Hello, I am new here, obviously. First of all, I'd like to thank all of you on this board. It has given me a lot of help and guidance over the past few days. I feel like its one of the few things keeping me sane. I find myself with a wife that is preparing to leave me. She may be cheating, or about to. I've read a few sites, blogs and books about what to do in these types of situations but honestly feel no better about it and things are declining even faster.
We have been married for 5.5 years and had some issues for about 2. I have always been controlling and jealous. I know, I'm honestly working on it. She started telling me about 2 months ago she was feeling smothered and wanted to see how things go when I return home. (I'm currently deployed)
As a husband I was total garbage. I took her for granted, said things without taking her feelings into consideration, was lazy and a drunk. I admit that. I knew it then, I was just so deep in a hole I didn't do anything about it.
I got super negative over the last couple years,without really meaning to. It's just my type of humor. Sarcasm, seeing the worst of a situation and making fun of it. Unfortunately, that started to actually become my frame of mind and I said a lot of things in jest that hurt my wife. That along with all of the other things I was doing as a terrible husband added up and took their toll on her.
Since things have started to go downhill I have begun really trying to get it together. I'm growing everyday and really trying to focus on being more healthy, kinder, giving and positive, which, as Im sure you can imagine, is pretty difficult at the moment. I haven't drank in 3 months, I've lost 30 lbs, begun working out 2-3 times a day, started eating healthy, reading more books and trying to find new hobbies.
None of these things matter to her since she can't see them because I'm gone, but I am honestly trying to better myself and grow as a man. I post what i can on FB or IG because I know she'll see them and hopefully realize I'm making an honest effort at bettering myself, but I want avoid looking like a self absorbed turd as well.
Unfortunately, I have also continued to push her away by asking her to reconsider, trying to convince her I'm serious about changing and being jealous at times as well. I am at the point where she's either going to cheat, already has or will never even consider trying to fix things. I love my wife and want nothing more than to be the man I know I can be and save this marriage. I have decided to let her go, basically, and let her figure things out on her own.
I wrote her a letter and told her I know I want this to work but I need to allow her space to take her own path an decide what she wants, if its me I'm here. Ready to do what is needed to make the relationship flourish. If not, I'll respect her decision, stop trying to change her mind and convince her to stay since it is not my decision to make.
Thats a pretty big 180 for me since I've never really backed off before. As far as counseling goes, I plan on starting for myself as soon as I return to the states, which is less than a couple months away. As far as the control issues, I've stopped snooping, sending her texts and calls to see where she's at and who she's with and I wrote her that letter telling her I'm going to stop trying to convince her to stay and allow her space to find her own path... All 180's for me.
I had no contact with her on Tuesday which was super tough. Wednesday evening I finally caved and sent her a message saying "I just wanted to say hi and let you know I'm thinking about you." She didn't respond to it.
Yesterday she sent me a message asking for a website we had discussed about trying to challenge issues on your credit history. Something she could easily google. I didn't respond for a few hours (trying to detach and be less accessible) and I could tell she wasn't a fan of it. She then sent a message saying "really? nothing?" I responded a few hours later with the info and told her it's pretty straight forward but I'd be happy to help walk her through it if she needed it. Then.. No response from her.
It seems like when I back off she finds a reason to talk to me and we start the cycle again. Start to chat, I listen, try to be supportive, say something that doesn't help, then we end up arguing over the M & R and it sets us back.
The letter I wrote to her is arriving today. Maybe I shouldn't have written it but I can't take it back now. I didn't find this site until after it was sent. I'm trying to study the LRT and 180's and trying I just purchased DB &DR off amazon, unfortunately because I'm deployed, I likely won't get them for a month at least.
Any tips or help or advice would be much appreciated, especially until I get my hands on the books and can read through them.
Thank you for your time and good luck with your own struggles.
Welcome to the board
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH. Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
OK you wrote her a letter and posted on FB - now STOP doing those things because you can not pursue her back into your marriage.
She needs to pursue YOU.
Keep posting.
Cadet,
Thanks for the info and the guidance. I'll definitely keep posting here.
When you say stop posting on Facebook, I wasn't posting to her or anything. Just in general. Things I'm doing 180's on, really. Not being lazy, working out, eating well, spending time with friends, stuff like that. Since I'm gone, and these are things she would normally see me changing if we were under the same roof, FB is the only way she would know they are happening and begin to realize I'm serious about changing.
I hope that doesn't sound too dumb, I'm just unsure. Like I said i can't get my hands on the books for a month or so.
Do you suggest I do the "go dark" type thing?
The thing to bear in mind with the FB posting is it may look a little OTT - like you're really trying to showcase your changes. Actually, the slow but subtle approach may be best - ie: you see her in a few weeks and she thinks - Wow Raws is looking good (from working out.) You say nothing of course....you just look good...
Actually the things I suggest are in my long homework post above.
You make the changes for YOU, not to win her back,
there is no single button that you are going to press that is going to turn her around.
Are you deployed and she is at home?
Thanks for your service.
Understood, Toots. I'll kick back on the posts.
Cadet,
Thank you for that, it is my honor to serve my country.
I am deployed and she's at home. We've never been good with the distance, it's just never been this bad. She's got a lot going on right now, too. Taking care of the house, pets, finances on her own while trying (and unfortunately failing) at reaching some of her own personal goals. She's got no "career" and has been in a less-than wonderful marriage with a turd of a husband. I think it's all coming to a head now and I am taking the brunt of the anger. Probably rightfully so. Still I'm serious about making these changes, whether she comes back or not. I'm disgusted at the person I allowed myself to become and will never allow myself to be that again.
I'll get started on the homework immediately.
Raws you are not the first service person to post and unfortunately not the last either.
TLEE86 is also in the service and posts here currently.
Here is a link for his current thread.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...517#Post2563517And that picture under my name is the plane that I flew while in the service a long time ago.
You have got friends here.
Rysin in infidelity is also in the armed forces & his threads may be of interest too.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Will do, Cadet. I'm doing the homework and reading every thread I can. This forum is really the only thing giving me any hope and helping me chill out mentally.
She finally responded to my message about the credit website she asked me for with a simple "Thank you". I'm not sure how to respond, or if I should at all.
The letter will be there soon. I'm starting to get really nervous with how she might react when she gets it. I hope
I didn't screw up too badly by telling her I was going to back off and give her time to choose her own path and figure out the things she needs to figure out. I mean, thats what she said she needed and I know I was smothering her. I hope some good comes from it.
This is the hardest thing I've ever had to endure. Thanks again for the help and thank you for your service as well.
Sorry for another post. I'm just really freaking out. Just got notification my letter was delivered. My heart is racing and I'm super anxious. I know this is what needed to happen (giving her space and stop trying to convince her to stay) but I feel like I'm doing everything wrong. The only thing giving me hope is the homework and that I've felt like everything I've been doing is what I was supposed to do and its led me here to this point. I went to the gym this evening, worked out but this was all on my mind the whole time. Its constantly on my mind. Its terrible. I'll find myself thinking about something else for a few seconds, then BAM! Right back in my own head and freaking out again. Sorry for the rant. This is just really hard. I know you guys know that.
Yes it is hard, sorry you are having such a hard time.
Detaching from thinking about it takes time.
It is hard work, but not work like digging a ditch.
Training your brain is not easy.
Sorry you're here Raws. I'm a military wife, so I get the 'life'. Listen to Cadet & Toots. They know what they're talking about. You're deployed. Use it as a gift of time. Focus on your changes & better yourself.
Stay safe out there.
Hi Raws, you say you are deployed, if you are in the military then allow me to thank you for your service!
As a husband I was total garbage. I took her for granted, said things without taking her feelings into consideration, was lazy and a drunk. I admit that. I knew it then, I was just so deep in a hole I didn't do anything about it.
OK, well it's good that you can see that and admit it. Just understand that her reaction now is because she was hurting for a long, long time. She did not make this decision overnight, she's been thinking about it for months if not years. And now that she has made it, she is scared witless about backing down from it. So don't fight her on it, let her do what she feels she needs to do. Dobson's book talks about how the WAS feels caged, and the LBS has to open the cage door. If you beg/ plead for her to stay she is going to feel even more caged in. If you tell her "I know you've been through a lot, and that you feel this is the best course of action. I want you to know that I care about you and support your decision whatever it may be, and will continue to support you" then that cage door creaks open a little. And when you open the cage door and the bird knows it can leave anytime, it no longer feels the pressure to escape and it might just stay there. So like DB says, pull back. Remove all pressure. Give her time and space. Respect her wishes. Support her. Validate her.
Since things have started to go downhill I have begun really trying to get it together. I'm growing everyday and really trying to focus on being more healthy, kinder, giving and positive, which, as Im sure you can imagine, is pretty difficult at the moment. I haven't drank in 3 months, I've lost 30 lbs, begun working out 2-3 times a day, started eating healthy, reading more books and trying to find new hobbies.
That's all great stuff, congrats! But she needs lots of time to believe your changes are real and not just tricks to get her back. The damage that took years to do is going to take years to undo. Be patient.
None of these things matter to her since she can't see them because I'm gone
It makes it more difficult, but you're changing for YOU, not HER. Change for YOU and she will eventually know it, and believe it.
I post what i can on FB or IG because I know she'll see them and hopefully realize I'm making an honest effort at bettering myself, but I want avoid looking like a self absorbed turd as well.
Yeah be careful with that. She will see it as an attempt to trick her into coming back rather than genuine effort.
Unfortunately, I have also continued to push her away by asking her to reconsider, trying to convince her I'm serious about changing and being jealous at times as well.
You've got to stop that. Print out Sandi's rules and keep them in your pocket or tape them to your monitor if you have to.
Ready to do what is needed to make the relationship flourish.
Put that thought out of your head. Like Cadet says, you need to take your marriage and put it in a box, wrap a ribbon around it and put it up on the top shelf of the closet. It’s going to stay there for a long, long time while you’re working on yourself and giving your W time and space. You’re in no position to make the relationship flourish, you don’t even have a relationship right now. You’ve got to build the groundwork first, and that means making yourself into the spouse only a fool would leave.
I had no contact with her on Tuesday which was super tough. Wednesday evening I finally caved and sent her a message saying "I just wanted to say hi and let you know I'm thinking about you." She didn't respond to it.
First, quit sending stuff like that, you're just putting pressure on her. Second, get used to her not responding, that's SOP for a WAS.
Sorry for another post. I'm just really freaking out. Just got notification my letter was delivered. My heart is racing and I'm super anxious. I know this is what needed to happen (giving her space and stop trying to convince her to stay) but I feel like I'm doing everything wrong. The only thing giving me hope is the homework and that I've felt like everything I've been doing is what I was supposed to do and its led me here to this point. I went to the gym this evening, worked out but this was all on my mind the whole time. Its constantly on my mind. Its terrible. I'll find myself thinking about something else for a few seconds, then BAM! Right back in my own head and freaking out again. Sorry for the rant. This is just really hard. I know you guys know that.
Yes it is very, very difficult. It makes everything you do at work and home almost impossible. I remember the anxiety attacks and having to leave my desk because fight-or-flight kicked in. Don’t you wish you could just flip a switch and turn it off! I wish I had a magic potion to send you, but unfortunately the only way through it is to go through it. There are no shortcuts. Don’t bury the pain, let it happen. You’ll work through it faster. If you feel depression setting in, by all means see a doctor. I took A/D’s for about 6 months and truly believe they saved me from suicide and returned me to my old, normal self.
Regarding the letter, many of us wrote such a letter or email to our WAS. You ready for the shocker? She’ll more than likely never reply to it or even acknowledge she got it. She will probably read it, then throw it in the trash. It means nothing to her right now. I keep referencing this thread of Sandi’s but it is a real gem:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2593214#Post2593214Lots of insight there on what the WAS is thinking and feeling.
raws,
Im in the same shape so I know exactly what you are feeling. However, im not away from home. im so sorry for what is happening but from what im learning here, there is no easy solution. My wife and I are still in the same house for now and sometimes I think it would be easier if we were not.
I know what you mean about not being able to shake the bad thoughts. Ive been going through this hell for almost 6 months now I still cant seem to keep it together.
I will say that finding my way to this site has helped a great deal. Take care.
Thank you all for the support. I hung out with some friends last night and was able to laugh and smile and put on the happy face even though it was eating me up inside. AnotherStander, you make a lot of great points and I'll do my best to keep them in my mind. I'm constantly playing back the last few months and beating myself up about "why didn't I get it together earlier, why did I continue to push her away?" Stuff like that. It makes things super difficult.
One question, when you say validate her, do you mean agree with her saying she's done and wants to separate and divorce? I'll stop with the posts and just let her see the changes when I get home. I'm learning patience and its a painful process. What a mess I've made.
Sorry, missed the validation sheet link. Reading it now.
I'm constantly playing back the last few months and beating myself up about "why didn't I get it together earlier, why did I continue to push her away?"
OK we all have done that, just know that it would not have mattered.
You didn't break her and you can not FIX her.
Start working on yourself now and become the best YOU can be.
Then you can not lose.
The problem every human faces when things are going wrong is we think about stuff and then go round on it again, and again, and again... What happens each time you go round the loop is that you embellish things, so what was dark becomes all enveloping and it feels impossible to get out of the hole your mind has created for itself.
What you need to do is to break the cycle of the thought going round your head by distracting yourself, it's part of what GAL is all about and you also need to develop strategies for when those thoughts start to loom and take action when there isn't time to distract yourself with your GAL activities.
Many find Mindfulness Meditation the way forward - Google it there's tons out there especially the Oxford University web site, which is where the scientically proven technique was first established.
It helps you, in only 10-20 minutes a day, to gently train your mind to refocus itself onto something in the present, not the past or future. It then takes you a step further (the unique facet of Mindfulness Meditation) and guides you towards observing painful thoughts and allowing them to happen and understand how they are effecting you. But you are the observer and this simple technique, that takes a while to master, will help you to deal with all the cr@p that you have to deal with and keep you from ending up at the bottom of a deep, dark well of pity and despair. You become like a bystander of someone else's thought but they are you own
When I first came across it, I was very sceptical but stuck with it and wow, the results are amazing, just don't expect it to work overnight, it kind of creeps up on you and the benefits take you unawares, in the nicest possible way.
As everyone says, keep posting there are many here to help you in many ways that you don't even know you need just yet.
Thanks guys. Today was horrible. Horrible. I feel like I'm going to just break down and lose it any minute. No contact from the W. She didn't say anything about receiving the note. I wasn't expecting it to make her turn around and you guys prepared me for not hearing anything about it, it still kills me though.
Went out to dinner with some buddies and didn't enjoy myself for a second. Just kept thinking about this and what I've done to get things here. Begley, you're right. Things have just kept swirling and swirling around my head and it builds and gets worse. I keep thinking about how things are going to be when I get home, how disconnected this woman I love is going to be and how terrible everything is going to be. I've been trying so hard to be positive but it's just getting harder and harder. For the first time since this all started i feel truly hopeless.
Question in regards to gifts on anniversaries and such. The anniversary of the day we first met is on the 15th.
Am I to not send W a card or message or anything just to let her know I'm thinking about her? I'm going pretty dark atm and she's basically done the same. Haven't really had a conversation since Tuesday. Just a message or two from then until now. i never made a huge deal out of anniversaries, valentines day (why would she wanna leave a guy like that, right?). But I did go pretty hard for her on Birthdays and christmas. Just wondering if I should send her something or let it pass and have her think I'm either forgetful, being a jerk, or completely ignoring her? Still getting used to this and DR/DB won't be here for a month.
Thanks, all!
Hi Raws, definitely no mention of anniversaries such as that. If she wishes you happy anniversary, you can just thank her and say you too...
Equally, she may not mention it at all. Best to have no expectations and treat it as a normal day....
Thanks guys. Today was horrible. Horrible. I feel like I'm going to just break down and lose it any minute. No contact from the W. She didn't say anything about receiving the note. I wasn't expecting it to make her turn around and you guys prepared me for not hearing anything about it, it still kills me though.
It [censored] but at least you were prepared.
Went out to dinner with some buddies and didn't enjoy myself for a second. Just kept thinking about this and what I've done to get things here.
This is tough, but you can't spend your life dwelling on the past. What's done is done. Learn from it and move forward, right? That's all we can do. Don't let the last five years ruin your next five!
Begley, you're right. Things have just kept swirling and swirling around my head and it builds and gets worse. I keep thinking about how things are going to be when I get home, how disconnected this woman I love is going to be and how terrible everything is going to be. I've been trying so hard to be positive but it's just getting harder and harder. For the first time since this all started i feel truly hopeless.
Fake it until you make it, raws. The happier you act, the happier you'll BE. You don't need your W to make you happy. You can be plenty happy all by yourself! I highly recommend a TED talk by ... Take the challenge, raws - I'll bet you can find 63 things to be happy about that don't include your W!
Hi Raws, sorry things are tough right now. Azzork has given you some good advice. Particularly in the early days, our situation can be overwhelming and all-consuming. The best thing to do is seek out activities that will give you some respite from thinking about everything - dwelling on the past, worrying about the future.
Staying in the moment can help. It may not come easily, but if you gently persist it will. Walking helped me, and meditation (try out the Headspace app - there's a free trial.) Reading self-help books and doing furniture restoration. Going to yoga class, being with friends.
It is lovely that you have buddies to go out to dinner with. In time, you'll be able to enjoy their company without spending so much time thinking about your sitch. It feels like that will never happen, but it will.
So try and really start to notice those things that help now, and mean that you don't think about your sitch for 5/10/15 minutes. Gravitate towards those things and do more of them, and enjoy the respite. Look after yourself. I came to realise that devoting so much of my headspace to my sitch was truly a waste of energy. That doesn't happen overnight, but I'm sure you'll get there too. Take care x
Thanks, Azzork. You're absolutely right. That being said, it's super difficult and still not coming together for me. Especially now, with zero contact form the W. I'll look for a message, knowing its not there. I'm really having to fight sending her a message just to try and start a conversation, but I know thats not what i should do.I'll check out that ted talk for sure. Thanks, again..
Anytime I think of sending a message to my W, I play it forward:
Me - "how's your day going?"
W - "Fine"
Now what? All I've done is shown I'm still attached. I've learned nothing, gained nothing. So what's the point?
Overwhelming and all consuming. Yeah, Toots, that's it. I'm lucky to have a good crew of guys out here who won't let me sit in my room and dwell for too long.
I just got a good workout in with my buddy and feel a little calmer. The gym helps me out a little bit, definitely more than sitting around. It just seems like even when I do get busy and try to distract myself, once the activity ends its back to reality. Hard.
Even when I'm lifting I'm so deep in my thoughts its like I'm not even there. I feel terrible for my friends because I'm sure I'm not much fun to be around atm. They're great though. I'm lucky to have them.
They've noticed my changes and have made a few comments about how I'm not the same person that left for this deployment, which I couldn't agree with more. Especially since I've cut the booze. I look at the person I was a few months ago and it makes me sick. I can't believe how far I let myself go. I totally lost myself and the person I want to be. That was the person that pushed my wife away and broke her heart until she could no longer love me. Maybe one day she'll see the change too. Maybe it's too late. Either way I've gotta keep going.
Sorry for the long post, I guess I just needed to get some stuff out. I'm sure i broke some of the 37 rules too. I'm still working on getting those in my head and read the post everyday.
Thanks again to all of you for being here for me through this. I appreciate it more than anything.
Raws - NOT A SINGLE PERSON here was fully detached right away.
Take it second by second, then minute by minute, then 15 minutes by 15 minutes, then hour by hour and so on. It gets easier.
The more you don't think about her, the more you WONT think about her.
Azzork- You're 100% right. That's probably going to be it. I know i can't pursue her. There's just that little voice in the back of my head constantly telling me "you can fix this, you can make it right, you can convince her you're not the same". It's like an argument that lasts all day.
I'm always about 3 seconds away from losing the argument but i've done alright since Friday. No big feat, i know. One day at a time.
As Cadet said, you didn't BREAK her so you can't FIX her.
The way to make it right is listen and validate and keep giving space. Use your time wisely to become the best Raws possible.
That's really all you can do.
Remember - choosing to do nothing is OFTEN the choice coming from strength.
Thanks, Azzork. I hope I get the opportunity to listen and validate. Still completely dark on her end, too. I see she pops up on FB, and I'm sure she see's me, but she's not saying anything. It's a real bummer.
I don't mean to sound dumb, but I'm having trouble with the "You didn't break her so you can't fix her thing". I've got a lot of guilt from how bad of a husband I was. Controlling, jealous, possessive, unsupportive, negative... Just plain bad.
I caused her a lot of pain and she put up with a lot of my crap for a long time. Not sure how to deal with that.
I did have a bit of an uplifting moment this evening. I'm not sure if it'll stick or if it even makes sense, but i had the thought "she can only hurt you if you allow her to" pass through my head. It gave me some peace, if only for a moment. I'm really making an effort to not have any expectations, but I still check my messages and get nervous like crazy if I have a message notification, only to see it's not from her.
This is hard.
No matter what she says, you are not 100% of the reason for the failings in your marriage. All you can do is recognize the things that you contributed and work on them. She has her own issues and you cannot fix them.
You cannot fix a relationship she does not want. But you can fix YOU. For example, you quit drinking right? - that's fixing YOU.
Hi raws,
I drank for a long time, I quit when my wife left ten months ago. I too was controlling, jealous, possessive, etc. How you deal with it is to dig deep and really learn why you were this way and then go about changing what you don't like. Like azzork said, it wasn't all you, your wife contributed to the failure of your m, but you can only fix yourself, its all you have control over, it's all you really ever had control over. Read about forgiveness, it is a choice, and it works for us too. We get to forgive ourselves. You cant hope for a better past, but you can live better now, and work towards a better future. Maybe that better future will include your wife.
Understood, Azzork. A lot of her issues stemmed from my ways, though. I would get jealous and question her about things, she would get defensive, say i didn't trust her. On, and on, i guess you get the point.
I'm just saying, she would have never gotten to the point she's at now had I not been such an a-hole. Thats the thing that's really getting to me. If she's with an OM, I pushed her there. I could just been cool, not been insecure, not been controlling and unsupportive and chances are I'd never find my self here, right now.
I feel extremely guilty for what a fool I was. I single handedly ruined a beautiful thing and it drives me crazy.
Thank you help 67, i appreciate you sharing that with me. I'll read as recommended and hope it calms this feeling. Thanks again.
Raws - if she is with an OM, you created the opportunity, you did NOT cause her to make that choice.
I read something today that would be a good quote, but my book's at home. But the point is that there are plenty of people out there ready to undercut you; you don't need to do it for them.
Raws - if she is with an OM, you created the opportunity, you did NOT cause her to make that choice.
I read something today that would be a good quote, but my book's at home. But the point is that there are plenty of people out there ready to undercut you; you don't need to do it for them.
After rereading it, the context is kinda jumbled. But the quote is:
Stop undercutting yourself. There will always be people out there to do it for you.My point is that you are not responsible 100% here. Take ownership of your faults, misdeeds, and poor choices. Fix them so you don't make the same mistakes again.
But you are not the only responsible party here.
Hey, all.
Wife messaged me today. She thanked me for the letter I wrote her. It was the first conversation we've had in a while that hasn't ended in a fight. Her temperament was completely different than it has been. She wasn't looking for a reason to fight or get angry and I feel like I said all the right things. It was actually really nice. I validated as much as I could and things went well.
I was super anxious, and in my own head all day, after the talk I felt like there was a weight lifted. She knows how I feel and that's where it is. It's up to her to make her choices.
Hopefully it's a step in the right direction. I tried to keep the convo light and kept from pushing or trying to change her mind. Definitely a big 180 from the way things have been, how I've been.
I'm hoping these last few weeks fly. Trying to stay busy, GAL and stay positive.
Thank you all for helping me on this journey.
One question, when you say validate her, do you mean agree with her saying she's done and wants to separate and divorce?
Hopefully you read the links, especially Wonka's validation thread which I think is a sticky at the top of the forum. But validating is NOT agreeing, in fact I usually tell people NOT to beg/ plead/ reason/ negotiate/ agree/ disagree/ etc. Validation is simply acknowledgement of her feelings. She says she wants a divorce? You say something like "that's not what I want but I understand you feel I've neglected you for quite some time and that divorce is the only option, I understand why you feel this way and I completely support your decision." That acknowledges her FEELINGS while also highlighting that yours are not the same, and it also reinforces that it is HER decision, that you are not making it for her, but you will support her no matter what she decides. Please, by all means ask more questions if you don't understand validation because one thing I've learned here over the years is a lot of people think they're validating when they're really not.
Thanks guys. Today was horrible. Horrible. I feel like I'm going to just break down and lose it any minute. No contact from the W.
Sometimes it's a little painful to read these things because it reminds me of things I went through that I've since forgotten about! Oh man, do I ever remember those days of constantly checking email and my phone to see if W sent something, and the heartbreak of not hearing from her. Just awful. Unfortunately you can't take a shortcut through this pain, you've got to feel it to get through it. Just take it a day at a time and if that's too much an hour at a time.
For the first time since this all started i feel truly hopeless.
There is hope for as long as you continue to hold onto it. It's not over until YOU decide it's over. If you need some hope then read the
"Another Divorce Busted"! forum (surprisingly few people here even know it's there), it hasn't been updated in quite a while but there are a lot of inspiring stories there of marriages that were saved against all odds.
Question in regards to gifts on anniversaries and such. The anniversary of the day we first met is on the 15th.
Am I to not send W a card or message or anything just to let her know I'm thinking about her?
You're not supposed to give gifts or a card for any milestone, she'll see it as pressure. My 20th anniversary came up not too long after my W left, after discussing it here I ended up talking to her about it, I said something like "given where things are right now I'm sure you don't want a gift for our anniversary, but maybe we could go to dinner not as a date or anything, but just an acknowledgement of the anniversary." She agreed and that's what we did and it went fine. It didn't change anything one way or the other, but I had no expectations that it would.
Thanks, Azzork. I hope I get the opportunity to listen and validate. Still completely dark on her end, too.
She's not "dark" per se. She doesn't want contact with you right now, and won't for quite some time.
I see she pops up on FB, and I'm sure she see's me, but she's not saying anything.
I know it hurts, but you've got to get used to it. This is your "new normal".
I'm having trouble with the "You didn't break her so you can't fix her thing". I've got a lot of guilt from how bad of a husband I was. Controlling, jealous, possessive, unsupportive, negative... Just plain bad.
And you should try to change those things about yourself to be sure. BUT, like Azzork said, no marriage fails because one spouse was perfect and the other did everything wrong. It's like most car accidents, both parties have some amount of blame. It might be 50-50 or one may have more blame than the other. Usually it just works out that our spouses got tired of it before us. I was darned near the WAS in my M many times. But BD has a strange psychological effect on the LBS, they may have been as unhappy as the WAS but BD suddenly turns them into a pathetic lovelorn mess, LOL! And early on we blame ourselves for EVERYTHING. Do take stock of your faults and work on them, but I'm sure that once the fog clears you'll remember it wasn't all your fault. So you are working on your problems and she needs to work on hers, that's what Cadet's quote means.
"she can only hurt you if you allow her to" pass through my head. It gave me some peace, if only for a moment.
Well, when you're married a long time the two really do become one. BD rips part of you away suddenly and (usually) unexpectedly. That hurts, and it hurts for a long time. It's not that she's intentionally hurting you or that you're hurting yourself, it's just the transition to your "new normal" that hurts so much. You'll probably emerge from this happier than you've ever been before like I did, but it takes time. And I don't want to downplay what you're going through or sugar coat it, it is agonizing! Just take it a day at a time and try to see that in the end, you will be a better person, you will thrive and your W may very well choose to be with that new and improved you, so don't give up hope
Hello Raws,
First, I'd like to thank you for your service.
I'm so sorry for the situation you are in.
How much longer will it be before you will be able to see her?
It would be extremely helpful to know what your next move should be. Please call me to discuss our program at 303-444-7004.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004
Thanks, AnotherStender.
Everything you've said is pretty much right on. I've continued reading threads, books and thinking back on some of the things I did to get us here. You and the others are right, it wasn't just me. Sure it may have been a bit more me than her but she has issues too. Everyone does. I can't blame myself for everything, I can only look at how I reacted and see what was wrong in that.
She's begun starting conversations the in the last couple days. I don't message her first anymore. She seems much less angry and even though she's still not back to being the sweet, loving woman I married, it is a step in the right direction. At this point, from this distance, i'll take what i can get.
The biggest thing in my head atm is weather she will respect this marriage enough to not cheat or move on while I'm gone. I know its out of my hands and there's no use worrying about it but it still drives me crazy. Just got keep myself busy and continue on growing as a man.
Thanks for the support, AS.
Thank you, Cristy.
I'm most likely going to have to wait until I return to the states until I can do phone counseling, luckily thats not too far away. I'lll make sure to get that set up once I do, though.
Raws,
I'm really glad you are returning to the states soon. When are you heading back?
Cristy
I think I posted in the wrong place so I'm moving here. My apologies.
Hello, I am back here, lurking and looking at threads 3 years after I first found this site and these methods.
W and I had some problems 3 years ago, mostly stemming from my drinking. 3 years ago, I did a 180, quit drinking, lost weight and saved my marriage. At least up until a few days ago.
W took her things and left. Didnt say goodbye, just left. She took the dogs and cat, her clothes and truck and just left.
Of course when I returned home I was in shock. Weve been having issues lately that seem to be building. Shes mentioned leaving and divorce but that was usually at times of anger.
I called her a few times when I got home, no answer. Sent a couple texts, no response. Since Wednesday (the day she left) I havent tried to contact her again.
I'm still sober, still in shape, still trying to grow as a person, I guess I just dont know what to do or where to go from here. I know from our last problem period that persuing her will only push her further. Do I continue no contact?
Shes got a lot of friends, all of whom will take her side and support her thoughts of leaving me. She felt unsupported, under appreciated and ignored. I didnt try to make her feel those things, life just got busy and hectic. Our schedules and interests changed and our priorities were different.
Please let me know what course of action I should take. I love my wife and want to save my marriage, I just dont know what I need to do since shes never left before. Ive read divorce busting but will re read it. Thank you all in advance.
Be your best you, do your thing and keep you head up.
you know what you need to do if youve been here before.
GAL and start the DB techniques yesterday.
Thanks Orange. Thats pretty much the plan for now. I dont think this time is easier, but I feel like I know what to expect a bit more so hopefully that helps. The big difference is I'm home this time, last time I was overseas. That and the fact that she actually moved her stuff out.
One of my big concerns is her friends. I know theyre decent people and theyre just trying to help her because they care but I'm worried they wont allow her to reach out to me. Ive got a pretty good relationship with one of them, I was thinkig of reaching out to him or his wife, letting them know I respect her decision, want to give her her space and she can contact me when shes ready. I dont know how that will work out though. I'm concerned about them filling her head with "see how little he cares about you, hes not even trying to get you back" type stuff. Espicially if shes complaining to them about not getting enough attention and support ya know?
Hello, I am back here, lurking and looking at threads 3 years after I first found this site and these methods.
Merged your thread in with the last time you were here, go back and read my first post to you at the start of the thread.
DB101 - start with a beginners mind!
Thank you, Cadet. Good to talk to you again in a really weird way. I apologize for just stopping the posts last time around. I think I got kind of sketched out by Christy asking when id be home from deployment and didnt want to post anything I shouldnt have about dates and such.
Anyways, I'm here and ill be posting. Thank you all for the support.
Hey raws, sorry to see you back.
Can I ask you something that always makes me curious, why did you stop posting before? If this forum and the book helped you save your M, why didn't you ever report back the good news? You can't imagine how much that would help others here, because we get a lot of complaints that there are so few success stories but often it's because people just quit posting once things turn around. One of the reasons I ask is it makes me question your ability to follow through on things. Like if you just quit posting here because you "finally got what you wanted" (IE, your M back) then do you do the same to your W- quit trying once you get what YOU want.
Of course when I returned home I was in shock. Weve been having issues lately that seem to be building. Shes mentioned leaving and divorce but that was usually at times of anger.
What are the issues that you've been having lately? It sounds like once you were back together that you slipped into old habits. You may have thought it was all water under the bridge, but she was looking at you under a microscope to see if your changes were real. If you didn't maintain those changes that brought her back then I'm not surprised she left without comment this time.
I'm still sober, still in shape, still trying to grow as a person, I guess I just dont know what to do or where to go from here.
Congrats on staying sober and in shape, that's great! It sounds like you weren't meeting her needs though. And there were fights and arguments taking place? Expand on that so we have a better idea of what's going on.
I know from our last problem period that persuing her will only push her further. Do I continue no contact?
Yes, leave her be for now. She will probably reach out at some point but it might be weeks from now.
She felt unsupported, under appreciated and ignored. I didnt try to make her feel those things, life just got busy and hectic. Our schedules and interests changed and our priorities were different.
Again, it would help us if you could expand on this. Why did she feel those things? It sounds almost like you pushed her out of your life and set your priorities elsewhere.
Hello AS,
So to answer your first question, I stopped because one of the people asked me a couple times when I was returning from deployment. I just got uncomfortable about it and stayed away. About a week later I was gone on a job and didnt have internet access for a couple of weeks. When i returned W finally came around a bit. We slowly got more and more comfortable. I validated and didnt push. When i finally got home things were a but rocky but we worked hard to get through it.
The biggest issues lately were her feeling like I dont support her or believe in . shes got some pretty lofty goals as an athlete (olympics) and she thinks I dont believe she can accomplish them. I pay for just about everything so she can go to school and train full time. I think i saw that as support where as she may have needed more on the emotional side. I also have a hobby that takes up a lot of time though my goals arent as lofty. I thought having something I was interested in would give us each something to do. When I quit drinking I had so much time and she was always training so i needed to stay busy.
Plus I struggled in the past with control issues. I think I tried to change that aspect and maybe just let go a bit too much
When we would fight it would usually be about money or small things like helping around the house, responsibilities in the home and such. But it would always come back to support or believeing in her or something similar.
She's got friwnds around her who are very suppoetive and encouraging. I guess she feels like I wasnt a good enough cheerleader. Ive always been proud of her accomplishments and hard work. I'm just not a very ra-ra person.
I hope thats everything. I'm on a phone so I apologize for any errors. I dont have a computer am.
Thank you, Cadet. Good to talk to you again in a really weird way. I apologize for just stopping the posts last time around. I think I got kind of sketched out by Christy asking when id be home from deployment and didnt want to post anything I shouldnt have about dates and such.
Anyways, I'm here and ill be posting. Thank you all for the support.
Well Cristy seems to have stopped posting, not sure why but we are still here to support you.
Raws,
Just saw this.
Work on you. That's it....you are doing that. Keep doing it.
Her. Okay, lofty goals and her need for super validation. Not your problem.
Step back from that. But listen and care (hard to do both I know).
All I can add. But probably all you need in fairness.
KR
Surfer.
Thank you, fellas. I got home a few hours ago and have been cleaning since I came in. The worst part of all of this is coming home to a house with no energy. No life. I'm used to her and my dogs greeting me when I come home and now theres nothing.
Ive been thinking a lot about what went wrong. I definitely think I got a bit lazy, sure. But it also might not be as much my fault as I think it is.
We argued a lot about money. She trained full time (6-7 times a week, mornings and evenings tues. Thurs.)and recently started going to school (wed. Friday). She didnt really contribute much financially and because she was training or at school she didnt really contribute as much as I probably would have liked around the house.
She would come home and just seem upset. She would get on me for not doing more around the house. I leave for work at 645 and get home around 430 and some days not until 530/6. Some days we were just able to say hi/bye between work and each of our trainings. In an effort to make her happy ive made a real effort to help around the house more. Dishes, Laundry, whatever. It still didnt seem to help. If it wasnt the house it was money.
She felt like she didnt have freedom to do what she wanted. Shed spend money and get upset when I would ask if the things she was buying were necessary. She would get offered camps and seminars that would cost 300+ and hotel fees on top of that and id be expected to just make it happen. Shes in the nicest workout clothes and I'm in the same stuff ive had for years. That never really bothered me, I enjoy being able to do nice things and get her nice things, I just didnt feel appreciated for it.
She would lose her temper and get snappy. Shed say some mean stuff when she was angry. Stuff just to get under my skin. Ive made a real effort to not do the same even when I wanted to. Being sober has made controling my biting tongue a bit easier.
Shes mentioned leaving before. Shes said shes going to leave but hasnt ever actually done it. She took all of her things. She took our pets and my cat. Technically shes our cat but we both know the cat is mine, I got her as a kitten and nursed her to health. She lived with me before my w did.
She did this to knowingly hurt me. She knew if she left the cat it wouldnt hurt as much. She wanted me to feel the sting of an empty house everytime I come in the door.
Shes gone black on her social media as well which is unlike her. Shes usually posting stories on IG of our pets and her workouts. Nothing since Wednesday.
Monday she got home from a competition after being gone since Friday. I couldnt go due to a retirement I had to attend and I think that really bothered her. Anyways, monday we had sex, caught up on her competition, then went and did our taxes. Everything seemed ok, we got along fine and things were good. I had duty Tuesday. We texted a bit, she told me she loved me. Didnt talk much more throughout the day. We were both busy. Go to work Wednesday morning, come home Wednesday afternoon and boom. Shes gone.
I dont know where I was going with this. Maybe I just needed to get it all out. I apologize for the long post and errors. Still just on the phone so its a little difficult to be perfect.
I havent reached out to her since Wednesday. I figured if shes angry enough to leave like that shes gottta cool down a bit if im gonna get anywhere. Im sure shes telling the people shes staying with that I'm a real a-hole and
I just realized this last part wansnt complete, im sorry.
I havent reached out to her since Wednesday. I figured if shes angry enough to leave like that shes gottta cool down a bit if im gonna get anywhere. Im sure shes telling the people shes staying with that I'm a real a-hole and theyre coaching/helping her through this.
Should i reach out to them and let them know I respect her space, love her and would like to talk when shes ready or should i just keep staying dark and not contacting. Im just worried they'll reinforce the "more of the same" narrative if I dont do or say something.
"She was looking at you under a microscope to see if your changes were real"
Is this really how anyone wants to live for 3 years? Under a microscope?
Raw, were you cheating? Were you spending all of your families income on drugs or gamblimg it away? Were you not coming home cause you were with friends hanging out at strip clubs and she was left wondering where you were? Were you forgetting to pick up you children from preschool cause you were hung over? Did you hit her or call her names?
Or are you just one of those guys that leave the toilet seat up?
Seriously. Sometimes we just have the misfortune to have picked a partner that is simply not committed to marriage. They might be committed to their own personal happiness. In which case, any little microscopic thing you do they will blame and villify because of their own miscontent. Use as an excuse to cheat, or leave. She has already done this. And will continue to do this cause this is who she is.
Maybe if you get a second job that enables her more luxuries? Maybe she will come back...until she adapts to that and wants something else.
To me it sounds like you are human. And living with another human gets boring or annoying. That's what marriage is. Some can handle getting annoyed or bored, others cant.
Stop the chase. Learn to value yourself. Cause as a woman whose husband did forget to pick up son from preschool multiple times, and who withdrew 800 a week in bad neighborhoods.. I'm scratching my head wondering, what does she want?
Again. Learn to value yourself. Work on your self esteem. She does not appreciate you? I am sure there are others who will. Her loss.
Hey Juju,
No, none of that stuff. I go to work, go to jiu jitsu and train, come home and spend whatever time we had together with her and the pets.
Because of our schedules we havent been doing many date nights. Its been hard to do much more than get a walk with the dogs in or watch a movie before bed.
The more I think about it the more I think it was a mixture of not enough attention, not enough support and Her being an extremely sensitive person.
She would complain that the only time I touch her was when I wanted sex, but I feel like I tried to give her more attention than she gave me credit for. I tried to be supportive and tell her how proud of her I am. Hoe im happy for her doing so well in school and how shes getting really good as an athlete but I guess it wasnt enough.
This is rough, I'm hoping she comes around soon but who knows. I think she expected me to really flip out when she left and go try to get my cat and truck but I didnt do anything. Im really wondering what she's wondering right now and where things are going to go from here.
It will never be enough cause its not about you.
Life will always get in the way. Marriage is about being committed to a person when life gets in the way. When your spouse is not perfect. Doesn't even sound like you guys have had any major life stress. Like kids, death, illness, job loss. So what happens when that happens? Do you want a fair weathered friend or someone that is committed through it all and doesnt run at the first indication of discomfort?
Most of us do not have the luxury of quitting our job when our spouse needs more attention.
You seem to blame yourself a lot but are her expectations realistic?
Is her reaction to not getting her way fair or realistic? What else can you do beyond support her dream financially and emotionally? Do you realize how lucky she is to have you do that?
I wonder what type of lifestyle she feels entitled to? What is her back ground? She sounds spoiled.
You guys both sound like you are still young and starting lives. I understand the appeal of dating someone that is an Olympian athlete. But her actions and expectations are all red flags.
Read some of the other posts here of men married to women like that with children. How these women leave kids, or even worse take the kids away and the father's have to spend all their money supporting ex wife while she lives with her new boyfriend and kids. There are tons of posts in here like that.
Personally, i think she is showing you who she really is. Actually, she showed you twice. Stop chasing her. Evaluate whats really attracting you to her and ask yourself if thats with it.
Thanks Juju.
Youre definitely right about most of it. She is a bit spoiled and ive contrubuted to that as well. I know our situation isnt as bad as some. Weve been married 7.5 years now and we dont have kids so I understand it could be much worse.
I love her though, and ive always seen something in her thats has attracted me to her.
In all fairness, while I did support her financially I admit I could have been more supporting emotionally. I could have made more time to do her activities and interests rather than use the time she was training to persue my own hobbies. Like i said, I do jiu jitsu but I dont have goals of being a world class competitor. I easily could have missed one of my trainings a night to train with her. But i didn't.
We are both young. Shes younger than me. Shes trying to find where she fits in this world and what her path is and I feel like she thinks ive obstructed her path with some of my control issues and lack of support.
Im trying to just give her some space and let her figure things out but its hard. Shes a very sweet, caring loving person when she wants to be.
Thank you all for helping me through this.
I dont buy it. You are blaming yourself for everything and not looking at your ex and what she's saying and doing. And until your fog dissipitates, it's gonna be a lot of guilt and self blame.
You're allowed to have a hobby that keeps you healthy. If she is telling you stuff along the lines of shes leaving cause you didn't give her enough attention, she is only gaslighting you.
Maybe go to therapy? Learn more about healthy relationship dynamics. Develop your self esteem.
So just came home to find a letter from the police dept addressed to my wife. Ive got a friend visiting and hes engaged to an officer who says it's probably a restraining/protection order for my wife. I didnt open it but I'm pretty sure thats what it is. This is totally unexpected and is absolutely out of the blue. I love my wife and have never threatened her. This is driving me crazy
Don't jump to conclusions. Could it also be a traffic ticket?
Just go no contact. That includes her friends and family. You shouldn't even think of involving them.
Don't put anything in writing. Stop pursuing immediatly. If its OOP you should contact a lawyer.
Thanks Juju,
No. It's not a ticket. The cars are both in my name so it would be addressed to me. Its definitely one of those things but sent to her for whatever reason. I'm sure ill be figuring it out this week sometine when I come home and check the mail.
I'm no contact since the couple calls and texts i sent when I walked in on my half empty house. I'm not talkig to any of her family either.
My friend talked me through it all a bit. He thinks that since shes always feeling like shes not contributing financially shes got no control in the r and is insecure about the power she has and compensated by exerting control by belittling me to empower herself. She didnt feel like an equal partner in the m.
Maybe this is her way of trying to get back in control? I dont know. If it is a restraining/protection order would that be her trying to control the situation further? Should I make any attempt to contact her prior to being notified to see if she wants to talk or say anything? Im so freaked out. I feel like this is all spinning out of control so fast
You dont know what this is yet so no use in panicking.
Don't try to analyze your ex. Most of us here do that. All you end up doing is projecting your own feelings and values on to them.
I know it's early in your sitch to hear this but most of them are selfish pos and are not thinking the things we like to think they are... I have female aquaintances that are walkaways. Trust me. If only you knew what they say and think.
Just take it day by day and develop a back up plan. Research some good lawyers just in case.
Will do. Thank you so much juju. I'm sitting here refreshing this page hoping for a response so I appreciate you.
I'm talking to legal on Monday to try to get some guidance. I know you say not to freak out but Its definitely not easy.
I just want to be happy and I want her to be happy. If its not together I'm ok with that, I just wish things didnt have to get ugly. I love her and I know somewhere under the anger and pain she loves me. I just wish she would realize it and come home or at least talk to me.
So I cant find my copies of DB or DR. Weve moved 3 times since I first used them (something that I'm sure hasnt helped things in my M)
Which one should I re read first?
Just ordered both. They should be here Wednesday.
I'm having a really tough time. I cant get that letter out of my head. I hope she doesnt do something out of anger that will affect the rest of my life.
I'm sorry just needed to get this off my chest
So today was rough but a bit better than yesterday. I spent some time with friends and was able to clear my head a bit. I came home and checked my facebook and she has blocked me on fb and instagram.
I'm freaked out again now. Shes never done this before. Not even during the first time we had issues. I feel like any hope I had that she may cool off is gone. I dont know where to go from here. Its been 5 days of no contact and now she deletes me? What is the point of that?
Talk to legal. Continue no contact. Be careful with what you say and do.
She doesnt want anything to do with you right now. Believe that. Accept that.
(I know it hurts to be discarded like that)
Just lots of self care. You need to start Learning how to love yourself more.
It gets easier. You will realize she is not a prize. Be prepared for keeping your cool with any thing that comes up
To me, it sounds like she is painting a picture. Of course you are emotional. You love her. But don't trust her.
Keep reading and keep posting. Its time to love yourself. Learning to love yourself is hard. Stop checking up on her, stop snooping, detach, once your are truly detach her social life wont affect you at all. As LBS we take every little thing to mean it's over. And we also take any little sign the WW or WAS give us to mean we have hope.
Once you realize there is always hope, you will be ok. But hope don't always come when and how we want it to come. Start working, start living, start loving and you will start to see the world for how beautiful it truly is. You are the prize, it's time for you to start living that way.
It's easier said then done, your changes won't happen over night. They will come gradually. Take your time, you will make mistakes, you will fall, but keeping getting up and you will start to see how resilient you truly are. It's nothing more attractive than a confident, resilient person.
Smile, smile, and laugh. You will have enough days of long hurtful thoughts, so smile and laugh as often as possible.
Youre right juju, it does hurt. I kmow she doesnt want anything to do with me now, I just feel like this is all so unnecessary.
I think she was expecting me to chase after her and try to beg for her to come back. When that didnt happen she blocked me to try to get me to react again. Everything she did, the way she did it, the fact she took my cat and my truck, she did to try to get a reaction. Either to make me beg for her forgiveness or to have a reason/excuse to say "see, hes an a-hole" and leave for good.
Is that kinda what you mean by painting a picture?
Thank you joejoe. I know deep down she loves me, but I think thats just covered up with anger now. I'm hoping she cant stay angry much longer and burns herself out. Still no contact, im just hoping she opens a line of communication sometime soon. Thanks for taking the time to respond to me. It helps.
raws, you're in good hands with jujuB and joejoe and so I won't crowd your thread with more information.
I will say this though
1. Respect the No Contact. Just give her space. You think there is a TRO that came in the mail. If you think so, be very careful. Don't do something stupid that you will regret later.
2. Don't act out of emotion. Better to do nothing than something.
3. Don't do something with the thought - what does she want me to do or if she wants to see a specific reaction. That is a lose-lose situation. she will find something wrong no matter what choice you make. Only make choices that feel true to your values and who you are.
4. But right now, your emotions are driving you, and you need to stop that. so, what feels true to you and who you are is skewed. That's why slow down.
5. Self-care is first right now. You cannot operate in a healthy way if you are not grounded. You need to make this your top priority.
Btw, I know how it feels to be discarded and just treated like garbage. That you don't matter one bit and that the history means nothing. It is a horrible place to be emotionally. You have to get out of there first before you can do anything productive.
I will quote another poster - Tread - who had said that it is better if the LBS just moves forward with their life without thinking about recon from the very beginning of BD. I cannot concur more. I know it's hard, but getting your mindset right is most of the battle.
Stay calm and cool.
Thank you Maika. Those are all great bits of advice and I will follow them as closely as I can.
"Btw, I know how it feels to be discarded and just treated like garbage. That you don't matter one bit and that the history means nothing. It is a horrible place to be emotionally. You have to get out of there first before you can do anything productive."
^^^ this 100%. Its like our whole marriage just went away with one click of the block button. Im pretty sure I made a facebook on her recommendation when we first started dating. Our whole marriage and time dating was on there. Its rough.
Yeah I know man. My W told me that she was unhappy during the whole MR - which was news to me because I remember plenty of happiness. She had rewritten the entire marital history, and it made me feel like $hit.
You come to realize that they have distorted the history to justify and rationalize their decision. So, you have to let it dust off your shoulders - easier said than done, i know.
That's why slow down, reflect, and GAL. All good stuff for self-care. You are not as horrible as she's making you out to be. And if I read it correctly, I think this is totally about her and her issues, and nothing to do with you. jujuB has already pointed that out so I won't regurgitate.
There be treasure here. ^^^^^^^^^^^
Yeah I know man. My W told me that she was unhappy during the whole MR - which was news to me because I remember plenty of happiness. She had rewritten the entire marital history, and it made me feel like $hit.
You come to realize that they have distorted the history to justify and rationalize their decision. So, you have to let it dust off your shoulders - easier said than done, i know.
That's why slow down, reflect, and GAL. All good stuff for self-care. You are not as horrible as she's making you out to be. And if I read it correctly, I think this is totally about her and her issues, and nothing to do with you. jujuB has already pointed that out so I won't regurgitate.
So true. I think hearing the rewriting of the MR history is probably one of the hardest things to hear. One other thing I read is that when the WAS does this, it is usually because they are projecting the last few weeks, month, or years onto the entire MR. So if you were married for 20 years, she was unhappy for the last year, that last year will be really what she is talking about.
When my wife drop the "I don't want to be married anymore" bomb she then went on to say that she had tried to make things better for 19 years. Remember, they blame you for all of it. They take no blame themselves. There are always plenty of things both spouses did or didn't do to get the MR to the point it is. Rarely, can it all be pinned on one spouse. (Usually in those cases it is physical abuse.)
Maika is dead on here. Don't put a lot of stock into the history. Before I found DBing I thought, "Wow, she was so unhappy for 19 years, there is no hope." I took what she was saying at face-value until it was pointed out to me that she was rewriting history. I could back to lots of times, some good some bad, where our MR was really good. And she was as much at fault during the times it wasn't as I was, in many cases more!
But yes, to hear your spouse, whom you love, say that they've never been happy is very hard. Until you realize that it is just not true.
Thnaks for filling in with more info, that helps!
The biggest issues lately were her feeling like I dont support her or believe in . shes got some pretty lofty goals as an athlete (olympics) and she thinks I dont believe she can accomplish them.
It sounds like you've been supporting her financially throughout her training effort, but what about emotionally? Have you been making her feel like she's in over her head or is that just her perception? Also, and this is a more tricky question- IS she in over her head? Are her actual abilities falling far short of her goals? I've been there before, trying to support someone in their efforts while also trying to figure out how to be honest with them as their expectations were well beyond their actual abilities. There's this belief that's particularly popular among younger people that you can do anything you set your mind to, but realistically some people are genetically gifted athletes and others are not. It's great to try to achieve goals but I'm also a big believer in being realistic.
I pay for just about everything so she can go to school and train full time. I think i saw that as support where as she may have needed more on the emotional side.
OK so you partially answered the above, and I am sure you are right about that. Strangely when you support someone financially they can come to resent you for it, especially if you're not giving them the emotional support with it.
I also have a hobby that takes up a lot of time though my goals arent as lofty. I thought having something I was interested in would give us each something to do. When I quit drinking I had so much time and she was always training so i needed to stay busy.
I would say you are taking the right approach there, you SHOULD have your own interests. My ex and I always talked about how one of the things that made our M strong was that we had common interests AND separate interests. We did some things together and some things apart. That's part of a healthy relationship. M's can fail anyway (as mine shows) but you maintaining some independence is certainly not the problem.
She's got friwnds around her who are very suppoetive and encouraging. I guess she feels like I wasnt a good enough cheerleader. Ive always been proud of her accomplishments and hard work. I'm just not a very ra-ra person.
I can personally relate to that, but you need to change. You need to become a very ra-ra person! Not so easy, but it pays off in your relationships with your W and kids big time.
"She was looking at you under a microscope to see if your changes were real"
Is this really how anyone wants to live for 3 years? Under a microscope?
We all originally came here or are here now because we're being subjected to a change of life that we do not want, so I'm not really sure what your question is. Of course no one wants to live under a microscope. No one "wants" to DB either, and no one "wants" to get BD'd, or separated, or divorced. Part of DB'ing is changing yourself and giving your spouse space and time to appreciate your changes. It can take years. It is not fun. No one does it by choice, it is hard work.
So just came home to find a letter from the police dept addressed to my wife. Ive got a friend visiting and hes engaged to an officer who says it's probably a restraining/protection order for my wife. I didnt open it but I'm pretty sure thats what it is. This is totally unexpected and is absolutely out of the blue. I love my wife and have never threatened her. This is driving me crazy
I can't imagine that's what it is, and maybe it isn't. My W and I had to fill out some paperwork for our marriage counselor and I snooped (learned my lesson later!) and she had made some comments about physical abuse. I was shocked! I had never touched her! I was getting really worried that she was trying to build a case for taking the kids by playing the abuse card. I could hardly sleep thinking of what she was doing. A few days later we had the counseling session and it came up in there and my W explained how she had been abused by a former BF before we had met. The stupid thing was I even knew about that, but in my panicked post-BD state I saw conspiracy everywhere. So take a deep breath, maybe it's nothing.
My friend talked me through it all a bit. He thinks that since shes always feeling like shes not contributing financially shes got no control in the r and is insecure about the power she has and compensated by exerting control by belittling me to empower herself. She didnt feel like an equal partner in the m.
I know he's just trying to help you but I think armchair counseling is not the best way to go about it. You don't know what she's thinking and neither does he. In fact, SHE probably doesn't know what she's thinking. That's kind of the nature of the whole WAS syndrome, nothing makes sense, nothing can be explained. Part of DB'ing is learning to accept you don't know what's going on and will probably never know.
Maybe this is her way of trying to get back in control? I dont know.
It's far more likely that she is just confused and in turmoil and doesn't know what she wants. That's why time and space helps, it gives her privacy to sort through her feelings.
Ive been thinking a lot about what went wrong. I definitely think I got a bit lazy, sure. But it also might not be as much my fault as I think it is.
It almost never is. Marriages typically fail because both spouses quit trying. Have you read the 5 Love Languages? It's a great book and I really took a lot of it to heart, especially the "bank account" and "love tank" analogies. I definitely work at keeping my GF's love tank full, and it pays off big time because when her tank is full she WANTS to fill mine. When both spouses sit back and wait for the other to fill their love tank then neither ever makes a move and both of their tanks just slowly drain away to nothing and the resentment builds. Usually both have thought about BD'ing the other, but once one finally makes that move it triggers a strange reaction in the other where they forget they were unhappy and suddenly feel like they will die if they don't get their spouse back.
We argued a lot about money. She trained full time (6-7 times a week, mornings and evenings tues. Thurs.)and recently started going to school (wed. Friday). She didnt really contribute much financially and because she was training or at school she didnt really contribute as much as I probably would have liked around the house.
She would come home and just seem upset. She would get on me for not doing more around the house. I leave for work at 645 and get home around 430 and some days not until 530/6. Some days we were just able to say hi/bye between work and each of our trainings.
^^^All of that sounds like a very broken, unhappy relationship.
In an effort to make her happy ive made a real effort to help around the house more. Dishes, Laundry, whatever. It still didnt seem to help. If it wasnt the house it was money.
That's all very beta behavior at a time you need to be more alpha and extert yourself as a strong, independent man. Being Susie Homemaker is not going to make her more attracted to you.
She felt like she didnt have freedom to do what she wanted. Shed spend money and get upset when I would ask if the things she was buying were necessary. She would get offered camps and seminars that would cost 300+ and hotel fees on top of that and id be expected to just make it happen. Shes in the nicest workout clothes and I'm in the same stuff ive had for years. That never really bothered me, I enjoy being able to do nice things and get her nice things, I just didnt feel appreciated for it.
Sounds like a lot of resentment on both sides. One way around this might have been to sit down and agree on a monthly allocation for her. Give her a budget that is hers, no questions asked. If she has to exceed that budget in a month then she comes to you to discuss it. If she stays within her budget then no discussion is needed. I can see both sides of this issue, she resented having to explain every little purchase to you and you resented her spending money freely without thinking about the financial implications. This is all due to a lack of communication.
I havent reached out to her since Wednesday. I figured if shes angry enough to leave like that shes gottta cool down a bit if im gonna get anywhere.
Yes, exactly! You've got plenty of time. Just settle down and relax and give her time and space.
Thano you all for the input here. There is a ton of great info and advice. I'm going to try to answer any of the questions that came up, please forgive me if I miss something.
Anotherstander- she is probably in over her head. She is good but shes still a long way off from competing woth the best in the world. The people around her continue to tell her she has tons of potential and will be improving a ton but she really isnt improving at the rate she probably wants. I think she uses me as an excuse for why shes not where she wants to be, not only in her athletic goals but in her career as well. Ive never told her she couldnt make it or wasnt good enough, ive always told her how impresive she was and how shes definitely gotten better and stuff, but I guess I just wasnt saying the right things.
I will work on being more of a ra-ra person if thats what she needs and I have the opportunity.
I agree that it was very beta behaivior which is not like me at all. I was just kind of defeated by that point and trying to keep things on good terms.
I did bring up a monthly allotment and she was against the idea. I think if anything that made her feel like I wanted her to be less in control of making decisions espicailly financially.
I was always trying to communicate but thinhs would just turn into arguments. We could hardly ever get on the same page with things and sometimes it felt like she was just getting mad for the sake of getting mad. Looking for a reason if that makes sense.
Maika & Steve85- thank you for sharing that with me. I remember the last time we had issues she definitely rewrote our entire marriage history. I'll be prepared for it this time if she chooses to open up communication.
I really think this whole thing is just her hoping to get some sort of reaction from me. Thats why she took my truck and most importantly my cat. She knows I love that cat, we've joked about it before, "she goes before the cat does" jokimg stuff like that. She probably expected me to come get my truck and bang on the door for my cat but instead she got nothing. 5 days later, still nothing she blocks me on fb and Insta hoping that will get a reaction. Still nothing. I cant imagine what shes thinking now.
Anotherstander- she is probably in over her head. She is good but shes still a long way off from competing woth the best in the world. The people around her continue to tell her she has tons of potential and will be improving a ton but she really isnt improving at the rate she probably wants. I think she uses me as an excuse for why shes not where she wants to be, not only in her athletic goals but in her career as well. Ive never told her she couldnt make it or wasnt good enough, ive always told her how impresive she was and how shes definitely gotten better and stuff, but I guess I just wasnt saying the right things.
I had a feeling that might be the case. I think I'm starting to see the big picture, and you sir, are in a crappy spot. Here is the thing, if she is not a world class athlete but she wants to pursue that dream WHILE ALSO working, being an attentive wife, and helping take care of the home then more power to her. Plenty of Olympic athletes do just that. But if she is not a world class athlete then she is NOT in a position to quit working, quit taking care of the house and quit being your wife because she thinks all of those things "interfere" with her progress. No, that's not how life works. She's starting to sound like an indulgent, selfish, entitled brat. She needs a wake-up call, and unfortunately you can't give it to her because she'll just resent you for it. She needs to learn on her own that she is not "all that".
I will work on being more of a ra-ra person if thats what she needs and I have the opportunity.
Just to clarify, I do not mean feed her ego. Don't tell her she's the greatest sprinter (or whatever) in the world and will clearly win the gold medal. I just mean to celebrate the things she does do right and be supportive of her within the framework of her being a good wife and such as well. If you get back together, then make an effort to go watch her when she does compete and cheer her on, and tell her how impressed you are and such. That's all I meant. My kids, it meant the world to them to look up and see me up in the stands. It thrilled them to pieces. That meant more to them than a thousand "attaboys".
I did bring up a monthly allotment and she was against the idea. I think if anything that made her feel like I wanted her to be less in control of making decisions espicailly financially.
Hmmmm, well it sounds like you have been trying. This may be more about her own personal awakening that she is not the athlete she thought she was and is now looking for a scapegoat. Does it feel like that may be what's going on?
AS-man, youre pretty much right on all accounts. I dont think she is ready to actually "grow up"and deal with the realities of everyday life for a regular adult (career, responsibility, taking care of home and marriage)
As far as support I pretty much do just what you mentioned. I make it to every meet I can and support her as much as possible. I missed her last one because of a mandatory function but I'm sure she used that as an opportunity to tell her coaches (the people shes most likely staying with) about how I'm unsupportive and dont believe or support her.
I feel like thats exactly whats going on. Shes not happy with her career (or lack of one) and where shes at athletically. I definitely feel like the scapegoat
I feel like shes almost in the same position I was when we went through this a few years ago but with some different variables. Rather than having a drinking problem and some of the other issues I dealt with, shes got her issues to deal with.
Shes either going to grow up like I did or the marriage is going to die.
AS just broke it down with such precision and looks like he was on point.
Shes either going to grow up like I did or the marriage is going to die.
So, now you know it's about her mostly and very little about you. the question now is - do you want to be with someone who operates with this level of maturity, or do you want a relationship with someone who has a good head on their shoulders and is grown up?
Why are you selling yourself short? You overcame major life challenges man - I am so proud of you. You are a solid catch. Just work on some NGS stuff.
You deserve someone who is mature and smart and doesn't scapegoat you.
Man... I honestly dont know how to answer that. I dont know what I want. I know I dont want someone else. I'd like to have a happy, healthy marriage, I'm just not sure thats even possible anymore.
You guys are right, this isnt really about me anymore. I'm so confused. I love her, but do I want to deal with this? I dont know anymore. I know I cant fix her, shes got to do it herself. Am I supposed to just sit in this empty house until she figures it out? I'm feeling pretty lost right now.
That's okay. That is why this is the time for you to figure that out and reflect critically on what makes you happy and what you need from a partner.
I know I dont want someone else
I know how that feels. You're feeling this because you're in the throes of your pain and hurt. The wounds are still bleeding and all you want to do is have it stop. And right now you think that her coming back is what's going to stop the bleeding - it's not. You're also feeling a loss of control, stability, and grounding. Your identity is tied up so much with yourself as a husband and partner, that you're neglecting who you are outside of that for yourself. Who is raws as a man? I'd like to get an answer to that question. What are raws's values and priorities for himself in life? Those are the questions you need to answer.
I'd like to have a happy, healthy marriage, I'm just not sure thats even possible anymore.
Listen, I am not far in my sitch to tell you that it's going to be alright at the end of the tunnel and that you'll have a happy and healthy marriage, with your current W or someone else. But you know what, I've seen plenty of folks here who are absolute success stories and have found new partners who have given them even more fulfilling lives. So, I know it's possible. But it's tied to improving yourself, finding out who you are, what your values are, and what you won't tolerate in life.
I'm so confused. I love her, but do I want to deal with this?
It's okay to be confused. You're in the LBS fog, which is the opposite of the WW fog - you believe everything is your fault and you internalize that. You see you MR through rose-tinted glasses and minimize your W's faults. The more you GAL, self-reflect, give her and yourself space, the fog starts to lift and you are able to detach and think objectively. Right now, you need to trust the DB process instead of worrying about the outcomes. The outcome will definitely be a better and healthy you; if your MR gets saved in the process, that's a bonus.
I know I cant fix her, shes got to do it herself.
Yes, absolutely. If she came back, I would insist on her going through IC before you even consider working on the MR with her.
Am I supposed to just sit in this empty house until she figures it out? I'm feeling pretty lost right now.
Nahhh!! get your lazy a$$ out of the house and start living your life. You don't have to move on from her yet, but you have to move forward - which means finding GAL, thinking about where you fell short and making improvements. In your case, you've already made huge improvements, and so I'd think about how to spend time with other people, expand your social network, and figuring out who you are and what your values are.
It's okay to feel lost. We all did. But, we're here a few months removed from BD, following the DB process, seeing that there is light at the end of the tunnel for all of us.
Dust up and just do something, even if it feels kinda inauthentic. Last thing you want to do is sit and ruminate and wallow in self-pity. For sure you can grieve and process your emotions, but get out and find what makes you happy outside of your MR.
I know where you're at emotionally man. I was there. It won't stay that way forever. Just grind through the process and don't suppress your emotions - go see an IC if you need to. I did and it helped me tremendously.
We're here for you and got your back. Come and post here your thoughts and what you want to do. The folks here saved my life. Honestly. I dunno where I would've been if I hadn't come across this forum. You can do this!
Maika- thank you for taking the time to share some of your wisdom with me. I really appreciate it.
I know there are more fish in the sea, as they say. But im not even beginning to think about that. I dont want to become the "I'll never get married again" jaded type person but honestly that seems a lot more realistic for me at this point.
Ive been working on GAL, I didnt want you to think I am literally sitting around the house waiting for her to figure it out, I meant more in the figurative sense. Like just waiting for her to figure things out or file papers/find someone new. I try to get home as late as I can, I go to work, then train as much as my body allows me to. I usually walk in the door around 9/930, shower, watch some news then go to sleep.
We worked with a MC 2x before she left (at her request) but she still complained about him saying he wasnt helping and it felt like a waste of time even though it was her idea. I saw him last week, the day after she left and I plan on continuing to work with him. Ill be there tomorrow. If she wants to work things out thats definitely going to be a just.
Ill keep working on me and trying to figure out who I am. [censored] to say but honestly, right now I dont know.
Thank you all again for the support.
Question for everyone, please help if you can.
W is still on my medical insurance and bank acct. I just saw a transaction for a patient first medical center for $180. Do I reach out and ask if she is ok? She is going to know I saw the charge. I dont know if this is a way for her to get attention or to get me to reach out or what it is. I am worried and obviously still care about her, i just dont know what I should do.
There's no reason to think about other fish in the sea. You're not ready for that. And you should not get validation about your self-worth from someone else's affection and attention. Get comfortable in your own skin. I wasn't saying that you should be out in the dating world or whatever. I am saying that she isn't the only one for you, and from what I have read, isn't the optimal partner you're looking for. She isn't giving you what you need from a partner. You can't see it right now, but I can see it plain and simple from what you're writing about her.
Good about GAL and working to pick yourself up. I am happy to hear you're in IC. MC only works if both parties are ready to rebuild the MR and are there in good faith.
For the medical insurance, I would err on the side of no contact just because she's acted so drastically by removing herself, your cat, and other belongings. But part of me also believes that you should not abandon compassion and care. So, I would text her this - "Hey, I saw the medical transaction. I hope everything is okay and that you are well."
Leave it at that.
Maika- I understand what youre saying and yeah, youre probably spot on.
I'm not going to hold my breath on the MC thing though, even if things start turning around I dont know how quickly she'd be open to the idea.
I'm worried about this whole medical thing. She knows we have insurance and it would cover er visits for her, but she chose to pay out of pocket. I feel like she did it knowing id see the transaction and is reaching for attention, you know? I dont want to reinforce that she can get my attention if she is in trouble if that makes sense. I dont want her to do something stupid if I reach out now, then go back to no contact.
On the other hand I love and care about her. I dont think it would be anything life threatening, but if I dont reach out I'm just the guy who doesnt care and she feels unsupported again.
Does that make sense?
raws - it's really messy to try and read into what your partner is doing and not doing. what it means and does not mean. maybe she did it because she forgot insurance info. maybe she did it so you could see it. maybe she did it because she doesn't want to rely on you. It could be a number of things.
I'd not focus on that because you're not going to get an answer. Understand what you can control - your actions stemming from your values. You care about her despite what she has done, so send her a short text and leave it at that. don't follow up unless she reaches out and then you can take it from there.
She's tried to remove herself and everything about her very dramatically from your life. I'd give her a wide berth and tons of space.
So, send that text and do something to get your mind off her.
Will do Maika. Thanks.
I forgot I was also a little worried about a possible TRO but havent recieved any notification or anything yet so maybe I'm making nothing into something.
I'm gonna give it a few hours so she doesnt think im constantly checking the account. I'll probably send it sometime this evening. I'll keep you updated.
sounds good. if she responds back, I'd highly recommend that you come here and post what you want to write back and get feedback. At least for a little while until you feel more grounded.
Just heard on a podcast last night - letting your emotions drive is like being a passenger with a drunk driver. Emotions will come and go. So, just buckle up for a while and doing nothing is infinitely better than doing something.
I hope your W is okay and it's not a serious medical issue.
Thanks, Maika. Me too. I will post updates either way and go from there.
That's okay. That is why this is the time for you to figure that out and reflect critically on what makes you happy and what you need from a partner.
I know I dont want someone else
I know how that feels. You're feeling this because you're in the throes of your pain and hurt. The wounds are still bleeding and all you want to do is have it stop. And right now you think that her coming back is what's going to stop the bleeding - it's not. You're also feeling a loss of control, stability, and grounding. Your identity is tied up so much with yourself as a husband and partner, that you're neglecting who you are outside of that for yourself. Who is raws as a man? I'd like to get an answer to that question. What are raws's values and priorities for himself in life? Those are the questions you need to answer.
I'd like to have a happy, healthy marriage, I'm just not sure thats even possible anymore.
Listen, I am not far in my sitch to tell you that it's going to be alright at the end of the tunnel and that you'll have a happy and healthy marriage, with your current W or someone else. But you know what, I've seen plenty of folks here who are absolute success stories and have found new partners who have given them even more fulfilling lives. So, I know it's possible. But it's tied to improving yourself, finding out who you are, what your values are, and what you won't tolerate in life.
I'm so confused. I love her, but do I want to deal with this?
It's okay to be confused. You're in the LBS fog, which is the opposite of the WW fog - you believe everything is your fault and you internalize that. You see you MR through rose-tinted glasses and minimize your W's faults. The more you GAL, self-reflect, give her and yourself space, the fog starts to lift and you are able to detach and think objectively. Right now, you need to trust the DB process instead of worrying about the outcomes. The outcome will definitely be a better and healthy you; if your MR gets saved in the process, that's a bonus.
I know I cant fix her, shes got to do it herself.
Yes, absolutely. If she came back, I would insist on her going through IC before you even consider working on the MR with her.
Am I supposed to just sit in this empty house until she figures it out? I'm feeling pretty lost right now.
Nahhh!! get your lazy a$$ out of the house and start living your life. You don't have to move on from her yet, but you have to move forward - which means finding GAL, thinking about where you fell short and making improvements. In your case, you've already made huge improvements, and so I'd think about how to spend time with other people, expand your social network, and figuring out who you are and what your values are.
It's okay to feel lost. We all did. But, we're here a few months removed from BD, following the DB process, seeing that there is light at the end of the tunnel for all of us.
Dust up and just do something, even if it feels kinda inauthentic. Last thing you want to do is sit and ruminate and wallow in self-pity. For sure you can grieve and process your emotions, but get out and find what makes you happy outside of your MR.
I know where you're at emotionally man. I was there. It won't stay that way forever. Just grind through the process and don't suppress your emotions - go see an IC if you need to. I did and it helped me tremendously.
We're here for you and got your back. Come and post here your thoughts and what you want to do. The folks here saved my life. Honestly. I dunno where I would've been if I hadn't come across this forum. You can do this!
Sorry for reposting this whole thing but Maika's advice is pure gold and you really should take this one to heart. This is your roadmap. We are not telling you to abandon your M and look for someone else. But we ARE telling you that you can't fix your W. Right now even though you're super lonely, separation is the BEST thing for both of you. It'll give her time to reflect and realize that you are NOT the source of her problems and it'll give you time to reset and wean yourself off of your co-dependence with her. Use this time to read, study, work on yourself, and get out and GAL. You've got plenty of time so don't panic!
Maika- I understand what youre saying and yeah, youre probably spot on.
I'm not going to hold my breath on the MC thing though, even if things start turning around I dont know how quickly she'd be open to the idea.
I'm worried about this whole medical thing. She knows we have insurance and it would cover er visits for her, but she chose to pay out of pocket. I feel like she did it knowing id see the transaction and is reaching for attention, you know? I dont want to reinforce that she can get my attention if she is in trouble if that makes sense. I dont want her to do something stupid if I reach out now, then go back to no contact.
On the other hand I love and care about her. I dont think it would be anything life threatening, but if I dont reach out I'm just the guy who doesnt care and she feels unsupported again.
Does that make sense?
She's not paying out of pocket to get your attention. She doesnt want you to know or get access to any of her health info.. but still seeking you to fund.
Just stay no contact about this, or you look like your invading her privacy but in a manipulative nice guy sort of way.
jujuB - I am going to disagree with you here.
It seems like his W went to the ER and paid out of pocket. I don't care why she did that even if she had insurance. But I think it's perfectly okay to reach out and say that hope she's doing okay and leave it at that.
You can still be compassionate without looking manipulative. And if she reads his genuine concern as manipulation, then that's on her.
I think if she wanted his sympathy, she would have texted him something like "Ugh, I broke my ankle" She did not.
She is blocking him in all other areas, and the only reason he even knows this is because he looked at the bank statements.
So leave her alone.
Thabks AS. I agree, Maika is dropping truth and knowledge. I understand exactly what you guys are saying.
As far as the disagreement between juju and maika on what to do; she has enough money to cover the 180 herself but chose not to. She used joint funds from a joint account. Additionally, she is still covered on my insurance. She could have used that and not had to pay a thing and I might never have known she was there. Instead, she chose to pay out of pocket with "our" (my) money knowing id see the transaction. I feel like she is looking for me to reach out and break the silence, either so she can open up comms or so she can feel perused or feel like I gave in first. I dont know, though. There might be another reason.
If I ignore it she for sure gets even more pissed than she already is and who knows what she does next. This is a tough choice, I feel like I lose either way
she has enough money to cover the 180 herself but chose not to. She used joint funds from a joint account. Additionally, she is still covered on my insurance. She could have used that and not had to pay a thing and I might never have known she was there. Instead, she chose to pay out of pocket with "our" (my) money knowing id see the transaction. I feel like she is looking for me to reach out and break the silence
I don't think so. If she wanted to communicate with you then she would do it directly. There's only one reason she is playing games like this- because she wants to punish you. I am with Juju, just maintain radio silence. Keep in mind that SHE left without warning, that is not the action of someone that wants to be pursued. She wants the opposite in fact- she wants to be left alone.
If I ignore it she for sure gets even more pissed than she already is and who knows what she does next. This is a tough choice, I feel like I lose either way
Go way back and read your very first post from 2015, and remind yourself what all the pursuit and begging and pleading got you. It would be the same this time. Leave her alone, it is for the best.
Also you are over 10 pages now so please start a new thread. Post a link to the new thread in this one as your last post, and post a link to this thread in the first post of the new one.