Time for a new thread, my old one is almost full.
Here it is:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2474878#Post2474878Here is my original:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2474855&page=1Things are gradually shifting for the better. We're not to piecing yet, but we're friendly, we're parenting together, and she doesn't mention divorce or moving out anymore. So that's a plus.
Damage control is mostly done, now I'm trying to get the spark back.
I know the road will be rocky, but I'm standing tall.
And on that note, she was a total crab tonight. To be fair, I think she was just exhausted from the week. On the good side, as grumpy as she was, there wasn't really D talk.
Also, I didn't let it get me down. I'm getting stronger.
Today sucked.
Weddings are extremely depressing.
And the fact that's she's a pissy that took the kids. She hates my faugit bmily. Of course this wedding involves my whole family.
Wow. Sorry about the really bad typing. I was super tired.
I meant that she was pissy that I took the kids to the wedding. She hates my family and it was a family wedding, so she wasn't being really happy about that.
Aside from that I was grumbling about how sad being at a wedding made me.
I have to admit i have little patience for people who are immature. You took your kids to a family wedding and your wife is pissy because she doesn't like your family? Could that BE more immature? It's a FAMILY wedding. Get a grip, woman.
On the other hand, I understand how a wedding can be an un-fun experience for you (or any of us in our situations). I'm convinced the bar is usually for those with struggling marriages.
Yes, the bar woulda been great...save for the 3 and 5 year-old I was responsible for. 3 drinks in 3 1/2 hours. Not getting the job done. Sigh.
I feel ya. But it's times like those that I say, "I'm going to make it so my kids go home and say, 'we had SO much fun with daddy at that wedding'".
When the kids have a great time, mommy always hears about it and wishes she were part of it...
Oh yeah, they had fun. Not as much w/ me, but they had fun. I did dance w/ my daughter tho. It's the only dancing I did. I love dancing w/ her.
Things have been good. Work started. I've been keeping up w/ working out.
We met to drop off my son on his first day of Kindergarten. I brought her a bouquet of roses as a "happy first day of kindergarten" present for my W. They were very well received.
We've been gradually acting more like we're married again. I certainly feel like I have my friend back. There hasn't been any affection or definitive R talk, so I'm nowhere near declaring us to be "piecing" yet.
Being patient and trying to not scare her off.
Nice thought with the roses!
You wrote this on another thread-
My favorite part is how our brains immediately and automatically create meanings all over the place. No matter what. Drives me nuts...facial expressions, sighs, accidental bumps, etc...they all seem to mean something in my head, at least for a second. I'm learning to slow my mind down some and take a more objective view of things so I don't get too spun up about every little thing.
Keeping this up and expanding it will serve you so well. We read things through our lens and take way too much of what other people do personally.
Yes, labug, it really does help to try and slow those thoughts down.
As does GAL, the more I've got going on, the less time my mind has to wander.
Saw IC last night. She thinks I'm doing things right at this point. Says I've got to have the mentality of the tortoise from "the tortoise & the hare." I think I've gotten myself there.
She also warned me that, although things are getting much better, expect more bad. This is something I knew from you guys, but good to have it reinforced.
Feeling pretty good right now. Still focused on those positive changes.
No matter our situation the path is always full of twists and turns, that's a given.
Take it as it comes.
That is well said, labug.
It certainly is a roller coaster of love. I like the Red Hot Chili Peppers version, personally.
We dropped the kids off w/ my parents and went to dinner together tonight.
Nothing about it was super date-like, but it was the first time in FOREVER that we've gone to dinner, just us two. Also, she didn't pull back after that this evening, she continued to be pleasant and friendly.
We still haven't hugged or kissed or anything like that and she hasn't openly stated that she's ready to get to work on this marriage, but it feels like it's close right now.
Hi, Im new
Just reading your thread and wanted to wish you well. Im happy things are improving for you.
Hang in there, I hope you will get to piecing soon
Still going well. W even got grumpy today and didn't turn the grumpy on to me. That's a win.
I'm sure I'm still in for some bumps and bruises, but piecing doesn't seem too far off.
I'm rooting hard for you, Joe. We have somewhat similar sitches, although my WAW has moved out. Be patient and work on yourself. Don't chase or push. You can't make up her mind, but you could push her the wrong way.
Oh yeah, card. We've gone through hell and back. Things have been slowly but surely getting better. I think we'll be into piecing things back together officially before too long. Already feels like we are.
Hey, Joe. Just been catching up on your thread. Have you gone back and read your earlier posts? You have come soooo far! Keep it up!
Yeah, I read back a while ago. It is amazing how much good can come if we look inwards instead of outwards for change. I'll have to go take a look at your thread. Thanks for the positive feedback.
Without having any official word from her that we're going to work on things and having still not gotten a hug or kiss or heard ILY at all, I'm pretty certain we are piecing.
Making joint decisions about the future, she's open to seeing my family again, getting rid of extra couches she got for moving out.
We're going to the NFL season opener in Seattle on Thursday together and may be staying the night.
It's weird, because I'd like to hear for sure where she stands, but I know better than to push right now. When she's ready, things will continue.
Right now, I'm enjoying my family and having my best friend back.
I'm still going to be here a lot because I've got a lot of work to do still.
Just letting you know I read your thread and to keep up the good work.
Wow, Joe! I love the talk of the future. That must feel great!
Joe, I just wanted to invite you to my most recent post to see my progress on your challenge to me.
"Without having any official word from her that we're going to work on things and having still not gotten a hug or kiss or heard ILY at all, I'm pretty certain we are piecing. "
Sorry to throw cold water on your fire, but you are definitely NOT in Piecing. You are only in Piecing when the WAS ACTIVELY does things to make things right. This includes MC and understanding their role in the demise of the relationship.
The signs may be positive, but it isn't in Piecing territory yet.
JOE,
That is very encouraging news in you r above posts but please keep yourself grounded. Enjoy the positives but understand there might still be some negatives. MrBond is correct in what he is saying.
I would love to be at the level you are at though!!
Keep it up
I hear you guys. I know there's still a long way to go and plenty of setbacks along the way. I may never get to piecing under the above definition. I'm not sure my W will ever do MC or acknowledge her role in our problems.
Whatever it is, it beats the hell out of where I was.
Baby baby steps.
In a way, it's all forward. In either direction.
Hi Joe! Great to hear things are going in a good direction. I'm proud of you! Eyes on the prize and keep doing the work!
Hugs, Lisa
So Joe, what doe you see as her role in your problems?
My mind always goes back to your description of her anger issues or seeming anger issues as described by you.
How do you deal with that?
Well, her anger and her temper are one definite issue. Other things: overly critical, unforgiving, expecting me to read her mind about what needs doing, and doesn't show me love in ways that are meaningful to me.
Me knowing the issues is fine, but I wasn't the one who wanted to D. My hope is that I keep getting better at being her H, she'll come around on some of these issues. If she does open up to input, sure I'll be glad to discuss my wants. Until then...I'm not going anywhere.
Setback day. I knew there was one on the horizon.
W views everything my mother does through extremely suspicious/critical eyes.
When there were hiccups in the plans for my parents to watch the kids while we may the trip to Seattle and back, she jumped at the opportunity to declare that my mom is selfish and I have no balls. Worse she tried to back out of going.
I called my mother and explained the way the situation appears from our end and did some back and forth with her to resolve the situation.
In the end, a lot of the problem was caused by communication foul ups. A lot of which were my fault. I was so hesitant to push W for how she wanted to do the Seattle trip (NFL Season opener, Seahawks vs Packers, she's from WI), that I didn't get plans firmed w/ my parents about the kids until they'd already laid out some travel plans of their own. I do tend to have a problem w/ not being immediate and direct enough in planning things. Room for more growth.
Hoping things mellow tomorrow and we can have fun.
[quote=Joe1981]Well, her anger and her temper are one definite issue. Other things: overly critical, unforgiving, expecting me to read her mind about what needs doing, and doesn't show me love in ways that are meaningful to me.
I know how you feel with regards to those issues.
Have you told her straight out that she acts this way towards you?
If you did, what was her response?
I told my WAW who acted exactly the same way that she could certainly think about the effects that are certain to happen after she exhibits those traits before she does it. Over the last weekend she actually caught herself a few times and apologized to me. That has never happened in the past.
joysjoe, I don't think she's interested in being self-reflective right now. If/when she is, I like that approach.
MrBond, labug, and nit84,
It isn't that I didn't believe you about how we weren't to piecing yet, it's just that l didn't want to believe it.
Going to the NFL game was a lot if fun yesterday, but she showed me more than a couple of times that she's very skittish about all this.
An easier one is that she wants me to take charge of things 100% sometimes. So all she has to do is show up. I can do that.
Harder is that she has major issues w/ my family and that I need to be more vigilant about everything with them.
So, it isn't piecing because she's not looking at her behavior at all, but it is something because she made it clear that we are trying to get this to work, just that I have the work to do.
Lots of hard work left to do.
The point is that if she continues to only see it as your responsibility to make things right, she will never be satisfied. M is a partnership, not a monopoly.
Mr Bond Igit here I was hoping to hear from you on my sitch. Needs some advice
I get what you're saying MrBond. At this point, I can only keep doing things that draw her in. At some point, the dynamic will need to balance.
She asked me for a hug today. She wasn't feeling well and needed the comfort. I'm trying not to over interpret it and just be happy for the most intimate physical contact we've had since April.
So happy for you. Baby steps towards what you want.
Yeah, I'm very much not pushing. Anything. I love having my friend back and working together on parenting. Love stuff will come gradually. She has to get there again.
Great weekend. Just doing stuff as a family.
On a bad note, my knee is throbbing and I'm unsure when I'll be able to work out next. I have no idea what I did to it. Hurts like crazy right at the top of the knee cap, especially if I use my quad muscles much. Which is super when I go up or down the stairs. Pain pain go away.
Kind of a blah week. My knee has kept me from working out and my energy levels are down as a result.
All things M are kind of stagnant right now. I'm worried that, due to lack of positive movement, she's going to drop the bomb again. Maybe it's just that I'm gimpy this week and she's having a rough week at work.
I feel like I need a breakthrough.
Ok, end of whining, back to being patient and strong. I will be ok, no, not ok, great. I will be great.
Injuries do slow us down, don't they?
Are you working out your mind? Can you still do upper body? Just some thoughts.
I'm having physical therapy today for a knee injury from Tai Chi, of all things. Actually it's a reinjury.
Did she at any point "undrop" the bomb?
Undrop...not in so many words. But yeah, the whole divorce idea hadn't been spoken of in quite some time. But it's been complicated.
Today WAS going great. Lots of friendly talking. She even had me come in the bathroom and talk to her while she showered to go out for her friend's bday.
She even came back super happy and friendly and we were chatting all friendly for a while. Then she suddenly shifted gears and started talking about my rebound EA again, so things turned sour. I did my best to validate her anger and diffuse things.
I guess I knew this was coming, I'd just hoped to avoid it.
Joe just found your post in a somewhat similar stitch. Doing the same thing putting my family back together and wondering when I can start piecing my R back together. Wondering if any of this is working and trying to put meaning to every and all actions. I'm cheering you on good luck.
Joe, even though it is difficult, I think her anger is a sign that she is still emotionally invested in you and your M.
When she gets angry, what does she say/do?
Hi Joe, I agree with Elsa. When she starts to feel closer to you is when the anger issues might surface. Validating is the best you can do and just continue your PMA.
Glad to hear things are going well for you!
Hugs,
Lisa
Undrop...not in so many words. But yeah, the whole divorce idea hadn't been spoken of in quite some time. But it's been complicated.
Today WAS going great. Lots of friendly talking. She even had me come in the bathroom and talk to her while she showered to go out for her friend's bday.
She even came back super happy and friendly and we were chatting all friendly for a while. Then she suddenly shifted gears and started talking about my rebound EA again, so things turned sour. I did my best to validate her anger and diffuse things.
I guess I knew this was coming, I'd just hoped to avoid it.
So you really don't know where this is going. If you are actually coming back together there's a need to sort things out, talk about going forward. A good R can't be built on the crumbled foundation of the old one. It'll be the same R, most likely even worse.
Do you feel you're walking on eggshells because of her anger?
Is this an example of her testing the waters? Or does it feel like shes punishing you?
Thanks for the responses everyone.
Her anger yesterday was not explosive anger. Really, it seemed more like hurt still being dealt with. She tends to only label her negative emotions as anger though.
I'm really not sure what I think at this point. I feel like it's a bit of what you all said. Some of it is pushback at feeling closer, some of it is testing my resolve, some of it may be punishment.
She tends to only label her negative emotions as anger though.
My old MC said that this is common. Anger is a secondary emotion covering up a primary emotion (like sadness), but it is usually easier for us to deal with the secondary emotion so it comes out as anger instead.
And she very well could be testing you to make sure that you still feel remorseful for what happened. Good for you for validating her feelings and showing her that she can trust you!
Oh yeah. This has been a rough weekend in that arena. I never once shied away from being remorseful for my actions.
I screwed up so royally in a few ways.
It's hard though, because at some point I'd like her to understand that none of my stupid actions would've taken place had she not initiated things. There would never have been a rebound EA, because I've never thought about being with other women, except when I thought that was my inevitable future.
Sometimes I feel like she hadn't thought about the kids meeting a new person if we did get divorced. I think she thought I couldn't attract flies, let alone women.
I dunno, there's a long road left to travel and unless she gets some kind of counseling to help her deal with the anger and help her look inward at her stuff. For now, I stand tall and steadfast.
Hey, Joe. Just catching up. Sorry to hear that it's been a bit rough the past week. I think at the moment you just have to put it down to "don't believe what they say…" She may well realize her role in the EA but doesn't want to own up to it so pins it on you (in a "I'm hurting and I want you to feel bad" kind of way). Don't be so hard on yourself.
Her anger issues are a recurring theme in your posts though - do you need to see changes there?
It's hard though, because at some point I'd like her to understand that none of my stupid actions would've taken place had she not initiated things. There would never have been a rebound EA, because I've never thought about being with other women, except when I thought that was my inevitable future.
2x4 alert!! I get what you're saying here, I really do. But we all have choices and when you felt the need to start an EA with another woman what other choices did you have that you didn't make? And why didn't you make them?
This is a slippery slope my friend, very slippery.
But it may be useful in helping yo see why your W has made the choices she has.
The obvious right choice would have been to focus on what was going onw/in me first and become ok w/ me. I allowed a lack of friends, the self-esteem boost of an OW who showed interest in me, and my W's assurances we were done to make me blind to the foolishness of getting involved w/ someone.
I am fully aware of the folly of my ways and that I never should have gone that route. Nothing I can do to undo it now. I quit talking to the OW cold turkey, blocked her on FB and will never contact her again as soon as I saw the error and resolved to fight for my M.
Oh well, this is all old stuff that I'm mentally past. Unfortunately my W isn't. Again, I need her to come to the table emotionally w/ something other than anger. I'm patient.
On the plus, just played my first soccer game in the league I joined. Finally trying to GAL.
I agree with labug. You have to own what you did, 100%. That is really the only way that your W will ever be able to let go of her anger and forgive. Just continue to take responsibility for your actions and show genuine remorse when she brings it up.
I know it's hard, but at this point, you are probably more invested in the R than your W is, which means that you have to shoulder more of the responsibility for keeping the peace for now. Ultimately, if the R is going to work your W is going to have to take back her fair share, but all things in due time. (Trust me -- this is something that I struggle with often!)
I agree too. That's exactly what I'm doing. I know I've got to be patient. I was pretty much just venting here.
Thanks for the encouragement.
It has been a pretty good week. D4's b-day party went well. My family didn't do anything to make my W grumpy...at least not too much.
She has been much warmer to me. She readily talks about future family stuff w/ me. We're still not back together in any true sense and we haven't really discussed anything involving putting in the work, but things are still gradually going in the right direction. I do think a lot of the stuff from last week was a test and/or nervousness at her having to deal w/ my family.
I'm expecting a big push back in the next few days because it seems to go that way, but I'm convinced it'll be OK.
Playing soccer on Mondays now, so that's a big plus in the GAL arena.
I called it. A busy, stressful day after a bunch of good days and she got pissed at something little and pulled way back. Ugh.
PMA, PMA, PMA.
Things were already better yesterday and today. Roller coaster!
So what's your plan at this point?
Still working on maintaining all the 180s. Busting my butt on the household chores, trying to give little gifts when possible and doing my best to maintain a PMA as much as I can do I'm fun to be around when we are spending time together.
Still here, been reading other people's posts but don't really know what to write about mine. I feel like the ups and downs keep coming.
I'm getting exhausted with being the only one who wants to make the marriage work. I feel like I ha to be perfect almost all the time and when I'm not it's like 3 steps back.
I need to keep working on me. I still have a lot to learn. I need to get a second job for now and find something new that pays better after the end of the school year. Teaching just doesn't allow me to provide for my family in the way I need to. I also need to find it within myself to take a more leadership role in my household and try to establish fun within our relationship so she starts to feel better about me.
So yeah, no biggie, right?
Took a month off from the site. Was getting depressed by all the new people having their lives torn apart. Not a great decision, I need to be here more. That said, I'm going to start a new thread...if you do read this and/or know/followed my mess, stay tuned...thanks.
Been wondering about you! It's true, there are a lot of new faces. But a number of old ones, too. All just plugging away...
I'll keep an eye out for your new thread.