Hi There,
I have been reading many posts and forums since end of Aug/14 and have been learning more in these few months then I learned all my life.
My husband gave me the D request on 7/26/14 - We have been married for 18 years on 12/14/14. We have three boys, 20, 16 and 14. I heard those words that are so famous on the boards - I love you a lot, but not the same way I use to love you. Well I have been in Limbo since then and we have been best friends, best lovers and very close since then. I decided to write so I can get some help of how to handle my situation in a way that will reinforce my will, my spirit and with or without my husband I will continue my life. I don't know if he has any affair at this point, he doesn't behave like he has but I am not sure, lots happen during this time and he moved out of the house on 10/31/14. H has been out of the house for a week but I got text messages almost every day, he called me friday morning and asked if we could meet to talk, I asked what he wanted to talk and he said about us, our lives. I was shaking all day long. I though he would just list his decisions and tell me he was filling for D now, but nothing, basically he just told me he checked the price of our house and that's it. We talked about what is going on in our jobs, we talked about my niece's birthday party, kids, more of his work, during the time we were talking I answer a text message and told him I need to get going. We talked a little more and towards end I mention that it was weird that for a long time we did not do this, meet just the two of us, drink some wine and talk and he said that it was strange I mention this because he was just thinking about this while he was waiting for me. He thank me a few times for spending some time with him to talk. He walked to my car and gave me a big, long hug and a kiss. I do not know what to think, maybe it is my DBing working, maybe he is still not believing in my changes, or maybe he is more lost then I thought. I notice he was somewhat sad, not beaten up but kind a poor dog eyes.
H was very polite and I still feel that he loves me, not D talking, no decisions,just talk. Crazy hum?
On saturday H came to pick up the boys for a fun afternoon and to give me some free time. I asked the boys to be ready so he wouldn't wait for them. H came into the house, he was happy and was very nice, gave me a hug and kiss on the chic, asked how I was doing. My S14 also mention that I told him H would pick him up by 1am when I arrived close to midnight, H just looked at me and said Oh! you got home kind a late then. H sent me a text saying that they would eat outside, when they came back H came in again, more hug and kiss. He said that the boys had fun. He start leaving and remember his clean with tshirts, socks and underwear. I gave it to him and helped him to put in a bag. H gave me a hug and kiss, then said he would use the restroom, when back he gave me another hug and kiss, we walked together outside the house and he put his bag in the car, walking back to me and gave me another hug and kiss, his face was sad, I could say it felt he didn't want to leave, he went to his car and and I went inside the house and close the before he was gone. I did not hear from him on sunday. Today I sent him a text to find out if he would pick up the kids from school and he answered me right away that he could do it. He also did text that it was snowing outside. By 7pm he called and I missed the call, I called him back to find out what he wanted and he asked me to take the kids to school tuesday morning, we talked a little bit about the snow for the next day and we end the call.
I really don't know what is going on, I wounder if my DBing is working so well and H is always contacting me. I don't know what to think about his attitude but as difficult as it is I am not calling or initiating anything with him, I am GAL but I don't know what to do next.
S14 wants to change cell phone and spoke w/h about it. H called by 6pm yesterday and wants to stop by the house to talk about the cell phones, then asked if I was cooking and if he could have dinner with us. He came in and was acting as usual. Gave me a hug and a kiss, talked about work a little and I was not talking much, just finishing dinner. H was talking football with the kids then came and set up the table, also as usual with him as the big daddy. After dinner he sat on the cough talking to S14 about the phone, then he starting getting ready to leave. At this point I did talk to him about the phones and he asked me to call once I get out of work and we will all meet at the store to get all 5 phones, I am surprised he will get all of us on the bill. I also asked if he gave some thinking about the house and explain again that I want to keep the house and not move to any rental, that I do not want to disrupt my kids live more then what we have been doing for the past 4 months and he agreed, he won't make any problem about this. Great! Then he said he would be picking up the kids to school next morning and I said that I could do it since the roads are very icy and it is very cold. He said he wanted to do because next week he won't be helping me since he is traveling. I asked if he was going to Mexico for business and he said that no, that he was going on vacation, I asked where and he told he would rather not tell me details. I asked if he was going with someone and he said no, he will go and meet someone. H doesn't know that I know he is going to France where his brother lives. He said he does not want to talk much about because he does not know exactly what he is doing. I then said that if he is meeting someone is because he started all this while being with me and he insist that he does not have any R with another person at this point, that needs to do this to find out what is going on with him. I was very angry hearing all this but kept my cool to find out more and try to understand what he is doing. I told him I do not want surprises and want him to be honest with me and he said he will never do anything to disrespect me because he really cares about me and I am the only person he will love and treasure forever. Yeah right! Well, he is going in his adventure to spend a week vacation in France with God knows who and I was saving money to pay bills because we can't afford to be to extravagant right now. The book DB and DR are right, one in this situation needs to GAL and have a good look at yourself and stop letting the WAS to take advantage on you. I realized that it is time to have a good look in the mirror and really find who I am and who I want to be. I know it is hard to hear all this from a man that does not even want to put divorce papers, a college kid that took his clothes and a few belongs and think that he has his freedom and has the right to rock 4 peoples lives. It is not easy for now until this bloody divorce is done, but I will find myself again, a woman that has been sleeping inside me playing mommy and wife and I will be happy again, no matter what. I don't get why he wants to be so connect to me right now, I asked him time and space to regroup and he just don't stop calling, text and seeing me, any excuse and he is in the picture. Well, who knows what will happen, I am a person of faith and right now I will put my pain in God's hands and try to be happy with my kids and start a new journey in my life, the new me start today, one day at time and I will find peace inside me again. And if H comes back, well I will think about this then, right now he is the worst person in the world and I am hurt because of him. I will go dark, I need to be away from all his drama for awhile. Hope one day I get to share some thoughts with the folks around here that gives advices and encouragement. Hugs to all!
Pink17
This week has been very hard. I know H is in Paris w/OW, I even had an idea who it is. Someone from his work. It hurts. I am trying my best, and really trying to exercise everything I have been learning from the threads I read, the advises that are given to other broken hearts that are here. As a matter of fact this is the place I find comfort. It will be nice when I start getting some replies. I have been working, exercising, I went to the bank to get some info on my house because I do not want to sell the house. H spoke about selling it and I said I do not want, he said it is fine w/him, that we will see. He will probably try to get some agreement in some other way. H changed so much in these last months, it's like he is another person. At least H sent a text to the kids saying that if they need anything they can call him. Sometimes the though of him w/OW feels like killing me inside, it feels like it is a nightmare that won't end. My three boys and me just came back from the gym, it feels good to work out and make me sleep well too. Besides, it feels good to be in shape, look good. The boys and I decided to go to the mountains for the Thanksgiving weekend, have some fun together, they are troopers and we all get along very well. H doesn't know our plans, I don't even know if he will care much about. It will be the first Thanksgiving that H is not home and I think it's good we are not in a house. I know I will be OK with H or without, I need time to heal and God to guide me. It just feels so difficult to believe that there is any chance for my M. With all what is going on since it all started I don't even know if I can forget, forgive...Am I going to be that strong and have such a spirit to just put everything in the past? I don't know yet.
This week has been hard, knowing that S is on vacation w/OW in Paris is hard to swallow, but I do not know what is going on in reality. H did text kids on last monday that if they need anything to call his cell - he called the S20 and S14 on wednesday to say that he is planning to see them on sunday 11/23.
What should I do, be around so I can talk to him a little? or totally ignore him and make sure he does not even see me?
I am still not sure if this is some MLC or he fell for OW since we had so many challenges since last year.
I read some very difficult situations here and yet it was possible to rescue the M. Do you think there is any hope for me?
Love if someone would share some advice...
Hi. Just a quick post to say there is always hope. Try not to mind read about what your H is doing b/c it will only wreck your head. Try to deal with facts and not what you THINK. Sorry your here but there are some very helpful vets who will offer great advice. Take care
Hi Pink 17. I'm really sorry to hear about your situation. It sounds as though you are doing some helpful things to get through this - and good that your boys are so supportive too - bless them. I was like you in the first period of time - my H had admitted his A - and we talked a lot about our marriage and why this happened.
I thought he might decide to end the A, but he hasn't. He too is involved with a former colleague, and flies off around the world to see her - even though their R doesn't sound at all happy...which hurts! After a few months, I decided to withdraw and he & I haven't spoken for some time now. Not sure whether this is for the best, but we'll see...
Some bizarre things have happened recently, and he has shown some lack of regard and consideration. Very out of character for him - and I too wonder if this is a MLC for him.
If the A is continuing, it is important to set some clear boundaries for yourself. Mine were - I won't live with you, or be involved in a R with you, whilst you are involved with someone else. I haven't regretted holding true to that one. I know now that I could have 'tempted' H back into a sexual relationship, and he would have carried on seeing OW too, which would have been awful.
What do you think led to your H being vulnerable to an A in your M? Have you read DB and DR? I would start with DR if I were you. Also, recognise that there is probably not much you can do about things for now in respect of him, the A or your M - other than not make them worse. What makes them worse? Lots of talking, reasoning, I love you's, pleading, talking of all our good times etc. I read somewhere - at this time, your H is operating purely on emotion - reason will never trump that. He may ultimately turn back to your M, but things are on a course that has to 'run the course' now.
Best to do things for you and your boys right now. What are your GAL activities? You'll need some for sanity purposes...and for showing your H that you can move forward alone. Just one point from your posts...are you doing his laundry for him still? If so....I would stop that right now. Having an A has consequences, one of which is you'll have to do your own laundry!
Time will tell what will happen. The stats on A's leading to marriage are grim, and most affairs implode after a period of time. But you don't want to sit and hope for that. You want to move (slowly and painfully - but with some joy in there too, I've found) towards the person you want to be - no matter what ultimately happens with your H.
You sound like a lovely woman and your H sounds like a decent man (like mine was - is?) This suggests possible MLC to me. I found some of the info from Hearts Blessing to be helpful to me.
Good luck to you anyway....I'll keep in touch with your sitch from over the pond!
Toots x
Thanks rd500! I have been trying. I noticed that when I get very busy I feel better about this whole situation. Going to the Gym with the boys are helping. I talk to some close friends, I am seeing a therapist, just booked a hotel to go to Glenwood Springs over the Thanksgiving break, which I think will be a blast with the boys. They too need some break from all this crazy situation and I think will be a way to relax and have some fun.
H does not know we know he was in Paris, visiting his brother and OW. Last time we spoke he said he was going somewhere to see someone, and he didn't want to say anything about because he did not know what he was doing. I said to him that if he was going to meet someone over a week vacation then it is because he was with that person for quite a while, even when he was with me. He said he was not, he is not and doesn't even know if he will be with someone, he just know he need to do this now.
Sometimes I feel like my biggest pain is the rejection, to be damped, to be replaced, I feel I gave so much for this M and now he just gets out and go have fun. Sometimes I feel I love him to death and other times I feel I just don't want to see him anymore in my life. Ahhh!
I don't know what to do next. I know somethings I need to do like getting a lawyer, but I keep postponing, almost like some miracle will happen. H will came to get the boys on sunday, what do I do? Do I talk to him? So far, we are friends, he hugs me and give me a kiss always when we see each other. But I am stock, I don't know what to do now, should I be his friend and welcome him with a smile or just be out of the house while I know he will be there?
I think I am still in denial, I really need to work on my GAL and 180s. I feel I am not doing this right. I feel quite lost.
Hi Toots!What led my M to this point... My oldest son was having some depression problems a little over three years ago, he was diagnosed with ADHD and started taking some medication, at some point his doctor changed the meds and he end up in a hospital for a week, he lined three times and we were given no hope for him to came back, it was devastating, but he made it. Right after, my S17 best friend (he was like my own kid) committed suicide, it was extremely painful and now I was dealing with my S18 depression. He did not want to have friends for a long, long time. On 12/24/13 S20 was finally diagnosed with Bipolar disorder. It was when he tried to kill himself, to hurt himself, that things started getting really bad. I would spend hours talking to him, giving support, holding his hands and praying, sometimes all night long.
To make things worse, my little one, the S14 had whooping cough (he had the vaccine), he was out of school for 50 days. At this point I felt drained, tired, I now recognize now that I was very depressed, sad, hopeless. H start getting very distant, he would come home from work, talk a little, eat dinner with us and then go to the bedroom very early. I did not have time for him for a while, and he decided I did not love him anymore and that's why I was not giving him the attention. I said to him many times that I would like to go to counseling and have my words translated to him in a way he would understand that I do love him, I just have too many things to deal with. I asked him to take some things of my plate for awhile but his selfishness did not allow him to help, to understand... he was thinking about himself and how life was stressful at work and at home, that his career was not the way he wants it to be and that his boss was in his way to success. That he wanted more romance but I was always busy doing house work, kids. He decided to withdraw from the problems we were facing at that time. I felt very alone, many decision were my alone, I felt insecure and afraid of the future. S20 was in a hospital for a week again and this time because he was trying suicide again. H took the other 2 boys and spent the week in the mountains, doing his snowboarding, can you believe that?
So I have lots of resentments, pain, anger...
Fortunately, the boys are doing better now, they are each others friends and help each other all the time. And now, they help me.
About my GAL. I do work part time, what I like a lot, and was told do not change my job situation until I know better if there will be a divorce or not. In my job I help people with serious problems, patients that do not have limbs. I do see a lot of hope and courage every day coming from folks that already lost so much.
I am going to the gym at least three times a week - lost 27lbs already... everyone says I am looking very good.
Signed up to volunteer for the Salvation Army Christmas bell ringer, go to church every sunday and sometimes talk to some friends after mass. Have a support group for hurting individuals during the Holidays to attend. I see a therapist every week and love it, he is pro marriage, but believes that I need to work on myself first. Have a prayer group that meets every wednesday, it's more like getting together with some nice friends to talk to God and ourselves about our lives. And I am always trying to do my best to find something to do if I have a day off, like next week short vacation trip to the mountains.
I would say my next goal is to call an attorney and set up an appointment and I want to go back to school, I have a bachelors degree in Languages, but I need to find out what I want next.
And you are right Toots, I can't do much about my selfish H.
And I cried, begged, etc just one time and then my pride was such that I refuse to be the victim. Soon after the bomb I found DB website, I have DB and DR and read both and keeping reading again and again.
Amazing as it is, what has been helping me is this board, I keep thinking about Labug's words of wisdom and it comforts me, it makes me feel that even without the dinosaur my life will go on.
If you have any other advise or idea to improve my situation, please do, I need to learn a lot, try, improve... thanks for all your help and caring
Hugs to all.
Hi Pink. You recent troubles with your S20 are very hard to read I am not a vet so please take what I say as general advice with no expertise behind it. It sounds like you H just can't or won't cope with the issues in his life You sound amazing and. Is you have this crap to deal with. If you read Sandi2 oats it gives an insight to a WASs mind. They just don't think like you expect them to. All we can do is improve us and carry on and get / enjoy our life.
The rejection and replacement feelings you have , we all share. For me it's hard to believe my W and I are where we are. If you had asked me 11 months ago could this happen I would have laughed
As per my other post , your imagination is your worst enemy at this time. Stay focused on each moment and not what could happen or might have happened. The is a long journey for all of us and we can only deal with it as happens. By imagining what is going to happen we are causing ourselves more pain than we maybe have to.
Your H has caused your pain but by over thinking it you are now causing yourself more pain
Please take care and enjoy those boys of yours
Amazing as it is, what has been helping me is this board, I keep thinking about Labug's words of wisdom and it comforts me, it makes me feel that even without the dinosaur my life will go on.
I'm with you there Pink17. This board is what has helped me most these days too.
And thank you for mentioning a support group for people hurting during the holidays. I had never heard of that and will try to find one for myself.
You helped me today just by mentioning that. Thank you Pink17.
The support group is from my church, the group is formed by people that needs to grieve during this difficult time. It's not only for divorced ones, there are people grieving the loss of a loved one, illness w/no hope for cure, you name it. I don't know if you are religious or not, but many churches offered this kind of service at no cost and for everyone, with faith or not, member or not.
Hope you can find one in your area and feel a little better about yourself during the Holydays.
Good Luck!
I'm sorry to hear about the hard times your boys have had - and great that they are doing so well now. I'm not so sure now about possible MLC. My understanding is that it comes more 'out of the blue' - whereas you and your H have had some big challenges in your lives recently.
I too feel much better when I have been out doing things. It is easier to feel more optimistic when you have been busy and your mind has been off things. I meditate daily now, and am slowly reading Full Catastrophe Living by Jon Kabat Zinn, which has helped me feel more calm and centred. It has also helped me not having contact with H recently as he has decided to continue the A relationship...although it sounds very rocky from what I hear about it.
I have eased off on work in recent months. I have been doing some, but not as much as I usually would, and not the high pressure stuff, so that has helped. One of the best things I have done has been to volunteer at a local bookstore a couple of times a week. I love the shifts I do there & it is very laid back and friendly.
Like you, I find this site very helpful, and you really pick up some things that stay with you. 'Aiming for better, not bitter' is one that struck a chord recently. Plus I think the same advice delivered again and again, it really sinks in.
I also go to an infidelity support group, which has been interesting. There is a mix of folk, most of whom have reconciled with their spouse who cheated...so that has been good.
It's still very up and down though - and our situation feels pretty bleak at the moment. It is hard to like my H just now, given recent behaviour. And it really does help keep you sane, just focusing on 'you.' I have been seeing an IC too - she is lovely, and that has helped.
You say you feel stuck, but recognise that you are dealing with one of the most difficult things you will ever come across - and you are doing really, really well. Each day is another day - some will be better, some will be worse, but you will get there...
Good for you booking a Thanksgiving trip.....enjoy yourselves! Toots :-)
Thanks rd500, HPoirot and Toots for the kind words.
I feel kind of anxious today, knowing that H will be back tomorrow. But I have been thinking a lot about the whole detaching aspect. I am beginning to think that this is the only way to claim my sanity. By other hand I feel this fear of letting go and find myself not loving him anymore.
Since end of July we had the best R, even honeymoon wasn't so good. We could talk more openly and our love was without shame, boundaries... it was amazing. And all those beautiful moments just to split. What a H.ll does this all mean?
But you are right rd500, I need to stop thinking too deep into my own imagination and take one day at a time.
Toots, it looks we have somewhat the same situation. So my heart goes out to you because I know you are hurting right now. I do believe that time will be my best friend. What is really hard for me is that I have been very black and white my whole life and I like to resolve things. Right now I can't resolve anything. I can just wait. It bothers me that I never made myself financially independent and now I need him to pay for most of all we need. It feels like a giant rock inside my shoe.
One thing I have decided, I will be his friend, at least for now, I need to be calm and keep my thinking straight so if it all goes to divorce, I will know how protect my boys and I financially.
Toots, it's great that you have been moving forward and finding ways to piece your life together. Sometimes I even feel happy with my freedom, all the things I have been learning, my stronger faith, new friends like you guys...
It has been enjoyable to find myself again. I always loved who I was, I am a strong person, I do not waste my time with people that don't like me, I let them go... Life has been hard lately, but little by little I will meet my own self again and will be able to smile, be happy for a change.
The hard part is that I love my H with all my heart and found out that I love him even more then I tough.
I still didn't decide what to do on sunday when he picks up the boys. What would you advise me?
Since it all started I do not call, text, ask for anything, it's always him that initiate, and by the way, he did everyday. Just this week he did not contact me, it's the first time in our lives that we go a week without any communication. I am not sure that I need to hide, go so dark he can't remember I am there. Or maybe I try to be (as much as I can) friendly, respectful, light?
The Thanksgiving trip will probably bother him, but I refuse to give in and wait around for him. I am a big girl and do not need his permission to be happy, period.
Love to all of you. I will read your posts this weekend and try my best to help the way I can.
Today was a good day, worked a lot, had a very good meeting w/IC. He was glad to here some of my progress, was also glad I am getting some support from this forum, he said I am actually doing very well and should be proud of myself.
I told him I am worry that I am angry and get angrier just thinking of H, I do not want to feed this kind of feeling because I will end up hurting myself down the road. I also told him that sometimes I feel like crying but it's harder and harder to drop a tear. He said to try to let go and be vulnerable, cry on my pillow and if it does not happen until next meeting in two weeks, then we will need to work on that. He doesn't want me to start walking towards depression.
What your IC is saying is important. Getting the anger and the pain out is healing for you. If they remain inside, it can be more damaging in the longer turn.
Watching tearjerker movies might be helpful - or just allow yourself to wallow from time to time and have a cry if you feel like it. I find my IC appointments helpful, partly as I tend to cry quite a bit at them!
For anger, I put pillows on the bed, and I bash them with a rolled up newspaper. I pretend they are H or OW, and I swear, rant and bash away at them for 5 mins or so. I read in a book that this might be helpful. Normally afterwards, I do feel a sense of release and calm. It is a way of getting in touch with your anger without causing harm.....tho I suggest waiting until the house is empty ;-)
Your IC is absolutely right. You are doing really well. It's a horrible situation, but your head is above water, you're looking after your boys and you are moving forwards. Those are the main things right now - remember to be compassionate towards yourself and acknowledge the progress you are making.
Thanks Toots,
That's one of my biggest mistakes, I am too hard on myself... my H always said that too. I will try to be more gentle w/myself and give some time.
I feel my heart accelerating today, I still don't know what to do tomorrow, be around or not? I really would like to see how is him after his vacation in Paris, but I am afraid to see him all happy. Any though on that?
Well, I can easily think of what not to do - cry, ask about OW, beg him to stay, grab hold of his ankles as he's walking out of the door...I'm sure none of these will happen of course!
I suppose the books would say to aim for 'lovingly distant.' Be pretty busy when he comes over. Show him by your demeanour - hey this has happened, but I'm still standing. Come across as centred and balanced.
Talk about the boys and what they have been up to. Talk about your GAL activities. Look good and smell nice.
And try not to worry about it all too much. Maybe just focus on not doing stuff that will make anything worse. And be the person you want to be without worrying too much about him right now.
Hope this helps....and good luck :-)
Thanks Toots,
This helps a lot, you are right saying I will not beg, cry, or hold his ankles.. nope, I have too much pride for that kind of demonstrations. I did beg and cry once, just when he gave me the speech..."H: I do love you a lot and will always love you, I am just not in love with you anymore, not the same way at least, but I will always care for you, to the rest of my life, I will always be there for you" Yeah! Crap!
I will do my best, I want to be his friend, most because I need to look after my boys and my financial stability if the divorce comes. And as far as I know he is thinking to serve me papers next month, we will see.
I am somewhat feeling OK, I think is because he travels a lot for work, so we are used with him being away frequently.
You know, I was born and raised in Brasil and I met my H at a sales meeting in Extapa, Mexico, we use to work for the same company, he in USA. Now, the story repeats itself for him, he is involved with a coworker from France, same company.
It hurts, hurts and hurts...but I believe that the wound will heal one day, it will take quite a good time, but I will get there no matter what.
I will do what you said, "lovingly distant". He knows me well and I do not need words for him to know I still love him. I just need to show him I am too moving on.
By the way, when this all started, I asked the kids if they would like to move somewhere in UK. They loved the idea, my S17 was in London last year, a 10 days vacation and loved it. The english I learned in Brasil was more British then american. Funny how life is, now you are helping me.
Life is really awesome if you think about it... and the world is very, very big for us to suffer so much for somebody that does not love us.
Thanks for your kind words, it means a lot to me.
Hope you are also finding peace within yourself.
Pink
H is back. Text this morning: "Good Morning! Hope that all is well. I was wondering if it would be OK to take the boys out for late lunch/early dinner this afternoon, like 3 or 4pm? If you all are busy, we can do another day, no problem. Plz let me know. Thanks!
Me after 30 min.: Good Morning! All is well...thanks! Hope all is well w/you. The boys will be ready by 4pm.
H: Ok. I'll see you then. Thank you.
And I still don't know what to do... I am getting so positive and strong on myself, on my GAL. But I know when he show up I feel the pain again. Maybe would be easier if I am not home, maybe I will see him when he drop off the boys.
I feel hopeless today... I need to be patient, patient, patient, and keep some of the vets words in my head, do what works and do "as if" and the 180s.
At least we can talk to each other, but today I know that he is coming back from a vacation with the OW, this kills me and makes me jealous and I feel I just want to file for D and never see him again in my life. Utopia! We have kids together and this R will be forever, no matter what.
I need to get real, but I feel like spinning.
Any help from someone?
By the way, my goal is to maintain some level of friendship with him, so if the D comes around as it is supposed to it won't be ugly for the kids, and it is always a way to show him my changes, my new me, at least make him think.
I need to cry and I can't, I need to calm down and I can't, all what I feel today is defeat. I feel like it is all lost. Oh! God help me, I wonder if I can go through this, it's easier to just let go and move on, it's so hard to try again, to work on the R without any reassurances.
How you deal with these feelings?
Hi Pink 17
So, how did it go yesterday? I'm sorry I didn't manage to reply last night - but hopefully you got through it ok, even if you were feeling a bit wobbly. Which is understandable in the circumstances.
And even if it didn't go as you hoped, remember that we don't all get it right all of the time. These are difficult times and we have to be compassionate with ourselves.
I just wanted to clarify. How do you know about OW anyway? I'm not sure if you explained that earlier? And, although he knows that you are concerned about a possible OW, he doesn't know that you know - is that right?
And at this point he hasn't admitted to an OW?
I think the 'friends' thing is challenging. I tried to do that with my H. But I found it tough. I'm not his friend, I'm his W, and he has betrayed our vows. At one stage, he started confiding in me about how difficult his R with OW is. How she can be distant, he doesn't feel cherished, and she doesn't always treat him well.
At that point, that was it for me. I couldn't be that confidante for him, and I told him so. He understood and acknowledged he had probably said too much about her. For now, I think he regards our R as 'over.' And has told others this too, which hurts. but I also know that things are extremely rocky with OW. She is still abroad with OM in the picture. H is issuing ultimatums to her....so we'll see.
Time and patience will tell for all of our sitches...
Need Help! H just called and wants to confirm if the kids and I are going to the Mountains to spend the Thanksgiving weekend. I told him that yes and that he is welcome to join us there. H said that no, that I can spend time with the kids.
H offer to take care after the dog and I said we are taking the dog with us.
Then he asked if it would be OK if he comes to the house to gather some paperwork, like tax returns, bills. I told him I would feel better if he does that when we are home.
He got very upset, and spoke very angry saying that he just want to help with this whole situation, that he told me what he is doing and this would make things easier for everyone.
He also asked if would be OK for him to have lunch with the boys tomorrow and I said that I have no problem with it, asked if he spoke with the kids and he said again very angry, that he was just talking to me about this, just making plans the right way.
I don't get, I have been dark forever, I don't call, don't text, don't give him a hard time, wasn't even home yesterday when he picked up the boys and was not home when he came back from dinner.
So why the h**l is he so mad with me. Like I did something wrong?
I just figure that I need to learn this boundaries business. He is the one that left me, cheated on me, has an affair, took vacations with his lover and now I get the bad mood, the yelling and anger.
Agh.. I just wish he explode in a million pieces. Sometimes I just wonder if would be just fine to do this idiot D and finish this nightmare.
He wants to be my friend, and I am now finding out that he just want to be friends to make his life easier. He is not thinking about his family. Love and hate walk very close... Oh, my heart hurts... how someone that not too long ago was saying he loves you and now is doing all this crazy. I wish I just hate him, would make everything much easier.
I think maybe he got angry because you were setting a boundary with - I'd prefer that you only come to the house when I am there.
He has probably been pleasant to date because you have been friendly and not making any demands or making his life difficult in any way.
WAS don't like boundaries - and may react to them - but you are quite entitled to have boundaries. And if this one matters to you, stick to it.
However, also work on maintaining a pleasant, 'lovingly distant' demeanour. So, when you set boundaries, try and do it in this way.
Hang on in there - and remember to keep GAL and working on detachment...it all takes time and patience, but you'll get there.
Toots :-)
Hi Toots,
I agree with you. He didn't expect boundaries from me. He never had to deal with it. I am a very open person, I do not have secrets.
H will be very angry when he finds out I changed the locks. Yeah, I think he will go to the house even if I asked him not to and he will stay there all four days we will be out. So, I decided to change the locks tonight.
H rented a room on someone's house and found out later on that they have a cat and four dogs. H has allergies and asthma and he has a very hard time w/cats.
Well, for 18years I have the house very clean so he would never have asthma, now it is not my problem anymore.
I am trying to maintain a pleasant R with him during this time, but it seems that the more I detach, the angrier he gets.
Probably his R w/OW is going well and he really needs to move on w/D... mind reading.
I really don't know him anymore, I am doing my best to be strong for the kids and myself.
I keep saying to myself that there is the practical side that I need to focus without any feelings... I need to look after our financial stability, our house, our future (the kids and mine).
H wants to sell the house and use the money to get some small place for himself and said that I can easily find a rental for me and the kids...Nope, thanks, I won't do that. I will keep the house no matter what.
Toots, you asked me how I know about the OW. End of 7/14 when he dropped the D bomb, he said he had feelings for someone, that he was not in an affair, and never had anything to do with this person, but he though she had feelings for him too.
Later, talking to him I asked if it was a coworker and he said sort of it. Then he got a airplane ticket on his miles but charged the taxes on our bank card. I called and found out the ticket was for France. His brother lives in Paris. I did some snooping (maybe bad for me) and found out that he has a lady in his welcome sales meetings list that leaves in Paris, is 50y old, has two older kids (25,22) and she is divorced.
That I know it is her, no. But I have a gut feeling it is.
I asked H to came clean with me and just talk very clear about this whole thing, but he does not want. He wants me to just understand that our marriage is over and there will never be us again. He is done for good and moving on and wish that I move on too. Hurts... I am read 37 rules and try my best to detach and not worry about what he says, but sometimes I feel like it is all he wants and he is not coming back.
I am confused...
Pink -
First thanks for stopping in on my thread and showing support. I appreciate it.
Second -- what does your state say about changing the locks on the house? I'm assuming both of you own it? The reason I ask -- I checked on changing the locks when H was in the full throes of his anger. I found that until we were legally separated (with documentation in place) or one of us was off the deed -- I could change the locks but my H would have no ramification if he decided to break in. My cop friend told me that he could break in, trash the house, etc and there would be nothing I could do, because he owned the house as well.
Just a friendly warning!
Thanks a lot Calibri,
Checked about the locks and there is no law against changing the locks but if I am not divorced yet or at least legally separated where the court tells who will stay in a house until the divorce is done, then the S can brake in the house.
You are a blessing, because it does not makes any difference, H can come into the house any time he wants. He can have the key and even came unannounced if he wants to.
Hope you're having a better day today. Mine is being hard today.
I will visit your posts later today.
Hang in there sunshine!
Hi Pink 17. I would also urge some caution about the locks. Best not to do any drastic things that will inflame the situation right now.
It is still very early days for you both. And whilst he is saying 'that's it for us etc.' and I'm sure that is what he 'believes' he wants right now - he is probably in affair fog/fantasy land.
And if she lives in Paris - that's a heck of a long way away - much like my H and his OW. But let's remember - he and she may be 'living the dream' right now. But their R has only existed in an affair 'bubble' thus far. Reality will gradually intrude, and if this is like most A's, their R won't survive.
Do you know the stats? Around 70% of M's survive A's. Whilst only around 5% of A's end up as M's and of those M's around 75% end in divorce. Those are dismal stats if you are having an A - and it is all very much in favour of M's.
But time and patience are so important. Things need to run their course....as people say. You have to go t-h-r-o-u-g-h it, there's no other way. And the best way to survive going through it is to work on the things you can control - you, and your life!
Toots :-)
Thanks Toots,
I think it is hard to just acknowledge that it is all happening right now.
Folks here are right... one day you feel you can take the world and the other you feel like garbage.
Because of his shouting yesterday, I feel like crap today. Need to go home and start packing, maybe some fun with my kids will be just what I need.
I won't change the locks... I am stubborn too. It's good I have good friends here so I can remember why I am here in the first place.
Besides, he thinks I am going to the Mountains for revenge and to punish him, so it could make things much worse with the whole lock issue. Ok, no messing up w/locks.
Toots, even when the odds are not exactly against me, I just feel that he is so done with me. But I am reading again and again Sandy's 37 rules, trying to believe that there is hope.
You know, from 7/26/14 to 10/31/14 we have a R better then when on honeymoon. I actually never had a most beautiful love. He was always very caring, nice, gentle. I still don't understand how H could make love with such passion, love and intensity if he didn't feel anything about me?
Does anyone knows why they do this?
I tough it was guilty at first, but it wouldn't last so long, then I tough was a goodbye, but again he did not leave very fast. Can't get it and I would like to understand.
Probably some vets would say, "it does not matter right now, you need to move forward, do your GALs and keep an eye on the prize" RIGHT??
Thanks ladies, my day is better just because of you!
[quote=Pink17]
You know, from 7/26/14 to 10/31/14 we have a R better then when on honeymoon. I actually never had a most beautiful love. He was always very caring, nice, gentle. I still don't understand how H could make love with such passion, love and intensity if he didn't feel anything about me?
Does anyone knows why they do this?
I would love to know this too. How did H sleep next to me every night, have great sex, talk about throwing parties at our new house - our future together if he was checked out of the marriage and done?
Probably some vets would say, "it does not matter right now, you need to move forward, do your GALs and keep an eye on the prize" RIGHT??
It would be interesting to hear the vets thoughts.[i]
Calibri,
I my case I think H started the affair awhile ago, don't know when...but he was withdraw many times. When I asked what was wrong, he would say that he was tired, that he was dealing with a lot at work.
I can't say we were unhappy but I can't say we were happy either. Lots of stress with my kid being very suicidal. I became very stressed out and many times I was withdraw myself. I was drained and he took much of my depression as a personal issue.
One thing he keep saying is that I didn't love him for a long time and now I am just having feelings of loss, that soon enough I will be happier because he is not in my life. H actually told my whole family this.
Lately I am avoiding him at all costs, I don't even feel like talking to him on the phone. And yesterday, when he said that he wants to make copies of all the tax returns and financial papers I felt again this pain in my stomach. It means he is not thinking we can turn around and work on our M. I fear he had a good time w/OW and will serve me D papers very soon.
I need to detach, but it's been hard. I look like detaching but I can't lie to myself. I think about him every second of the day.
I want to take some time this weekend and think about my goals, they are all over the place. I have no direction, no plan of action right now, and this is not good. I just have fear and I am paralyzed by it.
Hey Toots and Calibri what are your goals?
Did you set any and could accomplish any yet?
Hugs for you both...
"You know, from 7/26/14 to 10/31/14 we have a R better then when on honeymoon. I actually never had a most beautiful love. He was always very caring, nice, gentle. I still don't understand how H could make love with such passion, love and intensity if he didn't feel anything about me?"
I have read about this. I think it is partly because for a time, the WAS is getting all of his needs met. He is having an A with someone else, who is meeting part of his needs and you are meeting another part. Having A's can awaken greater sexual desire and affection in WAS's towards their spouse (or it can go the other way). Their libido has been boosted and they want to ML more often - potentially both with the AP and the LBS. So, the A adds 'spice' to your LM for a while. Equally, they can view their spouse very kindly/lovingly whilst having an A.
I think compartmentalisation is important too. For the WAS, the M and the A can be in two separate 'boxes', and they can convince themselves that what is in one box won't affect the other. In fact, they may even believe that having the A 'benefits' their M. In effect they 'open' the A box when they are with the AP, and they open the M box when they are with the LBS.
Plus WAS' may 'minimise' the A....this is just something for me... It's not a huge thing etc.
And they may also 'rationalise' things - 'the kids will be fine' etc.
Of course all of the above thinking and 'boxing up' is only sustainable for so long.
You say that your H has ML to you when he "didn't feel anything about" you. Of course that isn't true, and he does feel many things about you. But of course feelings at the moment are confused (and complex) and it will take some time for the dust to settle on all of this.
I do have goals....have a look at my sitch for these. I do want to update them though....I'm learning as I go along! :-)
Well here I am... Thanksgiving weekend. I am in the mountains with my three boys and H is at his place, at least I think so.
Last monday H called to offer to take care after our dog and I told him the god was joining us for the trip. Then he asked if would be OK to go to the house to get some tax papers to move forward and I said I was not very comfortable with him in a house while I was not there, he got mad and yelled on the phone that I new about this and that we talked about it before. I sad nothing, just let him calm down.
Then he asked me if was OK to take the kids out on tuesday for a kind of Thanksgiving Lunch, I said it was OK of course and he blow again saying that he was just talking and making plans with me.
I know he is very upset because we all left and didn't spend Thanksgiving at home, but what he wants? the good of both worlds?
He leaves for a week vacation w/OW, does not make any plans with his family and think we will just be waiting for him with our open arms?
He is in denial, he wants me out of the picture as soon as possible without talking about, addressing any issues. He just want to be done with it and forget it ever happened.
I feel sad, and angry and offended... 18 years married to this jerk and he just want to run away with someone else and forget about other people existence.
I also found out that he told about our divorce to our chiropractor, really? It just shows to me that he is moving on as he said.
When the boys and I arrived at the hotel I sent him a text saying that we got here save. He replayed next day and wish me a Happy Thanksgiving... I did not wish him the same. What is so happy about when he is destroying our family? He needs to get real.
Yesterday I send him a text saying... Hi! Kids all well so far. He did text this morning saying: "Hope you are all having lots of fun".
I need to understand better inside myself and my heart how to deal with detaching and showing my changes. I want to detach and I keep thinking about him all the time. I think to show my changes but I do not want to see him, it actually feels better away from the whole drama.
I don't know what to do, by my choice I don't see him for two weeks now. I don't know what to do. Reading some posts here, I see that people have a chance many times in reinvesting in their M. I feel so hopeless, I hear H ask to make copies of taxes and I see he has decided and feels like he won't go back on his decision.
Maybe I need to let it happen and see where it goes...
Hope you all had a decent Thanksgiving and is not hurting much during this time of family celebrations.
Hugs to all.
"He is in denial, he wants me out of the picture as soon as possible without talking about, addressing any issues. He just want to be done with it and forget it ever happened."
Hi Pink
Hope you and your boys had a great Thanksgiving trip. It may have given H some pause for thought....but of course you having a good time was the main thing. He will do what he will do at the moment.
I completely agree with you on the above quote. That is how it feels with my H and me. Suddenly I feel our marriage has become a huge inconvenience for him and he wants to drop it like a hot coal, marry someone else and have a new family with them. But the bottom line is I am his wife and there isn't much he can do about that for now. I don't think in his mind he regards me as his wife at all any more. I think he just perceives our R to be over, and he has decided how he wants his future life to look (without me in it.)
It is all pretty hard to take. But when you read all of the stuff here, you can see that this is common enough, and that feelings can and do change time and time again.
My H has also talked about the ending of our R with a couple of people and I have found out about this. He hasn't told me it is over. I had a big inner debate on whether to confront him - but decided to leave it. I didn't think any good could come from me opening up that line of talk right now. And if he wants to put on his BBP and tell me, that's up to him!
It is true that your H needs to 'get real.' And there is every likelihood he will at some point. Someone posted somewhere - don't worry so much about the OW...you know how this ends!
We know there isn't much likelihood the A will 'succeed' - the unknown quantity is the timescale. But of course, thinking in this way makes it 'all about him' and for now (as you can't control him) it just needs to be 'all about you - and your family.' It is hard, but it is the only way for now - and possibly for some time.
Slowly, but surely consequences will begin to seep in for your H - regardless of what you do. In fact, you can just 'do nothing' and get on with your life as best you can.
Be patient with yourself on the detachment. We are trying to prise ourselves like barnacles off the person we loved best of all. The person we hoped to always rely on. We can't expect it to happen overnight.
Hugs to you. Toots :-)
Pink,
What is it that YOU specifically want? You mention you want to make changes -- what are those changes?
Thanks for visiting,
I know myself and I know I could be a little different and still feel good about myself.
A little bit like you, I had a tough childhood, but I also had lots of love... it was very mixed. I had pain and happiness altogether.
I have been practicing, trying to find my inner self and feel good with my surroundings, the universe itself. I think it was always there and now it is becoming who I am. I don't want to be tough...I want to be strong in my values and my core as a person. I don't want to be a victim... I want to recognize what hurts me or what I don't like and make a clear choice of not allowing it to hurt. I don't want to be dependent anymore... I want to be in peace with who I am and not duel on who I need to be for someone else.
I have been in many places, many countries, many different cultures and I don't really know if I am right or wrong in my choices... I just know I want to feel I owe my own opinion, my successes, my talents and as well my mistakes, fears... and be OK with myself.
There is a big open wound inside of me and it needs to heal so I can be myself again. I know it is not going to be easy, but I am getting to the conclusion that it's best for me alone.
I have been reading a lot, and reading these posts a lot, and I got to the conclusion that my M ended some time ago and if there is a chance for reconciliation, then it will be a new M, starting over.
I am also looking for my financial independency, I want to go back to college and start somewhere, something I like and can give me an opportunity for a new job, a better pay, maybe a business. Somehow work also define my happiness, it's a big part of who I am and what mood I can get everyday. I like working, it feels good.
That is what I want to change, and I am changing... I will get there, with tears, smiles and everything in between.
Pink
He behaves like he is missing me, like he needs to be connected but yet he is moving forward w/D. Please, help me understand.
H has been texting every day for one or another stupid reason. Things he never did before now became normal for him. He even called me and left a nice message for me to call him back to discuss his invitation for our almost 21y old son to go with him to a company Christmas Party this coming Friday. Didn't call back... our older kid is a man, I do not need to talk to H about him going to a party.
H texted on Tuesday evening asking if we could meet on wed or thur, I did not answer right away. I need to meet with a lawyer tonight and I want to have all my info about my rights and what I can or can't negotiate with H before I talk to him. So, I text him back saying I was busy all week and could meet with him on Saturday.
Wednesday morning my kids had school late start and he comes in a house about 20min earlier, I was finishing the kids breakfast. He saw me and got really nervous, apologized for entering the house. I didn't say much, but I asked him what he wants to talk to me, if it was about the D and he said no, that he wants to talk about us, about our lives. Then I asked again, "about us, so you mean about our D?"... Ooops no DB at all, but he said that he just want to see me, spend some time with me, talk about us.
I am mind reading here, but I think he will try to convince me he wants to sell the house. Well, I am not supposed to be mind reading and get ready for something I don't even know. Need to calm down and see what happens.
Somehow, part of me wants to give up on all of this. I am tired of it all, all the drama, being careful, trying do not get hurt emotionally and/or financially. It's so much stress right now.
Does anyone have an advice for Saturday? Does anyone have some experience with the fact that H asked for a D, tells he has OW in the picture, left the house and does text me every day and sometimes calls me.
I don't want to get hurt again, but I don't want to lose an opportunity to make him fall in love with me all over again.
Pink
Well, sounds to me like he may still be somewhat conflicted...
I would listen and validate primarily. Be as strong and serene as you can manage. have a look at the validation cheat sheet.
If he is asking you to make decisions, buy yourself time....I'll have to think about that etc..
But if there are clear boundaries, you can state them. Mine was that I won't be in a M/R with H when he is involved with OW. We don't do family stuff and I'm not his friend.
Above all, remember it is early days. Things are pretty unstable in your sitch...as in mine - and everything can change.
And remember, you are not a victim here...you are a lovely, self-respecting woman who is deciding what she wants to do with the rest of her life....with or without H in it!
Good luck x
I woke up feeling so tormented today... I have a meeting with H today and I feel so afraid to face the D talk. I really need help getting myself together to face it. Please give me some advice of how to go through it.
H came into the house to pick up S20 to go to a company Xmas party. He was pleasant as usual. I did not hug or kiss him.
S20 told me that he did the whole explanation that he wants to be friends with me because he cares and will always care deeply for me but that our M is over.
H told him he never cheated on me and did not sleep with anyone and is not with anyone till now. That he just have feelings for someone that is actually far away.
S20 told me that H seems pretty done with me, that H said today he will talk about the D and try to agree on some things to make it easier for everyone.
S20 even said that at some point he asked H to stop talking about mom and the whole situation because it is something we need to talk about. S20 said that H would go on and on trying to justify himself, trying to get some approval for what he is doing. H said that it could be very different but he feels that he has been unhappy for a long time and does not see that things will ever change.
When H drop off S20 I was in front of the house, on the phone with a friend. H got out of the car and walked to the house, I tough he would say hi to S17 and S14 but instead he hugged me, gave me a kiss on the cheek and said Good Night.
I know that eventually this D will happen because he is moving towards it... but I can't help thinking that his actions are so different then what he says. I feel he still loves me. The way he looks at me, talks to me. The fact that there is not a day that he does not text for one reason or another, that he calls me for stupid things.
I spoke with an attorney and she advise me do not get too emotional at this point and protect myself and the kids, she told me she has seen many Hs being all nice and take advantage on the person that has too much hope.
Ahg...I know I need to be patient with all this and with H and with myself, but sometimes I feel I want to let it go and just have it all resolved, done for good.
I am so thankful for this board, it's almost the only place I can cry out loud and people won't say I am stupid and crazy, that I shouldn't have hope and need to get down to business and move on with my life and forget the bastard.
Please, if you have some advise on how to go through a D talk and yet show I changed, it would be appreciated.
Thanks to all of you.
Pink
Pink,
-look good
-smell good
-have a PMA about the conversation. You may think you know what's coming, but who knows what's going to come out of his mouth.
-but at the same time, have no expectations about the conversation or his actions. He could be "nicing you up" to soften the blow of asking for a D. He could ask for a D and OW could drop him. There's a lot of things that could happen.
-listen and validate his concerns/feelings
-keep your head held high and show the same grace, poise and dignity that you show us daily.
- you don't have to agree to anything in this conversation.
Hugs to you. Please let us know how it goes - will be thinking of you today.
Hi Pink
Just checking in with the forum and wondering how things went with your H yesterday?
Hope you're doing okay today :-)
I have been visiting with my parents today. I'm off to try a new aqua aerobics class this evening. I don't really feel like going, but I'm going to make myself do it!
Hope to catch up with you soon, Toots ()
If there is any vet that would like to give me some hints of how to understand what is going on, I would appreciate...
As planned H and I met on saturday night, I tough we would talk about the bid D, but as he said before we did not. We talked about us. I apologize again for making him so unhappy during our M, for being so unhappy for a long time, for being so stressed with my son's sickness. He also apologize, saying that he recognized he could do many things different and that he could be there for me a lot more, support more, and he didn't.
We also talked about good stuff, we cried, we laugh, he was nice and I end up having one too many glasses of wine. He helped me because I was very dizzy. When we got home, he helped me to get to bed and he end up in be with me. I know it was not good for both of us.
On sunday he showed up at the house to check how I was doing and said he is very worry about me, that he feels I am lonely and he knows he can't be there for me all the time. He said that he cares for me deeply and because of it he has his feeling mixed up. That he is confused but he needs to understand that maybe he feels this way because I am and was that most important person in his life, that he loved me for so long time that it is hard to separate things now.
He did apologize for taking advantage on the situation on saturday night. I told him it was not his fault and that I am an adult too. He said he is afraid I am not taking good care after myself.
He cried a lot, saying that he feels guilty for what he is doing to me, that he feels guilty for giving so much pain to all of us, including the kids, but he feels in his heart and brain that he needs to Move on with his life.
The only thing is that he said that 3 times. On the third time I finally blow up on him. Not bad, I did not yelled and was not angry. But I told him I can't change his decision, that I can not interfere in what he thinks is right for him, that I can only change myself and move on with my life. That I feel a big pain inside but I do not have a choice besides taking care after myself.
He told me he can't be there for me as he always did. That he fears that I don't have friends and that I am not being good to myself. I really don't get it.
I told him I have my friends what is amazing the support I have been getting from them. That I don't feel alone and I don't think I need to put a show for him to see that I am moving on with my life.
In my opinion, he is going crazy... I don't initiate any kind of communication, I don't ask him anything. He is the one that text me everyday for silly stuff sometimes. He is the one that calls me, and yet I don't answer him right away. He is the one inviting me to go out with him.
He is the one calling me honey, baby. On saturday, after dinner I said that he could drop me off at home, that I did not want to bother him. He said that he had a date with his wife and that he had nothing more important to do.
Oh my, I wish I can just understand all what goes in his head. I don't get all what is going on. Now I am mixed up too. He can easily end this nightmare, he can serve me the D papers and it is the beginning of the end, but he does not and keep saying all these things and can't detach from me and then say that I am the one that needs to move on and be happyl
Does anyone have some advice for me?
Thanks to all of you.
Pink
Thanks Toots,
You are a good friend, and one that understands were I am right now. Today I feel miserable. I am trying my best to be the upbeat girl but it has been hard.
Sometimes I feel would be so much easier to just put the D papers myself and let go. But I have kids with this man and I won't stop contact anyway. Besides, I love him, love our R now, love the way he has been with me.
His mixed up feelings made a mess on my head this weekend. By one hand he says he will always love me but it is not the same way anymore, then he says that he loved me so long and so intense, that he feels very confused right now.
He says that he can't be there for me anymore, that he can't be responsible for me... and then he says he will always care and be there for me as much as possibly can.
He looks at me with intensity, he hugs me and cry on my shoulder saying he knows he needs to let go because he believes he need to Move On with his life.
He told me he never cheated on me, even when he went to see the OW, that he couldn't, he just couldn't get himself to do that.
He speaks with me and I feel he wants to blame me for all what he is going through.
I told him that he needs to do what he thinks is best for himself and if this means he will leave me then be it, that I can't change him. Told him it's all bitter/sweet because I feel the pain of loosing him but I am happy it happen to me since I am becoming a better person for myself.
I don't know what to do. Sometimes I feel he is also in some MLC. I hear his words and he is sometimes so sure of what he wants, but when I asked if he wants me to put the D papers and then he would be free of my burden on him, he said no, not yet.
So what the H.ll?
And my head is just spinning crazy today because I don't know if I just file for a legal separation to protect the kids and myself financially. Since he is so unbalanced, maybe he can go crazy and spend a lot of money, or sell the house, whatever. He promise me that he will not do anything without talking to me.
Toots, he is a good man. And I regret so many times I was a very annoying person, I wanted it my way. I want to make a point and try to change him. I did so many things wrong that brought us to this situation now. He also tells me that he has been thinking and that he could do many things different in our M/R - he tells me that he was not there for me many times and that made me very depressed and unhappy because I was dealing with so much at the time.
He told me that he was in agony seeing how unhappy I became this last year. An it is true, sometimes I tough that I could drive very fast and finish it all.
I will read DR again as you advise me, will sit down w/myself and review and rewrite my goals. Try to make some sense of why he is doing all this.
Thanks for the support, it is a amazing comfort.
Hugs
Pink
I'll catchup on your sitch.
Hi Pink,
I'm sure that Bug will catch up and offer some questions for you, and I'd like to do the same.
You sound like you have a lot going on with your kids and activities. I know first hand how much juggling can deplete energy and the ability to focus on things at hand.
I wonder if you've always been so agreeable in regards to your H? And have you always been silent on issues that bother you so that you act out passive aggressively? I can give you some examples from your posts if that is more helpful. But as I read through your posts, I saw a woman who was silently in such pain but unwilling to fight for herself and what is important. You seem to keep a stiff upper lip when you've said here you're breaking inside. Has your H *ever* seen that side of you? I wonder if he thought that you really don't care by what you've said to him?
Please don't misunderstand that I think you should be a rager. I don't! But your silent anger is present for a reason, and my guess is from a childhood wound that you haven't addressed. Or could it be your culture? I'm not sure. I'm just interested in hearing how you came to this point. Do you suppress your emotions to the point where others feel you are aloof or indifferent? I know you said that things are better after the bomb, but I wonder why.
You mentioned that he feels you are not taking care of yourself. Have you always let him be the thermostat for how you feel? Personally, I'd feel as though that is a very unreasonable burden and I'd not want it either. I think he's giving you a road map to what he needs from a partner. Can you see this? Are you lonely? Do you depend on him to be your main source of friendship to the exclusion of others? I don't mean acquaintances. I mean deep, emotionally connected relationships with other people.
I would love to hear what sort of background you have to understand your passive aggressiveness. If you can tap into the why, you can change and learn how to express yourself honestly and with humility. Anger isn't a deal breaker, Pink. But how you get angry just might be. Passive aggressiveness comes from a long time survival technique and unless you address the why, you won't be emotionally honest with people.
So if you could share, that would be great.
Hugs-Betsey
Underdog,
Thanks for all your kind words. You are right on the money.
I think at this point it's all together. My culture, my background, my life until I got here. You are the first person in my life that reads me so fast and so precisely.
My childhood was filled w/happiness and suffering, with joy and sadness. I grow up in a farm. We had it all, calls, pigs, chickens, horses. I even had my own horse. Life was simple and happy and yet I was spanked by my mom to a point a had no more pain and no more tears.
My mom is alive, I love her with all my heart because I understood why she took it all on me. I forgave her long time ago. I think I was born strong inside, I took decisions, I mature very fast. My father was an alcoholic at times, when he was in his sober times life was a blessing, and when he was in his alcoholic times life was hell.
I was also abused by my stepfather that came to live with us for awhile. I am luck it was not the worse abuse, he made me touch him a few times. I never open this to anyone in my family, the first person I told it was my husband.
Now I am starting to understand that I develop some kind of defense mechanism and no one in this world would pass my limits. No one. Including my own children.
I never gave myself 100%. I never trusted no one 100%. I was always waiting to be hurt, to be betrayed, to feel pain.
I never let anyone to tell me what to do, but with H it was different. He is sincere, kind, affectionate and time to time I let him take care after me. It felt good not to be so strong.
I could do anything with the assurance that he would be there, in the shadow, looking after me and approving what I was doing. Sometimes I even recognized what I was doing.
In our R, I was the one to take care after my family, the one taking decisions, the one moving everybody around. But I never want to be alone, even to go to the supermarket. I always want someone with me.
In the same time that I want someone to be there with me, I treated my H like crap. I criticized him many times, I ignored him and his needs many times. He likes to show affection, hugs, kisses, and I don't. I want and I don't do it. Every time we made love was fantastic, he would even say this to me, but many times I escaped from that because I did not want to be touched and of course, it became a problem in our M.
Being in USA did not make it easier. Besides the culture difference, my H travels a lot for work (outside the country, I raised my children basically by myself. When we moved to Colorado it was stressful with babies.
When the kids started getting older, money was necessary and I started cleaning house with a friend. The money was excellent but it destroyed my confidence. I know how hard this work is, I know it is a honest way of making money, but I develop a sense of inferiority and it became another problem for my R w/H.
Finally I stopped it and got an office job and I am doing pretty good. But then life turns around again and my S20 is diagnosed with Bipolar Disorder, it was hell for about 4months then he started getting better. My S14 got whooping cough for 60 days straight and at this point I did let go.
I was so depressed that I feel I had some fog in my eyes. I died inside. I did not fight anymore, did not argue, did not even cry. Sometimes I even tough would be better to just free my H and let him find his life somewhere else.
A week before my H asked me for a D, I asked him, I said right on his face that he was unhappy with me, that I felt he did not love me anymore and I was unhappy with him.
Later, a week from my crazy blow out, he gave me the same speech. That I did not love him for a long time. The only difference he said that he met someone and that he would like to give himself a chance to be happy because we would never be happy together. He said it was killing him to make me unhappy and he could not take it no more.
Losing him woke me up. It was like I could see again. I got myself an IC, I decided to educate myself about R, M and issues related to it. I found out I have many gaps that are not related to H that I need to fill.
And that's why I say that it's bitter/sweet... this pain made me to wake up old wounds that I need to address or I will never be happy even with myself.
I don't know if H loves me yet or not, I feel he does. I feel he would like to be with me but he is afraid he will walk back into hell. He is gentle with me, I know he care deeply for me, but he says he does not love the same way anymore. The OW I don't know for sure, he told me that.
And I came to this board, the place that is teaching me so much how to be a better person for myself and for others. I never tough I would get help from strangers with no face, no real names. It's just amazing the power of giving that surround this forum. Thank you so much!!!
So now I know some of what's is wrong, I told my IC about some of this issues. But I don't know how to clean them up inside me. So, if you have any idea, I will sure try and start a new life. I know it will take time, but I want to became myself and I am up to the hard work.
Thank you again for helping me!
Pink
Hi Pink - hope you're doing okay....:-)
Just a few thoughts from me....you made a few comments - should I do this or that, or just D. When you are so emotional isn't a good time for making big decisions, so put them on the back burner for now. You can decide on big stuff in due time & when you feel sure and ready.
I'm sorry for your childhood traumas. It sounds as though H has been important to you in that you have shared & trusted in him alone in certain things. I can see how that now makes the betrayal (in whatever form.....it sounds like an EA at least) more painful.
It sounds as though working on you will need to focus on some unresolved things from your childhood. And hopefully this will be a really positive thing for you.
I'm also picking up on some dependency - or at least perceived so - in the comments from H. And in your own comments of not wanting to do things alone. Is that still the case for you?
I suppose we are all hoping to get to the point where we can care for ourselves enough that we don't need someone else to do that. But we may want them as icing on the cake. What would it take for you to feel you had reached that point?
You said before that you don't want to be a victim. Did that also link back to childhood? What would not being a victim look like? What would you be saying? How would you feel? What steps might you take towards this?
Since my 'dip' at the weekend, my PMA has been super high. I've felt quite a sense of peace with the situation this week. I think I am feeling more acceptance of things as they are for now. Who knows what next year may hold - but I feel I'm getting to a good place within myself....regardless of what H might be doing. This great PMA might be fleeting....but it's nice to feel this way - even if just for a bit! ;-)
(((((Pink)))))
Well, I was thinking either sexual abuse or alcoholism and rage, but not both. That's incredibly hard, and thank you so much for sharing. I know it's hard. There is so much there that I think I know what I want to say.
So now I know some of what's is wrong, I told my IC about some of this issues. But I don't know how to clean them up inside me. So, if you have any idea, I will sure try and start a new life. I know it will take time, but I want to became myself and I am up to the hard work.
As my dad says, you eat an elephant one bite at a time. It looks daunting, but it doesn't really matter where you start, just *that* you start.
I completely understand your isolation and holding back. I truly do. I've been accused of that in my own intimate relationships, and it is 100% truthful. I'm a work in progress. Everyone is.
Rather than focus on your marriage, I'd like to see you focus on addressing some of these childhood wounds. My parents also employed spanking, only because it was how they were parented. I've forgiven them as well. They didn't spank me to the extent you were (I was mouthy and probably didn't show enough respect anyway). And while I can sense that you have forgiven her, apparently that isn't enough. There's some forgiveness issue lurking under the surface. Understandably. If I were in your shoes and facing these wounds for the first time before wanting to heal them, I'd have to acknowledge that I was angry with my mom for 1) making poor choices with men; 2) allowing men into her life without protecting ME; and 3) For not seeking help for all involved.
There, that's out now. And you can't change the past. You can't even change how you feel about your past, until you address it, process it and let it go. Not sweep it under the rug, Pink. But let it go, and then it will allow you to stop letting your inability/unwillingness to be vulnerable have so much power in your life.
My own mom grew up in a very proper English household. One did not speak out or utter any impolite words or feelings to the point that it was praised to act dishonestly for the sake of being proper. And no I Love You's were said, nor was their outward physical affection. My dad's family is the complete opposite. They have lived all over the world, they say gushy and meaningful words, they've always told me they loved me and yes, they are huggers and kissers. My mom was initially very uncomfortable being around them. But deep down inside, she had always dreamed of having people hug her. So she decided that her way svcked and that she'd work on being more affectionate. I can still see parts of her parenting that hold on to her upbringing, but she can hold her own.
At the age of 49, my guess is that it's not going to be easy for you. I mean, nobody would expect you to wake up tomorrow and tell everyone you love them and start hugging them. But you can start small. Start by telling people how grateful you are for what they do or say or for acts of kindness that touch you.
What have you done for the depression? It runs in my family as well, so I'm not saying this with judgment.
The bad thing about defense mechanisms that aren't literally life and death situations is that you protect yourself from hurt, but you also insulate yourself from love. And in order to love others, you have to love yourself first. By protecting your heart, your soul is telling you that it is painful.
But I never want to be alone, even to go to the supermarket. I always want someone with me.
Can you tap into this childhood wound a little bit and expound a bit?
When the kids started getting older, money was necessary and I started cleaning house with a friend. The money was excellent but it destroyed my confidence. I know how hard this work is, I know it is a honest way of making money, but I develop a sense of inferiority and it became another problem for my R w/H.
Society today makes this very issue so doggone difficult. When I first moved to Colorado in 1991, I was a newlywed and hadn't been without at least ONE job since I was 15 years old. It was really hard for awhile... I was unemployed for 9 months. Yes, I had a husband to support me, but this was about who I defined as me. And my self worth was tied up in my paycheck. So I DO understand. But what I ultimately learned is that having a job no more defines me than what other people think of me. It's a means to an end. Period. It means that I'm willing to do whatever I need to do to take care of my family. There is no shame in that, Pink.
I'll share a quick story with you. It's something about this new age of American culture that disappoints me. I grew up the daughter of a policeman. We never had money, and my dad worked 2 side jobs on his days off to bring more money in. My XH's family is of Norwegian descent (he's 2nd generation). They also have a very strong work ethic. So it's ingrained in me. Back in 2008 when the markets crashed, a friend of ours lost 2 meaningful jobs within 2 years. His wife was having back problems and it was getting tough for her to sit at a desk, and they had 2 kids. Another mutual friend of ours owns his own company, and offered him a very lucrative desk job. It wasn't exciting, but it paid decently, with the opportunity of making more. Our friend offered it to him with full understanding that when he found a job in his field, he could move on without hard feelings. This person had been out of work for almost a year when this offer was placed. And is wife was getting more and more debilitated by her desk job and was in dire need of surgery. Yet he turned our friend down. Why? "Because doing that job is beneath me. You should ask my wife if she wants it." We were so angry with him. This entitled crap is embarrassing. It's not the old American way.
And BTW, my mom has a college education, is a classically trained pianist and she cleaned houses for years to bring in extra money while we were in school. My dad has a degree in Criminal Justice from American University, yet his side jobs were painting houses and working at the local bowling alley. You do what you need to do to protect your own. Be proud of that.
Losing him woke me up. It was like I could see again. I got myself an IC, I decided to educate myself about R, M and issues related to it. I found out I have many gaps that are not related to H that I need to fill.
And that's why I say that it's bitter/sweet... this pain made me to wake up old wounds that I need to address or I will never be happy even with myself.
This is exactly what I would advise you to do. You can't expect your H to fill the needs that you aren't willing to fill yourself.
So... it sounds like your H truly does care about you. Let's let that lie for the time being. Any problems with your marriage sound like they have tentacles attaching them to your childhood wounds. Until you heal them, it's not going to plug the dam, so to speak.
You deserve a life of happiness and warmth. And your boys deserve having a mother who is fulfilled and emotionally healthy. Have you found an IC who really connects with you? By that, I mean one where you've given yourself permission to be 100% forthcoming with your wounds and trust them to help you move past them?
Hugs, friend. I'll wait for our friend, Bug, to come offer her support as well. Until then, can you think of one thing today that brings you joy and gratitude?
Betsey
Toots,
It's really great that you can enjoy "at least a bit" of the inner peace you feeling.
Regarding to your questions, I will need to think about them and have time to do so. It will help me to organize my thoughts and think about some solutions.
I don't really feel I am a victim, but many times I felt sorry for myself, my suffering, and I would think that H was just a selfish bastard that wouldn't care for no one else but himself. Maybe it was all my perception, maybe I was totally in denial that I was not doing any good to anyone, but I was suffering because I was not setting priorities, boundaries, and so on.
I will need time to sort all this. My head will explode soon.
I will write more later today. I am at work now and need to finish some patients stuff.
Talk to you soon. Hugs!
Toots and Underdog,
Today was a tough day, but putting me against the wall made me concentrate and isolate what really hurts inside my soul to date.
The sexual abuse and the spanking has giving me more pain then far more then all things I have been through in my life.
My IC is very smart and I like him a lot. He worked with me to get out of the big desperation I was after the D bomb. He told me last week that it is time to work on me.
I told him the truth and felt really good that I can talk to him with such freedom.
It's really hard to talk about these two issues because I go back and feel like I am the little girl again. It is even hard to explain how I turn into that child.
But I agree with you both, that it is time to face it with tears or not, I need to find the way to get passed it. I will talk to my IC tomorrow and develop a plan with him and with the help I am getting here, I know I will be able to accomplish it. The truth is that I already started that path, I am cleaning the closet already.
My dependency started with my husband, maybe because he felt so responsible since the first day I got to USA. He says we are and will always be super good friends with or without our R and I think he is right. Because our situation, we got extremely close and relied on each other a lot.
But here comes the bad side, he is the only person for me. I have friends but not in a very deep relationship. I never gave that space to anyone. I am a very likable person, I am easy going, optimistic, fun to a point, do not put my nose in anyone's business, I don't really judge people.
So I have a case of dependency on him. Maybe he is suffocated by this. I was thinking why he kept saying over and over that I do not have friends and that he is really worried. I told him I have my friends and they are helping me with all what going through, but he knows people, he can read people much better then me, and he probably knows me better then I know myself, he knows all what you also knows now.
FEAR... I have a lot of fear, insecurities that came from fear. ANXIETY... I feel very anxious when I am alone. If I need to go somewhere, I get very anxious and I delay the departure, I procrastinate.
I was not like this my whole life, I became more and more afraid of moving forward. I now see I have been lost for a long time and in denial.
How do I want to see myself? I would like to see myself, not the many masks I put to get through the day.
How do I get there? Like Underdog said... a little bit every day... I did start today and feel good I did.
Regarding my M. I don't know what will happen, maybe we have a chance, maybe not. I really don't know because I still can't figure it out. But I think that I can put it aside for a little while and work on myself instead.
When I met my H in 1996 we were in a very large Sales Meeting in Ixtapa, Mexico. I was out of a R with someone I loved a lot. I was not married to him but we were together from 1992 to 1994. H met a very nice lady, I was very pretty, secure of myself, happy with a big smile in my face. I had my good job with a good pay, I was very thin and looking good. So he met someone very independent.
It make sense that he is feeling I am so dependent now. He knew someone very different. I doesn't mean I don't resolve all issues around the house, but I became a mom and a annoying wife and forgot the woman behind.
Ahg... my stomach hurts again, my head hurts and I feel I would like to put myself inside a well and cover it. I am so sorry I didn't see all this before, why I was so stupid I lost a good man because I was blind? Sorry, I am just venting... I hope things will get better and I can be happy again.
Right now I see it so far away, but I know that we all go through tough times but if I do my best, I can get there. I think it is just facing my issues put me in a crying mode today.
One thing I am thankful today is that I am having help from you guys... I am really thankful, I feel stronger to face all this that keeps eating my soul. You give me courage to tackle my demons.
Like I said, I will meet my IC tomorrow, and I will let you know what plan we will have to resolve unfinished business inside of me.
Hugs, hugs and hugs.
I want the hugs and kisses, so I will start giving them.
Pink
Pink,
I have so much I want to say to you, but I think Underdog covered it much more eloquently than I ever could.
Life takes us down paths and as we travel them we change, for better or for worse. I don't think you were blind. I think you were doing what you felt you needed to do. To keep your house going, to take care of your sons, to take care of your H. Ypu were doing the best you could, at the time.
You've got a great starting point. And you have to take it one step at a time. Please talk to your IC or doctor about possible treatment options for your anxiety and any depression you might have. It could be traditional medicine, holistic, or a mix. I myself finally bit the bullet and went on anti depressants about a month ago. Kicking and screaming (ok, depressed and mopey was more like it) but I did it. I have found it's helped take the edge off and level things out so the lows aren't so low anymore.
((Pink)) I admire your bravery.
Pink,
I have to like you for your courage. I admire that too. It takes a big person to face the demons and do the work to put them to rest. Hugs back atcha!
I'm so glad that you feel your IC is the person to guide you through the process. How about one piece of advice so that you embrace the emotional honesty with him? I know it's not your nature to trust, but why not offer it fully now, and then pull it back if he does something that warrants it? Not all people will fail you.
It's really hard to talk about these two issues because I go back and feel like I am the little girl again. It is even hard to explain how I turn into that child.
This makes perfect sense to me. Your injuries were sustained as a child. It's the little Pink who controls adult Pink. And until adult Pink can understand little Pink, it's difficult to feel like the adult.
But here comes the bad side, he is the only person for me. I have friends but not in a very deep relationship. I never gave that space to anyone.
Try not to think in absolutes. It's limiting and diminishing your worth.
So I have a case of dependency on him. Maybe he is suffocated by this. I was thinking why he kept saying over and over that I do not have friends and that he is really worried. I told him I have my friends and they are helping me with all what going through, but he knows people, he can read people much better then me, and he probably knows me better then I know myself, he knows all what you also knows now.
It sounds like you accept what he says as truthful. I'm glad to read that. Because if I were in his shoes, I would find this kind of dependency suffocating, and it would drive me away. I want a partner, not another person who is depending on me to provide for them. We teach our children to become independent, right? Spouses should have the opportunity to be with a person who comes to his table fully whole and who adds to his life, not detract from it. This isn't to say that we don't come to the marriage/relationship without baggage - we all do. But a healthy person tackles the part that gets in the way of current relationships. And yes, you are definitely on your journey.
Be gentle with yourself, Pink. As Calibri wisely said, those defense mechanisms used to serve a purpose. They no longer do. In fact they are causing pain. Sometimes, being in survival mode is the only thing you can do until you get to safe ground. But when you get to safe ground, it's time to move from survive to thrive.
I'll be anxious to hear your plan. I'm proud of you for being willing to brave your fears and start processing the pain. You're courageous.
HUGS!
Betsey
Hi Calibri,
Thanks for your kind words. I just mean blind because I gave so much importance for everything else but my R w/H. And now he is done with me, and all the house chores, appointments, cleaning, washing, you name it. And now it is not as important as my M was.
I am actually on anti-depressants since sometime in 8/14 - I do not have a family history of anxiety or depression what is good. When I started feeling that I couldn't stop shaking like bamboo in a storm, I saw my doctor and she prescribed me some mild anti depressant what like you said, is taking the edge off.
Saw H this morning when he came into the house to pick up the boys. You know, my boys are not so young, so he does not need to literally pick them up, they walk to the car. My S14 was already in the car and he came in after the S17. They were not late though. I asked him about taking S14 to his Orchestra Concert tonight because I have my IC and don't want miss it. H was all smiles, hugs and kisses. He said was not problem at all and that he will meet me there for us to see the concert.
I noticed that H really freaks out when he sees me. I was actually very calm this morning. He gets very nervous trying to be extra nice. It's almost as he is reading DR or DB. It makes me laugh now...what if one day I find out that he is using the techniques on me, it would be funny!
S14 told me that H told him he never cheating on me. What???
He is not suppose to be talking to him about this. I don't get it but he really wants to make sure I understand he did not cheated on me, even when he went to see OW. Why it is so important for him I don't know. Maybe because the D and custody.
Will stop by your sitch later (((Calibri))))
Pink
Hi Pink - interesting what you say about feeling like a little girl again when you think about the difficult things that happened to you. I have been talking to my IC about my tendency to people please & say what I think others want to hear.
She was saying that stuff like this is often a childhood legacy & that we learn behaviours/approaches that keep us 'safe' as kids then & we carry them into our later lives. She said - but you're 47 now....you don't need to do that anymore!
I think you are making so much progress - even though you may not see it right. Ow amidst all the pain. Your marital crisis may prove to be a catalyst for you to work through things from your childhood, leading to a more joyful and fulfilled life for you. You may well look back on this awful time and feel it is the best thing that could have happened for you.
Just keep moving forwards with your IC support - you've got this :-)
Toots,
I read that trying to please other people is also an internal issue and can be related to some trauma along the time you were building your personality.
It is somehow a desire to be accepted by others, when the truth is you need to accept yourself. Maybe you try to talk some more with your IC and try to figure why you have this tendency.
Talking about is already a step towards the solution. But these feeling we built inside and keep it for a long time they are hard to resolve.
"She said - but you're 47 now....you don't need to do that anymore!"
When I talk to my IC today I want to ask him about techniques or every day exercise, or through meditation... some ways that I can take the pain, resentment, wound, memory, etc away from my heart. People say, you don't need to do that anymore, but what that means? How do I go from point A to point B? How do I switch from hurting to being OK with it? If I had a stop, cancel, off bottom I would press it without a doubt, but I/we do not have one.
I forgot to tell you, I got my Xmas tree on Saturday morning, it's very nice. A little shorter then last year, but it is still pretty big. I am working on the decorations every day a little bit. H helped me to set up the tree inside the house on sunday, he actually never did it before, I guess he is also changing. I also put some lights outside, I am half away since I needed to clean the gutters too.
I feel good that my mood for Xmas is not getting all destroyed. I even think that maybe Xmas can be a good time to show some changes. Who knows...
Hugs... (((Toots)))
Pink
I have learnt to be distrustful. My h said he was doing xyz and it now turns out he wasn't, he was running off to date ow.
Now I've got huge trust issues, I'm looking to expand my circle of friends to include more men. I used to have a lot of men friends but h saw to that it made him uncomfortable, but he was allowed female friends and customers who rang at all hours and on weekends too.
I wrote a huge post which was insipre as is often the case with greats inspiration the Internet ate it.
I parked a link on my newest thread about abusive and addictive relationships, the chemical side is explained. This is not applicable to your m but to your mum.
Anyone who looks down on you for job needs to take long hard at them selves. Work is work better you work than take a government hand out. Working from a young age shows your stronger than. You know.
I just finished a great book called "Radical Acceptance - Embracing you life with the heart of a Buddha."
I thought of you when I finished reading it. While it's very spiritual as it's coming from a Buddhist stance, I came away with a lot of knowledge and tools about letting pain go, forgiving others, and perhaps more importantly, forgiving ourselves. It talks about meditation, opening our hearts and taking a look at ourselves and others with new perspectives.
Glad to read in your thread to Toots that you got your tree up. :-)
Calibri,
I will look for the book, thank you for the hint. I believe in forgiveness and I already forgave the people that did hurt me in the past.
The main thing now is to treat the trauma and the most difficult for me is to forgive myself. Came to find out that I am punishing myself because it happen.
My tree is amazing. Is colorful, have many color lights and a lot of ornaments, with a big shining bright star at the top.
I am decorating the house too. It gets all Xmas around my first floor. I also hanged some lights outside, it looks great.
This Xmas needs to be special, I will enjoy every moment.
Hugs,
Pink
Updating...
1st part of the night: went to my IC apt. It was painful, very hard. I told him in details about the spanking, which was many, many and a gazillion times more. I also told about the sexual abuse.
My IC was very kind, very open and very honest. A real gentleman. He was caring and yet straight to the point. He gave me the whole speech about not being hard on myself, forgiving the people that had that own demons and did this horrific things against me.
I told him I do not want to just talk about it. That going around the problem does not work for me. I am a straight forward person, if I get to it then I will go deep and resolve the issue.
He said it won't be resolved very fast. Next week we will start a program called Eye Movement Desensitization Reprocessing (EMDR). It's an 8 phases program design to basically reprocess triggers, stimulus, causes, assemble of new memories over old ones, a new focus, and much more. It's a Trauma Treatment. Very often used to treat PTSD. It also addresses a large variety of psychological problems.
I checked for this online and I am very hopeful it will help me. I need to be patient, but with time I can became a new person.
So, I would say it went very well. Of course, my head almost explode, I cried so much my eyes are very swollen till now. But I got through, and I feel good.
I will keep you posted with my progress and how the treatment goes.
2nd part of the night: H at S14 Orchestra concert. S14 plays the Cello for many years.
I got to the school it was almost 7pm, when the concert was supposed to start. H was inside, standing. As soon as I showed up he waved and called me to sit with him.
Got there and he gave me a hug and a kiss on the cheek. We sat and he asked me:
- How are you doing?
- I am fine...no, I am not fine and I don't feel too good right now.
Tears just blow out of my eyes.
- What happen baby?
- I was with my IC and we were talking about the two major problems I have, the spanking and the abuse.
- Oh, honey. I know it's hard but it will be good for you. I know you can do it. H hugs me.
- Just please, do not feel so sorry for me.
- I'm not. But I am your friend and I have sympathy for what you are going through.
- Why it should be so hard and painful.
- I don't know. But I know you will get through it.
The concert starts and he stays very close to me, he leaned towards me. He also put his arm over my shoulders for a while.
During the concert he would turn and look at me. Sometimes I looked at him and smiled. There was a song from Lord of the Rings that I really love. I close my eyes to hear the violins crying (love it a lot) and H hold my arm, rubbing it gently.
Concert ended and we walked together to the hall. H mention that he is closer to get the promotion he was waiting for years. It's not final yet, but the politics have started.
H said he hopes things go well for "us". Then I said, if things goes well you may change countries. He looked at me and said that if it goes well I will be doing what I want to do.
Outside, we were still talking about his work when a friend stopped by. I was very happy to see her, we hugged and talked on how amazing it was to meet at the Concert.
The she asked: So, is this your H? And I hesitated, I was Ahhh... Ahhhh....Ahhhh... . Then H said, yes I am her husband. Nice to meet you. We talked a little more about the kids then she left.
H looked at me and asked me why I hesitate to say he is my H?
I looked at him and said, Oh please J..., you put me in a hard situation here. I laid my head on his shoulder
Then he said, you are my still my wife, you are my wife.
Then I said that the lady he just met is very nice, and that she also said I am very nice. I said that in a very girl way. Then I apologize for my silliness and H said to please don't apologize, that he loves when I am like this.
I keep thinking that it is all so crazy, his behavior is all mixed up. Maybe it's because DB is working. My IC said that he thinks H is seeing all my changes, my progress w/therapy and he is confused now. IC said that H still loves me but is afraid that this is not a permanent change. That he wants to be sure things will not only change but transform.
So, this was my night. I think it went well. I have a lot of headache and my eyes are hurting, but I feel somewhat good.
THE TRUTH IS THAT I WOULD NOT GET WERE I AM NO IF NOT FOR YOUR HELP. MAYBE IT SOUNDS NOT SO REAL, BUT IT IS. YOUR HELP IS WHAT IS SAVING ME. THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!
Hugs to all!
Pink
Good luck with the EMDR therapy. I read about it in a really good book by David Servan-Screiber "Healing without Freud or Prozac" there is a chapter on it if you're interested. It was one of the less interesting chapters for me, as isn't so relevant to my life. But the book is great!
It sounds like your contact with your H is going well. He sounds very caring towards you. But remember not to worry too much about what he is doing and thinking right now. You are the priority here!
Sounds like you struck lucky with your IC!
Exchanged a couple of texts with H today. He asked how I was doing and how the flat is (he hasn't seen it) I gave a DB response "really busy with work and pre-Xmas social plans."
No other news from me....just really busy with work right now - but had lunch with some old friends yesterday, which was nice. :-)
Hi Pink, I caught up a bit but I have to say this:
Maybe it's because DB is working. My IC said that he thinks H is seeing all my changes, my progress w/therapy and he is confused now. IC said that H still loves me but is afraid that this is not a permanent change. That he wants to be sure things will not only change but transform.
was what had to happen in my sitch. I had to slay all my past demons and my H had to see that my changes were real, that this was the new me.
I think you're doing great.
Reading through your thread, I am very impressed with your efforts and use of Divorce Busting techniques. I know you are seeing a counselor, but, not sure if you are also speaking to a DB coach. Today we have a special promotion for the online community. Please take advantage of the $30.00 discount and speak to a coach for more specific guidlines in your efforts to getting your marriage back on track.
Thanks Labug,
It means a lot to hear this from you. Since I came to this forum you have been some kind of inspiration to me. I feel inside a lot like you.
It always bugs me that H did not put any D papers yet. There are no obvious reasons for that. He tells me his heart and brain are sure he needs to move on, but yet he is constantly present in my life. He is even nicer to me then he has ever been before.
He keep saying he is my friend, that he care deeply for me and will always be there for me.
Many times I feel like he is saying: "I need you to change and then you will accept the love I have for you".
I really hope we can keep our family together, I have good kids, they smart, honest, happy. We had many, many good times together as a family. I have faith, God, the Universe, or whatever it is have a plan for us and I am following the plan.
I am up to the task to become a butterfly. I know I am not so young. But who cares, it this is the time to wake up to a new me, then better later then never.
Labug, again thank you for stopping by. Your opinion means a lot to me.
I will keep all my friends posted here, so to have guidance and keep the hope of a better tomorrow.
Many hugs,
Pink
So, H came in today to pick up the kids. He came into the house and was
quite, gave me a brief hug and kiss. Waited a little bit and was gone.
Came back to just leave the kids. Gave me a brief hug and kiss and was leaving when I asked if I could say something to him.
I walked with him to outside and said that since I will probably not be seeing him tomorrow, that I would like him to know that was worth it, all the way.
He looked at me trying to make believe he didn't know what I was talking about. Poor job, I could tell he was pretending.
H: What was worth?
Me: Nothing, just want you to know that.
H: Why you saying this to me?
Me: Because I want you to know that 18years beside you was very worth it every minute.
H: And why you saying you won't see me tomorrow?
Me: Well, you were here today for the kids, I don't know if you have any plans with them for tomorrow.
Then H chokes, can't speak, just hug me very tight and for a long time.
Then, he says he really appreciate me saying it to him. That it means a lot to him.
He stand there looking at me, then I said that it was just what I want him to know. That I do not want to bother him.
He says I never bother him. We say good night and he left.
And, I feel like there is a monster in my stomach, I feel weak, lonely. I am paying a very high price for all my stupidities. I don't want to think it is all lost, but I can see he is trying very hard to detach from me.
Maybe I should let go today. I will try not to think much because my guilt feelings are killing me. I will wait until tomorrow is done and I can think better.
I have hope that some time from now I will look back and fell a little better, when pain is not gonna make my heart bleed so much like today.
Good Night,
Pink
Hi Pink
Sorry you had a tough day. I'm not sure about your convo with H in my mind. Was it more like pursuit (initiating R talk) or letting him go.
But the main thing to remember is that we detach in order to care for ourselves at a difficult time.
Feeling full of bugs today, so won't post further....but hope that today is a better day for you...:-)
Toots,
It's really a crying day for me today. I am leaving now to go to church with two dear friends of mine. I am catholic, but today I will go to a different church for the XMas celebrations.
One of my 180s is also showing that I care. One of the things I lack during my M was to speak out and let my H knows that he was very important for me. So, it may be wrong for DBing, but he also see that I have been changing.
H knows I am in therapy to clean my demons that will allow me to let people love me. He said last wed that he has faith in me, that I am a loving and kind person but that I keep hiding it somewhere.
So, I guess for my sitch it was not so bad to let him know that 18 years have value to me.
About my GAL activities. I need to get real with it. I need to get out of my comfort zone and do more stuff.
And the whole detach has been my big issue, I feel it very hard to detach from my H. I didn't even know how dependent I am on him.
I need to be honest with myself and do it. I keep giving excuses to let go. I really need to get down to the job.
I have been feeling overwhelmed though, dealing with those feelings from the past get me a little frozen. It's like being two persons in the same time.
Oh Gee, it's crazy,
Need to go
Pink
Hi There,
Had a tough day. But thanks for working, was so busy that couldn't even think much.
Going to my IC to start the new EMDR program to face some of my demons, the bad ones.
I know it is painful, but it's the only way I have to be happy again.
Tell you all later.
Pink
You can do it Pink.
The only way to get the end results (whatever they may be) is to walk through it.
(((Pink)))
How is it possible to be friends with a WAW who is involved in an affair? This is a serious question that I struggle with. My WAW said she wants us to work on our friendship. Wahhhhhtt? That is almost unbelievable when someone is consistently lying and cheating. How can I/one be friends with someone like that?
I honestly don't get it
Had a good session with my IC today. We started working on finding myself.
He pointed out how it was when I arrived there for the first time. I couldn't stop crying, blaming myself for the D, feeling like the worse person in the world.
He told me how much I have been growing and changing. He said that is very obvious that my perspectives about life in general have changed and for the better.
He asked what be a save place I could go to feel better about myself or when I am feeling depressed or anxious. It was hard to decide on a safe place, it is like I never tough about a safe place.
He asked me what is one thing that have been bothering me lately. I said that it is procrastinating. He then explain that procrastination is a result of fear.
Then I told him that one of my issues is fear. My insecurities, anxiety, complex of inferiority is all related to fear.
That's one big thing I had w/H. I felt really strong when he was around, I basically knew he always got my back. When he was away, I always felt I couldn't be complete. I that's what I need to work hard now, finding myself and being myself without much fear.
We started doing the EMDR program, then he asked me to close my eyes and go to my safe place, which I chose to be the beach. I started good, saw the water, the waves. Then I started following a lady that was walking along the beach, I noticed that it start getting dark, ugly dark, then I noticed that the lady was me and instead of walking on the sand, she was walking on mud. At this point my chest was hurting, I felt really uncomfortable.
He stop and said we will need to go very slow, this will be a long and painful process. IC wants me to exercise of finding a safe place. IC said that it is very important we find a safe place in order to start working on the hard issues. When I start the hard stuff then I will need to came back to my safe place.
I think the only word that comes to my mind now is HOPE. I am very hopeful that I start cleaning my issues then I will be a better person in a better place.
My emotions are very mixed up right now. Got very depressed reading and following KGirl's sitch. It was like I was feeling all her pain. In some ways I could see myself going through the final bid D and it is not pretty.
Well, I know it's not going to be easy but I need to do this once for all. Have been running from myself my whole life. It's time to smell the coffee and change. Not small or fake changes, but changes in my core as a person.
I have so much to learn, I feel like starting kindergarten all over again.
I mention that this Board have been helping me to keep an eye on the prize, better myself, detachment, boundaries. He is familiar with Michelle's work and agree with it.
Thanks to all of you, I think that reading other peoples conflicts, stories, successes, failures, pain, hurts have been helping me a lot. I find myself being normal e honest, it is amazing how much this board has been helping me to became a person I always want to be.
Love
Pink
By the way I have been reading Labug's sitch and I feel so like her. I also have been thinking about some questions that she was asked. Pretty good stuff to make you think.
I am very confused right now, my feelings for H are from loving him with my heart and soul to please disappear forever.
I am angry, feel disrespected, lonely, sad, happy, etc.. It's all together and I need to survive.
Calibri - thanks for cheering up. You are very sweet.
NAJ1964 - It's something very individual and every sitch is different, even if they seem similar.
In my case, I can't even prove my WAH is having an A. He told me he had feelings for someone else, then he told me he tried to go through with it and couldn't bring himself to cheat on me.
That I think he is lying and has someone? I don't know. That I think he is saying the truth? I also don't know.
I also have three children with this man and I want some kind of friendly R with him other then always fighting in front of the kids.
Besides, I really think that being his friend gets me closer to him every time. With time I will be able to show him some of the changes I make along the way.
I do not believe in hate, I can feel angry, upset but I do not hate anyone, even the people that hurt me badly in life, I do not hate them.
Although it suits my sitch, I know there are situations were the spouse is very disrespectful and unfair, so I guess it is easy not be friends.
Thanks guys, you mean a lot to me.
Pink
Hi Pink. Hope you're having a good day. I finally got broadband today, so I can speed type, rather than having to post using my phone - hooray!!
Glad to hear about your session. Sounds as though it went well. I think your IC sounds great and it's good you are underway with your treatment.
Any news from your H at all? Interesting to read the comments about being 'friends.' Is it possible? I agree with the 'for the kids' comment too. The phrase 'friends with boundaries' popped into my head...
Off to bed now. Hopefully my rattly chest will be better tomorrow. I'm due to GAL at a Xmas party tomorrow night!
:-)
Hi Toots,
Read your last post and will look for your new tread, seems like the one you had is closed now.
I also believe you need a lawyer to determined exactly what are your rights and in your unique situation what will be yours and his.
This socks, these whole money issue is annoying but necessary, but still socks.
I went to the court yesterday to get some more info, I have talked to a L on 12/4. She told me that my H will be broken after the D is final.
For now, the advice is that I do nothing, don't get a better job, don't move from the house, don't make extra money, and don't even put the D papers myself, what was one of my intentions.
I hate the fact that I am in Limbo Land right now, it is killing me to be so dependent. But for now, it's what I need to do.
I have been very black and white person my whole life, and I like to decide on issues as fast as I can. Waiting for something to happen and have my life on someone's hands is tormenting me.
I feel you are in the right path here, get yourself protected and go for what is your right to have. It also seems you made him a better man, like you said, he had nothing before being married to you.
Toots, regarding the D talk to others, I believe he will say or do things to justify his position. He is afraid of being judged, after all it is his second D, what does not speak very nicely about him in his own mind.
Would be nice if he can get some help and find himself. He is probably a troubled man with many issues unresolved and unless he gets some help, he will go through life doing lots of wrong and hurting others.
From the bottom of my heart, I hope you can find some peace with all what is going on. I know how hard it is, I am in the same boat here.
I have been exercising do not think much about my H. He has been quite these two weeks after the whole deal of that weekend that we end up in bed.
I think he realized that he was not giving me the time and space that I asked for. The bottom line is that without contact I feel our M is literally dying. In the same time, I know that things change from one day to the next and I don't know what awaits us in the future.
He told me that the first two weeks of January his company is holding the annual sales meeting. It means that people from outside US will be here. I assume that the French lady will be here too. So, we will see how that goes.
I would like to know exactly what is going on. Sometimes I think they have a R for a long time and that's why he asked for the D. But by his own words he said he did not have anything, no A, no R, that he just have feelings for someone and he thinks she has feelings for him.
When I spoke with a L, she said that if this is the case, then to just wish him good luck telling the new W that he is still married, did not do anything towards the D, have two minors to pay child support and will need to pay at least 9 years of maintenance for the XW. She said he will need to let the OP knows how broke he is.
I think H is not looking into this, he was never very good about resolving stuff in his life, neither he likes to face troubles, he just ignore things until they hit him hard and he needs to move.
Oh,well, it's not my problem and I can't do anything about it. I can only mind myself. I am getting better on this "can't control", "better YOU", feel good about myself business. I think it's been so long I don't really care about myself, it feels good to think about my priorities for a change.
I still need to do more of GAL activities. It's hard to find time for everything. I am going out "to dance" on friday, with some friends. I think it will be nice to see other people and have some fun.
Hope you have a good day, I will get ready for my busy day today. It's going to be a crazy one. I work with health and this time of the year is quite busy.
Hugs to you Toots. Keep yourself health, you will need to be in one piece now.
Pink
Sometimes being the best pink is all you can hope for.
Gal will it comes and things naturally change.
You can change your thoughts so therefore you can change the way things happen for you. There is no right and wrong.
Yes, Ggrass, you are right, it's all what I can do right now. It hasn't been easy with almost NC, just Kids stuff.
But, sometimes I actually enjoy. I am such a mess lately, and it's not literally. People say I am doing very well for someone that is going through this difficult time.
I really don't know what to feel anymore. I am not very persistent when it comes to love and friendship. Have been always like this. If someone does not like me you can be sure I am out of that person's way.
I just disconnect, don't make it important for me. My IC said that it is some kind of defense mechanism I develop since I was a kid. Probably learned from the times people hurt me.
Sometimes I am very afraid I will forget my H too, I will just let go and he won't mean anything for me anymore.
I know we need to detach, but in my case I end up detaching forever. I want to be with him again, recover my M and my family, but I don't know if I can.
I keep thinking that if he was able to tell me that he has feelings for someone else and just that makes me think that he can go and live his life with someone better then me, maybe more attractive, better job, better this and better that.
Then next thing I know I moved on. The only difference is that it is my H for 18 years and we had a family together.
Ohhh...Gosh... maybe I shouldn't fight, just let it happen.
I hope things get a little better between us both, I don't know. Nobody knows.
Pink
Pink,
What would your life look like if you didn't fight, and just let it happen?
Hey Pink
Thanks for letting me know my thread is locked....I hadn't realised. Need to think up a new title now..:-)
Calibri,
I am trying my best and my hardest do not fight. But it is in my nature. I am now fighting for a better job, a career maybe. I am fighting to detach from my H, I am fighting to get into a new life.
I really don't know what would be my life without the fight. I always think that if I want or need something I need to go after and do my best to get there.
With this situation with my H, it has been the first time I do not fight straight forward for something. I am letting it happen, and it is very hard to count the days and let it go.
Maybe you are right, I fight for things that are in my way, but they just happen to be in my way. My life keep taking turns I am not looking.
Maybe it's not that I fight for something, I just see an opportunity and get into it, with my heart and soul.
Pink
The hardest thing to learn is doing a nothin is an action.
I keep trying to explain this to one of my friends, she doesn't quite get it. The harder you fight the harder they fight back.
The ow in my sitch has posted a selfie of them as her profile pic on fb, she also responded to messages my mate sent last feb, which I asked her not to do. But why now. It's been over a year, who cares. Her message talks of us moving on???
Im not sure where she gets the idea we haven't moved on, since the local gossips are phoning me asking about my new bf! Lol
I am out making new friends, hell I'm asking blokes out. Not had much luck but that will come.
Journaling,
So last days, very busy with work, kid's school stuff, Xmas stuff, you know, end of the year, always a busy time.
So H has been very quite and does not call me or text unless it is necessary. Today I tough about sticking a needle on him. I woke up earlier and took a good shower, dressed up, nice make up on, high heels. Looking good.
When he arrived the kids and I were ready, I left the house w/the kids and walked to his car. I was feeling really good and had a big smile on my face.
Said hi and he asked me "How are you" I said I was fine and asked how he was doing and he said he was fine too. Don't know about that, he looks tired.
Well, I asked if he was going to pick up the kids from school today and he said there wouldn't be a problem. I told him it was really good because I wouldn't be around. That I was invited to a XMas lunch with the doctors from the amputee clinic at Children's Hospital. Then I said that needed to go and he said that was looking good.
I said thank you and see you later. As I was walking to the car I went back to his car and gave him a kiss and a hug. He said thank you.
Then I left...
Pink
Well done pink.
So Christmas outfit is ? Better get planing, don't hover on the day make sure you rip up the social scene with some hot single drs or nurses.
H asked if we could spend XMas (12/25) together. We agree that would be nice. Then talk about 401K balance so we can separate our finances.
That's is really great, spend XMas together making arrangements for the bid D. What a Hell this whole thing has been.
I said I tough he would spend XMas with his girlfriend and he said that he does not have one, he just have a W. And add saying he does not want to talk about it.
I sometimes think he is going crazy, but my reality is that he is still moving towards the D, making plans that I will keep the house and he will transfer the house just to my name.
Telling me that he is very, very close to his promotion. Tell you, I was feeling really good and then when I talk with him, I feel really crappy. It's tormenting me.
He is so into his own thinking that he does not see anything else around. He has been very selfish his whole life but now it's all about him.
I know I need to disregard his words, but he is so intense in this D stuff once in a while that he eventually talk about that I feel discouraged. I feel he made his mind long ago and now it is just logistics. He said that he is getting his 401K balance to see if maybe we can pay some of the house principal and it will be easier on me to have some lower payment.
Aghh... And I just want his to become a kite and be gone forever. It makes so much easier do not see or talk to him right now.
I have been quite dark but I don't know if it is working or not. I can think that when I go dark that he finds a way to talk to me about something. But I am not really sure if it is pushing him to get to the conclusion that he is better off without me.
I don't know. I also think (reading minds here) that his R with OW is not exactly a R yet. She is coming to Boulder in January for the sales meeting and I am guessing he needs to move towards the D so he can show something to her.
Wow...I have been good at this mind reading, supposing, maybe, guessing stuff lately because the truth is that I don't know anything that is going on in his life. And he basically does not know anything that goes on in my life.
By other hand, I am quite disgusted with him. Because I have been getting myself in a better place and working towards being a better person, I also think that he is being very disrespectful and does not deserve my sympathy.
Sometimes I think he is a JERK and I will be better off without him. But then, what do I do with this stupid heart that still loves him and desire to be with him.
My brain says let go and my heart says fight for. What an idiot combination I have now.
I will do nothing to ruin the chance of having a nice XMas, my kids deserve this. Even throughout this whole separation and divorce talks, they are straight A's, what great kids I have.
So I need to put my best face, smile, attitude and have XMas as a nice family that we are not.
Soon, I will write about my good news at work and GAL.
Just needed to vent here, so my head does not explode.
Pink
Hi Pink
Sorry it's so tough for you. Having a family Xmas alongside talk of D from your H. I'm sure you are doing the best thing just to focus on you and your boys and minimise things with H/detach as much as you can.
I do think you're doing really well. There's a lot on your plate right now - IC, H etc. - So, remember to give yourself little treats and breaks when you need them.
Great that you are able to have some fun and laughs with your boys.
I am slowly recovering from this horrible virus. I feel as though I am clawing my way back to good health. I'm trying to eat well, have fluids and do some gentle things.
I have no idea what H is doing for Xmas. I imagine OW will be back in the UK for the festive season. So, my worst mind reading has them making blissful and romantic Xmas plans together. My best mind reading has things being rather fraught with busy work schedules and H spending most of Xmas with SS and missing 'us.'
Actually, the best mind reading is no mind reading isn't it!!
It will be good to get out and about more. I have struggled with loneliness this past week when I haven't been well. For years in the past I have happily lived alone, but it is harder living alone at times like this and I have to work on it some more.
My PMA was so high a couple of weeks ago, I just need to get back to full health, get through Xmas and build up some more GAL activities in the new year. I'll get there.
Sometimes, it is tempting just to have a fast-forward button to press. If we did, I would fast-forward to 6th January I think. But I know we can't skip over it, we just have to go through it.
Sending hugs to you....Toots (())
Hi Toots,
I had some GAL activities this weekend, on friday I went to a nice hotel here in Boulder with some brazilian friends. We dance samba for about 2 hours and it was the best.
There were some guys that came over and talk, but I was not into this kind of stuff. I just want to dance and be with my friends. I can't even think about other guy, it's repulsive right now.
I was kind of sad, thinking I should have done this kind of going out and have fun with my H. This was something missing in our M.
But then I think that things were not so easy back a year ago. During this exactly time a year ago my older son tried suicide a few times.
Today I am going to church with a friend and hope to sing out loud and be happy with my faith.
Hope you get better, it's always awful to get such bug that last so long. It takes all your energy away. You will have a better PMA once the bug is gone. Your energy will be back and you will feel like doing more stuff. Give yourself time to heal well.
About your H, it's really weird that he does not talk to you. He is a mess, is not taking care of his issues and is already finding someone else. He is not going to have a good R with this OP. We need to solve out problems before jumping into another R and he is really messing up here since he didn't even talk to you yet.
Yes, this time of the year is very hard. It's not going to be easy, but then I think it is also an opportunity for my H to enjoy family once again.
The OW is coming to US from France at the beginning of Jan/15 for the big sales meeting, there will be a lot of time for him to spend with her. I am not very sure of what is going on with them, sometimes I have the impression that he has some going on with her but not really a formal R. Back in july he said that he had feelings for someone and he thought the person also had feelings for him.
Maybe that's why he didn't serve me with papers yet. He is checking his chances and if it doesn't work he thinks he can always come back. I won't say that it is not possible because I would like to be back with him. But the road will be very long for us to get somewhere. We will need to build a whole new R/M if that happen one day.
But for now I think it is almost impossible, with talks about financial, house, I am thinking that D is on the table and that is the direction our M will take.
It makes me sad but then I think that there were many things on him that I really did not like. Many times I really want to be far away from him.
We will see, he wants to make it all friendly and easy on him. I don't hold too much grudge, but I know I was not the one running away and having an affair, it was him and now he needs to deal with the consequences.
I think he saw a L and was told things do not look good for him financially and that's why he needs to get my best side.
I won't take what is not fair, but the law is clear about my rights and I will do whatever is necessary to get it.
I won't make it easy for him. If you want your adventures then pay for it. Be a man and face the consequences.
It's amazing how love can become something else, I love him with my heart and I despise him with my brain.
Take care, and keep eating, sleeping, taking fluids, medication and hope the bug will be in the past as well.
Lots of hugs to you too!
Pink
Hi Pink
I think I am finally on the mend. I feel much more 'well' today. Hung out with my parents this afternoon. Not seen much of them as worried about passing on my germs.
After such a long spell with a virus, I'm just pleased to be back in the land of the living and able to get out and about more. This time of year is hard enough in our sitches without being ill.
I agree with you about my H. It's bizarre isn't it. I'm pretty honest and tend to just get on with it if unpleasant or difficult things need to be done. But H has always been more of an avoider. It is weird that he has been saying to others our R is over for a couple of months now, but never to me. I just can't ever imagine myself doing that. He is in a bit of a mess I think, and I'm not going to rescue him.
If there are things he wants to say to me, he knows where I am! I have been in touch with his XW today. She and SS are coming for a visit to my new flat just after Xmas. She told me that SS will be with her from Xmas day onwards.
I have no idea what plans H may have. But I imagine OW will be back in the UK for the holidays. I had a worry today - what if he doesn't have many plans and feels really low.
I had to stop myself texting our mutual friend to ask her. But he has been on my mind today since I know SS is with his Mum from Xmas day onwards.
Good to hear about your dancing and church activities. I agree with you about the other guys - I still feel loyal to my vows at this point in time. I volunteer with a nice guy, who asked me if I am dating at the moment (he knows all about the sitch) and I told him no. I also have a friend at work, who I suspect is match making....again with a nice guy. It's nice to know that there are nice men out there if I decide to dip a toe in the water again!
Have a good day Pink! xx
H did text yesterday asking if he could stop by to get a shovel and some wood because he is going snowboarding today.
I said OK, no problem. Then he after a few minutes he did text asking if he could spend an hour in a house. I said OK, no problem.
It was about 7:30pm he arrived. I was doing some laundry and cooking dinner. He sat with the kids to see some football, then when I showed up he came to talk to me.
He start saying that since I told him on the phone the other day that sometime in the future we will need to talk about his affair so I would have some closure that he would like to answer any question I have. He said that first he did not and does not have an affair (really?).
He also said that never had anything with OW while we were together and he does not know exactly how things are now. I think I put a foot on my mouse. Not so much DBing. I told him I knew she was ..... and that she was the sales manager from France and that he could drop the whole theater.
Yakis! I should have control my words but I was so annoyed with his "I am not guilt buls...t" Then he said that she told him she is not married but live with someone for many years and that they are separated but live together yet. She also have a son 8 years old.
Then he said that she is not the reason of our D. The reason is because I was unhappy and he was also unhappy in our marriage. But I should always remember that he loves me a lot, and maybe I won't ever believe but in his way he will always love me and no one will ever have the same love from him. (yeh, right, I love you so much that's why I don't want even to work in our M, I am checking out).
He asked me what I have been doing and I told him some stuff. H is weird these days. He look at me like he would like to see someone miserable. Then from nowhere he says he always worry about me and he cared deeply for me. Whaaaat?
I told him I have been working with my IC on some of my childhood issues (he knows my issues) and that I am very hopeful to resolve them, with time. And I said I have been learning how to put myself as a priority. I told him I learned I need to be happy for myself, respect my individuality and have became a better person in the process.
At this point dinner was ready. After we ate, he asked me if we could go outside to talk a little. Then he says nothing (as usual, H is very quite always). He keeps looking at me, then I asked him "What's up?" and he says Oh, pink, nothing bad.
Then he says again that he cares deeply about me, that he loves me and he wants me to understand that. I told him I understand and I also understand when he said he does not love me the same way, that he is moving on to be with another person. H seems so mixed up.
I can taste that DBing is somehow working, I notice that he looks at me with admiration. Well, I can't have my hopes high because he did not say anything that would change the situation and the truth is that we will be moving towards the D soon enough.
But here we say do not pay attention to their words but to their actions, and his actions show that he is still with a lot of doubts about our R and it he is doing the right thing.
I keep telling myself I need to detach, but now I can also see that detaching is attracting him. The more independent I become, the more he gets mixed up.
Sorry I wrote so much, but my stomach has that horrible pain again, I feel so tired. It has been 5 months of craziness and the stress is piling up on me.
I need now to prepare for XMas. We will spend almost all day together, let's see what will happen.
Hugs to all
Pink
Gosh Pink. OW doesn't sound very 'available' does she? Lives half way around the world with someone else - but 'separately.' reminds me of my H and his OW!
It has the typical 'ring' of affair 'fantasy land' about it....even if just an EA
Love will conquer all! We'll overcome the fact that we have 4 kids between us, live on different continents and I'm married, plus you live (don't live?) with someone else.
These scripts really are quite banal and predictable arent thet? It's hard to see that this R is going anywhere much.
Mind you, the fantasy may be desperately chased for a bit...
I wouldn't lose heart now - and you may just want to play it nice & slow when it comes to any D stuff.
Give it all some time to fizzle out.
You take care....no more putting feet on mouses! Toots x
Sounds like my situation.
My WAW has her AP who is married with two little kids in another city. Her AP claims to live in a separate room sa they are close to splitting but she is conflicted. She is still in constant contact with the AP.
Now my WAW says that she knows this relationship won't go anywhere long term but it was a catalyst for her to see how broken our 19 year marriage was. WTF.
GG is right Pink...you need a nice Xmas outfit!
Confident, sassy Pink. What's your best colour - wear it. Don't go for anything baggy or 'mumsy.' More 'yummy mummy' Go for a nice form-fitting outfit in your best colour that you'll feel comfortable & confident in and that your boys will say - Wow Mum, you look great!
Make up and hair....and go very easy on the wine....if you have any at all. Plus, keep the focus on your boys and friendly/breezy towards H.
Don't think about D stuff. Remember, things are so uncertain right now, none of that means anything much. It's anyone's guess how it will all work out..
xx
Thanks bunch Toots. You and GG are right. I will go shopping for something cool, sexy (not much as I do not like appealing, but enough to drive him crazy.
Last time when we had a date, I had this very tight jeans pants and a white blouse w/lace. He said that I was very pretty and charming.
I always have make up on these days. Never know when I will see H around. My hair is natural crawly, black and long. Everyone says it looks really nice.
H will help cooking the whole XMas dinner, so we will spend a lot of time together. Need to have some goals and prepare myself to be nice. Sometimes I am too straight forward, but it can hurt more then help.
I keep thinking I do not want to get hurt again and I fear to expose myself to have hope. In the same time, I keep asking myself why H always want to talk about us, our R. I already told him several times that I understood his decision and will respect it. That he can move on and be happy.
Maybe it's guilt. My IC said that he is past the whole guilt feeling. He may still feel guilt but it is not the main reason anymore.
IC thinks that if I am not reaching to him and he is the one to always initiate contact and put himself in the position to discuss about our M/R, then it's because he consciously wants to check if the marriage has nay chance.
IC also said that H is very confused right now with the fact that he prepared himself to help me to go through this difficult time, and yet he sees me very happy, upbeat and uplifted, I tell him my new discoveries, adventures. My world is changing and getting better, instead, his world is shrieking an becoming a mess.
I really don't know but I am not going to lose him further, he is already lost, so What!!!!
About the Wine... OK GALS, got it, no wine on XMas, at least not more than a glass. When I have wine I feel really hard to resist the sex appeal. I feel like my body is on fire and my skin is claiming him. Well, too much, NO... NO...NO. of limits.
I will be red ridding hood and not the bad wolf!
The truth is that I feel pretty good hearing him saying that he feel along, misses his family, misses me and misses talking to me. And say that he hope he is taking the right decision because he is not sure if what he is doing is right or not.
I wish things could change soon, but this idiot OW is coming to US in a few days and who knows what is going to happen. Maybe a need to expect a long journey.
Thanks girls, you are the best, I will make you proud.
Gazillion Hugs,
Pink
Pink
Try non alcoholic wine, will look like you are drinking but you will know the absolute truth.
Then there are lovely cordials to have with plain sparkling soda or low cal lemonade.
I am already giggling with the deliciousness of it. I can lend you a pair of bright purple bed socks if that helps.
Vanilla
Pink,
First let me say again how much I appreciate your insights on my thread, it really helps keep my PMA. Next, obviously not a vet so take my comments with a grain of salt.
The truth is that I feel pretty good hearing him saying that he feel along, misses his family, misses me and misses talking to me. And say that he hope he is taking the right decision because he is not sure if what he is doing is right or not.
I wish things could change soon, but this idiot OW is coming to US in a few days and who knows what is going to happen. Maybe a need to expect a long journey
As you know my WAW had said similar things to me and like you, I know that here we believe in actions over words. HOWEVER, that being said I take those positive things that my W says as truthful in that particular moment in time.
I think that to some extent we do need to take into account what they say because IMHO, your H saying those things is a lot better than saying I hate you or I never want to be with you again. He may or may not have said those hurtful things before when he was just starting to be in the fog, but now that the dust has settled a little, he may be thinking a little bit more clearly and has little moments where he actually misses it again. Just my opinion. Keep your head up!
Thank you Tlee,
Even you say you are not a vet, but your opinion as a guy counts a lot. Sometimes I like to hear the guys input because you probably understand better how guys think.
I was at the movie theater tonight, my kids and I went to see "The Hobbit" (I loved the Elves as usual). H calls a few times, my phone was on vibration so it keeps vibrating all the time, so I text him saying I could not talk, sorry.
He then text he just would like to talk to me for a little moment. I text back saying I will be home late,then I add if this is about the XMas list from the kids. I know he sleeps early and it was almost 10pm. He text me asking me to call him next day so we could talk for a little while.
So, what is this he wants to talk that we actually need to speak with each other? I left the movie theater then call him. Obviously he is sleeping and I know he is tired from a whole day snowboarding. So I asked what he wants to talk about and he asked me if I had the XMas lists, and if I do to send them to him so he can check what the kids want.
Gee, why so much drama over a simple reply...Do you have the XMas lists already? I don't get it. He is the one that wants to D me, he is the one saying he has feelings for someone else, he is the one that left me. Why he goes around every stupid subject and make a big soap opera?
I really think that when he start feeling I am slipping out of his fingers, then he start this whole torture campaign of being in my life every single day.
I know we have kids together, but if he is trying to get rid of me, why is he doing this? Sometimes I tough he was doing these kind of things because he wants a friendly D, but the D never happen.
Guys are weird creatures, I can't get their whole psychology.
Again, thanks a lot for the positive comments, I also think like you. I am just afraid to go there and break my heart again. He can say all these things that makes me think there is hope, but the truth is that he is not saying he wants to work on our M, he did not mention he even feels like coming back home, he does not say he at least would like to date more often and see what could happen to us.
Maybe he thinks he is giving me some kind of support for me to rebuild my life and find someone else, so he wouldn't feel so guilt about living me at this point in life.
I don't know, sometimes I feel like he is doing the DBing on me. Lately, I actually feel good that he is not around. I had my independent life when I met H, it's coming back to me and feels pretty good to do whatever I want to.
Thanks Flee,
Pink
Change a couple of details in your story Pink, and you have EXACTLY how my W has been lately.. Funny how they do it!!..
Ever since I put a lot more effort in to detaching and sticking to LC, WAW has been doing the same thing as your H.. I have also felt that she has DB'd me as well!!..
Thanks Vanilla for the advice, I will sure get some of the sparking soda, I like it.
Please, do not think that I drink a couple glasses of wine and get drunk. I need to drink kind of 2 bottles to get dizzy.
I do not have the habit of drinking, I go months without any alcohol at all. I think we started talking about my drinking because I had a date w/H and got wasted. One thing you can be sure, I was not driving, he was driving so I could drink. We actually agreed on that before hand. And I had a lot of wine.
Anyway, I will be careful and sober to remember everything H will say that day.
Thanks Vanilla,
Pink
LovemyW,
Thanks for posting on my tread, I will check your posts soon.
It's really curious how he behaves like he does not want to let go. Sometimes it feels like I am the one that left him and he is the one that was left.
As soon as he feels I am sleeping out of his finger tips, then he start this campaign of showing up, calling, text. I just would like to know why.
In anyway it is not my problem. He is the one that needs to deal with all this OW drama.
I feel more and more that I want to detach. The pain goes away and maybe the love will go away too. Don't know what will happen.
Hugs,
Pink
It's not about the drinking alone Lisa Xmas can be an emotional time and Ilike you I don't drink a lot nor do I get drunk easily, but letting my guard down even a little tiny bit around my H is not what I want to do. So I drink the soft stuff until I ca let loose.
I want implying a weakness for drink, heavens no. Lisa this is a wonderful occasion for you and I imagine you I all your gorgeousness.
Vanilla
Hi Pink, just another male pov, your H has a huge connection to you. No matter who comes into his life or who he thinks will improve his life they are not you. Its very easy to get attached to someone else if your perception is that all is not perfect at home but reality starts to bite when the person you did not want starts to move away from you. You seem to be DBing well and even if it seems like he does not notice he does. He will be watching every response and text you make. I don't believe anyone walks away from a spouce and family with 100 % confidence (unless abuse or the like). As a man I started Dbing the day W left, I was open to her but never once mentioned her flat, her life outside or how she was, I would comfort her re kids and validate her choices while disagreing with them. I had numorous texts along the lines of ' you are coping better than me ' or ' glad your doing so well about this, sorry i'm such a state" . I made it clear she is welcome home IF we start to work on our M but it would take a long time. Your H knows he is losing alot, he has to, your history together might be tarnished in his mind now but he will have moments of clarity caused by life, a memory, etc. Obviouslty I don't know your H but please believe me, he is temp checking you and you seem to be doing perfect. I have read your threads from the start and you seem really strong, keep the PMA because even if your H is stupid enough to lose you, it will be someones elses HUGE gain ( if you think their good enough).. PS I am picking up a grand cherokee today or tomorrow ( good for Colorado, just saying !!!!!)
Thanks Vanilla and Rd for the encouragement, I can use it.
Vanilla, you are right. As much as I want to be just OK with it, there is always a lot going on when H is around me. It's hard to be close to someone that shared a life with you and pretend you are just friends.
I will be very aware and careful during the time we spend together so I can make the most of it. Like you said it very well, do not let your guard down at all times and use this time to share and show H what he will be missing.
I never been super happy around XMas, the wounds of growing up with an alcoholic father that would always make a big deal around the holidays (my dad passed away a few years ago). Missing my family that is 5000 miles away, in Brasil. All together and XMas was never 100%.
This year it needs to be about the new me. I am old enough now, have big kids, friends, it need to be XMas about what I built and my own family moving forward.
Good advice, I promise to be a good girl. Yes, and I am all my gorgeousness. I am lucky to look about ten years younger then I really is. Now that I lost so much weight, I look really good. So yes, I will be in my gorgeousness. I also have been accepting that I am a very nice person.
People love me, they say I am very kind and fun to be with. I am light spirit, do not bother judging people. I just accept them for who they are. My vision about myself has been changing, I have been more gentle with myself.
All the work that I have been doing w/my IC, close friends, reading and mainly in this board have been a step forward in accepting that I am a very good person with strong personality, lots of good values, honest, caring, with a clean soul, no secrets no more, with a strong faith in my God and religion.
Wow, the way I say seems like the D is the best thing that ever happen to me. And it is, for the first time in my life I came clean with myself, it's all out there. I am facing my worse demons, cleaning the hardest skeletons in my closet. But in a way I found myself and I am very happy with who I am now.
I have been feeling a lot of peace in my heart, a lot of hope for tomorrow, I am getting strong again and I am loving it
Thanks Vanilla, you are awesome!!! Look what you brought out of me today.
Rd, thanks for the male input on my sitch. It really help to understand my dinosaur (that's the way the kids and I talk about H these days). My IC have the same opinion, he told me my H has a very strong emotional connection with me and it is the hardest thing to break.
He also said that my changes are very obvious and for the better side of myself. So H is very confused and is questioning his choices and decisions.
IC was always making me see that H was not trying to be mean to me but he was instigating me to do the whole beg, plead and pursue because it would make easier on him to just blame me for the brake of the M and let go. The fact that I apologize for being a b**ch wife, a nagging person, to make him unhappy for so long... it broke his defenses. Since the beginning I have been understanding and always tell him that it is painful but he has all the right in the world to pursue his happiness and I would and will never stop him.
Yes, we have a ton of good memories. 18 years of many adventures. All we have we built together, on our own. Hope we have a chance. Hope things turn around. It is not all finished yet, as a matter of fact, nothing changed besides the fact that he is not in house and has someone out there.
We will see, who knows. I am doing great in detaching because it is in my nature. Have been like this in regard to people. When I feel not loved, I just let go. It's very easy for me, I just off, don't talk anymore, don't call, don't want to see the person, it is like I turn the page and done.
Sometimes I even think that 180s for me would be to show more caring and connection. My H even says many times that I do not love him for a long time. And this 180s is very hard for me right now. I have been very jealous, I keep thinking that my H kissed, hugged and made love to this OW, and that just make me to want to ignore him and be as far as I can.
Oh my, need to work on those feeling today and tomorrow and get on some nice place with those feelings or I will blow and tell him to go to hell once for all.
Need to work, catch up later.
Thanks,
Pink
Hey Rd,
Congrats on the new Cherokee. We are getting a lot of snow in the mountains but not much in Boulder.
Last 24hours we got 29" of snow in the mountains.
We will get some snow XMas evening.
Cherokee is the best around here.
Have some fun with it. Go for a ride with the kids, see the XMas lights. They will love it.
Pink
I wouldn't like to be so hopeful, but it's hard to ignore what is happening. I see that my DBing is slowly working miracles.
Sunday H came over to the house, had dinner with us and talked about our R and why we got were we are now. I apologize again for being so stubborn and let our M slide and make him so unhappy and validate his words saying that I am working on myself and will give me a chance to have a more health R with someone else if that is one day to happen in my life.
I told him he deserves to be happy in his own life and if the OW can offer him that then I was not and will not be in his way ever, that I care about him and wish him a good life.
On monday night he kept trying to talk to me and by coincidence I could not talk to him right away. When I finally called him he was very tired and sleepy and just discussed about XMas gifts for the kids and asked me to call him the next day so we could talk for a little while.
Next day I did not feel like calling him, so I just sent him an email with the kids XMas list. He text me saying he knew I was very busy at work but to call him when I had a few minutes to talk. I called him on a hurry during my lunch break and he was so nice. He said he could help bringing lunch for the kids and that he could take S17 to guitar lesson if that would take some load off my shoulders.
I said that would be great because I was super busy and then I could make dinner a little earlier. When he came back with S17 he stayed in a house. While I was making dinner, he got a chair for himself and sat there with a cup of tea and want to talk about my baptism on a Christian Church. He asked me why I decided to change church and if there was someone that influence on my decision.
I explained him that at my deepest pain I found I was so alone and the only one there with me was God, my faith and that gave me hope to start the next day.
He still insisted asking if there was anybody, why that church. I explained that it is a church close to us and that I feel very comfortable there and feel my heart fulfilled. I don't really know what is thinking but I decided it's not my problem, he can think whatever he wants.
H said that he saw and felt something is different about me since he saw me last sunday. (he is seeing my detachment, he is feeling my distance, with grace, gentleness but distance).
I told him that during this time I hit the bottom, found a strong faith in myself, gave priority to resolve my own issues, I am working with my IC to clean some old and very painful wounds and that it is making a huge difference in my life.
I told him I have a support group that tells me I am worthy and I am a good person and that without this group I would never get where I am now. "All of you guys".
H told me he is not doing much and then told me about his work and his new promotion and all the adventures at work for about almost an hour. Just the way he always did when we were together.
I listened to him, did not say much but showed him I was paying attention. Towards the end I said some words, he knows I understand a lot of what he is talking about since I used to work in the same field.
I tough he would leave, but he invited himself for dinner. Started making some Ice Tee, helped set the table and then asked if he could sit at his place. I said that it was OK today but he should remember that I am the head of the family now and that place belong to me. This is some italian thing and we both have italian background, so he knows what I mean.
He ate and said that it taste like home. I said I was glad he liked and that he is welcome anytime he wants some fresh food.
(well, get a H by the stomach).
After dinner, I started cleaning up and we were all talking about football. The subject was hot and the kids were discussing about who would make the super bowl this year. It was very family talk, great stuff.
H, S17 and S14 moved to the family room, then S20 started some blueberry muffins from scratch. When he was almost done, S17 and S14 joined us in the kitchen and started joking about the muffin color since S20 broke the blueberries. We were having so much fun, we laughed and were joking about the muffins.
H was just sitting there by himself looking at us. At some point he closed his eyes and took a nap. Then when the muffins were ready, the kids asked if he would like some and he said it was getting late and he need to leave. I was around but I did not gave him any attention. I made myself busy.
H asked me to walk outside with him because he would like to talk to me. OK, lets talk. I sat on the bench outside and he stood right in front of me. He said that he recall that sometime ago I told him that I knew how disgusted about me he was. H said that he would like to make it clear that he was not disgusted.
H said that there were times when he was very upset with me but never disgusted. He said I am a very valuable person in his life, that I am a beautiful woman and he thinks I am sexy, gorgeous, charming and attractive woman that he feel in love one day. He said that many times I felt he was looking down on me but that he never felt this way. That he always respected me and always tough very high about me and always knew how capable I am.
I then told him that I appreciate all what he was saying to me. That it makes me feel good and I understand that he cares about me and thanked him for doing so.
I said to him that I am practicing to look at myself as a valued person, a good human being that does good stuff for whoever is around. I told him that I started understanding why I have so many friends and people in general that loves me. I said to him that he felt my inferiority complex for many years and I am sorry I put him through this but I coming to terms with myself to accept that many, many people are attracted to me, like me a lot because they see what I tried to ignore about myself. I am a nice and caring person.
I told H that many tears were dropped, but I am thankful I am having this opportunity to find myself and get myself in a better place. That me alone is happy, that I am not walking in front or behind anybody, I am walking my life and it is enough for me.
H then said that he is very, very proud of me, that it makes him extremely happy to see me this way and that he can tell how much peace is inside my heart. I mention that he knows me very well and that he can see how much I have changed towards myself and that it makes me look even more beautiful.
H then took my hand and said "Come here". He put his arms under my winter coat, look into my eyes and gave me a huge hug, it was a very warm hug, very tight and with so much feelings. I hugged him back very lightly. He was hugging me yet and said thank you, thank you so much... I just said you are welcome. I don't really know what he meant with the thank you, but this time I let go, no explanations to break the lovely moment.
He gave me a strong kiss on my chick, kissed my neck gently, put his head on my shoulder, hugged me a little more and then had tears on his face. Did not cry, but had tears going down his face. I did not say anything, I did not hug him back the way I want to, I was just there, nice, gentle, attentive but not in it. He looked in my eyes again and said he need to keep going. I said for him to drive safe and good night.
Then he said, I will see you tomorrow. Probably because he is making a big deal about buying the XMas gifts, It was always my job, I always decided everything, now it is his turn.
I don't want to be so hopeful, but I can't ignore that the DB is working. My detachment, what is getting easier for me, is somewhat making him to feel that I am not there a 100% as before. I can tell he feels I am moving on without him in the picture, that I accept the fact that he is moving forward with his life and I am building a life for myself without him.
I know he is probably very confused yet, but I can see that all my efforts in DBing is paying off. I just hope that I am not really letting go. I am also very confused and have been hurt, so I need to be careful I will be there if he comes back. It happen to me before, I want the love and then I start to walk in opposite way to avoid the pain and when the person comes back I am too far gone and don't feel anything.
Well, I will not worry about that now. I know I love this man and he is a good person. We had a rough time in our M, some things were not even related to our feelings as a couple but they just put a lot of stress in our M. Who knows, maybe we can rescue something beautiful we had and we forgot was there.
Love you guys, your support to stay on track may be the glimmer I have now. I felt there is a chance. I don't know for sure what will happen, but I have a little hope now.
Hugs to all
Pink
Your story was wonderful Pink. I am so happy you got to experience that. Stay strong and I really hope this is the beginning of a good period for you and your H.
Fantastic and touching. You should write books !!!!! I was really moved and it looks like he is starting to realise what he is losing Well done , you were perfect Really cheered me up. Rd
Wow, what a beautiful experience. Best wishes! No expectations, remember, just keep on doing what you're doing.
Hi Pink
I'm pleased for you, for what happens. It does sound like your H cares very much. Keep things up on the DB front, and have a merry xmas!
Toots x
Pink,
So happy for you and H. Like everyone said before me, no expectations, and don't pursue. Keep doing what you are doing because it seems to be working!
Hope you have a Merry Christmas, keep your head up.
To all my best buddies here,
Have a lot more to tell about H. It's really amazing. Right now he just texted that he is coming over so we can both wrap the kids gifts.
His idea: Let's give some cash for the kids and they go out to eat something while you and I have a wrapping gifts part, just the two of us.
Wow, H was never into wrapping gifts, it is the first time in our lives.
Will keep DBing, it's working.
Thanks guys for being here for me, it means a lot.
Hope you all have a very Merry Christmas.
Pink
Pink I feel so thankful for you right now. I feel happy reading your good feelings in your words. You sound excited. Yes DBing is working for you tonight. Keep it up! H is being drawn to your detachment and confidence. I really hope you both have a very Merry Christmas.