Old thread (Rebuilding my life #2) Journaling:
I understand your views on the matter. I agree with Ginger too, but I also hope my next partner is someone who can look for the kids if need to go to etc see a doc instead of having to rely on my XW.
So I spend the morning being responsible for my D's practise (with one mom) and it was fun! I don't know why I haven't done that previously. I am amazed how much more social I can be if I really want to. We laughed a lot.
Do I feel sad for my marriage? Yes, but I think I'm really approaching the point where I can see the bright future properly, and this feels different than previously. I spent some time reading statistics and other posts elsewhere in the Internet and it truly opened my mind to step into XWs shoes to analyze the marriage she had. I feel empathic for her that she had to do this.
D is here now and we are having super fun. I got her to open up a bit emotionally as she doesn't want to share any of her feelings or issues. She nodded after that it feels good to talk. She's been feeling down since S was born because mom and dad are more with S. Her mood really brightened when I said that it's a phase and told her that she is special to us. I mentioned too that she is a big sis, S is going to keep her as a role model which D really liked to hear. I really hope she can tell me about her feelings going on from here.
Have a good weekend everyone
I admitted a strong reaction to your behavior because I wanted to step back to examine why.
(I'm referring to when your wife asked you on short notice, to take the kids so she could see a doctor.)
Were you at all interested in why I had that reaction? I think you actually that because I had a strong reaction, you would "refuse to discuss it" with me or anyone??
That's really puzzling to me. Maybe I misunderstood.
Okay so Yes I think you made a mistake there. Here is why:
Your wife will always be the mother of your children (and their only mother). Regardless of your marital status, or hers.
When a parent takes ill suddenly, and decides to seek help on a Friday night and ask for help (the "help" being to watch the kids) from the person they are divorcing, it's a big deal. She wasn't asking for you to fix something or lend her money for clothes.
I think she was concerned and maybe afraid. Ending up in the hospital "just for monitoring" is not a small thing. Your minimization of it is something for you to look at perhaps with your IC. It's rationalizing after the fact, like because it turns out that she's not deathly ill, you made a good choice. But I would not use the "ends justify the means' argument with this type of thing. Hence erring on the side of compassion and using this as a great chance to show her a 180. (Even if you have no hope at all, it's okay to step up to the plate. It's not just about getting her back, you know? Sometimes we don't get a payoff for a kind act. That's part of what makes it kind.)
When I was unexpectedly sick and the hospitalized a year ago, I was freaking terrified.
My sisters totally supported me.
My h's failure to show up for me even after I asked, was the single biggest factor in my decision to file for divorce. He did not have my back when I really needed him. He is an MD and justified his absence by saying said he was "monitoring from afar" (and I can only assume he justified this further by the fact that I had siblings caring for me).
Yes I knew we were having problems. Still, his absence showed me something that was a deal breaker.
25,
I get why you feel so strongly towards this particular subject, considering your own history. But I think LC got the message.
DB'ing is damn difficult. We come here for advice and we get a lot of "go dark", "friendly neighbor" "his/her sandbox" "counter intuitive" "not my circus" "no pursuit" etc. You get the picture. This is confusing..
It is hard when you have been dumped like yesterdays newspaper to be friendly towards the XW. Particular when there is a third party involved. We probably on some level want to be friendly but on the other hand, we do not like to be taken advantage of. We are guys. We have something called dignity. We already lost enough didn't we?
So it's a fine line we are walking here. And sometimes we slip up. I'm 100 percent sure every one here is there for their kids. And will do everything for them. But when it comes to the XW we might panic whenever there is a possibility to do a 180 or whatever. This appeared to be a thing for the XW, not for the kids. I know she is the mother of the children. But that's it... We got fired from the other job, you know.
My XW is currently "just" the mother of my kids. And if it's obvious that something I do for her will benefit the kids more than it does her, I do it. The other way around, not so sure.. Maybe I'm a jerk. Maybe if you go find OM before you leave (or even work sufficiently on) the marriage, you deserve that your XH is a jerk?
(just to clarify my stand on this, at some point when my XW for the umpteenth time asked me to take the kids on a friday night when she was going out, I told her to stop asking. UNLESS she had an emergency, or in her family, or if for some other reason, it was better for the kids to be with me than her).
But I still get why LC acted the way he did.
I find it odd that people assume it would be a 180 for me. I've taken kids out several times when she's felt tired or ill, since the BD. Also in my marriage I obviously took kids if she had to go. I spent 2x half a year with my D pretty much alone while she was studying to the pre-exam to get into her uni (she met OM there last year). I loved her and supported her for 8 years so she could get into the university.
Just to counter this I asked how she is doing now and did she get hospitalized and it was a no. She visited again. So D was put to grandparents while XW probably used the situation to be with the fuckwad.
Now, please understand that she's not there for me to care for anymore. She trashed me and switched me to another man, who didn't want to ever have kids just a year ago. She does not care that my son who I tried so hard to get with her attaches to another man. This hurts so bad. Please stop talking about me not being there for her. I have accepted all the blame for the breakup and accepted that she wanted OM because I wasn't there for her/apparently didn't love her, and OM can make her happy like she said. But please do consider that you are exaggerating this. I misinterpreted her vague message and didn't want to put off my entire weekend full of GAL which was the best time I've had in ages. She has visited the doctor on short notice before too, so I would have loved for her to open up a bit more that it's more serious rather than what it has been before.
I am not really DBing to get her back. I am imagining my life with someone else. My situation is hopeless. They are going to marry. It's a fact. I am here to recover and to share one viewpoint/experience. I also like to read other sitches.
Thanks Btrow.
Also this board helps me to stay amicable which is the best for my kids. I doubt I would have been so nice and friendly if I couldn't vent or open up somewhere.
My situation is hopeless. They are going to marry. It's a fact.
Hi LC,
My situation is hopeless - Your opinion
They are going to marry - Your opinion
Its a fact - Its not a fact, its your opinion.
You have no idea what is round the corner, but if you have this mind set you are literally preparing yourself for the worse.
Even the people that have achieved some sort of recon have all thought it was over at some point, but if you keep believing and looking to improve, you never know what is waiting for you.. whether you end up on your own, or with someone else, or even a new relationship with your W. You seem to want to shut that door pretty quickly considering your D isn't even final yet.
lcause,
Benito is right here.
For me I can never get into the habit of thinking the worst even if my situation is as bad as it can be. IF we choose to fight for what’s right then our mindset needs to reflect a positive outcome or you’re demeanor will allow the negativity out!
I understand how hard it is when we see our WW carrying on with their destructive actions BUT if we are serious about wanting a positive outcome we have to put in the hard work! My WW is presently enjoying a 5-night break with her AP/LO somewhere in Europe, the positive here is that I have my kids throughout this time AND it just escalates their “getting to know each other” time.
Again the time is key for me but as much as that is the continued PMA for me to move forwards improving myself.
Look at it this way – at the beginning of their A for them everything was amazing with rainbows and unicorns whilst I was in the darkest place I’ve ever been, now through time I’m beginning to see a lighter picture. I believe through time their A will take a downward turn, it has to if it doesn’t then they truly are “soulmates”. So while they “come down” from their addiction I’m working towards making my life better, my life has to get better it can’t get any worse so this mindset makes me remain positive in a very difficult time.
Another thing the statistics for second MR’s being successful? NOT THAT GREAT. Just because you D doesn’t mean it’s over, keep positive show her that person IRRELEVENT of where it goes and work on being the better.
M.
Not threadjacking but I really needed to read that today. Thanks Btrow, lcause, benni and parkema. Had a bad couple of days. Feeling good this morning.
It is very very disheartening to go through what we all have done and/or are doing.
How were we taught from right from wrong as a kid? We did well at school---> We got sweets, or a bit of money, or something similar. Its in our make up to want to see some sort of 'end result' from our actions. Even if we are fully aware we aren't going to get a result straight away - we are ok with that because at least we know that 'in the end everything will be ok'.
The difficulty we have is that the situation we are in needs an absolutely unbelievable amount of hope and internal strength because you aren't guaranteed a result. If you ever think "so what's the point then?" - then your journey to self improvement is not complete yet and you are still holding onto changing or coping or waiting for a recon subconsciously.
If you are looking at your W as the goal or normality, then its easy to think its over or it’s a lost cause (boom boom) because there is no pat on the back for our daily struggles emotional and physically.
I can only talk from my experience because I really do want to help. I know what its like - I could have killed myself 3/4 times over the last 6 months. But I am still here.
Not only am I here, but to give you an impression of the stage I am at I received this yesterday from her via text
"Aww (name), I love you, I seriously don’t know what I would do without you. This new you is an absolute dream come true for me. Thank you"
"Very Happy, Were happier now then we used to be. Sorry all this had to happen. But it has changed us for the better Xx"
I haven't wrote that because I am trying to show off, or I'm trying to make people feel worse, I am on here because I want people to know that fully detaching does (or at least can) work.
Even now we spend each weekend together, I have never text her first, ring her first or chased.
I sat in my house crying while I knew on facebook she was out, enjoying life without me. But then it dawned on me. I CANT CONTROL OR MANIPULATE anyone. People will come to you (as they did when they first met you) because they are interested in you. Remember back then?
I had drifted so far from that it was untrue. I was a wet rag.
When we did spend time together I didn’t put on a act.. But I did promise myself I wasn’t mentally looking for clues or similar when we were together or separate. I forced myself to enjoy every moment. I was happy to be alive. Happy to have a car. A playstation. My hobbies. Whatever it takes to focus your life onto some sort of self and internal appreciation I had to get there.
When I did, even though it broke my heart to see my life fall apart.. I still believed (not with her) that things would be ok. If I was positive enough for long enough and I didn’t let the bad times shake me - something, someway, somehow would be ok.
An hour visit turned into a day out… a day out turned into sleeping over.. And so on.
Never text to say "so sex was great last night and I love you etc.. When you coming home?"
I left it. Started each day a fresh. Acted like it didn’t happen at all.
That space gave her the time she needed without any pressure to go through her own experience and to make her own mind up without any pressure from me in any way shape or form.
That was 6th months. Everyday I woke up sad, but I stuck with the game plan and kept faith. I wanted it faster, but I didn’t push, didn’t look for clues. I planned my weeks in advance so that I had things to do, so if she didn’t text or call, it didn’t matter because I was busy.
Its such a hard road, it stinks, but fortune favours the brave and sometimes I look at this last 6 months as the worst but also the best thing to ever happen to me. Keep your chin up - life is NOT fair, but you know deep down if you are attractive to women or not. If you don’t feel attractive - look at the key points you think that women find attractive and implement that into your thinking until it becomes part of who you are. Anyone can change if they let go of the emotional mental story that plays in the mind when they are hurting and focus on the end goal.
Hi LC,
My situation is hopeless - Your opinion
They are going to marry - Your opinion
Its a fact - Its not a fact, its your opinion.
You have no idea what is round the corner, but if you have this mind set you are literally preparing yourself for the worse.
Even the people that have achieved some sort of recon have all thought it was over at some point, but if you keep believing and looking to improve, you never know what is waiting for you.. whether you end up on your own, or with someone else, or even a new relationship with your W. You seem to want to shut that door pretty quickly considering your D isn't even final yet.
Well, I managed to destroy the small tiny ittybitty chance by telling her I'm better off. I was angry, hurt and stupid, but I can't change how I behaved so there's no reason to dwell on there but to accept the scenario and move on. This pushed her more towards OM, albeit I know they were seeing much more than what she told me.
Expect the worst, hope for the best. The D is final in two months from this day. I don't know how I should handle it, should I go sign the paper if she even asks me to or should I say something like "let this be the final apology and my trust that our marriage would have been savable, but I let you do what you feel is the right choice; I am not going to file it myself"? (I don't have to sign it since either one of us filing it the second time is enough - just like the first time). I think she just files it and asks me for half of the money.
lcause,
Benito is right here.
For me I can never get into the habit of thinking the worst even if my situation is as bad as it can be. IF we choose to fight for what’s right then our mindset needs to reflect a positive outcome or you’re demeanor will allow the negativity out!
I understand how hard it is when we see our WW carrying on with their destructive actions BUT if we are serious about wanting a positive outcome we have to put in the hard work! My WW is presently enjoying a 5-night break with her AP/LO somewhere in Europe, the positive here is that I have my kids throughout this time AND it just escalates their “getting to know each other” time.
Again the time is key for me but as much as that is the continued PMA for me to move forwards improving myself.
Look at it this way – at the beginning of their A for them everything was amazing with rainbows and unicorns whilst I was in the darkest place I’ve ever been, now through time I’m beginning to see a lighter picture. I believe through time their A will take a downward turn, it has to if it doesn’t then they truly are “soulmates”. So while they “come down” from their addiction I’m working towards making my life better, my life has to get better it can’t get any worse so this mindset makes me remain positive in a very difficult time.
Another thing the statistics for second MR’s being successful? NOT THAT GREAT. Just because you D doesn’t mean it’s over, keep positive show her that person IRRELEVENT of where it goes and work on being the better.
M.
First off, thank you Mark for commenting my thread. I am truly sorry I offended you and I won't comment on your sitch anymore. I feel that you misinterpreted me though but I am here to blame because I worded it really badly.
My mindset just doesn't work that way. As long as I keep up hope, my changes are fake. I don't truly transform for myself but keep thinking what she would see as a pro in me. I need to truly move on and heal before I can get lasting changes for MYSELF.
I don't know why people are saying "there's always hope" "you will most likely get a chance to recon" for me, because they don't know my sitch at all. We are so young that we both can build our completely new lives from scratch. I don't really know if my XW had an affair or not (there were signs but who knows? I very much suspect it though), but it's not moving nearly as fast as your XW's Mark. They are still only seeing quite rarely, although XW spends most of the time talking with him in WhatsApp.
It is very very disheartening to go through what we all have done and/or are doing.
How were we taught from right from wrong as a kid? We did well at school---> We got sweets, or a bit of money, or something similar. Its in our make up to want to see some sort of 'end result' from our actions. Even if we are fully aware we aren't going to get a result straight away - we are ok with that because at least we know that 'in the end everything will be ok'.
The difficulty we have is that the situation we are in needs an absolutely unbelievable amount of hope and internal strength because you aren't guaranteed a result. If you ever think "so what's the point then?" - then your journey to self improvement is not complete yet and you are still holding onto changing or coping or waiting for a recon subconsciously.
If you are looking at your W as the goal or normality, then its easy to think its over or it’s a lost cause (boom boom) because there is no pat on the back for our daily struggles emotional and physically.
I can only talk from my experience because I really do want to help. I know what its like - I could have killed myself 3/4 times over the last 6 months. But I am still here.
Not only am I here, but to give you an impression of the stage I am at I received this yesterday from her via text
"Aww (name), I love you, I seriously don’t know what I would do without you. This new you is an absolute dream come true for me. Thank you"
"Very Happy, Were happier now then we used to be. Sorry all this had to happen. But it has changed us for the better Xx"
I haven't wrote that because I am trying to show off, or I'm trying to make people feel worse, I am on here because I want people to know that fully detaching does (or at least can) work.
Even now we spend each weekend together, I have never text her first, ring her first or chased.
I sat in my house crying while I knew on facebook she was out, enjoying life without me. But then it dawned on me. I CANT CONTROL OR MANIPULATE anyone. People will come to you (as they did when they first met you) because they are interested in you. Remember back then?
I had drifted so far from that it was untrue. I was a wet rag.
When we did spend time together I didn’t put on a act.. But I did promise myself I wasn’t mentally looking for clues or similar when we were together or separate. I forced myself to enjoy every moment. I was happy to be alive. Happy to have a car. A playstation. My hobbies. Whatever it takes to focus your life onto some sort of self and internal appreciation I had to get there.
When I did, even though it broke my heart to see my life fall apart.. I still believed (not with her) that things would be ok. If I was positive enough for long enough and I didn’t let the bad times shake me - something, someway, somehow would be ok.
An hour visit turned into a day out… a day out turned into sleeping over.. And so on.
Never text to say "so sex was great last night and I love you etc.. When you coming home?"
I left it. Started each day a fresh. Acted like it didn’t happen at all.
That space gave her the time she needed without any pressure to go through her own experience and to make her own mind up without any pressure from me in any way shape or form.
That was 6th months. Everyday I woke up sad, but I stuck with the game plan and kept faith. I wanted it faster, but I didn’t push, didn’t look for clues. I planned my weeks in advance so that I had things to do, so if she didn’t text or call, it didn’t matter because I was busy.
Its such a hard road, it stinks, but fortune favours the brave and sometimes I look at this last 6 months as the worst but also the best thing to ever happen to me. Keep your chin up - life is NOT fair, but you know deep down if you are attractive to women or not. If you don’t feel attractive - look at the key points you think that women find attractive and implement that into your thinking until it becomes part of who you are. Anyone can change if they let go of the emotional mental story that plays in the mind when they are hurting and focus on the end goal.
I understand the point. I'm very happy for you B. It's really heartwarming that some of us really get the chance to make our marriages much better the second time around. Your sitch gladly took the turn due to your changes and her willingness to see them. Thank god there was no third party involved either. I think I would probably have had a chance if the timing was different and she wouldn't have lined a replacement before leaving me. I sometimes wonder if she was there with me just until a better man showed up.
I get your point and I'm agreeing with you here. My mindset just continuously seeks for either points that proves I'm a good man or points that fall in "revenge". This is why I need to force myself out of the hope aspect to truly understand I'm alone here and I only transform for MYSELF, not because of anyone else. I don't have any clue whatsoever why people keep saying I would have hope (because I truly DO know her and I truly DO know how she thinks right now), but it's just too easy to trust on that and just keep waiting. I know I want to hear it... but then again I don't.
It truly is disheartening, especially since I lose most of the kids' lives. Time will heal me and maybe I can enjoy family life with someone else in the future. I think - I really think - I want more children.
OK..
"I say something like "let this be the final apology and my trust that our marriage would have been savable, but I let you do what you feel is the right choice; I am not going to file it myself"?
Because I can step away from the pain you are going through I can see what you say from a different angle.
Is she stupid?.. do you really have to write down to notify her you don't want her to leave? or is 'a last roll of the dice' kind of vibe to it.
Which means than rather than allowing her to naturally see something to want to come back to, you are trying essentially make her feel a little sad for leaving you if your honest and 'maybe' sway her opinion.
I personally think that you know deep down that 'at the moment' you arent the guy for her. So you overcompensate by trying to get some validation.
Just give it time. Truly focus on yourself and what will be will be.
B, I told her things I now regret. E.g. I'm pushing it through, I don't see a future for us etc back when I was angry and so sure I wouldn't take her back. That's why I have no idea what she even thinks about my intentions. I did say I'm sorry and explained that I was probably just trying to convince myself, and that I really appreciate her effort in our marriage... To which she said that she understands and accepts the apology. I'm not trying to make her sad, just say my final apology and "stand" for the M because I loved her and truly wanted to seek for all the possible help to save it. It took a lot to accept that I'm depressed and seek help for it. I should've done it before but I didn't. I probably wouldn't be here now if I did. I can only learn from my mistakes and hope that there's no health issues so I still have a good 40-50 years left - enough for a lot of happiness.
I will give it time, but by then it's too late
D is going through in two months. She is more and more in love with OM. But those are things I can't control and dwelling on them will do no good. There is a future for me, just need to find my true passions, study more/get a job (->confidence, value for women), I'm pretty good looking and I am really funny when I'm not tired. So yes, I can see myself possibly enjoying family life in 5-10 years from now
Not with XW but with someone new.
DB'ing is damn difficult. We come here for advice and we get a lot of "go dark", "friendly neighbor" "his/her sandbox" "counter intuitive" "not my circus" "no pursuit" etc. You get the picture. This is confusing..
It is hard when you have been dumped like yesterdays newspaper to be friendly towards the XW. Particular when there is a third party involved. We probably on some level want to be friendly but on the other hand, we do not like to be taken advantage of.
We don't really discuss this much because it rarely comes up, but in an emergency situation you should always do what is right regardless of where you are in your DB'ing. You may be 100% dark with your W, but if she has a medical issue and asks for help, do the right thing. Whether that's watching the kids or driving her to the doctor or hospital or calling people for her or picking up prescriptions, it is the right thing to do and trumps DB'ing temporarily. You can always get back to DB'ing after the emergency has passed.
Well, I managed to destroy the small tiny ittybitty chance by telling her I'm better off. I was angry, hurt and stupid, but I can't change how I behaved so there's no reason to dwell on there but to accept the scenario and move on. This pushed her more towards OM, albeit I know they were seeing much more than what she told me.
Stop the mind-reading LC. You really don't know what your W is thinking AT ALL. She probably doesn't know herself. She's confused and in turmoil. The whole idea of DB'ing isn't to give up and move on, it's to move forward. Leave your W to sort through her mess, you sort through yours. Quit trying to analyze and predict and plan, just LIVE YOUR LIFE and let her live hers. That's it.
And please, STOP talking about spending time with other women and starting a new R and such, you ARE NOT READY. Not even close. Look at your timeline, you've barely started in this journey. It's a 26 mile marathon and you've taken a few clumsy, halting steps. You have a ton of emotional healing to go before you should consider bringing another woman into your life and especially your kids' lives.
I don't know how I should handle it, should I go sign the paper if she even asks me to or should I say something like "let this be the final apology and my trust that our marriage would have been savable, but I let you do what you feel is the right choice; I am not going to file it myself"?
If she does all the work on the D and all that's left is your signature, then sign. If you've already apologized for whatever your mistakes were in the M, then don't apologize again. A lot of LBS's apologize over and over and that just looks pathetic to a WAS. Once or twice is fine, no need to beat a dead horse.
I don't know why people are saying "there's always hope" "you will most likely get a chance to recon" for me, because they don't know my sitch at all.
LOL! Brother we know your sitch very, very well. You think this is our first rodeo? This is YOUR first rodeo. For a lot of us, your situation is one of hundreds we've followed. And for Michele and her coaches, I'm sure the sitches they've monitored number in the thousands. Trust DB'ing.
We don't really discuss this much because it rarely comes up, but in an emergency situation you should always do what is right regardless of where you are in your DB'ing. You may be 100% dark with your W, but if she has a medical issue and asks for help, do the right thing. Whether that's watching the kids or driving her to the doctor or hospital or calling people for her or picking up prescriptions, it is the right thing to do and trumps DB'ing temporarily. You can always get back to DB'ing after the emergency has passed.
One more nail to the already sealed coffin then
Stop the mind-reading LC. You really don't know what your W is thinking AT ALL. She probably doesn't know herself. She's confused and in turmoil. The whole idea of DB'ing isn't to give up and move on, it's to move forward. Leave your W to sort through her mess, you sort through yours. Quit trying to analyze and predict and plan, just LIVE YOUR LIFE and let her live hers. That's it.
And please, STOP talking about spending time with other women and starting a new R and such, you ARE NOT READY. Not even close. Look at your timeline, you've barely started in this journey. It's a 26 mile marathon and you've taken a few clumsy, halting steps. You have a ton of emotional healing to go before you should consider bringing another woman into your life and especially your kids' lives.
Isn't expecting them to be in turmoil mind reading too? She could very well be glad that she finally got rid of me and found someone better. If she leaves me and wants to pursue a relationship with someone else, it's rather clear which one of those it is.
I am not pursuing other women now. I am just talking about my future with someone new. There's a big difference. I am not ready like you said and I am just not very attractive currently due to poor job.
If she does all the work on the D and all that's left is your signature, then sign. If you've already apologized for whatever your mistakes were in the M, then don't apologize again. A lot of LBS's apologize over and over and that just looks pathetic to a WAS. Once or twice is fine, no need to beat a dead horse.
It's not what I did in my M, but what I've done since BD. A month or so ago I got really pissed off and was so sure I'd never want to be with her anymore so I decided for god knows to state that I'm fine, I'm going to do it myself, I was depressed due to our relationship, we both said we can't ever be again yadayada. I did apologize this already, but I'm a model DB screw-up
She doesn't require my name there. She can file it completely without my knowledge. I just get a paper in mail afterwards that we are divorced legally.
LOL! Brother we know your sitch very, very well. You think this is our first rodeo? This is YOUR first rodeo. For a lot of us, your situation is one of hundreds we've followed. And for Michele and her coaches, I'm sure the sitches they've monitored number in the thousands. Trust DB'ing.
Those people have not screwed up and been bad husbands. I DO know if you compare our M to a new one, grass IS greener unless the guy is abusive or an alcoholic. Now I don't want to dwell on this and I can offer a much better one going on now, but she will always remember how horrible I was. I'm at least 90% at fault for the demise of our M.
For me DBing is more of a life style, a guide how to get better. I just don't trust it saving my situation, but that's ok. I just wish I could get this hope off myself so I could stop dreaming about things. It also sparked my interests in reading relationship material and overall finding out how real relationships work. When you are just going with the flow, you will most likely fail. MR is really hard work.
Icause,
Actually OM typically have done worse. The OM my W is onbsessed with is a multiples time serial cheater. Even left his family once to be with the OW. Then came crawling back to his W after kicking the woman to the curb after ahe left her own H. OM since theb continues to mess with other W. They leave their families, while he stays with their W. Then repeat to another W, until he eventually met mine. OM E told me all about her H behavior. I told this to my W, but she is going to learn the hard way as usual.
When it's all said and done. My W is going to lose me, S13 respect, home and has already lost close/oldest friends due to her behavior. All over some man who will never leave his W and family. I can honestly see my W playing in traffic once this fog lifts. Because she has contemplated suicide in the past for less.
So trust me, OM is far from being better than you. He just happens to be new and exciting at the moment. My W will eventually see that she is nothing more than one of his booty calls once every couple of months.
Thanks for your supportive words Tread, but this OM is a regular guy, not anything like that. The only thing he has is that he didn't want to ever have kids a year ago but now that he left his long term R (not sure when), he seems to want to have kids and is ok to date a woman with two. But trust me, this guy isn't a serial cheater or anything like that. I can however see that your wife will eventually get hurt badly.
Thanks for your supportive words Tread, but this OM is a regular guy, not anything like that. The only thing he has is that he didn't want to ever have kids a year ago but now that he left his long term R (not sure when), he seems to want to have kids and is ok to date a woman with two. But trust me, this guy isn't a serial cheater or anything like that. I can however see that your wife will eventually get hurt badly.
Out of curiosity have you ever had a conversation with the guy to get to know him?
Im guessing not. If not that paragraph above is complete fantasy in your mind.
A regular guy? - Who was probably having a EA with a pregnant women? - Seems like a c**t to me.
Stick to the facts. You have NO idea at all about their relation or him.
Benito is right. And the question is what does OM think about your W in the long term. Would he ever be able to completely trust her knowing that she cheated on you for him? I certainly wouldn't be looking at someone who cheated their H for me as a long term R, let alone a W. She would be nothing more than a play thing.
I haven't met him, but he rather seems like a guy taking an opportunity than an alpha male seeking for affairs. XW said she's happy now that someone wanted her, as she thought no one would never want her - plus they are so together all the time (if not physically then texting) which implies he is serious about it.
Maybe she is talking the truth that they only started after BD? I don't know. There were so big signs and statistics (lol) say that when you have a strong suspicion, it's almost always right.
I wouldn't do what he did but I can't force my morals to others. He just isn't a scumbag cheater, like e.g. your W's AP Tread.
he rather seems like a guy taking an opportunity than an alpha male seeking for affairs.
He just isn't a scumbag cheater, like e.g. your W's AP Tread.
So we can help, can you give me some factual information that you have witnessed with your own eyes can confirm those comments.
Heh
Just said it so that it'll show my case is less hopeful. Better to not think about it at all from now on. Thanks for your support
Expect the worst, hope for the best I guess.
Tomorrow fishing trip again. Waiting for it. We bought a few bottles of whiskey. Man I love doing really hard work and then relaxing with a beer/whiskey.
My handstand pushups (with support) have progressed again. Now I started to practise handstand balance. Goal is to be able to walk with hands next summer. Yesss. Really like how my veins are now much more visible. These are definite confidence boosts!
It seems that the WAS loses all the sense of humor towards the LBS. Oh well. Oh and someone please give some cologne suggestions thanks
Need to update again.
Oh and someone please give some cologne suggestions thanks
Need to update again.
Thats a no brainer. JPG Le Male - the ladies really dig it
Enjoy your fishing trip LC
Thats a no brainer. JPG Le Male - the ladies really dig it
I've been looking to switch things up myself. Thanks for the recommendation!
Thanks for the suggestion but I already own it
I'm leaning to YSL La nuit De l'homme or A*men pure Havane mugler
One thing I always resented in my XW is her insecurity. I stopped complimenting her because if I told her "omg you're sexy", she would say "stop it because I'm not", and really seriously not jokingly. It's hard to keep complimenting someone who thinks you're just doing it for making them feel good instead of truly meaning it which I always did. I know this is an issue from my side too.
Also, I really loved when she had the messy hair look, i.e. how the hair is after sex. Told her this, and for some reason she now has it almost every time she comes to pick up the kids. I know she's seen OM so it really hurts how now it's ok to have it like that but never with me. Also, why do women start to dress very unsexy in long Ms? Then say their Hs are really boring in the bedroom and sometimes justify an A with that. We are visually stimulated, why not put the sexy lingerie for us but just for the AP? When I was still living under the same roof I saw her buying things I wished she would have had with me. But each time she said something like "yeah so I don't look sexy naked?" Like wtf. Those things are there for teasing and foreplay lol. I wouldn't have sex with you if I didn't find you attractive naked.
Sorry about the rambling I'm drunk
Man 10c/50f water and sauna feels nice. Made some smoked fish and laughed a lot.
So XW asked now if I could be with kids at Sunday evening so she could go to her hobby. I'm still here (200km away) at the fishing trip. It's her weekend to have the kids. Am I a DB screwup if I deny or is this the time to say no?
8 hours today at the sea. Lots of pikes but nothing else. Dropped the fishing nets today. Just won 300 eur from an online slot game!
Have a good weekend everyone!
This is what I tell people from experience. If you want her to be flexible in the future when you need it, you have to pick and choose when you are going to be rigid or flexible. Is it doable for you without cutting your plans short? If not, I wouldn't because there is no emergency.
I know many say when you "give in" it's cake eating. But in the reality of a long term situation of custody schedules, it's good to be flexible when possible, but not all the time. You might need it back one day. Only you know if she would repay the favor if you needed.
Decided not to cut my plans short and was at home only this morning. I don't think I will give up on my weekends especially if I need to cut my plans really short. I already switched the weekends with her when she asked.
She hasn't sent anything in a while. No pictures either. I guess she understood or just got tired of it. Recon seems really impossible anymore, we are so far away from each other - to the point where I think she doesn't even remember my name anymore
51 days till I am officially divorced. Amazing that I'm already almost half a year from the BD. Time sure flies past. I don't like AS saying that I've only took two small steps from a marathon. I'll give myself a year before I start dating again. I'll work for that and I hope I can feel confident by then.
For some reason I'm waiting for D day to come. Maybe it'll give some real closure I so desire. The mark left by the ring has almost entirely vanished. I know I'm going to be fine.
I had a fun weekend. Didn't think about XW except for at evenings. Detaching is going better and better. Friend asked me to join them to go hiking to north next summer. Totally agreed and really waiting for it already.
I'm so jealous of others who have no OMs or OWs to deal with. It literally seems impossible to recon unless he dumps her or turns out to be a non-match after all. That could take years. I'm not here for years. I miss my family life and my kids, gladly this feeling is fading as days go by. Having a relationship is one of the basic wants we have - thus why not search for one when I'm ready? One thing I'm going to make sure though - I won't get attached to anyone before I'm 100% sure I would directly say "sorry, no thanks" to my XW if she decided to try to come back. I would never put any girl through what I've read in many "ex wants me back" -stories. When I start to seriously date someone exclusively, I'm going all in.
I feel that this "hoping" and waiting could possibly backfire very hard on me... It certainly does seem to keep me attached. I think a better approach for me would be to just move on and leave everything for destiny, even though I don't believe in that mumbojumbo. I just can't grasp detaching without moving on. Detaching is moving on for me. When I've fully detached to the point where I don't emotionally get any feelings when I hear from her/see her, why would I ever want to go back anymore? That's just ILYB. I still don't completely know if I want her back because of fear or because of love. Life would be easier but would it really be what I want? How can I find the answer for this question?
My T said the blame definitely wasn't 95% on me. She does agree I had some issues but she thinks they were not anything to divorce for, and she wonders why we never tried counselling. She said she's worried XWs hormones are playing a role here. She made me realize that I actually tried to be affectionate but it's hard to continue when you get turned down - eventually it fades away, thus she shifted some of the blame towards XW. Men tend to tolerate "worse" things much longer than women. Then again, I'm taking much of the blame because I could have acted differently and more confident regardless of her turning me down. I now understand that it was a huge hit to my confidence when she said that she doesn't want sex right now as it hurts. I should have understood it's just the physical sex and that it is related to the pregnancy... but that made me feel so bad. Also, each time when I tried to give her together time, she had her phone and social media open. I understand I did this too, but I can now see that it wasn't only me and it was a self-feeding thing (me doing it -> she doing it -> me doing it more -> she doing it more).
I still hope karma would happen, but hopefully that thought dies off. I don't want anything bad for her and I'm going to start to think that she actually started the new R after she BD'd me (and that she didn't believe this would happen). This is what she told to me and I'll believe it. This way it both hurts my ego less and makes me less angry. Hopefully she is going to find whatever she is searching for now and hopefully the guy isn't going to turn out to be a bad role model for my kids.
I laugh much more now. I'm much more confident too. I look people in the eyes, my XW too and I don't feel awkward about it anymore. I really feel now that I'm going to be fine, regardless. It'll take me time to truly change - but i'll work towards getting there. I will give myself time.
D baked me some ginger biscuits for me, they were good. Told her that I'm proud of her. S is so positive. He claps his hands all the time and laughs. It's amazing this boy has my genes, considering how negative I've been. My kids are amazing. I love them from the bottom of my heart.
Journaling:
Not really anything new when it comes to XW. Our communication has died even more, although I just received a couple of pictures of S again with some "seemingly funny" messages.
A coworker told me she has a friend who has her life in order but "just lacks a man" (apparently she's been single for quite some time). Coworker mentioned that she knows one guy (me) who has just divorced and is "really good looking" (lol). Now her friend would like to go on a date with me. Really uncomfortable as the coworker was pushing it really hard for me (go, what could you even lose? It's not like you need to marry her. Love doesn't watch the time). It definitely feels like an ego boost however, but I don't know if I should go. The girl knows my sitch and says that she's fine with just making a friend out of it, not attaching any future to it... She looks cute however
I know I'm not ready to be anyone's boyfriend. But then I'm weighing it against all these what ifs - that probably just spark from my fear of the future... But then again, if she really knows the situation and is extremely picky about guys (she has been on dates according to coworker so it's not like she's not attractive or anything). What would I lose? It doesn't seem like she would get hurt regardless... Maybe I would get more hurt due to more rejection if I get rebound attached haha. But as far as I know to take it extremely carefully and weight my emotions, I don't think making a friend out of this would be a bad thing. Dunno.
I now know exactly what I want from my next partner. I'm done with being "caged", as I always was with my XW. If there's a good song playing in say a clothing store, I could just randomly make some dance moves - I don't care what others think about it and most of the time the reactions seem more positive than negative. I think our culture needs more extroverted and "in the moment" people. My XW was immediately really embarrassed and always angrily said "stop". I want someone who isn't as strict and formal in everyday life situations. If I don't feel like putting on the best clothes from the closet when I go to shopping, so what?! I'm more of a joker than a stereotypical "handsome" business man. I want to be childish at times when the situation allows it. Who cares what other people think about it?
Another thing: I want to show my love in public too. XW had so many issues with walking by holding hands, kissing in public etc. I just want someone who appreciates me randomly grabbing her in my arms no matter where we are and kissing her neck. That's just how I am. I can now start to understand why my affection died little by little. I want someone who BY THEMSELVES come to me after a long day at work and kiss me, and ask me how my day was. I don't want to go back in the situation where I just get a random "hey" and see her walking away from me. I want someone who appreciates my comments about her sexyness. "If we were alone together, I'd totally take you here right now". I used to say things like this but she never seemed to like it. I know these are not reasons to turn down affection, but it's hard to keep up when you are always getting rejected. I know she tried to give me kisses too but I guess our timings were different. We both probably tried to do it when the other one was feeling stress (i.e. me after my workday -> me relaxing and her being with kids+cooking food -> her feeling stress vs. me doing my thesis and really trying to figure something out when she started to relax after we put kid(s) to sleep).
I'm starting to really like myself again. It's amazing how much my body has transformed since the BD. I am 30 years old and when I woke up at the morning, my body physically hurt in many places. I was a slouch! Now, I feel much more energized even though my sleep has gone haywire. No place hurts! I can jump with one leg again! I can put myself into weird positions as I'm much more flexible! I think my mental health has gone up too, I seem to remember things better and be a bit less of an auto-pilot. I'm 180 pounds now (was 220 lbs at the beginning) and I still need to lose ~10 lbs of fat. Then my body fat% should be at ~8-12%. I'm starting this one long course which I've been SO interested for over a year and thought it would never be re-introduced. But guess what! It's going to start soon (really helpful for my career and I'm super interested in it)!!!
I'm sorry about my babbling and maybe I should write these messages for myself only. I don't know if these interest people since they aren't exactly about my M. It seems to help to get these thoughts of my head though and I really feel the growth from figuring things like these out.
Maybe I would get more hurt due to more rejection if I get rebound attached haha. But as far as I know to take it extremely carefully and weight my emotions, I don't think making a friend out of this would be a bad thing. Dunno
Yeah take it carefully LC. I made out with a co-worker 6 months ago and unfortunately I quickly developed a crush. I didn't pursue it due to the fact that I'm probably not ready yet and well... her age, but it certainly hasn't made life any easier. To be honest, I'm sure I have entered the dangerous fields of limerence.. Bummer ... So be careful, but if you can manage to just be friends with her for now, then by all means, go for it!
Another thing: I want to show my love in public too. XW had so many issues with walking by holding hands, kissing in public etc. I just want someone who appreciates me randomly grabbing her in my arms no matter where we are and kissing her neck.
This I don't understand. I thought ALL women wanted exactly that... That their guy shows his love for her to the whole world. I'm sure your next partner will appreciate that sort of behavoiur so don't hold yourself back.
Well done on the weight loss. Keep up the good work. And good luck on the course. Doing things you are passionate about is the way to go.
Don't stop posting. I can't really speak on the behalf of others but I certainly like to read about people moving forward. Whether they save their M or not (lets be honest here, hardly anyone does...) we can all learn from each other on how to deal with the aftermath of BD.
D was with me for the weekend and we were visiting my parents. Took her back and XW had all makeup and hair done, so I don't really have to question what she's been up to (OM of course). Now I am just waiting for the announcement that D is going to meet OM... Gave a kiss for S and left. Also failed hard and sent XW a text that was supposed to go to a friend, and out of context that sounded like I was in a hurry to somewhere, lol. I hate this new phone as I keep sending WhatsApp messages to wrong places all the time.
My mom told me that XW had said something very "rude" and odd for her back when she was pregnant the first time. "I'm pregnant and he (me) can leave anytime if he wants to". Mom never told me this before and said it came out of blue for her too. It's odd that I always thought I was seemingly happy with XW but mom said she thought I felt a bit unhappy when we were visiting. Not sure if this is to make me feel better...
Yeah take it carefully LC. I made out with a co-worker 6 months ago and unfortunately I quickly developed a crush. I didn't pursue it due to the fact that I'm probably not ready yet and well... her age, but it certainly hasn't made life any easier. To be honest, I'm sure I have entered the dangerous fields of limerence.. Bummer ... So be careful, but if you can manage to just be friends with her for now, then by all means, go for it!
That sukcs if you get into the limerence. I know it's a danger, but I think this could actually be very good for me too. Ego boost and noticing that "I can do it" are nice. Just got to keep myself really unattached and I
know I'm not boyfriend material currently anyways, not to mention that she probably isn't what I'm after (assumption). I can hurt myself as much as I want to, but I wouldn't like to hurt anyone else. However she seems very content in her life based on what the coworker told, and apparently she's not "actively" seeking for a man. That, tbh, sounds quite attractive
She's a divorcee, but it's been years.
This I don't understand. I thought ALL women wanted exactly that... That their guy shows his love for her to the whole world. I'm sure your next partner will appreciate that sort of behavoiur so don't hold yourself back.
Tell me about it! Maybe I was too embarrassing or not good enough to show publicly? Hah! Who knows, right? Thanks, of course I'm not holding myself back.
Don't stop posting. I can't really speak on the behalf of others but I certainly like to read about people moving forward. Whether they save their M or not (lets be honest here, hardly anyone does...) we can all learn from each other on how to deal with the aftermath of BD.
Yeah, well I have at least one active reader then!
It feels good to open up, somehow I feel like these things are getting more ingrained into my brain when I open them up this way.
To be honest, I'm quite happy now and it feels like the world isn't going to end - not sure if these feelings spark from the girl wanting to go to a date, haha. Baby steps towards the future that I want.
Thats a no brainer. JPG Le Male - the ladies really dig it
I've been looking to switch things up myself. Thanks for the recommendation!
I
love cologne on a man, and Armani makes a
great one. Makes a guy who would be a 6 into an 8.
Burberry for Men is also quite lovely.
I really could go on, but I heard a comedian say to "keep it simple for men"!
the public displays of affection are things to discuss with your future partners.
And it's not appropriate in all places - I see holding hands as a beautiful symbol of affection and bonding, whereas being grabbed for a kiss can come off as "love bombing" which CAN feel more like a public act of demonstration (to reflect on the man)
or possession. Suddenness is usually off very putting, too. Communicate in the moment.
Just saying, think out the "why's" of it from your end and talk it out without defensiveness. Hear her answer.
Don't assume all places or all acts, apply. Seems obvious, but really it isn't.
Definitely requires discussion and not a hard/fast rule.
Cologne wears off too quickly.
Thanks for your insight 25. I can understand your point. To defend (heh) myself a bit - of course I know it does not apply or is appropriate in all the places. And it's not like I did it always - nor for "possession" purposes.
But definitely something that needs to be discussed with my next partner. As you said, it feels obvious but it isn't. But I'd really like to hold hands and it's really adorable when you see older couples walking around holding each other's hands. I want that kind of a relationship - long term where affection is still shown, publicly.
It is snowing now. The first snow for this year. Beautiful. The ground is too warm still so the snow just melts immediately. Last year this time I was writing my thesis and waiting for my son to born. A lot can happen in one year. Lives turn around; new lives start and old ones end. 2018 is going to be my year. A year ago I said that 2017 is going to be OUR year. Plans do not always work.
L
get longer lasting cologne, and yes they do exist. (Trust me on that.)
If you have an attractively fragrant alternative, by all means
yes, a year can change a lot.
13 months ago I was living in a large lovely house with my h of decades, and I was healthy.
Life has surprises. But we can change our own direction and create change, too.
And no matter what life tosses our way, we learn to handle it - or not.
You would not be here if you wanted to hide from it all. Which is good
25
opinions please, on Boss, Prada and Aramis (the latter of course being an 80s throwback)
thank you!
If i recall clearly, i liked Aramis
love Prada, will track down Boss.
There was an androgynous Calvin Klein i was Not impressed with - just not masculine enough for me - obviously an opinion!
In college, i sold men's clothes & cologne. Best job i had in college -
I mean, cologne by definition is the most weakest one (if you speak about EDC), as far as I know? I usually go to EDT, or now I want EDP of the same fragrance. I want it to last till the next morning
Could be that you are just bundling all the fragrances under the term cologne though.
YSL La nuit de l'homme is my next one. Need to buy it tax free because it's much cheaper.
Life indeed has surprises and I'm glad this board exists. I feel that we do grow somehow together, by following each other's sitches. We get the power and find the light within. Hiding from this is not an option.
[quote=lcause]I mean, cologne by definition is the most weakest one (if you speak about EDC), as far as I know?
LCause
I have a strong preference for cologne, as do many (not all) of my women friends. Coincidentally I spent the weekend with 5 women friends of mine and we mentioned colognes and all got dreamy eyed when a married woman mentioned how much she loves her h's smell.
I get it.
But I gave you my opinion and it's free. You're free to ignore it of course. 
I don't know what "EDT/EDP" means and
yes, I'm referring to men's fragrances in general, when I use the term "cologne."
I usually go to EDT, or now I want EDP of the same fragrance. I want it to last till the next morning
Could be that you are just bundling all the fragrances under the term cologne though.
YSL La nuit de l'homme is my next one. Need to buy it tax free because it's much cheaper.
This ^^is a good one too. (I need to double check my research for more data). And there is something to be said for avoiding inexpensive colognes Somehow they seem to be too over the top.
IMO a man who cares about his scent, is more aware of those around him than a man who doesn't' even notice.
Plus I think it shows a clean, sensual side to himself.
Not to go too far with this, but subconsciously I think it makes me believe he's going to be a better lover.
God, I hope I'm right about this.
Eau de cologne/toilette/parfym. Basically tells how much of it is the active fragrance and tells how long it lasts. You can get the same fragrance in different forms
I agree with your points. However fragrance shouldn't be used everywhere since people can be allergic. But obviously when going out etc.
I was surprised that you didn't tell me not to go to the date. I'm now back at work after the weekend and the first thing the coworker said "...sssoooo? Are you going?".
Those people have not screwed up and been bad husbands. I DO know if you compare our M to a new one, grass IS greener unless the guy is abusive or an alcoholic. Now I don't want to dwell on this and I can offer a much better one going on now, but she will always remember how horrible I was. I'm at least 90% at fault for the demise of our M.
Bull$hit. Seriously, bull$hit. Every sitch on this site posted by a man is the result of a husband who was inattentive, or worked too hard, or depressed, or oblivious. There are also LBHs who had affairs, and even abusive alcoholics. All of us LBHs are here because we didn't give our wives something they needed. You are not unique in this regard. You are not alone. You are not worse than anyone else.
So pick your damned self respect up off the floor and screw your head back on straight.
As for him being "better" than you, bull$hit to that, too. All I can say is no LBH will ever win the "pick me" dance, even if their competition is a hobo living in a trashcan. In another thread, someone (don't remember who) pointed out that the WAS/WS stacks the deck against the LBS when it comes to APs. The WAS has hardened their heart against the LBS. They blame the LBS for 100% of the problems in the M, not even the 90% you're taking credit for. Nothing the LBS does or says is ever right or good enough. Meanwhile, the AP is absolutely perfect and understands the WAS so well, and makes them feel like no one ever has before. Why is that?
Because the AP is carefully spoon fed EVERYTHING the WAS needs to see and hear. "My husband does this and I hate it." "My wife is such a bitch because she did this to me." "I love it when a woman tells me X." "I love it when a man does Y." There is no competing against that.
My XW's AP is like yours. Someone who saw an opportunity, not someone who was cheating on their partner. He moved here from Florida to be with my XW. My daughter thinks he's a nice guy and really likes him. So what? He's still a scumbag, because he put himself into the middle of a marriage and helped end it. Stop putting yourself in the trap of thinking the AP is somehow better than you.
You have an opportunity, here. Whether or not you save your M, you've been given the gift of self-knowledge. Self-pity is not going to make good use of the opportunity.
Thats a no brainer. JPG Le Male - the ladies really dig it
I let a young woman at the store pick for me. She suggested "Chrome" which I liked and it seemed a good choice for a geek to wear a cologne that shared a name with a web browser. I now want to go smell the cologne you suggested, as it's named after an image format.
Thanks EastTN. This is exactly the type of roasting I wanted a month or so ago!
You are probably 100% correct, but I don't think OM played a role in helping my M to end. Who knows and who cares? I have regained my self-confidence. I'm probably taking the offer and going to see the girl this weekend.
JPG Le Male is too "exotic" for my taste, and I think it's a bit too common. Otherwise a really good choice.
Hey Lcause you sound great! This journey [censored] and beneficial at the same time.
Try and be careful with this date deal. I have two ladies, very pretty and respectable talking to me. One of them has kinda died out. I never looked for them and was pretty lonely throughout this process. I was very upfront and honest yet we still managed to have sex, hang out, etc. Any guy would be lucky to have either one yet I cringe every time they text/call. One in particular is ramping up her talk to me, telling me goodnight and good morning almost daily now. I have zero point zero feelings for her. Now it looks like I will have to shut all that down, don't want to hurt her which it seems I will anyways.
I believe I did it for reasons you speak of, self esteem and validation as a man. Just be careful man, play it extremely slow.
As far cologne, YSL Nuit is awesome! That is my most sentimental cologne bc I bought it on my second date with W back in 2010. As for my 180, I recently sold 99% of my collection for $1,100 lol.
That was 44 colognes and I kept 3. W hated me buying them plus I grew out of it. So Im trying to be way less wasteful in my 180.
Anything made in 2000s by chanel or dior is very good. Your in northern Europe if I remember right so you would probably need something for the cold. I would suggest Carolina Herrara CH Men prive, valentino uomo intense, prada lomme, YSL nuit, blue de chanel, spicebomb extreme, dior sauvage.
Thanks dale! That's a massive collection of fragrances, holy cow and thanks for the suggestions. Yes I'm in Northern Europe and it's snowing here right now.
Sorry to hear your situation. Are you still standing for your M? If not, how are you so sure you couldn't build more with this other woman? Although zero feelings is... zero feelings, lol.
I admit I got "validated" and an ego boost as she apparently wants to go, but I'm definitely not going to use her for that. She apparently is pretty strict when it comes to men so I'm more likely to get dumped than dump her myself, ha
Holy $hit. Dior Sauvage smells so good that I'm borderline getting attracted to the men wearing it! That's going to definitely be the second one I buy. Bought the YSL. It's a bit more tame but still very good.
Hmm I kind of forgot to write here. I haven't has much time either. GALing and the course has taken over my time and I've spent a bit too much time with the girl.
We synced really well... she likes the same music, is amazingly secure in herself, really seems to like children, likes to be a bit childish and doesn't care about embarrassing herself. For example we just randomly conducted a survey in the city, asking people which one of the city's ice hockey team they prefer (she likes the other one than I do, but it's been just more fun teasing each other). People seemed to be amused by it and it was fun.
I've not discussed about the future and she tells me she prefers living in the moment. There was a huge poster in her bedroom full of self-improvement quotes like "to be inspired is great, to inspire is incredible" and so on which was really surprising to me.
Today XW told me that she's going to introduce OM to D. This triggered my urge to write here (I've visited and read the sitches though). I hope everything goes well and D takes it well. It didn't trigger any sort of feelings for me, except the thought of how D will handle it, which is surprising. I'm happy for her.
I thought I would end up validating myself through the girl wanting me but I really don't. I know I'm not ready to be a full-time boyfriend yet, but I really want someone who wants to develop and challenge me and herself which this girl seems to do. I'm probably limerent but so be it.
My journey of wanting my XW is completely over. I'm more oriented towards the current moment and I can't say anything about the future. However, as arrogant as it is, she currently possesses so many traits that turns me off. She would have to go through the process of changing, which I doubt she will ever do.
I now understand what happiness is and what really matters in life. I got a job interview and I'm really hopeful
I guess this update is not something people wanted to hear and I'm going to get some 2x4s. I'll visit every now and then, especially if WAW ever has a changed tone
I keep improving myself and inspiring others to do so as well. My children will always be my priority.
My children have been introduced to OM's parents already. This all happened quite quickly... I mean, we aren't even divorced yet. I'm more of wondering the urgency and the speed of all of this, rather than anything else - to the point of almost laughing at it. It's less than a year since she gave birth my child and now it wouldn't even be surprising if they were engaged already. I think I'm going to take much longer with things, despite not even wanting her back anymore.
D has changed completely. I don't know if it's her age, school or the divorce, but she's really angry and loses temper immediately. She acts out quite a lot too. S smiles and gets really excited every time he sees me. He's so cute. Outside of D's behavior, life is smiling at me currently. If my XW could do something like this so quickly, I think I rather dodged a bullet and lost something.
Good weekend for everyone.
and=than... argh. This board really needs an edit button.
Lcause,
This site really does need an edit button. It use to have one, I dont understand why it was eliminated.
You W seems to be running from something. Do you think she fixed the things that caused a downfall in you'll M? Because, if not she's headed down the same road in a second one. I wonder if the parents of the OM knows she's M? Most likely not. Starting a M or R on a our is not good.
You seem to be strong and moving forward really well. Keep up the DBing.
Joe,
Thanks for the support. I rather think she doesn't want to be alone for the Christmas. This way they can spend time in both places.
I don't know if she even understands she had faults, even though she stated so. Being validated by someone else is just so strong feeling when the person is even close to what you could be normally attracted to.
I don't know about the details. It's only legal at this time so doubt a lot of people care about the marital status. To my knowledge they aren't engaged however I wouldn't be surprised if they soon were.
L,
Thats awesome. You sound strong buddy. Do you have big plans for the holiday?
Joe,
Thanks, haha. I started really wearing cologne and I gotta admit I've caught girls looking at me and even smiling back! I do think my mojo has made a comeback. I guess having sex does wonders for it.
I'm actually taking my kids to my parents at Christmas. It'll be the first time S spends a night with me. XW is still breast-feeding so S hasn't spend a night with me yet.
Thanks for checking by, Joe. I need to read and comment more on the sitches here. I wish you good luck for your piecing process. It's nice some of us do get to that phase. Don't forget what you've learned and keep growing!
LC,
Thanks for the vote of confidence.
So, I'm officially divorced now. I thought I would have had some sort of a feeling but I think I've processed this through too many times already to emotionally feel anything anymore - after all, I knew this would be the end result from the beginning.
2017 certainly marks a year of total change for me. So much can happen in a year. From the most beautiful thing in the world (well, end of 2016) to one of the saddest ones that can happen to a person with mere 5 months in between. Life has its ways... However life is not going to stop here. We all decide how we choose to see the situations we are forced to face - we can either grow or stay miserable. I chose to grow. Life has a lot in store for each one of us but we have to put in the work and seek for the individual next steps that, at the end, combined, do create the entire journey for us. I still do cry sometimes but not because the end of my marriage but because of not having gained the greatness I so desperately want to achieve.
Things are ok between us. We are still extremely amicable, no fights or anything at all. I don't ask or send anything, XW does contact me more - but all of it is related to kids. XW asked if I'd want to join to S's birthday party she's going to organize for her side of relatives and I politely denied. I find it odd in fact, because frankly put, I don't have any intentions of showing up in the same places anymore, especially on those occasions. You are with your next partner now - so children will have two different parties. I personally find it odd that divorced couples come together to spend e.g. Christmas but that's just me.
I'm eagerly waiting for what 2018 brings. I just keep taking the small steps, and there are so many things I want to try. My goal is to each and every day force myself to live in the moment, yet I keep reminding myself that a year from now, I can look back and say I grew. I learned. I lived.
Happy Holidays/Merry Christmas for everyone. All the best for the future
Thanks for the update on your sitch, LC. Just the other day I was saying to myself, "I wonder what ever happened to LC."
I'm sorry it's come to D. I know this was a hard path for you, so I'm glad the negative feelings aren't getting worse.
I hope you can find the personal growth you're looking for.
So, I'm officially divorced now. I thought I would have had some sort of a feeling but I think I've processed this through too many times already to emotionally feel anything anymore - after all, I knew this would be the end result from the beginning.
I can relate, that's kind of what happened with me as well. I was expecting some terrible emotional response and instead it felt more like a weight had been lifted, it was more of a relief than anything else. Glad to hear you're doing well!
We all decide how we choose to see the situations we are forced to face - we can either grow or stay miserable. I chose to grow. Life has a lot in store for each one of us but we have to put in the work and seek for the individual next steps that, at the end, combined, do create the entire journey for us.
Well said!
Just dropping by to suggest a fragrance for men. The people in my country are generally really introverted and so far I've really never got complimented for wearing a fragrance, except by my gf/XW at the time or friends. This one I just bought and have been wearing, so far 2 girls have told me that I smell nice. One guy also told me that he really needs to know what this is. Sure it's a bit pricey, but definitely worth it. The fragrance is Creed Aventus. Compliments could also be because it's not really a mainstream fragrance, especially in my country.
XW cried last time I saw her when she had to talk about the divorce processing fees, because I want to split it 50/50. I don't understand women. Why cry over something like that? It's been over half a year already, get over it. I had zero interest in any kind of emotional support. She just doesn't mean anything to me anymore
Wow you can say that again.. Just checked it. That one IS pricey.
She just doesn't mean anything to me anymore
For real? Only 7 months after BD. That was quick. But good for you though. Must be so much easier to move on then.
Btrow: yeah but it lasts long
Hah, I'm just coming up with reasons to justify buying so expensive fragrance. Actually just ordered Thierry Mugler's Pure Havane.
Hope everyone is doing fine and happy holidays! I had superb time with my kids at my parents. I bonded so much with my son as he was with me for two nights.
Just took kids to XW and she brought OM with her to meet me and the kids at half way. That hurt a bit. I had scenarios running through my mind where I pull the door open and smash my fist to OMs face saying "now we are even", but confidently wished XW merry Christmas, gave kisses to kids, made D to laugh and left. I'm the adult here and I don't need anyone to validate me. I know I will be happy regardless, so happy that people are going to envy me.
Today I'll see all my old friends as we have had this tradition of seeing at this one club at Christmas Day. I will update my to do at new years eve, and this time I will follow through.
Again, happy holidays! And to the newcomers, it will get better. You will discover so many new things about yourself. It's a journey, learn to embrace it. Remember that you are not alone and being divorced does not define you.
What a lovely inspiring post thank you so much for the joy in it.
I love that TM perfume and I adore Angel too......
What fabulous Xmas scented Xmassive.
Thank you
V
Thanks V. This smells quite like a Cuban cigar store, with vanilla and honey.
I've seen a few people mentioning that they don't know how they would take it if there was an OM in the picture. It initially was a shock but the biggest thing for me currently is a) losing over half of the lives of my kids and b) me struggling to find my path despite of trying quite a bit of new things. I can pretty confidently say that I'm not depressed anymore and I find joy in regular things, so - I keep continuing the "kaizen" (the term; not the user
) -way. I don't know about my future and that's the first thing I learned - you can never properly plan it. We need to just keep working hard and eventually the pieces fall down on their own places. Pick a path and stick with it but don't fear to experiment.
Previously I was always feeling bad or being sorry if I couldn't help my XW with something. Now I'm not. If I can't, I can't. It doesn't bother me at all. Just realized this yesterday. A friend from work asked me what would I do if the grass doesn't seem to be greener on the other side - I didn't have answers except for I would be really sad for her if that happened. People who know my situation, all say she probably was having an affair before she told me. I don't know, maybe. Now, I do know her wanting me back is not going to happen ever, but regardless of how nice one tries to be, getting that "ego boost" would still probably give me a nice smile.
I keep visiting less and less... Well I don't have anything to share.
Hey everyone!
I felt like I'd like to update my sitch a bit. I have thought about writing something before but I've been pretty busy lately. Nowadays, I mostly do stuff that I personally enjoy doing and I don't ask what others want, but one additional motivator for this update (and probably upcoming ones too) is that I remember people wanting to hear how the sitches have progressed during the months and years - without the original writers just disappearing.
OM moved in to live with my XW and my kids at some point during the last month. I wish I would have heard this from XW since even though it probably isn't my business, they are still living with my kids. I can't push my morals or my views on others and I try hard to get away from the old, analytical, self - still can't fathom how quickly they decided to do this. Mainly because I fear my toddler is going to be more attached to the OM than me. I do realize this is a useless emotion and I am not going to borrow problems from tomorrow. I can only be the best dad now and trust in the process.
I am not a religious person but I truly do believe this happened for a reason. I am far more happier than I have ever been in my life previously. Why is it surviving the divorce, huh? I call for a thriving after the divorce subforum! I understand FAR more about myself and other people, how emotions come and go, how pessimism and optimism differ, how each one of us here deserves the best, what co-dependency is, what validation is and the list goes on.
I have lived my entire life in fear. Fear of failure, fear of what other people might think about me, fear of not living up to my own or my parents/friends expectations, fear of rejection, fear of not making it, fear of sucking in something... Why? Because even though as silly as these common sense factors might sound, they are all but that! Before you truly learn to stop and UNDERSTAND fully your emotions, you will never understand these factors completely. I have always tried to go past these fears and to cope with them, accepting that it is just how I am. F*#" that s&¤@! Now, I push myself daily. Fears are only beaten by facing them - and by doing that, understanding how useless they are; the mind tricking boundaries created by your own brains.
I am a YouTuber now. I figured making a video series of my life improvement on learning the thing I want to do while showing my struggling to others helps both me and them. I get over my fears and they see other people are walking in the same shoes. I read so many forum posts about people having issues learning this particular thing and I truly believe it's the same issue I have. In addition, this gives me a good routine and constantly reminds me of my changes and what I have to be working on in myself. I think having a routine and consistency are the most important factors in this process. This isn't all what I do but it does take quite a bit of work. I am slowly coming out of the consumption rut towards the creative awesomeness. I am truly challenging myself and even when it sometimes feels like smashing my head to a brick wall, after I've completed the hard task, I feel really good. Life is about learning, growing and challenging oneself.
I've read about a dozen books now. Most about self-improvement and such, but also books about history, leadership, innovation and so on. I never thought I would like to read this much. I find it funny how some of the books I would have never read at all, but I just started reading and found them fascinating later on. Maybe this falls to the "take action before waiting for the feeling" -category. Don't judge the book by its covers, literally.
This post is already a bit too long and all the sitch related stuff was mentioned at the beginning. However if someone reads this far and is still struggling, I remind you that it is only temporary. You will get better. You deserve the best. I leave all the rest motivational stuff for others as there's been quite a many good posts lately (unless asked, of course)
LC,
What's you youtube name or give me a hint, so I can search it and add to the view count?
LC,
Also, I glad to see you coming out the other side. Congrat's buddy. Keep it up. Keep tackling fear. You deserve it.
LC,
What's you youtube name or give me a hint, so I can search it and add to the view count?
Sorry, I like to keep my privacy. There's so much stuff here about me and people related to me so I don't feel confident in sharing it. I realize this might be over cautious, but it is what it is.
LC,
Also, I glad to see you coming out the other side. Congrat's buddy. Keep it up. Keep tackling fear. You deserve it.
Thanks dude. It feels good. I am by no means where I want to be yet - but then again, there's another lesson I learned. Life is never about reaching a set goal or having something and then being happy. Goals are best kept as individual breakpoints or points where you can measure your progress. Solely working on a goal and expecting it to be the end all be all is just wrong. Constant growing is where it is at.
I hope you and your W are fine
Don't forget to keep working on yourself and on your relationship.
OM moved in to live with my XW and my kids at some point during the last month.
Ouch, that had to hurt. Sorry man.
But don't worry about the toddler being more attached to OM. There can be only one daddy, and that is LC.
Regarding the rest of your post, wow, you have certainly done some self-growing. Impressive. Remember when You were a scared little LC and a giant mess just 5 or 6 months ago? Well done.
I'll try searching for your YouTube videos (it's probably against the rules to direct us there), cause I want what LC is having ;-)
Just promise me that you every now and then shut down the computer, close the books, put on some of that extremely expensive cologne, and go out and let the ladies experience the new, improved, awesome LC.
Ouch, that had to hurt. Sorry man.
Well, I do admit I did dwell on that feeling for a bit until I realized it is really all pointless. It's an interesting feeling when you actually understand where the emotions stem from and how you can actually understand and accept them as they are, rather than dwelling on them for a prolonged period of time. Frankly put, this is not related to me at all. It's an external factor - like most of the emotions I feel - and external things aren't really related to my own self-worth or well being. Internal things are what matter the most. You can take away any external possession but you can't never take away what I have experienced myself and how I've grown from it.
But don't worry about the toddler being more attached to OM. There can be only one daddy, and that is LC.
Thanks dude
I do realize this, but as with most fears, they are really irrational and only in the mind. It'll pass and as I said there's no point in living in tomorrow instead of staying in the present.
Regarding the rest of your post, wow, you have certainly done some self-growing. Impressive. Remember when You were a scared little LC and a giant mess just 5 or 6 months ago? Well done.
Thanks and a cliché here: "if I can do it, you can do it!". I believe it's truly just understanding and finding what brings happiness to you, realizing where your emotions come from and how you can control them. That, and realizing you're not alone in this world nor your ex-partner was the "only one for you".
If I'm being asked, I will always say learning new things and pushing yourself over your limits no matter how much it hurts at that particular moment are the things every human should strive for. As far as I know, we are the only species that is born without any skills at all, except for sucking the tit and crying. We can't walk, we can't communicate - we are "programmed" to learn and push ourselves from the get-go.
Just promise me that you every now and then shut down the computer, close the books, put on some of that extremely expensive cologne, and go out and let the ladies experience the new, improved, awesome LC.
Of course. However, being appealing for someone else is now against my own principles. I (try to) wear colognes because they make ME feel good, not to get some random girl to compliment me.
Who the f@!% cares what other people think about me? That's the mentality what I'm constantly, day by day, working towards.
Hey LC! Appreciate the update. I am happy to hear you're thriving and making strides forward.
Hmm... So much time has passed again. Nothing new on my sitch, except that I am in a new relationship. This feels much more mature than my previous ones. There has been days off without communication and we have had serious conversations about our needs and general views. She understands me but does not seem to try to solve my problems, which is really nice. I have not told her about this place and will keep it that way.
My XW and I were never alike. We liked different things, valued different things and chased different things. Part of this realization made me think about sitches overall and wonder why people believe in this "script". If the "script" applied to my case, OM would be someone who is "less" than I am in many areas - but he is not. I think those cases where OPs are "less" are the minority. One could go on and babble about morals and such, but morals and ethics could be debated till the distant future. Fact of the matter is that impulses can easily override morals. My XW wanted something else in her life than what I was offering, she was not this "foggy" depressed person. Sometimes people just are not a fit for each other. What I am really saying here is that I think newcomers are comforted too much about their own value by bashing the OP when in fact the two best life advices I have ever heard is "take 100% responsibility of your life and what happens to you" and "compare yourself to who you were yesterday, not to someone else". This comfort makes them basically addicted to this site and the people supporting. Leave the anger, belittlement, moral pushing, ego-fixing and just live your life to the fullest.
I have spent way too much time thinking life and its meaning. I do not really know why I sometimes think about my past and my marriage or XW. One thing I know for sure that it is not about wanting to reconciliate. More of thinking about the meaning of it or the actions that lead us to where we end up divorcing. I do not know if this is normal, even though I am already in a new relationship. It is not harming though and I believe fully in myself that I am not trying to replace anything with anyone.
The morals I have adapted are generally viewed as christian. That combined with extreme interest to find my purpose and to satisfy my intellect and cognitive needs, I have been reading the bible even though I do not believe in deity and generally identify as an atheist. Oh boy how much I have changed. If you would have told me two years ago that I would be reading the bible through with an actual curiosity in the stories it teaches (as I think I could have read it through as just an interest in it as general knowledge, to see what it is really all about or to impress people in quizzes) I would have laughed my ass off and called you crazy. Well, here I am, next tackling Dostoevskys books.
I find it interesting that people find meditation and mindfullness as useless practices. My XW told that this is her view. I have seen evidence of the contradictory sort. Maybe some people are generally very mindful and thus do not require these practices - but I have seen personal improvement alongside with actual research results indicating otherwise, at least with some subjects.
Well, I just wanted to share something so this message is probably all over the place. As a new era has started in my life, this will be my last update to my sitch. I wish you all the best for the future and many thanks for the people who have helped me along my journey. You know who you are.
LC
Well, I thought that was the last post. Update: they got engaged. Also, OM was accepted to a prestigious university, having a bright future when it comes to salary and career. Somehow my self-image got shattered - not because I would care to get my XW back, but because it reflects how much worse I am in many aspects. I am sure I could get there with work too but I have zero interest in that career path. I will never have the possibility to get as high when it comes to social appreciation and no matter how hard I have tried, changing my view about the meaning of money is not working. There have been times when I question the possibility of changing oneself altogether as I think this doing is just forceful facade, not a genuine change. Somehow the neural pathways do not die. Maybe it requires more time but I am getting somewhat exhausted of forcing myself. I like it, but why does not it become natural already? Maybe it is genetic.
Well, gladly this was the first time I got a setback in months and it is mostly about a reflection of myself, not really about them. Overall I feel pretty content.
Happy summer.
LC,
Do not worry about him or any fancy degrees he might earn. She did not leave you because of your earning power or lack of diplomas on the wall. And if she did, who needs such a shallow person after all. I was replaced by a guy 12 years my senior. He looks his age, dresses his age and when speaking, sounds like he is some low-intelligent hillbilly. I make probably 20-30K more than him per year, look better, dress better and the list goes on an on. You know there is no logic in neither of our sitches, right?
If you are happy being you, then do not chase after something else. Personally I am happy with who I am. I will not let the actions of my XW define me. I label myself a succes. You do the same. The best version of ourselves is the most we can achieve. And if you are there now, then you are there now. Stop forcing yourself.
Thanks Btrow. It is just the talk about them always switching to someone worse which gets me. Like it is also in your case. I know she did not leave me because of that, but my self image still got bruised as a reflection of not being a good enough of a person on many areas. Like somehow I am missing in life - I would not even take my XW back anymore even if it was a possibility. Not sure why it is this way but it is. I was just fine and not caring about it all for many months. I have been GALing, occupying myself constantly, meeting new people, traveling, building things... Still the happiness does never feel truly genuine. I am beginning to question that I have some genetic issue or my brain has altered from a concussion with a seizure earlier in my life. Maybe this is coming up with am explanation but this much work and I ultimately feel like, outside of detachment when it comes to XW, I am at the beginning.
Healing is going to take a lot of time, even if you are doing everything right. I still miss my old "family". And. I am more than 6 months longer into the proces than you are. It is not just the wife we lost, is it.
No matter if we want them back or not, we were still betrayed and/or abandoned by the one who knew us best. The one we really depended on. That will hurt for a long long time. No matter the amount of gal we do. Do you remember missmyfriend or whatever his name was. 11 years later he still misses the XW. So one year for you really is not that long even if it feel that way. You will get there.
The affair down we hear about all the time, forget about it. They all affair up. At least in their own minds. But that has nothing to do with us. We were good enough for a long time. We were not the one that changed, right?
How are things with your new lady?
See, I don't really miss her. I miss my kids each time I have to give them back, but that's only for a few hours. Days I'm without them, I don't really miss them in the sense of "feeling" it. Of course I would want to be with them but it's not an active thought that occupies my mind daily.
I don't really feel betrayed. I'm over the divorce already but I am not happy with myself. I feel bad that my own life is not even close to what I want it to be. The issue is that I will never be there since I lack the traits that would make me be there. I have so high anxiety about everything and I am a perfectionist that I can't appreciate anything but perfect - if I know I can't do it perfectly, then I'd rather not do it at all. I've been forcing myself believing in self-help stuff but months have gone by without any real progress. I'm still the same person with the same thoughts, restrictions, skills and features. I still get anxiety, I still find it hard to do things, I still find it hard to study, I still find it hard to apply for jobs... Frankly put I'm tired of forcing myself to be something that I am not. I am getting frustrated at the self-help, "you can be whatever you want to be", "you make your own happiness" bullcrap. Some people are happy that they can for example buy more material and thus are materialistic, that's just the truth. Just as an example.
Therapy does not help. Has been expensive and thus I quit it. Meds and stuff do, Ashwagandha, Theanine and Green tea have been an amazing combination for my anxiety. I've been on/off for about 20 times now and each time I've taken these, my anxiety is not nearly as bad it usually is. I don't overanalyze everything which feels amazing. Wish I would have found this combination earlier. Works better than exercise.
My point is that some people think they always affair down when compared to the LBS but that's just nonsense designed to make the LBS feel better about themselves - or my scenario is a special case. The only trait OM has "worse" than I do is the moralistic view, but who cares. He is not an alcoholic, he is younger than I am, he is in better shape, has more money, more friends, more active life... I think stating this is very harmful and causes comparisons anyways, like this. People in this board go overboard to mock OPs and WWs/WASs when they are simply people with needs, wants and passions too. I know now that if my relationship is not going the way I want it to go, I'll bail out. Life is too short to spend on with someone you are not happy with.
The girl is a much better match than XW was. She is supportive, appreciative and knows how to say "thank you". She validates, rather than either tries to fix my issue or gets pissed about me complaining about something. I don't recall XW EVER validating or really understanding my issues. I always felt like she did not really appreciate me. Part of me thinks it was my own fault... New girl has higher sex drive than I do which I find a bit pressing at times. She doesn't have kids but wants to have one. I planned on having three, so I am fine with having one more. We jog together quite a bit, pretty much each day we see each other. And go to sauna, of course. I just don't know... She is not generally worried about life and laughs at my jokes, seems to have fun and doesn't complain about her work. She listens to my interests (like programming) even when she doesn't understand a single tiny bit - and actually tries to understand by asking questions! She feels like superb gf material, outside of having mere college degree and not university... Will not be as successful as it comes to a career and I really hate myself for even thinking about these outside factors. This just seems to be so hardwired in me. I wish I could just ditch these mental blocks... Of course, this is all early in the process so her views about me could change after "limerence" wears off. I am not limerent but actually very careful, probably even too much. Sometimes she can be a bit clingy though.