Wife Wants to Leave Marriage 7 - DivorceBusting.com

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doodling

So today is our 15 Wedding Anniversary. Actually got married twice. On August 4th with a few close friends, then we had a big wedding with family and everyone else October 18th. Funny how this time last year we had made plans to renew our vows and take a cruise to Mexico. A little over a month later W was having an A. Not really feeling sad about the whole thing. Just interesting how the dynamic of a family can change so quickly.

Originally Posted By: Tread

So today is our 15 Wedding Anniversary.

Tread, so sorry for you today! Hope you have some plans of your own to keep your mind off it.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Funny how this time last year we had made plans to renew our vows and take a cruise to Mexico. A little over a month later W was having an A. Not really feeling sad about the whole thing. Just interesting how the dynamic of a family can change so quickly.

My 20th anniversay was in June, last year around November we had talked about going somewhere just me and her to celebrate our milestone. I actually had booked a trip to the Bahamas for a long weekend that I had to cancel(probably should have gone by myself) It is funny(and sad) how things changed. Try to make the best of the day!

No plans for today. I have S14 who I will take to bible study tonight. I actually exchanged the cruise to Mexico for the Bahamas. So my brother and I will be taking a sibling trip at some point there.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Funny how this time last year we had made plans to renew our vows and take a cruise to Mexico. A little over a month later W was having an A. Not really feeling sad about the whole thing. Just interesting how the dynamic of a family can change so quickly.

It's mind-boggling, isn't it? I've mentioned this before but my W started crying one evening, I asked her if everything was OK and she told me (in part) that I can't let anything happen to me, because she would not be able to survive without me. It was one of the biggest outpourings of love and emotion I had ever seen from her. A year later, "I can't do this anymore." "Can't do what? Do you mean the marriage?" "Yes." What had changed in that year? Not a thing. Why the sudden change? THERE IS NO REASON. BD'ing is all about working on ourselves and making ourselves the spouse only a fool would leave, but the bottom line is a lot of times this crap happens for no reason at all. None of us is the perfect spouse, but who out there is? No one, that's who.

A few days ago was my 25 year anniversary (we're D'd, but technically an "anniversary" is "the date on which an event took place in a previous year"). I had completely forgotten until my phone sent me a reminder. I thought about it, and then sent my XW a text just telling her I'll always remember the date fondly, thanking her for being a great mom and wishing her a good day. She sent a nice response back. Then that evening my GF came over and we went out and had a nice dinner and went home and got more than a little nasty. Yup, changed dynamic. Not saying it's better or worse but it's different, that's for sure. Life is an adventure.

So I decided that I will finally get back to writing this book based on my experience with WW. With a fictional spin on it of course. Might even tryi to get it published. Tried to write it over the summer, but just pissed myself off writing some of the details. Now my mindset is in a much better place. So hopefully there will be success in this. And it doesn't somehow blow up in my face...lol

Tread,

I feel for you. After our 20th including recommitment of vows and a second honeymoon adventure with lots of sex, two months later came b d. I echo AS. It makes no sense which only exacerbates the hurt.

So my lawyer calls this morning in regards to not hearing back from me in regards to W signing the divorce papers. And its been several weeks since I emailed them to her and have yet to hear a single word in regards to the paper or divorce period. I know that were not supposed to bring up the R. But I am wondering if I should ask her what she wants at this point. Does she just want to stay separated to think or just sign the papers, so I can get this divorce over with?

As sick and tired as I am of this situation. I realize that I have never made a decision without hearing the opinion from W. And I'm wondering if this should be any different? She certainly isn't in a rush to do anything. But she does have the convenience of living with her sister, not having me around to spoil her sneaking around. And gets to do whatever she wants the weeks S14 is with me.

One of those moments when you wish you could read the wayward mind. If she had doubts about the divorce, then I could be patient in regards to getting this done. But if she is just cake eating, then let's get this over with, so I can move on with my life.

Originally Posted By: Tread

One of those moments when you wish you could read the wayward mind. If she had doubts about the divorce, then I could be patient in regards to getting this done. But if she is just cake eating, then let's get this over with, so I can move on with my life.

You will never know this.

What do YOU want, regardless of what she is doing?

You should not ask her what she wants. She already knows you want(ed) to save the M. You already know that she doesn't want to save the M, at least not RIGHT NOW. What is there to talk about?

This is about what YOU want. If you do not want to be divorced, then don't push it forward. If you DO want to be divorced, then tell her you need a response by XX date and if she doesn't respond, then tell your L to go ahead and file and have your W served. Your agreed divorce will turn into a contested one, but it will be moving forward.

I come back to this:

Quote:

Keep the D moving if that's what you want. While that's moving forward, be "done" with her if that's what you want or stand for your M if that's what you want. Whatever you do, though, commit to it and STOP WORRYING ABOUT HER AND WHAT SHE'S DOING! You'll never find any kind of peace unless you do.

Unless and until you accept that there's NOTHING you can do to control what she does, and live for YOU and your kid, you're going to keep hurting, going to keep spinning, and you won't ever move closer to something better than the hell you're in right now.

This isn't about her. It's about you (and your son). Stop making it about her, decide what it is YOU want, figure out what your timeline for that is, and do the best you can to achieve your goals.

she's living with her sister, not in her own place. She only gets s14 half time.

Tread, I know you're in pain. But please tell me how this^^ is so great for her?

Couldn't she say -

"I can't live in my own home. I had to move into my sister's! And I only get to see s14 half time. The holidays are coming. This stinks."

I don't see too much cake eating. I do see indecision on her end & limbo on yours.

And that is really the issue, isn't it? You want certainty where there is none, unless you push for it.

So Now it's all Up to you, not her.

25 makes a good point, one that I have drilling in your head forever. You have control and you can make choices. Stop leaving it all in your W's court. You make too many decisions based on her actions and what she might be thinking. Try making them based on what is right for you regardless of what your W's life looks like or how she is feeling or thinking.

25,

Actually W and her sister ended up renting a 2 bedroom home together. SIL gave up on her plans to move to Florida, clearly after being manipulated by her own sister. Never occurred to any of them to get a 3rd bedroom for when S14 stays there. But one of W complaints to me was wanting to be by herself. Now she is stuck with her Parrott if a sister who ahe treats like a child. And spending all kinds of time with my abusive MIL. But yet this is better than being with our family?

But you right about me wanting certainty. I work with really dysfunctional families on a daily basis. Which only makes me want to ensure that my own life is in order. Easy to see how out of control things can get. Whereas my W comes from a dysfunctional family, so this is all normal to her.

Ginger,

What you are saying that definitely starting to set in. Just used to us making decisions as a team. But I do need to start making decisions solely in the best interest of myself and S14.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Which only makes me want to ensure that my own life is in order. Whereas my W comes from a dysfunctional family, so this is all normal to her.

So why are you relying on her chaos to lead you to make decisions about your life?

EastTN,

That is the tough part. I want this to come to some kind of conclusion. But I have this feeling that my being impatient might be dying the chamce of reconciliation taking place at some point. But on another note, I do need to move on and focus on myself. And that is difficult with a WW doing her own thing with whoever. And I am here ducking and dodging women who maybe showing interest.

Originally Posted By: Tread

I do need to move on and focus on myself.

This is all that matters. Make this your goal for now.

Originally Posted By: Tread

But I have this feeling that my being impatient might be dying the chamce of reconciliation taking place at some point.

How many times have you heard this on this site: "This is a marathon, not a sprint." YES, being impatient will lower if not outright kill any chance of reconciliation. Which is another reason why this is about YOU and not HER! If you want to reconcile, then BE PATIENT. Stop pushing. Stop worrying about what she's doing. DETACH.

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But on another note, I do need to move on and focus on myself. And that is difficult with a WW doing her own thing with whoever

Hence, "detach." Why is it hard to focus on you because of something your W is doing? By definition, if you're focused on you, you're not worried about what she's doing.

Quote:

And I am here ducking and dodging women who maybe showing interest.

Why are you ducking and dodging? If you're not ready to call it quits, then shut that down. Don't duck and dodge, just flat out tell whoever that you're not ready for that, yet. Don't be passive. Passivity is one of the MNG traits that helped you end up where you are right now.

Look, we all understand what you're feeling and how much it [censored] to be where you are. You'd give ANYTHING to be ANYWHERE other than where you are now. D, R, whatever, just let it end, right? Well, if "stop hurting" is your goal, then "D, R, whatever" isn't going to get you there. Because the truth is that the piece of paper isn't what changes things. Time is.

Take this time that you have. Introspect. Decide what YOU want, and what's best for YOU. Don't rush, don't be in a hurry. It doesn't work, there really aren't any shortcuts, and you'll make things worse for you, and for those around you if you try.

Kaizen,

Excellent point...lol

EastTN

My behavior definitely comes from MNG. Saw myself all over that book. Does detaching allow me to be around other women? At this point, I want to just start living for the moment. Playing it safe in life clearly has helped get me to this point.

Try being around yourself right now.

You admitted to your codependency in not even knowing how to make a decision without it relating your wife's actions or feelings. Take some time on your own to learn this.

If you don't know if you want the divorce to go forward or backwards why would you be dating other women? Because it feels good? Will it feel good for these women when you are from emotionally ready to be dating?

Date yourself for a while. focus on your S and yourself. You are going through a complicated emotional time. Do you really need anything else in the mix?

I am not one of those people who think you should wait a year after divorce to begin to date. You should date when you KNOW your M is over, you are in a personal healthy space, and you are ready to be a good partner to someone else. Is that where you are now? I don't think so according to your postings.

I don't thin you understand detaching. Deatching isn't "ignoring" or " not caring" your ability to detach is mutually exclusive from being around other women.

Detaching is not attaching your actions and feelings to that of someone elses.

I think you really need to handle what's in front of you before you try handing a relationship outside of your M.

Quote:

Does detaching allow me to be around other women?

Ginger,

I hear what your saying. At the moment I have no intent on starting a new relationship. But since my MR is currently a one sided open relationship, I wonder if having sex with someone who has the same understanding be acceptable at this point? Seems to be the opposite of my MNG mentality.

Tread, what does your moral compass tell you about what's acceptable?

Can you do it and get away with it? Probably. But how will you feel about yourself afterwards?

I've been struggling with NGS myself. It's about becoming a more confident, self-respecting, and honest version of YOURSELF. I haven't seen anything in the program about just doing everything the opposite way.

Holding,

That is what confuses me. Being an MNG would have me not even consider doing that. Therefore denying my own needs in the name if some moral code of mine. Which in turn hurts me in some way subconsciously. The moral compass is part of the MNG, which is why I am now questioning many of my life choices. I would assume that a lot of people would say screw this woman and live their own lives to the fullest until the WW decided to return.

One would assume that the LBS would be resentful if the WW did return after having their fun with God knows who. And here you're willing to move on and forgive without having a chance to do your own thing. While they had the chance to get it all out if their system.

Tread, tread, tread! Not being a MNG does not mean compromising your moral compass!

If banging some chick is something you find morally acceptable for YOU, then go ahead. Not being a MNG is more about doing what you find morally acceptable for yourself, not for what others find morally acceptable.

What you should question is how your actions are based upon everyone around you. That's not to say don't be considerate of others.

For example for me, it is not morally acceptable to use someone else for my selfish needs. Living your like to the fullest doesn't mean using other people for your wants. That would make me feel worse. Living my life to the fullest would be doing the things I desire that align with my values that don't hurt other people.

I was a Ms. Nice Girl. It wasn't because I wanted to make everyone happy for THEM. It's because I was conflict avoidant, I had no self-esteem, and I figure if I compromise myself to make others happy people won't leave me. Being a MNG is not a selfless act because your moral compass is so great.

And for the love of God, stop making your decisions on what she might be doing or the way she is living her life. You really think you would be resentful because she got to bang guys and you didn't get to bang other chicks? That's not a reason for resentment.

Do what feels RIGHT for you. And well, if your desires and your moral compass truly feel it's right to screw this woman, then do it. No one is telling you not to, it's a decision you need to make for yourself that align with your values.

Ginger,

Apparently I am a MNG based in the fact that I am willing to put my W ahead of my own needs. Found $100 bill a few months back. My first thought was what can W and I do with this money. It never occurred to me for a second to spend all that money on myself. That is the type of thing that makes me a MNG. I have questioned my moral compass quite a bit in recent months. And after reading the MNG book, I feel that it might be time to step away from my moral compass a bit.

Probably won't go looking to sleep around while in this MR. But if it comes to an end. I certainly won't be looking for the next Mrs. Tread. My moral compass is about taking care of others needs first and foremost. I need to seriously readjust my morals a bit to focus more on myself ahead of others.

[quote=Tread]Ginger,

Apparently I am a MNG based in the fact that I am willing to put my W ahead of my own needs.

actually this ^^^sounds biblical, if you read St Paul. It's also what 90% wives and parents do for their h's and children.

Please don't misunderstand the MNG book or misuse some parts of it to justify being a jerk now, all in the name of "fixing" yourself.

Found $100 bill a few months back. My first thought was what can W and I do with this money. It never occurred to me for a second to spend all that money on myself.

That is the type of thing that makes me a MNG.

OMG!!

you'd have been a selfish jerk to just think of yourself. (Who would do that??)

The MNG is being very misunderstood and I do think it's frequently twisted around this site.

Not sure why

[quote=Tread]Ginger,

Apparently I am a MNG based in the fact that I am willing to put my W ahead of my own needs. Found $100 bill a few months back. My first thought was what can W and I do with this money.

to me, this^^ is normal healthy married behavior.

Tread -- in your very first post you wrote that your W started an affair with her sister's cousin. Do you mean her half-sister's cousin? And so the man and your W are not biologically related, are they?

AS/Gordie -- there are reasons why WW/MLC's do what they do. They are hard, if not impossible know, at times but things happened in their lives to bring them there. They might be acting irrationally but something brought them to this point in their lives.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Ginger,

Apparently I am a MNG based in the fact that I am willing to put my W ahead of my own needs. Found $100 bill a few months back. My first thought was what can W and I do with this money. It never occurred to me for a second to spend all that money on myself. That is the type of thing that makes me a MNG.

I do not see how this makes you a MNG.
I feel that the fact that you think of what wife and you do with the money is not putting your W's needs before yours. I feel disturbed when you even think its sacrifice that you spend it together with wife. There is no sacrifice there because you are enjoying it too. I think the problem comes when you consider normal things as favours to wife when in actual fact these are normal things. As a married couple it is normal to do things together and put the needs of your other before yours. Generally speaking this is a concept not understaood by majority of H and it frustrates the wife.

Originally Posted By: Tread

My moral compass is about taking care of others needs first and foremost. I need to seriously readjust my morals a bit to focus more on myself ahead of others.

I think that you need to sit and look at your character flows and try to read more on this subject. I feel that there is nothing wrong with taking care of yourself. I feel that sometimes we tend to paint ourselves positively too much. Looking at what your partner complained about as your flaws , what friends and family say will give us a more accurate picture of what we do. That way you get a more objective look at what you do right and what you need to work on.

ForGump,

You are correct. W and SIL have different fathers, but we're raised together. No relation biologically, but the man is married with children. SIL was actually just finally getting to know her side of the family. And W decided to be selfish on the family cruise.

Lovelyp,

I have been working on those flaws. But from what I read in the MNG book, it seems as if I need to start addressing the issues of focusing more on my own needs. And stop worrying about my W. Seems to be what everyone is telling me here. Which is classic MNG.

What 25 and Lovely P wrote you is something you really need to focus on.

Thinking of others is not a MNG trait. it's a kind human being trait. If I found $100 I'd take my friends or daughter out to dinner and buy my daughter something special.

I baked an apple pie the other night. Apple pie is my ex's favorite. I brought him and OWW a piece at my D's football game. It was not at the detriment of myself, it was attached to no expectations, it was just a kind gesture.

Yes, MNG says you should focus on yourself more. Not to stop nice kind behaviors. It's when we do things for others and it is to the detriment of ourselves. Doing nice things for others shouldn't hurt us. It's when we attach expectations to them that they do. or when we neglect our own to fill another's.

When we say don't worry about your W, we mean you worry too much about what she does and why she does it. That has nothing to do with MNG.

Like LovelyP said, it you shouldn't find kind acts which are normal as a sacrifice.

You use others to guide your actions too much. If you didn't use others, I would hope your intentions and actions would still be kind acts. because that's what you want to do. Not because they make you some sort of martyr. They shouldn't feel like a sacrifice.

You've got some digging deep to do.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Apparently I am a MNG based in the fact that I am willing to put my W ahead of my own needs.

I assume when you are calling yourself a MNG you are doing it in the context of the book NMMNG? If so then I'm wondering if you've read it, or understood what you read. Because the premise of the book is that NG's are NOT nice. They do NOT put others' needs before their own. They only pretend to put others' needs before their own to get what THEY want, and they do it in the sneakiest, most passive/aggressive ways possible.

Quote:

Found $100 bill a few months back. My first thought was what can W and I do with this money. It never occurred to me for a second to spend all that money on myself. That is the type of thing that makes me a MNG.

You are most definitely not understanding NGS. NGS would be "woah, 100 bucks, I'll tell W I'm going to take her out to dinner and then she'll HAVE to give me the sex I haven't had in weeks." Then when you don't get the sex you expect after the dinner, you mope around all evening and every time she asks what's wrong you say "nothing". Later she is putting dishes away and you yell at her for making too much noise, but you're really yelling at her because you are mad you didn't get sex. THAT is NGS. There's nothing good or nice about it, other than the fake "hey I'm just a nice guy!" facade.

Quote:

I have questioned my moral compass quite a bit in recent months. And after reading the MNG book, I feel that it might be time to step away from my moral compass a bit.

If you have NGS then your moral compass is all screwed up and needs to be reevaluated as part of the reform process.

Quote:

My moral compass is about taking care of others needs first and foremost.

Is it? Or is it to take care of others' needs because you want something? Are your motivations selfish or selfless? I'm not asking you to answer, just to dig deep and work through that. I did, and discovered some nasty truths about myself (that book was a real eye-opener). I'm mostly reformed from NGS but it's still a work in progress.

AnotherStander,

I don't fit every example in the book. But I did find myself falling into the example of not asking for what I really want. I don't things for my W with expectations. But lately I have found myself bitter that my W is probably spreading her legs for men who haven't done 5 percent of what I have. I did those things with no expectations. But now I am wondering if I was a damn fool for doing so. W left this MR, because apparently I wasn't doing enough. But yet lays up with men who won't even give her a lift home. So yes I do feel foolish and used.

Which is why my W still called me a few weeks ago asking for a ride. And I came to the rescue with no expectations. Which folks on this forum told me that I shouldn't have done that for her. This whole experience is making me want to go to a version of myself that would have been moved on from this nonsense. My W probably would have been returned to that version of me, because that person simply didn't give a damn.

At the moment, I just need to reevaluate a lot of things with myself. And most important what I will no longer entertain. Also it occurs to me that we're plab B if the WS returns. They typically have their revelations when things go to hell for them. They come back apologizing, but that is only due to their plans falling apart. If I am confused about this please let me know.

Originally Posted By: Tread

But I did find myself falling into the example of not asking for what I really want.

Yeah that's definitely a big part of NGS. In my new R I've turned that around and it's amazing how when you ask for what you want, you mostly GET what you want

Quote:

But lately I have found myself bitter that my W is probably spreading her legs for men who haven't done 5 percent of what I have. I did those things with no expectations. But now I am wondering if I was a damn fool for doing so.

Why? How is that a reflection on you? That's a reflection on who SHE is, not you. Who is the fool in that scenario? Seems pretty obvious.

Quote:

Which is why my W still called me a few weeks ago asking for a ride. And I came to the rescue with no expectations. Which folks on this forum told me that I shouldn't have done that for her.

But did you really have no expectations? That's the key. If you can do that for her and not care if she thanks you, or drive's to someone's house to sleep with them, or whatever, THEN it's OK to do that. But if you do it and then later say "I was a damn fool" well then THAT indicates that you had some kind of expectation. I used to volunteer for Hearts and Hammers. Some of the younger people would complain about how the homeowners never helped or even thanked anyone. I would tell them that they need to reevaluate why they were doing volunteer work, because if you're doing it for praise or rewards of some kind then you'll be disappointed every time. You have to do it BECAUSE IT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO. Nothing more, nothing less. That is personal integrity, when you can do something for someone and walk away feeling good about yourself no matter what they said or did in response, even if it was nothing.

Quote:

They come back apologizing, but that is only due to their plans falling apart. If I am confused about this please let me know.

That does happen sometimes, and usually when it does then the recon is a false one and doesn't last long. But sometimes the LBS walks away and the WAS realizes what they lost and comes back remorseful and truly repentant. Those are the recons that stand the best chance of lasting.

Tread, you are understandably VERY UPSET about the choices your W has made. It seems you're running on anger right now (I TOTALLY know how that feels).

But I feel like you want to even the score. You may regret that down the road. It's almost like you're asking for permission: "Hey, can I be totally immoral now, since W did?"

No one can tell you what to do here. You know what's right, and you know what you want. Be honest with yourself, act with integrity, and be authentic.

AnotherStander,

Never had an expectation for helping her out. But afterwards folks were looking at me like I was crazy for doing so. Asking me why didn't whoever she is laid up with picking her up. Started feelig pretty dam foolish after that. Like I am good enough to use even though she goes around claiming that I do nothing for her. Nobody likes the feeling of jumping through hoops whem the next man sits back and doesn't lift a finger. Why would she expect more from the guys she uses for sex, if I do all the serious stuff.

All I am saying is that I need to put a stop to that. Why would she return to the MR if things are this good for her? She actually needs to lose the benefots of being with me. And see what dealing with these other guys is truly like.

Holding,

This has nothing to do with evening the score. It's about sitting back and trying to enjoy life. But yet I have these limitations. At this moment I am seriously questioning what morality even means to the MR at this point. I am literally in a open MR right now. And only one of us is benefiting from it.

So enjoying life means going having a one night stand, then go ahead. Just be sure not to hurt that that person.

No one is holding you back from enjoying your life.

It's not about a one night stand. But if the opportunity arises, I shouldn't be thinking that this would be wrong to do behind my W back.

Do not do things out of anger. If you are in that mood you get the opportunity and feel worse afterwards. I was in that mode when I ended up having a one night stand with a person who I find very unattractive and it made things worse for me. I have so much pain and everyday I replay that and think of how I could have avoided that. I also think of risks and what could have been. It added to my depression and things went downhill mentally.

So I left IC a few hours ago. IC thinks it's time to throw in the towel and move on. She feels that I deserve so much better. Ran into W old IC who asked how things were going. After explaining everything she pretty much suggested the same. I know that she wants to probably tell me what took place in their session but can't by law. So she just gives me these sad looks. But she told me that I need to look out for myself and S14. Any thoughts?

Very rough my friend. No real thoughts. The common advice here is to detach, take care of your kids and GAL.

Stick with it

T....it rides with you. What do you want to do? Do you feel you have clarity?

Tread, you seem like a nice guy, but also an angry one. I think it would help you to work on your anger before you make any big decisions. Just my impression, could be wrong.

Originally Posted By: Tread

IC thinks it's time to throw in the towel and move on.

What does this mean to you?

How will your actions/thoughts be different after this?

Originally Posted By: Tread

IC thinks it's time to throw in the towel and move on.

Tread,

That actually kinda-sorta sounds like DB; you work on yourself, detach and build a future for yourself and your children. Asta la vista baby. It doesn't mean that you have to take immediate legal action.

Bigbiz,

Definitely going to stick with those method. S14 is going to be staying with W for a weekbstarying tonight, so I some GAL activities in mind.

Joseph,

Clarity is tough I suppose. Gave my W the divorce papers my lawyer sent me for her to sign 4 weeks ago. Still no word in regards to that. Put it out if mind that W may have been having second thoughts. She claimed she wanted the divorce, Simone would think she would have been quick to sign. W IC who she hadn't seen since March let slip out that it sounds she was still being manipulative.

OwnIt,

Actually I am quite calm and controlled. I do my my venting in here to avoid saying anything to crazy in the world...LOL. But I read an anger management book earlier this year about defensive anger that described me perfectly. And I made 180s in that regards. My frustration right now is feeling like a fool. Especially when friends and family are at the point of telling that it's time to move on. Any staying married to W at this point is in me.

Kaizen,

It means moving on from this MR. My brother and his W were had a very dysfunctional MR. They separated moving to different states. She had a boyfriend and he had several women. My brother was definitely the WH in this situation. 1.5 years later they got back together. And they are so much better this time around. So I told myself after BD if these two of all people can make it work. Then we can definitely work on this MR.

Which is why I am hesitant to ask W abiut the divorce papers. Because she maybe having second thoughts. Not to mention that would lead to R talks. But I hate being in limbo. Separationcan mean different things to people. For me it's sitting here working on myself avoiding temptation. For W it could be dating and sleeping with anyone she wants. Seeing if someone better is out there for her. And if not, then plan B it is. So I wonder if this some kind of break period should I be trying to see if there is someone better for myself? Is W my possible plan B, even though she isn't really W material at this moment? So there is still a lot to think about. But I do know is that I hate waiting and being unproductive. I want tobse this time to know more about myself in all aspects.

Originally Posted By: Tread

It means moving on from this MR. My brother and his W were had a very dysfunctional MR. They separated moving to different states. She had a boyfriend and he had several women. My brother was definitely the WH in this situation. 1.5 years later they got back together. And they are so much better this time around. So I told myself after BD if these two of all people can make it work. Then we can definitely work on this MR.

Which is why I am hesitant to ask W abiut the divorce papers. Because she maybe having second thoughts. Not to mention that would lead to R talks. But I hate being in limbo. Separationcan mean different things to people. For me it's sitting here working on myself avoiding temptation. For W it could be dating and sleeping with anyone she wants. Seeing if someone better is out there for her. And if not, then plan B it is. So I wonder if this some kind of break period should I be trying to see if there is someone better for myself? Is W my possible plan B, even though she isn't really W material at this moment? So there is still a lot to think about. But I do know is that I hate waiting and being unproductive. I want tobse this time to know more about myself in all aspects.

So the only thing you see that would be fundamentally DIFFERENT between throwing in the towel vs. not is dating someone else? Is that what you mean by "productive"?

How about you make yourself plan A for some time and not try to find if someone else is out there for you? Date yourself for a while.

Ginger and Kaizen,

At this I feel I should be plan A. But W won't acknowledge that until things blow up in her face. Then she will look at her plan B who she'll realize was plan A all along. I have no issue dating myself for awhile. Right now I am really trying to figure out what type of characteristic a woman that I want at this point? Guess I am not really interested in dating. But I would like to hang out with different types of women just to see what I would like at this point. I was married at 21. So my views at 37 is quite a bit different than they were.

T...it doesn't sound like you truly want a D and maybe you did it to get a reaction out of your W. If you really don't want one then don't reach out and leave her alone. If on the other hand you have complete 100% non-emotional clarity on the sitch then proceed, reach out and engage with the D talks. Put pressure on her etc. Only you can answer that question for yourself.

I agree with K and G......if your only barrier is dating other women you can't put that on the back burner until you have seen your current sitch through to completion? Is this the only way you can move on with your life? Is this the only way you can find peace and happiness?

Your a young man T with a long life ahead of you what is some more time in the grand scheme of things? I would just encourage you to make sure you can look back with no regrets.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Ginger and Kaizen,

At this I feel I should be plan A. But W won't acknowledge that until things blow up in her face. Then she will look at her plan B who she'll realize was plan A all along. I have no issue dating myself for awhile. Right now I am really trying to figure out what type of characteristic a woman that I want at this point? Guess I am not really interested in dating. But I would like to hang out with different types of women just to see what I would like at this point. I was married at 21. So my views at 37 is quite a bit different than they were.

This does not come from hanging out with other women. This comes from getting to know yourself independent of your W.

Stop worrying about whether she thinks you are plan X Y or Z and get to know who you are independent of her. The kind of women who is for you follows after that.

being married since 21 is hard. you are in this place where she still is a factor in your personal decisions and you are ready to see what woman meshes with you when you don't even really know who the true you is independent of being your W's H.

Joseph,

Dating other women isn't required to move on. Just wondering what type of women I would be interested in. During this whole finding myself process, I have eliminated friends who were no good and added some good people in my life. So I look at dating somewhat like that, just trying to figure out who I want to deal with. But I am in no rush to date. Though if the opportunity happens, then it's something to consider.

You are right about me not being sure about this divorce. Probably has tobdobwuth my indecisiveness more than anything. I was all for it, but in this small corner in the back of mind, I have doubts. But for all I know that might just be fear of moving on. My indecisiveness is the reason I have no tats, even though I want one. I feel I will regret it within a week....lol

Ginger,

I haven't thought indepently at any time as an adult. Dated W as a teen and looked out for her best interest ever since. Being separated has helped me actually get back to what I was like prior to getting married, so there has been some good. Guess the biggest issue I am having lately is people asking me what are you doing in regards to divorcing W. I try staying cool, but it gets to you after a while with folks wondering what am I waiting for in regards to her.

Originally Posted By: Ginger1

you are in this place where she still is a factor in your personal decisions and you are ready to see what woman meshes with you when you don't even really know who the true you is independent of being your W's H.

Exactly.

You are talking about throwing in the towel...but Im not sure what that means for you. Filing for divorce? Sure. Fine. Knock yourself out. I dont really see how that would change your life any. So what are these counselors suggesting that you DO?

My guess? Detach and GAL.

Same things weve been saying to you for months.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Guess the biggest issue I am having lately is people asking me what are you doing in regards to divorcing W. I try staying cool, but it gets to you after a while with folks wondering what am I waiting for in regards to her.

Why do you have to be 'waiting' for anything?

You are standing by your commitment. What does that have to do with her?

Originally Posted By: Tread

I was all for it, but in this small corner in the back of mind, I have doubts.

I suggest you wait until this doubt is gone. You haven't wanted this from the start, so doing it now when you're not ready may haunt you later.

When the doubt is gone, you will know.

Kaizen,

I have been GAL and detaching. But the counselors are pretty much along the lines of cut ties with this woman andvcomplerelt move on. Saying that I deserve to find a good woman out there. Not tomorrow, but as long as I am committed to W the longer that pushes that back.

As for commitment, I thinkbthat is ginebat the moment. Hence the reason for strongly considering the divorce. Looking at TxHubby sitch. He waited until it got to the point where he just said he'll with it, I want to be happy. A WW will always be the elephant in the room even when everything in your life is going great. They only part of my life right now that isn't good is my MR. All ither aspects has seriously improved. And I have plans going into 2018 to make it even better.

Holding,

Thanks for the advice. It makes sense, but I often wonder if that is just the fear of completely letting go. Apparently through the experience, I have abandonment issues that I had no clue about.

Originally Posted By: Tread

But the counselors are pretty much along the lines of cut ties with this woman and completely move on.

What I am asking you is what that means beyond what you are already trying to do?

Filing for divorce? Like I said. Go ahead. I still dont see how that piece of paper changes anything for your emotional state.

Originally Posted By: Tread

He waited until it got to the point where he just said he'll with it, I want to be happy.

Will being divorced make you happy?

I think you said you are indecisive.

I have seen that as a theme throughout your posts. it's like you can't make a decision on your own because you are afraid of doing the wrong thing. You can't rely on others to make your decisions. You may be wrong sometimes and that is ok. You learn from it and move on. Take responsibility and accountability for your decisions.

See, this is part of learning to be an independent adult. You can't look to others for these decisions. Trust yourself.

Kaizen,

Not sure if divorce would make me happy. But it helps with moving on from what I hear. Never been divorced, so I honestly Can't say if it would or not.

Ginger,

Most of the time, I have no issues with making major decisions. Just things that I know I would seriously regret if it turned out wrong. I made the decision to get the lawyer draw up the paperwork. Sent it to W and then no response from her. Which has me now wondering what the deal is.

The waiting is what had your mind wondering once you made a decision. You start thinking is there something in play going on. Is this God finally answering a prayer? Is W simply being manipulative? Most of the time I am good just GAL and detaching. But it is these moments where you wonder what the next move is. Does my MR require me to be more patient? And if so what is time limit on patients. I assume I could wait another year. But wouldn't that simply standing still if nothing progresses?

Originally Posted By: Tread

Kaizen,

Does my MR require me to be more patient? And if so what is time limit on patients. I assume I could wait another year. But wouldn't that simply standing still if nothing progresses?

I think everyone has tried to ask you this in a million ways and we have tried to answer this in a million different ways.

If your actual divorce doesn't progress and you don't get the papers to make it legal, why would you stand still mean? What does progressing mean? The only thing that may change due to whatever you may believe is dating. but dating right now I personally think is a bad idea for you.

Why would you stand still with your life if you do not file for D?

And for the record. You may GAL, but you are soooooo far from detached.

T...to add I am 5 months in and I know that I am not completely detached. I am getting there each day but IMO it is a process and not a light switch. For me detachment is a constant work in progress.

I think the point is that you can move on with your life in many ways without your W being involved. Can you do that?

IMO having a piece of paper in your hand should not help you move on. You can start mentally doing that now by accepting that your MR is over and technically you are already D'd.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Is W simply being manipulative?

So why did you have the L draw up paperwork and send it to W if you arent going to see it through? THAT sounds manipulative to me. Like you are hoping/expecting tat maybe the paperwork will cause her mind to change.

Let's say you filed the paperwork this instant and you were divorced. What SPECIFICALLY would be different in your situation?

Ginger,

So what is the point if staying married if your spouse is out just fooling around? No one saidna thing about standing still without a divorce. But people did do get divorced for a reason. And I would assume that constant infidelity would be a reason. Divorce to me means completely moving on. At this point, even detached you still leave yourself open to hope.

Joseph,

Divorce is legally cutting ties to this person who is bringing me down financially as well.

Kaizen,

It would honestly be no different. Other than free to do what want morally and save myself from W financial mistakes. And truly start over without these organizations telling me "Sorry but your still married, so we can't do a thing for you."

The plan was very much to see it through. Figured W would sign quick, since she swears that is what she wants. Now this is in limbo as well. And as time went on I naturally wondered what the deal was. It was never my intent to change her mind with the paperwork. I was willing to let her go and move on.

Originally Posted By: Tread

It would honestly be no different.

So why do you need to be divorced to 'move on'?

Originally Posted By: Tread

Other than free to do what want morally

You have your own moral compass so follow it.
My marriage/relationship doesnt define my morals - I do based on what I believe in.

Originally Posted By: Tread

and save myself from W financial mistakes.

If this is truly a concern, then you should see the divorce through. You could certainly be liable for her spending now.

Originally Posted By: Tread

The plan was very much to see it through. Figured W would sign quick, since she swears that is what she wants. Now this is in limbo as well. And as time went on I naturally wondered what the deal was. It was never my intent to change her mind with the paperwork. I was willing to let her go and move on.

So you only want to get divorced because she did? Now that shes not signing it, youre pausing because she might not want the divorce?

Im sorry but that doesnt make sense with what you are saying above.

Letting her go means letting her go. Being wishy washy about whether or not to push through the papers shows her that your filing was a 'tactic' to check her temperature.

Kaizen,

The point of the papers wasn't because she wanted it. I just figured she would have been quick to sign since she wanted it. At that point, I was tired of her sh*t and wanted to move on. It was not a tactic, but I do feel that her waiting might be a test to see if it was a tactic. Now I did pause, because there might be a sign that she didn't want it. But honestly I want just push on with it anyways.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Not sure if divorce would make me happy. But it helps with moving on from what I hear. Never been divorced, so I honestly Can't say if it would or not.

It's been a year since BD so you are likely getting to the point where you can decide if that's what you want without letting emotions (anger/ fear or whatever) cloud your judgment. Divorce itself isn't going to make you happy, but it could very well help you to move on and become happy. Personally, leading up to D I hated the thought of going through with it and was convinced I would be really depressed and sad afterwards, but when I walked out of court and drove off I just felt relief, like a great weight had been lifted off of me. It was no longer hanging over my head like a dark cloud, and the financial implications were no longer vague and undefined. It's like that saying "Better The Devil You Know Than The Devil You Don't", right?

AnotherStander,

That is exactly how I feel. Not sure if I will be skipping or doing cart wheels out of court. But it opens up a new chapter. Its not a fear of losing her, but rather a fear of doing something to push her away when she might be starting to lean more in my direction. Just trying not to be a screw up I suppose.

Well I talked with my parents tonight. And they brought up two things that I really hadn't thought about.

1. That I have no family whatsoever in this city. I helped move my MIL and SIL down here years ago. So I have the sole responsibility of raising this S14 on my own every other week. Whereas W has the constant help of SIL and MIL. S14 mentions that the four of them are constantly together when he is with his mother. So W isn't really having to deal with being a single parent on her end. Needless to say that my parents are proud how I have been handling things on my end.

2. My parents are pissed about the fact that I haven't heard a single word from my in laws at all. Once I thought about it, I haven't heard a word from my MIL and SIL since they came over with the Uhaul to clean this place out. Haven't heard from my FIL or BIL even longer. One would assume that they would have at least checked on me to see how I was handling things considering they know what W has done and continues to do. I admit that I was a bit pissed once that was brought up by parents. The thought of being kicked to the curb by people you have spent years helping.

Not expecting them to take a side. But it would be nice to know that they cared enough to see if I didn't have some mental breakdown. Right now it just further proves what my parents have told me for years. That they are nothing but users and will cut me off the moment they have no use for you. A lot of life lessons that I will take from this sitch. One being to become closer to my own family. Another lesson is that if there is an R. Keep these people at a far distance. SIL and MIL spent way too much time at our home. I would have their time around this home at a bare minimum.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Right now it just further proves what my parents have told me for years. That they are nothing but users and will cut me off the moment they have no use for you.

Your parents have been saying this for years?

I wonder how that sort of disdain impacted your R.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Keep these people at a far distance. SIL and MIL spent way too much time at our home. I would have their time around this home at a bare minimum.

I dont really know what you expect from them based on the current situation. You say you dont expect them to take sides....but I do --> HER side.

Kaizen,

It played a role in the MR. My parents spent less time visiting, because they didn't feel welcomed by my W. Plus my W would make little slick comments on occasion. And my father doesn't play that. So he would say something back. And she would play victim. I spent quite a bit of time playing peacemaker. But W had no problem having her family coming to constantly visit and us trying to get them set up in this city for better job opportunities. And my parents have actually helped us out on a occasion.

My W got into with my SIL, which resulted in my brother and I not speaking from 2/15 until 12/16. Not because we were mad at each, but because we took the side of our wives. All because my W ran her damn mouth. So my parents were pissed about that as well. But I stood by my W and defended. And while doing so, she is out there cheating.

Nobody is asking for them to take sides. But don't act like I don't exist either. My brother and his W were separated for over a year. My family didn't pretend she never existed. They stayed in contact, even asked if she needed anything. So when they got back together there were really no hard feelings. My W family have treated me as if I was the one out sleeping around with someone else's spouse. So if a R was to happen. Things will not go back to the way they were between me and them.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Kaizen,

It played a role in the MR. My parents spent less time visiting, because they didn't feel welcomed by my W. Plus my W would make little slick comments on occasion. And my father doesn't play that. So he would say something back. And she would play victim. I spent quite a bit of time playing peacemaker. But W had no problem having her family coming to constantly visit and us trying to get them set up in this city for better job opportunities. And my parents have actually helped us out on a occasion.

My W got into with my SIL, which resulted in my brother and I not speaking from 2/15 until 12/16. Not because we were mad at each, but because we took the side of our wives. All because my W ran her damn mouth. So my parents were pissed about that as well. But I stood by my W and defended. And while doing so, she is out there cheating.

Nobody is asking for them to take sides. But don't act like I don't exist either. My brother and his W were separated for over a year. My family didn't pretend she never existed. They stayed in contact, even asked if she needed anything. So when they got back together there were really no hard feelings. My W family have treated me as if I was the one out sleeping around with someone else's spouse. So if a R was to happen. Things will not go back to the way they were between me and them.

Well, this looks like something maybe you can work on. instead of blocking out future in laws, how about you examine why you took sides and didn't speak, rather than agree that there is beef between the two of them, and you and your brother should maintain the integrity of your R.

You play the blame game a lot. You blame your W for a lot of your external problems/R's. A great learning experience is how you could have handled things differently to maybe change the outcome for yourself a little.

Your W's cheating isn't your fault. But you need to really look inward. This is the best opportunity you'll ever have to do so. Many don't get that opportunity. I am so grateful for the chance to look at ME and see how I could change the outcome and situations without just reacting to what's going on around me.

We both took sides out of loyalty for our wives. Maintaining peace in the home with wives who in our belief takes priority over even family. W was mad at the fact that I even wanted to work it. Even when I was clearly on her side. But I own up to that one. Should have just been a man and told W that I would fix things regardless if it upset her.

As for the blame in the R, I have mentioned my wrongs. But the issue brought up was the issues between my W and my parents. So I explained. To be honest, I am not sure how I could have handled things differently. W feels that she can day and do things with zero consequences. And my family in general have no problem checking disrespect. They all loved each other at first. But as time went along certain disagreements came about.

Trust me, I have looked inward. But at the end of the day, I am not taking the blame for W actions. I have no intent on blocking them out. But the R with the in laws won't be the same. No more saving their a** like before. There are just certain people who aren't good for you. And need to just keep at a certain distance. Knew they were users, but I seriously considered them to be family.

Originally Posted By: Tread

We both took sides out of loyalty for our wives. Maintaining peace in the home with wives who in our belief takes priority over even family. W was mad at the fact that I even wanted to work it. Even when I was clearly on her side. But I own up to that one. Should have just been a man and told W that I would fix things regardless if it upset her.

Noooooo, I think you were both scared of your wives. I can probably bet on that one. You had nothing to workout between your Wife and SIL and neither did your brother. That was for them. To not to talk to your own blood to keep peace in the house might be something you would want to do differently one day. And no, you didn't need to fix things. The only thing you needed to fix was the R between you and your bro.

When I was pregnant, my crazy ex SIL went NUTS on me. Mean, vicious, lied about a whole bunch of stuff and was downright cruel. I expected my ex to stand up for me, because he knew the stuff she said was unfounded and downright wrong and he knows she is nuts. I refused to talk to her, but I didn't stop him from having an R with her. As long as he stood up for me. When I had the baby, she wanted to reach out when she found out about the early delivery, baby in the NICU. ect. I wsn't ready. I approached her when I was ready. But he still spoke to his sister. (and guess, what, they haven't spoke in years over something with their mother. I was way out of the picture when that happened).

it's something to definitely think about for the future

As for the blame in the R, I have mentioned my wrongs. But the issue brought up was the issues between my W and my parents. So I explained. To be honest, I am not sure how I could have handled things differently. W feels that she can day and do things with zero consequences. And my family in general have no problem checking disrespect. They all loved each other at first. But as time went along certain disagreements came about.

Trust me, I have looked inward. But at the end of the day, I am not taking the blame for W actions. I have no intent on blocking them out. But the R with the in laws won't be the same. No more saving their a** like before. There are just certain people who aren't good for you. And need to just keep at a certain distance. Knew they were users, but I seriously considered them to be family.

nope, don't take blame for your wife's actions. Not telling you to do that. But look at your reactions to situations. Evaluate them very closely.

Originally Posted By: Kaizen

You say you dont expect them to take sides....but I do --> HER side.

Exactly right. When it comes to BD, S and D, the old adage "blood is thicker than water" applies. Families will rally around blood relatives and shun the LBS NO MATTER WHAT. Your W could be the most insane, raving lunatic siren to ever cast a shadow on God's green earth and still her relatives will cluster around her in a defensive formation. This is NORMAL Tread. You shouldn't expect otherwise, no matter how great your previous relationship with your in-laws was.

AnotherStander,

Perhaps I just come from a different group of people. Didn't think anything really abiut until my mither brought it up. These folks won't return a phone call. And My FIL was crying about me not getting him involved for advice. Now he is afraid to answer the phone. My father confronted him in Wal-Mart a month ago. Asked why he was ducking my calls. FIL said he Didn't want to get involved. Father told him to stop walking around telling everyone I won't come to him when he is simply afraid to tell his daughter she is wrong.

The craziest part is that that my father works in Wal-Mart with my BIL. Both work in the grocery aisles next to each other. My father treats my BIL as if he was one of his own children. But our MR has been elephant in the room and they just avoid all conversation dealing with W and I. But my father has been upset that BIL has ducked my calls as well. But I told father not to bring it up.

So today was a tough day at work. Got one of those jobs that can really get to you some days. The first thing that came to my mind was wanting to talk to W about it. So much for trying to be completely detached. Tough when your W was actually your best friend, before there was even a relationship. Which only reminded me that I am coming up on a year of DB. Over the past couple of months on this forum, I received some great advice. At times confusing but enlightening.

Perhaps I jumped the gun getting a lawyer and getting the divorce papers put together. Seemed like a good idea at the time. A way of growing the balls to simply move on. But today I recalled that my boundary was to give it a year if W wasn't messing around with OM. That I would be patient, while she we both dealt with this whole thing. Not sure if OM is still in the picture, but it seems as if W has moved onto potential OM2. Only confirms what I figured out about a little over 2 months ago. That this likely has nothing to do with me.

Like everyone else, I jumped through all the hoops giving my W everything she complained about after DB. We even continued to have sex more than before DB. Which I am certain she enjoyed. But it seemed that with me doing everything to please her, she would still contact OM. A man who contributed nothing to her life whatsoever. Which only made me doubt myself. The feeling of doing everything possible, but yet it simply was not enough. Even as I was losing weight and getting into shape, it still seemed not to be enough. OM was overweight and getting even bigger, but yet there was still this obsession that I simply could not understand.

And then there is potential OM2. Another overweight guy, with a long time girlfriend and three children. Seems like his sniffing around may have finally paid off after W moved out. The guy is clearly scum, but yet W is entertaining this guy. Currently I am in the best shape that I have been in over a decade. And now I'm starting to bulk up with muscle. Not to mention that I have all kinds of fitness goals that go well into 2018. And other things as well. I blamed myself for so long for my MR falling apart, but my W has issues that I have never been able to help resolve. So I accept that there is nothing wrong with myself.

Her weight has gone completely out of control and her friends are dropping like flies, because of her behavior. Friends and family have told me that with my changes I am quite the catch. And to just move on to someone mentally and physically better. But with the detaching I have done, there is still this small part that longs for my W. The part that keeps me from just filing the paperwork, because of some tiny bit of hope that likely doesn't exist. So I am honestly sitting here wondering what the hell is wrong with me? Created a boundary that has clearly been crossed. But yet can't do what is necessary based on the fear of making a mistake in MR that is already dead.

I have always considered myself to be very confident person. But at some point that went down the toilet and the A simply killed my confidence. And almost a year later that confidence has returned. Reading on sitches from people who have divorced on this forum, life clearly gets better. But the unknown is scary and yet I am a bit curious to what the future holds. The only certain thing is that S14 will always be around. And I am definitely glad that he will be returning tomorrow after school. Got a couple of activities planned for us. Not to mention that his has chores waiting for him, starting with cleaning his room...LOL

Tread,

How are you doing? I�m 14 months post b d and have felt many of the same things. W has been back and forth on d but when she decided to go public with OM2 then it was my turn to push the D. I just knew i couldn�t live like this any longer. My d b Coach even told me she may have to D before ever considering R and think she is right. I�m saying that to point out filing for D and wishing to save your M aren�t incompatible, if that makes any sense. Best wishes on making the best choice for you and s14.

So the last day has been interesting. Today after school, I had planned to take S14 tobse e Justice League. W calls me up and mentions that she invited one of S14 friends to come along. Also brings up that she will be meeting us at the movies as well. So W basically just through herself in my plans. Not wanting to argue in front of the boys she had on speakerphone, I simply said okay.

Also the clerk from my lawyers office called me later yesterday. He has been going through the phone records from last month. Mentioned two guys names. I didn't recognize any of the names. But he was laughing telling me to just lool them up in FB. Had no intent on looking them up, but after a few hours I took a look. First guy has to be pushing 50 or at least looks like it. Scrawny with a beer belly and looks like he drinks way too much. Between his first and last name had "boutthismoney". Job is making sandwiches...lol.

The second guy who apparently she has been texting with nonstop is some 24 year old. Goofy looking and according to his own page 6'1" 125lbs...lol. Instead if getting upset, I just wondered why this kid would risk messing with anyone W. Based on what the clerk told me that started contacting each other last month when W attended her friends wedding. That is when I suddenly realized that this kid is the brother of W friend/coworker who recently got ordained and officiated the wedding. My guess, the friend hooked my W up with her brother.

The crazy part is that these folks don't realize that people get seriously hurt over this stuff. But to be honest, I wasn't even that upset. Considered showing up to this kids job and basically just having a man to man conversation. But as I am typing this, I don't even care to do that. I just want to move on. W is basically just entertaining anything with a penis at this point. Some say that I should be happy that her options have been low. But I just feel numb about this all.

So W contacts me on the way to work, asking about S14 dental and vision insurance. I have always covered him under mine, including medical. W suddenly is interested in covering him as well. Now in the divorce paperwork I sent her last month. My lawyer put that I would continue to cover S14. But this always meant that W had to pay me more money in child support. W claims that two forms of insurance will help cover everything. But my question why is she suddenly thinking about this Now? W bas worked in insurance for 3 years now. My guess is that she is trying to lower those child support payments that she is looking at.

Earlier this week, W called me out of the blue talking about she wanted to close the main account we were using to pay joint bills. Still has yet to present me with a plan in regards to the joint bills. So my guess is that W is finally preparing for this divorce. And its time for me to stop playing defensive and just demanded she sign those papers next week.

Just because she's covering more insurance doesn't mean the amount that you pay to support your child would go down much. Really, just by the amount of your copay. But who knows what she's thinking?

Just like you, I would not have been inclined to look up the two guys, but I think the temptation would have been overwhelming.

Jim,

I tried not to look, but the temptation to see what he was laughing about won. Thought about confronting the kid just as a reality check. Far too many people do things thinking they will never get caught. Figured having the husband standing info from of you will make you realize what could easily happen 6you for messing with a man's W. My own father gave me this lesson at 17 when someone W was trying to get me over her house. My dad told me that there are men out there who don't care about your age and will kill over their W. Glad my father did that to me. Because a saw examples of things years after that we a couple of people.

Originally Posted By: Tread

Jim,

I tried not to look, but the temptation to see what he was laughing about won. Thought about confronting the kid just as a reality check. Far too many people do things thinking they will never get caught. Figured having the husband standing info from of you will make you realize what could easily happen 6you for messing with a man's W. My own father gave me this lesson at 17 when someone W was trying to get me over her house. My dad told me that there are men out there who don't care about your age and will kill over their W. Glad my father did that to me. Because a saw examples of things years after that we a couple of people.

you do know your wife doesn't consider you guys married anymore, right? I wouldn't even doubt it if she didn't tell these guys. Or if she said "we are in the process of divorce"

Confronting these guys have no benefit to you. I feel like sometimes you want to relieve your frustration and anger towards your wife on someone else. You want to make someone accountable when the one who is truly in the wrong here is your wife. You are going after the wrong person.

Not worth it.

Ginger,

All the blame is on W. But I come from a family who would confront you whether it's to beat you or just talk. So I am fighting a natural instinct. We believe that if you think your man enough to do something. Then your man enough to get confronted. And we believe that is a huge issue with society. Everybody doesn't feel that there are consequences for their actions. I plan this guy alone.

Tread,

Be careful. Say you guys get in a fight and he calls the cops and says you assaulted him. Even that accusation could have consequences on your d agreement and a judge�s decision on custody of s14.

Gordie,

Every guy thus far has been a big coward when confronted...lol. Have a strong feeling that this kid would piss himself. But your right about being careful, not to get into an altercation. He would likely run into a wall trying to run and claim I pushed him. Probably will just leave the whole thing alone and file for divorce. None of these guys this far has been remotely close to an upgrade for W. Karma is looking real good right now. Just a little stunned that W ordained friend would be cool with little brother hooking up with a married woman.

Of course no upgrades. What type of guys mess around with married women?

Good news and bad news. Ran my first 5K and did great. 27 minutes. Also brought down my time to 8 minutes a mile. So I was feeling great as I returned to town from the run. Then W called about wanting to get the divorce papers notarized and going. I'm sure the sudden motivation has a lot to do with the goofy looking 25 year old she is seeing. FIL will never accept this kid, he is very old school. And my guess is that W will play as if she met this guy after the divorce.

So we decide to meet at my lawyers office on Monday. I also bring up that we need to tell S14. W wants to wait until after the holidays. I say that I want to tell him Sunday, because I am not going to blindside him. Typical WW says that you can talk to S14 about the divorce. So I mention that you just going to put all this on me again. W sighs and agrees that we both will talk with me. At this time, I am reading a work email on my other phone involving a kid. At the time, I mumble under my breath "Is kids name really that important." W suddenly gets mad and says what did you say. I tell her it isn't important. W starts yelling you know what you said. At that moment it hits me that the kids name is the same name as new OM that I apparently am not supposed to know about.

I tell W that I want to focus on our S14 and whatever else isn't important. W continues to get mad and start yelling. I tell W if she is going to yell, then I am going to hang up. W says that I am done with this conversation. She then hangs up. Interesting how she gets caught once again cheating, but is mad at me. But at this point, it isn't even important. Her a** needs to be there at that lawyer Monday to sign these documents. If left to it, I am going to tell S14 the reason I am divorcing his mother. Not giving all the details, but he will know that W is still actively cheating. I promised that I would be honest and truthful about what's going on. Not going back on my word to me. How he reacts will be his right and I will support him regardless.

Tread,

That�s a great time, congratulations.

And yes, get those papers signed and tell s.

How are you celebrating Thanksgiving?

Going out of town to spend Thanksgiving with my parents and brother for the first time in 14 years. This will be the first time my home will not be hosting my in laws.

Tread,

Update buddy!