I am new to the BB and have been reading many posts over the last month. I have found some good inspiration and hope from here, and hope you can help me sort out this mess.
I am married to my W for 26 years and we were high school sweethearts, together 30 years (or so…long time anyway). As such, I always thought we would always be together. We have been through all kinds of turmoil in our relationship mainly to do with Money, deaths, kid rearing stress and so on. We have always stuck together and truly loved each other in all this time. There has never been any unfaithfulness, and I don’t suspect any, and we have always been loyal and truthful to each other.
So you can imagine my surprise when one day out of the blue my wife says she has had enough and doesn’t think we can continue in a relationship…..(MLC?) I was devastated, totally blindsided, I had no idea etc. I think it has something to do with the last child leaving the house and she wants to “live” life now.
Apparently she was tired and felt lonely in the relationship. When I asked why she felt this way the floodgates opened. Like most people (Men…) in my situation I guess I thought things were better than they seemed. She was tired of doing everything around the house and not going out more. We have another couple that we see a lot of, and have fun going out. The wives are close friends but us husbands are not. I mean we hang out and talk and it’s all good, but we don’t socialize other than when we get together as a couple. The wives however are best buds and essentially talk or dance together all night. As you can guess, us husbands are left with polite conversation over a few beers. The problem I have is that when we go out, we really are not together, she is with her friend mostly, and spends little time with me, thus my reluctance to want to go out…. Her complaint is that she is tired of worrying if I am having a good time or not, even though I am out with her.
I’ll try to keep this short, but I am at a loss as to what to do or not do. I have read Sandi’s rules and have tried to make them relevant to my 180’s but am not having much success. (Though it’s only been 6 weeks). For example, years ago, I used to be a touchy feely guy, but she wasn’t so much, so I adjusted myself to back off over the last 10 years. Well, guess what, her main complaint is I don’t “hug” and “touch” her enough….. talk about confusion.
Anyway, I could use some advice from anyone who has the same problems or same spouse issues. I am doing more around the house, mainly for myself, as I will have to do it anyway when and if she leaves….
I am afraid that the Rules may push her further away….
Sorry you're here RD, but this is a good place.
When I first joined, I noticed that a lot of advice started with get hold of Divorce Remedy and/or Divorce Busting and read them. Also read Sandi's Rules - which you've mentioned you've already done. Remember that they are a guideline - they won't all apply equally to every sitch.
I'm in a similar sitch - my H announced he was unhappy, and that he'd been getting closer to a new friend (since become PA. We'd been having a few problems in terms of spending time together but not enough to have expected him to announce that he wanted a D. We've now been separated for 6 weeks, and we've actually had more conversations and us time since he moved out than in the preceding few months.
I'm pretty convinced my H is MLC - as well as the OW, he's been spending cash we don't have to spare, and all his new friends aren't much older than my stepsons. He started going to the gym and is fitter now than when we got married, and he's also changed his hairstyle back to the way he wore it when we first met. The other giveaway is the fact that the OW remarkable resembles his XW#1 - that in itself screams that he's trying to recapture his youth.
You're on moderation now and your posts will take a while to show up. Don't let that stop you - keep posting in small amounts and you'll soon be off moderation. I found that frustrating when I first joined, but the more post the faster you'll be off moderation.
I'm no vet by a long shot but I've found that joining this forum is one of the best things I've done to try and save my M. Keep posting, read other threads and you may find helpful info there. Hopefully some of the vets will catch up with you soon and be able to give you more advice.
Apart from the two books and Sandi's Rules, I'd suggest finding yourself some activities to GAL, as well as the 180s. Concentrate on yourself as that is the only person you can change. Your W has to figure out things for herself at this point. Don't expect change overnight and don't get your expectations up too much when you have a good day. You're in for a rollercoaster ride - my H changes his attitude from hour to hour sometimes, not just from day to day. You're in for a long trip. If you find that some of the Rules are pushing her away, don't do them. Others may work better. It's a case of experimenting until you find what does work.
Patience is going to be very important to you in the coming weeks and months. Don't try to rush anything. And as they say on here frequently "Believe nothing that she says and only half of what she does". Doing for yourself is important - if nothing else, you'll come out of this a better person.
So you can imagine my surprise when one day out of the blue my wife says she has had enough and doesn’t think we can continue in a relationship…..(MLC?) I was devastated, totally blindsided, I had no idea etc. I think it has something to do with the last child leaving the house and she wants to “live” life now.
MWD talks about this in DR, but basically your W has probably been planning this for months or even years. You're probably right that leaving after the last child left was her plan all along. Typically the WAS has some milestone like that that they are waiting for before dropping the bomb. From everything you describe it sounds more like WAS than MLC by the way.
I’ll try to keep this short, but I am at a loss as to what to do or not do.
Read DR, it's your roadmap on what to do and not do.
I have read Sandi’s rules and have tried to make them relevant to my 180’s but am not having much success. (Though it’s only been 6 weeks).
6 weeks isn't long enough for them to have any effect. It takes many months or even years of consistent, changed behavior before the WAS believes the changes are real.
For example, years ago, I used to be a touchy feely guy, but she wasn’t so much, so I adjusted myself to back off over the last 10 years. Well, guess what, her main complaint is I don’t “hug” and “touch” her enough….. talk about confusion.
Your confusion stems from the fact that you were mind-reading. She didn't react to your touch the way you expected, so you assumed it meant she didn't want to be touched. Obviously you were wrong. It's essential that you learn new communication skills and quit mind-reading. I spent decades mind-reading my W (because she is totally a closed book when it comes to communication) and in one weekend at RetroV I learned just how far off I was in my mind-reading. Don't assume anything, learn how to listen to your W and validate her emotions.
I am afraid that the Rules may push her further away….
You only think that because your instincts tell you to pursue, pressure, beg, plead, negotiate and reason with her. Your instincts are WRONG. Those things are pressure and WAS's HATE pressure. Stick with the rules. Note that the rules are not about being cold and indifferent, they are about lovingly pulling back and giving your W time and space to sort her thoughts.
Thanks NQ.
There is comfort here knowing I am not alone.
We had a relationship chat the other night and her words were that she didn't want me to change and be something i am not just for the relationship. But in my mind, if I don't change,(do some 180's) things will remain the same and she will still want to leave. Feels like a catch 22 or a declaration that no matter what I do, we are doomed.
We still have light chats after work, mainly about our day, but they seem labored. Once that subject is exhausted she remains quiet the rest of the evening.
Trying to be upbeat and act like i am all good is tough. I actually think it is pushing her away more like I don't care. I was always the chatter box. I think not initiating a conversation with her makes her think I don't care.
Lots of stumbling in the dark I suppose. I guess if it was easy there wouldn't be divorces..
I guess i will just have to ride this out....
Thanks AS.
The fact she may have be planning this makes sense. I will get a copy of DR and give it a go.
The Mind reading thing is interesting. I have never thought of it that way before. I guess trying to figure out the signals I am getting will be the big challenge.
Its great to have a place to share my thoughts.
Thanks again.
Hi All
Its been a while since I last posted. A lot has happened. I have been trolling this board the whole time though, looking for hope and ideas on how to rebuild.
First i bought and read DR some time ago and have been trying these techniques. How do you find the strength?
We are living apart now and have sold the house in March. I try very hard not to text or call unless its about the kids but I seem to be making up "kid" texts just to get some contact. I know this should stop.
What makes it tougher is that all our together friends have disappeared.... I guess in truth she was the more social of us and they have gravitated over to her.
This is all very tough. I don't think she has any desire to be in a relationship with me again.
Has anyone else had there whole life removed including their so called "friends " due to this. She is a WAS so I am bitter that I am left with no support.
Any advice on how to cope?
(1 day good - 3 days not so good)
You need to post more than 4 posts in a year, okay? People assume you have quit and they won't keep posting without you putting some effort into your thread.
Sorry you are having such a difficult time. Maybe you need to start building a new life with another circle of friends. What do you do for GAL?
You are right sandi. i have trouble expressing myself and have always been a private type guy.
It took a lot of courage to post here. The comfort level though is improving. but i have found great encouragement and support by just reading posts of people in almost similar situations.
Doing GAL is a bit rougher for me as most of my friends where marriage friends. As my wife was always the more outgoing, they naturally gravitated toward her and i am left with nothing. She is actually planning a trip with our old travel friends, just her mind you. but this hurts a lot as well.
I have actually started going to a local pub near me about twice a week to put me out of my comfort zone. I am starting to get acquainted with a few regulars but am still quite a way away from a new circle.
I have taken up photography again and hop e to meet up with a club soon.
anyway, great place to vent, as i find it helps me greatly.
More to come.
I have been reading other posts of people in my similar situation.
Currently, my wife and I have been talking and interacting a lot. This is mainly due to our oldest daughter getting married.
We have great talks about work, kids, wedding planning, etc, nothing to do with relationship. She has said she loves me and wants to be friends, but i an having a problem with this. I have come across this in other threads that a friend wouldn't do this to me.
I feel good when we are talking, but somehow I feel that she is the only one benefiting from these "light" talks.
Now that the wedding is past,(maybe another post on how to get through that, remember its all about your daughter, not you, suck it up that day), there is really no reason for us to get together other than me pursuing or her calling.
I am struggling with detaching, and am now thinking of and maybe going a few shades of dark. I am afraid to go completely dark as this was normal for me during conflict while we were still together. She may see this as same old.
I am also thinking of telling her that I don't think I can be her friend right now, but again, I am afraid this will piss her off and push her away more.
Whats difficult is I have always trusted my gut, But DR is about not doing that, its very hard, and feels so wrong really. But i trust what I have read in other posts and their results and have been trying.
Tomorrow we will both be taking our other daughter to the airport so she can return home. I am thinking of giving the "cant be friends speech" on the way home. Ill make sure we are almost home before talking, so I don't have to walk the rest of the way..:)
Or should i just leave it and go grey and see what happens...
Detaching is super hard. I'm in the middle of it myself. WAW's pick up on the non verbals when you "need" them though.
I'm only partially detached, but way better then I was weeks ago. Give it a try. Get some space. It is great for the soul.
I am just afraid that if I detach she will sigh with relief and carry on with her life, pleased that I am starting to move on...
I guess we all fear that, but I guess no risk no reward...
Hi RainyDay, you have to get with the program. By detaching, GALing, and if you will stop pursuing your W, these are the things that might make you more attractive to her. Have you read DR?
Hi Wet,
I have read DR. Just weak I guess and even though we have been separated 6 mths she continues to connect at least once a week. As stated above I am realizing that she wants her cake and to eat it too. I honestly enjoy the talks, however, i feel there is no hint of progress with R anymore. She just needs someone to talk to.
I was confusing the talks with more interest, but I think it was wishful thinking, as there was never any mention of R.
Anyhow, thanks for the kick in the butt
I will detach, and continue my GALing.
I am torn on a particular situation and I am hoping someone out there has had experience with this.
If you read my story you will know that most of my "Friends" where "couple" friends that suddenly disappeared or became all awkward whenever I tried to connect. In fairness the inner circle was the wives with the men tagging along, but we are talking years here and we build good friendships.
I ran into my old "Buddy" and we had a few drinks. I suggested we do something and he agreed. We are planning a concert this weekend.
I guess my whats bothering me is it feels weird.... I dont know if i can trust him not to spill anything to his wife and therefore get back to my S. As alcohol will most likely be involved i will most likely spill some tidbit or 2.
As well, spending time with my buddy now becomes very painful as it is a reminder of all I have lost. We used to travel together a couple times a year as couples.
I feel that i should just cut all ties until i am more detached and therefore cancel this weekend.
Any insight would be appreciated.
Hi RainyDay, go have fun! Out to a concert with an old friend, a few drinks, and your wondering if you should do it? May I suggest the Serenity Prayer here? All you can control is yourself. Don't blab anything that should not be blabbed to your friend, then you don't have to worry if he tells his wife anything. Keep a positive attitude when you are around your friend, just like you are working on when you are around your W. No moping! Then he'll be more likely to want to hang out with you in the future. This seems like an easy one - stop over thinking it.
Thanks Wet.
hehe, makes sense when you stand back and look it.
I do tend to over think. Need to stay in the now more...
As always great advice.
Well we both took my D21 to the airport tonight to see her off.
On the way was fine as D21 was a good distraction and kept us conversing.
On the way home was hard. But I was strong and stuck to the program. Presented good PMA and was a bit indifferent. We only talked about work/kids stuff and no R talk whatsoever. When there was silences I really had to bite my tongue and let it pan out, as I usually would always try to keep the conversation going. I think this troubled her a bit or threw her off, but that's mind reading i suppose.
It was tough as in my mind, I was planning on not initiating any contact for a while and detaching/going dark.
When I dropped her off I just said goodbye and hugged.
I am hurting over it, but in a sense it felt kind of liberating. Time to look after me and GAL. (knowing my luck she will text or call about something, but I think I will maybe be busy the first time.)
The sadness was creeping up so I came here to spill. It makes me feel better to share this stuff. In a sense this is a 180 for me as well, as there was no way I would have ever posted on a forum like this previously.
I am glad I found this place. You all give me strength. I already feel much better.
This detaching, going dark thing is hard. I have followed the rules for about 2 weeks now but every now and then I get this incredible urge to call or text her. I have been able to resist these urges but boy is it hard.
Today I am picking up my S20 from her apartment to come stay with me for a while. She usually asks if I want to stay for a coffee. I am not sure whether to accept or not. In all honesty, having a coffee with her and chatting would please me but I am thinking it may go against my efforts to detach. Of course she may not ask me to stay, in which case that solves that, however part of me would be very disappointed. I just don't know how I am going to handle this one.
This is almost an art form....I really have no clue whether any of this is working. Being separated makes it harder as she wont see any changes unless we meet up. i don't think she wants to meet up....that's why it is so challenging for me not to text or call. I am truly afraid that I wont hear from her for a very long time if at all. Once the S20 goes back to school in a couple of weeks I expect her to disappear and not bother with me anymore. I suppose that this is the reality that I must face. But it continues to cause me great pain and sense of loss.
To help cope, I have found a Separation/Divorce group that I meet up with now, and its great to share with people in similar situations. I have also returned to playing music again, which is something that kind of disappeared during the last 15 years of marriage. Feels good to belt out songs again, as it makes you forget about everything. I am also hitting the gym and have lost a lot of weight. To be honest i started this hoping the S would like the change, but now I am doing it more for me as I am losing hope by the day.
Hoping to here from someone similar situation. Any tips would be great.
Hi Rainy;
Darned right it's an art form - staying detached.
As for W asking you to stay for a coffee, I would suggest to take her up on her offer and be totally happy, talkative and at the same time casual. Absolutely no R talk and no talk bordering on your troubled emotions. Keep it light, like good friends talking as if you're first dating. Try to be like the man she first fell in love with 30 years ago. But don't hang out too long - say you've got to get going and exit gracefully.
Afterwards you can let out your true emotions in the privacy of your own home.
Hang in there. Keep posting. Listen to what Sandi says - she's a long time vet and full of great wisdom. She's helped turn my sitch around. Also Wonka, MLP and Starsky are gems of wisdom if you're fortunate enough to hear from them. But be sure to keep posting and baring your soul here. It truly is cathartic.