Here is a link to my first post
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...05#Post2611605.This journey to detachment has been a slow but steady process and I am thankful for the support here. The feedbacks and comments are encouraging.
This past weekend was typical where activities are family focus (kid events and social with friends). The one difference is WW continued to be friendly and polite towards me as we entered the weekday. She even said goodnight to me Monday night; she NEVER does that (always goes to other bedroom without a word).
Also on Monday night, I saw several text alerts on her phone pop up from OM.
I did not freak out or bring it up (kudos to me.. first time not saying a word about it). I assumed she was sharing how my S10 won his flag football championship tournament on Sunday; along with other stuff. Had a flash back where W shared S10 win with league baseball championship this spring (back then I saw the text along with the sex texting too). Did I mention OM is the owner/head coach of the travel baseball team my S10 played on? Makes me ask the question, is it wrong for me to take a stand that I will support any baseball team my S10 wants to play on
EXCEPT for this travel baseball team this OM owns?
Journaling.
Work has been crazy busy leaving little time for me to work on my personal goals. I have the framework but need to put it down on paper so I may routinely review and edit as needed.
Last night I went to a school fundraiser for my S10; just parents. I went in place of my W and would have never signed up for this but actually walked away from it feeling good. It was an exercise class (spinning). The instructor made it fun. While I was suffering on the stationary bike I had a moment to reflect that heck I got to stop feeling sorry for myself and move on; I don't deserve to be punished (mentally and emotionally) for something I truly was not aware of (not knowing I was not meeting my W needs); so it's time to learn from my mistakes; pick-up my pieces (she broke me) and raise up to be a better man.
Someone at my work made a comment on the crazy hours (and pressure) many people are experiencing here at my job. Though he was making reference to a job I found it insightful. He said, don't waste 90% of your life worrying about the 10%; enjoy life. I took this as why am I wasting my time focusing on something I have no control over.. I am getting there.. DETACHING.
Journaling.
Every year we spending Thanksgiving with family. Last few years we hosted but this year I am going to be selfish (I hate spending 1 day prepping and the next day cleaning up) so want to do something different and take my kids on a roadtrip (since they have no school). We will see how things go. Leaving tonight (Tues) and returning this weekend. W is coming. It's the only way the kids expressed interest in going. I am detaching from R so we will see how I feel during and after roadtrip.
So, we decided on a nontraditional thanksgiving this year; short road-trip. We hit the road Tuesday after work. Wife offered to drive first leg so that I don't have to drive the entire 6 hours.
Kids fall asleep. Three hours into the drive, it's 9pm (of course traffic), wife's phone is in the center console's cup holder, she gets a text and it's from the OM. I ask her if she would like me to drive so she can answer him. She does not respond to me but continues with our conversation; ignoring my jab.
We make a rest stop. When she returns to the vehicle she places her iPhone turned screen down on the floor. I jab her again, saying she doesn't have to turn your phone screen down to hide his texting.. shouldn't take the risk of scratching iPhone screen; she ignores me again and doesn't fall for it.
I was loosing control of my thoughts and emotions. The first 2 days at theme park I can't shake off the fact that she is still communicating with him. It was impacting MY TIME and SPACE with MY KIDS.
Third day we leave for another theme park down the road. We get there and my S10 points out a boy few years older than him wearing a hoodie with the travel baseball team he played on.. the travel baseball team owned and coached by the OM. I jab at W again saying, maybe mom can take a picture of the boy and send it to OM. She doesn't fall for it but gives me a look of please stop it.
2 hours pass and we exit a ride. On the exit out, my S10 jumps up and down as if he sees a celebrity saying there is <beep>. The OM!! We have to walk past him because he sitting down eating lunch with his team parents. I am thinking WTF!
We walk passed OM. WW and OM do not knowledge each other. So, I call out to W asking her to hold-up. I say, you can go back and hangout with them and I will take the kids. She replies, no I am here to spend time with.. <not sure what she said cause I was in a f#@! blur> and continues to walk while holding my S10 hand.
She gets back in line for the same ride because its my S8 favorite ride (only ride he actually cares to ride). At that moment I lose it.. I learn towards her and whisper.. you have NO f@#!'en IDEA how I feel. Her response in a claim tone, no I do not.
I know I should not confront W but how can I let this go? I realize she will just lie to me.. again. But, to ignore it? It's driving me NUTS!!
During our road-trip and over the weekend W kept going over the activities now to the end-of-year. There is a lot, half are kid activities but the rest are purely adult relate events. I want to ask her what's up with her and the OM. Perhaps she would prefer to go with OM. I recall reading somewhere that someone did not want to be in an open marriage; I understood the concept but now I am feeling that I too do not want to be in an open marriage.. where I get nothing but the crap that comes with a marriage. Why should I PRETEND to be married? This is not my definition of a marriage. I wasted 2 years of my life.
Flashback.. several weeks ago she removed all pictures and memorabilia of marriage. She even went into my dresser and threw out all the greeting cards/notes I kept from when we were dating. I found them in the trash.. and if I didn't find them by chance my kids would have thrown them out with the trash (their chore).
Back to present.. holidays around the corner and she already sent out invites to our Christmas party. But for the past few days I have been seriously thinking perhaps she can do ALL the work (and cover all the cost herself.. she works), I will step out that night and she can invite OM. Why not, many of our friends know who this OM is because of his business (travel baseball team) then it does not need to be a secret A. OM can be her date for the other holiday events too. I do not want to be with her!
What's bad about this situation is I know this past road-trip was for my kids. But subconsciously I let my MR get to me. I rode my S10 hard for misconducts like picking on his younger brother while standing in line, in the car ride, at dinner, etc. I had a hard time differentiating my S10 from the kid he is who admires a coach he looks up too.. problem for me is the coach is the OM.. only if he knew the truth. Perhaps I should confront W and tell her we should tell our kids about our MR and OM..
I can't carry this secret much longer.. it's eating at me.
You would do that to your child?
Does this site not advocate exposing affairs to the whole world to crush them like the filthy little bugs they are? It is impossible to work on a marriage if there are more than two people in that marriage. Affairs are never ever a positive thing and must be ended. Affairs thrive on secrecy and deception. Take those two tools away and and they wither and die. I've been there.
HI Tx,
Im not an expert here by no means but experience has shown that bringing in the kids too early can have devastating effects.
Only when things are terminal 100% do you bring them so everyone can start adjuting. Involving them in squabbles or as backup to go against WS is a really bad idea.
I know all this from all angles. The life as you knew it is over. You dont take sides if you are young. You just want mummy and daddy back again.
A married couple are together through a different love of their children. You can fall out of love with a S but for a child mummy will always be mummy, etc. Unless of course there are othher issues.
To put it short... anger, vengeance, spite and children dont mix.
As for 123's jabs at wife, he is not DB at all and jabs, snide remarks, etc they wont get him anywhere. He has mentioned he has been hard on S. That is what he is achieving.
It is a tough situation by all means that we have not been taught to handle so best to listen to what the people here who know have to say.
Peace
Max
I understand but even Dr. Harley, who is very accommodating when it comes to affairs, prescribes exposure as the best chance of killing it. Marriages can not be saved while one member of them is having an affair with someone else. That's one person too many in the marriage. If we're telling betrayed spouses just to go along with the affair to save their marriage then I'd love to know the logic behind that.
Your question was does not this site advocate exposing affairs to the whole world. The answer is that Divorce Busting does not advocate exposing. Marriage Builders and some other sites, do advocate exposure. That's not to say that we don't have a few independent board members who support the idea, but MWD does not. In fact, she came to post about that particular subject a few years ago.
Dr. Harley and MWD have different approaches.
Thank you very much for the explanation. I guess the difference is here we're trying to stave off divorce and not necessarily work on marriage building...yet. I can maybe see the point but at least you have to agree that working on a marriage is darn near impossible when one member of it is having a relationship with someone else. Human brains aren't wired that way.
Titles can often be misleading, I think.
The other site is tougher, IMHO, but you better not step sideways with
anything Dr. Harley teaches! I agree with a great deal with what he says, although, I prefer this site much more.
Hi Sandi, good to hear from you. I am going crazy!
I swing from detaching..
to I want my W back!
I know I should not have done it but last night I
lost my cool and brought up MR. W in family room sitting on couch and told me she just added all the events/activities into our family calendar.. that was my lead in and I asked in a respective voice if she wanted to spend the holidays with OM and she said, no. My reply was, "he texted you on our family vacation". Her reply was, "I can't stop him from texting" then she caught herself and said, "well, I could". What was different this time, for the
first time, I could
feel myself loosing control and getting upset at the entire sit (did not yell but dropped a few f bombs).
I realize I am the one who is hurting; not her. It's what I do that makes a difference not the conversations. The conversation does not reveal new insight but I want to share a few comments W made (in no particular order) as she crys (W rarely tears but does when she tells me the following):
1. You were not there for me (I agreed based on the examples W shares to make her case; I see her viewpoint now).
2. I have been alone for a long time. You only feel like this now because I am not in your corner anymore.
3. You would not have changed if it was not for the affair (She is probably correct. W always refers to affair in past tense.. but she talks to OM).
4. The abortion broke/changed me.
She asked me questions that caught me off guard:
1. I made a comment like "you not the woman I married". She replied "you are right.. I never would have imagined I would have had an affair or an abortion at 40. Why do you want to be with me then"? I did not respond.
2. I made a comment like "this is a f@#! situation we created for ourselves". Her reply was like, "how do you suggest we fix it"? I just replied it would not be easy.
Towards the end of the conversation she said, "I do not know what I want. You should do want makes you happy do not wait for me. It may be 2, 3, 5 years before I know and I may regret it". She acknowledged she is the one who has to do the work to make the change but also said she could not get back to me (hinting to how she views me.. as a selfish individual and was never there for her).
This stinks because I see that she needs to give up OM then and only then does it have a change to work. But her personality is to take the path of least resistance and the resentment she holds is so strong.. she often said her heart turned cold.
Hi Maximus,
Thanks for the posting re: kids and adult sit. That said, I am just going crazy and probably would not do such thing as bring kids into it.
Awhile back (before I found this website) I had my suspicion of A and some solid evident but would be
the fool and believe W's lies. So I took a lesson from kids' schooling and started to journal. The journal started off as facts but turned into a journal where the audience was my kids. W found it on computer.. deleted it.. held that against me for awhile. Never indented to share with kids but it helped me cope with my feelings/thoughts at that time.
I am at the early/mid phase of detaching but lost it. I suppose seeing the OM text W on our family road trip brought back a rush of memories of seeing my W's text messages to OM on summer family vacation (she sent him the icon with kisses and hearts).. I never got those! How they interacted (as if strangers) when we walked pasted him at the theme park brought back the same behavior I witnessed at S10 baseball games... to know I handed over my hard earn $$ for S10 baseball to OM and to learn OM with my W..
Hi 123,
Crazy is normal, Not good just normal. It is one of the many emotional states you will go through until you stabilize.
When people say they are on a rollercoaster ride they mean it.
The unfortunate thing is that damage control goes out the window. Consequences are no longer an issue. You have an objective and dont give a sh1t about them.
If you read the posts here, whatever your sex, there is a pattern we all start off from when BD hits. As men and women are wired differently the recovery may be similar but the day to day i think is different.
In your case i understand you and feel for you. I know what you are going through. Unfortunately as my parents also split up when I was young I also know what it feels like to a LBC (left behind child). I know what it is to be dragged into a slagging match and artillery barrage of negative emotions between 2 people who hate each other. I am supposed to attack/defend 2 opposing forces that I loved, both of them. It is cruel and I always advocate that children are not leverage.
I am also against the WS/WAS that also leave the children behind or those that use custody as a tool to effect injury to the other party because they are emotionally immature.
Zero tolerance.
When I read your posts I was disappointed you had chosen that option. Please stop it period. No excuses.
Going back to you. You are still a loooong way to go to be detached. It sounds easy, people vent and then mention it as a mental reminder but truth is even the pro's are hit with emotional arrows everytime that the S says something that triggers off a memory. We are human, make mistakes and have feelings. The thing is you STILL need to do it and also GAL. Until you start enforcing them for some time you will not see any benefits. When you do, it is like someone tuned on a LED in a tunnel to lead the way out.
In the meantime you will feel pain, as you are now, be lost and confused. Don't worry, help is at hand. From those that know a lot to those who just offer support, you will feel comforted, helped and cared for by the people here. And no I am not the forum PR.
Your W has her mind on the OM. He is the new love of her life. As simple as that. She quit her job as your W and fired you as her H. Now she has feelings for someone else. When a W goes rogue I understand that the chances and probability of getting her back are very small.
Women are emotional creatures and our logic and way of thinking is different. We speak in mathematics, logic and equations, etc. They speak poetry, latin, etc. What we think should work generally doesnt if we think like a man.
You are thinking like a man dont. If you understand what is going through her head when she sends those messages and icons you will have a grasp what it is she is missing or looking for. The OM just hit the jackpot with your W. [censored].
When I first found out about my W EAPA i hit the roof. Truth is after some nice conversations and posts from members I realized I ignited it. I had a PA some time ago that made my W feel unloved and she got into an EAPA. She also sent icons and lovey messages to OM and never to me in all these years. Why? I never made her feel loved and desired. Focusing my attention on my OW I neglected my W who felt this and drifted until she met OM. It started as a friendly R but I know guys and if we see a vulnerable woman we go into stereo mode and think with both our heads.
I am not saying what she did was right, same as what I did was wrong but after some deep soul searching I realized in all honesty i cant throw that stone. I also realized that I was and am not the guy I thought I was.
So how do I expect to get icons and messages again? First off, dont expect anything. Expect means that you think you will achieve your goals at the end of the day. In these cases you have NO guarantees.
Rephrase it to how can I get my wife to want to sext me. As an example not final goal.
Your first obstacle is the OM. While he has her attention you are on the sidelines. I said this before... you are now the waterboy and going head to head with the quaterback. You have to start working on yourself in all ways possible. Emotionally and physically. Here is where detaching and GAL get into play. One thing... do not do it with one eye on the road and the other on your W. That will just wear you down, it changes the motivation from doing something to improve yourself to something to get a reaction from W. The less she reacts if at all, the quicker you wear down the motivation.
If you flip it around and work on yourself for yourself you will see change and that will INCREASE motivation to continue. It is through this change that your W will hopefully start to see a change in you.
We mention here dropping the rope, read up on it, it works. The moment your W sees you have shifted your interest to something else and she is no longer in your scope it may also puzzle her. Put everything in the mix, fast forward some time and she sees a change in you for the better as well as a chance to lose you. Here is where you may start to have a fighting chance of a new R with your W.
One thing that people forget as did I... you dont want your old MR back. It didnt work so why want it back? If you have become 123 2.0 and your W wants in, she has already changed. Remember she has started sexting, some feelings have woken up. Hopefully your W will be W 2.0 in MR 2.0.
While you still use the words, how could she, why should I, i remember, she did this, she did that, after all that i... you get the picture. You will not advance.
She has taken you to the cleaners emotionally but you still want her back so stop reminiscing about the past and understand that interactions from her with OM are normal ... for a person in that state. It does hurt and will for some time but that is the price. That is why I always think we should sit down and see if it is worth it. Go through all this to get a person sexting or sleeping with someone else. Once we decide then we need sheer determination to move ahead and it will be like walking against a gale force wind with emotional debris socking it to us every step of the way.
Ok, so now I have painted a rosy picture of your future, think about your next steps. You will need a LOT of patience as these things take time, months and months or longer. Each one to his own level of patience before quitting or admitting there is no way to get the s back.
One final thing, she CAN stop him from texting her. It is called cuting ties and she could do that with a message or call. If he insists then it is harrasement or stalking and comes into the jurisdiction of the p1ssed off and protective husband.
While I will never advocate violence I do find that explaining to someone the irresistible force paradox or as the chinese flics call it clench fist v pretty cheekbone to the OM does yield results.
I will get hammered by pros but hope to have been of help.
Peace 123
Max
Hi TxHubby,
I did something that exposed OM. It was not the right move at least for me.
When W verbally acknowledged the EA and PA I lost it. I created a blog about the OM (never mentioned W). But I pointed out who the OM was and posted pictures of his text to W (it showed his cell number); very sext explicit. I only called out the A.
I forgot about the blog and a few months passed. OM found out about blog, calls my W, and W goes off on me saying how could I do such a thing.. that his daughter might see it.. that people may put it together and know it was her.. (my thought was.. I don't know or care about his daughter.. how would they know it was W specifically). I deleted the blog that night but perhaps, I should have kept it up since legally OM and/or W cannot do anything about it.
That blog probably gave W and OM more fuel for the A.
I found this website and learned of DB after that event. I think had I found this site 2 years ago (when I first confronted W about OM) DB would have made a difference.
Hi Maximus,
Thanks for the feedback. Looking at your signature I assume our sit are similar (age, living in same house, discovered timeline, W does not want S or D).
When people say they are on a rollercoaster ride they mean it.
Complete agree. I have been on the rollercoaster of emotions and still on it; the turns are not as sharp and the drops not as drastic.
As for kids, I completely agree with you that
I need to stop before I do/say something I will completely regret. I cannot relate to LBC. But I recall awhile back W asked me if it was better that we live together co-parenting or S (to model the way for kids not live in a lie where mom and dad are happy together). I remember thinking and still believe my kids don't care about how W or I feel.. all they care about is being together as a family and I heard them say that again during this last road-trip.
We speak in mathematics, logic and equations, etc. They speak poetry, latin, etc. What we think should work generally doesnt if we think like a man
Completely agree and learned the hard way. Before this website I was the poster child for what NOT to do; laying out shemas and presenting facts. W did not like that but I did not understand (then I read the DB book and realized doing the things that don't work doesn't help.. I stopped).
work on yourself for yourself you will see change
Agree, small positive changes with self improvement opportunities. Earlier this year I was doing well and that's when I saw a change in W (was not expecting it); but then I screwed up and everything feel apart.
I need to get my self confidence back!!
One final thing, she CAN stop him from texting her. It is called cuting ties and she could do that with a message or call
Yes, W even told me earlier this year when she acknowledged to A she said she was going to just stop talking to him and he would get the picture. But because she revealed the A she did not know what to do and was going to continue to talk to him. Fast forward and here I am..
Journaling.
Yesterday evening after work W goes to get hair cut and I home with kids. S8 jumps on iPad (iPad account is under W appleID) to FaceTime with his friend and there I see it.. the OM name. She added his name to contact after I posted pictures of OM sext to W on blog. My emotional roller coaster cart went into a steep drop. I recovered but did not like the sudden drop.
Later that night, W ask if we could stand up aritfical Christmas tree. As we put up tree and hang some decor, S8 kid asked if some decor was real or fake. W responds they are fake. I chime in and say something like.. many things in this house, fake (in my mind I was making reference to MR.. thinking why are we having a Christmas party with friends when you are not here in the R.. yes in a way it is for the kids since it's kids' family friends.. but more for adults). W does not take the bait but after kids go to bed she said I know that remark about being fake was a sarcastic comment. Lately I seem to be unable to control my emotions.. I feel myself loosing control.
Journaling
I have to pay bills and W has not contributed. She routed her paycheck to bank account she opened without me. She said because I cut her off from the other bank fund (cash savings) she needed to take care of herself financially.
My thought is OK then stop using my CC to buy stuff and pay for your own cell phone service. If I remove her from CC account and her number from cell services then what??.. she will get extremely upset.. and the vicious cycle/jabs continues.
If I drop her how can I enforce (get W to help cover) large expenses like home mortgage, property tax, insurance, etc? These things are joint (in both our names).. so she would get dinged but I don't want to get dinged myself.. W is a spender.. "budget" is not in her vocab.
Perhaps I have to tell her that we both need to stop the malicious jabs. No one wins. I never saw or experienced this from W before (waywardness.. is evil). My W having trouble with co-workers too. She told me the other day her defense is to be that sarcastic person on top and make life miserable for the other person.. I told her that's exactly what she doing to us (sound familar??)
Alternatively, if we could work on the financial piece together.. put things back the way they were.. builds trust.. something that we both do not have for each other (she said she cannot trust me being there for her emotionally and I can't trust that she is not in an A). Could this be a start? But all postings here say to "drop the rope". Dropping the financial rope could hurt me too.
Venting my frustration.. sitting in office at work thinking.. I want to slap my wife across the head (let me be VERY CLEAR.. I have NEVER physically hurt my W or ANY WOMEN.. so this is a figure of speech) to slap her out of this situation she has made for herself, me, us.. social/psychology is her domain.. NOT ME!!
She says I was not there for her for many years.. I get it and am honestly sorry and working to better myself. But she still in communication with OM at minimum.. so she is dragging me through HELL and we cannot fix (or start a new) MR until OM is out of pic.
I am working on self and GAL.. again I just venting =)
She shares her workday stories with me where kids are messed up and I think that is NOTHING. Hello?? Why can't you see what's in front of u and HELP me!! Example, she tells me kids these days cut themselves with razors along their bodies at times because they have emotional pain and that mental pain cannot be seen so they cut themselves. Hello?? Awhile back when I was messed up I told her and she recommended a psychologist because I shared that the pain I was having could only be comforted by the thought of death.. (death brought piece). I am over it but I am like this is your line of work.. HELP US <her name>!! Of course I realize this pain is mine NOT W's or ours.. it's mine alone.
Over weekend I reflect back a lot on my S and can see now how DB would have worked if I only knew of DB approach and technique (and was here on this message board) then.. what I know now.. DB would work! But given the vortex mess W and I are in together (2 years) and now I understanding and knowing W better.. (taking into account DB approach of little changes and taking note).. I am beginning to wonder if dropping the rope on her is in my favor.
I am completely against being W's doormat but if we continue to tease apart daily financials the big things are still there and she can't cover her monthly expenses. She works and makes good salary but spends above her income. Lawyer shared that our stuff is joint in M so if I cut off financial support (aka drop the rope here) it impacts me and my kids too.
As individuals (W and I) do not want to move out, separate, divorce.. etc. But I cannot continue like this.. it simply is eating at me. GAL is absolutely necessary but I wonder if working towards a common ground together is more beneficial. For example, she shared she cannot trust me, that I will be there emotionally to support her; of course she is referring to the old me. I cannot trust her; she is still in communication with OM even though she tells me she does not want to be with him. Common ground, build trust in each other and start with the financials.. $$ is just the means to an end (my wants). My end (my wants) is happiness (not $$ in a bank account).
W is DB'ing me and I hate it! Grr..
Earlier this week she showed me an email, the high school she attended asking if she and a handful of her classmates who live in the area were free for dinner; a representative from the high school was out here (probably fundraising). So yesterday, W went to this "dinner" directly from work and came home at midnight.
I think I mentioned that the OM was my S10 baseball coach but did I mention OM is also her high school classmate?
My sit is making me crazy!! I cannot focus on work.. kids.. what is happening to me?!?
W is DB'ing me and I hate it! Grr..
How is she DBing you?
W is GAL. Example, she never would go out on a week night (aka homebody) and to stay out past 10pm was rare; she came home at 11:50pm last night. (I was up because my kids are coughing with a cold so it kept me up).
She does many of the things suggested here that a LBH should do with a WW.
Let me clarify that W is DB'ing me while being cold and disrespectful. I honestly do not know how much of this I can endure. I had been moving towards GAL but recently slipped back with all the recent events and it weighing me down.
Yesterday, I heard my S8 ask his best friend on FaceTime. "Would you be sad if your parents D"? A child would only ask that question if he felt something or was exposed to it. Don't get me wrong W is a great mom just awful W.. and its killing me inside.
She said everything works but the MR.. so true.
I am falling apart 1 foot in detaching and the other foot in "let's work it out". Wish I could completely detach and be like those macho men and say "screw you W I going do what I want".
"Let me clarify that W is DB'ing me while being cold and disrespectful. "
I'm not sure what's bothering you. In fact, it seems like you're the one who keeps bringing up the OM with your jabs. If you want to be the better man, then stop getting into a p*ssing contest with him.
If your W is blatantly contacting him, then pack up her stuff and drop it off at his home if it bothers you so much. These petty jabs don't do anything for you.
MrBond, you are absolutely right. I need someone to slap me across the head! I am the one losing control over my emotions and throwing jabs. Not sure why I am falling apart.. but I am certainly doing just that.
I fell apart big time last night.
W cuts my hair (15+ years with an electric clipper). Yesterday evening, while W is cutting my hair I ask her how the dinner with the high school rep. She shares and to keep the conversation going I ask her who was there. She shares (2 other couples with their kids). Then she tells me the OM was there (he carpooled out) and after the dinner she took him home (he lives 3 miles down the road from us). I can feel myself loosing it.. in that she took my car to work to take to dinner.. bought gas with my CC.. and drove him home?!? She tells me she did not go inside his place but sent time talking to him. W says he is just a friend but adds she understands that no matter what she says I don't believe her because I have already made up my mind on what's happening. How am I suppose to believe that based on all the sext I saw?!?
We go at it exchanging words for 1 hr.
W saying how I was not there for her 8-10 years and when she needed me the most (referring to unwanted preg.. and during that time my mother visiting and relatives over for thanksgiving holiday.. that I should have known better and said, no not this year because we need time/privacy.. from that experience I did not show her that she was not important enough).. that she always has to be the strong one when we faced life challenges (making reference that I was never her rock/support during those times).. that there is nothing for her in MR.. she sees the changes in me but unable to accept it and doesn't know why therefore she does not want to work on MR.. that she does not know what she wants.. its her personality to be subborn.. that she is being selfish but no one is looking out for her (making reference to how she feels about my outlook of her)..
Me, I acknowledge her feelings but spill.. saying that it can never work with OM because he is there emotionally supporting so she can never work on us.. I begin to fall apart too.. saying stuff like did you tell <friends> about you and OM; why not? Why hide it if she enjoys his company?
Conversation ends because I have to pick up S8 for sport practice.
Sorry last night was rough on you. You need to STFU, and stop asking questions that you don't want to hear answered.
Yesterday evening, while W is cutting my hair I ask her how the dinner with the high school rep. She shares and to keep the conversation going I ask her who was there.
Look, you know exactly why you asked her who was there! You were fishing. Then you got more than you wanted. Don't set yourself up by asking your W questions, trying to find out about OM.
Then she tells me the OM was there (he carpooled out) and after the dinner she took him home (he lives 3 miles down the road from us). I can feel myself loosing it.. in that she took my car to work to take to dinner.. bought gas with my CC.. and drove him home?!? She tells me she did not go inside his place but sent time talking to him.
So, why have you continued to support her A?
W says he is just a friend but adds she understands that no matter what she says I don't believe her because I have already made up my mind on what's happening. How am I suppose to believe that based on all the sext I saw?!?
Whenever a woman chooses a male "friend" over the feelings of husband, then it's more than any friendship.
We go at it exchanging words for 1 hr.
She wouldn't be able to "go at it", if you wouldn't join in.
Me, I acknowledge her feelings but spill.. saying that it can never work with OM because he is there emotionally supporting so she can never work on us.. I begin to fall apart too.. saying stuff like did you tell <friends> about you and OM; why not? Why hide it if she enjoys his company?
Not exactly what a strong, attractive, confident man says at a time like this.
Continuing..
After the kids go to bed I pick up an iPad that wack.. I see the FaceTime log of W FaceTiming the OM at 12:50am yesterday..
I lose it. W sees me agitated and asks what's wrong.
I start by asking, "what do you want to do"? W is in FULL CONTROL. She says there is nothing to discuss and she does not want to get worked up again. But I can't control myself. I keep talking.
I say stuff like, "I wish you would pack up your s#@! and leave". She replies, "I am not leaving". I continue with the questions of OM (I know it's wrong and gets me no where and makes things worse but I can't control myself..). She replies, "what does it matter about him?
He is not the problem with our MR. Removing him does not fix how I feel about you. I do not want to work on our MR."
She also shares
her thoughts that I am only upset and want to work at MR because affair. That only now after there is someone else who shows interest in her that I am ready to work at it but there is nothing to work at (that I showed up to the game after the game ended and everyone left).
That I had to be hit with the affair and shocked to fall to realize what was going on with her[/b].. these are some of the tings she said!!
She tries to end it by saying, "I am removing myself from this conversation" and sits on the other end of couch while I just go at it (jabs of OM).
I need help as I simply cannot control these thoughts of W and OM.
Hey 123,
I am in a similar sitch but fortunately or unfortunately more advanced. I will try to catch up on your sitch and try to help you avoid some the mistakes I made.
yours in strength,
RAI
What if she told you she simply could not control herself with the OM? Would you buy it?
Hi RAI, thanks for dropping me a line. I jumped over to your posting just to take a quick peak. Saw this:
A short prayer: May it be thy will, Lord, our G-d, that I pass the next week in peace, with complete peace of mind that you are in control, and that my children are not adversely influenced by the forces that conspire against me. Also, please grant me the patience I need to pass the next week with a smile on my face.
I like this prayer and it got me thinking, the other day W asked if we were going to Church for Christmas? I am born Catholic but do not practice (ie. go to church). W has no faith but we were married in the Catholic Church. So this question she threw at me.. I was like SERIOUSLY?!? She only brought it up cause kids need clothes to attend and we will probably go with friends. But SERIOUSLY?!? We are living in SIN!! I'll stop here..
I will be pulling for you too RAI!
I would buy it. Last night without me prompting her she said she is driven by her emotions and doesn't know what she wants (and added that she may regret it years from now but this is how she feels).. so being with OM she cannot control.. probably.. all she knows is that he makes her feel special and not me.
She shares I was not there for her and I know from text I had seen he is there for her now emotionally. She said she needs someone to be her rock.. and that's him.. she said I was never her rock (hard for me to hear but true). OM has nothing to loose in A (he invested nothing but a few text and calls).. gives him an advantage over me to be that tough/macho guy (the I don't care attitude).
I know my actions yesterday made me look WEAK and just gave her more reasons to be with OM.
After our talk yesterday I am realizing she has no where to fall other than the financial support. Emotionally.. she hit bottom a long time ago with me and there is nothing I can do to change her mind.
I have to pick myself off the floor and work on me.
SERIOUSLY?!? We are living in SIN!!
The ability of the WW to compartmentalize is incredible and difficult for us as the LBS to comprehend. To all casual observers, my W is an observant member of the orthodox Jewish community and she has no shame mingling within it even though she is breaking
at least two of the ten commandments. Kind of a big deal, right? But she does not see it that way. She is experiencing such a cognitive dissonance that she must, for her own sanity, justify and rationalize everything she does. This cognitive dissonance is also the reason that the WW will vilify the LBS and make them out to be the bad person. It is the only way to justify her actions which are, by societal and moral standards, just wrong. It must take a lot of brain power for her to do this all day long.
I look forward to the day when I can see this from a distance, rather that daily under the same roof.
RAI
123,
You are engineering more probability that you two will not be able to rebuild your M, or you're adding a lot of time (weeks, prob months!), difficulty, and more barriers for your W to have to get over before you can make any progress.
In short, you're hurting yourself and won't stop.
The grief is understandable. I've been there. But listen closely to what Sandi said:
What if she told you she simply could not control herself with the OM? Would you buy it?
Sandi is exactly right. Listen to what she's saying. Your current thinking is that we are all just crafty animals driven by primal urges and feelings.
But it's not a matter of she (or you) can't. It's a matter of she (or you) won't. Mature people understand that everything is a choice. Immature people a driven by their feelings and appeal of instant gratification, the easy road.
She's taking the easy road by feeding her emotional addiction to someone else.
You are taking the
exact same easy road by feeding your emotional addiction to her. You're essential doing the exact same thing as she is emotionally.
Your W doesn't want you to be addicted to her. She wants you to be attracted to her.
Years ago, a wise DB'er on here (named 'grasshopper') once posted something to the effect of, "Women want to be taken on an adventure; they don't want to be the adventure."
So knock that s--t off, bro. STFU. Take care of and work on yourself. When you release her to her path of disrespect and failure to commit, you also release yourself from the pain associated with your unhealthy attachment to her.
Accept the new reality. Let go of the unhealthy part of your attachment to your W. GAL and embrace your own path.
And get some prof. counseling help with the somewhat codependent stuff if you simply cannot break free of it on your own.
This question you ask, "What if she told you she simply could not control herself with the OM?" is my W's additive personality. Once she tries something and likes it she keeps going and going even if she knows its bad for her.
Example, I tried to get W to stop going to Starbucks (that's just one of her additive habits she cannot control.. $,$$$ annually AND all those calories from the specialty drinks) for many years but earlier this year she simply stop going but is back at it.
So yes, I would say she simply can not control herself. I am so screwed!!
The ability of the WW to compartmentalize is incredible and difficult for us as the LBS to comprehend.
So VERY true. Why can't they see the black and white.. facts!!
WW will vilify the LBS and make them out to be the bad person.
I realize that when W cries its because she furiously blames me and she did finally tell me so (when for a long time she would say we both contributed to the screw up).
I look forward to the day when I can see this from a distance, rather that daily under the same roof.
Nice
tl2,
Thanks for the feed. I seriously need someone to tell me straight up.
You are engineering more probability that you two will not be able to rebuild your M, or you're adding a lot of time (weeks, prob months!), difficulty, and more barriers for your W to have to get over before you can make any progress.
I know what I was doing was wrong but in the moments I can't control it.
Immature people a driven by their feelings and appeal of instant gratification, the easy road.
This is W personality. She goes for the
instant gratification and easy road. I am so screwed!
You are taking the exact same easy road by feeding your emotional addiction to her. You're essential doing the exact same thing as she is emotionally.
Never realized I was acting the same way. Thanks for shining the light on this perspective.
So knock that s--t off, bro. STFU. Take care of and work on yourself. When you release her to her path of disrespect and failure to commit, you also release yourself from the pain associated with your unhealthy attachment to her.
I need someone to be straight up to knock that s--t out of me.
So what are your goals for yourself related to detaching and GAL that you're committed to, and how is that going at the moment?
I know what I was doing was wrong but in the moments I can't control it.
When I asked what if your WW said she couldn't control herself, you brought up her addictive personality. I was really referring to you. You excuse your own bad behavior by saying you can't control it. YES, YOU
CAN CONTROL IT, AND SO CAN SHE! Talk about taking the easy road! You just shuck it off with you can't help it.
Truthfully, I am not doing a good enough job at detaching and GAL. WW and I still do a lot of things together because of kid activities and social circle.
I make it an effort to spend quality time with my kids individually on weekdays. Simple things like playing ball, reading a bedtime story, art/craft activity, or board game (they always end up calling WW to join).
A small change that I had been doing well with until a few weeks ago, due to weather conditions is jogging or riding bike for exercise; down to 1 day per week.
I know I have to work on detaching and GAL.
WW and I still do a lot of things together because of kid activities and social circle.
You just need to look at these as opportunities to remain detached.
But more importantly, you should probably get out and do more because you need to have outside interests that you can spend your time and attention on, which will generate more independent mindset on your part and will help when you need to interact with WW. This is absolutely necessary because you will learn what it feels like to have a good time and feel good and strong without the W around. You will then be able to carry it back into the home. The stronger you are individually, the better you can handle the more challenging aspects of this.
tl2, thanks, I hear what you are sharing.
you need to have outside interests that you can spend your time and attention on, which will generate more independent mindset on your part and will help when you need to interact with WW
For me finding the time and energy between work (recently its been very demanding) and home has been a challenge. I hardly have the time to be here on this message board which I find very helpful.
Thanks Sandi, you are correct and I need that tough love to realize I really have no excuse and need to suck it up to be that strong/confident guy again.
I hear you. I work a lot as well. My way of looking at it, if you like your work and you get a lot out of doing it in terms of personal satisfaction, that's a good GAL in my book.
If not, you need something that makes you feel good about yourself that doesn't involve your W or family.
I have been contemplating my sit. WW goes about as if things are fine. She told me that I should just go back to the way I was before her A; speaks to A as if it was in the past (she is implying that I should just not care about her like I did before.. that's her perception and I see how she thinks that.. but how can I? I am not that guy.. I changed and that change is for me!
For awhile now I have been thinking of my boundary; something that would help me detach; and that is split our living finances. My thought is why should I support a WW who is capable of supporting herself?
Last night W makes a comment about taking the car to fill gas (Costco on her way to work) and my response was it has enough gas. She quickly replies she can’t drive it anymore (that I won’t let her). I respond, you took the car last week to work, filled it with gas (thanks for doing but on my CC that you are refusing to help pay), went to dinner with your “high school classmates”, then drove OM home; and spent time there alone. Why should I let you drive the car (that she haven’t put a dime towards)?
She tells me to take her off the car registration. So I tell her that’s fine. But we need to look at other things too like CC (because my thought is she uses CC but doesn’t help pay the bill). She reacts and gets the CC whips it at me, I pick it off the floor and place on kitchen counter, she comes over and says I will help you and starts to cut the CC with scissors.
WW pissed! Later that night, she explains how she put her career on hold to be the safe/secure one in the family allowing me to take risk and progress professionally. How she was my support when I lost my jobs during bad economy. This is all true and I cannot deny it but that was not what she portrayed years ago.. it was that she did not want to move jobs that she was comfortable at her job.. I have tried to spark the interest for her to purse her career goal; but she would always give an excuse why she did not want to change and those excuses were because she was comfortable. So again, WW sees things differently and making it know that I was not there for her... and now "I am sticking it" to her.. this is a no win situation.. I can't even detach cleanly.
That's a nice positive outlook and will make a mental note of it; thanks for sharing. I like my job but this year has been HELL at work and it is wearing me down; hoping things change in the next few months.
I stopped woodworking and home projects this year.. thinking I will pick that back up Spring/Summer 2016 (I don't have a heated garage).
This morning I walked into the MBR to get ready for work, WW is inside getting her clothes (she doesn't sleep in there only has her stuff). She says, I find it odd that you choose not to step inside spare bedroom (where she sleeps and text OM) but you are fine driving car (cause she took the OM home the other night from dinner. I never told her she can't drive it but I would not answer yes to driving it).. adding "how you know I wasn't holding his hand"; she continues.. it's all about you and want works for you (she is making a point how I am selfish). I tell her I do not want to talk about it.. we don't need to get ugly.
She then follows me into MBR bath and tells me to get out. She needs to get ready and takes my things off the counter sink and throws them out into the MBR floor.
I told her stop it.. it doesn't have be ugly.. let me get my things (picked up and stepped out). What the F was that about?!?
Sandi, sorry I am slow (as my neurons are not firing on all cylinders these days.. they are fried). She made a comment the other week that really caught my attention and had no response other than I was sorry.
WW said, do you want me to post on FaceBook how you raped me. She says definition of rape is when someone says, no.. ah yah we all know that.. (WW said no because she came off of pill, thinking it was causing her headaches, and that she was most susceptible to getting preg at that time). Different perspectives, me just thinking she was just tired (for the record I DID NOT force myself onto her).. her now vocally saying that I raped her.. I think this is how she views it now and it hurts me to hear her think that. I know we are to believe nothing they say but this is a stinger.. because it's not true but it's how she views things now.
You really don't know why she is acting this way?
I hope this is not a trick question for me but.. she is acting out in hopes of controlling the world she created, OM and.. me to support the leftovers.. but I am establishing my boundary now that I will not support a WW while she is with OM and that does not fit her fantasy world.
WW acting this way because she blames me for putting us in our sit. Does not want to take ownership and work with me to fit it. Easier to point the finger at me.
Well, that's all true, but mostly she was showing you just how little she respects you. When she's throwing things around, javing a trantrum, I suggest you can't be nice by telling her it doesn't have to get nasty. To be very frank, it comes across as you being way too soft. I mean, she's pitching a fit and slinging things out of the bathroom through the door onto the bedroom floor. This is a WW's way of saying, "Now, what will you do about this little bit of disrespect I am showing you"? In other words, it's a test to see if you are man enough to do anything about it.
That is mainly what a WW does, is test the H's manhood. She challenges him about everything. Just like a spoiled brat who throws temper tantrums when they don't get everything exactly like they want it. I am no fan of Dr. Spock, so I will tell you that anytime a parent tells a spoiled brat, who is pitching a fit, that it doesn't have to be that way........that parent is helping to create a monster. I believe that's basically what a LBH is doing when he follows his WW around the house trying to calm her down or giving some type of soft-soap response. You are only helping to create a larger monster. And, a monster who will despise you! Is that what you want?
The only way to handle a mean, spoiled, disrespectful, wayward woman is to leave her standing in her own sh't and let her clean it up all by little ole'self. Why are you putting up with her crap? I just don't get it. When a school yard bully picked on you, what did you do?
You have an ugly, spoiled, bully living in your house. And you are going to stand there while she's throwing things, telling her it doesn't have to get nasty? It's already nasty! So, get prepared b/c it's going to get a lot worse. The LBH who dilly-dallied around, hoping his WW will end her A and want to work on the M, can thank himself when things getting worse. I will tell you, and any H out there........it doesn't have to be this way. She is acting this way b/c YOU allow her to do it.
Nothing will work until you show her you will not stick around any woman who acts like her. Until you start acting like you deserve better.........why do you think she's going to believe you do?
Stop being the nice-guy H.
It's already nasty! So, get prepared b/c it's going to get a lot worse. The LBH who dilly-dallied around, hoping his WW will end her A and want to work on the M, can thank himself when things getting worse.
I think I am there as it is getting worse. Last night, WW is working on things for this weekend's party we are hosting. She hands me a check from her newly created bank account and tells me she went to Costco and used debit card from my account (although its a joint account); so paying me back. I was caught off guard and asked what was the check for? She went off and cut the debit card up as she did the other night with the Costco AMEX.. saying here I won't use this either. Just because I asked for clarification on why she handed me a check..
Later she tells me she is not going on road-trip to College Football Bowl Game on New Years Eve with family friends. She plans to tell kids the night before.. kids already said they do not want to go if we do not go as a family. She said she does not want to go because she does not want to be with me.
WW tells me that we need to get a 3rd party to help us determine cost of living because it's unfair for her to pay half when I make more; that we need to factor all the other things besides just bills.
She is done with me.
Your situation begs for a strict 180. Your wife is behaving like a child. The 180 will snap her out of it. Don't waiver or go in half-ass. Full on 180 religiously. Judging from your wife's words and actions, it'll work. Don't get drawn into fights. 180.
She is done with me.
You should be done with her! She's not treating you like a H, she's not treating you like a friend, she's not treating you like an acquaintance, she' s treating you like sh1t on her shoe!
I don't know all your sitch, I've only read the last few posts, but just stand up to her for your own self respect
Tx, sorry for the stupid question but my head is spinning so bad and looking for clarification. When you make reference to 180. Are you suggestion I drop the rope and not support or offer attention as my 180?
IsItToLate, thanks for the words of encouragement.
I realize I need to let W go. Letting go will allow me to focus on myself to build confidence and get my life back on track; to enjoy life. But it's hard when we living under same roof and I have to see her daily (and be nice about it).
First thing is mentally stop focusing on OM and that R! (I did it before and can do it again.. I know I can!!) Give me strength.
123mich - I just read through all of this thread, but not the first. Can you tell me why you two are living in the same house? I'm kind of lost about this one. If she is indeed having an A with OM, right now, she needs to lose the benefits of being married.
I just want to start there, if that's ok?
The 180 is a full set of rules/steps/principles to live by in your situation. It was created by Michelle. It's described in DB book in detail. I've seen several members here lay it out in a thread. Learn it. Live by it. Your wife is behaving in a way that is tailor made for the 180. In your particular situation I truly believe it'll help get you where you want to be.
Instead of more of the same , you do a complete reversal.
Ancaire, WW shared this is her home and does not want to move out. She is emotionally attached to property because her mom grew up in it (and it was to be her inheritance). But we bought it from IL at market value and remodeled entire home to take advantage of what it offers now to a young family. As for me, this is home (like W). I feel I did not turn my back on MR so why should I have to move out. Also, cost of living (rent) is very high (and moving further out to neighboring cities is killer with the commute).
If she is indeed having an A with OM, right now, she needs to lose the benefits of being married.
W told me she has nothing to lose other than finance support. So I am trying to let go by having her contribute to cost of living and think of savings.. in the end she would be better off too since she is a spender and has acknowledged she has no concept of a budget.
Hi TxHubby, I have both DB and DR. Honestly, my 180 is just what LBH not suppose to do with a WW. Show affection, pay attention, small gifts.. this would be my 180.. reflecting on my sit I can honestly say I was an a$$.
I think for myself it's not to focus on her.. light blub going off.. currently this would be a 180 from me.. find what makes me happy and focus on that rather than what may make WW happy.
Yes, the question of what things can be done to 180. In my sitch, my wife often said that i was emotionally unavailable, didn't give her as much physical attention as she needed, came off as selfish and self absorbed, and couldn't understand her feelings. 2 of those things I can 180 right now. 2 of them I cannot as we are physically separated (living in different places) and she is still in contact with affair partner, so she doesn't want me to meet her emotional needs, which makes things rather difficult. My D is my primary tie to her, so I try to use D interactions via text or phone calls to exhibit the 180s. That's actually what my coach prescribed today.
NateG79, sorry you here in your sit like me. With the exception of being physically separated, it's like reading my own sit, what you shared is what my WW told me too.
We need to work on ourselves. Listen to what they shared and work on our 180.
It is. In my current sitch, I'm dealing with an OM who is married 10 years, has kids, and a home, and he tells my wife things like He would leave his wife and family for her. As a man, I can't fathom that a father would do that. I don't know if he's just lying to string her along, or if she just makes things up like that to hurt me. I'm terrified by the idea of some other man who broke up his family from an affair being around and influencing my daughter. I'm doing the DB'ing and the coachings, but sometimes it feels like I'm not fighting enough for my family although there's nothing else I can do.
NateG79, I get you. We focus on OM (that sitch) and spin out of control.. fixated. But what the vets share is true we have to find a way to stop it (stop those thoughts.. I too trying to find what works best for me). Be the best dad you can for your D (IMHO, your D sounds too young to be influence.. be her rock).
I'm doing the DB'ing and the coachings, but sometimes it feels like I'm not fighting enough for my family although there's nothing else I can do.
DBing is a different kind of fighting for your family. Even when you feel you are doing nothing........you are fighting for what is right and true. DBing is counterintuitive.
We hosted our holiday party with friends over the weekend. It kills me to know W is not with me that we are just co-parenting and pretending to be a couple.
During the party, I would actually find myself thinking, what if these people knew what was going on? Would they feel sorry for her.. kids.. me..? Would they even care?
Having trouble controlling my thoughts. It's raining and cold outside. Earlier this year, when the weather was raining and cold, I saw a text between WW and OM about meeting up to "cuddle". Back then I was able to blow it off but now.. I can't! I can't get that text out of my head!
Another of the dangers of snooping. I have dozens and dozens of these text messages. DO NOT SNOOP!
I know it's hard not to and you may have already stopped but "what has been seen can never be unseen"
Completely agree with you gs9.
what has been seen can never be unseen
so true. Snooping does not help anyone. Wish I could electric shock that junk out of my mind. I have limited brain power and memory space to begin with so this is taking up unwanted time/energy.
Christmas was manageable but I still know she is talking with OM; there is nothing I can do.
My New Year's resolution is to let her go and GAL. I am taking the kids on a short road trip with other family friends to celebrate the New Year. W is not coming along because she said she does not want to be with me but the last several days we have been glued to the hip.. doing stuff so my speculation is she has other plans (plans that do not include me and the kids). That's ok because I am learning to let go. I no longer want to be with a woman who treats me like sh#!. I deserve better, I deserve someone who will appreciate me for who I am (life is too short to wait around).
W just text asking me for my AppleID. She wants to switch the family iPad AppleID from her to me because the FaceTime revealed her logs when she was FaceTiming OM (from her phone). She is upset at me for not responding to her text within 2 minutes.. my phone was in my office and I stepped out to discuss work related stuff with co-worker.
This weekend she established her own mobile carrier account (at least I don't have to pay for her A). =)
WW also shared a few weeks ago she stopped taking her antidepressant med. The story on that is 2 years ago, I reached out to her primary care physician asking the doctor to reach out to her (because of patient privacy it was a challenge) and ask for psych evaluation to get her antidepressant med (thinking she was depressed due to abortion).. now knowing that the abortion was the turning event for her (and us).
It's been a few days since I posted. Last week, while I was walking my dog late at night I get a text from WW. She got someone to watch the dog so she can join me and kids on road trip (which I was planning to leave early the next morning). I wanted to say, NO because she already told me she would not be going (and I assumed she had plans for New Year (eve)) but.. I had to hold back and say ok for my kids.. I know my kids really want their mom to join us.
Long story short she joined us for road trip. I have to give myself thumbs up for staying in control of myself. I need to continue on this path of DB'ing (letting go and working on myself).
Nice job, 123mich!
How are you going to keep your emotions in check on the road trip?
Chad
Trumpet, during the road trip I kept my emotions in check by telling myself that I didn't deserve to be treated like sh!t and that I am here for my kids (family trips are something I never had as a child so building memories for my kids is important to me).
Long story short, I called my brother today and told him I could not have our mom stay with me if she was flying in to visit. He asked why and I replied I was having MR problems (no details shared). He is the 1st relative I told. He replied that I can always call to talk to him about it but honestly I don't need to talk I just need action (DB for myself and my kids).
I've been looking through the MLC threads this morning, looking for inspiration and guidance. I found this little gem, and I'm going around sharing it with everyone I think it may be helpful to. Sometimes everything just gets to be too much, and I forget where I'm supposed to be focusing. It really helped me redefine where I want to go, and how I'm going to get there. I hope it helps you a bit, too.
Consider the DB basic principals....
1) Healthy boundaries.
2) Better communication
3) GAL
4) "act as if"
5) Change how you look at things
6) Keep a positive outlook
7) Personal growth
8) Learning more about you so that you can be all that you can be.
9) Learning to avoid "cheese less tunnels"
10) Love and respect
These principals can be used in all facets of ones life. When used properly....they truly can change you from the INSIDE OUT.
Ancaire, thank you for sharing. It is a very nice sweet and simple list to remind ourselves of where we should focus our energy and time. I like it.
I am doing well keeping my cool. Not bringing up MR or OM.. none of it but I internally am dying.. Working to stay strong for my kids and myself.
Tonight, I made a comment about someone winning mutli-state lotto.. over 1b. W replies, "it's to bad you didn't win then you could buy your own house; we both would be happy". I didn't say anything but left the room a short time after to walk the dog, cold and raining outside but better than being in same room with WW.
I am truly accepting the fact that I cannot change WW and that I need to work on myself; DB. This is difficult especially for someone like me, self diagnosed, having some form of OCD (fixated on WW and OM).. but I am working on it for me and my kids.. life is too short.
I am working on me (one foot in front of the other.. moving forward)..
I am still around.. just not posting as frequently.. working on me. Beginning to truly accept the fact that there is nothing I can do to help WW or MR.
I walk my dog at night. Typically 10-15 minute walk but last night I sat outside on the front steps; just chilling with my dog (yes, it was cold). Walked in and WW made a comment, saying she was about to lock the door, then she followed that up with, I didn't have to go outside to have privacy; that it doesn't bother her. I was like.. what?? I just didn't reply.
Then this morning, I said "good morning" to WW (just to be polite). Her reply was "um". So, I didn't respond to that either.
Then later today while at work she texted me about a comment I shared with my son about me having to possibly take a short business trip (my work typically does not require me to travel but wants me to take a course). In her text she told me that I should let her know ASAP on my work travel (but I have no control over that).. her last comment was "that's chicken sh!t" referring to me telling my S8. What?? I suppose it is if I was afraid to tell her.. but I not.. I did not tell her directly because it is not finalized and I was just chatting with my S8.
This weekend WW asked me, "what are we going to do". In a calm manner I reply, "what do you want to do". She responds she is not sure. I pause, then reply that the options have not changed..
1) separate..
2) continue like it is..
3) work on MR.. which she responds she does not want to.
So I just keep driving to our destination (running errands).
Yesterday, S10 did not go to school because of a bad cold/flu. I stayed home with him.
When I went to get S8 from school, I moved WW's bicycle out of garage to get my bicycle.. left all the bicycles outside of garage and WW gets home.
First thing she says when she walks through the door is "don't ride my bike.. if I can't drive your car.. you can't ride my bike". I respond I didn't ride your bicycle it's there because I had to move it to get to my bicycle.
She then goes to her bedroom to take a nap (she has a bad cold/flu too). She wakes up after kids and I ate dinner.. she does not look good or feel good but carries a conversation with me as if nothing happened.
I know she does not feel well and her head hurts.. so I offer to massage her neck and back because its something I would like if I did not feel well.. (no intention of pursing). After she goes to her bedroom to sleep.
This morning, both S10 and WW still have cold/flu and stayed home. I took S8 to school on bicycle (taking advantage of the break in weather) and returned home to get ready for work. As a kind gesture, I took a hot cup of tea to WW in bed (left it by her bedside), told her that S8 rode bike to school and I left van for her to pick him up after school.
Note, I have a narrow driveway so I had to move the van onto the street to get my car out that was parked in garage. Then I returned the van back into driveway.
Here is where it gets weird. Last time, I took the van because it was the first vehicle in driveway she said.. "I don't want to drive your car".. several times over the past few months she would make comments to kids like "dad does not want me to drive his car".
Then this morning I get a text from her and it says.. "You're to fu!@ing much. You move the van out so I don't drive fu!@ing car! I get it. We need to start a separation cause I'm over this bu!!$hit".
I simply text back what was shared that morning. No matter what I do I cannot win..
I haven't been posting for awhile because I have been working on me and GAL. But my WW throws these roadblocks in my way making it much more challenging to move forward.
What is your plan in all of this?
Hi Sandi, good to hear from you. That's a great question because I still do not have the answer to it. I was working on me and DB'ing.. that was my plan and I was executing it.. (ie. being respectful and mindful towards WW.. stopped texting/calling WW during the day to checkin.. GAL.. etc).
I do not want S or D because it will hurt us both individual socially, economically, and mentally. Take away the emotions and look at the facts.. there is no doubt it will crash us. The big factor are our KIDS. It will kill them especially S8 (WW and I both feel he is developmentally/emotionally behind).
WW has asked me several times if it is better for kids to see a healthy MR rather than what we have.. I have never physically or verbally attacked my W.. kids do not see physical affection (holding hands/a kiss between us but we both give a lot of physical affection towards kids) but I do not think they care.. all they care about is that mommy and daddy are together (laugh, smile, joke, etc as a family) and always there to support them and love them unconditionally.
I am torn because if S or D is what she wants to be happy; I do not want to be the obstacle.. and on the other side do I stand to fight for my kids because who will fight for what they want (their best interest) if I do not?!?
So I do not have a plan other than continue to work on me (for now).. any insight/thought is EXTREMELY welcomed.
Hi Sandi, it's not that I have not thought about it. What I do feel is WW is not here with me in MR. I accept that we are here co-parenting and I am happy to support our kids $$ (more than 50%). We are here co-habitating and I feel this should be closer to 50% $$ because she works and is able to support herself. However I am sure this is NOT how she feels. I covered 100% of living expenses.. but now that I am coming out of the fog.. this is where I need to stand my ground and disagree because I did not end the MR.. she did and makes it clear she does not want to work on MR.. I have no obligation to support her.. right?
I have learned so much from this experience. I honestly see my flaws and opportunities for improvement to be a better man, father.. and hopefully someday a husband/partner.
Just Journaling.
My kids have a few days off from school making it a long weekend. A few weeks ago WW and I planned to take kids to play snow (7 hour drive away). But now my S10 and WW have a really bad cold/flu and will not be able to make it. This morning, I asked my S8 if he still wanted to go and he replied, "50/50 because I want it to be a family trip and if mommy and <his brother> can't go; it's not a family trip but I still want to play in the snow and you can't get your $$ back from hotel.. <he paused>.. I still want to go because you already paid for the hotel".
I should not let my MR interfere with doing things with and for my kids. He didn't get to play snow last year and I know it's something he really enjoys. I see it as building memories with S8 and me.
What I do not look forward to is WW. The van is equipped for roadtrip and snow while the car is not. I would prefer to take the van but I know my WW will give me $h!t about taking the van since she does not want to drive the car (or at least that's what she says).