Hey, I am FIRST here!
OD,
Originally Posted By: Old Dog
I just received an text from WW and now I'm angry again.
What's going on? Why are you feeling angry?
Again, what is really making you angry? What was the text all about?
And most welcome :-)
I get angry sometimes because it's so unfair (stamps foot) and I don't deserve this. And when I see a text or email from WW, it just brings it back when into focus when I was working or GAL or whatever.
The text this morning was WWW telling me a couple of things:
That she could have got S12 to phone me as I didn't speak to him when I called yesterday, only S15.
They are going to S12's school this evening to discuss his class options: which subjects he is going to continue with and which to drop. And I won't be there, just as I haven't been for all his others and all but one of S15's. This I not how I imagined being a parent to be and it breaks my heart.
That she is taking them to see her folks this weekend - quite a long way in the car for someone with recuperating from spinal surgery methinks.
And also checking that I'm still coming up alternate weekends and that I'm aware it's a bank holiday next weekend.
I replied that I am aware and that I'd like them to come down to visit me on that weekend. We've sent a couple back and forth about logistics.
S12 just called me. So I just sent her a text saying thanks for getting him to call.
In other news, the watch is out, OD!!! What is your plan there? I see Apple kindly included an app in the latest iOS upgrade to entice us all...
As an Apple fan boy, I'm all excited of course gan ... however, I never wear a watch. And I've always been a little shy of spending money, especially on myself. Having lived on the breadline for so many years, I guess it's a difficult habit to break. WW is crap with money and just spends it. She's taking the kids to se her folks this weekend and going to see an old friend next weekend. Hello? You lost your job remember? Why did I start writing about her? Oh yes lack of detachment.
Back to me me me. It took me over a year to get an iPhone6 ... upgrading from an iPhone 3G would you believe ... not even 3GS. And I'm typing this on an eight year old MacBook Pro!
I did treat myself to an iPad mini the xmas before last though.
Oh and a Mercedes Benz CLK 280 Avantgarde Convertible two weeks ago ... with added engine light and Service B demand.
Thank you for dropping by gan, I look every day to see if someone has added to my thread and am a little disappointed when there's nothing. I don't post as much - I was going to say "as I should" but it's not that - as I would like, to be more involved. I feel as though I take more than I give on here. Maybe that's all I can do at the moment. Paying forward comes later.
There's an issue in that isn't there. Sigh.
I know what you mean, OD. It feels a little like receiving a gift when someone pays attention to what is going on in our corner. Everyone loves getting a gift. I don't know why but for some reason you struck a chord with me early on. Not sure if it is because you called yourself Old Dog and added the "(Not So)"...something about you resonated for some reason though we've had quite a different reaction to BD (anger for you, no anger for me).
I am the same way as you re money....and that is a habit I am trying to kick as I've denied myself some fun times because of my frugal ways. (I'm fortunate for being able to afford to kick this habit). Went on a bit of a shopping spree today as it turns out.
I remembered you were an apple fanboy - hence my question. As it turns out, I popped into the store today and tried on the watch. I was surprised by how heavy it is (the small version even). I don't wear a watch either so it would be an adjustment, especially considering how large it feels. So far I'm not convinced that I need to make that adjustment....but it is pretty cool.
Somebody came into my office a week or two ago wearing an Android version of the watch. I didn't even know there was such a thing. It looked cool but I feel like my life is sufficiently intruded on by my phone. The watch seems like a very expensive way to be even more over connected.
STBX has been spending as much on his credit card by himself as I do for me and the three kids on mine. Sometimes more. AND he has a corporate card. It will be a relief to manage my own spending without him. I wasn't frugal when I first met him but I've learned a lot in the last seventeen years.
You're getting there, NS-OD. Read some of my threads from last fall -- and I was already over a year into my sitch at that point. I just passed the one-year anniversary of him moving out without even noticing. You'll get there.
OD
Of course the car is fixable, it's a machine.
Not so sure about an Apple Watch. Although I do have a Fitbit on my wrist.
I use so much technology that I love it when I have downtime.
I saw Toots saying too much GAL on your last thread. pleeeease is there any such thing?
Drops too at Ceroc. Looking forward to that dance OD even if at the Kindergarten crew party. I have Ceroc dance tonight and regular Sunday Ceroc tomorrow.
I can read you are having a tough time detaching and you know what is needed?
More GAL, specifically Ceroc GAL.
Tons
V
gan - re checking for posts: It may be something to do with the co-dependent thing. Am I looking for validation from others because I'm not completely comfortable within myself? I get angry if I dwell on how unfair it all is or if I think about WW with OM.
Ah frugality. I just let a right bargain of a bike slip on eBay because of it. And it was in the town where I work so no shipping costs either. Back on my 20 year old Marin tomorrow then. At least I’ve given it a bit of a tweak today. Three new spokes, adjusted the brakes so they work, which is important as my first mile is downhill fast.
Yesterday, I went to a meeting of co-dependents anonymous. Too early to tell if this is for me, but I shared a bit of my feelings and thoughts with the others there. It was a little scary, but not as much as it would have been without all this self examination.
I woke up feeling a bit down so as well as CoDa, I tried to busy myself during the day:
- did some washing
- did the washing up
- found a garage that specialises in Mercs and booked mine in for a service on Tuesday
- went to Lidl* for two items and spent £65 (mainly on cycling stuff inc a workshop stand :-)
- went to a gig - Stornoway at the lovely De La Warr Pavillion. I hadn't heard them before, but they were great. Beautiful songs, lovely harmonies and performed well. They also engaged with the audience in an informative and chatty way. Apparently, the oldest ever fossilised spider web was found in Bexhill-on-Sea. I did know about the petrified forest and dinosaur footprints at low tide, but I didn't know about the smallest dinosaur that trudged around before Darwin was born.
I went to the gig on my ow as my flatmates were holding an AA meeting. Although I enjoyed it, I also found myself missing my wife as I looked at other couples and felt sad and moments of anger before I managed to rein them in.
* Lidl is a German owned supermarket known for cheap but decent quality 'different' branded goods ... and also a deadly buy it now aisle that changes every week.
I started this post first thing this morning and left it to finish later, but now it’s bed time so I’ll have to post this now and finish it off tomorrow.
gan - re checking for posts: It may be something to do with the co-dependent thing. Am I looking for validation from others because I'm not completely comfortable within myself?
Maybe. Or may just be you are just looking for any kind of connection with others during a rough time in your life. I think it is pretty natural to want that
Community (definition): a group of people living in the same place or having a particular characteristic in common.
Here's a tip - if you look and no one has posted on your thread, post on someone else's. The more you check in with others, the more others will check in with you.
Let us know how the CoDa meetings go. I'm curious...
Or maybe it's because you come across as a truly loving guy with a sense of humour?
Who posts back.
Acknowledges posters, is polite and enjoys a thread party?
Or maybe because we empathise and you listen, even if you don't always agree.
You post regularly, are in a tough spot, say what's on your mind.
You Ceroc and like music.
So OD what's not to like?
V
PS you shop at Lidls, says cheeeeeese, know the best ale houses near Euston and have a red convertible
Hey od,
We'll see your paying it forward i didn't know what lidl was, like Aldi. For us.
I bought air tools and stuff last week, fine the deadly specials Isle.
I've been a bit mia, although on line chatting to a bloke supposely a date, but boy he needs some help. Ms fix it has been out of duck tape.
Maybell - yes, I think I am getting there. I know I am impatient and like everyone would prefer the silver bullet but when I talk to my IC for instance, I can see progress. (Almost) moving out has helped. I no longer see, nor talk to WW, so removing those triggers has helped. I still feel righteous anger when I think of her behaviour. I believe anger can be good for motivation, but probably not righteous anger, I reckon that is destructive, but I'm not there yet.
As for re-reading your Autumn :-) posts, crikey, when would I get time to do that with all my GAL? I did read it the first time round. Your posts are a constant for me but you write too much for me to keep up :-)
Vanilla - Of course the car is fixable, it's a machine. Yes and it's haveing it's service and being fixed as I type. Collecting it after work and driving back to the flat with the top down. Woohoo!
Toots - I saw Toots saying too much GAL on your last thread. pleeeease is there any such thing? (Vanilla) Yoga and Ceroc combo Toots. That would be awesome.
gan - Here's a tip - if you look and no one has posted on your thread, post on someone else's. The more you check in with others, the more others will check in with you. Yes, but there aren't enough hours in the day. Not when you have to keep up with V & Maybell's threads ;-)
Vanilla again - Or maybe it's because you come across as a truly loving guy with a sense of humour? ... That is so sweet. What's the emoticaon for blushes like a girl?
Ggrass - Lidl & Aldi are pretty much interchanegable I reckon. Air tools. Oh Gg, where have you been all my life? Lovin' the Deadly Specials Isle as opposed to aisle ;-) Is it a South Sea Island? As long as it's not overun with brown snakes.
And ... Leroc tonight. Ain't gonna blame it on aything but the boogie.
Wahey! We had guest dance instructors last night and we learnt a spot of tango.
Some of the regulars found it a little uncomfortable to be so close and a couple even sat it out. Me, I threw my self into it ... had to apologise and promise not to get too excited again :-)
----------
Just got a text from WW.
Sorry about Millwall* :-(
Green bin's been emptied :-)
*Millwall, my team, just got relegated.
I just don't want to hear from her, I don't want to reply.
I have been trying to get the council to empty the green bin for about 6 months though.
Should I ignore it, just say "thanks" to cover both statements and that's it or something else like "stop trying to be friends, I hate you guts, but thanks for letting me know about the green bin".
I think just thanks would be fine.
Yes, that's what I thought.
The third option was tongue in cheek by the way, just in case it didn't come over in text.
I trust you know the answer to that one OD.
Oh great. WW just texted me with news that our tenants are moving out in early June.
Is that bad news OD? Does it give you any new options at all??
Well it means we either get some more tenants or sell the house.
We did want to sell it, but now WW has lost her job, my solicitor has said "It is in your interests to try and resolve finance and property matters when WW has another position of employment.
It would carry more risk for you if you commence finance and property proceedings on the back of the divorce proceedings whilst her financial circumstances are uncertain."
This assumes we are heading for the door with the big D on which makes me so sad. Feeling a bit low at the moment. I did want to go to my first Jiu Jitsu lesson this evening but I couldn't find it. I had two different postcodes and wasn't able to spot a big fitness centre at either.
And S15 doesn't want to come down to the seaside this weekend as he reckons his back is not up to it. So I'm disappointed about that too.
There's more trivial complications with other things too but all of this is making me stressed. I just want it all to go away now.
And following on from last night's feeling stressed, I am in a foul mood today.
Sorry to hear that OD (we need an equivalent of hand on shoulder icon here!)
Could you use a guaranteed letting income agency to bridge the gap? Not as good an income but better than the alternatives maybe?
Know what you mean about wanting things to go away, I have no idea if the current upswing in my sitch will last or go where I obviously want it to go but I do know in January and February I just wanted to put my head under the pillow pull up the duvet and hide some days, just felt like a constant slog up an infinite mountain with no clear idea of what was waiting there.
Keep on keeping on OD you will get to good days again, the shape of them? Who knows. But they will be good.
Make sure even if S15 isnt coming you have some good times this weekend, problems will always be around and we may not be able to fix them all but I've learned the level of stress they cause us is something we do have some control over even if we just need to breathe, get out to a new view or go for a walk.
Hang in there matey.
Thanks edz. I like your duvet idea. You need to take plenty of cheese in there I guess.
What's a guaranteed letting income agency?
Hi OD, well I dont suggest the duvet as a good plan but the cheese sounds good if not great for the waistline!
Dont say cheeeeeeeeese too much or v will be here with the wine, crackers and olive bread you know and then we'll have to have a party, oh that would be awful
I dont claim to be an expert on GLA's (dont own a property and privately rent) but from what I understand they take over the letting responsibilities, vetting etc and guarantee a minimum income but take a slice of the rent when its let. I'd google it in your area and see whats out there and obviously read all the fine print
Ah OK, a hands off approach. We are such crap landlords or brilliant, depending on which side of the fence you're on.
We just let our tenants live in our house for 3 years without a single rent increase. The income doesn't even meet our own rent ... and that's before we pay any tax on it.
I like the sound of a cheese and all the trimmings party. It's a pity it'll have to be a virtual one.
OD...sounds to me like you'd like to keep things as is rather than sell, resolve finances and head for D. So why not try to find some more tenants? Or as Edz suggests, use an agency to find some. Is it hard in your area to find tenants?
Last time we got an agency to find and vet them but not manage them. That really is money for old rope.
I can't see WW agreeing to this again though as we were supposed t be selling up.
Last time we got an agency to find and vet them but not manage them. That really is money for old rope.
I can't see WW agreeing to this again though as we were supposed t be selling up.
Well OD, That cuts both ways. She can't sell without you agreeing, right?
Would air Bnb help at all?
Try googling airbnb I have a chum who used to work there and they do holiday lets etc.
Regards
V
raliced - yes, it does cut both ways. I do want to sell as well though and she has said she's not out to screw me financially ... But don't believe what they say etc
V - AirBnB would be a good idea, but it's unfurnished.
I guess I'm going to have to have an email exchange with WW at the very least.
I'm back with my lovely boys now after another flippin' stressful journey. My nice new car definitely dies want to leave East Sussex as it did the same thing as before. I took it to the man who cleared the diagnostic error light but it'll have to go in again to find out the cause. I did a age to drive up here but I was two and half hours late.
The boys like it though and came out to see it I the dark. S12 operated the soft top button and we decided to go out in it tomorrow for a spin.
Ah the therapeutic powers of my boys are wonderful. I felt increasing stress and anger as I approached the house especially as I passed through the town where OM works, but when I got here (I can't call it home any longer), they made me feel OK. I miss them so much ... and my old wife.
Having said that (above) though, this morning I am sad and depressed, angry and immobilised. That Kübler Ross curve in a couple of hours. Crying over the washing up, feeling rage at the injustice of it all and slumped in a pit of depression.
I hate this house (where my kids & WW live). It's never been my home apart from a couple of months over three years ago. It's too small, too cold, right next door to a church who spend three hours every Sunday morning disturbing me (sorry religious folk, but it does), far too expensive and most of all where bomb day happened.
Why am I still, after 11 months, at the mercy of these stupid thoughts and feelings? When will it ever end? I am trying to get on and get some sort of life but this **** is never ever far from my mind and can ruin any occasion at any time.
Vent vent.
((OD)) I would find it hard going back to the site of BD, too. I've since moved but even when I am driving near there I can feel the emotions coming on. Actually we had a long weekend over here last weekend and there is a particular thing we do on that weekend - and I couldn't even stand seeing the ads for it because it brought back feelings around BD. Around this time last year my H announced he wanted to separate and within 4 weeks he was gone.
So how to deal with it? I know you do a bit of mindfulness. One technique I've been learning lately is called noting - where you simply put a label on whether it is a thought or a feeling that has got you distracted from the task at hand and then refocus on what you were doing. I think it could be quite useful. Maybe you want to check it out?
OD, read my timeline. You'll get there.
I understand it's Winston Churchill who said when you're going through hell, keep going.
Hi OD. I feel your pain. Can you and boys go and do something for the day to get your mind off it for a while ?
It's a very tough road and the horrible part is you have to travel it. It's near impossible to imagine but you will be happy again. You are out and about with dancing You have a life and most important you have your boys in your life. At times it might not seem enough but it's more than a lot of people get
You will get through this OD Take care. Rd
OD, sending hugs your way. I second what gan said. I too feel uneasy now because it is the same time of year as last year when the s..t started to hit the fan. Recurring holidays and the like are reminders of what we were doing last year when I started to sense something was wrong, and watching him flirt with OW in front of me, feeling very unhappy and confused, and then BD.
If I still lived in the same house I think I'd probably have adapted to the location by now but we both moved. Locations where we went around BD still have negative associations for me. So I get why you would feel uncomfortable at the house. You aren't there full time and thus able to adapt. It still feels fresh.
I do what gan said, when I am reminded due to the date or location I try to refocus on something else.
I hope you are feeling stronger.
Hugs to you!
Lisa B
gan - thanks for the noting suggestion. It sounds like a step further forward from mindfulness where instead of just watching your thoughts, you box them up.
I feel as though I'm doing everything wrong at the moment. I'm getting caught up with negative thinking which spirals out of control at times, and with so many triggers around its hard to step back and just watch.
Today was again frustrating, waiting for S15. As he is confined to home during his convalescence, a highlight of his week was a friend coming to visit which meant today was a write off until around 6pm
I'm not doing any household chores as I don't see it as my responsibility any longer I f I'm 'forced' out of the family home. So it's now more difficult to occupy my time. I did spend at least an hour trying to get my satnav to accept petrol stations with LPG. Nope, not for you matey, you can't have it.
At last though we put the top down on the car and drove round to see my mum and brother and things have improved. It's bad when silently seething is your baseline.
V - good old Sir Winston, the force behind Gallipoli where they did indeed go through hell and ... hmmmm, maybe that's not the best example.
rd - yes, that's the thing. Doing things to take you mind off it. Being with others helps. My boys are great ... But like most teenagers, they do spend rather a lot of time lounging around in bed all morning and with their noses in computer games.
I know it's a long hard road and one day I will crest the summit, I just hope that summit isn't Beachy Head.
Lisa - thanks Lisa. My mood was yoyo-ing every weekend as I went back to the 'family' home. It's now every fortnight, and even though WW is away when I'm there, the whole place just stinks of bad connotations. I'm so glad to get out. Now that I'm at my mums, I can see that more clearly.
I'm sorry you're also reminded of last year. It's coming up to our first anniversary on June 1st. I'm considering writing something on the calendar, or perhaps getting a card. Something vindictive and derogatory*. What do you think?
* [alarm]joke alert[/alarm]
HAHA Old Dog! Good idea. I'm going to join you and do the same.
"Dear WAH,
I just realized it has been almost one year since you started lusting after that hot girl at the office and treating me like trash. Happy anniversary! Hope you enjoy this gift I got you to celebrate. It's a fancy body wash from Paris. Don't mind the nasty smell as you rub it all over your face, body and hair. Don't be alarmed as your skin turns lumpy and green and your hair all falls out. Put some on your teeth too. Girls love it! You'll get more dates.
Hugs and kisses, LisaB"
gan - thanks for the noting suggestion. It sounds like a step further forward from mindfulness where instead of just watching your thoughts, you box them up.
No not boxing. Just acknowledging and moving on. You already acknowledge that they aren't serving you well ("I'm getting caught up with negative thinking which spirals out of control at times"). In the Headspace series, the technique is incorporated into the series called "Anxiety." He suggests that labelling thoughts or feelings as just that, brings a bit more distance to them so we don't feel quite so controlled by them. Google "noting meditation."
"Dear WAH,
I just realized it has been almost one year since you started lusting after that hot girl at the office and treating me like trash. Happy anniversary! Hope you enjoy this gift I got you to celebrate. It's a fancy body wash from Paris. Don't mind the nasty smell as you rub it all over your face, body and hair. Don't be alarmed as your skin turns lumpy and green and your hair all falls out. Put some on your teeth too. Girls love it! You'll get more dates. Hugs and kisses, LisaB"
^^^ How did I miss this? Classic!!!
Hi od just catching up.
On the subject of bd location that's the flat in my case. I was glad to be out of there but I will say with recent warming I dont mind being there now.
I will add both w and I agree there's no way any reconciliation will include that place in a residency role I will never move back in there for that and a thousand other memories haunt that place ive no desire to revisit.
You're doing well matey there will be fun days ahead trust me.
Edz
Love it!! - Where can I buy some of this fancy body wash please??
My STBXH does not need it! Any extra pooh is unnecessary.
V
Very restrained Lisa. I was thinking of something much worse :-)
I do know what you mean gan. Boxing wasn't the right word: labelling is better. I must listen to Headspace some more. Thanks for reminding me.
And on a different note - quite literally - I just won an auction on eBay and bought a nice Lake Placid blue Fender Squire J bass guitar.
I keep buying things.
Quite a long and complicated dance move at Leroc this evening - nailed it ... sort of :-)
I found a lady outside Leroc who'd been once a couple of weeks ago but then took fright last week and bolted. I persuaded her to come in and have another go and she enjoyed it. Convert ... oh yeah!
My new passport (now where shall I go?), driving licence, vehicle reg doc and flatmate's birthday present (multiple guitar stand) all arrived today. Phew!
This Lenoc and Ceroc gets into your blood.
I love it OD!
I would have everyone dancing, and dancing.
V
I found out yesterday that the neckbreak move that I thought sounded a trifle violent is actually neckbrake.
I'll have to ease up on the holds I'm putting on my partners.
I found out yesterday that the neckbreak move that I thought sounded a trifle violent is actually neckbrake.
I'll have to ease up on the holds I'm putting on my partners.
And this is dancing?
Ha :-) Yes.
I was going to post a link but then remembered the rules. Pah!
Hmmmm
Brake neck, neck brake move, is a shoulder stop. Leave that neck alone!
We ladies need our heads on our shoulders we look better that way. Besides you could end up with blood on your shoes.
Have you done the windmill yet? The octopus?
V
Octopus yes, windmill, not sure. Names aren't really a big part of it.
Yes but the arm moves are really neat!
V
How depressing. As if life isn't bad enough, the ******* scum have been reelected.
What on earth is wrong with the people in my country?
Oh and I've done my lower back in at Ju Jitsu.
This is such a bad day.
That's no good, OD. Your back I mean (I have no views on UK politics - spend far too much time lamenting over politics over here). Are we talking physio, remedial massage or hot compress kind of done your back in?
I've no idea. I think it was caused by lifting and twisting at Ju Jitsu and is probably a compression injury.
Re: UK politics. No, not the place for this, but it adds to my deep dissatisfaction with my lot today.
Having a rough time today.
My lower back still hurts - a lot - after Thursday's new GAL activity, Ju Jitsu. I'm taking painkillers and moving slowly.
I went to a Codependents anonymous meeting this morning, introduced myself, just looked at the uphill struggle ahead of me and cried.
The turkeys in this country voted for xmas.
WW sent me a email this afternoon about planning ahead which made me cry again.
1. You'll have got my text about the tenants moving out in June? I assume you agree we need to press ahead with putting the house on the market? You printed out some online estate agents a while back - which I'll try to locate. Let me know if you have any particular thoughts meantime.
2. The weekend of S12's birthday is not a weekend you'd be scheduled to come back here. Have you had any thoughts about that? Do you want to celebrate it with him on another weekend, or come and join us for that one? It's fine either way, but please let me know so I know what I'm saying when I discuss options with him.
3. I'm still working on the basis that the kids are coming to you in the last weekend of their half term - 29th May.
4. Are you thinking of having time with them over the Summer holidays? It's another thing it would be useful to plan.
My thoughts:
1. She has said she's not about to screw me over financially which would mean we can just sell it and split the money without recourse to lawyers. But she has lost her job and the lawyer I went to see for an initial consultation (I haven't retained him yet) said it's best to arrange financial stuff when she does have job. It would be good to sell the house, we lose money on it every month and we won't have to get new tenants.
2. At the moment i never want to see or hear from her again so i won't be celebrating S12s birthday with them. Not DBing but I'm far from that at the moment as I feel such anger and age towards her.
3. Yes
4. Of course I flippin' well am ... but I don't know when. I told my mum I would accompany her on her lifelong dream of sailing round the Norwegian fjords as she will never get another chance and I suddenly find myself relatively free. And the thought of her arranging a holiday with OM when I've got the kids makes me mad.
What I really want to reply is **** *** *** ******* **** in huge uppercase letters.
I don't want to whinge (like a typical pom - for gan & Gg). I would so much like to just snap out of it or watch those feelings, recognise them for what they are - feelings are not me and not succumb to them.
It's hard though. I can't be as busy as I'd like to be due to my back pain. I'm on my own today and feeling down. My flatmates will be back this evening and it's good to have them to talk to but I also know I'm using them to feel better. I'm not happy within myself and don't know when I will be again.
Fed up writing this now so I'll post it and wait for some 2x4s. I don't want sympathy, I feel too embarrassed by my own failure for that.
Well I would say right this minute not to respond at all,
aren't you busy doing something else anyways?
48 - 72 hour rule should be in effect.
Maybe start thinking about it(replying) on Monday.
Yup, I remember that much from DB. Yes, I am so busy at weekends ...
I haven't replied to her previous 'tenants are leaving' text a few days ago.
Hi OD, sorry you're having a rough day & hope your back is all better soon. Good for you going to Jujitsu and the Coda meeting. Will you go again do you think??
In terms of interactions with your W. I know it's hard, but does it help to try and see stuff like this as a business transaction and respond in that vein? If you take the emotion out of the response and it was a work thing, how would you respond then?
In terms of 1, it sounds as though you're happy with selling. But, I would at least arrange some free consultations with L's before you confirm to your W. Normally the advice is to only sell your main home if it is part of a full financial settlement. Your W says she's not about to screw you over financially, but believe nothing that is said and take reasonable steps to protect your interests without being aggressive about it. I just told my H that I didn't feel able to make big decisions like that without some advice.
For your S's birthday, it sounds as though you know what you want to do, and presume you'll make some nice separate plans with him.
Sounds like you are happy with three.
For four - why not just respond, yes I'll want some time with them. I need to firm up plans & will come back to you, then talk to your Mum. If she decides to go on holiday with OM, there's not much you can do about that, and best to just let go of stuff like that. Our WAS's feel no loyalty to us or the M right now and - horrible though it is - it's not something we can control...
Hope this helps OD, and hope tomorrow is a better day for you. ((OD))
I will go again ... to both.
Strictly business. Yes, I know... sigh. But I wouldn't to do business with someone I hate. And at the moment I do hate her so it's hard to take the emotion out. In fact if it was business I'd respond in a friendly manner with a view to working on a an agreeable outcome for both of us. I'll have to give it a few days before I can muster up a reply that doesn't stick in my craw.
I do want to sell. But I don't want her to do it either. I was the one who had to sort anything out with the house or tenants as she didn't want anything to do with it. Now she's lost her job, she's got more time and the tenants giving notice means we have to get a move on. I guess it makes more sense now but it still rankles.
Not knowing a thing about this, I don't know how I can protect myself. We always planned to port the mortgage and buy somewhere else but that's out of the window now. I wonder if you can split and port. And how long you can wait before buying again.
I may try and rearrange my weekends so I can fit in being nearby on my birthday and S12's but pick the boys up and take them out rather than stay. I'll think about that.
And yes, Need to firm up some plans for the summer holidays.
Thanks Toots for your support.
Can someone glance over my responses and to see if they could be improved please.
1. You'll have got my text about the tenants moving out in June? I assume you agree we need to press ahead with putting the house on the market? You printed out some online estate agents a while back - which I'll try to locate. Let me know if you have any particular thoughts meantime.
I decided (online company x) was the best one. I registered with them and filled in the details but have not instructed them to do anything yet.
There are a few things that need seeing to on the house.
I also want to take some advice for instance to see what implications there are for capital gains tax.
2. The weekend of S12's birthday is not a weekend you'd be scheduled to come back here. Have you had any thoughts about that? Do you want to celebrate it with him on another weekend, or come and join us for that one? It's fine either way, but please let me know so I know what I'm saying when I discuss options with him.
3. I'm still working on the basis that the kids are coming to you in the last weekend of their half term - 29th May.
I intend changing my weekend plan so I can be around on my birthday and S12's. I prefer to celebrate our birthdays separately whether that be on the day or another time over the respective weekends.
My schedule will be:
15-17 May @ house
22-25 May (Bank Holiday) @ house
29-31 May @ my flat
6-7 June (S12's birthday) @ house
4. Are you thinking of having time with them over the Summer holidays? It's another thing it would be useful to plan.
Yes of course. I need to firm up plans first and will come back to you.
Looks ok to me OD. Maybe drop the "of course" in the last response. A simple Yes should do. I'm not seeing any opportunities to validate but that's not my area of expertise so I'll leave it to others to chime in.
Thanks gan. Even though I feel I am emerging from a long dark rage infected period, I don't feel like validating anyway.
I don't think anyone here ever does, OD!
Hi OD. Do you want W back ? I realise how tough it is with OM in the picture but what's in your heart ? I understand the rage and anger because this was your best friend , could you put that behind you if you were given the option of W returning to M ?
I hope you don't mind me asking
Take care. Rd
Good point gan. I did say 'emerging' rather than 'emerged' :-)
I don't mind anyone asking anything rd. I believe I can put that behind me. I have thought that before and no doubt can again. In fact if I am to truly be the best I can be, then forgiveness is a must ... whatever happens.
The only trouble is I don't think I will ever get the chance.
The only trouble is I don't think I will ever get the chance.
A chance at reconciliation? Or forgiveness? Coz a chance at the latter has already arrived, OD. You can chose to forgive when ever you want. In fact I think it will release a lot of your anger if you did make this your goal.
The only trouble is I don't think I will ever get the chance.
My thought is that most posters here believe the same thing.
There sich is different blah, blah, blah.
I honestly believe that in the end the LBS does get to decide, and if you have not gotten to decide yet it is not yet the end.
Recon gan. I'm not at a forgiveness stage yet. I could try but I know my heart wouldn't be in it yet.
Aha! The bigger picture Cadet. I try so hard not to wallow in self pity as I know that's what I've done before. It doesn't always work.
Hey OD-
Just a thumbs up on the email response - simple, factual and to the point. Looks good!
Hope you're planning some lovely time with the boys this summer.
Still thinking about what to do with them raliced, but want to take them abroad somewhere.
I'm going to go on a Norwegian fjord cruise with my mum this summer too as it's something she's always wanted to do and she has no one else. I said, here's your chance, let's do it.
Norwegian fjord cruise!! I wish I lived in Europe!!!!
I honestly believe that in the end the LBS does get to decide, and if you have not gotten to decide yet it is not yet the end.
Would you mind elaborating on that just a bit Cadet? Or pointing me to a thread where it is talked about more?
I think for most of us LBS's we feel like we're in the furthest place from the driver's seat with that decision.
(sorry if I just hijacked this thread)
I think for most of us LBS's we feel like we're in the furthest place from the driver's seat with that decision.
I certainly understand how you feel as I have been where you are, I do not think there is a specific thread that says this.
It is my observation, and research that leads me to give out that advice.
I do believe that the LBS is the one that gets to decide,
as I have written on some other threads many times the LBS becomes the WAS and everything becomes flipped.
I think maybe it comes down to a boundary that finally is enforced, and the LBS finally dropping the rope and
Letting Go.
At that point the WAS has no one else to blame other than
themselves and maybe at that point decides to start
to make changes to FIX themselves.
For all along it was never about the marriage or the relationship but something that was missing within themselves.
I am not saying that each person in the marriage is
not responsible for 50%.
The LBS thinks they have no choice,
when in fact they have 50% of the choice.
Norwegian fjord cruise!! I wish I lived in Europe!!!!
North Americans are allowed too :-)
No worries. Anyone called PigPen is most welcome :-)
Email sent.
Now to hobble around the dance floor with a bad back. Not sure if I'll be able to do anything tonight but I'll see.
Thank you Cadet, I appreciate your response and all of the knowledge that you impart on here.
Email sent.
Now to hobble around the dance floor with a bad back. Not sure if I'll be able to do anything tonight but I'll see.
Well I did manage to bust some moves on Tuesday after all and it was the fourth year anniversary of the class so they brought in some guests and wheeled out a cake: which was nice.
I think for most of us LBS's we feel like we're in the furthest place from the driver's seat with that decision.
I certainly understand how you feel as I have been where you are, I do not think there is a specific thread that says this.
Cadet, I really agree when the LBS stands for the M, grows for themselves and starts to become someone only a fool would leave. The more that DB is applied the more this is the case. In the end we push ourselves to grow and learn. In many ways most threads here say that. Unless the WS has serious personality issues they must eventually emerge from their tunnel or replay. Review the damage to their own lives and then the harm to others. Then they either grow themselves, ignore it with enormous pain but stay in the worst place until it is faced. The best for the LBS is to let go of the resentment.It is my observation, and research that leads me to give out that advice.
I do believe that the LBS is the one that gets to decide,
as I have written on some other threads many times the LBS becomes the WAS and everything becomes flipped.
This is in essence how I see it too.I think maybe it comes down to a boundary that finally is enforced, and the LBS finally dropping the rope and
Letting Go.
Detachment comes first. In my case "I will no longer be abused or disrespected"At that point the WAS has no one else to blame other than
themselves and maybe at that point decides to start
to make changes to FIX themselves.
Cadet there are some WS (rather than WAS) who have personality issues and may never realise. For the great majority, this must be true, even if they repeat with yet another LBS. even if it's another round.For all along it was never about the marriage or the relationship but something that was missing within themselves.
We are all work in progress I really believe that.I am not saying that each person in the marriage is
not responsible for 50%.
The LBS thinks they have no choice,
when in fact they have 50% of the choice.
in essence we become more than we were at the start of the R. The most attractive self to ourselves and more substantial as an R partner. We outgrow the old R and the WS. We may even re attract a WAS who was dissatisfied rather than wayward. We have our choice. I believe we neither have to forgive nor forget unless we choose to. However it is best to let go of the resentment as that will cause damage to the self. Often it is necessary to hang on to forgiveness as a protection. Eventually contact with the higher power links to love, when we project love to another despite their failings we are at our best.
Eventually that must come, more in sorrow than in anger. Old Dog, WW is the mother of your children and eventually as the spiritually developed OD is becoming forgiveness will come as it must. WW will no longer be able to deflect her pain, this takes too much energy.
OD, be angry if you must for the time being. I recommend letting your higher power work on releasing your anger and resentment as it may burn you out. let it take over, link to the love in your heart and despite all project it, to yourself as well as WW and your children.
Know this OD, it is ok. When you need to be strong remember these feelings, this time as it is part of your power. Let go but if you wish to stand it is ok you stand for OD.
Dance the best dance
V
Now you see I have trouble with all this higher power stuff.
I am an atheist, so god is out of the question straight away and I also struggle with the thought of some 'universal' or inner power.
It is my belief that you are on your own. There is no higher power, it is just you. If you give yourself over to some sort of inner higher power, then that may work, and has indeed been a life saver for many, but you are just following a set of rules such as the 12 steps.
I do have power and I can exercise that power or relinquish it consciously or unconsciously, but it's mine and in alone not some magical mystical ethereal entity.
Anyway, I'm at the kids house now. I don't call this home any longer I hate being here. I've got to sleep in the same bed as she does during the week and I really don't want to, but there is no other bedroom.
I think I may remove all of my remaining clothing when I go back to the flat - and that's not home either. All bar my wedding suit and a leather jacket which she bought me on my birthday a couple of years ago. I can't see me wearing either of those again.
Maybe just think of the higher power as the part of yourself that sees more than you do with your eyes OD. Like if you look back on your life now and can find coincidences, chance meetings, and/or times when you thought you wanted something and then later realized that you're glad you never got it. And see how they all fit together in a pattern that's just slightly above your rational mind to comprehend or could comprehend at the time.
There's an intelligence to you that doesn't reside in your brain, or upstairs, but is a deeper knowing part of you that you not get to tap into often.'
Maybe that will help. Or just like you said, "I can exercise that power or relinquish it consciously or unconsciously" - when it happens unconsciously, that's what a lot of people describe was work of a higher power. It doesn't have to be outside of yourself.
Also, sorry to hear about your situation, my heart goes out to you.
Hey thanks for chipping in PigPen. I understand what your saying however, thinking about it, our unconscious brain doesn't necessarily have the best plan for us. It's our unconscious brain that follows the script that got many of us into this position in the first place.
I have a script. In it I adhere to passive and passive aggressive tendencies as well as others. I am not a leader I am co-dependent. I hate it and understand the only way to alter it is to recognise it, face it and work to change the habits of a lifetime. So it's our conscious brain that has to teach the unconscious one the 'correct' way.
It is soooo dispiriting sometimes and I feel I can't do it, or can't do it alone. There goes that co-dependency alarm. I am seeing a counsellor to try and combat it. But I am impatient too. I have lived this way all my life and I want it to stop. I have also started going to co-dependency anonymous (CoDA UK) once a fortnight. Of course, they follow the 12 steps as an offshoot of AA, so I'm going to have problems with the higher power thing there too.
-----
And on the other topic above, here I am on Saturday morning at the kids and WW's home. Just being here amongst all possessions makes me irritable and angry at the injustice. The kids aren't up yet and I don't display that in front of them anyway: in fact they help me maintain a positive metal attitude - my goodness, I realised it's months since I used that expression. I've felt so down since WW started her affair. Damn her.
"I think I may remove all of my remaining clothing when I go back to the flat - and that's not home either. All bar my wedding suit and a leather jacket which she bought me on my birthday a couple of years ago. I can't see me wearing either of those again"
Hi OD, I understand what you say in your post about home. I also don't feel I have a home as such right now. Our MH has stopped being my home, and I don't regard my rental flat as home either. I never call it home, just my flat. Now, all of that is a shame - but I am living in a warm, pleasant place with a roof over my head and food in the fridge. That's not such a bad place to be.
WRT your comments about taking stuff above. I think there's some of the passive aggressive coming through in what you propose. Leaving only your wedding suit and a present she bought you. You wouldn't be leaving those because you "won't be wearing them again." You would be leaving them as a kind of silent protest - a message to her that you are unhappy and will leave just those emotionally charged items for her to see. I think if you want to move your stuff, move it, but move it all if that's the case.
Hope you and your boys have a good weekend OD...:-)
I am going around agreeing with Toots again!
Take everything, the leather jacket can be eBay item and sold. Dump the wedding suit, in the trash if you want. No statements which are not worthy of you, ok?
Higher power if that is inner power to you so be it. OD I do believe in spirit and inner power. The higher power is that part of you which makes the best choices of all. That power is replenished so for me it is not some mythical deity or being but the combined wisdom of humanity. The following are part of my higher power in no order):
~my family and the love they have for me, particularly glam sis
~my staff and loyal clients who support me
~bestie
~gam-anon
~this board and its posters
~ those who do Ted talks, write books, provide services
~ those who listen and are kind, in the bank yesterday, the doctor, my counsellors
~myself
Oh yes and even poor damaged H, there is much wisdom to be learned
This extends beyond those here now to those who influence from the past, the writers of articles, books, Al Turtle, MWB and many others. An endless continuum from the beginning to time to the end of it. A collective conciousness of higher power of which the inner part is tiny and part of me.
OD it is comforting to know that whatever happens, that power is freely available to you, especially in the days when we struggle.
The way I think of it, Toots, Pg by posting to you are all part of that power helping to replenish your inner pool of power
V
WRT your comments about taking stuff above. I think there's some of the passive aggressive coming through in what you propose. Leaving only your wedding suit and a present she bought you. You wouldn't be leaving those because you "won't be wearing them again." You would be leaving them as a kind of silent protest - a message to her that you are unhappy and will leave just those emotionally charged items for her to see. I think if you want to move your stuff, move it, but move it all if that's the case.
Hope you and your boys have a good weekend OD...:-)
Ha ha. Bang on Toots me dear. I was also thinking of shredding her wedding dress :-)
I did think of taking them to the charity shop, but then passive aggressiveness kicked in.
I'm also considering selling my wedding ring which I took of a few months ago.
And thanks both.
I realise, I also hate it here because she is not here: she is with the b*****d.
she is not here: she is with the b*****d.
There is actually an advantage to that.
She is HIS problem, not yours.
One of the things overlooked is that the person in crisis
latches on to another person,
they need that other person to provide for ALL of their needs.
For some reason that is when things really start to unravel.
Two broken people do not make one whole person.
Make yourself whole Old Dog,
that is objective #1.
Nice profile pic Cadet :-)
Maybe I think abut this too much - gasp! But I do think, in a way, I am helping them by pushing together.
He has been divorced for years and she has shown no sign whatsoever of seeking any reconciliation. She is determined and has always been proud of that trait.
Who knows though. I can't do anything about that. It takes a lot of my strength and resolve not to scrawl what I think about her on the bedroom wall or shred all her clothes.
If I still lived here, I would have thrown her out.
Damn! This place doesn't half change me into Mt Angry.
Nice profile pic Cadet :-)
Maybe I think abut this too much - gasp! But I do think, in a way, I am helping them by pushing together.
Actually as usual counter intuitive.
Best affair busting strategy IS to push them together.
An affair born out of cheating is very likely to self destruct.
You need to help more to push them together - good job!
Oh and thanks for the comment about my plane,
that is the one that I flew for 3000 hours!
Counter intuitive is the way. Must remember this.
That's a big plane: you're so manly :-)
I flew a chipmunk for about 25 minutes when I was about 18.
i flew a kite once! Does that count at all?
v
Yes, that counts ... as long as it was 'up to the highest height'.
Cadet has hit a nail on the head here. How many times do you here of people having affairs who actually end up as a happy couple? At my workplace one guy was messing with a girl 16 years his junior. So, he left his wife for her, within six months she got bored, wife didn't want him back and due to his position within the company, and his lack of work whilst he was 'busy' with his new woman, he lost his post. So, out of the house, out of work, no partner and the kids won't talk to him.
Essence of story is, it's exciting to kick off with, but, when reality bites and the temperature cools down, you have lost it all for nothing.
Have hope. Unless there is abuse etc. use Sandi's rules to tempt them back.
Yes, that counts ... as long as it was 'up to the highest height'.
Oh yes.
V
It's my birthday tomorrow. I plan to pick up my kids and go to my mum's until Sunday morning when I'll return them because she wants to take them to her brothers.
WW usually leaves the house before I get there and returns after I've gone. This time there may be a danger that I bump into her ... or she may leave a card and or present for me.
My state of mind at the moment means I hate her guts and don't trust myself not to tell her to her face nor rip up any card in her face and dump any present straight in the bin.
As if by magic, here's an email I just received.
I've arranged to take the children to Suffolk on Sunday, as you know. So I could do with them being back here by 11 please.
Have a good birthday. The children's presents were selected by them, not by me. So hopefully you'll take them in the spirit in which they were intended.
Arranged. But not with me. She just told me.
I so nearly replied.
You didn't arrange your brother's with me, you just informed me what you are doing. Thanks for that.
As I said it's about when S15 gets out of bed.