This morning I feel numb. Everything thats been going on in my life seems ( not sure how to desrcibe it ) like theres no emotion involved in it . Im just going through the motions . She is still in volved with A but Im really out of touch with it because Ive detached from that part of her life .i have no idea how much she is seeing him or if they are still being physical , whether its getting deeper or shallower . I will admit that it is easier on the mind on some level not knowing whats going on but i feel very vulnerable not knowing what shes doing . How do you protect yourself and children if you dont know whats going on ?
Someone on another thread said you act as if she is already your ex. You treat yourself and your kids the way you'll if you were already single.
I forget, are you actually separated?
I'm sorry you're in a bad place. Remember to treat yourself with kindness today.
No not even separated . Still sleeping in same bed , although its incredibly difficult . I dont know how to act . When you wife thinks shes in love with another man and is cheating lord knows how much , how are you supposed to act ?
Why are you still sharing a bed with her?
I didn't stop sleeping with my H until he left me. I had my reasons, and I did some heavy duty compartmentalizing, but it was terrible for me. I don't think I got a good nights sleep for eight months. That exhaustion snowballed into how I treated him when we were awake and made things a lot worse.
The night after he left I slept like the dead. All but a handful of nights since then have been just as restful. If I had it to do over I would have booted him out then and there.
I'm not necessarily advocating a separation. But it sounds like a very healthy and helpful boundary for you would be to ask her to move into the guest room, if you have one, while she's involved in the affair. A transparency plan would be necessary for you to let her back into the marital bed.
Of course I defer to any vets who have an opinion. But you can't be detached in your sleep. Sleep is for rebuilding the strength to do that.
Same bed so the kids arent the wiser of the sitch
Do you mind putting together a signature line that describes your details? It's hard to keep track of people without it.
Yes, that was one of my rationalizations for not booting him sooner. I didn't want to hurt the kids if I thought the situation could be salvaged.
If I remember rightly, you are four months into knowing about a seven month long affair? This has now done an amount of damage that your kids are going to become aware of. There is no way to patch this enormous of a breach in the relationship without blowback leaving the two of you and hitting the people around you. The best you can do is minimize it.
I don't want to push you into something you're not ready or willing to do. But DBing is about doing what works, and this isn't. She's being incredibly disrespectful of you. Rest is a need, not a want, and no good will come of tolerating things as they are. Something must give. W won't, and OM won't.
I do wish the best for you.
Dawgy,
I understand what you're saying about keeping it from the children. But it's got to be so hard to be sleeping in the same bed. I don't know how you do it.
I wonder--and vets please correct me-- that perhaps one of the "consequences" of her behavior is that YOU don't work to cover it up for her?
So, if she's sleeping on the couch, or moves out, it's incumbent upon HER to explain this to the kids and why that would be.
If she's really intent upon ending your M, it's only a matter of time anyway.
Why all the pretense if she's really committed to "moving on"?
Hmmm.....
---GG
Well, I'm no vet, but I'll weigh in on this topic. And I'll go way off into my detail, if only to give some perspective.
I still sleep in the same bed as my W, after discovering the PA in Dec. There is no doubt that it is disrespectful, and that doesn't help the situation.
In May, I made a point of removing her clothes from our closet, and asking her to leave the marital bedroom. But W has such a sense of entitlement, and no shame, and has convinced herself so thoroughly that she is the victim and I am the villain, that she refuses to leave it. The tiff ended up with an arrest for me and a large lawyer bill. (no kidding. all dismissed now.)
Could I repeatedly ask her leave the bed? Sure, until she goes down the "verbal harassment" line.
Unfortunately, a man has to be careful of a woman who has no problem calling the police. By all means you can tell her to leave the bed, but understand that you cannot make it happen.
So, we still sleep in the same bed. I am detached (mostly), so it really doesn't bother me. I sleep fine. W does not sleep well at all. She rolls, turns, occasionally sobs, and takes sleeping pills every night. She might sleep better in the guest room, but she refuses to lose ground in the house. There's no way I'm giving an inch, so there we are. Sadly, I do take some comfort in her sleeping badly, because it suggests that she is still conflicted. If she starts sleeping like a baby, I'll know we're really done.
"How do I act?" you asked. I told my W months ago that as long as there was an A, she had no business in the marital bedroom. I pretty much behave as if she weren't there. I don't go out of my way to provoke her, but if I want to watch TV, I do, and if I want the light on to read, I turn it on. She's usually asleep when I go to bed, and still asleep in the morning when I shower and dress. She always changes in the bathroom now, with the door closed. That's new.
Now by no means am I suggesting that I'm doing this the "right way". Yes, if she slept down the hall, that would have to be explained to the kids. She's not ready to say "I'm breaking up the family and dating other men.", and I'm not going to lie to the kids and cover for her, nor am I going to take the blame for a breakup as long as I'm working to DB. Impasse.
Sadly, sometimes a bed is just a bed.
Wow, zew, you're a better man than I am.
In more ways than one!
---GG
I don't know about "better", GG. I find myself in a situation. I will cope, and I will survive, and I will do the best I possibly can for my kids. I used to be hung up on the bed thing back when I was trying to "force consequences" on W, but now, not so much.
Zew , thx for that > That is exactly whats going on in my sitch . And i figure as long ashe is in our bed she is still not sure what she wants ( fogged ) We still even have contact at night sometimes but nothing sexually as of yet . ( i wish there was sex ) Any way she said she was gonna leave and hasnt . I think allowing her cake eating until the fog lifts is my plan for now , but that could change if it goes on too long .
Dawgy, forget the sex. Put that way out there. It's way more important to get the R on solid ground first. If you value the R, you can go without; really, you can and you must.
Just to be clear - the fact that she is in your bed does not mean anything. She may or may not be sure of what she wants. It may simply mean that she doesn't want the consequences/expense of leaving. I don't say this to be cruel; I say it to warn you that you should not try to "mind read" what her actions mean. Don't set yourself up for disappointment by assuming that she is staying for you. For example, in my case, W would have left if she could have financially. She couldn't, so she figures she could "go along to get along" until she can afford to leave. She is finding this harder to implement than she thought. (yay!)
Allowing your W to eat cake is generally not a good thing. A lack of consequences for her does not motivate her toward any decision or realization. But you must also know that you can't really impose the consequences; they must come from her choices.
This may be overwhelming - if you give more detail, you will get more insight. Key point - you have time. Relax. Don't do anything drastic.
Good points zew.
That is what I think may be happening with my WAW at this point.
Dawgy, I am the king of mindreading, I don't want to be but I don't know to shake it. I have gotten better but still not there.
Zew is right try not to set yourself up for disappointment by putting too much stock in the fact that she hasn't left yet or you are still in the same bed.
I hope everything works out for you, hang in there!!
The mind reading is difficult . I do it all the time .Just when i think she is warming up to me she goes the opposite ten minutes later . When i think she is gone cold and hard she comes up to me and is warm and friendly . I cant figure her out at all . Which makes me believe in the FOG all the more . If I didnt believe in the FOG we would be done , The thought that she is being influenced by brain chemicals and this A will burn out eventually is keeping me in there . If there was no FOG and no end in sight for the A I would be moving on . She has just cause me too..... much pain and agony through this to forgive her if i didnt believe in the FOG .If the FOG was to clear and she came to me and authentically apologized for what she has done to us and our family and swore to never do it again and be transparent during our rebuilding then i can honestly say i would be ok and we would stay together > I trully believe in my marriage vows and i thought she did too
Wow not much feed back or support the last couple days . Do i have to start another new thread . Reading DR . Its a good read but Im questioning alot of things right now . Detachment totally works to make you feel alot less pain , I will agree with that but as far as pulling away draws her to you , Im not seeing it . She is just as distant if not more so since I started detaching and i know my wife . She probably thinks i dont care anymore and have given up . So this tells her that she can do whatever she wants now , just like being single . Which leads me to ultimatums . Stop cheating or pack your bags . She hasnt moved out like she said she was going to . Not sure why , likely because she doesnt have to . I mean she can run around with her stud and I dont seem to care because of detachment > Im not snooping so I dont even know how often she sees him or is she seeing someone else . How could I know . At least when i was snooping I knew the status of what was going on , when and where . I had a little control , now I have no control . I have alot of concerns
Sometimes you don't get much traffic, just keep journaling though.
You don't want to snoop. You may think you know what's going on, but it won't do you any good and it could harm your cause.
Plus, no you don't have control. The only person you can or should control is yourself.
i have to say one thing about all this turmoil im in , it does put life into perspective . And you find a complete whole new meaning to the word "love " . Its means so much more to me than it ever did before . And ive learned that you never reallly know what someone is thinking . Even the closest person to you could be thinking totally different than you truly believe
I think what you're seeing as control is an illusion. For me, one of the hardest things to come to terms with is the feelings of loss of control and the desire to fix things, change his perspective, argue my points, and know exactly what's going on.
Focus on controlling yourself as opposed to focusing on controlling the situation. Also, try not to assume what she's thinking and feeling - keep detaching.
Hi Dawgy. Sorry, lost your thread but found it again. It's a week into July and you thought she was going to leave July 1st. That should tell you that the DBing is working. If you had kept up the pursuing, begging & pleading she would have been out the door a week ago, IMHO.
Are you being upbeat? Are you taking care of yourself; exercising, eating well, grooming impeccably, GAL? Did you read the section in DR about "When she won't end the A"? I used to read that daily, sometimes 2 or 3 times.
Keep up the no snooping. Good self-control! You're doing well. It will take time. Try taking up a hobby: knitting, skydiving, anything to get out and GAL.
Thx for finding me Pete . I was feeling likely my sitch was too cliche' and no one was interested in helping . Its true shes still there . Last week all i cared about was the hope she wouldnt leave and she hasnt . But that satisfaction was short lived . Im havind trouble not knowing whats goin on because ive detached . I dont know if shes still in the A ( Im sure she is )or maybe shes with someone else . She said something funny to me on Sunday when she said she was going to Town for coffee . Well I know coffee means to be with OM so I casually said " off to see him eh ? " then she says I have coffee with alot of other people > WOW what does that mean ?
I'm having trouble not knowing what's going on because i've detached
You may have stopped snooping, but you certainly haven't detached. Detaching is not being reactive to everything she does, and you are still clearly hitched to her wagon. Focus more on what you are doing and can do to better your frame of mind. Focus on fixing what you know was wrong with your M (only those things that you can work on independently, of course)
Well I know coffee means to be with OM so I casually said " off to see him eh?"
Stop doing this. You can't casually say that. You accused her. It may be true that she's off to see him, but you can't change that, and being snarky or judgmental about it will not help your case.
You right zew . Thx Im still struggling with some control issues that werent there until i found out she was cheating . She came and went when ever and where ever before the A . It wasnt until i found out about the A that I started being controlling , for obvious reasons , That was before DBing came along . And Im trying with everything in me to stay the course even though i dont see much progress
Dawgy, maybe she has coffee with girlfriends in whom she confides. Whatever. Doesn't matter. Don't believe anything she says.
I sometimes go for days without anyone responding to my thread. It's just goes like that sometimes.
You need to figure out what went wrong in your marriage. What needs of hers did you not fulfill? What behaviours and patterns of interacting lead to this sitch. Try to figure out what your role in all of this was. Then put together a plan for your own growth and self-improvement. Seems like you have the detachment thing under control. Now you need to change.
I did a lot of soul searching and made some drastic changes in my life. She did notice the changes, but still is not convinced they are permanent - she's afraid I'll just slip back into my old ways. That just takes time. I've been at it 6 months and she's still not trusting the permanence of my changes, but I think she's starting to feel a little more comfortable with them. I'm still in the process of making changes. Every month I see something else that needs changing in my behaviour or my patterns of interacting. It's a lot of work, but I am becoming a better person. I'm becoming a H only a fool would leave. It takes Patience, Perseverance, Persistence and Ponderance.
Dawgy, don't worry about your W. Work on yourself. She will notice and it will cause her very conflicted feelings. She will go through all sorts of ups & downs. She will spew forth vitriol that will make you upset. Don't let it get to you. Put on your spew jacket and smile. Says things like 'that must be difficult for you", or "I see how you can feel like that". Don't take her bait if she pushes your buttons. That took me a long time to master.
How do I know what to change or what i did to contribute to this sitch . Ive asked her and she said I did nothing . But i dont want to keep prying when Im suppose to be detaching . She said she just wasnt feelin it anymore . She loved me but wasnt in love with me . I said its pretty hard to be feeling it for me or still be in love with me when theres someone else in the Picture . She is in total fog .There seems to be little i can do except detach and try to stay attractive to her . I work hard Im giving her space . She new this guy in junior high and he tells her he loves her with all his heart and soul . I tell her that and Im being pushy ?? after devouting 25 years to us . Sometimes I just wanna say pack your [censored] and hit the road woman .Other times i just want to hug her and hold her and tell her i understand
How do I know what to change or what I did to contribute to this sitch?
Seriously? You have no idea? She must have said something. Dig, man, dig. As much as the LBS initially wants to be a victim of all this and blame the wayward spouse, it is usually the case that they had a big hand in the demise of the M.
Time to be honest with yourself, dawgy.
2x4 time. You are responsible 50% for the demise of the M. I agree wholeheartedly with Zew. This is going to require soul searching, remembering what she said for the past few years, hints that she dropped, a study of your style of interaction with her over the past 25 years, and more. It's a lot of work but you now have the time to devote to that. It's not easy work, but it need to get done. I know it's often tempting to say screw it and throw in the towel, but if you still have hope then hold on to that and put your head down and get your work done.
Im honestly trying to think what i did and correct it but certainly if shes seeing another manthen he would be to blame for alot .
Nope, usually doesn't work like that.
She went to OM because of something you were doing, or something you didn't do.
Remember, she started off believing in your M. Then at some point she gave up went to OM as a last resort.
Dawgy, you are a big part of this. Don't try to pin it all on your W or on OM. Given that the only influence you have is on you and your actions, you have to figure out what you have to fix with you.
Im not saying that Im perfect by any means . However i will say that many good marriages have people stray and geet into an affair just out of circumstanses and not because the BS drove the WS to it . What Im saying is shes telling me I did nothing wrong and she doesnt love me anymore . How can I change that ? Yes i can try and figure out what things I may have done to have her not desire me even though she said there wasnt any . But I believe that she met up with OM by chance , they supposed dated back in junior high but I dont believe it . They talked casually and said lets have coffee sometime and presto it happened > Those were her words . She thought that it would be just a fling but it turned into more > Now I know that if she was completely satisfied with me she never would have met him for coffee and it just would have it was nice to see you .
The OM obviously met an emotional need that you were not fulfilling. What need was that? Figure that out.
How much have you read up on the subject of WAW? Have you read anything about the WAW in an A?
Detachment totally works to make you feel alot less pain , I will agree with that but as far as pulling away draws her to you , Im not seeing it
I have seen where you question several things in DBing. What was working for you before you started trying to apply DB?
You aren't detached. You are trying to pretend you are.....b/c you hope it will draw her in. And it's
that expectation that keeps you hyper-focused on her. As long as you are watching to see how she reacts to what you do.....you aren't detached.
She is just as distant if not more so since I started detaching and i know my wife . She probably thinks i dont care anymore and have given up
What if she does? What could she do worse that she isn't already doing? Leave you? stop allowing that fear to control you.
So this tells her that she can do whatever she wants now , just like being single
News flash........she's already doing whatever she wants as if she were single! What does that have to do with her thinking you've given up? Do you think by being this passive, clingy, needy, attached pup, that it's going to
control what she does?
Which leads me to ultimatums .
.
That's almost laughable. You say she hasn't moved out like she said she'd do........b/c she doesn't have to. And you want to blame it on your detachment? WRONG! Try another excuse. But forget ultimatums. B/c she would know it was only a bluff. You would not enforce consequences, and that would only prove to weaken you in her eyes.
I had a little control , now I have no control
You didn't have control! You are deceiving yourself. You cannot control her. She is the one in control here.
Have you read Divorce Remedy? Maybe you need to go over the part about infidelity again.
Sandi is spot on.
You are not in control over your W. You are only in control over you.
Read Divorce Remedy. Read what it says about infidelity. I don't know if your wife is also exhibiting symptoms of Mid-Life crisis, but that's also important information.
In my case, my H definitely wanted to have his affair partner and me, especially at the beginning. He bravely declared that he didn't care who knew about it, he was certain that he'd found the way that most people should live. It was complete crazy talk. He knew I was against the affair, and I established some pretty weak boundaries, but boundaries nonetheless (no texting her in front of me, no late evenings after work when he should be home with his family).
The fantasy is unraveling bit by bit. It takes time and patience and it's utterly awful. Detachment helps a LOT. He also is recognizing, slowly, what he stands to lose. He has actually told me that the grass is NOT greener on the other side. (I don't bring up the relationship anymore - just listen when he talks.)
Ok Pete > i will try . I know Im not perfect but she was weak and gave into temptation . I cant fix her weak morals . But yes I must have done something
Dawgy, You got to look at your part in the demise of your M and what you have to work on regardless of whether your W comes back to the M. You're just focusing on her still and blaming her. Just my 2 cents
Thanks guys for some input and i will agree i havent detach in th DB way totally ,but when you still live in the same hous w with children that we are trying to keep oblivious to whats going one , its not easy to totally detach . I feel different about my sitch daily so its hard to make decisions that are the best . I agree with you all but i think Sandi is being a little rough on me . Maybe i need the roughing but really i think that my sitch is a little different because we are not separated .I think Ive done well going from spying , begging and pleading and trying to reason to doing none of that > i can say honestly I have noer clue what the status of her affair is or what she does every day . All I can say is that she has shut me out as her husband and she seems to be turning us into roomates . I hate it > I want my wife back but everyday she carries this on the less and less I feel I care . Also I met another woman who wants to talk > She is very attractive and that scares me . I dont want to see her because I m afraid it will detach me big time from my wife and possibly make me throw in the towel . Im feeling feelings that I ve never felt towards my wife (anger resentment , how could she hurt me like shes been doing ? )This other woman may make me feel so good I may decide to move on . Please help me . I dont want to lose my family
Dawgy, I'm not S from my spouse either. It is hard and I struggle with detaching daily too. I truly believe that in order to get things in a better place, you have to focus on what you've contributed to the marriage. We all do things that creat some problems in our M because we are human. Mine was not showing enough support and appreciation. It doesn't excise the PA my H started, but I can see why someone else became attractive to him.
I would urge you not to start something with OP. Two wrongs don't make a right. Plus you'll only take the same issues you have today into another R. Focus on YOU not anyone else.
Dawgy -
I am not separated from my H. We still live in the same house and still sleep in the same bed.
Until very recently, my children were totally in the dark. My 15 year old then discovered a book in my bedside table about infidelity. She talked to me about it.
Honestly - when I read your posts, I know exactly where you are. I was there. I spied. I cried and begged. I reasoned. It didn't matter.
Detachment is the ONLY thing that has made me feel sort of normal again, but like you, I want my husband back. Here's what I've learned: I'm not going to get him back. He and I have BOTH changed as a result of this. It will ultimately be up to the two of us to make the new marriage between the two new people work. Right now we're both in a state of flux, so it's impossible to say. As others have written here - my crystal ball is broken, so I can't see the future.
Here's what I do know: the current situation is awful and not what I had planned when I said yes to my H 18 years ago. Divorce and separation is also awful. Divorce will not make the pain go away. Divorce will be incredibly hard on our children. And I did promise in sickness and in health. In my situation, I truly believe that my H is in Mid-life crisis...this is sickness. I watch this man, sleepless, bewildered, frightened sometimes, try to explain why a crazy situation makes sense. It doesn't make sense. Only a crazy person would think it could. So, for now I'm standing by, and hoping that the storm will pass and he and I will be able to rebuild at some point.
(By the way - my detachment probably started about a month ago...that was the last time I brought up the OW in any way. So, it took me 7 months to get to a point where I truly went dark talking about the affair. But - the detachment has been interesting. It has changed things, very subtly, between us. I do see him shifting back towards me a bit.)
Adding another woman to the mix probably feels like it would be a good salve, but I can't imagine that ultimately it would help. I would wait to do that until you are either actually separated or divorced. Otherwise you've given your wife several gallons of gasoline to pour on a fire.
I know you probably don't think you did anything to deserve this. I feel that way, too. I have ASKED my husband why he was so unhappy and, confusingly he has told me that he was happier a year ago than he is now. He has expressly told me that he doesn't want me to change: that he loves me. That is completely wackadoo and doesn't help me much....In his brain he truly thought that we were best friends and I would understand his relationship with OW. Crazy. That said - I'm not a perfect person. No one is. So - I'm doing what I can to improve myself. Working on myself as an athlete, working on my professional career, working on my skills as a parent (REALLY tough when I feel my own emotional tank is dry)...I will also need to work on myself as a friend, and I know that I need to do a better job showing my appreciation and gratitude as a spouse, but that requires more than I've got right now. I'm going to have to fake it 'til I make it for that....
Anyway - good luck. Detachment takes time, and you've got that right now. Breathe deep and hang in there!
Thanks for the message MLP . Its nice to have a womans perspective who is the LBS and its nice to have sandis perspective as the WAW also
Wow MLP , thank you soooo much for that post . We have soooo much in common with our sitches . My wife and I too are still in the same bed . She too has told me she loves me the way that I am . And yes it seems so , as you put it " wackadoo " She expected that i could understand that she wants this affair and I should be a good enough spouse to support her .If never seen such bizarre mood swings and mindless acting out like everything is just peachy . Then the array of emotions that set in at times . Its a roller coaster hun. My wife has been having this affair for seven and a half months .( ive known for about 4 ) It kills me a little bit everyday . But i agree with you whole heartedly that If we do pull it together it will be a new me and a new her in a new relationship with each other , Hats off to you , you are a very strong woman THx again . I look forward to hearing from you some more
Dawgy, news flash. Sandi is not being hard on you. She's giving you a well deserved 2x4. Listen to her. She helped turn my sitch around.
Remember this is a marathon. It may take months to see results. Make a plan. Follow your plan. Detach and GAL. Change yourself. Improve yourself. Don't focus on her at all.
Back off. Way off. We all fall down from time to time. It happens. When in crisis consult your plan, not your emotions.
Last night was a mess . i didnt get any sleep . The sexual deprivement is really rough . Its been 5 weeks since shes been sexual with me and she seemed to initiate some contact in bed . I got excited and made a subtle move and got shut down .Stupid stupid > I payed for it all night and couldnt sleep . I dont know if shes teasing me or WTF . She was ok this morning though . I tried to pretend like nothing happened .
dawgy,
I wanted to say, in response to your earlier posts, that it may just be that you're not in a place yet where you're ready to put the focus on yourself. If so, that's fine; I don't think you can force yourself there. In the meantime, it seems like you know (at least in theory) that trying to practice detachment, and to get a life, are the best means of not making anything worse. As you wrote on 7/10,
"There seems to be little i can do except detach and try to stay attractive to her." Add in getting a life, and I think you've got a solid foundation, the practice of which is hard enough as it is.
In the meantime, I don't think you can rely on her statements now in order to get an accurate read on what the problems were in the past. You mention that "Ive asked her and she said I did nothing... She said she just wasnt feelin it anymore . She loved me but wasnt in love with me." As others have said, this is classic WAW/MLC talk, and it is not a source of useful information for you.
Also, you're correct that "its pretty hard to be feeling it for me or still be in love with me when theres someone else in the Picture." But YOU cannot accomplish anything useful by trying to point that out to her, because as you also note, "she is in total fog."
So for now, it seems like it's a hard enough, but suitable task for you to focus, a day at a time, on practicing detachment and getting a life. These are incredibly difficult tasks on their own, but you can master them (even though you'll fall off the wagon, occasionally).
Once you do, maybe it will be easier for you to effectively turn the lens on yourself, in order to review your history together and find out what it is that you need to work on. Because in the long run, even if you can't (or decide you don't want to) repair this relationship, you want to avoid a repeat of the same behaviors, attitudes and interactions in any future relationships (yet another reason to avoid adding another one now, even though getting validation from someone else can *seem* like such a nice thing).
So let me get this straight .... I should not try to find out the status of the affair , because if i do she might find out i was snooping and then back to square one , and i might not like what i find out < correct ? But what if I find out something good ? Wouldnt that be beneficial to my well being and to the sitch ?
Have you actually read the DB or DR?
Reading DR . And why do you keep asking ? Arent we supposed to be supportive here ?
First off, it's not doing you any favors being snappy.
I ask because whatever advice I and others are going to give you are primarily going to be based on the book. So if you didn't read the book we need to know so the advice makes sense to you.
In fact, much of what you're asking is addressed in the book, so I'm not sure what you're asking for. If you're looking for validation to see if what you're doing in terms of the A is going to be "correct", that's not what you're going to get. Ultimately it's your choice on what to do. Every situation is different.
My W is not cheating but we still sleep in the same bed when she is at home. I don't know how to act either, is she waiting for me to act first what. I said I would sleep on the couch and she said no what are you suppose to do about that?
Dawgy, I know it's very tempting to reciprocate when she cuddles and then try to take it to the next stage. That used to work when you were originally dating and when you were happily married. Things are different now. You cannot expect sex. If you were to read His Needs Her Needs by Willard Harley (very educational - you can also watch Willard on YouTube) you'll see that women want to cuddle. Men want to have sex. It was my mistake throughout my marriage to interpret my wife's cuddling as a green light to have sex. This is not the case. Especially now since the marriage as you knew it is over.
Yes your marriage as you've known it is over. You have to face that. What you need to do is change yourself. Then maybe you can reconnect with your W, and only then can you create a new path to a new marriage.
I even said to my wife, "I don't want this marriage to continue. I don't want a divorce. I want a new marriage, a new relationship". She acknowledged that. But she hasn't stepped up to the plate yet. That'll take time.
As for snooping, it really does us no good. I did it a few times and even confronted the OM but then W drove up and joined us. Not a pretty scene. You have to let the A run its course. As MWD says most affairs don't last. My W's lasted about 15 months. And even now I'm not 100% sure it's NC. But at least she's not sleeping with him anymore (I don't think). Still, I haven't been snooping so I don't know for sure. But she tells me it's over. Then again she could be lying. She's been lying to me for over a year. See what I mean? Thinking about the A will drive you crazy.
I just need to work on myself, GAL, be happy and independent. Hopefully one day soon she will come to me and ask to reconcile. It's a long, long path but it's the path I'm on. It's the path we're all on.
As for sexual fulfillment, don't expect it from her. It may not even be safe if she's in a PA. Who knows the health of the OM. I would just recommend that you take that matter into your own hand if you know what I mean. It may be a long time before you can expect a health sexual relationship with your W again. That will come after reconciliation, which is still a long ways off.
Just hang in there dawgy. Keep DBing and keep reading. Time to educate yourself. You are your own teacher. Take the time that she's given you now to improve yourself. To become the husband only a fool would leave.
Dawgy,
Remember, an alien still is controlling your W. You may "see" the real her for brief moments but the alien is still running that ship.
Don't best yourself up either, you're in control of each and every action you do. Always strive to be in the best shape wearing the best clothes you can around the W. She needs to kick the alien out and WANT to come back, that is her job.
Pick up some hobbies and hit those hobbies immediately if you start getting frustrated like you did last night.
You can do this.
Hey yall , Things are still up and down in my corner . I think the W is playing me alot .Shes been very distant the last few weeks and i have evidence of her seeing another man other than the one shes been having A with . Which is good in a way , It shows me that shes not in love with other man >however this new guy is divorced which could be bad for us > The other guy was married . To be honest she is really out in left field . lol shes acting like a spoiled teenager alot of the time . The fog is very very thick and I feel she is far gone . I wonder if I have the power to stay through this . A month ago I was completely committed to holding strong but as each day goes by I see no change to my benefit and each day i feel betrayed more and more and it hurts more and more > To complicate things Ive met a woman in the same sitch and she is very nice and very attractive and she wants to get together for coffee and talk . As if I need anymore complications .
My detachment only goes as far as being away all day at work but then I see W at supper time then I GAL until midnight then come home and go to sleep . Im seeing her for 10 mins in morning , 20 mins at supper and bout 10 mins at night .She still rolls back the blankets for me to get into bed , she still makes my coffee in the morning . What gives ?? She s so very messed up I wish i could help her but really i want to see her hurt the way I do . Saturday night she said she was going out so i said where and with who ( I know not good DBing )she said it didnt matter and I said I didnt want her to go . She said she wanted to tell the kids everything but I believe this to be a bluff to get her own way because she knows i will do anything to have them not find out and be crushed by this . So i said see ya < go have you fun .But what if i had said go ahead and tell them , im almost certain its a bluff and she would chicken out . It seems like a game now between us , who plays what card to win their hand until the next game . Shes using the secrecy of the kids not finding out to get her own way . But theres just enough of a chance that she would tell them that I cave in . I believe sooner or later Im gonna say go ahead < I ll call her bluff .
I believe in this wayward fog thing big time . I never seen somebody change so much so fast > Shes lost her morals and her values
I believe in
To complicate things Ive met a woman in the same sitch and she is very nice and very attractive and she wants to get together for coffee and talk .
yeah im having a really rough day . i was drinking a bit on the weekend and that may contribute to my down feelings . When i feel like this i wish i could just flip a switch and turn those feelings off . Its very hard > I miss mife wife sooooo much but im trying hard to detach which means more detaching . I can see how detaching keeps her around but it doesnt seem to draw her in . Sometimes it seems to a bit but not much . I hurt so bad today that i back slid alot . I texted her clingy needy message then she called me and i was a mess .I hate myself every time i backslide but the pain is so great . Im gonna read Sandis rules again > i hope someone can chime in because Im a complete mess today
Dawgy -
We all have good days and bad days. Today's a bad day - or it has been one up until now. Sometimes you just have to decide that it's not going to be a bad day anymore and move on.
For instance - H is going to OW's city tomorrow. I have NO idea now what is going on. In the past, I have usually spent this day fretting and acting cold towards him. Today it is a beautiful day in the northeast so I've been outside with the dog. I've been super polite and pleasant to strangers (and hey - they're nice back, so that feels good!). I've spent much of the day with D and her friend getting them ready for camp. If I'm distracted, then I'm not so much of a mess. Distract yourself! I've got LOTS more to do on my to do list....if you don't have a to do list - make one! On my to do list include some work things, some home things, and some everyday things (like - find something that makes me feel good....Yesterday I heard bullfrogs when I was running, and that made me smile. Today I spied a cardinal flying around, brilliant red through a verdant green forest...That was a thing of beauty!).
Anyway - hang in there. I know you feel needy. I totally, totally get it. But when you detach a little bit, you realize, maybe not ACTUALLY needy. I think we like to think that we are needed and it's nice to feel like you "need" someone...but you don't. That's a little sad, I get it. I was at the airport this weekend looking at lots of couples reuniting, and I wondered if I would ever have that exciting, super happy rush again. I might not....BUT - I'm okay. I really am okay standing on my own two feet. Would I like to get back to that place? I think so...I don't know if I ever will. That was a place based on fearlessness and blind trust, and I don't know if I will ever feel that way again. Time will tell.
Haha - feel better? I'm all over the place!
Sandi, you're funny!. But yes, I agree. Run. Last thing you need is a rock solid reason for your wife to blame everything on you. Besides adding an OW into the mix is hellbent for trouble.
Dawg I am truly sorry for what is happening to you. I haven't found your previous thread but I do understand wanting to be there for the kids and keep them out of harms way. But reading Db and reading DR (which honestly give me a swift kick that I needed) it will help you see that there is a chance of making this situation better....for you. You have to stop and detach. It is hard. Read my thread and I am still figuring it out. I have done 180 from what my wife usually sees and I got a little response. Not a huge she wants me back but a little one and I will take that over what I was getting before I read the books. My W would tell me that it is none of my business what she is doing and that hurt. I told her everything I did and this weekend I didn't and I saw results. Like I said minor and I don't believe a thong she says and only half the the things I see.
You have to make her see that you will be fine with or with out her. Inside we hurt and we cry when we are alone and ask God why but you have to start this. The an she fell in love with that was you needs to come back. Let me ask this, when you first got with your wife and you two got serious would you have been ok with her doing what she is currently doing? I realized tonight that in my situation that if the woman I fell in love with was acting like the W I have now and is acting I would have never said let's go out all those many moons ago. I am going to guess and say you wouldn't have been. So find that old dawg and bring him back. Honestly that is the best feeling.
Remember NC, 180, and GAL. It might not save your marriage but it will save your sanity and brotha this is taking a toll on it. Also I found when I drank I would get sappy and want to call and backslide. So I drink still but not even close enough to make me backslide. I can't for my sake. You can do this.
Thanks Guys /Gals for the feedback . Just had a couple brutal days dealing with anxiety and depression over my sitch . I keep having about two days of this then I snap out of it for a week or so . This has been going on for months now . When I get like this I hide it very well and I busy myself to try and alleviate the immense pain . I feel much better today after crying for about 20 mins last night . I feel so stupid for crying when I should be manning up .But the crying seems to stop the anxiety and depression . Does anybody else have this reaction ?
Meanwhile I have no clue what my sitch is because I havent asked , or snooped or pryed into whats been going on with her and the A or A's . She has been drawn back to me in anyway that I can see from my detachment as of yet . She started too a couple times weeks ago but now nothing . Just as distant as when i was snooping
Stay the course, Dawgy. Not snooping is ultimately better for your sanity (it definitely was for mine, anyway...). And remember, this is a marathon, not a sprint. It takes time time time time time. I think MWD says that it takes three times as long as it feels like it should, and it feels like it's taking forever. (A very bad paraphrase - but something like that!)
Stop focusing on what SHE is doing, and refocus on yourself. (I know - hearing that from me is laughable. Sorry. Pot, this is kettle...you're black.)
As for the anxiety and depression - for sure I still have good days and bad days. I have good hours and bad hours. A bad place for me right now is the car. I've spent so much time crying in the car after dropping a kid off (because it was a safe place when I knew I was alone) that it's almost a trigger. Really need to work on stopping that. I think, too, that I practice the "I'm not going to make it" speech too much. I need to really reprogram myself to a "I'm TOTALLY going to make it" speech. Because right now H and I are on different paths and I need to watch the footing on my own path. His journey is about him, and my journey is about me....BUT - I'm quite hopeful that our paths will converge again.
I'm feeling pretty optimistic this morning. Not sure why. So many people go through MLC (25%! That's really a lot!) and so many people actually manage to come out on the other side of it okay. It's a weird part of life, but people get through it, just like kids get through toddlerhood and adolescence. Patience, faith....And more patience. You can do this!
I found a four-leaf clover in the yard just now, so I'll pass that luck along to everyone here!
Thank you MLC . We coincide once again . I too use my truck to have my breakdowns . But Im ok with it because it is a safe place and alone . I will even have full on conversations with myself trying to counsel me . Strange ? maybe , but it seems to help me . Today though i was offered an opinion to EXPOSE the affair . That is the only way to end it , so I was told . But DB says no to this and is not considered a good DBing practice . But I see others say it is . I refuse to EXPOSE mainly for my childrens sake .I would do anything to not have them feel the pain that IVe felt over the last 4 months . However I wish I knew the right path to take because Im not seeing any results in what im doing . I could have all the patience in the world if I knew that she was going to stay in our marriage but I dont know . So it leaves me with the question of what is the right path to take
No shame in crying. I cry too. Not as much as I used to. Yes, crying does help. It's sad. That's the reality of it.
The DBing thing is for your own sanity as much as it is for changing your relationship. It's only been a month since I've been following your thread - it was a month ago that you feared she would move out. You started the DBing. She's still at home with you. (I wish my W was home with me.) So you did something right.
Had you pursued, begged, pleaded, etc she would have been gone by now. She's still at home. Consider that a major step in the right direction. Stay the course. This will take some time.
Thx Peter . Your right she is still home . Im a terrible person for the glass being half empty . I do for my own sanity have to live in the moment and keep the glass half full . I worry alot about the future and I likely project that out there . So the remedy for that is to live in the moment , correct ? I worry day to day about whether she is gonna leave . The end of the month is coming again , so I wonder ? but I havent seen any evidence pointing towards a move . But then again thats not living in the moment thats worrying about something that may not happen .
That being said Pete , If your wife was still at home how would you use that to your advantage ?? You say you wish she was still home , so how would that make your sitch better? What are steps I can employ to keep her there ?
dawgy if you're trying to find something to occpy your mind, try some of these:
Resources for feeling betterIt will get better.
Follow Sandi's rules to a T.
Actual what worked better for me, was copying Sandi's rules, pasting them into a Word doc and editing them to put the in the first person. e.g. if it said: Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel, I changed it to: ... how bad I feel.
Then printed them out and read them over and over.
Thankx Pete but she left us last night . I tried to do everything not to pressure her but she left us to be with OM . What do I do now . I feel like its over
Dawgy, I've been exactly in your shoes only 4 months ago. Weeping. Crazy with jealousy. Not knowing what to do. Thinking it's totally over. Then I read and reread DB & DR and set my mind to it. I know it's incredibly hard and totally counterintuitive, but I think it's the only way. It certainly seems to have worked for me, so far so good.
If you want something to disappear, first you must let it flourish. If you want something to diminish, first you must let it expand. That's just the way.
Very good that you didn't pressure her. That would just drive her away faster and farther. I know it seems totally contrary but, seriously, that's the way it works.
She is creating a false world in her head. She will spew lies. She will try to rewrite history. It's something that she has to go through that has really nothing to do with you. Let her go through the stages. You have your own stages to go through, and this is one of them.
Hopefully sooner than later she will succumb to her own façade and start to see the light. But you cannot push her or reason with her. It will only drive her farther away.
Work on yourself. Improve yourself. Make a plan for yourself and execute it. Consider it a full time job.
Ahh good to hear from you Pete .I was waiting to hear from you because our sitches are similar and your advice is real and doable . Yes it is very hard but doable . I do have a question for you Peter . While GAL im making women friends who obviously want more than friendship and Im having a very hard time with this . Its happened 4 different times with 4 different women . Geez , Im sooooo lonely im trying to behave . But these ladies are offering a shoulder to cry on and hugs and kisses . Its brutal
STAY AWAY FROM THE WOMEN.
Seriously, Dawgy. I know you want some female companionship...but these women are not friends of your marriage. THAT is what you need right now IF you want your marriage to survive.
Yes - I'm telling you to suck it up and deal with a dry spell.
Yes - I know that men aren't super big fans of this.
Yes - I know that it isn't fair.
This process is long and hard and awful BUT if you really, really want your marriage to survive, I think it's the only way.
And yes im going to make a plan . I need it a good doable plan that i can stick to . But one of these women in particular has me wound up tight . very sexy .How can i stay away from it . I need to . If i slept with her i would feel like I had the right to but if W found out it maybe all she needs to say see ya later , have a nice life . Crazy thing is , the way we are living now is no life . I want the life I had a year ago or less . Last November i was happy . Hell i was even happy in march when the affair had been going on for 3 months behind my back
Why are you keeping up two threads? You are talking about how upset you are on one thread and the other how tempting other women are. I would consider closing the thread. The mods can do it for you and post on just one thread.
You do not need another woman to help you feel better. YOu would both be using each other, you would be cheating and in no way is any of that good for you or your family.
Tell your wife she needs to go somewhere else unless she will be faithful and work on your marriage. You have control of this part. Act like it.
kat
Oh dawgy....
You are playing with fire.
I am sorry.
I KNOW you want your old marriage back. Believe me, I get it. I actually am now at a point where I don't want my old marriage back. That one was broken, even though I didn't know it at the time. I want a better one. I deserve a better one. I believe I can have a better one (because, darn it - I'm a really good wife and partner and friend!). Right now I can't have it because H is going through MLC and he's got a whole boatload of issues that simply do not allow him to look at life clearly. It stinks, but I've chosen to wait it out. I've chosen to wait it out in arguably what COULD be the best years of my life. That's not fair....but - it's what I've got.
And attraction to people is like drugs. This is what your wife is going through. Her OM is a drug to her. She knows it's bad but she wants more because it makes her feel temporarily great, and then it makes her feel terrible.
A sexy woman coming on to you feels great - but if you pursue it WHILE you are trying to save your marriage, you will feel awful. And your W will have ammunition. Do you want to give her that power?
I'm telling you that adding ANOTHER affair partner to this mix is not a great solution. It will move things along, but probably not in the direction that you want.
At one point in my life, I guess I used to be a pretty good flirt. I am not the world's most beautiful woman, but I'm smart and I'm charismatic. Men liked talking to me, and I liked talking to men. I've lost all interest in attracting men to me. No thanks - nothing but trouble can come of it and I do not want H to have any justification for the decisions that he made to pursue another woman. Would it feel nice to have a man attracted to me? I can honestly say that it would NOT feel nice to me. It would make me feel like a hypocrite. I am trying really hard to live a life of integrity for me and my kids and to be the role model they need right now.
Lonely? I am definitely NOT lonely enough to open up THAT pandora's box.
I have two threads because this is my old one and i had a reply on it . And believe me im upset on both threads . And anyone who says they havent been tempted with the opposite sex while going through this is not being truthful . Im only asking how to deal with the temptation because im brutally lonely and while GALing you meet alot of people of the opposite sex
Oh Dawgy....
I haven't been tempted by the opposite sex (and that is the God's honest truth. Sometimes I wonder if I will ever feel or allow myself to feel another romantic feeling ever again, and that makes me cry). But I understand why you are.
I just think it's a terrible, terrible idea.
I'm sorry if I sounded too harsh.
Im only asking how to deal with the temptation because im brutally lonely and while GALing you meet alot of people of the opposite sex
Sure. It's called
self-restraint, Dawgy.
Thx Mlp thats what I was asking . I needed a clearer view on how to handle the opposite sex in regards to getting a life and how it seems to have lead me in that direction . Im going to have to choose activities that dont include the opposite sex
I feel soo weak . I want to give in to temptation but i realize thats what the W did .If i was to give in it could or most likely would make my sitch worse
Dawgy - it's all about choice right now. I read this a few weeks ago and it helped me tremendously. Maybe it will help you, too.
The power of choice
MLP has given a great link to an insightful article.
Take this from it, Dawgy. You cannot control your W. Period.
You must learn to control yourself. I find that to be the greatest challenge. Just try not to test yourself by engaging in conversation with the opposite sex. Yes, choose activities that don't include women. At least that'll keep you away from temptation while you learn the skill of self-restraint and self control.
While improving your self control, work on other aspects of your character.
You can also read what DBinSF is doing these days for his self-improvement. The difference, of course, is that he was the cheater...but the similarity is that he's trying to stay faithful to his WAS. I like his list. It's worth looking at for ideas.
Look dawgy I stole it. The saying I stole i played copy cat 101!
Your welcome to come in to my thread share jokes and chat. There is nothing happening with my m! He's bolted like a rogue colt
He could hardly approach me to say hello, last week at the funeral. The ow is receiving gifts including a car.
rolls eyes right.
There is a lesson in my thread, from today.
So tits up out, onwards upwards with dignity.
Dawgy - it's all about choice right now. I read this a few weeks ago and it helped me tremendously. Maybe it will help you, too.
The power of choiceLoved this article, MLP, thanks.
Having abetter day today only because W was so nice last night . Just like her old self . Om not sure why but i guess it doesnt matter . Believe none of what she says and half of what she does Right ?? I felt so good . Anyway that had a direct influence on my demeanor today . Kids are going away friday night for the night which leaves us alone . I dont know what to do . She doesnt want to be alone with me so it seems . So I think i have to make a plan to go away for the night myself . The only thing is , I know where she will be . With OM . I want to ask her what she wants to do . If she says be with him it will kill me . Im in a pinch and I dont know how to handle this
The last night we were alone she said she wanted to go be with him and i said no . And I wouldnt let her . She was very upset that i wouldnt let her go . Maybe thats why she is being nice , to butter me up for friday night . I can handle the thought of her being with him a few hrs here and there but the thought of her spending the whole night with him kills me . Cant she see how much pain that causes me ???
The last night we were alone she said she wanted to go be with him and i said no . And I wouldnt let her . She was very upset that i wouldnt let her go . Maybe thats why she is being nice , to butter me up for friday night . I can handle the thought of her being with him a few hrs here and there but the thought of her spending the whole night with him kills me . Cant she see how much pain that causes me ???
Peter , Starsky , Mlp, Sandi , anyone please chime in and give me an opinion on what to do Friday night ?
She isn't caring how much pain she inflicts on anyone because this isn't about anyone but her.
Why don't you try something new? You make plans for Friday night that do not involve her. Don't tell her what they are but keep yourself busy.
Right now I realize how hard it is for you, but you have to pull yourself together. You are a seperate person and no one controls your emotions but you. I went through this 6 years ago and it is so strange realizing what I know now. I feel awfully grateful that people stuck with me until I got it. I am trying to offer you a path, not necessarily a shortcut but a path to get back to you and a life you can be proud of. None of us can say your wife will come back but I believe we are all trying to give you the best shot. Work on yourself.
kat
No disrespect Kat but thats what i want to do but i dont want to do it if shes gonna be with the OM all night long . I cant accept that .Im not ready for her to go that far . I get very up tight thinking about her staying the night with him I get very uptight . Now it may have already happened but i didnt know about it so it didnt bother me . But I would know this time
Reading this article is very helpful.
Perspective.
Thank you
Your sitch seems to be similar . Your signature is almost the same as mine even to the OM revealed in march lets compare notes
Didn't she just go "live" with him about a week ago? (Yes, I know she came back...did you find out why?) How are you going to try and stop her?
It seems that we do have very similar feeling and situations.
Last week I went through the situation of W going out of town over night for business and knowing that it is a strong possibility of OM being there. It is so hard to let go, but I did (so far). The articles about MLC explain a lot and gives much perspective about what may be happening with her.
It's a hope that the pain ends quickly - but it seems unlikely.
No she went to her sisters for 4 days and told her we had a fight them she came home . I believe she is not sure about moving in with him because she knows her sons will never forgive her for that . And U-Turn my brother , you are a strong man and you dont deserve this . I applaud you for keeping it together and protecting your family . You are a man of integrity Big time .Im doin the same and I will not give up > Like Sandi s list do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel
I dont know how to stop her but theres got to be a way . its one thing to sleep with some one for a few hrs and then go home . But a whole night together in bed is a whole different animal .IMO maybe its just my perception . She can go wherever for the night except with him thats my line in the sand . She can bang him for 2 hrs sunday morning or 3 hrs thurs day evening but no overnight . Does that sound crazy
Yes I read all about the MLC and it seems relevant in alot of ways but not all . W even told me she that she thought that I thought she was having a mid life crisis and she couldnt affirm it or deny it . never the less alot of it makes sense and it does give a fella some guidance . Its essentually DBing advice when dealing with a W in a MLC
So....
About the same time that I found DB and DR, my H was going on a business trip overseas. I knew that OW was going to be there because I asked him. They were both going to be away from their spouses.
Did I draw a line in the sand?
I did not. There was not one thing that I could do about it. That was the last conversation that I had with H about OW.
Since that date (almost 2 months ago), I have been practicing DR techniques. One of those techniques is to NOT bring up the affair. Another one is to detach. Another one is to GAL. And another is to do 180s (and no relationship talks is a big 180 for me).
While he was away, I did not contact him. He would message me, and I would respond. He would send pictures, and I would respond. But I never initiated contact.
When he returned, I gave him space, but I also gave him a much more pleasant version of myself than what he had been living with for the previous 6 months. I make an effort to look nice. I make an effort for him NOT to see me sad or brooding. I keep busy and I have no expectations of him joining me or the kids.
I have no idea what the status is of H and OW right now.
He was silent (and sleepless) for about two weeks following the trip. I didn't ask about anything. He was DEFINITELY distant. And then he started changing. Things are shifting. He went to her city last week and he spent his evenings in the hotel face timing with me on the computer (at his suggestion, not mine) or playing an online game with me. He asked me to lunch today. He spends his time with me in the evenings now - not squirreled away at his computer or hiding somewhere with his tablet. When I want to walk the dog, I go walk the dog. I tell him I'm walking the dog. More often than not, he joins me. He has invited me to play an online game with him and the boy, which I do.
Now - we're a long way off from "perfect" or "better," but I will say that my attitude about myself and my situation has helped ME a lot. I no longer feel desperate or nearly suicidal. I have a great IC who is helping me look at ME and how some of MY issues are damaging to my relationships with other people (not just my marriage) and to myself. I still FIRMLY believe that my H is entrenched in MLC. He's going to be there for a while. I am a LONG way off from him having any sort of realization that he blew up our perfect marriage or an apology. I may never get that. But for now I can live with what we have. I have hope again.
So - what should you do? I say do something else on Friday. Don't ask her what she's doing. It will be the hardest thing you have ever done.
There are some here who suggest that you tell her that you won't be in a relationship with her if she's in a relationship with OM. Many have had success with that.
I, for one, subscribe to the theory that you shouldn't talk about the AP. Just stop talking about it. Stop talking about the relationship. That relationship is built on lies, but yours is not. That relationship has very, very poor footing. Yours does not. I do think that drawing a line in the sand is more likely to drive her to OM, but different people have different success with this. You know your W best.
Doing something is hard. Not doing something is hard, too.
Good luck - I hope my story helps you a little bit!
Thx for the input Mlp . But its still do I let her go or do I say no to her behavior . im thinking about inviting her out for a few drinks and food , but im sure she will decline . Then I will Do my own thing and if she goes to him then I will have to let it be and GAL . But it will be in my mind the whole time while GAL ing . I wont be able to drink . I cant trust i wont go to his house and make a scene . I' ll have more info tomorrow but im positive shes making plans to be with him overnight knowing the kids will be away
I don't think it is "let" her go. She didn't ask you for permission. She is making her own choices right now. They aren't kind or good or honest, but they are hers.
You have your own choice. You can live a life that is kind and good and honest. You can go and make a scene (which is unlikely to result in her choosing you that night). You can invite her out (pursuit) or you can have your own plans where you will look and smell your best and do something nice for yourself (which might confuse her and make you look more interesting than the desperate spouse you've been showing for a while).
Dawgy, it concerns me how much talk you are doing about sex, other women, and temptation. How can you make very wise decisions when you are thinking along those lines?
If you stay with her Friday night, your mind will be on mostly getting sex, judging on your other posts. If she doesn't want to be with you, I think you'll be setting yourself up for rejection. That's JMHO.
I just think you need to get yourself under control before you try to do much of anything else.
Dawg,
I know it's hard - as you saw from my thread, but I had to tell myself, she is not captive and will make her own decisions anyway. All you can do is focus on how you are reacting to it.
You will think about it, but try to do other things.
Great point, Sandi.....
I was just thinking about this a little more....
I KNOW I am the better choice, but I have to be a choice. I don't want to be with a man that I've forced to be with me.
Here's the other thing....I have a choice, too. For now, I have chosen to stay with him. I have made this choice because I believe he is in MLC. At some point, I may decide that I've had enough. I may choose to either establish more boundaries or to end our relationship. I just don't think that any good will come right now from forcing the issues.
In Jim Conway's book, [u]Men in Midlife Crisis[/u,] he writes "The 'one more time' stage is most difficult if a man is saying, 'One more time - with one more new woman.' Naturally the wife views this as rejection. When I speak on this subject at a conference, women will frequently look at me in startled amazement as I suggest to them that their husbands do not want to leave them or lose them. Men in crisis think a new sexual experience will restore their confidence in themselves. These men imagine they have missed something. If the wife can keep calm during this very painful stage there is a great likelihood the couple will stay together. If, however, the wife pushes and demands a choice, the husband will probably side with the 'one more time' option and the marriage will dissolve."
Wow MLP
I've thought and used these exact words (mostly in my head but some out loud and in letters to W).
I really am surprised to hear that my feelings are not unique.
I wonder how Jim Conway's scenario would be if it was the woman having the affair - same?
U-Turn, I'm curious about the other way around, too. You might want to see if the library has a copy of Sally Conway's book. It looks like you can get it on Amazon. (Women in Midlife Crisis, by Jim and Sally Conway).
Sociologically speaking, I understand it's much harder for men to accept their wives having an affair....I wonder if that's simply because the media has shown us over and over again men having affairs. It's sort of a dirty little accepted truth that it might happen, this sort of dalliance. Men probably have the same emotional beating of feeling "less than."
Ultimately, the affair isn't about you. It's about your spouse. And broken attracts broken.
The thing that has astonished me about this whole journey is how similar the stories are. Sorry you have to be a part of this club. I've read tons about it, which has helped me (I just became academic about the whole thing). I'm hoping that it will carry me all the way through to the other side and he and I can have the stronger, more fulfilling marriage on the other end. That would be awesome, because honestly - the marriage before was pretty darned great! For now, I'm working on my issues....we'll see how he does on his!
Hi Dawgy,
MLP is giving you good advice. It is really difficult to accept that you cannot control what the WAS does, but you have to accept it. Setting boundaries are good, but boundaries should be for your/your children's protection and not as a means to control the WAS. That will only drive them further away. Been there, done that!
I know how hard it is to watch your WAS leave to see the OP. Been there, done that, too. But you can't let them know it gets under your skin. That will only make the OP look more attractive and you less desirable.
In your shoes, I would tell her I was going away to spend my free night without kids with a relative or same-sex friend(s) and would see her the next day. Then I'd do it - turn the tables on her in a safe way (no OP involved). And if I didn't have a relative or friend to visit, I'd check into a hotel and find something enjoyable to do with my free time. It would probably be a long sleepless night, but at least I wouldn't be letting her see how distraught I was. That's not necessarily for everyone's sitch ... but, just a thought.
Listen to MLP. She's giving you good advice.
2times I had the exact same thoughts . Could go spend the night with my mom but she would be suspicious of something wrong , so I thought about hotel and some relaxation for myself time . But it would be brutal if i cant get her out of my mind .
Sandi I agree with you to a point . Im not focused on sex or other women but the lonliness is soooooo brutal it scares me . I dont want to sleep with another woman . I want my wife but she doesnt want me right now and it hurts immensly . Im trying really hard to restrain myself .Ive put myself in a couple of situations while GAL and it led to women wanting to be with me and talk to me . And the temptation would not be there if my wife loved me and was shoewing me affection . Just to have a woman to hug me is such a comforting feeling . im sorry if i seem shallow or weak , but im really trying to restrain
I have a feeling that is the draw of having an affair. Right now she is getting the affection and touch she needs, and why would she give that up? She seems to have the best of everything and you are the only one losing. I feel the same way.
I just try to remove those feelings, try to realize that this is not the person she wants to be and know she is hurting too (even though the affection she is getting is carrying her through).
Sex, for me, is for a good relationship. I try to remove all desires until that is back. It is very difficult.