Old Thread here
Old Thread Link (WAW - One month in but looking for coping advice) Morning,
old thread locked so I thought I'd start a new one. Not much changed, W texted me to say S is a little poorly (which I wont go into here) but wanted to know how H hunting was going. Said that the flat I looked at was too small and she said lots more coming on.
Said I had cancelled a couple of viewings and Im not rushing since not much will change until she and S are in their own location I wouldnt go into more details but this is basically because I know (W told me) one of the main reasons for W being reluctant to allow S to stay is because of MIL reaction to what S says when he goes back there. Even if I move I cant see this changing as I will still have a different mind set and more technology.
So if I move I cant see much changing on S staying over, I dont want to stay here really but I dont see the point in rushing to something Im not madly keen on just to go, I also have the impression that if I move (and here I should point out that this apartment is owned by a company MIL runs but I have no interaction with her) MIL will suggest W moving back in at a reduced rent (no one has said this but I know its how MILs mind works - she will also retain "control" of what W and S are up to). Last time W and I spoke about that option she had said she thought about it but didnt want to.
W then immediately (and she never replies immediately) to say she didnt understand what not much change meant she then moved into light texting with me on TV shows.
I wouldnt be drawn into a long drawn out discussion on moving on texting, supposed to be meeting up with W and S to take him out this evening - not sure thats happening since we're both a bit lurgied - and I'll talk to her about it then if she wants to know more.
Then crashed out since Im full of cold messaged her this morning to see when she wants to meet up but not had a reply yet.
Not sure but W seems conflicted or is cake eating and getting nervous whenever I step away from what she thinks is the script, I honestly dont know at this point if she's building up to wanting to make moves to reconcile (and no Im not building expectations except that she will flip flop again) or if she and her mum are just trying to get me to vacate the apartment so she can get some space. The latter would seem odd since W has been in tears to get away from MILs control and before all this was in tears to get away from this apartment due to noise, stress and a lot of other things connected to living here and not to me.
Confused, sick and feeling very low and worse cant go swimming until this lurgy passes
Edz
I think it maybe a good idea to stop discussing your house hunting with your W .
It seems to be something that gets you down.
Can you not just stay where you are until things are a bit clearer with your W ?
Hi South
W keeps raising it but I get your point hence I tried to head away from the conversation. I'll try harder on that one.
I could its just the issue with S sleeping over which definitely wont change while Im here (and may not anyway see previous) and technically being tied to the property of MIL.
Getting over this cold first and then see how I feel, just hate the idea of the holidays here although they wont be great anywhere to be honest!
Just a quick update, met up to pick up S tonight to take him to dinner, didnt want to get into the housing situation but sure enough W confirmed she wants to move back in to the apartment if I move out. She wants to be in by Christmas if possible before she has a major bust up with her parents.Pretty much the tenancy means if I dont go she can ask her mum to activate the two month clause and I'd have to leave in January anyway.
Sigh.
So I either push myself out or push S unfairly in the middle of a battle royale get W irate and kybosh any hope I have. Great.
Oh well Rightmove here I come I suppose.
Edz
Think I've seen this written before and it was something like .
Don't make things easy for the WAW .
All things like she made her bed so she can sleep in it . The grass isn't always greener on the other ride etcetc.
So let's get this right you can't have S stay over at your place but W wants you out so she can move in .
Your situation seems insane. It would explain why W is asking so many questions about your house hunting .
hopefully a vet can put there views maybe mr bond .
Sounds like trying to stay is just an argument for arguments sake. But there does seem like a double standard being applied over S staying over.
Feels like there should be an assertively stated boundary in there but not entirely sure of the best way to say it.
I'd guess something like
'I understand your wish to move in by Christmas and I am taking the steps I need to to help you achieve that but I would prefer you refrained from continually asking me about it. It is also clear that there is no issue with S staying in the apartment and so I would like to discuss the arrangements for this to happen in the bear future'
I'm not great at this so I probably not that but its maybe a starting point.
Vets input needed me thinks.
How about u do what's best FOR YOU, not your W. If that happens to be the same thing so be it. U can't dictate her life, don't let her do that to u. But be in emotional control and pleasant whatever u decide. My 2 ¢
Thanks for the feedback guys.
Was in a serious state today and set myself away to think in a dispasionate way.
I cant think of a single upside to staying here beyond some weird need to get her to realise the manipulation her mother performs on her, I don't see that would work really and even if it did what would it do to help? I cant think of anything beyond putting S in an unpleasant situation slap bang between MIL and W, exactly the sort of situation my 180s are supposed to be moving away from.
I didnt want to move here in 2010 and although its spacious its in disrepair (and MIL/FIL are lacklustre at repairworks)
So to my choices as per bravos point to do whats best for me.
Move, but dont pick any old place for speed, pick something I'll enjoy and S will enjoy and that has room for another person, the door is open for that to be W but I need to make sure I dont have any expectations that that will happen and she may just choose to carry on. However doing so has no down side to W and shows some of my 180s on intransigence and caring for S.
If I choose not to which I considered I will have to move by, at the latest, feb under the tennancy and I will have been pushed out, W will have had 5 months of conflict with MIL and S will have been in the middle.
Its a given my birthday and christmas are pretty much not going to be what I want, I can try to aim for having S shared over christmas and W has made some suggestions splitting christmas day and him sleeping over so I need to let go of hope for a "disney" happy ending, its not going to happen.
I get the double standard thing, I confronted her on it. Her answer did make sense, at the moment S would come to me have his own room, tech, space, fun then go back to MIL no room, no tech once I move he has a nice room and facilities in both places hence the difference. Effectively the issue isnt me, its the involvement of MIL this removes her from the situation.
So whats best for me short term is to get out of here and break my link with MIL and also a new space and room to build, gives me an opportunity to set up a nice "home" for S. Middle term it will be a better maintained property and will remove the PIL involvement in my life and give S a bolt hole thats ot connected to them. Long term, who knows, maybe a nice home environment will be a pull factor to W, although that cant be counted on.
So thats where I am, apart from trying to "punish" under a 'youve made your bed' scenario I cant think of any benefit to me either in DBing or my happiness, to stay here.
I'd welcome any more input guys, Im trying to stay afloat in the tidal wave of confusion but I cant keep up with W's points. W has said, Im not mind reading, that she isnt trying to push me away, she's said - after I pointed out she wasnt wearing her rings - that this was not a point and she had been earlier the same day. She says she just wants space without MIL to think and see what she should do next, I cant count on anything coming of that, if - indeed - any of what she's saying is even true and this is not just a backup plan she's building in case the living alone is not something she wants.
So, for now, my decision is to look for something else. From there I dont know yet.
I am by no means a vet or qualified for advice. I see your sitch as a tough one for sure. The only thing I can gather in all of this is that for whatever reason (whether its because of prior issues in M, the separation, or part of who she is) she is trying to control her situation and those involved. At the same time it seems she really isnt thinking fully for herself in all of this.
The fact that she hasnt been upfront about the her moving in seems to show two things. 1) She is trying to get it done in a sneaky way 2) She will use conflict if need be (by using MIL) but she herself is not interested in major conflict with you.
For me I think that your biggest issue right now for the time being is the involvement of MIL. Yes staying makes a statement and gets her to lie in her own bed. but it also causes a lot of conflict and a battle royal between you and MIL. The plus side to a move is having her being less of an influence by W not living with her. doouble standard or not the key here for me is if it gets me more time with my kids I would take the hit for it. I am moving from an awesome place in FL with access to beach and mild winters to a frozen tundra. All because I want to have more time with my kids. your in my thoughts and prayers man.
Just my opinion but I think you hit it square on with your first option. Move but at your pace to somewhere you are happy with where you can set up a room for your S. Let him get involved in decorating etc. Use it as bonding opportunity with him.
Personally I don't follow your W reasoning. S isn't allowed back to his bedroom and his stuff because he doesn't have it at MILs. Don't get it but that's not unusual at the moment.
Thanks guys, I really appreciate your input and your thoughts.
CMS I agree, MIL has had a hand in this from the begining, dont know if you read my first thread about the postal redirect but thats not my W, thats a MIL plan. She's a schemer and she decides if you wont play her game you are a target, sounds mean I know but its her.
Jim, cant say I understand anything that W is coming up with at the moment, one minute the "space" is to allow her to get away from being controlled the next its because she wants to work on our M but she wants to decide if she's trying to get away from MIL or because she wants back in. Its enough to make a calm person baffled let alone someone with their heart in bits.
Ultimately I agree it boils down to my goals, what are they? They are to rebuild and strengthen my relationship with my Son and if even feasable to reconcile with W. Neither is served by staying both by moving, so, even if Im playing W / MILs game, moving it is.
Again, thanks all, you are all in my thoughts as well.
More journalling really.
Spent a chunk of the weekend "driving by" potential places. Nothing really looks great, only comment from W was to say I had previously said you cant always get what you want, which is true but I was talking about properties when we were discussing renting at twice the amount we could afford before this year of hell started. Didnt respond just let it go.
Feeling flattened right now, Im digging down to get some reserves but between work, this bug I had and all thats going on here Im feeling emotionally and physically exhausted.
Been working like a banshee on 180s and GAL (as much as Ive been able to while sick) but I just cant envision my life without W on a long term basis, thats something I really need to work on as theres no way I can let myself expect that to happen, W still says she just wants space and is still considering coming back, I cant see it as she's been away 3 months now, why would being back in the apartment change that?
Need to get more direction sorted, when I get down I try to think about what happyness looks like to me, of course ideally my family together and working on a happy relationship but what if thats not feasable? I know I dont want to be alone for the rest of my life, there's no question of dating or anything along those lines right now, even if W said it was the end of the road I'm not ready and anything I entered into would likely be a disaster.
My relation with S is good but I cant work more on the "Dad" side of it until he's staying over, commented on that to death but W aknowledged the issues arent with me there.
I know I've made good progress on my relationship with me but the lonliness aspect is causing me problems right now, I think its feeling so close to something changing but so far away. The UK is also starting the ramp up to the holidays with family stuff everywhere and me out and about or sat at home alone, W is also firing over suggestions for Christmas including swapping S part way through Christmas Day with W having him Christmas Eve and me on Boxing Day. I dont want him to feel "juggled" and the while I am delighted at the thought of seeing him on the day the thought of Christmas Day without W (our first apart in 15 years) causes a feel of panic that I need to quickly back away from.
Cant help feeling that what I do, say or become just doesnt matter right now. I know all those changes are for me this is not a case of changing to impress - I also know I had issues with codependence which is a 180 thats difficult for me to deal with, but this knowledge although it helps with GAL and tuning my 180s does nothing to stop me feeling completely abandoned in the empty evenings, my hope is that aftermoving I will get S more and wont be alone so much (this is after GAL activities, I can keep myself occupied in the day and up to the evening) and so kick that mind set into touch.
So suppose must get moving on moving....
Feels like there should be an assertively stated boundary in there but not entirely sure of the best way to say it.
Just while I remember I did put this into practice. In conversation when W was saying maybe I should just go for this first place Im seeing tonight I replied with something along the lines of
I'm going to see it, if it fits my needs and will be good for (S) then I'll see if I can do it. I'll let you know what my decision is.
I'm in no way convinced she's really going to take notice of boundries as she just expects her mother and her will get their way on this. But the good news in that (which I realised last night) is any two month notice restriction in the agreement is pretty much meaningless meaning if I find the right place I can move now not have to pay two more months and try to synchronise moving. One - very small - bit of good news from the weekend.
And another update, saw the house this evening road its in is a little cramped but offroad parking and nice inside (or will be when the current tenant takes their stuff out) so paid the fees, so now on a countdown to december 6th to move, not sure how to feel about that.
Sounds good. Congrats on the house
Also sounds (to my limited knowledge) like you handled that conversation with your wife really well.
Edz
Good news on finding a place so quickly .
You should look at it as a new start for your S and yourself and then possibly your W
South
congrats on finding the place. Its a step forward either way and maybe it will allow more room for DB and the new you to take place. I know there will be lots of different emotions as they day approaches but know that your not alone.
My latest mantra is "this too shall pass."
Many thanks all. Ironically one of my 180s is trying NOT to be the Mr Fixit on everything, in these cases its handy though! Ran through 25ish properties, saw about 5 in person before seeing the house (been trying to get into it since last Tuesday as suspected it would be first in rents it)
Thanks for the comments on the conversation with W, interesting that I didn't feel it was difficult to say. As I said no idea if it made any difference as I did end up going for it anyway but I feel it was my decision which is good.
Took S for Pizza tonight and W came along, we had a very brief chat about moving and who's taking what. I'd been dreading it as its another "end point" but it didn't feel that way. While S sorted his ice cream and various dink refils we did chat about Christmas and possible options - too early to decide I think.
We did briefly touch upon our future, I've said all along that if she wanted to part I dont want it, I dont agree but I cant stop her and would rather work on it. If she does go down that route I will be civil and will always work for the best of our S but I cant be buddies it would just be too painful and she appreciates that. I will, however, never be adversarial it doesnt help anyone and I never want S to be in the line of fire. I said that I'm doing what I need to do and she's doing the same, I want us to work on things together and if she decides thats what she wants she knows where I will be.
After that there's not much I can really do. In another thread I read that you can be the lighthouse but not the tug boat, I like that, I'm sad about where I find my M, I'm lonely right now but I have a vague path to follow, a lot of challenges not to mention financial hills to climb and a long way to go to be the Dad I want to be. I'd also love to work on building a new relationship within my marriage but thats not just my decision and I can only hope my W gets to the point of deciding thats what she wants during her space to think.
For now, thanks for all the input guys, lets hope we all get where we want, or at least need, to go.
Well, a dull day by yesterdays standards. Work (from home as my desk at the office is in use by someone who needs a hot desk) and cooking dinner. briefly sat on by both cats and now breaking bad continuing. This bug has nearly gone at which point I'll thankfully be able to get back to swimming which will be great. Was planning on some walking after work but the weather was god awful.
Friday, Saturday and Sunday will be busy with the delayed card meeting I promised my son from last week, begining the loooooong packing task (anything my Ws not keeping I've got to get packed up and out of the garage / dumped and ready) and swimming on sunday.
Brief hiatus on feeling low yesterday with positive action but today is a bit back in the dumps after the busyness of work in the day. Not overdramatising the situation Im not bawling my eyes out, just feeling empty and low again.
As I said, dull.
Self indulgent journalling again, sorry!
Lousy, lousy night. The weather was very windy and it sounded like tiles were going to get removed at times. Everything was weighing heavilly on me as well, by 3am gave up and carried on and finished my breaking bad marathon (didnt like season 5 particularly but 1-4 were great, definitely should have stopped there). Eventually dropped off at 4:30 ish and then up again around 7 never mind shower and coffee would have liked a shower of coffee but eventually got going.
Been working on my envisioning over the past couple of days to try to lift myself out of a negative spiral. What does a happy life look like to me (mentioned this a few posts ago) still find myself feeling empty and missing the companionship of my W and S, even with GAL life seems empty and I felt like a lot of my reasons to plug away at a job I dont like very much arent there, yes I have bills to pay and debts (boy do I have those now) but I caught myself feeling so what, give up, doesnt matter really as no one cares. Tried to act quickly to squash that line of thought with thinking of the way life can change so quickly. Just the other day W and S and I sat down and had pizza and enjoyed each others company, less than 3 months ago W was sending me dour, cold emailed letters telling me all the reasons our marriage ended.
She isnt sending me divorce papers, she still says she's thinking about rebuilding (although as I've said I struggle to believe that she will do so and still feel manipulated somewhat), my relationship with my S is getting better and stronger and when we talk its generally positive.
But, but..
I'm impatient, I miss her, I miss him. I want to show her these changes that she and he both have commented on arent for show but are making me a better person and wont be undone and I want to do that with them as a family. I want them to be here and to move into a new home, a new start, with me. I want..... too much, too soon.
I recognise all this, I know it just wont happen, W is busy with S's HE and although she has some space this week (MIL/FIL are away - how I wish they wouldnt return) its not going to make a difference this week, the doorbell wont ring and be them ready to move back in. Maybe, maybe we'll spend some time together at Christmas (W was hinting on something more than just passing S over on Christmas Day) but I'm not putting any hopes on that (dont believe anything said, half of whats done).
Even when Im busy working (which is difficult right now as Im not focussed) or at the swimming pool (which Im really missing with this virus) or on the miriad of things connected with trying to move etc I still feel almost hollow.
So the envisioning. What will happiness look like to me in 3/6/12 months? A new home will be a good start, I want it to be warm and welcoming (or as much as I can make it in the financial situation Im in) I want S to be around and part of that home as much as he can be and I hope to not be alone this time next year. Right now I hope against all hope that this will mean W is working with me on our R and marriage. Its a long time away and yet around the corner.
I was reading about the stages of acceptance and I do firmly feel like Im in depression right now, the anger and bargaining are gone (at least for now) again, I'm being as smart as I can and trying to book another counseling session for myself. I hope that restarting exercise this weekend will also help but for now venting on here also seems to lessen the pressure somewhat.
Thanks All
You sound melancholy. Don't worry things will get better
When you do your envisioning try it as what kind if person you want to be rather than what your situation will be. Imagine some of the kinds of situations you would have handled badly and envision how you want to handle them in future.
I know you want your family back (believe me I know that feeling too well) but focus on making yourself better and the changes permanent - they can't help but notice.
Hi
following on from the above, firstly I should point out i raise none, absolutely none of this kind of issue in front of W, a calm PMA is all thats shown and I remain calm, happy, balanced and occasionally funny thats it.
Second Im looking for a little advice. I'm obviously not in NC and theres no one else (unless she's hiding them in a cellar somewhere from S) but I do try to limit my coms as otherwise I could easily go overboard, dont try to push anything R, dont start conversations unless they relate to S, something we need to get done or a light carefree invitiation (i.e. taking S for Pizza she's welcome to join if she would like, if its a no theres no issue).
With the moving coming onto the agenda I'll obviously be taking most of the contents of the apartment such as TV etc. Some things are easy to sort (we have 2 sofas) but she will need to get a TV etc and is asking for my help. I'm presently treating these as if they are a request from a friend / neighbour but W said she doesnt know how I feel about helping out when she moves in (setting up TV, sorting internet access etc).
Now my natural reaction is to help, help, help and be about as much as I can. But I think this is probably counter productive since she's saying she wants space and I also should probably need to be missed!
Anyone got any advice on how to roll with this?
Our sitch seems odd and doesnt seem to fit what a lot of others are finding, W doesnt seem to have any hostility to me right now (unless she's just covering it or is manipulating me) and keeps saying she wants to just be up front and discuss things. But Im not certain if she's actually entertaining the idea of getting back together at some point or just manoevering me to get her where she wants to be and what she needs.
Kills me to think that way but this kind of thing really screws with your thinking!
Thanks
You sound melancholy. Don't worry things will get better
When you do your envisioning try it as what kind if person you want to be rather than what your situation will be. Imagine some of the kinds of situations you would have handled badly and envision how you want to handle them in future.
I know you want your family back (believe me I know that feeling too well) but focus on making yourself better and the changes permanent - they can't help but notice.
Many thanks for this, yes, melancholy fits the bill well. I'm not sobbing into the cushions or wailing and confusing the cats but Im also not feeling much of anything, so yes, melancholy.
I like the idea on envisioning my reactions, I have done that as part of my "self therapy" relating to delaing with S and have indeed run over some of the times I reacted with frustration and what I would do now. In deed at the resteraunt the other night he was full of beans as he'd been indoors a lot due to the weather here at the moment. He was therefore playing up, the old me would have reacted very nageatively I know, I can see my old actions in my mind and they would have made matters worse and enraged W. This time I was calm joked with him calmed him and we played noughts and crosses (tic tac toe) on the play pack he was given. I know my changes are making me a better person, I think the frustration now is in being able to apply that where I want to and thats the work I need to do on myself.
Thanks for the reply
Remember I wrote this
thinking of the way life can change so quickly.
W just called to say shes going to ask work can she work part time and would I mind therefore if im working from home having S two days a week (from her description before and after I move).
Had a brief chat about it, I'm very happy for this to happen (S would bring work sheets etc to work through in the day while I work). I suppose If I were a cynic I could say this is just fitting into W's schedule but if its time with S at home? I'll take it.
That sounds like a very positive development for you and your son Edz, as I recall your wife seemed to have him on a pretty tight leash. Go ahead and be cynical- the end result is more time with your S.
That sounds like a very positive development for you and your son Edz, as I recall your wife seemed to have him on a pretty tight leash. Go ahead and be cynical- the end result is more time with your S.
Indeed, obviously she still needs to get the ok from work but I dont have an issue with anything that gets me more time with S, my only concern is this is while MIL is away when she returns will W just flip/flop again and suddenly MIL will have him on those days. But for now, for now I'm going to be happy W suggested it at all given the fact for the first 4 weeks she wasnt even comfortable with him being out without her!
Well rental paperwork doesnt get any simpler, 2 3/4 hours to fill in the application and references. Still have a letter to send as well..
And as expected she called today to say she's found a possible school place for him from January as that will give her time to work since she's concerned for Money coming in.
I really can't (and I'm getting to the point where I don't want to) keep up with the number of direction changes she's presently making to be honest. I have a feeling this is because she's backing away from the idea of this appartment and still being connected to her mother and is trying to go back to the idea of renting somewhere and will not stop until she gets it.
I do know the one idea she doesnt want to entertain, and I'm trying hard not to keep bringing up is the idea of coming back so whatever I'm not her agenda right now, no change there then.
Honestly I think school is a good idea though, it will reduce her 24/7 time with S and even she admits he's not putting in enough effort and she will never get into conflict with him so wont push the matter not to mention anything that distances MIL has to be good.
Well, suppose I'll just focus on the mundane business at hand, while I dont doubt she'll change her mind several times in the next few weeks (days, hours, minutes) I'll just give her the space to do so. Nothing she comes up with is going to be relating to anything other than what she wants and even S is now being pushed into second place with HE being jettisoned rather than her plans to find somewhere so nothing I say is going to phase her.
Well, no point in worrying about it, back to my routine I suppose.
Think it's called vacillating .
We just have to hang in there
"wavering between different opinions or actions; irresolute."
Yup, that's it all right.
Of course she seems pretty resolute about me not being an option, well at least when dealing with me. Not that I should believe that, still doesn't buoy your self worth though or how you feel, don't show it to her but I still feel completely rejected after 15 years.
I know, get on with it Ed, get on with it...
Another interminably long evening tonight.
Taking S out to his card event tomorrow so that will at least keep me occupied. Not sure I'm ever going to get used to feeling like this.
GAL ramped up again, after work today went for a walk, took a swim did some shopping cooked dinner and did some work on my gaming pc but once the pc was done didnt feel like playing it.
Tried reading but couldnt take it in (normally a voracious reader so this is not good). Of course I know why its so bad today, 3 months since W walked away..
Well, as the man said, time for bed, hope tomorrow is a brighter day in weather and spirit.
And no, no it isnt on either front...
Bucketing down again, at least I'm seeing S tonight, that's what's getting me through today.
Its the UK....It always rains.
It will be a better day, your seeing your S today.
Its a bit cheesy but I cobbled together a few quotes into a short text which I printed and read a couple of times a day. It helps me focus on the fact that if I expect a bad day then it almost certainly will be but that the reverse is also true.
Hi Edz - that's a good way to think about good/bad days. I have also found that a good day tends to follow a bad. Normally as I feel so desperate on a bad day that I get on this forum, or re-read books to get myself into a 'better' place - and so the following day tends to be so much better. And I appreciate feeling better in contrast to the awful day before etc.
I also just try and look a few days ahead - and anything further than that will be worried about at some future point in time!!
Thanks all.
Yes Ive noticed the ping pong of good and bad days recently. Just too much at the moment, moving, work, was ill, W is being awkward on moving her credit card off the main account and I cant afford to keep paying it and just feeling so flippin' alone. Doesnt seem to make any odds being out with people either even plastering the PMA / Shiny happy people face on still feel hollow, fake it till I make it I suppose.
Anyway, as I say seeing a small happy 9 year old tonight even if its really only glorified chauffeuring I happen to really like the passenger.
Still plowing through the landlord check documentation and rigmarole not sure how complex it is in the US but here (like everytghing else) its a pain in the wotsit and expensive (£245 in fees so far)
I keep telling myself it will reach a point where Im back and stable and possibly happy but right now Im finding it very difficult to belive and impossible to visualise.
What a negative nelly I am at the moment!
Its alright I'm having a bad couple of days but then I had some really good ones at the start of the week.
The important thing is that you focus on what is good. Or if that doesn't work how about answering the question of what would you have wanted different in your marriage?
I read somewhere that getting angry (not resentful) can help with melancholy. I took mine out on a squash court and felt better for it.
Yes I take it out on the water in the swimming pool. Helps to exhaust me so I at least sleep.
Different in my marriage, I tried that at the begining when I first started counselling. I can see what could have been different, indeed I can see what happened to cause a lot of the issues but Im worried if I dwell on that too much I wont move on. Will be useful if W ever wants to move forward or, alternately, if she ends it and I eventually at some point find myself in a new R but right now it just makes me feel Sad on what could have been really.
I know its something that's normal to go through, tell myself that, look at the posts here and Im thankful that although my sitch often feels batchit insane and my Ws actions change minute by minute in comparison I'm not dealing with worse. But then I realise Im still on my own, no S, no W and still feel low and sorry for myself then I just get angry with myself for being selfish and lazy!
As I said, negative nelly or what!
I meant more where did your marriage make you unhappy. What would your W need to change. I find it makes it slightly easier to detach and stop punishing myself. Probably not good advice but it has helped me a bit.
When I felt positive it was because I was feeling the improvements I was making in myself and had a really nice weekend with my kids.
Also Edz - try not to be hard on yourself for finding it so hard....it's one of the hardest things to go through. But keep recognising what helps and do more of it. Keep reading & you'll find more ideas to try and move forwards some more.
Sounds like you have a great R with your son & working on you has helped too - But there will always be those tough days. I just try and accept them & let myself grieve or be angry - it is all part of healing.
Hope it's a good weekend for you :-)
Thanks for that.
I think everything in our marriage related to communications going down the pan. I made pursuing mistakes and W distanced, I got frustrated, she poured herself into relation with S, I got more frustrated at being pushed further away...rinse, repeat...and down the spiral we went. W ultimately felt I was pushing S away and maybe I was because I was frustrated and maybe even jealous, MIL weighed in and pushed me to feeling fourth or fifth in the marriage and in the end we all were in our own orbit. If we got back together time and communication would be the two things that would have to change, W would need to learn to talk to me about the now not build things up and learn to spend time as a family more (me), with S more (me) and on our own (W she always had S when she did anything) and as a couple more (W never, ever wanted to do things as a couple or spend time alone).
Funny enough she just dropped S round for this evenings card event so I can cook him dinner first, she was invited to stay with the usual no pressure/strings but declined as she wants to spend some time by herself (which is interesting but to be expected considering MIL is back sunday). In passing mentioned has she been thinking about whats next and she still just wants to get out of MIL and get some time by herself, not going down the mind reading road so I dont know whether she's talking time to decide whether she comes back or just time to work out the next move away..only she knows really. She's off to meet up with an old (female) college friend of hers tomorrow so S will actually be staying over tonight (yes, I know, first time since july!).
Working, hard, on relationship with S, seems to be the best its been in years, W sometimes doesnt help by pushing back at me that she's had years of taking him places - I know she's just spiking at me and in some ways I deserve it but sometimes it just doesnt help and I have tried to put a boundry in place of not saying things like that in front of S but its still a painful reminder of what I could have done in the past.
Thanks again all, finishing up work then I have a dinner to cook.
Edz,
You just enjoy the time this evening and tonight with S.
I've had a good week and I think it is down to keeping busy GALing like mad and doing things with the kids keeping us all busy. Glad my mum and dad have recently secured a Bach hut which is getting loads of use by me and the kids.
I'm trying my hardest to avoid the W as not seeing her seems to help me a great deal with detaching and I think I'm nearly there and I'm very close to dropping the rope and seriously thinking about moving on for my own happiness but Also for my kids . Don't think it would be good for them and me to just spend all my time with them .
So I can recommend GALing as a good way of stopping the downs .
With it being half term next week are you able to get S to stay over at yours a few more nights ?
Hi South just caught me there (Im at my desk working from home on the phone in case anyone wonders why Im not with S, he's taking a rare opportunity to play a video game in the living room while I finish up here)
Yes will enjoy being with him, we're off out tomorrow so will have breakfast together then head out for a walk if the weather's nice. Not likely I'll be much on here until he has to go home at which point its likely to be me moaning again about being on my own
Holidays? Dont know, MIL is back Sunday on her broomstick (cue pantomime boos) so I imagine W will fall under the evil spell again, for now though he's all mine for a while
Have a good one guys
Ed
Just a quick update.
Well, just had to take S back to MILs he didn't want to go was crying I didn't want to take him and damn near was too. We had a great time last night. He slept right through and was great this morning we had breakfast at a cafe went for a walk visited an event day at the Bic and played on ps3 then had dinner.
W was pretty insistent he was back for 7 so that's what we did.
So back to being on my own now. Better knuckle down and just get on with it I suppose.
Could you not have your S over every Saturday ?
I'm just thinking that if it was more regular then maybe it would be easier on him emotionally because I'm assuming that each time he does stay he isn't sure if it will happen again.
It would also give you something to look forward to Edz .
I Think south is right in that a regular schedule would help.Routine is generally good for kids
Well I'd love to say yes. Getting a commitment from w so far hasn't been possible indeed this is the first stay since she walked away. Also the mil is back tomorrow I'm sure she'll lose it with w when she finds out he was here. Yes nothing to do with her but getting w to understand that is something I've failed at in 15 years. Maybe when I move and w leaves mil we can start making more progress. It's all so slow and both s and I seem to be hurting while w continues on pleasing her own ambitions and not ticking off her mum.
I know I sound bitter. Tired and upset and I seem to be the only damn adult out of the whole family.
Well. Less bitter than yesterday. That wasn't helped by it being the anniversary of us first meeting which I held as a tradition each year w was never the overtly emotional one so no surprise she doesn't seem to care.
There are just days where I think if only I could explain better. If only we could discuss this clearly we could get back to our life together. I sit and think I simply can't do this anymore each day then realise there is no alternative I keep going. Probably none of it will work. Probably w is just playing along to get what she wants and has no intentions of coming back but I keep on plugging along.
I know I don't want any new life that doesn't involve her and s but there is absolutely nothing I can do about it and the pain is just sometimes overwhelming.
Its at least heartening to know that we all have similar emotions. I know how you're feeling far better than I ever would have wished to.
Do me a favour if you don't mind - try and describe what a happy edz looks like without reference your relationship or your W. What does he do? how does he act or react? What does he like about himself? What is he passionate about?
Hi Jim
Thanks.apart from my s I'm still cooking myself right now. Reading. Movies. Music. All huge things in my life but they're now so enmeshed in times in my life I with w I find I can't watch/listen to them anymore dropped over 80% of my media collection off the play list as I couldn't bear the tracks coming on. I still enjoy a nice meal fine wine or good coffee but happy? I don't know yet. Still working on it.
Its easier asked than answered. But then that's an element of codependency in there
So will a happy confident edz go to the cinema or out for dinner by himself? Is it the food or the company?
Music really affects my mood so I'm having to adjust my playlist as well. But this also works positively by finding songs that make me feel better and more positive
Yup have been to the cinema twice dinner about 4 times alone 6 or so with son.
No worries eating alone at restaurants just take my kindle or a book.
I absolutely know I was codependant I know the danger signs now counselling was what I needed there I can't put that to use right now though unless I get into a new r or w comes back.
Not so much I now need w to function it's more I don't like lots of people in my circle as I find dealing with lots of people borderline painful being a serious introvert. Therefore those in my life take on much more importance and my w is my best friend intellectually as well as emotionally and of course there's the physical.
As I said I'm a work in progress. I'm also stuck at the moment can't move yet until the tons of paperwork for rentals are done and it's vacant in December.
Christmas is also ramping up here and all you see is happy families and all I can think is why can't I have that?
I'm not looking forward to Christmas as it will be W turn to have them. I suspect I'll be a wreck Christmas eve. Doesn't help that its everywhere already.
Everyone is a work in progress. The day we stop trying to grow is the day we stop trying to live.
I've not managed cinema yet so your doing better than me.
UK. in the west Midlands if that means anything to you.
Shame mate im down in bournemouth i'd have treated you to a (small) popcorn if you were nearer mate
No mint poppets though you're on your own there!
Well started the fun task of books and dvd shelves being split today, thought it would be cathartic. Was to a degree but cant say its a lot of fun!
I've always been more of a peanut m&m man myself
Ha.
Hey Jim no chance of a split holiday? W and I are at early, early stages but we floated her having s Christmas eve and morning and me afternoon and boxing day so he doesn't miss one or the other of us.
Emperor palpatine otherwise known as mil may complicate matters but I'm done allowing her to impact s if w is too chicken to deal with her that's her problem I on the other hand have no issues reminding her who s' s parents are and that she isn't one of us.
Actually that was her suggestion but she will be off to Hampshire and I won't. Neither do I fancy spending 3hrs driving on Christmas day.
Current plan is handover on boxing day then do a repeat of Christmas on the 27th
Thats lousy (changed as the auto filter is apparently based on a very wide range), sorry to hear that. Well at least your kids get to have a double christmas with you both. I hope you all have fun.
Just pulled a bit of a boner with W as she's poking me to get information for a housing form and asking when this other house will be available and when Im moving. I was happy with the first response that I'm waiting for the landlord clearance and landlord to confirm and I'll let her know but then of course she was pushing further and got to me while Im low and I ran into too much information again. No, no begging or sobbing, just too much honesty really.
I just dont know how Im going to get through the next 4 months or so, I just cant see a good ending at the moment. Well one day at a time I suppose no matter how lousy they are.
Oh and forgot to say, South if you're about, 40 lengths today not the best but the pool was silly busy and Im still not 100%
Thanks all
Sigh, the filter on here is worse than my aunt maude (well not that I had an aunt maude) think hoover for the censored word or even a small straw being used in a drink!
That's a good start especially if your are still a bit poorly .
Could you not have just plowed through everyone lol.
Got to work on getting back to nearer 80 Edz .
I'm nearly down to 13 stone the circuits is really helping also getting fighting fit lol.
Good for you South, you should be proud of what you've achieved if you ask me (although no one has ;)) think you're going to do well no matter what you decide with W.
I think I'd be better if I didnt have this move as well. I'm also - as expected - being left to sort all our possessions out - W is hiding as I thought she might do. Dont think the reality of it all is really anything she's dealing with or she's dealing with it just fine in which case she's become a very very cold person indeed. No idea and I dont have the energy to guess any more. I'll just take what I want and know she hasnt said she wants to keep. I have all our photos digitally so photobooks, wedding pics, wedding book I'm leaving here. If she joins me later she can bring them if not best I'm not surrounded by reminders of whats been lost.
Anyway working from home again today, back in the office tomorrow. Going to book some time off as soon as I can as I need to decompress from one aspect of my life and it wont be moving or WAW any time soon unfortunately.
Some time of sounds good but make sure you have a plan to do something with it.
I'm thinking of taking a trip somewhere or learning to ski - basically something a little off piste. It doesn't have to be expensive - Maybe just get away to a mates house for a bit.
I really need to improve my fitness regime...
Sounds like your fitness regime is good to me mate, much more and we'll see you at the olympics
Money means I can either move or go away not both and knowing my sich you can see why its the former.
Time will probably be spent packing and working out logistics rather than having a holiday and, as you say, not sure I'd know what to do with an empty day apart from stay in bed or go mad - although I did finally play on the PC last night, Borderlands pre-sequel - really, really bad at these games but was fun to play for a while.
W's birthday next tuesday so wondering what to do about that, card obviously and maybe a small gift but nothing like I would normally do presumably. Another wonderfully cruddy milestone in this year.
You want try earth defence force then - it requires no skill at all.
I think an empty day would be really hard. So focusing on the move is a good thing.
Not sure about BDay - mine happened about 3weeks after BD and the card she gave me was one of the most hurtful things. It was just so cold. But then I'm LBH so I have a very different take
Yes, to be honest I dont want to make a big deal of my birthday this year, Im off so I think I'll go do something away from home so I can at least pretend my life isnt in the cr@pper
As you say as those left behind we want to be shown affection and caring but doing that with the WAWs is another matter indeed.
I know my S wants to make a big deal about it as a family, Im guessing she'll squash that (at least acting on orders from MIL) which leads to an even more difficult situation
On games I have a wide choice with a fully loaded MAME set, fully loaded SNES,NES,MD/Genesis and a load of classic stuff I also have tower force which I got just before all this started may have to take another look at that. Also havent finished blood dragon yet!
Not to mention my ps2, ps3 and ps1
The Wii....I'm leaving for W and S (although did consider modding it for gamecube as dolphin is slow at emulation even on my overclocked i5 4670k!)
Yup used to be a serious tech head. Well still am at work, decided to jettison it moving forward though. One of my 180s. Yes, I love technology but disappearing into it is one of the ways I've ended up here. Not the only one and not throwing out the baby with the bathwater but I need to poke my head up and spend at least part of the time in the real world much as I (as a very very serious introvert) dont like it.
Interestingly this really concerned my Son, spoke to him and told him not to worry but he seemed really upset that Daddy isnt into his computers any more. Of course W just told him not to be silly and told me to talk to him. Nice.
I can understand that. I reduced my computer time massively just to hang around my W - look where that got me.
I started being weak and insecure so she fell for the guy at work.
Hi Jim, yup I think I've retreated more into it in recent years as well. I took on some out of hours third party work to make some extra money telling myself it was for the family to pay bills, of course it meant trading in my weekends and family time.
How much would I like to give that money back for that time now.
Another of my wife's complaints is that I was too concerned with money - had to work to earn. Had to earn to be secure.
She thought it was about the money. For me it was about trying to make her happy with stuff rather than giving her the care and attention she craved. She would have been happy in a shoe box as long as it was our shoebox. Now I have a big empty house I would trade in a heartbeat.
Yup I can imagine how you feel mate I really can. My case I was seeing it as helping the family when I was really pushing them away.
In our case we spent every penny on my s's education so we have nothing tacit to show or split either.
W has also undone a lot of it with her push for Home education, we spoke about this the other day when she was telling me about sending him to state school now in January so she can work (she hasnt told him yet so that will be fun for her in January - I am absolutely not taking that heat, she pulled him from school really between her and MIL planning to start home education which I was ramping up for in July when she took him and walked away - while I agree him going back to school is the best thing he's going to go nuts. He's already pushing back at W as he wants to be with me / us all together so this is going to really cause trouble. I try to maintain a united front but at some point if she's living alone with him and pushing her / her mums rules on him without me - she's going to have to take the innevitable consequences. Sadly my W hasnt had to deal with consequences for 15 years as I've been around to absorb blame and costs so its going to be a rude awakening.
Sorry went off on a tangent there.
Really wish you could edit posts after 40 seconds have passed!
Just to clarify as the above makes it sound like Im using S as a weapon. Absolutely not doing that. Just W keeps changing the rules for him, one minute he cant come to the flat then he can in the day then he cant as MIL gets upset when he complains about living there in comparison (which if you ask me is a fair comment) then he can and he can stay because W is moving back.
In Summer he's told he's leaving school so we can move up north and he can have an expanded education, now its July and it will just be MIL and W teaching him and now, in january, its not convenient and he's not putting in the effort so its a normal school again away from his old friends and his new HE friends.
Poor little tike, I just worry that he's going to really suffer in all this and while W says everything she does she does for him she cant seem to see nothing she's presently doing (and by presently I dont mean the HE - she runs around like a mad thing doing that NOW but it will end, or be massively reduced to tutoring at most, January) is for S but is to placate her mothers never ending mood swings and to push her agenda of being on her own - which seems to be creating nothing but negatives before she even gets going (She's been asking me about £400 Tv sets so she doesnt feel S will have better with me - I'm not trying to create a competition but I'm a 25 year tech veteran I'm always going to have more tech).
I of course want to run in and save the day but I just cant let myself and I cant help but think this is just going to (A) upset S and (B) cause stress between he and my W and ultimately me and her as well.
She will not discuss it with me though, this is what she's doing and nothing is going to stop her, especially not me. I just hope S doesnt turn around in a few years and turn his back on her for it as one of my best friends did to his mother when much the same happened to him many years ago.
Last thought on the above, all I can really do under the situation is be there for my S, I will always be available to him and put his interests as my utmost (sometimes this may not be apparent to him) and while I will absolutely try to be of one voice with W for stability and for discipline and for his own good, if it all gets too much and he can get to me he will have a place wherever I am.
Sounds rough. But you already know the key is to be the best you can for your S
Yes indeed, ultimately being the best Dad I can is all I can do for him and no more than he deserves.
Edz,
You would love my retro game collection which is currently in my shed .
Emptied my computer room to make it and ironing room which as a 180 due to wife complaining about my clutter.
Got ps1 ps2 amigas segamegadrives sega master system , dream cast, snes , even a Sinclair QL . And tons of games to play .
All put away in the shed .
Might bring it all back in and set it all up in the bedroom lol.
South
Gotta love the master system. You guys are making me nostalgic for my old commodore 64
Loved the sid music on the c64, good old Tim Follin, some of his stuff is up on you tube as well!
Well had a perfectly charming email from MIL last night lambasting me that it would have been courteous to tell her I was planning on leaving and running through a normal tennancy vacating process reminding me to have my stuff out to avoid unnecessary costs of disposal etc. Lovely. Could feel the love and warmth, this from a woman who I gave hundreds of thousands of pounds of free tech help to in the business(es) she flushed down the toilet and spent countless hours helping, driving about and otherwise assisting. Lovely. I hope a piano falls on her.
And yes, she had arranged W moving in so already knew, just another cheap shot from a cheap woman.
Ahhh thats better, now back to retro gaming. Well actually back to work unfortunately.
Think the sooner you move Edz the better .
You may then not have to deal with MIL ever again.
I've got a Sinclair QL that needs testing have you ever used one ?
Yes I agree thats the only positive in all this she's then not my problem (beyond impacting S of course, W is a grown up if she wont deal with her chit then that has to be her problem)
QL oooh long time ago, microdrives used to cause issues as the tape (yup sinclair used a tape based microdrive echewing discs) stretches in the cartridges over time.
And with that you have gone further back than I remember. I shall retreat to the comparative safety of Texas instruments
So been splitting the book, movie and cd collection, decided to only take what was mine before or I really want and I know W doesnt. Anything we got together Im leaving. If W wants to try together we can remerge it all if not I'll be better off not having those things around.
Despite asking W has made no effort to help although thinking about it thats the case since this began. Her parents got her basics and S's her clothes are still in the wardrobe etc. I thought it was because there was no room and it wasnt because this was planned as shes only coming here as a last resort (or so she says but S says she did see a lot of flats before facing the financial truth) I think she just cant face it, I'd love to think she's not sure and she's telling the truth on needing time to think but I'm inside I'm just so hurt right now and feeling so abandoned that I think Im just projecting what I want.
This.
Truly.
Blows.
It was a car boot purchase with loads of books and loads of games and blank micro drives .
One day I will see if it works lol. Was only 20 pounds
Well W still wont get into a face to face or on the phone discussion on splitting contents up.
Best I got was an email telling me she wasnt being cold just practical.
Since I've spent the past 3 months being "practical" and the last month "practically" arranging a new place to live, tennancy agreements and vetting and the last week and a half starting to rip apart the last third of my lifes contents I was, lets say, a little miffed. Especially since she, to all intents, moved to her mothers and stayed there. Yes she looked at other places and filled in a DSS housing benefit form but thats it, all the rest has been me replacing the car etc grrr. She did say she's putting the car in to be looked at - this follows two weeks of her telling me it was playing up, I didnt know if that was fishing for me to have it fixed but I wasnt biting on that one!
Anyway I didnt get into a shouting competition just went back with an email answering each of the points and items she'd mentioned. It was late in the day by this point so I probably was more sentimental than I should have been in closing, I said that I wasnt angry with her, but again this wasnt what I wanted, I think she feels differently about all this since this is what she says she wants but its a horrible thing to do and I do hope we can put it all back together and if she wants to talk about that or decides its what she wants I'll be happy to work with her.
Also asked about S's card meeting on friday, it's a special "release" event for new packs. Sadly it's also Halloween and S is off to a fireworks and Haloween party so wont be seeing him although I will ask W what time it finishes and where and if I can pick him up instead and have him saturday, I imagine MIL will be continuing to spread her vitriol in the background so probably not but I'll keep being the positive one.
About 42 days to moving now which both seems an eternity in this place by myself and a terrifyingly short period to get everything I need done completed by myself.
I am frustrated with W, she's left me to do this entirely by myself at which point she will "swan" back in and then only have to deal with a few bits, be a sense of achievement I suppose and it will be S and I's place unless W chooses to join us later on. Its been difficult going through our books, music and movies - each with a strong memory. Left me feeling even lower than I thought I could get. I think leaving a lot of things here for S and W (I left some special collectors books W bought me on S's bookcase as he likes to look through them. I was trying to decide if that was being snarky and destructive or just protecting myself against pain later on. I carry memories strongly (uif you havent picked up on that yet) and feel them deeply unfortunately, some things I was given by my Mum still hurt to see now 18 years after she died so I was worried on the first night in the new place if I look around and see those that remind me of W... I dont know how I would react.
Anyway enough maudlin...work to do.
Well that went bad quickly.
Texted asking about picking S up on friday, I wouldnt have been phased at a no or any other response than what I got.
W doesnt want him staying over at the flat it upsets him.
Cut and paste from a few weeks ago, now what could have changed her....oh yes, MIL is back. Afraid I just burned myself bad on that one, texted (stupid I know but she wont deal with me any other way, is always "busy", like talking with a teenager) to say please stop saying this is upsetting S when its an issue with her mother, S isnt upset unless he's flat out lying to me when I discuss it with him. Said that this isnt a subject for texts either but W wont sit down or make time to talk unless its more demands. Then totally blew it and said I know she wants to huirt me ...
She followed up with an email (sigh) saying it wasnt connected to her mother but was that the flat was being split. I take her point but replied that she absolutely has to call me or speak in person about this kind of thing texting just is not appropriate and is open to misunderstanding as just happened. She also blew me off from seeing her on her birthday which I was expecting but doesnt hurt any less.
Well this evening Im not doing anything with this sodding flat, I've reached a point I dont care, just me and a bottle of rum as soon as works over.
And of course now, silence....... I really hate my life right now.
Well we did pick up on an email, I've now put two personal boundries in place, firstly I dont want to deal with MIL in any way unless its connected to the appartment which cant be avoided and secondly anything relating to S or our R we do via phone call or in person unless its very very quick (he's left his coat here shall I drop it off? That kind of thing)
W said she would give me a ring "later" at 11:30 ish this morning, now 7pm nothing as yet. If Im honest Im expecting nothing or an email or text possibly berating me possibly just saying shes been busy. I wont tell her but I did break down this afternoon. Just found myself uncontrollably sobbing and I couldnt stop. Feel a little better this evening but I still feel like Im missing a rudder, it's odd, Im not afraid or feeling "needy" I just dont want to be alone, tried going out after work to see if exercise would help - it didnt and I left after 15 minutes, just wanted to go home.
If anyone was worried no I didnt open any alcohol, just have soft drink. Taken an evening off preparations to pack as cant face it this evening.
..As she just did, been busy and will try tomorrow... Beyond being angry or upset now, its not W its just life and I need to chill out and calm down.
I sometimes wonder if the reason WAS finds detaching so easy is because they have kind of detached from reality.
Glad you didn't hit the bottle
Indeed, never had an alcohol issue. Briefly considered getting one recently though