Confused Newbie 3 - DivorceBusting.com

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After some of our friends had talked to me over the last week, they told me that my W had not been acting the same around them. They all thought she was mad at them. In a way, I am glad to hear that it's not just me that she has changed around. I know that she isn't the same right now. Just like the pic on my phone, she appears almost bitter some days. Very unlike the optimistic and outgoing woman I knew.
I have done everything that she asked for while we went to counseling. I actually agreed with those points, and want them to stick. She never actually tried to fix anything in her between BD and S. She fixed nothing since then. Wouldn't even agree to go out with me. I asked her to go to see a counselor a while back, but she said that she was talking to her mom. For a couple months, she wouldn't even speak to her parents, until they agreed with her that she isn't happy. She convinced them that she hadn't been happy for years. Script, right? She is not the girl I fell for now, and it seems that others are seeing it as well.

Ranting a bit, I guess. I just wish something here made some sense. I want the girl I love to reappear, and come to me. Until then, I will try and be the best dad ever.

I see why it is said to believe nothing they say, because W contradicts herself quite often. I keep looking for the good, even thoughI am told not to. It's a lot of what keeps me hoping right now

Have a baseball game tonight. This team is the one that I usually do dugout dad for. I will try to appear confident, have good posture, appear ok with my life, smile, be happy and have some fun with the kids. Be someone attractive, that W would be a fool to leave.
My first week of LRT has went ok. Nothing major happened, good or bad. Some good things, that may be nothing... W hasn't mentioned D, hasn't mentioned me getting anything out of the house this week, asked me to do favors for her, offered to do things for me, asked for advice regarding the boys (which I think is the proper thing to do), cooked a meal and sent it home with me. May be nothing, may all be temp check. I will stay at it, and hope to continue to see small changes. It IS helping me to detach a tiny bit, so that is definitely a plus. Having zero expectations is hard for me. It's a marathon, not a sprint!
Anything that I am forgetting here?

So W didn't even acknowledge that I was at the game, until we were walking out and she asked the boys to tell me goodbye. This just keeps on hurting.

Thinking things through, don't believe anything... all last week, W was very nice, and tried to be helpful and asked for help and advice. Last night she sat with people I had never seen her talk to, and didn't say anything to me. So in 24 hours, I saw 2 completely different people in her.

Anyway, is this a "normal" or "typical" reaction to LRT? Full moon? Monday night football? Can't find matching socks? Etc.

Either way, I think I am definately seeing a reaction, which means she is noticing the change in our dynamic. As it is the only thing I can do, I feel a little lighter. Feel as if I have/am trying everything to save our M. I am far from detached, but I feel less obsessed every time she does something out of character.

I miss the woman she was

Keep strong

I can so relate to your last post two different people ....old wife was not secretive and did not loose it so much with the kids

It makes detaching easier I think

Quote:

She never actually tried to fix anything in her between BD and S. She fixed nothing since then. Wouldn't even agree to go out with me. I asked her to go to see a counselor a while back, but she said that she was talking to her mom. For a couple months, she wouldn't even speak to her parents, until they agreed with her that she isn't happy. She convinced them that she hadn't been happy for years.

Here is what most LBH'S don't seem to grasp. When he hears her drop the bomb, it wakes him up and he's ready to work and repair the MR. However, the reason she dropped the bomb in the first place, is b/c she has reached the end. She feels she cannot endure anymore, and has no desire or intentions of working to repair things. She's done!

So, why do LBH'S seem perplexed when their W doesn't show any effort to join him in trying to make their M work? They are on two different paths. They have two different mindsets. To me, it seems it would be very self-defeating for a LBH to continue to be disappointed that his W is making no changes, showing any effort, or cooperating with him to fix the MR.

Actually, I do try to empathize. However, he needs to remember that he has been awaken and ready to go to work. She has resigned and called it a day. It will take a long time before she'll want to commit again.

Quote:

Anyway, is this a "normal" or "typical" reaction to LRT? Full moon? Monday night football? Can't find matching socks? Etc.

Either way, I think I am definately seeing a reaction, which means she is noticing the change in our dynamic. As it is the only thing I can do, I feel a little lighter. Feel as if I have/am trying everything to save our M. I am far from detached, but I feel less obsessed every time she does something out of character.

Yes, it's typical.

Changing the dynamics will get her attention, and you will get everything from temp checks to being ignored.

It is normal to miss the W she use to be. You loved her. There's a good chance that you will see her again one day. I sure hope you do.

Thanks Sandi, I sure hope you are right that I see the one I love again. I will stick with LRT, and work on me. Still hoping for the best!

dday,

It seems like you are doing well. Keep up the good work.

Whyus, I am not sure that I am doing all that well, but I am trying. I would do anything to keep my family whole, and W knows that. But it's up to her now. I HAVE to let her figure it out on her own. Wish I would have realized that months earlier, would have made the road back much shorter.

Thanks for the support all. I need it

Please tell me that the pain, worry, fear, etc. get easier to handle. I know that my M is dead. I hope to start a new one with my W. How long do you have to make a change stick, for someone to believe that it is sincere? I know now that I will never take someone for granted again. So there has been some good in all this process. I am not grumpy like I was, which was one of her complaints. I do not drink to avoid problems anymore. I am working towards being more outgoing and friendly.

My goals include being more optimistic, less codependent, being an even more awesome dad, being a better friend, enjoy life!, make my changes stick, regain more of my confidence.

Hopefully W gets through this time in her life and wants to join me again. If so, my stipulations are to talk through problems and not let them fester, and I want and need to feel like a priority. I have taken a backseat to the kids and our friends, and sometimes her family. I will not stand for that anymore. I love my kids, but they are involved in everything... and it took up way too much of our time. There was no "us" time left after working, remodeling, kids activities, etc.

At least I have some goals now, that I need to make more actionable, and I know what was missing for me in our M. I have fixed/quit the negative things that she asked for in our M They are baby steps, but they are mine.

Now to just be able to be happier when I see her. Keep standing for my M. Keep moving forward. Hope like h3ll that her fog lifts and she comes to me again.

W texted me 4 times earlier. I waited 30 mind before texting back. It was all kid stuff, with a few extra tidbits thrown in. But, after last night, it felt good that she made contact again. Back to DB work...

Here is what most LBH'S don't seem to grasp. When he hears her drop the bomb, it wakes him up and he's ready to work and repair the MR. However, the reason she dropped the bomb in the first place, is b/c she has reached the end. She feels she cannot endure anymore, and has no desire or intentions of working to repair things. She's done!

So, why do LBH'S seem perplexed when their W doesn't show any effort to join him in trying to make their M work? They are on two different paths. They have two different mindsets. To me, it seems it would be very self-defeating for a LBH to continue to be disappointed that his W is making no changes, showing any effort, or cooperating with him to fix the MR.

Actually, I do try to empathize. However, he needs to remember that he has been awaken and ready to go to work. She has resigned and called it a day. It will take a long time before she'll want to commit again. .

Changing the dynamics will get her attention, and you will get everything from temp checks to being ignored.

It is normal to miss the W she use to be. You loved her. There's a good chance that you will see her again one day. I sure hope you do.

^^^^^^^^^^. This is golden ^^^^^^^^^^^

Lbh will then do anything to try to make it better right but it is too late for her

Alright. I like where your head is. Lets get to some work!

My goals include being:
more optimistic How ae you going to do this? Have you watched the TED talk by Shawn Achor? I think you should try the Happiness challenge.

less codependent what steps are you taking? reading books? Taking actions?

being an even more awesome dad by doing what? helping with HW, reading books, extra outings, etc?

being a better friend what kinds of things will you do? validation? GAL activities?

enjoy life! Similar to the first one. What are your goals for happiness?

make my changes stick How ae you going to measure this?

regain more of my confidence. By doing what? dressing better? eating better? sleeping more? etc

Set em up so that you can really see your life laid out. I think it's the only way to actually make sure that you hit them.

Thanks az. I know they are vague, and I need to tie actions to them to quantify it. Those are all good questions though, and should help me do it.

Originally Posted By: dday

Thanks az. I know they are vague, and I need to tie actions to them to quantify it. Those are all good questions though, and should help me do it.

I understand that they were just set out in a vague fashion originally. But thats easy. Its really easy to say "My goal is to enjoy life. My goal is to be a great dad." Those were ALWAYS my goals, even in the years where I WASNT being a great dad or enjoying life. I just didnt ever have plans in place to do them, so I forgot about them and deprioritized them.

I just worry when these vague concepts get floated out as "goals" because its so EASY to do that, which makes it EASY to assume that you are doing them.

For me, it has been so important to list things out in detail that I can keep them out in front of me and accomplish them.

Great dad:
play more with the boys
be more attentive
find more teachable moments

More optimistic:
Try and squish negative ideas
Avoid negative people
Thank God for something every time I pray
Watch the TED talk thing that I keep hearing about

Less CD:
detach
I am responsible for my own feelings... repeat 1 billion times!

Better friend:
Listen AND validate
accept more invites
not be such a recluse
take nothing for granted

Enjoy life:
Be grateful
Enjoy the boys
Maybe run a 5k?
Start working on some projects (wood lathe, get my antique truck running)

Make changes stick:
be accountable
Find someone to hold me accountable

Regain confidence:
Exercise more
Sleep more
Posture
PMA
Do the other goals on the list, and confidence will come

Better?

OK...lets keep going through. Remember, were looking for SMART goals - specific, measurable, attainable, relevant, and time based. In general, I think they are all good things you should be doing. But youre going to want to know whether you are doing them or not.

Great dad:
play more with the boys is there a target for time? or activity?
be more attentive how? keeping your phone away? helping with HW?
find more teachable moments again, how? talks at bedtime?

More optimistic:
Try and squish negative ideas ...try...? What will you do to "squish" them?
Avoid negative people do you have a list of who that is?
Thank God for something every time I pray good. Make it something different each time!
Watch the TED talk thing that I keep hearing about Theres two that I had recommended by 25years - one by Amy Cuddy and one by Shawn Achor. I also like the one by Brene Brown if you want extra credit

Less CD:
detach ok...thats too easy. HOW?
I am responsible for my own feelings... repeat 1 billion times! Maybe say this to yourself every time you look in the mirror?

Better friend:
Listen AND validate good
accept more invites can you accept ALL invites unless you have a kid-related thing?
not be such a recluse maybe limit your TV time? or video game time? How will you measure this?
take nothing for granted ok....how?

Enjoy life:
Be grateful Can you try to say thank you to 3 different people each day? Or say thank you to one person for something you wouldnt normally thank them for each day?
Enjoy the boys how to measure? Do one or two "special activities" per month? Go for a treat once a week?
Maybe run a 5k? Pick one and sign up!
Start working on some projects (wood lathe, get my antique truck running) whats your timeline?

Make changes stick:
be accountable Write them out specifically and emasure yourself against them!
Find someone to hold me accountable we can hold you accountable if you post them

Regain confidence:
Exercise more more = how much?
Sleep more more = how much?
Posture Watch the TED talk! Do it!
PMA Good
Do the other goals on the list, and confidence will come Yep!

Better? Yep. Keep going!

Ok az, I will revise it some more. Thanks!

So, I really want to shake my W and ask her why we are doing this. She came up to me and talked like we always have, so I played catch with the kids and made myself scarce. She is talking to people that she normally wouldn't, and is laughing and acting normal.

Having to see her nearly everyday is making this hurt even more. Luckily, baseball will be over in another week. Then it's basketball, bit that will only be once a week.

I just saw my pay statement with the first child support taken out. Yet another reminder of this. S8 asked me when I was coming home last night. He is the one that usually avoids talking about this. He said "maybe over fall break you can come back home?" I would so love that! Between games, W wanted to talk like we are still good friends, so I went off to the restroom, came back and started playing catch until some of my friends arrived to talk to.

W best friend at S8 games was sitting on the bleachers. W sat down beside them, and within 5 minutes her friend was at the complete other end of the bleachers and her husband followed. Maybe it is cruel of me, but I liked it that they would sit by me and show support, but not her. It helps reinforce that I am not in the wrong, and it may shake her up some. Start lifting some fog.

Up to now, W has not suffered any setbacks. I helped her through her medical problems this summer, cared for her and the boys. She still had the house. The new van. My boys, most of the time. I am hoping that she has some adversity that makes her realize the gravity of this decision. I long for another chance, with the W I had.

I have been uprooted. Have to change my work schedule and burn my vacation time. Lost money. Have sold off possessions. Was isolated from friends. Have to rent this shabby house, but it was the only one open. Drive a car with 250k miles on it. And suffer emotionally.

The plus said is that so many people care, that I never realized. I AM growing, and will continue to. She did wake me up with this, but I changed everything she asked for. (They were needed) The changes have stuck for 7 months so far, and I don't want to backslide.

I need to let her go, move forward, etc. I know this, but I haven't gotten to how to do it. I need to be prepared to move on, if she doesn't clear the fog. For my own happiness, my boys, and for the chance at a future R.

Dday, I just wanted to stop by. I have been following your sitch and yours sounds very similar to mine. Our BD dates are days apart. Our move out days are withing a week. And it sounds like your friends are catching on now too. I don't have much more to say other than keep your head up buddy! We're in this together.

Listened to Shawn Achor ted talk. That dude is funny, and had some great ideas.

3 things I am grateful for today:
Awesome fall weather, I love this time of year.
My boss is being very understanding, and allowing me to change my schedule to suit my kids.
Talking to Dan, my friend here at work that is very supportive, and reassuring me that I am on the right road.

Thinking out loud:
I have done all that I can to show her what she means to me, and the lengths that I would go to to make her happy. I have given her a great life, and have made sacrifices along the way to do so. I know, in my heart, that I have done the best I can, and have tried to make amends where I could. W knows where my heart is, and that I want her back w/ changes. I am becoming more comfortable with LRT, and showing her what life will look like without my support if she continues down this path. I think I am ready to start letting her go. I will be ok, regardless.

Hey dday,

Reading your sitch reminds me of the time my now exwife decided to walk away. This was before I even knew about DB.

I can vividly recall all the feelings you listed and the struggles you talk about. It was awful.

Anywho.. she ended up leaving and moving to a town about an hour away. She bought a home and enrolled our daughter in school and her life was great. She made lots of friends and was doing well at work. In the meantime, I was gutted. My life was over. I missed her and our daughter every single day. Brutal.

Then I slowly started to get over her - really get over her. Something that only time allows us to do. I started to be ok again. Started noticing other women. Started to see the world differently. Guess what happened - she had somehow felt it. She felt me moving on. She felt me not caring what she thought about me anymore. In my mind I wasn't doing anything differently when I saw her to exchange our daughter for visitation. I can only assume I was giving off some different energy unbeknownst to me.

She started sniffing around and calling. Then she wanted to hang out. I was torn at this point. Do I allow her back into my life? Or do I continue down this exciting new life I was discovering?

I decided for the sake of our daughter to date her again. But because I had this new strength, I was wasn't desperate for her anymore. I was able to see her flaws, her compulsive nature. Her ability to manipulate and charm me. She actually started to turn me off. To be honest, I didn't want her anymore. And I told her that.

She had become the LBS. And she did all the crying, pursuing, and threatening. And all it did was turn me off even more.

You never know how things will turn out. And your feelings may very well change as time passes. It's terrifying right now, I get it. But realize that things are unfolding for you and a lot of this stuff you have no control over.

Keep putting one foot in front of the other and let time do it's job. Release your waw. Turn that focus on her onto yourself and your kids.

Ps.. My exwife still contacts me every once in a while. She's been through 7 relationships and kicks herself for letting me go.

Thanks thorn! I am glad to hear that you had another chance, even if it didn't work out. That would eliminate a lot of what ifs from my mind.

I truly believe that I can start to let her go, even if my motives for doing it aren't what I would like them to be. I love her, and want my family repaired, but she has some work to do now. I understand a bit of what everyone says with the S needing to catch up. I can own my mistakes and work through them, eliminate my bad behaviours, she hasn't gotten there yet.

Time will tell. I hope she becomes happy. I hope she comes back to me after that.

Happy to help!

Keep in mind I was able to DB my new relationship with my fianc� when she left over a year ago. Things are going great!

Stay calm even though you are in panic mode. I remember doing exactly what the Vets told me to do. Keep reading DR and make sure that your wife only sees the confident and happy dday. No relationship talks. Fake it if you have to.

You are awesome thorn. That is just what I need to hear today. I see the W 4+ times a week right now, and I need to show her the happy me

I have done all that I can to show her what she means to me, and the lengths that I would go to to make her happy. im guessing you mean this in past tense. But it's time to knock this off, if it isn't.

I have given her a great life ...in your opinion. If it's so great, why is she leaving?

and have made sacrifices along the way to do so. I know, in my heart, that I have done the best I can, and have tried to make amends where I could. none of us KNEW. We didn't have the tools to fix ourselves even had we known. Don't beat yourself up over the past. Now you know better - all you can do is change yourself going forward.

W knows where my heart is, and that I want her back w/ changes. again, I assume this is based on past actions/discussions. If not. Knock this off. You don't want to leave this decision to her. Don't keep telling her the door is always open.

I am becoming more comfortable with LRT, and showing her what life will look like without my support if she continues down this path. I think I am ready to start letting her go. I will be ok, regardless. its time to take your focus off of "showing her her life" and put it onto living your life. You don't need to consciously "let her go". When you live your life, you'll look around and one dat discover that you have already let her go.

Revised goals:

Great dad:
stay off phone and focus on boys, playing HW, etc.
Look for more teachable moments, at bedtime, and as they occur
(last night they were wondering about the rules for passing cars and yellow lines)

Optimism:
Avoid (as much as possible) negative coworkers
Stop negative ideas, or process and release them as quickly as possible
Pray and be grateful
Watched Ted talk by Shawn Achor, try and implement ideas
Watch Amy Cuddy Ted talk

Less CD:
I have read CDNM
I am responsible for my own feelings- repeat
Work on detachment through physical distance, and trying to analyze without emotions as much as possible
I need more suggestions here

Better friend:
Listen and validate
accept all invites that I can attend
Less reclusive, (I detest being alone right now, so that is easy)
Try to not take anyone or anything for granted... be grateful and thankful, more appreciative

Enjoy life:
Be grateful: (Ted talk idea) write 3 things I am grateful for every day
Try and give the kids the best life I can, as single or hopefully with W. Try to keep taking vacations, etc. if affordable
Train and run a 5k this fall (I would like to do a mud run next summer)
Get my 55 Chevy running this winter
Get the woodlathe from Ws house and start turning again

Be accountable:
Post list here and be accountable to you all

Regain confidence: (it is starting to come back)
Start training to run a 5k
Sleep more than 6 hours per night (its very broken sleep at that)
PMA
Posture
Keep at my goals

How's this one?

Az, I am on a zero pressure kick. I haven't brought up anything for the past week and a half. Since then she has bounced between giving me a pot of soup to ignoring me to trying to sit by me and everything in between.

W has the house, kids, vehicle, vacations, etc that she has wanted. I enjoyed making all those things possible. She worked part time to be with the boys more, and I had to work OT a lot to accommodate it.

2 weeks ago, and this was the last time!, I told her that I was here now, willing to do the work to make us great...but I wouldn't be there forever. Yeah that was my last pressuring time.

I am starting to live my life, but I can't say it's for me yet. It's getting there, but I am not there yet!

I still want her back, but changes will be in order first! Before, I would have jumped right back, but I have some stipulations now.

At kid exchange, W handed me a loaf of pumpkin bread, we discussed some financial junk. She brought up that she hadn't seen any child support yet, and the email I received from the lawyer wasn't mean, and shouldn't have put me on a bad mood last weekend. I told her that it's just another reminder of this, just like my paycheck today saying child support. And then, I screwed up, I said that I didn't choose this. I pretty much left after that. So, I had a bit of a backslide. Wasn't hateful or anything, just shouldn't have said it

As I've been told over and over again...so you had a backside. No big deal. Do better next time. It's okay D. I don't know the number of mistakes I've made and probably will make. The point is...you are trying. And you are DEFINITELY making progress!

I'm on your side, my friend! Just keep doing the best you can.

I see it more as a truth dart, than a backslide.

However, her giving you food when you swap the kids, or sending home by the kids......is one of her ways of keeping you emotionally attached. She is reminding you, just as much as the child support checks are reminders.

So, when are you going to stop going inside her house at kids swap?

I did go in this time, I didn't last time. And yeah, I don't know the term truth dart, but I would guess that it was one.

So, a truth dart is actually a good thing. I was afraid it was a big no no. I guess that it was my 2nd one in 2 weeks. I was afraid I had screwed up again!

I am grateful today:

Had my boys last night, played video games since we have colds, still a good night though

My preacher friend here at work, he listens to me nearly everyday and is very upbeat and encouraging.

My bank account looks a lot better than I had feared. That's nice

Yeah, D! Great PMA! Keep it going. LOL

Good job dday!

Keep that focus on you and the kids.

Something had happened in the last 24 hours. I feel different. I am conflicted on this "new" me. I am finding myself less attracted to W. I have been informed that there are many rumors, I don't think they are true, but they are there. Yesterday, I was thinking about building a small house, and I got excited about it. Plans for the single me, and I actually feel ok with them. I even talked to someone about getting some land. I haven't completely given up on W, but I feel like I can move forward for myself and the boys today. She has texted me, and I answered vlafter a while, very short answers. I haven't responded to the last one, because it wasn't about the boys. I feel like now, I have boundaries that she would have to honor for me to take her back.

I will not be walked all over anymore. We always did holidays with her family on the holiday, and mine whenever we could squeeze it in. Then she would try and make me feel guilty that we didn't spend enough time with them, even though it would be a couple times per month.

I know, it doesn't matter really. But she has always put everyone else in front of our M. Not sure why I never realized it until now

Funny how that happens huh?

You're doing good dday!

It feels weird. I don't want to quit, but I am done being pushed around and toyed with. There lies the conflict inside me. I think I am going to like the new me! I didn't expect my feelings to change for quite a while, but here I am. I am excited to start doing house plans though. Feels good to have a goal that excites me.

Originally Posted By: dday

I didn't expect my feelings to change for quite a while, but here I am.

For me, it honestly started once I started to actually set goals and work towards them. Thats why I talk about it so much on here. Spending the time to figure out what I wanted and start to work toward it allowed me to take my focus off of my wife and our relationship and out it where I want it to go.

Now that you are working on you, its time to achieve all of those goals you set!

I'm jumping on the goal setting bandwagon, too! Once I started making plans that didn't revolve around H, my entire attitude changed. I'm still going forward with those plans, too. I've taken control of my life back, and I'm happy.

I am so proud of you, D! You're doing so well. Pat yourself on the back for me, okay?

You guys are such a big help. This is like a big family, full of people in dysfunctional sitchs. Lol. Anyway, thank you all, because you guys are helping me through this.

My mind is bouncing tonight. I feel sorry for her, she had everything she had asked for and is throwing it away. I hope she realizes, and tries to work it out, to be a greater couple. Sometimes I wish that I hadn't ever met her. But then I wouldn't have my boys.

She is troubled and I still pray for her. Maybe she will come around. I pray that too. But right now, every minute that passes is going to make it so much harder to make it right.

I have done the math, and she will not have any money for food, gas, etc. After daycare, mortgage, van payment, utilities she will have nothing left. If she hasn't seen this yet, then there must be someone else willing to pay for her. So, she is either extremely short sighted or has someone on the side. Not sure which is worse. Being completely uncaring about my kids, or having been betrayed. Either way, after that line of thinking the hole she is in is much deeper.

Not my circus. Not my monkeys. It's all on her

I am grateful today for:
Family that is helping me stay busy, and helping me with little things

Kids basketball starts today, which will.make them happy

Support that I am getting from some/most of the "parents". I have been genuine with them, and they seem to have been to me

I still have trouble with no expectations. I had a dream that she came to realize what she had done, and wanted to work on us. So I think that affected me today. We are both on the board for this basketball league, so we were both here. She tried to get me to do something, but I was taking the forms and money before she got here, so I stayed at my spot and she went and mingled. It's amazing the way she has to sit with people now, nobody will sit with her. We live in a small town, and she is rapidly losing her approval rating. It saddens me, but she needs to wake up to realize it. She will soon be alone, if she doesn't wake up. I feel bad for my kids, because their buddies families are pulling back from her, and them too

The fact remains that you love her. Of course, you feel badly for her and worry; that's a natural thing that people who love engage in.

The best thing I read is that you stated you realize she has to live with the results of her choices. That is the best thing we can do for people we love. Too often, we swoop in to save them from themselves - which ensures they learn nothing.

If you ever wind up together again, and are certain you never want to experience this situation again...

Let her fall, all the way down. Do it lovingly, from a distance. People never appreciate what they have unless life has taught them some really hard lessons.

This is easy for me to say, much harder to do. You seem to be doing really well! Your mindset is much improved, you are committed and involved with your kids, you're getting out and doing things...You are becoming a DB success!

So proud of you, D. You're doing great.

Yes, the big sister in me is always coming out...lol

Thanks Judy, I need the big sister. I am leaning on a cousin of mine, since I don't have parental guidance. So you all are very helpful.

That ace score thing, I am not even going to go there because it will probably scream Basket Case! Lol

I am getting better, stronger. W looked very nice today. She must really like this new pair of jeans, she has wore them the last 3 days I was around her. She is taking the kids to family stuff, and then the movies. Her parents are probably handing her money, enabling her. Nothing I can do there.

Still love the old her. Her power over me is fading though, along with my resolve to wait for her. I have been trying since February and have gotten very little back. Some of her "new" friends were talking to me, saying they had no idea since they always see us together. They said "it makes no sense".

Pretty much sums it up to me too

I am at our house, moving some more of my stuff. W isn't here. I am taking half of the freezer meat, a freezer, half of our canned veggies (we do/did our own), and some more of my tools from the garage.

It's another step, and I am not crying. I am somewhat angry. But, it's all on her now. Maybe my taking my things will wake her up... probably not. Either way, the boys will have food when they come over. Selfishly, it makes me hopeful that when she sees there isn't as much food left as she thought, and she has to buy meat at the store... it may enlighten her as to the future a bit.

My den is still completely empty, and she took my books off the bookshelf, yet left all of our pics up. Even the dating ones.

Question: how do you act happy, vague, and keep it short all at the same time when talking to them?

You may have noticed that whenever attending some event, the WW seems to think you should continue to escort her or sit by her. Some LBH'S really buy into it and think that's some kind of "sign". It is not a sign. It is not her being interested or anything, other than her not wanting to be in public alone (especially if the H is there) without a man by her side. It's as if she wants to keep up some kind of appearances in public. However, it usually just makes a sucker out of the poor H.

Same goes for whenever she's lonely, neglected or OM has rejected her. Look out, b/c that's when she's going to show up.

Quote:

Question: how do you act happy, vague, and keep it short all at the same time when talking to them?

Well, I suppose another LBS should be the one to answer that question. I will just give you an opinion. First, by acting happy, we don't mean the goofy kind of happy. No cracking jokes, giggling over every word she says, as if you are plain giddy to be with her. Not only will it turn it waaaaaay off, but She will see right through you. Instead of over-kill, just work at not showing how sad you are feeling. Don't let her see how upset she has made you. Work at being even keel and showing a peacefulness or contentment about yourself.

It is not unusual for a WW to ask her H lots of questions, but she she doesn't want him asking her. You do not have to answer, just b/c she asked! I have always said that a man can say more with just a look at her, than he could ever say with words. When she's being nosy, or asking questions you think aren't fair.........just give her a look that tells her she no longer gets these answers. Some questions can be answered with a little grin. Try using one-three word answers. Come on, guys don't seem to have trouble with few words BEFORE they get the bomb.

I have been able to keep the conversations shorter. I have made excuses to walk away, have been busy when W wants to chat. I feel like she is using kid stuff as a reason to come talk to me. I know that I come across as mad, more than hurt now. And that is without faking anything. It's just where I am right now. I trusted W with everything and she has betrayed me and the boys. Maybe not A, but I wouldn't be surprised anymore.

I can have a good time with the kids, and other parents now. And it's real... that is a change. I still hurt to see her out of the corner of my eye, and not see her glance my way.

Far from detached, but I have made a few steps that direction. I still want it to work out, but I am making plans for the other outcome. I don't feel so tied to the idea that we have to... it is more of a want now.

So, I probably don't come across as unaffected, but like I have controlled anger. No R talk. No pressure. No goodbyes. No compliments. I try not to ask her anything, unless it's kid related. And I walk away first, most times.

Feels wrong, but I think I am following the advice. Let me know how I should tweak it!

Good Morning Dday, I just wanted to reach out and let you know that you are a good man. Through your posts it is clear you care deeply for your wife and children. Your efforts are true. We LBS don't always get it right but tend to end up in the right direction. I think that you effort has to be authentic, or the spouse may see through it.

Shifting from hurt to mad seems logical. Next may be indifference or what ever your feeling. I think seasoning your detachment with a little emotion makes it real for them. Don't listen to me though, my marriage is in a sorry state. Be true to yourself Dday and know we love you (like a brother).

Coming across as mad isnt ideal for a reason so try not to think it's a huge positive. Its understandable to have anger but controlling yiur emotions and you is very important regardless of what they are. It may not be as bad as desperate but its neither attractive or helping you toward your goal. There's less pressure from no R talks but there is still pressure. The anger/coldness you show her still proves to her she's doing the right thing. In her mind the M is the wrong thing and to make herself happy she had to leave it and you. Anytime you go against those feelings(anger, coldness,pressure with R talk, being desperate, etc) your keeping her focusing on getting away from you. As long as she's running from you she can't see what's making her really unhappy. Once the pressure is completely off her by you she MAY start the journey of understanding where her true unhappiness comes from, or shs may jump from one wrong thong to another trying to find it. Also remember this isn't about you, this is more about her and maybe learning things about herself just as you may have right after BD.

Thanks mu and fogg. I am not intentionally acting mad, but I think it comes out anyway. I have never been one to give a short answer, and have always tried to keep any conversations going, unless I was truly upset. So, I think that it probably comes across as me being angry of I am not trying to keep the conversations going.

Does that make sense?

_________________

I am grateful today:
Friends invited me up to their campsite, and we had a good time last night

I get to see the boys perform at church today, children's mass

Going to have dinner with sister and brother in law tonight

Sandi, I wish you made house calls!

Boys ran into church and sat with me, so guess where W sat. I was friendly, but short and asked her nothing. S4 repeatedly asked why I wasn't going home with them today, and when that would happen, why I didn't want to, etc. I hope she hears this too, because it hurts and it's not my fault. When we were walking out, she started defending herself, unprevoked, saying that she had told me about today's church being a children's mass a couple weeks ago. Wrong. So that led me to ask why she didn't tell me about parent teacher day Thursday. She said "you've never went before" which is true. I replied that I never needed to, because she told me what was going on with the boys, unlike now. She apologized.

This [censored] for me and those kids. I think she still lives in a dream world. Not sure what she thinks divorce is going to look like for our family. The picture I have is going to be tough and strained and emotional.

I am upset and hurt again tonight. W sat with me, which we have discussed before. She is withholding info on my kids too. She is still disrespecting me, and I am sick of it. I have been reflecting on some more of our past. W never likes to ask for things, just drop hints until I would volunteer for something. If I didn't catch on, or for whatever reason didn't volunteer, she would become upset with me. W cannot voice what her wants/needs were/are. That is one of her issues, that she had projected as my problem. Sorry, venting again.

What should I do about her sitting with me again?

D, if she won't honor your request, you may have to get up and move. You can start by reminding her that you have discussed the topic already, and ask her to sit elsewhere. If she won't, I guess you will have to move. I don't know her, so it is hard to fathom her reasons, but she is clearly disregarding your wishes.

"W, we discussed this. I'd really prefer you sit somewhere else. Thanks."

Be pleasant, and keep it as short as you can. Just remember you are standing up for yourself, not attacking her. It's your boundary, and she needs to respect it.

Thanks Judy. It is my request. I do it because it gives me false hope. And, I still believe that it does the same for my boys. Especially when they are asking me, repeatedly, when I am coming home and why I don't want to. So unfair to all of us. S4 about broke my heart yesterday doing that. I'm not sure what to tell them, and I feel like it is her place to break their hearts. Not mine.

Quote:

I have been able to keep the conversations shorter. I have made excuses to walk away, have been busy when W wants to chat. I feel like she is using kid stuff as a reason to come talk to me. I know that I come across as mad, more than hurt now. And that is without faking anything. It's just where I am right now. I trusted W with everything and she has betrayed me and the boys. Maybe not A, but I wouldn't be surprised anymore.

I don't think the H has to go around with a cheesy smile when his W is disrespecting him in front of his kids.

Exactly what did you say to her about not sitting by you at the games? Maybe you were too nice or not plain enough? Did you actually say something along the lines, "Wife, I do not want you sitting by me.......anywhere. If we are going to be separated in our M and private lives, then we are going to be separated in the public".

Are you discussing the games together during the week whenever she contacts you? I suggest you stay clear of any game conversations. Do you contact her if you aren't attending a game? If so, you need to stop, immediately. I tried to explain this previously, and how it works against you. She will not respect your request if you are not behaving as if you are separated.

This may shock some people, and they may think it's rude or childish......but I'm thinking like a woman here. Stop taking her homemade bread, or any other dishes she tries to give you. If the kids bring it home without you face to face with her........put it in the frig and don't serve it (unless the kids presicely ask to eat it). Always have something else planned for the meal. You don't have to dump it in the trash, just put it away till the kids leave. Trust me, she'll know if it was not eaten. I think I can guarantee a change. She will be furious! So what? If you want her to stop the games....then stop being involved in these things that agg it on. As I said before, she uses this to keep you attached. What do you say when she tries to give you food? "No thanks, I'm good", and immediately leave. If she persists, shake your head and move your feet out the door (or show her the door). Nothing gets the message over as clear as saying, "No thanks".
That woman knows what she is doing with the food, sitting next to you, and using the kids as her excuse to keep you attached and her backup plan. You are going to have to make more tough decisions, before she gets the picture that she cannot play these games. At this point, she is not feeling she's really lost you (as crazy as it sounds). She thinks she still has you for all practical purposes.

About parent's night at school, get a school calendar that shows the dates of events. You are S, and should not rely on your W to inform you about these things. You can also have a copy of their progress reports, notices of conferences, etc., sent to you.

Your children should not be left to think daddy doesn't want to come home. What is your W doing when the kids are begging you to go back home? Let me guess........nothing.

Have the children seen a counselor or Priest who could talk to them about the separation?

Btw, don't tell her you are trying to detach. She needs to see you doing it, without her help. If you tell her she needs to stop sitting by you b/c it hinders you detaching or moving forward.....then you are defeating yourself. You don't tell a woman those things.

Thanks Sandi. I do not contact her. I wait to respond when she texts me. She does nothing at all when the kids ask me about coming home... how did you guess? I read your explanation of WW, that fits her. I told her that if she doesn't want me, then she needs to not sit with me. You can't have part of me, it's all or nothing. Don't know if that's the right thing to say. The bread is still sitting on the table, never opened it. The boys didn't eat the soup the week before. So I guess I unknowingly did that right.

Keep the advice coming!
I am having issues with lack of trust and respect for her today. Maybe that's a nermal step?

Quote:

I told her that if she doesn't want me, then she needs to not sit with me. You can't have part of me, it's all or nothing. Don't know if that's the right thing to say.

No, I don't think it was wrong to say.

Quote:

The bread is still sitting on the table, never opened it. The boys didn't eat the soup the week before. So I guess I unknowingly did that right.

Good!

Quote:

I am having issues with lack of trust and respect for her today. Maybe that's a nermal step?

From what I have read other LBH's say, it is completely normal. Here's the thing, when a person gives you reason not to respect or trust them.....then it's up to them to earn it back.

How do you respect someone who is disrespectful? How do you trust someone who did not value your trust? If they continue doing the same thing, then how can it restore what has been lost? I have read where this can be very difficult for the LBS during piecing. It takes time for the WS to earn it back, and if they aren't trying to earn it back......that's not good.

Don't be too hard on yourself today.

You are right, she will have to earn the respect and trust back. Its funny that it is exactly one of the things she has said about me. She doesn't trust that my changes were real, and she doesn't respect me. I turned to mush @ BD. So, I can see the lack of respect. I recently started standing up for myself, and she backpedals and apologizes. I was afraid to do it, avoiding fights I guess. But when I did I got a positive result.

She has texted me several times in the last 24 hours. All of which are quite wordy. My responses have been 1 or 2 words. May come across as a d!ck, but I'm not sure that matters right now. I just respond: ok, no, yes, etc.

I do want to restore my family, but I won't just give in and run back to her. If she decides to work on us, she has a LOT of catching up to do. I'm not bitter, I'm just in a different place than I was a couple weeks ago.

Had baseball tonight. W didn't even talk to me. Yesterday she wants to sit with me, then texts me. Texts me this morning. Then doesn't talk to me tonight. Is inconsistency normal?

I know that it's not supposed to bother me. I haven't reached that point yet, I suppose.

Still have trouble acting nonchalant, etc. Wish I could do that a lot better!

You will do better tomorrow and better the day after. You are a product of your experiences. As long as you keep evolving you'll do fine.

At this point in my life I feel wishes are for kids. If I want to have a different behavior I work at changing my actions. No magic fairy's in my book.

My gut says you still have a shot at saving your marriage. That doesn't mean it won't get harder for you or that you could still crash and burn. If what you said is true, you could have chance. As events unfold you must react/respond carefully. Sandi2 has your back, listen to her and heed her words.

Thanks mutatio. I sure hope there is a chance at saving my M. I am trying to not pressure her, and there has been no R talk for a couple weeks. She hasn't mentioned D stuff for a while either. Baseball ends this week, so I won't see her nearly as often. I think that will help me be able to detach more, if nothing else.

Forgot to do this yesterday.
I am grateful today for:

I get to enjoy fall break with my boys this weekend/next week.
My friends that invited me to go camping with them a couple weeks ago, they are very supportive.
S6 wanted to play catch with me last night. He misses me, and I am glad we got to do that.

_________________________________________________
I am re-reading the detachment chapter in CDNM. It still feels wrong to me, I feel like I am giving up. I know it is healthier to let go, but it feels wrong. I need to get to the place where I can show everyone that I am ok, no matter what. I know that I will be, no I just have to figure out how to project it.

Thanks for the support and advice! Keep it coming!

Sunday's reading at mass was from genesis. It was the story of God taking a rib from Adam and making Eve. Because it is not right for man to be alone. And this is the reason that man leaves his mother and father, and is joined to his wife to make one.

It spoke to me, that God is trying to show her the way. I hope she heard it too!

Feeling down. Have had to fight back tears a couple times. Haven't had that in a while. I have counseling today, and I am sure that will help me. I just don't understand this. Wish I had a time machine...

After a pep talk, I feel a little better. I have counselor, and then my sister invited me over again for dinner. So, I have things to do tonight. (Need to pay rent too, but that is not so much fun) Tomorrow we have 2 ball games. Then Thursday we start fall break. I realize that I keep having expectations. That is why I feel down today. Any suggestions on how to not have them?

Counseling went well. But, his advice conflicts with DB. His thought was to ask W how she is doing with the D stuff, and see if she has changed her position yet. W knows that I was all in, the last time we had M talk. My question is: since they knew that we want the M to be great, they do know all they have to do is admit they want to work on it. Right? Do they ever think that maybe the lbs is too far gone to even ask about reconciliation?

Thoughts?

I do not want to tell you what to do but I can tell you that I will never bring up divorce again to my wife. I did it a few times in the spring, never again. I will speak of it no more. If she wants a divorce she can bring up the conversation.

I believe your wife knows your position. I used to restate my position once or twice a month.
Each time I did my wife would say I know. After a while I felt silly restating it.

I would like to think that if they want to stay in the marriage they would at least give us a hint. I guess some walk away spouses might give up because they perceive the marriage "totaled". I think I would worry more about the second part more then the first part.

Originally Posted By: dday

Counseling went well. But, his advice conflicts with DB. His thought was to ask W how she is doing with the D stuff, and see if she has changed her position yet. W knows that I was all in, the last time we had M talk. My question is: since they knew that we want the M to be great, they do know all they have to do is admit they want to work on it. Right? Do they ever think that maybe the lbs is too far gone to even ask about reconciliation?

Thoughts?

In my opinion, if she had changed her position, you would know.
I don't see how doing what he says is at all going to be beneficial. Even if she is thinking about changing her position, you asking the question is going to scare her off and lead to a "no".

But, you aren't paying me for my opinion...

Thanks guys. I still feel that she knows what I want... even though I have quit saying it. I just don't want to screw up anymore than I already have. She isn't bringing up any D talk, which I think is good. She hasn't stopped it, but she isn't pushing anything right now either. I'm just trying to cover every base, I guess

I haven't read your entire thread, so please forgive me if I'm asking questions that you've already covered...

What was her childhood like? Did she have both her parents around? I'm wondering where her position of wanting to leave has come from; eg is/was there someone influential in her life that portrayed the concept to her that if she is unhappy, it's better to walk away than to try and fix?

Originally Posted By: Hulk

I haven't read your entire thread, so please forgive me if I'm asking questions that you've already covered...

What was her childhood like? Did she have both her parents around? I'm wondering where her position of wanting to leave has come from; eg is/was there someone influential in her life that portrayed the concept to her that if she is unhappy, it's better to walk away than to try and fix?

Have you ever tried to pet a hurt animal?

Comfort it and told it that if you loved it the animal would feel better?

I love this analogy cadet!!!

Her parents are still together. Someone had told her to quit, but it isn't her family. They have tried to get her to work through it.

I am grateful today for:

Had a good visit with my landlord last night. He's a very nice man that just met me recently, but is trying to help any way that he can.

Have a project here at work that is different than normal, so it is sort of a challenge, and will keep my mind off some things hopefully.

S8 has his last baseball game tonight. It will be nice to slow down a bit after this is over. S6 has one more after tonight.

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Oddly enough, W boss is the only person who told her that leaving out M would be a good idea. W has told me that "He just tells me how it is". W has always been close to him, and tells him her side of everything. So, if we had a problem in the evening, she would go to work and tell him about it, and may never talk to me about it at all. Wasn't really fair to me to not know how I had "hurt" her, but her boss knows. It's hard to fix what you don't know is a problem. We have always held back our feelings, etc to not hurt each other. They just bottled up and turned to poison in her.

I feel that is a major part of our breakdown. We didn't communicate our wants and needs effectively. That is a main point I have been working on in IC. Communication of my feelings, without it appearing like an attack.

Conflicted feelings again. Sometimes it is: I can't understand why she would do this to our family. I have given her everything that I knew she wanted, and have tried to guess what she has been needing that she couldn't/wouldn't tell me. Sometimes it is: It's her mess and she has to be the one to fix it. Sometimes it is: I am not sure that I want her back, if she would throw me away so easily.

Double header tonight, and I need to appear "as if" I am ok with her decision. Hard to not show my feelings. I can do it, but I fear that I am slipping into the friend zone then. I WILL NOT just be her friend. That isn't fair to me, my feelings, and I fear that it hinders any chance at R.

It is so disheartening to be here at the kids game, and W is sitting with one of the moms and texting someone and laughing. Seeming to have a good time. I, myself, wasn't having a bad time with the kids. But for some reason, it really bugs me to see her on the phone so much. I know it shouldn't, but it does.

I can't quit expecting something to change. I would like to, so I wouldn't be disappointed every day. There hasn't been any loss for her, or any great change, other than I am not at home. So I really have no reason to think she would react differently, and have the fog lift. I was happier, and don't think I showed her anything else. One of the boys was sick and she apologized, saying that he wasn't like that when she left the house. I wasn't accusing her of anything, but she got defensive anyway.

I need to keep working on letting go. I feel guilty trying, but I know I need to. I'm still praying, and trying to give it to God

I find the phone thing infuriating. I feel like she lives her life on it. I have been trying not to look at her lately. It kind of helps.

My wife does the same thing with the phone. I used to resent being ignored while she is on her phone. Now it doesn't matter because she won't talk with me anyway.

I am not sure rejecting her friendship in the short term is wise. I repeat I am not sure. It seems to be an emotional reaction. Isn't it smart to appear friendly and supportive in a relaxed setting. Let her see the new and improved dday. Allow her to learn to like you again.

I don't know the answer but I do know burning down a bridge is easier then building one up in hostile territory.

Originally Posted By: dday

Her parents are still together. Someone had told her to quit, but it isn't her family. They have tried to get her to work through it.

Ok. I'm guessing the person who told her to leave you is/was influential in her life though?
Stay strong

I am grateful today:

This is my last work day for a week!

I get the boys for the next 5 days... I have some fun things planned for us.

I had a decent interaction with W last night when dropping off S8, and I still have some hope.

_____________________________________________________

Ok, W told me last night that she and her mom are going shopping for the boys to get them new winter coats. (I am sure that MIL is going to pay for them, which does not help W see reality) I know that the in-laws are just trying to help... but it is very much an interference with us having a possible R. Nothing I can control, just an observation.

I have had 2 dreams this week about W wanting to reconcile. I don't normally remember my dreams, so this is memorable. I know it's probably my brain showing me what I want. But, it makes it harder for me the next day, when I do not see my dream become reality.

I am exhausted. Physically and emotionally. I have been feeling lately that I should just quit. I don't want that, but do I need to do it? I am not even sure what that will look like. But I feel that I am in need of something to stop this turmoil and fill the giant void.

I get the boys the next few days, and will try to focus on them. Let them fill my life up. It's not the same, but I love them, and they love me. They keep asking when I am coming home. In a way, I am glad that W hasn't told them that she is done. Gives me a bit of hope.

I really don't know what to do. Have been attempting LRT for a while now, and haven't seen any consistent results. She is still hot and cold with me.

Last night, she asked me to lift something heavy, and told me about hurting her back on a field trip with S4. Then told me that she was going shopping with her mom. Then asked if I needed anything special packed for the boys this week. Fishing for me to give her info on what my plans were.

Seems like maybe our dynamic may be changing a bit? At church, she still wants to be a "family". At ball, she now sits farther away from me. When it's just the 2 of us at kid swap etc, she seems to try to reel me in a bit. The changes are small, but I think they are real. I am still confused.

At kid swap, she tried to give me hamburger to feed the boys, I told her that I had it covered. She came out with a huge suitcase full of clothes, smiling saying "you know me!"... it's always been a running joke that she over packs for everything. I wanted to respond, well I 5hought I knew you. I didn't, I bit my tongue. Then she mentioned that she didn't know what I was taking the boys to go do.

I am grateful today:

Parent teacher conferences went well, only 1 b between S8 and S6. They are both doing very well in school.

S4 said that all he wants to do over this fall break is go bowling. He has never been and apparently has high hopes.

Cuddling. All 3 have came up and snuggled with me. Feels nice, and I miss it.

______________________

W met me at the school for conferences. I didn't really say much to her. She had on new clothes, jeans with butt bling, that we had always made fun of. Kinda odd she mentioned buying second hand clothes for the boys, and then shows up in new ones herself. She is acting as if she wants to be friends, but mostly we just talk about the boys. I fear she has become indifferent to me. Can you come back from that?

Boys keep asking me when I am coming home. S8 said he asked W and she told him "we will". And we are a family now. Not sure if I should hold out some hope there? God knows I want it, I pray to him several times a day. S4 is acting up a lot. I am sure our sitch is part of that. I miss hanging out with these guys every day. Miss W even more. Gonna try to make the best out of the next 4 days with them! Zoo, caves, bowling for S4, hotel and tons of good food. W and mil are taking them to an amusement park next weekend. I'm outnumbered, since I don't have my parents to help me. W and mil are going shopping for boys coats and new shoes today, which I am sure mil will pay for it. It's a nice gesture, but hurts W seeing reality.

D - funny that you were just commenting on Overcom' s thread, because I was heading over here to give you very similar advice! LOL

I started out pretending not long after finding my way to this board. It really worked for me. My heart was shattered, but I managed to find the strength to do what I needed to do. I spent plenty of time crying in private, but had on my "game face" in public. Pretty soon, my feelings really did undergo real changes. I detached to a level that I can operate at on an unemotional basis for the most part. I care about H, probably always will, but if he doesn't join me on my quest for a better R, I'll be able to move on. His actions destroyed a blind trust I used to have, but the loss wound up making me stronger.

Do I want D? No, absolutely not. I'd prefer to stick with my core beliefs and wind up with a happier M.

Will I be okay if it doesn't work out? Yes. I refuse to settle for an unhappy M any longer.

So my advice to help you truly detach: Pretend, Pretend, and pretend some more! Give an Oscar-worthy performance, because it matters. Do you want the same R, or something better? Your W is going to have to earn her way back to you. If something comes too easily, it is rarely valued the way it should be. You are a great dad, friend, and husband. You deserve a great M with someone you can count on.

You can do this, D!

Thanks Judy. I can pretend I am happy, but I am afraid she thinks I will be her friend. I don't want that. She just brought me a hot chocolate to the ballgame, it's chilly tonight. Then W told me about the deals she got kids shopping. I feel pretty good tonight, and I really am having fun. Don't want her to think I will be her friend though. That is what I am having trouble with. I want a great M! I will not settle

I meant a friend to others (like myself) not your W.

She should be in the friendly-ish neighbor zone. Someone you know, but would not share anything other than greetings with...Very, very casual. She's lost the right to know anything more than bare bones about your life. No need to be mean, just be vague.

Glad you're having fun tonight!

I know what you mean Judy, it's hard for me since I am so comfortable with her. It's like we are still married in public o4 something. This stinks, and I want my family back

dday everything will unfold in it's proper time. Stay true to yourself and love and support your kids. If you succeed at those two simple tasks you will be well prepared for whatever crosses your path.

Thanks mutatio, I wish the best for you too! All if us here, standing for our M should be proud of what we are doing. It is the right thing, no matter how it turns out.

I am thankful today:

Fell asleep on the couch watching spiderman with the boys, woke up after midnight with all 3 of them on me. I miss that, so it was nice.

Taking kiddos to the zoo today.

S4 asked if we could all go home. I asked if he didn't want to hang out with me, and he said he wanted me there too. It's nice to feel wanted by these 3!

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I had a great time at ball last night. S6 team finally won, and it was the last game. S8 filled in on the team, so we have pics of then running the bases back to back. Pretty cool. W showed up with a mug of hot chocolate for me. I took it, not sure if I should have, but it was nice that she was thinking of me. Not sure of the motives? She wasn't dressed up at all, hair pulled up and glasses, not contacts. Kinda out of her new normal. It felt good though. Until it was time to leave. Then I'm crushed again, because we are going seperate ways. I still have the expectations that she will "wake up" and want to work on us. Any suggestions how not to have the expectations, yet still have a little hope?

One minute you tell about her taking you a hot chocolate, and stress over her treating youas a friend. The next time you tell about her taking you a hot chocolate, and seem to like it and how it was nice of her to think about you..

I would not refuse to take the chocolate. Just say thanks and take it. But then watch the game and don't show interest in what she is saying. I have told you what her motives are.

And for goodness sake, stop watching her.

Have a hard time not noticing her. I took the hot chocolate and started to walk away. Shared it with S4. She followed me into the dugout, and showed me pics of her day on the phone. Kind of a captive audience at that point. I didn't really pay much attention, honestly. She followed me, not the other way around. I didn't mention anything about her appearance, or ask how her day was. What do I need to improve on?

See how confused I am? I keep seeing everything that W does that is nice, at a sign of reconciliation. How do you balance ignoring her with being happy, and not being a total ass?

S8 told me last night a little more. He said he has been asking W when we would all be together again. He said W replied "soon", and " I wish we were now" I hope she isn't deceiving them.

New thread:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2614369&#Post2614369