Quick details:
Married for 4 years, together 9
2 young boys (under 5)
Seperated 9 months - my wife initiated separation
For the first 5, 6 months of separation, my wife kept asking me to move out, I begged pleased did everything wrong. Found divorce busting, totally changed my life! Way better now than 3 months ago. Given my wife lots of space but maintained in home separation.
Lately she really wants me to move out-she's firm that I go by sunday--but for one week to see what happens she says.
Well I usually would not however, there is some interesting behaviour that make me think one week might be okay.
For about 2 years(since our other son was born) she has always been way more loving of me when we are apart. She texts me nice things, she is very pleasent. However, once I get home her tone changes! She's far less nice, doesn't want to see me. That's why I thought a week away might be okay - maybe she'll miss me a lot and ask me to come back? I believe it's highly possible
However, there are downside risks, and I understand. I know divorce busting advices against moving out and until his point I have steered clear. But she's been pressing more now and she did say the words: 'for one week and then we'll see what happens'
So I need some advice - I'm really trying to save my family and especially my kids. They mean everything to me
ALSO! It's my Wife's birthday on the 13th. Do I buy her something? She bought me nothing 2 months ago for mine.
Open to any and all advice. Thank you so much
Welcome to the board
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htmYou may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH. Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Consult a lawyer before moving out for a week. There could be legal ramifications.
Thanks Thornton. Certainly will do!
Take a vacation for a week.
ALSO! It's my Wife's birthday on the 13th. Do I buy her something? She bought me nothing 2 months ago for mine.
No only no, but hell no.
Work on yourself for you and your kids' sake - not the "wife." Its not about her anymore. Just you. Only you.
Why a week, and why adamantly by this Sunday? Hopefully I'm just cynical and have read too many stories here, but is it possible she has something planned with someone else that you can't be around for? Tell her it's almost Easter, you need to be here for that with the kids, and you'll think about it.
Why can't she move out for a week, if that's what she wants?
Leaving the home is the worst thing you can do.
Great. Thanks for the advice guys! Definitely will not move out. I'm going to take a business trip for a few days this week
Be prepared that if you leave, you may not be allowed back in.
In my opinion, youve been separated for 9 months, I dont see what one week apart is going to do. What exactly are you going to 'see'?
No you're right. My thought was that the physical separation might make her 'miss me' and want me to come back. But upon reflection and talking with you guys, the best way to achieve that is with a trip or working longer hours more consistently- moving out would be a horrible idea.
I'm going to be contrarian and recommend that you do find a way to live apart. If what you're doing isn't working do something else. If she wants you out and you refuse you're establishing a constant, persistent adversarial relationship in the house. She's saying "I want more space" and you're saying "you can't have it". That tension moves to the forefront and becomes a blocker for anything else to change.
That said, it doesn't have to be you who moves out. I agree 100% that you should talk to a lawyer first. It can be very helpful to draft a separation agreement that specifies how you two are going to manage things while you're separated, because you then have "rules" you're both living by and don't need to negotiate every thing that comes up. Once again, you want to remove points of friction and contention so you're not arguing every time you talk.
There's a school of thought known as "relationship judo" which suggests that your best approach is not active resistance. She wants to live apart? Great! Let's together figure out how that's going to work. Change it from a conflict to a team challenge where you're actually working together on a plan.
Regarding her being nice to you when you're not around, but then going cold while you're there, this is what is *often* going on (but not always):
When you're not there, she thinks about a romanticized version of you. She thinks about you when you're at your best, and remembers good times that you've had together. This is often considered "loving who you want someone to be, versus loving who they are". Therefore, she's projecting this nice stuff onto a vision of who she wishes you were.
When you then spend time with her, you don't match the fantasy person she wants you to be and she gets annoyed at that and withdraws. Your reality doesn't match her vision.
That's not to say that there's anything wrong with you, there's not. It's just a reflection of that fact that she doesn't feel she's getting what she needs from the relationship.
Sometimes when that happens people start an EA or PA and project their "fantasy soulmate" onto their affair partner. The good news in this case is that she's still projecting it onto you when you're not around.
In standard DB style evaluate what it is you're doing or not doing that isn't working for her, and then decide if you want to address that for yourself. If you "do it for her" that won't work, because you're just pursuing a tactic as a means to an end and she'll see through it and won't believe in it. You need to do it for you because you believe its worth doing regardless of what happens in your marriage. That's a real change people can believe in.
Give her the space she wants, figure it out as a team.
Acc
No you're right. My thought was that the physical separation might make her 'miss me' and want me to come back. But upon reflection and talking with you guys, the best way to achieve that is with a trip or working longer hours more consistently- moving out would be a horrible idea.
Hello hubby89,
I'm so sorry for the situation you are in.
It is going to sound like an echo around regarding you not moving out of your marital home. Throwing yourself into your work is one way to give her space, but what about something fun? Any hobbies or activities that you were involved in before the two of you met?
Focus all of your time, effort and energy into being the best hubby89 and dad that only a fool would leave. What GAL activities would that include?
Knowing what to do and what not to do at this point is crucial. Feel free to give me a call at 303-444-7004 to discuss how we can best help you determine what to do next.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004
While I'm here, anyone have advice on responding to pressing questions oabout me moving out? Usually I play a fancy dance, avoid subject. any one with ideas for a good response/how to deal with it?
Thanks!
So after about 9 months of separation my wife finally said she had enough and asked me to move-she was specific however that I move for a week to see how things go.
Anyways, after some great feedback here:
I decided that I will not be moving out
This made her very angry and now she is threatening to leave with our two young boys tomorrow for a week. She's trying to guilt trip me into leaving so she doesn't have to uproot the boys.I told my wife I'll go on a business trip for a few days on Wednesday but she quickly shot that down.
She says I'm causing her anxiety(in general) and she can only get better(or know if she can) if I leave. I'm pushing for couples therapy now-praying she goes for that. Plan is to find a good pro-marriage counsellor.
Anyways, in the meantime, I'd hate for her to uproot the kids and move with them for a week -not sure of the best path forward for now but I'm not moving.
Thoughts?
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Threads merged
Well now my wife is being super pushy about me moving out. Getting combative. But I just won't. I'm worried she files for divorce this week and we go down that path. All hard things to think about. But I'm keeping a level head on things. Not getting emotional or falling into her traps.
My number one goal is to be the best father for my children as possible. So I want to get my family back. Again, any and all advice is very appreciated!
Do not take the bait.
Your wife wants you to react so she can justify her behaviors. Detach And keep your focus on you and the kids.
Hubby,
You seem to be in a tough spot, but like others on here why can't she move out? You seem to be the only option out from her side, but is that right?
Only suggestions I have is to continue doing the best things to help YOU in this and GAL, do something for you, focus on the kids and detach from your W.
Always easier said than done.
Best of luck,
Trying
Thanks guys. I should say, throughout this I've done a fantastic job getting my life in order. Started working out, spending time with friends again, quality time with my boys. Very proud of myself.
My wife is now begging me. She writes: I'm begging you to give it a week. I really need you to leave, or pay for a hotel room for me.
Well that's too bad for her. I'm staying home and looking after my boys and I. I pray she comes back to me because I miss her-but I'm prepared to do what's best for me and my boys
Well we just had a very serious discussion-she called me names, begged me to leave. Said I was being mean and unfair.
I did not take the bait. Ultimatum after ultimatum from my wife that either I leave or she leaves with the kids. I was firm as a statue. She almost cried.
I just left to grab my kids from my folks who are babysitting.
I offered my wife to go to counselling. She said no. Maybe she will maybe she won't. Maybe she'll be home when I get back with my kids, maybe she won't.
But I'll be there, with my kids. My wife is always welcome. And I'll be a good father and (if she ever needs) a good husband
Furthermore, my wife's only money, is the money I give her. And she constantly blows through it. And she has none right now which is also causing some pressure on her. But I decided to stop giving her money a few months back because it wasn't the smartest thing to feed her spending addiction and was bad for the kids
But I'll be there, with my kids. My wife is always welcome. And I'll be a good father and (if she ever needs) a good husband
Good for you! That's the very best thing you can do for you, and your kids, and (in the end) your wife. If she wants out, then by god let her be the one to walk away.
Furthermore, my wife's only money, is the money I give her. And she constantly blows through it. And she has none right now which is also causing some pressure on her. But I decided to stop giving her money a few months back because it wasn't the smartest thing to feed her spending addiction and was bad for the kids
This is... less good. You should consult an attorney on this and make sure this is not going to cause you trouble in the end if everything falls apart.
Thanks! Sure will.
My wife left for the night again. She was balling after she left. I feel this might lead to a meltdown where she comes back to us and apologizes. She is essentially in a place right now where we are the only positive option in her life. Which is great. She can live a happy life with her family or throw everything out and live a not-so-good life
This forum and posting has been good for clearing my head
I'm afraid your W is feeling trapped and feeling like a cornered animal. It seems you have the power to keep her with you by refusing to give her any money and refusing to leave the house.
Where do you hope this will lead?
How do you see it getting there?
Well my hope is that my wife sees the light and that she comes back to us. I actually do give her money. But it's just a monthly draw that comes out and has for the past 2 years. I users to give her even more on top of that. So she has the power to make her own changes if she adjusts her habits.
Well my hope is that my wife sees the light and that she comes back to us. I actually do give her money. But it's just a monthly draw that comes out and has for the past 2 years. I users to give her even more on top of that. So she has the power to make her own changes if she adjusts her habits.
Controlling her into seeing the light will only cause harm.
She's never had access to the bank accounts? She only gets what you hand her?
hubby89,
Well my hope is that my wife sees the light and that she comes back to us.
Well this is the universal hope on this board right?
What do you think leads to someone seeing the light?
Do you want to be the "least worst option", or the best option, and what is the difference in your view?
Fair point Accuray. My intention has never been to trap my wife. We never set up a joint account because it just never came up. Throughout our marriage i've simply been giving her money because that has been our relationship.
I guess my earlier post did come across as I'm trying to steer her a certain way - which is causing me to re-evalute how I've been treating her.
I suppose my whole thought all along is to work on myself as a person and as a father. I thought that if I made positive changes, not only will i feel better about myself, but she will come back to me.
I'm not trying to have my wife act certain ways or make certain decisions, my biggest challenge is constantly figuring ways how I should respond to her when she attacks me or becomes verbally aggressive. I don't want to be cold, but if I agree with her or go along with her wishes, it could lead to far worse scenario for my children and I. I want to be positive and warm yet no go with her down a path that will hurt my family. Tricky situation.
And I appreciate the feedback - it really means a lot.
I must say my wife sends very confusing messages to me. She walks around me naked all the time, she has no problem pouting, telling me about everything going on with herself, and what she thinks of her friends. She is still expecting a birthday present and wants me to buy her things!
I guess those are positive things. Obviously not so repulsed with me that she keeps to herself. It's not a game changer but it's nice to see that she still has some connection with me. I believe all you need is the smallest hook and it's possible to reel in anything!
I'm not trying to have my wife act certain ways or make certain decisions, my biggest challenge is constantly figuring ways how I should respond to her when she attacks me or becomes verbally aggressive. I don't want to be cold, but if I agree with her or go along with her wishes, it could lead to far worse scenario for my children and I. I want to be positive and warm yet no go with her down a path that will hurt my family. Tricky situation.
If she attacks you or becomes verbally aggressive don't engage. Make it clear that you won't tolerate that, it's not acceptable behavior, and then continue to reinforce.
As with parenting the best arguments are those you only have once because the other party sees there is no leeway.
Note this is only if she's attacking you or being abusive, not if you just disagree with her. If you disagree, validate her point of view. Make sure she understands that you know how she feels, but that doesn't mean you agree with her. To most people, validation is more important than agreement.
Acc
Thanks accuray-great points!
Does anyone else wish they could just tell their wife how much they love her?
I am still madly in love with my wife. Most beautiful woman I ever seen. I miss her terribly. It's amazing. We live together, see each other all the time, have two kids and I can't tell her how I feel. I know that it won't help my situation so I say nothing. But my goodness is it hard! Definitely good motivation though
Happy Easter to everyone
Well unfortunately had a negative step by wife today. She came to my office with our 2 wonderful children for a lunch visit. We sat, chatted, had a nice time.
Then my wife asked about filing taxes and told me she wants us to file as separated. I didn't get into it much. But she said she wants it as evidence in case she wants to file for divorce in the next year - she wants a document to say we've been separated i guess.
She did say 'in case', which means its plausible she won't. Gotta stay optimistic and positive!
Anyways, every year I take care of the tax filings for both of us. She offered to do hers herself or asked if I could for her. Obviously if i do, i have to state that we are separated. I think that's the best thing to do.
Anyone with thoughts on this? Thanks and take care
hubby89,
"Married filing separately" for tax purposes doesn't have anything to do with the state of your marriage, so it isn't evidence that you're separated today. Some people pay less taxes if they file jointly, and some people pay less taxes overall if they file separately even though they are married.
You should do what allows you to pay the least amount of tax based on the advice of your accountant.
Does your state have a requirement that you have to be separated for some period of time before you divorce and is your wife trying to start the clock on that just in case? That's something she should talk to a lawyer about -- that's not what that filing status is about on your federal return.
Acc
Hate to throw this out there, but is there a possibility that W wants to file taxes separately because she will claim some expenses or income that she doesn't want you to know about?
Anyone with thoughts on this?
hubby89,
I'm wrong more often than I'm right, but here's my two cents...
Your wife is temp checking. She wanted to see your reaction. I think her reasoning for filing separately is totally bogus. She just wanted to take another shot and see if you'd writhe in pain.
Accuray, not sure to be honest. I will heed the advice of my accountant and go with what he says is best for tax purposes.
EastTN, no, that wouldn't be an issue because she wants me to actually do the paperwork and filing
doodler, I totally agree with you
Hey guys, something I'm really trying more to understand is this great quote:
Anyone with thoughts on this?
hubby89,
I'm wrong more often than I'm right, but here's my two cents...
Your wife is temp checking. She wanted to see your reaction. I think her reasoning for filing separately is totally bogus. She just wanted to take another shot and see if you'd writhe in pain.
I really want to understand this more. I firmly believe it to be true. But why?
For example, my wife and I would be having several good days then all of a sudden she'll say: 'so when are you moving out'(or something like that. Totally out of the blue! I don't believe she's sincere--but wants to take a swipe.
Why do wives do this?
It isn't just wives that do stuff like that.
Hey guys, something I'm really trying more to understand is this great quote:
Anyone with thoughts on this?
hubby89,
I'm wrong more often than I'm right, but here's my two cents...
Your wife is temp checking. She wanted to see your reaction. I think her reasoning for filing separately is totally bogus. She just wanted to take another shot and see if you'd writhe in pain.
I really want to understand this more. I firmly believe it to be true. But why?
For example, my wife and I would be having several good days then all of a sudden she'll say: 'so when are you moving out'(or something like that. Totally out of the blue! I don't believe she's sincere--but wants to take a swipe.
Why do wives do this?
I'd guess it's to reinforce the feelings in their head, to make you the bad guy so you can be the victim. Mine does that lots, even within the same day. Perfectly pleasant in the morning, perfectly evil by evening. Or nice by text message during the day, and cold as ice when I walk through the door.
Mine even initiated sex last Wednesday, then Thursday hated me again. There is a lot of complicated stuff going in in their heads, and there's many issues to be resolved. Focusing on you as the bad guy is essential to their narrative, and they probably resent themselves slipping and being nice - so double down.
hubby89, the "hot and cold" thing, or the "touch and go" is your W testing you. She's trying to navigate this, she knows that you want her back and fully committed. Sometimes she will "lean in" to see how it feels -- do you get along well? How does she feel about it?
If, when she's leaning in, things start getting a little too comfortable, or she's afraid that she's signaling to you that everything is okay, then she will "lean out" by throwing a dart at you to let you know that everything is not okay.
It's a little dance where she's trying out connecting with you, will catch herself, and jump back out.
That's normal and you should expect that to go on for a long time. The best prescription is to just ignore her leaning out. Don't react to it. Don't show that it bothers you. You want your demeanor to just be on an even keel. She's nice to you? Great! She's mean to you? Who cares, you're still happy and know how to take care of yourself.
Make sense?
If you can show her that she doesn't have power over your emotions, then you become "safe" and she can move closer without fearing that you're suddenly going to grab her leg and never let go.
That's really what it's about, she doesn't want your emotions to be tied to her, and she doesn't want your emotions to sweep her away.
Acc
You are the best Accuray! Thanks so much for putting that into perspective.