not going to lie to myself. I am scared.

PEW,

Are you scared she won't choose you? Here's the problem. Why should she choose you when she is able disrespect you by cheating on you and you just put up with it?

A woman wants a man that she knows will stick up for her and protect her. How are you going to provide that for her when you can't even stick up for yourself?

Look man I know it sounds harsh but those are the facts. It's time to put an end to this one way or another!

LH19, I am not scared of her not choosing me. She already has not chosen me. I am coming to grips with that. I guess what I am scared of is my letting go of my feelings. To me there is something more finite in that. I realize it is what I need to do.

PEW,

Letting go of your feelings is detachment. That is what your are trying to obtain. Do not be afraid of letting go.

Pew....LH and Sandi are correct, it is an unfortuante situation but the reality of the matter is that you MR with your W is over. I have spent a tone of time, I mean hours on this site reading through sitch's, advice, wisdom, gudiance, etc. and the one thing that stood out to me was that you have to be willing to lose it all before it will ever come back. When my W came to me and told me she wanted to get an apartment and her timeline was 3 months to move out. I told her that wouldn't work for me and I essentially needed her to move out ASAP. Within 3 weeks of BD she was gone. IMO the longer you interact with someone who wants out, the longer your living together, etc. it delays the healing and potential recon process.

I still have my moments but the good days certinly outweigh the bad. Tomorrow will be 7 months and I am still standing!

You have to let go.

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

I am not going to lie to myself. I am scared. I still love my W and I am trying to table those feelings as to not cloud what I need to do. Even after 9 months I am feeling the struggle to let go. I need to work on that and I will work on that.

Pew,

I was scared when I told my wife it was time for her to leave. I was afraid of the impact it would have on my sons and I was afraid of all of the future unknowns. Taking action actually allowed me to step-up my game and move forward with confidence. Prior to telling my wife to leave, she was in the driver's seat. After asking her to leave, I did most of the driving and everything turned out very well. My fears didn't have any foundation, but it was hard to throttle the imaginary scenarios of what the future may hold.

There's a good quote, but I don't know who to attribute it to, "fear is the mind killer." When you're gripped by fear, it's hard to make good decisions. Live in the moment (GAL) and don't ruminate all of the potential futures. Do what you need to do in the present and let the future take care of itself.

Joseph9, thanks for your comments. I have followed your stitch from the beginning. I haven't commented because I knew I was failing at DBing myself. You have gone on an amazing personal journey. I admire the inner strength you have shown throughout. I am finally going to try and just let go. It has taken me a long time to come to this point. I realized the death grip that I had on it even though I was lying to myself that I wasn't.

It is not a healthy way to live. I have to choose myself first from this point forward.

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

I am finally going to try and just let go.

Come on man! TRY? Just do it!

Doodler, your right about the future scaring me. I need to live in the present and not worry about what will happen. The fear has clouded my judgement for making good decisions. Although, I do not regret the past months. I have been able to change a lot in me and I have been able to show compassion towards my W even though I have felt anger for what has happened. But now is the time I need to show some love and respect for myself.

Your right. No more trying, just doing. Thanks

Pew....thanks man, it definately has been a journey but one of the most rewrarding journies in my life! Look we all have failed, no one is perfect at this.

Open the cage door and set her free! It is your only hope. It is tough, everyone is different, different circumstances, finacially, emotionally, etc. I think once you start to make some decisions you will find your confidence starting to grow. Both of you need time and space from each other and you are currently not getting that.

IMO the quicker you set her on her way the more likely she may want to return. You have indicated how much you love your W could setting her free be your ultimate sign of that?

Can try, can do......make it happen!

Doodler,

Great quote. Something I needed to read today.

Doodler,

That quite is now attributed to you.

Pew,

We are almost in the same place. I am looking at apartments today. You can do this!

Thanks Gordie. Ironically enough I was just finishing reading your latest thread when I saw your comment. You are definitely further along mentally/emotionally than I am. I am getting there. The irrational thoughts of our W's is unreal.

Happy New Year to all. So the new year has begun and I have begun the search for alternative living arrangements. Unfortunately, apartments are so damn expensive I am unsure if it is financially possible at the moment. Still trying to crunch the numbers or see if I can crash with a friend for a while.

My W has been trying to engage with me but I have kept her at a distance. She got real angry the other night cause my son was not listening and then directed her anger at me. I remained somewhat calm, just ignored her and proceeded to get my S8 into his shower and get him ready for bed. It was the first time in several months that she has showed this nasty side of her. So I put my son to bed and and fell asleep in his room.

The next morning, as I walked in the MBR to get my clothes for a shower, she apologized and tried to get me to come into bed next to her. All I could do was just acknowledge her apology and walked out to wash up for work. I was going into work late so I could take my D18 to the airport for her to go back to college in Florida. So I was still home when after she took my S8 to school. She tried apologizing again and I proceeded to tell her that I will not accept being treated like that and that I think we need some space from each other. She then started crying and asked if I could come back home after taking our D to the airport. I replied no I needed to go to work.

So this is where we stand right now. My think son is starting to sense something is going on between us and that part is breaking my heart. Really trying to get a grip of my emotions at the moment and figure out the best way to proceed.

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

The next morning, as I walked in the MBR to get my clothes for a shower, she apologized and tried to get me to come into bed next to her. All I could do was just acknowledge her apology and walked out to wash up for work. I was going into work late so I could take my D18 to the airport for her to go back to college in Florida. So I was still home when after she took my S8 to school. She tried apologizing again and I proceeded to tell her that I will not accept being treated like that and that I think we need some space from each other. She then started crying and asked if I could come back home after taking our D to the airport. I replied no I needed to go to work.

I think you handled the situation very well.

FastCars, thank you for your comment. At one point while she was crying she said she didn't want me to leave. That normally would have gotten to me but this time I mentally stopped and realized that all she really cares is not losing her comfortable situation. Its still hard to process how manipulative she can be when saying things like this.

P,

Good work at twisting her advances. How is the apartment hunt? It took me a while to find something affordable but finally found a place for a move in a few weeks. We�ll get through this whether or not our wives wake up.

Resisting not twisting

Well it has been a long while since I last posted. In that time I have looked inward as to what has held me back from doing what is needed to be done and all I can honestly say is fear. As much as I tried to deny it, it has been fear of losing my family, losing my wife and losing the life that I had once known. I realize now that I have already lost most of those things and I need to start healing my wounds and building myself a new life.

I had a conversation last week with my W and explained to her that this situation is not working for me anymore and that we have been living separated but under the same roof and the time has come for me to physically separate to start putting my life back together. I gave her 2 weeks to figure out if she wanted to stay in the house and I would take my half of the equity and move out or if she wanted her half and she move out. She tried to give me the "I don't know what I want" excuse. I explained that while I understand that this will be hard for both of us, it is something that is needed to be done. I also mentioned that once I am set up, I would want 50% custody of our S8 as my D18 is an adult in college and is old enough to make her own decisions as to who she will see in a schedule that works for her. My door for her is always open. She started crying but after the conversation was done I calmly walked away.

So it has been a week since this convo and man has she gotten so cold towards me. I truly beginning to realize now what everyone here has been saying to me this whole time. All the closeness that she was showing me over the past few months has been a facade and just a way to keep me emotionally attached.

On the other hand, my apartment hunt has been an adventure that has left me questioning what can I really afford. While I want to find my own place I do not want to be tied for a year to something that is too small for me and my son. I have opted to stay at a friends house in our town for 2 months and then lock an apartment up. This will work to my advantage as my W's car will be paid off at that time and I will have a great deal more money each month to put towards rent.

One more week to go for her to decide and then my future should start to become a little clearer to me. I must admit I am still a little scared but just at the uncertainty of my future at the moment. I also am beginning to find a little excitement in the unknown. I just want to say thank you for all the brutal honesty you have shown me. I understand it was always meant to help me.

P,

Good for you to come to the realization that although scary you are not going to put up with her BS anymore.

You are going to be just fine my friend! Onward and upward!

Thank you LH19. It was your 2x4's that have really opened my eyes and made me look inward. I know eventually I will find my new normal. Trying to remain strong brother.

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

Well it has been a long while since I last posted. In that time I have looked inward as to what has held me back from doing what is needed to be done and all I can honestly say is fear. As much as I tried to deny it, it has been fear of losing my family, losing my wife and losing the life that I had once known. I realize now that I have already lost most of those things and I need to start healing my wounds and building myself a new life.

I had a conversation last week with my W and explained to her that this situation is not working for me anymore and that we have been living separated but under the same roof and the time has come for me to physically separate to start putting my life back together. I gave her 2 weeks to figure out if she wanted to stay in the house and I would take my half of the equity and move out or if she wanted her half and she move out. She tried to give me the "I don't know what I want" excuse. I explained that while I understand that this will be hard for both of us, it is something that is needed to be done. I also mentioned that once I am set up, I would want 50% custody of our S8 as my D18 is an adult in college and is old enough to make her own decisions as to who she will see in a schedule that works for her. My door for her is always open. She started crying but after the conversation was done I calmly walked away.

So it has been a week since this convo and man has she gotten so cold towards me. I truly beginning to realize now what everyone here has been saying to me this whole time. All the closeness that she was showing me over the past few months has been a facade and just a way to keep me emotionally attached.

On the other hand, my apartment hunt has been an adventure that has left me questioning what can I really afford. While I want to find my own place I do not want to be tied for a year to something that is too small for me and my son. I have opted to stay at a friends house in our town for 2 months and then lock an apartment up. This will work to my advantage as my W's car will be paid off at that time and I will have a great deal more money each month to put towards rent.

One more week to go for her to decide and then my future should start to become a little clearer to me. I must admit I am still a little scared but just at the uncertainty of my future at the moment. I also am beginning to find a little excitement in the unknown. I just want to say thank you for all the brutal honesty you have shown me. I understand it was always meant to help me.

Wow. This really struck me as I feel I am in a similar situation. My WW draws closer to me when I pull away. When I start talking moving forward with separation and D she starts hedging. I get the same feeling about her "closeness" being manipulative, and I often hear the "I don't know what I want" statement. WWs in limbo often will do whatever it takes to remain in limbo.

The one time I gave her a boundary, about 3 weeks after BD, I told her in no uncertain terms that I would need full transparency if she decided to stay. She said "Ok, I will start looking for a job and an apartment." I felt great, I really started to detach. When I wasn't a bit upset at her desire to move forward with her plan, the very next night she came to me teary-eyed saying she didn't think we should get a D, that it wasn't what God wanted, and that she was praying hard for God to make her want to stay.

Of course, 5 days later I found a full profile on the >50 dating site OurTime, including a picture. SO obviously she was manipulating me with all of her "I want to want to stay" stuff. Believe nothing they say!

So I think I will eventually have to have the same conversation with her that you have had. Can I ask how long you've been in limbo?

It ain�t fuching easy climbing that mountain but once you get to the top the scenery is unbelievable!

Stay strong my man!

Steve85, short answer... TOO LONG. I am just coming up on a year from BD in 2 weeks. I really thought that we would have been trying to work on our R by now. I realize now how foolish that train of thought was. While I am not fully in the "my life will be so much better" thinking yet, I know that this is the only way for my life to improve. This past year has sucked the life out of me and has wounded me to my soul. All the lies and deception and the constant feeling like you have been discarded like a piece of trash. I will not do this anymore. I will not allow someone to make me feel like this. You will get there. Hopefully with less stumbling than I have.

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Thank you LH19. It was your 2x4's that have really opened my eyes and made me look inward.

LH's 2x4's seems to have that effect on guys

You are going to be fine, Pew. I mean, just look at what you have been through, and you are still kicking! Sure, you probably have some fear, but that's okay. Do it afraid........ but do it.

((hugs))

Thank you sandi2 for all your help even when I was too stubborn to listen. It has been very comforting to have so much support through all this.

Originally Posted By: PEW1974

As much as I tried to deny it, it has been fear of losing my family, losing my wife and losing the life that I had once known. I realize now that I have already lost most of those things and I need to start healing my wounds and building myself a new life.

Exactly. Cadet used to say something like "most LBS's are divorced at BD, they just don't know it yet." That doesn't mean that there's no hope for a future R with their WAS, but just that their marriage as they knew it ended at BD. Rarely do you go back to what you had.

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I explained that while I understand that this will be hard for both of us, it is something that is needed to be done. I also mentioned that once I am set up, I would want 50% custody of our S8 as my D18 is an adult in college and is old enough to make her own decisions as to who she will see in a schedule that works for her. My door for her is always open. She started crying but after the conversation was done I calmly walked away.

Great, you handled that perfectly! I know it's tough, but when you're stuck in a miserable situation at some point you have to do something differently. And you're doing that, so congrats!

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I must admit I am still a little scared but just at the uncertainty of my future at the moment. I also am beginning to find a little excitement in the unknown.

It's human nature to fear the unknown. But I'll share a line from my favorite show "Vikings", when Rollo meets the seer and says he feels like his life is over the Seer starts laughing and says "Oh Rollo, if you knew what the gods have planned for you, you would go down now and dance naked on the beach!"

AS, thank you for those words. It is overwhelming but as I look passed the fear and anxiousness, I can see that this is the right thing to do for me. I just want my S8 to remain the happy and sweet little boy that he is. I am so concerned and sad for how he will handle this that it constantly brings me to tears.

P,
Yes us LBS we live in a fantasy world that our W/H will snap out of it, now that I look back my W been a war with herself before bd it was like getting the rug pull off me because I at the moment didn't see it. But when I go back through our text,e-mails or pictures I see W was gone but holding on I mean literally 3 weeks even the bd came W said let's adopt another baby or let's try to have one. And we where looking to build a New home. I honestly think that our spouses are fighting hard before bd.

I also won't sugar coat your child has a long road. I have 3 beautiful kids we adopted my s9 and d9 took it hard emotions everywhere, they even beg there mom in there knees please give my other mom a chance please don't break our family W no emotions it was crazy seeing my kids this way. S8 was more quite reserved at first I thought myself HAPPY but what happen is reality didn't kick in for him till 6 to 7 months later tears flowing, not sleeping,wetting the bed, bad behavior in school my s8 was once a happy child. We are in a better place since lots of therapy and constantly showing them love and reminding them is not there fault. It has drained me emotionally and physically because my kids are hurting and I can't take the pain away. But I can tell you it gets better we literally live a day at a time. Everyday is a new day. And the healing gets better.

Just remember take care of yourself so you can be there for your son because he will need you. I wish you luck in this journey and just take it a day at a time.

Marina7,

Thank you for your comments. I realize that there is no delicate way of avoiding my S8's pain. I am trying to keep it to a minimum though.

I am at a point where my W and I are arguing more and more. I have tried to avoid letting here get me into those types of talks but I find that I am losing the will to fight for this M anymore. I can not get her to try and work together so we can just physically separate. All she knows is what she wants and that is all she cares about. This R is toxic... She is toxic... I need to figure out how to proceed as cheaply as possible. Trying not to get lawyers involved but it appears we are going to have to go that route even though we can not afford it. Looking for advice or thoughts on how to proceed. I still love my W but I need to love myself more and save myself.