Divorcebusting.com
Posted By: rickb89 DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/14/12 10:32 PM
I plan to somehow feel better by the end of this thread!
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/14/12 10:36 PM
You were getting way to much action on that other thread...:)
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 12:06 AM
I'm telling ya..
Posted By: 25yearsmlc Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 12:12 AM
working yet Rick?

((( )))
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 12:23 AM
Ha ha 25!
Posted By: Mach1 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 02:28 PM
So let me ask you something Einstein....

How the F, do you have two part 2 threads, and jump to a part 4 thread ?????


Maybe that is why you aren't feeling any better yet ???


jus sayin
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 02:31 PM
Its an ongoing saga. He knows there will be a four so why not just get it started. I'm starting part 7 today!
Posted By: Mach1 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 02:36 PM
LMAO....

I guess so....

You doin okay Rick ???
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 02:58 PM
He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!

That's our rickb89!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 03:52 PM
Hey Mach and Monkey man. I do have a thread part 3! At least it shows that way on my posts. Odd.

I have been giving a lot of thought to how I have been seeing, reacting and acting in this sitch for the past year. I recognize (and it took a long time to do this) that I have given my total focus to my W and her sitch, not really focusing at all on the fact that I am on a huge journey in this too.

I have been agonzing over what is selfish and feeling like anything I did that was purely for my benefit or my growth(not for her) is selfish. Also, I took full responsibilty for my W's sitch and really needed to realize that this is her crisis, her journey, and I have no right to try and control it or will her to find her answers.

I realize that I have not really let her go, have, in a way that is harmful, taken total responsibilty for the environment she is in throughout this sitch. I honestly feel like I have devalued myself and knowingly given my self away.

I have created this environment for her that I think allows her to have this safe warm open road back to us and see that it has certainly helped in some ways. That may be necessary to keep the door open for a reconciliation someday.

I can't know how she will go through this, nor predict any outcome. Anything could happen.

I do see this though. I do not have a W anymore, nor a lover, partner or even a friend. I may have done the loving thing for her by offering support and a healing environment. There's providing loving support, then there's allowing yourself to be trampled on. I think I am allowing it and rationalizing it as unconditional love. I have to recognize that loving myself is not selfish. I look at my track record throughout this M and see that I sold myself out. Had I overcome the affects of my childhood sitch earlier I would have never put up with the things I did with her, regardless of her source for these issues. It also would have been better for her and our M if I had the growth I needed in this area. FWIW, it took this sitch for me to see that I have value too, not just in being a provider and coach of others.

Do I have a W or partner? No. What I am living with can best be described as a teenage daughter. She's got her room, her safe home, spending money, time, freedom. She's acting like a spoiled little girl. If she has everything she wants she can be fine, even civil and friendly, but if anything challenges her or is in any way uncomfortable in her current state of mind she runs, lashes out, defends, blames, etc.

She's got to grow up and I'm not doing her any favors by being the benevolent sugar daddy. My self esteem is shot. She does things, and I go along with it that other people see and say, man how can you live with that? I put everybody in their place at one time when they were sticking their nose too much in our M. I do see, given some time with this, that I am really actually being used, maybe not consciously by her, but used nonethelss.

First I had to get beyond the absolute trainwreck of the bomg going off, then I needed to see what was going on with her. Then I needed to put the pieces back together so that my kids and my W had a open road home for healing. Okay, I did that. Now, I need to see what my journey and god path is in this, and I need to learn the lesson that's been staring me in the face my entire life.

For me, for my W, and esp for my kids I need to handle this differently. I've got two kids in college, one about to enter high school this fall. I have an obligation to remember my value as an individual and that if I give up my value for her I am doing no one any good. For our family I cannot enable my W to stay in this stage. I am doing that and I see the effect it has on my kids. They look at their Mom and are seeing a spoiled teenage girl who is being handed a lifestyle of opportunity for her, no consequences. They see her hanging out with OM's and blowing me and the family off. They see me rescuing her from drunken bar nights, taking on all the burdens. They see that they can't have meaningful connection to her. I have made it clear to them that their Mom is really in a deep crisis and that she needs love and support and they get that, and do that too, but its so draining to everybody.

Look, I love her, my boys love her. She's in a dark place and I'm not helping this not loving myself.

I have to take steps. God helps those that helps themselves. Right now this sitch is open ended. She has told me she is keeping an open mind about us and is afraid that she might be making a mistake. I can't see us getting to a better place by enabling this sitch as it is. I have no idea of where or what my W might end up as. I have decided that I am moving forward with a new mindset. I am looking at everything in terms of how I can rebuild my life, be happy and fulfilled, fulfill my mission on earth, be a more self realized person in a relationship.

I'm going to handle my interactions differently with her too. I will still be friendly, supportive and loving. I will not pamper her anymore, make excuses for bad behavior, not try to exert my will over her path or her recovery, not accept her actions that are demeaning to me as her husband. I will not give her verbal reassurances that I love her, that she has unlimited time to figure herself out. She has to see the consequences of her actions too, just like I have been. I have a date set in my mind. At that time I will see what's what. If I see any progress in my M then maybe I'll stay with her, but if not I'm moving on.

Okay, so here it is. I'm putting my very soul in god's hands. Frankly, I'm scared shitless but here I go.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 03:54 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!

That's our rickb89!


Thanks Bug. You're the best. I need to do some of that for myself too as you recently suggested.
Posted By: purgatory Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 03:59 PM
Your continued ability to peel away your own layers and look deep into yourself, is inspiring an motivating.

In the day of my trouble I will call to you, for you will answer me . Psalm 86:7
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:00 PM
Good for you Rick! God speed, my friend!
Posted By: nhmom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:09 PM
Rick, you're doing an amazing job on discovering yourself and trying to figure out what YOU want. It is absolutely not selfish to love yourself. You have been giving without receiving for so long.

Your self-discovery is inspiring to me as well. You're a good man, father and husband. You have a good heart.

I'm so sorry about the way your W is acting. Not only has it taken a toll on you and your M, but also on your sons. It must be so hard for them to see their mom act the way she does. While she is not setting a good example, YOU are. You are showing them what commitment is; the meaning of family and marriage.
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:11 PM
I have been giving a lot of thought to how I have been seeing, reacting and acting in this sitch for the past year. I recognize (and it took a long time to do this) that I have given my total focus to my W and her sitch, not really focusing at all on the fact that I am on a huge journey in this too.

Rick you are beyond journey and into a Homeric Odyssey now wink
Again, your fortitude and current introspection are inspiring.


I do see this though. I do not have a W anymore, nor a lover, partner or even a friend
I disagree.

I'm going to handle my interactions differently with her too. I will still be friendly, supportive and loving
These last three words are the hallmark of a good friend.
Posted By: Mach1 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:13 PM
I think you are getting it...

Being THAT person, is the magnet....

Now, those are just words and thoughts, although through repetition, your words and thoughts will become your actions....

Is that what you want the world to see ??

Is that the man you want your children to see ??

I would venture that your answer will be a "yes"...


Be that man, consistently.
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:15 PM
I have had difficulty with the "turning it over to higher power"
AlAnon 3rd Step but I keep trying. I know that when I am able to embrace that then everything else goes better because I let go of that belief that I can control things. I don't have to worry about every little detail because it's out of my control. I can concentrate on my next step.

I can only control myself. I can only control myself. I can only control myself
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:37 PM
Wouldn't it be great if we could all get together and swap "Tales of the LBSer"

Y'all are the best!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:41 PM
Originally Posted By: purgatory
Your continued ability to peel away your own layers and look deep into yourself, is inspiring an motivating.

In the day of my trouble I will call to you, for you will answer me . Psalm 86:7



Thanks Purrr....that helps.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:42 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
Good for you Rick! God speed, my friend!


You too, two.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:54 PM
Originally Posted By: nhmom
Rick, you're doing an amazing job on discovering yourself and trying to figure out what YOU want. It is absolutely not selfish to love yourself. You have been giving without receiving for so long.

Your self-discovery is inspiring to me as well. You're a good man, father and husband. You have a good heart.

I'm so sorry about the way your W is acting. Not only has it taken a toll on you and your M, but also on your sons. It must be so hard for them to see their mom act the way she does. While she is not setting a good example, YOU are. You are showing them what commitment is; the meaning of family and marriage.


Thanks NH. You are so sweet. I really don't want to make my poor W out to be some sort of villian, and I'm sure you know that. It's just I can't see how she will find her way to growth if I keep enabling, and if I keep selling myself out we all go down. This is hard.

Best to you BTW!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 04:57 PM
I do see this though. I do not have a W anymore, nor a lover, partner or even a friend
I disagree

G-monk - what do you mean when you disagree? thx
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 05:05 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
I have had difficulty with the "turning it over to higher power"
AlAnon 3rd Step but I keep trying. I know that when I am able to embrace that then everything else goes better because I let go of that belief that I can control things. I don't have to worry about every little detail because it's out of my control. I can concentrate on my next step.

I can only control myself. I can only control myself. I can only control myself


Bug - I have often felt, heard and even seen the unseen hand of the universe in my life, but I have never felt more unable to handle something and need the help of the higher powers in this. This is the biggest act of faith for me and I'm just saying I'll keep walking forward all the while quite nervous. When I was a kid it was easier to do. If I suceeded I lived, if not I died, and the hand of the divine was felt through it. This is much harder for me because it involves the love of another, and my kids. It was easier when it was just me.
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 05:10 PM
Rick - I meant the "friend" part. I think you are being a good friend to W. I do understand how you feel though. My W is "dead" to me.
Posted By: ces67 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 05:29 PM
I'll jump in with GM as well. Not sure if this is the same for you all but while I still love my W very much, I cannot see her as a friend, lover or support in anyway. That's just not where she is right now. To look at her in these ways would only be to place expectations on her that she cannot live up to and will ultimately disappoint me.

The question I have to keep asking myself is "what do I want to be to her?" The "lover" thing is definitely out of the picture but I can still act as a friend & support when opportunity arises.
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/15/12 05:32 PM
So true, ces, so true. Getting there is hard won but it certainly makes things easier when we drop the "wow, why isn't he acting like a my H?". I think it takes us out of victim mode when we accept that.
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 01:07 AM
i think you have discovered the secret to setting loving boundaries and learning how to detach. did you patent it??

i was deeply moved by your words and your insight. you will definitely inspire your boys to become awesome men.

you have value. this...

"He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!
That's our rickb89!"

does not. *shudder* however.. if you choose to put on swim trunks while doing so.. i may change my mind.
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 01:53 AM
Ohhh did that ^^^^ come across wrong. rickb is always visiting threads and pumping everyone up.

Didn't mean any disrespect.
Posted By: BklynMom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 01:58 AM
It is so much easier when it is just about "me". Why do I have to take my kids into account?? If it was just me I could cut all ties and move to Thailand for a while and lay low. Why do I have care even a little for the WAS? Cant this all just be about me?? Can I try to act 21 again??
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 02:02 AM
Labug - I wasn't offended at all smile. It was just a funny image! Lol. For some reason.. I also pictured the easter bunny!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 11:58 AM
Originally Posted By: barely floating
i think you have discovered the secret to setting loving boundaries and learning how to detach. did you patent it??

i was deeply moved by your words and your insight. you will definitely inspire your boys to become awesome men.

you have value. this...

"He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!
That's our rickb89!"

does not. *shudder* however.. if you choose to put on swim trunks while doing so.. i may change my mind.


Yeah...that might bring to mind a little chubby cherub gaily flitting around the DB board. Let's hope that's not me! Swim trunks in Feb? Hmmmmm...
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 12:01 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
Ohhh did that ^^^^ come across wrong. rickb is always visiting threads and pumping everyone up.

Didn't mean any disrespect.


Thanks for going to bat for me LA!!!!

That's all I need....to be perceived as the little fat cherub with the bow and arrow on VD! Imagine getting branded with that image in cyber world ha ha.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 12:04 PM
Originally Posted By: rickb89
Originally Posted By: barely floating
i think you have discovered the secret to setting loving boundaries and learning how to detach. did you patent it??

i was deeply moved by your words and your insight. you will definitely inspire your boys to become awesome men.

you have value. this...

"He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!
That's our rickb89!"

does not. *shudder* however.. if you choose to put on swim trunks while doing so.. i may change my mind.


Yeah...that might bring to mind a little chubby cherub gaily flitting around the DB board. Let's hope that's not me! Swim trunks in Feb? Hmmmmm...


At the time I read this I think it was valentines day or the day after and I had visions of Rick as cupid slinging his love arrows all over the place. Come to think of it doesn't cupid wear red speedos? laugh Does that work for you BF?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 12:20 PM
Originally Posted By: BklynMom
It is so much easier when it is just about "me". Why do I have to take my kids into account?? If it was just me I could cut all ties and move to Thailand for a while and lay low. Why do I have care even a little for the WAS? Cant this all just be about me?? Can I try to act 21 again??


Brklyn - I know you're in a shitload of pain. There's truly no hiding from it as I am discovering just like you are.

And I know how you feel about going back to a previous life. I have often thought about going back to the Far East and beginning anew.

We both have our kids and what I meant was that we owe it to our kids to try and mend the M. Our spouses do too, and they can't do that right now, so it was up to us alone, however we also owe it to ourselves and our kids to save our souls.

People keep telling me that I can't know what's around the corner. There's a lot of things people tell us that we know to be true but can't feel right now because of pain and fear. I don't know....I'm like you I don't want to join the D club. I feel sick at the thought....so horribly sick I want to tear mountains down with my hands.

If there's anything you need, no matter what and when I'll help you out okay? I really, really understand how low you feel.

What if someone told you that you would be a single woman and then you were given these two beautiful little girls? And it was your job to raise them and to show them how to navigate emotionally and practically in the world? I'm sure you would have chose them. What if you had each day in front of you with them...to get better and better for you and them? I know...you may not want this type of cheerleading right now.

Let the rage and despair play through though. I'm told it passes.

Brklyn...I'm truly bummed out you feel so bad.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 12:22 PM
Originally Posted By: rickb89
Originally Posted By: barely floating
i think you have discovered the secret to setting loving boundaries and learning how to detach. did you patent it??

i was deeply moved by your words and your insight. you will definitely inspire your boys to become awesome men.

you have value. this...

"He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!
That's our rickb89!"

does not. *shudder* however.. if you choose to put on swim trunks while doing so.. i may change my mind.


Yeah...that might bring to mind a little chubby cherub gaily flitting around the DB board. Let's hope that's not me! Swim trunks in Feb? Hmmmmm...


Barely....just wanted to tell you that I truly respect how strong you are and what a great Mom and woman. I thought about how you had the strength to handle VD so well for you and the kids. That motivated me to move forward myself so thank you for that. You're the best!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 12:27 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
Originally Posted By: rickb89
Originally Posted By: barely floating
i think you have discovered the secret to setting loving boundaries and learning how to detach. did you patent it??

i was deeply moved by your words and your insight. you will definitely inspire your boys to become awesome men.

you have value. this...

"He's hoppin' around the board spreading rose petals and sunshine!
That's our rickb89!"

does not. *shudder* however.. if you choose to put on swim trunks while doing so.. i may change my mind.


Yeah...that might bring to mind a little chubby cherub gaily flitting around the DB board. Let's hope that's not me! Swim trunks in Feb? Hmmmmm...


At the time I read this I think it was valentines day or the day after and I had visions of Rick as cupid slinging his love arrows all over the place. Come to think of it doesn't cupid wear red speedos? laugh Does that work for you BF?


2 Man...enough with the red speedo comments! Gross! In my yoga class the teachers keep trying to get the guys to switch from b-ball shorts to speedos...supposed to improve efficiency. No way! Ewe.
Posted By: ces67 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 01:21 PM
2 Man...enough with the red speedo comments! Gross! In my yoga class the teachers keep trying to get the guys to switch from b-ball shorts to speedos...supposed to improve efficiency. No way! Ewe.

Mental note: Do NOT sign up for co-ed yoga classes....
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 03:46 PM
Originally Posted By: ces67
2 Man...enough with the red speedo comments! Gross! In my yoga class the teachers keep trying to get the guys to switch from b-ball shorts to speedos...supposed to improve efficiency. No way! Ewe.

Mental note: Do NOT sign up for co-ed yoga classes....


I wouldn't go that far, just say "no to speedos"!
Posted By: Mach1 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 03:51 PM
I can envision some "man cards" getting pulled, if this continues....


: )
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 03:58 PM
^^^awww
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/16/12 09:36 PM
i think my eyes are burning. ye gawds.. red speedos aka banana hammocks. lol

where in the far east did you grow up rick?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 03:27 AM
Seoul Korea....my Dad worked for Raytheon and US government. How about you BF...where did u growup...live now? How are u and kiddies tonight?
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 03:39 AM
I'm glad my description of Rick has brought so much laughter to everyone! We need it.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 03:43 AM

Always willing to be the clown for the rest of you......even if the subject is grape smugglers.....
Posted By: BklynMom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 03:48 AM
I totally just goggled grape smuggler. Not sure I want the image that it conjures up but... whatever.

It has made me giggle. hee hee
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:00 AM
Did google actually say what that is?

Hi brklyn BTW...... Hope tonight is good..as part of my plan to take back my life I bought a Nook tonight. I'm not a big shopper but I love to read and this made me wildly happy.....gotta take care of myself....thought about this all day....the more I think about it the more I realize how much BS I have let go on this past year...I'm embarrassed that I let so much soul killing stuff happen

(((((((You))))))
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:03 AM
OMG! Someone stick a red hot poker in my eye! That image is tooooo much. (Yeah, I had to google it, too)
Posted By: BklynMom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:03 AM
Yes the google explained it to me.

I love reading and I have been reading the same page of a novel for 10 months. Pathetic. Good luck with the nook, let us know of any good easy reads.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:07 AM
OK folks, I have the all-inclusive list of creative names for the most abused bathing suit, (I've self censored some that were a little over the top for this forum):

Marble Sack
Banana Hammock
Grape Smuggler
{self censored}
Nut Hut
[self censored}
Scrote Tote
Nantucket Nad Bucket
Sausage Sling
Portuguese Pud Purse
Ouch Pouch
[self censored}
Peach Pit Papoose
Ballbushka
Lolly Catcher
[self censored}
[self censored}
Nugget-Hug-It
[self censored}
[self censored}
[self censored}
Saint-Tropez Truffle Duffle
Bratwurst Bath Cap
Pickle Pincher
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:11 AM
i googled it too. i had an idea.. but had to make sure. i don't think i'll eat grapes for a while. lol!

rick - i have spent the majority of my life in vancouver! a west coast girl for sure. born in asia but we moved here when i was 18 months old. i'm a total banana.
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:16 AM
i'm dying now. truffle duffle and the bratwurst bath cap are my favourite i think. i almost want to look up the censored ones.. ALMOST! smile too funny
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:22 AM
Scrote Tote, I will never look. laugh
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 11:54 AM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
OK folks, I have the all-inclusive list of creative names for the most abused bathing suit, (I've self censored some that were a little over the top for this forum):

Marble Sack
Banana Hammock
Grape Smuggler
{self censored}
Nut Hut
[self censored}
Scrote Tote
Nantucket Nad Bucket
Sausage Sling
Portuguese Pud Purse
Ouch Pouch
[self censored}
Peach Pit Papoose
Ballbushka
Lolly Catcher
[self censored}
[self censored}
Nugget-Hug-It
[self censored}
[self censored}
[self censored}
Saint-Tropez Truffle Duffle
Bratwurst Bath Cap
Pickle Pincher


Jesus 2TP...with all this energy available for research...why don't you solve the global economic crisis or something?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 11:57 AM
Originally Posted By: barely floating
i googled it too. i had an idea.. but had to make sure. i don't think i'll eat grapes for a while. lol!

rick - i have spent the majority of my life in vancouver! a west coast girl for sure. born in asia but we moved here when i was 18 months old. i'm a total banana.


Where were you born? Were we neighbors?

Vancouver huh? Go Bruins!

Seriously - always wanted to see Vancouver. Looks so good.
Posted By: ces67 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 12:47 PM
Wow....just....wow. This is far more slang for a sling than I ever needed to know (still funny though)
Posted By: sayitaintso Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 02:06 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
OK folks, I have the all-inclusive list of creative names for the most abused bathing suit, (I've self censored some that were a little over the top for this forum):

Marble Sack
Banana Hammock
Grape Smuggler
{self censored}
Nut Hut
[self censored}
Scrote Tote
Nantucket Nad Bucket
Sausage Sling
Portuguese Pud Purse
Ouch Pouch
[self censored}
Peach Pit Papoose
Ballbushka
Lolly Catcher
[self censored}
[self censored}
Nugget-Hug-It
[self censored}
[self censored}
[self censored}
Saint-Tropez Truffle Duffle
Bratwurst Bath Cap
Pickle Pincher


LMFAO 2, hysterical!!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 03:30 PM
It seems like everyone on this board has had quite an intense week.

Most of you know I have recently made a conscious decision to take back my life, and move forward accepting the reality of my sitch. I am taking steps towards what I feel is the right thing to do no matter how frightening or gut wrenching it is. I recognize that my big life lesson in this has to been to recognize my own worth and that I am deserving of mature love as well. I also recognize that when I have gone off course it has typically been when I have lost faith due to fear. I am willing to walk this walk no matter how terrifying and no matter that I can't see in any way what the outcome will be.

I realize that I cannot see beyond the curvature of the earth, but if I keep walking towards it step by step I'll reach it anyway.

Interestingly, I am starting to feel better, a sense of well being. Its like there was a shutoff valve that was shut off and has been opened and I feel life flowing back in. I am starting to feel connected again to the other things in my life and a sense of purpose is flowing back in.

Also, with just a week on this mindset I am seeing how much outrageous BS I put up with. Some people are starting to feel comfortable enough with me again to say that they were praying I see that I should not throw myself on the sword for her, and that even though she is obviously in a major life altering crisis, they can't see her ever getting through this if I allow myself to be a victim to her demons and bad behavior.

I'm seeing that she is not being honest with me because despite her gains and self analysis she doesn't have it in her "now" to not be controlled by her demons. And I'm enabling it and doing everyone harm by doing that.

I'm seeing clearly the affects this is having on my sons too. They literally don't know what to do for her. They continue to reach out and get lied to and know about the OM which they can't overlook or pretend it doesn't kill them. In her state she may think she is doing some great job of hiding but she makes the mistake of not hiding it well. I know this is brutal on her too because she loves her sons. She is so messed up and can't seem to find a way to stop steeping on her own toes.

For example, last night I get home and see my S13. He asks if I know where she is and I say she told me she'd be here. Maybe she's at a store or work late. I call...no answer. The poor kid just looks at me and says Mom's never home anymore. He sounded so dejected. And then he had this big school project and him and I went to school to see all the projects. She had completely overlooked it, didn't acknowledge it to him, and had to ask me what it was. This was something sitting on our dining room table for three weeks and a bunch of kids have been working on it. She chose to hit the club scene with her coworkers.

I've changed how I am handling my interactions with her. I've backed out of this. I'm not killing myself to create this super supportive world of family events and "dates". If I didnt do this not one thing would happen on her initiative. Maybe she will in her own time if that is going to be, and if we are still a family by then. It's all been me. And I don't respect how's she handled the OM sitch. She may say there's been no affair but I don't measure what I've seen by the same standards. In fact I've caught too many lies to feel comfortable. So, when I'm working my a$$ off to keep this road open, be the cheerleader, the Mr everything, I feel this sick feeling in my stomach that I'm selling myself out.

That's it then. I'm on a mission to rebuild me (like Steve Austin in the old Six Million Dollar Man series)...I have the technology. These next few months ought to be interesting.

Someone recently posted here how the WAS turns everything into a reason to blame the LBS. I can already see that. She's looking at me funny because I'm not fawning over her. I know that will lead to the "you obviously don't care and are happy with this accusation". She's still finding anything she can to blame me for her sitch. She told me recently she dd not want to end this because she is afraid of making a mistake, and that she is open to seeing what we can be in our M. Those are great words but I can't see it happening if I enable her not to face this all the way, if I allow bad behavior and make excuses for it, if I allow a life with her which includes OM, and if I let myself be a guy who doesn't value himself enough or have the guts to change this up.
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 03:51 PM
Have you read Accuray's thread over on the SSM (sex-starved marriage) board?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 04:42 PM
Ummmm....why are you suggesting going to the sex starved marriage board?
Posted By: bustorama Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 05:11 PM
Originally Posted By: rickb89
Most of you know I have recently made a conscious decision to take back my life, and move forward accepting the reality of my sitch. I am taking steps towards what I feel is the right thing to do no matter how frightening or gut wrenching it is.


It's the right thing to do.

Originally Posted By: rickb89
Also, with just a week on this mindset I am seeing how much outrageous BS I put up with.


Yup, it's crazy what the LBS put up with/justify while we are in our own "fog" of desperation.

Originally Posted By: rickb89
I'm seeing that she is not being honest with me because despite her gains and self analysis she doesn't have it in her "now" to not be controlled by her demons. And I'm enabling it and doing everyone harm by doing that.


She actually DOES have it in her. This is where many LBS make the mistake of not respecting their WAS and saying she can't act differently because she is in a fog, because she isn't properly medicated, because she is so depressed, because life is too overwhelming for her. While these are all pressures on the WAS, the WAS CAN make different choices. They are not infantile children or demented elderly people that are helpless and have lost their reasoning abilities. Sometimes it seems like that because of the choices and rationalizations that they make. But, they are adults capable of acting differently, and they are more likely to do so if they experience the natural consequences of their choices.

Originally Posted By: rickb89
]I'm not killing myself to create this super supportive world of family events and "dates". If I didnt do this not one thing would happen on her initiative. Maybe she will in her own time if that is going to be, and if we are still a family by then. It's all been me. And I don't respect how's she handled the OM sitch. She may say there's been no affair but I don't measure what I've seen by the same standards. In fact I've caught too many lies to feel comfortable. So, when I'm working my a$$ off to keep this road open, be the cheerleader, the Mr everything, I feel this sick feeling in my stomach that I'm selling myself out.


That's you crossing your own boundaries of how you want to be treated in a relationship. Don't cross your own boundaries. If you don't respect yourself, how do you expect your WAS or any other women to respect or value you? I did the same early in my sitch, and it led to the standing joke with my DB peers at the time of me getting mariachis to serenade my W and giving her footrubs, etc.

Originally Posted By: rickb89
That's it then. I'm on a mission to rebuild me (like Steve Austin in the old Six Million Dollar Man series)...I have the technology.


Welcome to DB, Six Million Dollar Rick!
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 05:22 PM
Originally Posted By: rickb89
Ummmm....why are you suggesting going to the sex starved marriage board?


Because that's where Accuray's thread is. crazy

His wife has been depressed, she has had A (can't remember if EA, PA, not that it matters), she makes no movements toward him, thinks he should accept her just as she is.

Just thought it might have some useful insights for you.

I've found inspiration on many of the different boards here.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 05:44 PM
Thanks Busto. I feel better given your input...it helps.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 05:50 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
Originally Posted By: rickb89
Ummmm....why are you suggesting going to the sex starved marriage board?


Because that's where Accuray's thread is. crazy

His wife has been depressed, she has had A (can't remember if EA, PA, not that it matters), she makes no movements toward him, thinks he should accept her just as she is.

Just thought it might have some useful insights for you.

I've found inspiration on many of the different boards here.


Thanks Bugaboo....I'll read it. I thought maybe you were busting my chops with the sex starved thing! Funny though...I miss the simple stuff w/ her more than anything else or maybe I've just blocked that part of the brain to protect myself!
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 06:03 PM
rick.. that was so beautifully written and said so much of how i've been feeling as well. it is such a scary path because of the fear of what we are possibly leaving behind. but there is a sense of calm knowing that we will be ok.. no matter what.

((((( rick )))))

you are such a caring, insightful individual. and a great father to boot.
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 06:07 PM
...and looks great in a speedo blush

sorry, couldn't resist. It is a great post and reflects much of where I am right now.
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 06:18 PM
smile hahaha. great minds think alike! i was going to say something about speedos in my response too but thought it would negate my heartfelt message.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 07:10 PM
Funny...never worn one...yet branded for life by this! You know it depends in who wears it. I could be a cross between pee wee herman and don knotts...

2TP forever scarred a nation of LBS'ers with his post. I think he got off on it!

Barely....I get what you're saying. I'm starting to feel like I will be okay...in fact having these flashes of a new life, new home, unrestrained future, unrestrained love. I feel good just writing this!

((((((Barely)))))))))))) & ((((((((Bug)))))) thanks guys
Posted By: kolja Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 07:14 PM
As an aside, speedo also makes less revealing trunks. The ones I burn laps with are more like bike shorts - streamlined, but much more modest. Yet one must be careful how one describes it, lest one's coworkers come to the conclusion that one wears a speedo...
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 07:42 PM
Originally Posted By: kolja
As an aside, speedo also makes less revealing trunks. The ones I burn laps with are more like bike shorts - streamlined, but much more modest. Yet one must be careful how one describes it, lest one's coworkers come to the conclusion that one wears a speedo...


No you did not! Did you just mention bicycle shorts! Hang tight, let me see if I can find a list of slang names for those dreadful bicycle shorts.... laugh
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 08:49 PM
Kolja just opened up pandora's box - 2TP is on another mission!
Posted By: ces67 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/17/12 10:04 PM
Originally Posted By: kolja
As an aside, speedo also makes less revealing trunks. The ones I burn laps with are more like bike shorts - streamlined, but much more modest. Yet one must be careful how one describes it, lest one's coworkers come to the conclusion that one wears a speedo...


I totally had a pair of swim-trunks that were "speedo brand" in college. They were normal, baggy swim trunks that came to mid-thigh. But when I called my girlfriend (now my W) and told her I'd got me some speedo's, she freaked out and I couldn't understand why.... laugh
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/18/12 06:04 PM
oh yes.. the less revealing ones are actually kind of hot! lol. but when you say speedo.. it does make the mind immediately jump to those skimpy ones that you see european men wearing. so not hot. smile
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/18/12 08:17 PM
I was once at an elementary school outdoor event with my sons and there was this guy walking around with only a speedo (the euro kind), nothing else. It was horrifying!

Then, there's my oldest son's former roomate's dad who jogs around our town in only a speedo, and does strecthes by the side of the road. It's so puke inducing!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/18/12 08:50 PM
The more I focus on my life, the less I focus on my W, the stronger I feel.

I feel like I'm coming out of this fog. I keep feeling amazed that I have been putting up with so much and am feeling good about the lessons I learned about myself. I feel like I will be so much more fulfilled in my life going forward.

I am starting to look forward to so much new opportunity in my life.

Last night I took my S13 out for dinner and then we went home and watched "Killer Elite". Just what was needed to get my mind off of a blown up M, a violent guy and spy movie. My two older sons and girlfriends made guest appearances so it was a great night. My S21 and his girlfriend (also 21) live with us too. She's lived with us since she was about 14 (her parents split and moved and she stayed with us so she could remain in the school system). She is the closest thing I have ever had to a daughter (I grew up with all guys, and I have all sons). We spend a lot of time together, she's in yoga with us too, so in a way I have some meaningful female companionship, which I miss.

Today I took an intense yoga challenge. I go to Bikram and the classes are 90 minutes in 110+ degree heat and 40%+ humidity. I did two successive back to back classes. The first class went well. The second class I survived but I was pretty dishragged out, and cramping up like crazy.

I guess one thing I have to get used to is thinking in terms of myself as "not married". Its a weird mindset for me. I've been a partner with her for 25 years and she detached from me. So now i am thinking about how I will live with my newfound understanding of myself, and with a brand new set of self awareness tools.

I don't know what this means. I see my W, I listen to her and interact with her, but I am not barely as tied to her as I was. A life without her is becoming something I can think about and at least know that I will have a great life going forward. I also know or suspect that I will have moments where I backslide into despair about it, but I do feel pretty good today FWIW.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/18/12 09:25 PM
What do you guys think about this sitch? You all know I have been the one in the M right now who is doing all the planning, the family events, the date nights, the cheerleading, etc.

I won't do it anymore. She just stopped by to see me before she heads out. Usually, as it is the weekend, I would be full of plans and ideas for us to do. I won't do it anymore. She can show me if she's ready to share a life with me. Let her suggest the plans. I know she met her friend this morning to go over some work ideas. Normally I would ask her how it went and do my best to be the rah rah guy for her. I'm not gonna ask anymore. I just spent a year by myself and was never asked once how my life is.

Also, I can see she's sick, run down and hurting. I'm not going to be the nursemaid for her as i normally would have been. I'm not making this decison to go in a new direction because I want to match her point for point. I am taking my life back and not letting her drag me down anymore. I know she's going to turn this all around and say I'm not trying, that I don't care anymore, that this is proof of why we shouldn't be together, that this is proof we can't communicate.

The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.
Posted By: keep_going Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 07:31 AM
Originally Posted By: rickb89
The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.


((((((rick))))))

It sounds to me like your latest decision has been "brewing" for some time now and you are taking control of your life and letting go.

Good for you!

PS - are you sure you want to do this w/o your speedos? smile
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 08:33 AM
uh... i hope sans speedo isn't a code word for commando.

((((( rick )))))

wow. when you talked about thinking of yourself as not married.. i have been thinking about that too. it's such a strange space because.. yes i am still married.. but it's not a M. and where do i go from here?

it seems like a lot of us are at a crossroad this weekend. lots of things happening and we all seem to be questioning what happens next.

it is possible to love and care about W while moving forward w/ your life. i know you will find that balance.

you are pretty awesome.. with or without those d#mn speedos!
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 01:32 PM
Quote:
The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.
I think you're reaching DB nirvana, Dude!

I wish you well.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 02:04 PM
Originally Posted By: rickb89
What do you guys think about this sitch? You all know I have been the one in the M right now who is doing all the planning, the family events, the date nights, the cheerleading, etc.

I won't do it anymore. She just stopped by to see me before she heads out. Usually, as it is the weekend, I would be full of plans and ideas for us to do. I won't do it anymore. She can show me if she's ready to share a life with me. Let her suggest the plans. I know she met her friend this morning to go over some work ideas. Normally I would ask her how it went and do my best to be the rah rah guy for her. I'm not gonna ask anymore. I just spent a year by myself and was never asked once how my life is.

Also, I can see she's sick, run down and hurting. I'm not going to be the nursemaid for her as i normally would have been. I'm not making this decison to go in a new direction because I want to match her point for point. I am taking my life back and not letting her drag me down anymore. I know she's going to turn this all around and say I'm not trying, that I don't care anymore, that this is proof of why we shouldn't be together, that this is proof we can't communicate.

The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.


Rick - I think each of us has a breaking point. The point where we each say, ENOUGH! You have a unique sitch. Your W hasn't completely bailed on you, emotionally she has, but her physical presence seems to provide some glimmer of hope that she will eventually come around.

But, there is a limit or at least there should be a limit to how long one should endure a loveless relationship before moving on. It seems t me that you are now at the point and I think it is ok. You've waited a very long time. You've put in the time and energy with no real sense that your effort s being reciprocated.

I think its time for you to step out on that world stage and let everyone see the new and improved you.

I've always felt like we all have to take the last step, the one that says we are moving on, for our WAS to realize it is game time. Sh!t or get off the pot, IYKWIM. For some it happens in a matter of weeks or months. Others it is considerably longer.

You'll know when the time is right and it seems like that time for you is now.

Go embrace your future, Rick!
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 02:06 PM
Oh, and don't forget your speedos. Unless you are going to some nudist colony. wink
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 04:43 PM
Originally Posted By: keep_going
Originally Posted By: rickb89
The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.


((((((rick))))))

It sounds to me like your latest decision has been "brewing" for some time now and you are taking control of your life and letting go.

Good for you!

PS - are you sure you want to do this w/o your speedos? smile


LABug has forever branded me with the speedo tag!

Seriously, I'm moving forward this way but I have to admit its step by step process. Its one of those things that I believe to be the right course to take and I'm nervous about it, and each step requires me to stay on top of my mindset & emotions, keep in constant prayer and listening for divine whispers. And I feel that she is going to try and turn this around against me but I'm done with being cautious because of other people's issues. I'm walking through a minefield with pepper spray in my eyes but strangely feel good about it.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:01 PM
Originally Posted By: barely floating
uh... i hope sans speedo isn't a code word for commando.

((((( rick )))))

wow. when you talked about thinking of yourself as not married.. i have been thinking about that too. it's such a strange space because.. yes i am still married.. but it's not a M. and where do i go from here?

it seems like a lot of us are at a crossroad this weekend. lots of things happening and we all seem to be questioning what happens next.

it is possible to love and care about W while moving forward w/ your life. i know you will find that balance.

you are pretty awesome.. with or without those d#mn speedos!


Commando? In the spirit of leaping off the cliff in my new direction I guess I'm open to something new!

Barely...I wish I knew the answer for you, which if I did, would be the answer for me too. I'm going on blind faith here, mixed in with these small whispers I'm getting, and a pinch of logic. Also, I have to share a new lesson with my sons. They've seen me support her all along and understand that I am standing for my M, my love for her, despite the hardships. They also need to see what someone does to regain their own life, in a non-selfish way, and that someone is never too old to face their own issues and decide to grow with them, and take a chance in life. They and I need to see that there's unconditional love, but there has to be self-respect too, just not in an ego driven way.

I have trouble with the thought of moving forward as a no longer married person because I am not abandoning her, nor want this in a selfish way. The truth is though that I am not in a "married" relationship anymore. I'm not so much giving up on her as I am getting out of her way, and tackling the monsters that were in a closet I didn't consciously think about for years. In a way I'm doing the same thing as her, just in a very different way. As far as balance goes, I guess I will have to see how this goes. I really am in uncharted territory here.

Barely...I have a lot of respect for you. To go through this with the little kids has got to be so tough. But at least you have them and will help two more barely's go out into the world someday with all these fine examples of strength and honor from you.

You never told me what country you were born in? Okay, I know its in the far east somewhere...Hong Kong?

(((Barely ....out west))))
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:03 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
Quote:
The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.
I think you're reaching DB nirvana, Dude!

I wish you well.


Nirvana? Hmmm....I guess it take a lot of pain and cojones to get there huh?

Wish you well too smooch...smooch
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:08 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
Originally Posted By: rickb89
What do you guys think about this sitch? You all know I have been the one in the M right now who is doing all the planning, the family events, the date nights, the cheerleading, etc.

I won't do it anymore. She just stopped by to see me before she heads out. Usually, as it is the weekend, I would be full of plans and ideas for us to do. I won't do it anymore. She can show me if she's ready to share a life with me. Let her suggest the plans. I know she met her friend this morning to go over some work ideas. Normally I would ask her how it went and do my best to be the rah rah guy for her. I'm not gonna ask anymore. I just spent a year by myself and was never asked once how my life is.

Also, I can see she's sick, run down and hurting. I'm not going to be the nursemaid for her as i normally would have been. I'm not making this decison to go in a new direction because I want to match her point for point. I am taking my life back and not letting her drag me down anymore. I know she's going to turn this all around and say I'm not trying, that I don't care anymore, that this is proof of why we shouldn't be together, that this is proof we can't communicate.

The fact is I do care. I'm steeping out of the way so she has the total freedom to figure her entire life out, know herself, choose what she wants and doesn't want in her life, and if she shows me she wants me in her life then I'm willing to hear what she has to say. Until then I'm walking down a new road and I am going to hit it full blast until my number comes up....sans speedo.


Rick - I think each of us has a breaking point. The point where we each say, ENOUGH! You have a unique sitch. Your W hasn't completely bailed on you, emotionally she has, but her physical presence seems to provide some glimmer of hope that she will eventually come around.

But, there is a limit or at least there should be a limit to how long one should endure a loveless relationship before moving on. It seems t me that you are now at the point and I think it is ok. You've waited a very long time. You've put in the time and energy with no real sense that your effort s being reciprocated.

I think its time for you to step out on that world stage and let everyone see the new and improved you.

I've always felt like we all have to take the last step, the one that says we are moving on, for our WAS to realize it is game time. Sh!t or get off the pot, IYKWIM. For some it happens in a matter of weeks or months. Others it is considerably longer.

You'll know when the time is right and it seems like that time for you is now.

Go embrace your future, Rick!


I'm doing it 2, FWIW I feel pretty good, but there's still a lot of fear and turmoil running through me. And, I have an idea of a point down the road when I will have to take the real big step, which is telling her that I'm moving on alone. Richt now she's just seeing it in the flesh but not with the full act of actually walking away. She's getting kind of the easy version right now.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:09 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
Oh, and don't forget your speedos. Unless you are going to some nudist colony. wink


Ha ha. Just wait for your beach visits in Madrid!
Posted By: nhmom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:16 PM
Rick, I heard there is a nudist beach in NH...lol

Jokes aside, you're in an incredible and important fork in your life. You wanting to take charge of your life, tending to your own needs and wants in hopes of finding happiness along the way shows how strong you are. And you are right to show your S's not only what it means to be loyal and faithful to your M, but also how to build self confidence and respect. You're a truly amazing person, Rick. It sounds like you've found your path. Now stay on it!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:23 PM
I have been sticking to my lifeplan at home but it can get weird.

Last night, my W and I were both in the kitchen and I acted according to my decision. I didn't try and plan any "date", did my own thing and kept to myself. So we were both there, both polite, very quiet around each other. It's like a game of chicken, but there's no way I'm going back to the valueless, serf I had become.

I'm not forgetting what she is dealing with on her own, but I'm only going to be with her if she can conguer and live having solved her issues to a degree that she can be loving, non-dependent, not ruled by fear, and be a partner. And I'm not going to be with her either with any of the issues I have worked on. It's not a one-way street. I'm doing my part too.

When I got home from yoga this morning she says "come her I have to show you something". I had no idea what she was referring too. She shows me her wedding rings that are way too big for her fingers and how easily they slip off. She hasn't been wearing them for months. She says she isn't wearing them because she would rather have them at least, than lose them. She says that she is telling me this because she knows I am hurt by her not wearing them. I said "thank you for telling me" and left it at that.

I would normally get sucked back in with hope and expectations, she does have my number FWIW. This time she's going to have to grow up, and chase me if she wants me.
Posted By: nhmom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 05:37 PM
It's funny how when we make up our minds about something and feel confident about it, and then something is thrown in our way to confuse us.

It's good of you not to read into your W's actions, but FWIW your W did take a step closer to you. She acknowledged that it upsets you that she doesn't wear her rings, that's good. But you still don't know how SHE feels about it. Does she WANT to wear them? If they still fit, would she wear them? Whatever her comment meant, take it as a positive. But you're right, she'll have to do more than just comment on something. Maybe it's the whole distancer/pursuer thing...you're backing off and she's stepping in....the only difference is that YOU know what's going on.
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 06:27 PM
rick.. you are doing an amazing job.. and being such a great role model for you sons (and also your "daughter").

i don't think your decision to move forward is far from being selfish. in fact, it think it's a gift you're giving yourself, your kids, and your wife. hopefully she'll come to see that and really discover her "truth".

definitely unchartered waters.. but FWIW, we're right there with you. i'm not sure who'll navigate yet.. maybe labug.. but i'll definitely be out there paddling!!

rick, thank you always for your kind words and support. they really do mean a lot to me. i take everything to heart.

as for where i'm from.. from a little country called VN. but, i definitely grew up canandian. when people try to figure out where i'm from they always think i'm korean or japanese. always seem surprised to find out i'm neither! there you have it. i'm a banana.
Posted By: purgatory Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/19/12 07:03 PM
You're always our little cherub, spreading encouragement everyday (not just valentines.) smile

As far as being in uncharted waters... save me a seat in the boat and hand me a paddle (and a TON of dramamine for my motion sickness!)

Rick, you give so much hope and kindness to all of us on these boards, I'm assuming you are similar in "real" life- always giving to others.... but I suspect you rarely give to yourself. Your current decision is something that you are finally doing for yourself- and ONLY you. The fact that you feel like you're being selfish is a testament to the kind-hearted person that you truly are, and also how you would rather put others before you.

You are putting yourself FIRST now. There's nothing selfish about that. It doesn't mean that you don't care anymore nor that you are forsaking all of you efforts to repair your M... I think it just means that you are gaining enough self-respect to not be her doormat anymore. I'm sure the concept of self-respect is something that you hope to instill in your children, and the best thing you can do is lead by example.

None of this means that you won't hurt from time to time, but I venture to say that you will cope better than you have in the past.

I too see your W's comment about her rings, as reaching out towards you. She's using a 'backdoor' way of letting you know that she's noticed/paid attention to your feelings about her rings.. which means that she still cares about your feelings (ie: she *cares* about you.) You can't be completely emotionally gone if you still care about hurting someone's feelings.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/20/12 04:52 PM
Originally Posted By: nhmom
It's funny how when we make up our minds about something and feel confident about it, and then something is thrown in our way to confuse us.

It's good of you not to read into your W's actions, but FWIW your W did take a step closer to you. She acknowledged that it upsets you that she doesn't wear her rings, that's good. But you still don't know how SHE feels about it. Does she WANT to wear them? If they still fit, would she wear them? Whatever her comment meant, take it as a positive. But you're right, she'll have to do more than just comment on something. Maybe it's the whole distancer/pursuer thing...you're backing off and she's stepping in....the only difference is that YOU know what's going on.


I do feel like I have a path to wander down again. We'll see what happens. Thanks NH!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/20/12 04:56 PM
Originally Posted By: nhmom
Rick, I heard there is a nudist beach in NH...lol

Jokes aside, you're in an incredible and important fork in your life. You wanting to take charge of your life, tending to your own needs and wants in hopes of finding happiness along the way shows how strong you are. And you are right to show your S's not only what it means to be loyal and faithful to your M, but also how to build self confidence and respect. You're a truly amazing person, Rick. It sounds like you've found your path. Now stay on it!


Thanks NH. Your thoughts matter a lot to me and it helps me do this.

Hope you're doing well in NH. I need to catch up on your thread!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/20/12 05:16 PM
Originally Posted By: barely floating
rick.. you are doing an amazing job.. and being such a great role model for you sons (and also your "daughter").

i don't think your decision to move forward is far from being selfish. in fact, it think it's a gift you're giving yourself, your kids, and your wife. hopefully she'll come to see that and really discover her "truth".

definitely unchartered waters.. but FWIW, we're right there with you. i'm not sure who'll navigate yet.. maybe labug.. but i'll definitely be out there paddling!!

rick, thank you always for your kind words and support. they really do mean a lot to me. i take everything to heart.

as for where i'm from.. from a little country called VN. but, i definitely grew up canandian. when people try to figure out where i'm from they always think i'm korean or japanese. always seem surprised to find out i'm neither! there you have it. i'm a banana.


Barely - thanks for the response! Just so you know when I got your message I was in the Museum of Fine Arts in Boston at a Japanese Sci-fi Anime movie. I always try to picture where people are when they get my messages.

Hope you and kids are enjoying the day. Hope you're happy today!!!! I'm heading out to western MA today with some of my kids to find a trail and hike it. There's this Quabbin Resevoir that's man-made and when they made it, it was flooded and buried five towns so there's a cool sense of mystery to it.

BTW, we could have been neighbors at one time. I came within a breathe of living in Saigon. My Dad was moving there from Korea and I was supposed to go with him. Our new home was in the Chinese section of Saigon. My Mom was moving to the US and splitting up with my Dad, and taking my younger brother. My brother begged me to come so I agreed to go as a visit and see my cousins here too. While I was here Saigon got invaded so I couldn't go there to live. My Dad ended up getting out and moving to DC. Anyway, we could have crossed paths!

I like you're banana comment! Help me out here. I'm wondering what type of fruit I would be and think it may be an avocado? Italian and Amerindian on the outside, culturally both east and west on the inside. I don't know!

BTW, love Canada but have never been to the western provinces. Spent a lot of time in Nova Scotia, and Montreal. Love both! My Mom's family was from NS - Indian, and some French blood.

I know I'm rambling here but I do enjoy talking to you.

Have a great day. Peace.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/20/12 06:57 PM
I am still making daily progress in taking control of my life. This past year has been invaluable to me in tearing apart and understanding the affects of patterns I developed out of my wild childhood. I feel better and better about each new day, and I feel optimistic.

At the same time I see my W in a big downward spiral and I pray to god she has the strength to come out of it for good. I don't know. I do know the more I attempt to do the work for her by being Mr fix-it/enabler, the less likely she'll get to a point where she has to/will do something. She was a total wreck last night and this morning. She told me she's falling apart. Normally, I would do anything for her when she gets like that but it helps no one. So I just listen, but I'm not getting caught up in any expectations or false hopes. You know how it with a troubled kid. Sometimes you just have to let them go and pray they make it. She has the psychiatrist today. I figure each time she goes, has to help her somewhere down the line. I hope.

I continued my journey towards a new life yesterday by meeting a friend in at Boston Museum of Fine Arts for a Japanese Sci-Fi anime movie, then dinner at a Japanese restaurant in Chinatown. Just being out in a cultural setting, with friends, being part of the crowd attending, I was feeling like I can certainly do this. I happened to get a sweet friendly post from "barely" while I was in the movie. It was like having the right thing happen at the right time to confirm you're on the right path.

Some of the people on this blog, I think it was at least Brklyn and Grmp Monkey mentioned this book called No More Mr Nice Guy. There was enough chatter about the book to catch my attention. My initial reaction to it was to shudder. Will it be a book about a bunch of whiney wimps, or about a bunch of guys controlled by their wives? In the spirit of taking back my life I decided I would take a look and downloaded it as my first book on my newly purchased Nook Color. I have to say the book runs much deeper than my initial thoughts on it were. There is great value in it and through the examples in the book I see how my childhhod traumas caused me to develop patterns of self preservation that did not serve me well. In fact it couldn't have been a more different mix for me and W. We both had real trauma as kids. I would attack any challenge in a kind of ultimate survival mode, and my W would run from things. When she did that I would try harder, and she would run further away. In any event, I see this and this book does seem to help a lot.

Many thanks to all friends here. You're all the best.
Posted By: ces67 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/20/12 09:54 PM
Rick - you're an inspiration for GAL. Lately the fact of going home each day just creates a feeling of dread for me. In readying your posts, it helps me to let it go and do and be what I want and let go of my concerns for how W will act or behave.

I've looked for that book in a few book stores and haven't found it. Guess, I'll have to get it off amazon.

Enjoy your week!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/20/12 11:40 PM
CES....its on Amazon and its under $10 in ebook form! Good luck.
Posted By: ces67 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 04:23 AM
Thanks! I'll look for it tomorrow and have it shipped to my office.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 05:01 AM
"At the same time I see my W in a big downward spiral and I pray to god she has the strength to come out of it for good. I don't know. I do know the more I attempt to do the work for her by being Mr fix-it/enabler, the less likely she'll get to a point where she has to/will do something. She was a total wreck last night and this morning. She told me she's falling apart. Normally, I would do anything for her when she gets like that but it helps no one. So I just listen, but I'm not getting caught up in any expectations or false hopes. You know how it with a troubled kid. Sometimes you just have to let them go and pray they make it. She has the psychiatrist today. I figure each time she goes, has to help her somewhere down the line. I hope."

Rick I think you know that I have shared similar concerns about my W in prior posts. That she seems to be in a downward spiral and I wondered if she would hit bottom and find her way back.

so I think this line of thinking is normal. The thing is your W is a big girl and IS CAPABLE of figuring this sh!t out for herself. So let her and try to stop worrying.

And if your W is anything like mine, sooner or later life will catch up and an awakening of sorts will occur and then things will get real interesting.

So keep moving forward down your chosen path and maybe keep this in mind:

Love, like a river will cut a new path whenever it meets an obstacle.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 06:01 AM
One other thing, Rick. A T friend of mine explained that sometimes people have to allow themselves to go completely in the opposite direction of where they have been, (i.e. if their life was perfect and stable then they have to let it go completely into CHAOS in order to then find the equilibrium they need to move forward).

I think this is true of my W and I think it may be true of your W as well.

Just something to think about.
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 07:46 AM
rick - i thought of you today! i was watching a movie w/ my gf. thinking.. wow! that city looks amazing to live in (thought it was nyc). turns out it was boston!

i think maybe you'd be an eggplant. a little dark.. and little mysterious.. but appealing to both the east and the west! yum! grilled eggplant w/ green onion oil. but i digress...

western canada is very different from the east. sort of like nyc and lax. very laid back.. beautiful! if you ever want to come visit.. you shall have a personal guide. smile

it's really hard to watch the people we love struggle because our instinct is to try to save and protect them. i know i did that for many years. trying to make everything "nice". and when i look back i realize i helped neither myself nor H. maybe i had a fear of being disappointed if i left things to unfold on their own? but in doing that, perhaps i didn't allow H to grow and become himself experiencing the natural consequences of life whether good or bad.

you and i are learning to step back. to allow the people we love to grow and become who they need to be. there will be many painful moments (i don't doubt this), but i think ultimately, it will bring us great happiness. i truly believe that.

ok eggplant.. who else we recruiting on this journey? let's find a couple more colourful fruits and veggies. purg is the spicy red pepper i think wink
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 02:07 PM
Quote:
you and i are learning to step back. to allow the people we love to grow and become who they need to be. there will be many painful moments (i don't doubt this), but i think ultimately, it will bring us great happiness. i truly believe that.


The essence of DB don't you think? Great insight, BF.

And in getting to this nugget of truth, I've had to realize and accept that the best place for my H to be, might not be with me. That's what we fight against for so long but once I accept that it's a choice, his choice, it all became easier.

Pema Chodron has a great book called When Things Fall Apart which I read early on in my sitch. It was very difficult because it's about letting go. And I didn't want to let go, I was holding onto the rope with every ounce of strength I had. But letting go and moving toward the pain, figuring out my role, accepting what is has allowed for so much growth.

I want to be a chipotle, dark, smoky, with a slow burn...
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 02:57 PM
I want to be a chipotle, dark, smoky, with a slow burn

^^^liking this.
Posted By: Mach1 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 03:38 PM
Well....

101 posts later...

Feeling any better yet ???
Posted By: BklynMom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 05:15 PM
Do you think the wife of a mr nice guy would benefit from the book? My h is the epitome of a nice guy or should I was the epitome of mr nice guy till he snapped.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 05:31 PM
Originally Posted By: Mach1
Well....

101 posts later...

Feeling any better yet ???


I do for the most part. Today I woke up with a wave of doubt and feeling very burnt out.

The good news is I know how I let myself get ino this mess, and what I needed to learn from it, and have a pretty good sense of moving forward with some newfound selfawareness and tools to use.

I have changed how I have been handling my life w/ my W in this sitch, and my mindset and actions towards building a new life. I do feel confident of myself and my place in this world and have been having flashes of wellbeing, which is nice.

At times, however, like today, I feel just dead inside, absolutely burnt out. With my W I have completely stopped enabling, stopped giving her the cake eat life, stopped the cheerleading, the social planning, the dates, everything. For many reasons I have taken this step. I didn't feel that this was doing any good for her, or for our family. I'm not sure I'm just being an easy to "use" crutch for her. Also, I began to feel like what I was doing was in many ways selling myself out, and pursuing. I could not see a future in all this high energy effort and after a year of being alone felt like I was almost empty and need to rebuild.

I guess this change is the classic 180 everyone keeps talking about. Its weird to see but without the efforts I just described the entire house and atmosphere has taken on the feel of a morgue. I can't/won't do it anymore though. Every little interaction between us is radically changed. Where before I would ask, how's this or that, I don't do it. I'm not offering to fix everything that comes up, offer dates, activites, nothing. I have a hard time even thinking about doing any of those things and have been having a physical aversion to it.

I imagine there might be some way to balance my moving forward with my life, and somehow being there for her but I'm not sure how. I don't want to make this insane effort anymore, nor do I want to live with expectations that this can work out.

I guess I'm feeling burnt out because after all that has happened and esp the last year I won't keep running 100 mph for her. She's going to have to bring some energy to this herself. She's going to have to show me something or make some kind of verbal commitment to making this work if I'm going to make efforts.

So while I can feel good that I can have a great life going forward, I also feel deadened by the present. I have a mountain of responsibilites besides this sitch with her. It's just the way it played out. I looking around at the effects of this sitch on my house, my kids, finances, the absolute crappy home environment, and I feel like I have a monster journey ahead to climb out of this.

I have a dilemma in that I get the logic of keeping the road home paved and smooth but someone's got to do this ongoing maintenance to keep the road clear. I wonder if my recent 180 is actually going to or is unknowingly closing the road, or is it her time to do the maintenance and open the road herself?

Maybe reality is starting to set in? In the absence of my year long efforts, what is left is me, my sons and "daughter" (thank god for them), a monster uphill climb with the practical day to day stuff, and a home lacking in warmth, happiness, a real family. It's just horrible there. The relationships between everyone else is great but in her current state it just drags everything down into the depths. In the absence of me being the family cheerleader she just remains in this semi-feral state up in her room. Remember how the girl in The Exorcist was up in the bedroom? Picture that while the rest of us are downstairs enjoying the family. A bit extreme but sadly not too far off. And if i dont keep up the effort to bring everyone together then this is what the current default setting is.

I'm not unaware of the good in life too. I have a lot, and have made some very good friends here too.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 05:45 PM
Originally Posted By: BklynMom
Do you think the wife of a mr nice guy would benefit from the book? My h is the epitome of a nice guy or should I was the epitome of mr nice guy till he snapped.


I'm not sure. If anything it explains how Mr Nice Guys get there, and may certainly explain to you why he had certain habits in your M. It's not too academic of a read but still has pretty good insight. The beginning part of the book explains it pretty well, how they get there and why. The rest of the book gets into how to break out of these destructive patterns. I'm about 1/3 through it and it does help. BTW, now that I think of it, I used to see a lot of these nice guy patterns in my W...overcompensating based out of traumatic fear.

I think it will be worth your while to read it. You will have to be careful how you introduce this concept to your H. I imagine he might be very defensive. I see this w/ my W. She gets massively defensive about any concept that I introduce that might help. I have to kind of place it there in her path and let her discover it as if it was her own discovery.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 05:52 PM
Just thinking Brkyln. I know your story but not all. I wonder, if you told me about how your H was in your M before the bomb, maybe you will get some insights by hearing a guy's thoughts on it. I can see how I became a nice guy from my past and how it played into my M. Maybe there's enough common ground so that I can relate to your H and then you can talk it out in a safer environment with me before trying it out in a live fire environment with your H.

Just trying to help, and brainstorming.

If you want you can call me. Maybe it can help. What do you think?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 06:00 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
Quote:
you and i are learning to step back. to allow the people we love to grow and become who they need to be. there will be many painful moments (i don't doubt this), but i think ultimately, it will bring us great happiness. i truly believe that.


The essence of DB don't you think? Great insight, BF.

And in getting to this nugget of truth, I've had to realize and accept that the best place for my H to be, might not be with me. That's what we fight against for so long but once I accept that it's a choice, his choice, it all became easier.

What you and BF say makes so much sense. It seems like many of us here are reaching this point at the same time. There are days when it's easy to see the upside of this awareness and there are days when the reality of what's there when you drop the rope is so difficult.

Pema Chodron has a great book called When Things Fall Apart which I read early on in my sitch. It was very difficult because it's about letting go. And I didn't want to let go, I was holding onto the rope with every ounce of strength I had. But letting go and moving toward the pain, figuring out my role, accepting what is has allowed for so much growth.

I'm going to read this book right after I finish "no more mr nice guy" (remember the old Alice Cooper song?)

I want to be a chipotle, dark, smoky, with a slow burn...

Okay, then you are hereby the chipotle of the group. Say hello to the eggplant and the banana.

Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 06:08 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
One other thing, Rick. A T friend of mine explained that sometimes people have to allow themselves to go completely in the opposite direction of where they have been, (i.e. if their life was perfect and stable then they have to let it go completely into CHAOS in order to then find the equilibrium they need to move forward).

I think this is true of my W and I think it may be true of your W as well.

Just something to think about.


Sure is something to think about and I think that this is probably the case for both our W's. Some of the excessive reactions your W has had are so much like my W's, and I think they may have some similar fears driving it. I do worry so much about my W bottoming out though and its impact but think that is probbaly what is needed.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 06:33 PM
Originally Posted By: barely floating
rick - i thought of you today! i was watching a movie w/ my gf. thinking.. wow! that city looks amazing to live in (thought it was nyc). turns out it was boston!

Boston is awesome, I have to say. Have you ever been here? If not there's a lot going on....old new england villages, cape cod, mountains, its pretty good. If you're going to make your way out here let me know so I can show you around!

i think maybe you'd be an eggplant. a little dark.. and little mysterious.. but appealing to both the east and the west! yum! grilled eggplant w/ green onion oil. but i digress...

Ha ha...okay banana...I accept being the eggplant! You do realize the impact of this naming game? I put a banana in my smoothie this morning and thought....there goes barely.

western canada is very different from the east. sort of like nyc and lax. very laid back.. beautiful! if you ever want to come visit.. you shall have a personal guide. smile

Okay... so don't be alarmed if I tell you I want to visit! You're in Washington state right? I do like the idea of laid back (I keep hearing the snoop dog song in my mind...gin and juice...laaaiiiid baaaack). Never been to Vancouver but always wanted to to see it. I remember when my sons and I were completely hooked on x-files back in the day, and we knew it was filmed in Vancouver.

it's really hard to watch the people we love struggle because our instinct is to try to save and protect them. i know i did that for many years. trying to make everything "nice". and when i look back i realize i helped neither myself nor H. maybe i had a fear of being disappointed if i left things to unfold on their own? but in doing that, perhaps i didn't allow H to grow and become himself experiencing the natural consequences of life whether good or bad.

Yes, me too. I did the same thing and buried a lot like you did. It's good to finally be taking control of own life and happiness, letting go, but not easy is it? If someone had told you you a few years ago that you and kids would be in this sitch, and talking online with another guy while naming each other fruits, would you have believed it? I will say that this proves some good things come out of adversity. I'm very glad to be talking to you. You're a wise person and strong enough to be so open.

you and i are learning to step back. to allow the people we love to grow and become who they need to be. there will be many painful moments (i don't doubt this), but i think ultimately, it will bring us great happiness. i truly believe that.

Somewhere down the road and in some fashion this will happen. I think you're right.

ok eggplant.. who else we recruiting on this journey? let's find a couple more colourful fruits and veggies. purg is the spicy red pepper i think wink


I think you're spot on about Purg being the spicy red pepper. Maybe those pictures of her will prove it! And LAbug claims to be a chipotle! Wiat till 2TP gets hold of this concept. I can only imagine the comments!

Hope today is an "up" one for you. I woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning, bummed. Damn this nasty DB business!
Posted By: Grmpy_Mnky Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 07:42 PM
Its hard stuff my friend. I applaud your journey and dedication to the marriage.
Posted By: 2chiquitos Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/21/12 07:56 PM
Power to u Rick for continuing DB. You have learned to parent yourself thru all this and that's a major step!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 06:44 PM
I imagine you all have those moments when you wonder if your life, and this sitch is real. Like I wonder if I'm actually in a coma somewhere and there's this bizarre movie of my life playing in my coma ravaged brain. Or am I actually lying in some alien craft's experimental lab and they are inducing some sort of bizarre life story into my mind in order to see how humans respond to extreme stresses. One can only hope!

Really though, it gets strange at times. So last night I go to yoga class with the knowledge that all is under control at home. Mom is home, S13 is okay.

But, as most of my friends here will see in about ten years, when you have teenagers anything is possible. 2TP, Crimson, Barely, NHmom, Purg, Brkyln, and others with younger kids....wait and see!

The kids are off school this week so they are making the most of their time off. My S13 tells me yesterday that he's having a few friends over for a bonfire in the backyard. Okay, seems reasonable.....Mom's home too...everything under control.

So, I leave the yoga class and its about 10 PM and all is well....feeling the post yoga bliss and I get a call. It's Kelli from London. I'm immediately a little worried because its 3 AM her time and with her awful DB sitch going on I'm worried. I say what's up. She says I tried to reach you but knew you were probably in yoga class and unreachable so I set my alarm to wake up and call you. Hesitantly I say okay and wait. She says have you seen your S13's facebook page tonight? Now I'm really wondering what's up. She says I just wanted to give you a head's up about this monster party going on at your house and the FB pictures look pretty wild, and she starts laughing at me. She says S13 sent the FB invite out and the word got out, and because its FB all his friends around the globe know about it, including her. I'm thinking that I have been off the grid for hours in class so I missed the whole thing.

I get home and as I drive down the street I'm getting the feeling I used to get when pulling up to an obviously big party...the adrenaline, etc...but remind myself these are my kids and just want to make sure this doesn't get too out of control.

In my mind I'm thinking why didn't W at least text me some kind of warning and how is it that I have to rely on another girl in a foreign country to clue me into a huge event at my own house?

So, I get to the driveway and my S24 and fiance, S21 and girlfriend are standing there with all these martial arts training swords in their hands. They're all hooked on Game of Thrones and have been training in sword fighting styles almost non-stop. I say, Wow, this reminds me of some of my college parties. Where's Mom? They said, we didn't know this was going on and we stopped by and Mom was upstairs asleep. They said they decided to stay here and keep an eye on things, keep it under control and they called me but I didn't pick up because I was in yoga class. And while they were watching decided to make the most of the time and spar with each other. Okay, so the foxes are guarding the hen house I think but in their defense they had booted out anyone with booze and I didn't see anyone out of control.

I start walking through the house and its all I can do to not believe I somehow have been transported to the movie 16 Candles, and that any moment The Donger is going to be found swinging on my front door. I start looking for the pizza on the turntable, you know? I noticing that the HS kids have found out about it and the word has gotten around town as these things will. Kids are coming up to me who don't know who I am and saying "Dude...what's up?".

I find my S13 busy on the couch with his girlfriend...ahem. His is all excited and says "Hi Dad". I say look I'm not against a party by any means but did Mom know this many people were going to be here? He says, I'm not sure.....but my brothers are here. I decide to see how he's going to handle this and i ask him when the party ends. He says 11, I've got this all worked out. I say, who is going to clean it all up? He says I will, and these two guys who are sleeping over. i decide to see if he's good at his word. And to his credit, everyone did leave at 11, and they did clean up.
Posted By: nhmom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 06:54 PM
OMG Rick, sorry, I couldn't help but laugh. I know I'll get my share soon enough.

You sound like a pretty 'cool' dad. Good thing that your other sons stopped by and kept an eye on things. Your W could have gotten into some serious trouble if it did get under control and involved underage drinking.

13 and throwing a wild party? Sounds like you've got your hands full. But it also sounds like your sons have decent heads on their shoulders.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 07:28 PM
"I start walking through the house and its all I can do to not believe I somehow have been transported to the movie 16 Candles, and that any moment The Donger is going to be found swinging on my front door. I start looking for the pizza on the turntable, you know? I noticing that the HS kids have found out about it and the word has gotten around town as these things will. Kids are coming up to me who don't know who I am and saying "Dude...what's up?"."

Man, that was pretty damn funny! Imagine if The Donger HAD been swinging from the front door and you asked, where's S13 and his response would have been..."Mawried!" and you said "Married?" and he says "Mawried!" and you say again, "Married?" as you are walking away completely bewildered.... and Donger says one last time "Mawried!"

Or worse, S13 is missing so you sit down on the couch surveying the destruction all around, including the accumulated trash on the fancy lucite table of yours. Then out of the corner of your eye, you catch a glimpse...... of another eye trapped underneath the table. It S13 aka Farmer Ted! laugh
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 07:29 PM
Post-party-mortem.

I'm up and 5:30 and see that my S13, with some help from his brothers did complete the cleanup task. Now I'm thinking about my W and how lost from it all she must be. This was the woman who focused her entire life on her boys and would have never in a million years been able to sleep through something like this. Things are seriously wrong.

I walking around the house and thinking how many enormous demands I have to handle as a single parent right now, and that if my kids weren't older how would I do what some of my fellow DB'ers go through with little kids. I'm thinking this is it, she's too far gone, or too far away in her sitch that I've got to make a big decision sooner than later.

I see her finally come downstairs and I say wow, that was unexpected. She looks at me and says "my pinochio got broken, I've had it since I was 13", and shows me this savagely broken up pinochio. I'm thinking, this is insane. This is it. I've got to do something big or we'll never get out of this hole that's been dug, and I can't let my S13 risk what could have happened if the party had taken the wrong turn. I'm thinking we're in big trouble here and maybe she needs to deal with this in a different environment or way. The she starts talking about everything she's going through and I just sit and listen to her for about 2 1/2 hrs. I end up thinking that she has awareness enough of the issues and their effects, but then gets lost in the emotional turmoil of it all, and just can't handle it. She still in her weaker moments, evades, runs, blames. She's telling me that the more she uncovers about herself, the more she has been falling apart, and by facing it she feels like she's physically ready to drop and is in constant stress induced pain.

She tells me she has nothing in the tank to meet her responsibilites, and then guilt drives her further into a hellhole. She reiterates that she doesnt know who or what she is because she's been living a lie her whole life and wants to make sure she goes forward without any of the selfdeceptions and self illsuions she herself created. She says she cant stand that she's killing me, the kids, the family but has no choice but to go through this. She says she needs to figure out how to live as an adult in this world and learn to do everything she never learned to do with me, that I took care of everything. So she's in this dilemma in that if we work together on anything or I help her then she feels like she's less likely to get it on her own. She the says she also feels awful that she has pulled away so far, but has no idea of how she will get there and not destroy everything in the meantime. I tell her that I'm not sure how to handle it either. When I let her go completely she freaks out and thinks we have nothing together anymore and we should end it, however she knows she isn't sure of who she is or how our M will be in a new environment. She keeps bringing up the past, the things that made her feel bad. I say to her that I can understand looking at the past as a tool to uncover issues and move beyond them but if she's going to continually judge our M by that then yeah, we're cooked, however if you can use these past events as a means to a better you and us then what the hell, that could be really good. She tells me she was like a daughter and I was like a father type all along. I tell her that I dont and never wanted that, I want a partners, an equal. She tells me she can look forward without saddling us with the past to define us now, but that she is so devastated right now she has no idea who or what she will become.

Guys...I welcome the aliens to take over my brain if it means some much needed rest! Prayer and patience is what I got as my gamer weapons at the moment.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 07:38 PM
Originally Posted By: nhmom
OMG Rick, sorry, I couldn't help but laugh. I know I'll get my share soon enough.

You sound like a pretty 'cool' dad. Good thing that your other sons stopped by and kept an eye on things. Your W could have gotten into some serious trouble if it did get under control and involved underage drinking.

13 and throwing a wild party? Sounds like you've got your hands full. But it also sounds like your sons have decent heads on their shoulders.


Ha ha I can laugh now...I'm survived it. I think my S13, who is entering HS this fall just got his first taste of unrestrained youthful abandon, and what the teenage tidal forces are capable of. I think he actually handled it pretty well, and thank god his older brothers got his back.

I actually saw the FB pics today....actually pretty damn funny but I can't let him know that. I actually thought it was hysterically funny in some cases. Like the one photo of my S13 wearing a girl's bra...he doesn't know I saw that one... he actually looked just like his Mom in it! And to think FB allows the whole world to see it.

Thanks god nothing happened that was bad. My S13 actually learned quite a lesson here and stepped up and took responsibility for the entire town's teenage population.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 07:46 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
"I start walking through the house and its all I can do to not believe I somehow have been transported to the movie 16 Candles, and that any moment The Donger is going to be found swinging on my front door. I start looking for the pizza on the turntable, you know? I noticing that the HS kids have found out about it and the word has gotten around town as these things will. Kids are coming up to me who don't know who I am and saying "Dude...what's up?"."

Man, that was pretty damn funny! Imagine if The Donger HAD been swinging from the front door and you asked, where's S13 and his response would have been..."Mawried!" and you said "Married?" and he says "Mawried!" and you say again, "Married?" as you are walking away completely bewildered.... and Donger says one last time "Mawried!"

Or worse, S13 is missing so you sit down on the couch surveying the destruction all around, including the accumulated trash on the fancy lucite table of yours. Then out of the corner of your eye, you catch a glimpse...... of another eye trapped underneath the table. It S13 aka Farmer Ted! laugh


Mawried jeesh.

The Donger has never been so happy.

I actually did think of Farmer Ted. You know, when he's almost out of air under the table, and yells "Jaaake"!

Ironically, my W is a dead ringer for Molly Ringwall.
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 07:50 PM
"Ironically, my W is a dead ringer for Molly Ringwall."

I always thought Molly Ringwald was the hottest babe on the planet. Something about that red hair, beautiful lips and great legs!! Oh, la la! smile
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/22/12 07:54 PM
Originally Posted By: 2thepoint
"Ironically, my W is a dead ringer for Molly Ringwall."

I always thought Molly Ringwald was the hottest babe on the planet. Something about that red hair, beautiful lips and great legs!! Oh, la la! smile


She is something that's for sure.
Posted By: purgatory Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/24/12 04:13 AM
Rick you're out 'spreading the love' today on the board...

How's life in Boston??
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/24/12 12:38 PM
Rick, you went a whole day without posting. You OK, my friend?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/24/12 03:27 PM
Originally Posted By: purgatory
Rick you're out 'spreading the love' today on the board...

How's life in Boston??


I have a lot on my mind recently. I'll post my thoughts. It seems like everyone else has had so much trauma the past few days and I wanted to be sure I could help somehow. Thanks Purg.

That 8 yr old kid breaks my heart. Imagine how his Mom must feel seeing him from her porch and not being able to go to him. Alcohol does so much damage, but really its the original pain underneath it that drives these sitches.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/24/12 03:29 PM
Originally Posted By: labug
Rick, you went a whole day without posting. You OK, my friend?


I think so. Actually I did get hurt. I pushed too hard in yoga and have been having back spasms so I've been walking around like "yoda", all bent over and twisted. Nicde image huh?

Thanks for asking chipotlebug
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/24/12 04:04 PM
Since I had the long conversation with my W the morning after my son's party I have had a lot on my mind, and needing time to sort it all out. A back injury from yoga has slowed me down a bit too but expect to be back at it by tomorrow.

I've been following Barely's and Brklyn's sitches and for whatever reasons their comments and thoughts resonate with me too, as well as Bug telling me I need and should take care of myself too.

In addition I have been reading the No More Mr Nice Guy (I can't say or write this without hearing Alice Cooper in my mind) and been reflecting on my wild childhood. I'm connecting the dots from then to now and seeing some patterns and habits that got me to great places. I also see one big "paradigm" as the book calls it that insidiously made its way into how I responded in my M.

I was one of those classic cases of a kid who through organized programs - sports, martial arts, and caring adults made it out of the streets and gained entry into the mainstream world. I got out of the underworld, became a straight A student, earned scholarships and paid the rest of the way through school myself, raised my boys, etc. What I have discovered is that I buried a sense of not being worthy to be in this type of world, not being loveable enough. In effect I realized I felt like I was an imposter in a world that I was not meant to be in. And I overcompensated and became the endless giver, caretaker, enabler. I put up with so much that I should not have because deep down I didn't realize I had more value than that. So while I could take on the corporate world and thrive, reach great heights in the martial arts world, and reach all these outside successes I didn't do that inside.

I've been thinking a lot about how i deserve fulfillment in a relationship, that I have value just by being me, not only wrapped up in what I can give or do for others, or provide. I have been realizing that I deserve to and can be happy going forward with or without my W. Oddly, while I think a D is a horrible tragedy I am no longer afraid that I won't be fulfilled going forward.

As for my W, she continues to go at her issues. After our post party discussion I think she may be approaching things with more of an attitude that extreme change in a R can be for the good which has been my attitude but not hers.

I basically told her that I'm not afraid of eruptions in a M so long as they are used to make our lives better, that I'm going forward with the attitude that this entire sitch if used to better ourselves could erase the problems of the past and make our M better. I also told her that the only kind of realtionship I'm going to be in is with two mature adults, equal partners and not dependent.

The train has left the station for me and I hope she can join me. I do think she might be seeing that she is going to have to kick herself in the a$$ her life or our M is going to work. She's been very close the past few days and it might mean she is acting on the positive things she has been saying recently.

Talking to the incredibly strong woman on this board has made me realize how amazing a strong woman is and how great it can be to have a loving partner like this. This sitch has been invaluable to me retooling how I will live.
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/25/12 03:43 AM
Great insight, Rick. It's like peeling the layers of an onion, don't you think. As we learn more about ourselves, more twists and turns in our road forward are revealed.

A bit of a mixed metaphor but I think it makes sense.
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/25/12 08:51 AM
rick.. it sounds like the tides are changing..

reading your post today made me think of my own childhood.

long story short.. i had a screwed up childhood. some very good memories, but definitely some memories that i would rather forget. i think i also went through that stage of never feeling quite good enough. and at the beginning of all this, i questioned, why wasn't i good enough? why aren't the kids and i enough?

but like you, i'm learning.. H's actions speak more about him then they do about me. because i am lovable. yes i have faults, but i am willing to admit that and try to become a better person.

you are an amazing father. your kids.. though crazy.. sound pretty incredible too. and that is a reflection of you. i hope your wife sees all that you are soon.. because it saddens me to think that if she doesn't, she may come to regret it later in life. and we all know all those i should haves, i could haves can be so painful.

(((((( rick ))))))

ps. i was checking your post everyday (usually late at night on my iphone) but wanted to wait until i had some real time to write! also.. i had eggplant yesterday and couldn't help laughing to myself. smile
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/25/12 05:02 PM
Originally Posted By: barely floating
rick.. it sounds like the tides are changing..

reading your post today made me think of my own childhood.

long story short.. i had a screwed up childhood. some very good memories, but definitely some memories that i would rather forget. i think i also went through that stage of never feeling quite good enough. and at the beginning of all this, i questioned, why wasn't i good enough? why aren't the kids and i enough?

but like you, i'm learning.. H's actions speak more about him then they do about me. because i am lovable. yes i have faults, but i am willing to admit that and try to become a better person.

you are an amazing father. your kids.. though crazy.. sound pretty incredible too. and that is a reflection of you. i hope your wife sees all that you are soon.. because it saddens me to think that if she doesn't, she may come to regret it later in life. and we all know all those i should haves, i could haves can be so painful.

(((((( rick ))))))

ps. i was checking your post everyday (usually late at night on my iphone) but wanted to wait until i had some real time to write! also.. i had eggplant yesterday and couldn't help laughing to myself. smile


Barely, so glad to hear from you and happy that I could be part of your dining experience yesterday!

Its hard to think you would question your own value. I can clearly see what kind of person you are and how fortunate your H and kids are to have you. Knowing what you are and what you are going through makes me think about M in and of itself. How does one S miss what is so obvious? I think about it and I guess that's what married couples do, they are like a mirror for the other, and I guess go through life experiences at the expense of the other when things are bad, and grow and bring out the best in the other when things are good.

I realize that both contribute to the dynamic that lead to the RAS (run away spouse). The RAS is more often than not running from their own issues, more than they are running for us. If I could talk to your H I would tell him he must be out of his mind. But, sadly, that is kind of what is going on.

You say the tide is changing. I think so too. It's more the tide in me that is changing and I'm questioning so much of what I'm doing right now. I hearing in my mind an old song that said "I've got one foot on a banana peel, the other in the twilight zone". That's kind of how I'm feeling right now, very torn between staying the course for my M and accepting the incredbily tough trauma of it as this moves forward, and between moving forward alone and possibly destroying a family. The questions is really hard and there's so many factors to weight into this.

Barely, I'm not the dependent type but I will say detaching is not just a matter of saying, okay I'm detached and moving on. I truly gave my soul and life to this woman and the road back to being me for just me is like pulling apart a material that has been woven together, has to be pulled apart thread by thread. I'm not the needy type but I have learned a lot about needing to remember my own value.

Your messages to me really make my day and provide a jolt of strength just at the right time. I see your comment...long story short....about your childhood. I would actually like to hear the long version sometime.

Hope you have a great weekend banana....I'm kind of open ended this weekend....got injured so doing a very backed off version of yoga...maybe watch some movies and definitely do some reading. What about you?
Posted By: BklynMom Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/25/12 07:59 PM
hey Rick, I am still waiting for my copy of No More Mr. Nice Guy - (Thanks for putting the song in my head) Your description of the classic Mr. Nice Guy is my H. I wish I could give him the book but I know I cant! ugh!!

I really relate to what you said about not being dependent or needy. I feel very independent and I feel like from a financial & overall survival view I will be fine. I am coming to understand being co-dependent differently. Its more like thriving on your partners approval or on their predicatable response to our self destructive behavior (or something like that I am still trying to figure it out)

I like what you said about mirror each other as well.

Enjoy your day bumming around the house, which is what I am doing. Cooking a little, playing with the kids, checking the boards, cleaning up messes...
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/25/12 08:54 PM
Originally Posted By: BklynMom
hey Rick, I am still waiting for my copy of No More Mr. Nice Guy - (Thanks for putting the song in my head) Your description of the classic Mr. Nice Guy is my H. I wish I could give him the book but I know I cant! ugh!!


I can understand how it will be tough to broach this topic with your H. When I first heard about the book my reaction to it was "no way this is me"! I thought it was gonna be a bunch of wimp stories. Maybe you could take some of the key points out of it and just sort of weave it into a conversation
with your H. You know, like "I have been looking at what the dynamic was between us and this is how I contributed to things that were good and things that were tough. I'm seeing my contribution to this sitch clearly and have thought about you and how you might be feeling and why. I'm not telling you that I know all of your feelings for sure. I think that I came across this way and you would be very non-confrontational. That created a dynamic of non-communication. Maybe we should try discussing our issues where you let me know exactly how you feel on things and I'll be better able to rerspond and discuss them with you more rationally......



I really relate to what you said about not being dependent or needy. I feel very independent and I feel like from a financial & overall survival view I will be fine. I am coming to understand being co-dependent differently. Its more like thriving on your partners approval or on their predicatable response to our self destructive behavior (or something like that I am still trying to figure it out)

If you think about it we are in the midst of a huge wake-up call about being in co-dependent or needy sitches. And its not just our WAS's. We may be handling this sitch a trillion times better than our S's but I'm sure we both have had our eyes opened to how you can become needy and dependent on things based out a habits developed from when we were very young, stuff we were not even consiously aware of. Maybe this is like a stage many M's reach.....like we break out of a shell and become a butterfly (I hope that doesnlt come across as too gay). A necessary stage in our growth.

I like what you said about mirror each other as well.

Enjoy your day bumming around the house, which is what I am doing. Cooking a little, playing with the kids, checking the boards, cleaning up messes...


Yeah me too. Talk to you soon!
Posted By: BFloat Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/27/12 07:44 PM
eggie! are you having an ok day? what did you end up doing this weekend?
Posted By: purgatory Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/27/12 08:00 PM
Long time, no post.... How ya Doin??
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 02:42 AM
Bananarama....what's up? I did miss you this weekend. Lets see, what did I do? Went to yoga twice, did some home repairs, took son and "daughter" to a breakfast diner, had everyone over to watch The Walking Dead, read, catnapped.

I did have a serious talk with my two oldest boys. They are upset with their Mom and feel that, despite her struggles, she is wiping out our family, and they are worried she is dragging me down in a bad way. They are old enough and mature enough to see it clearly so I handle this very delicately. This is not an easy sitch, balancing being there for her, handling the boy's issues with their Mom, keeping my head above water. I have to make some big decisions soon.

Thanks for asking!
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 02:59 AM
PURG! It's sweet of you to ask. Honestly Purg I'm at such a crossroads on what to do. I hate everything about D and what that does to everyone in our family. W is pretty far gone still and its tearing up everyone. Still trying to determine how muchof this is the illness and what is just her personality. So much to consider!

I need to catch up on your thread! Howz the neighbor kid? You are so incredible to do that, on top of a new job, and a whacky H.

Hope you're well...(((Purg)))
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:15 AM
Hi guys! Hope everyone is well out there and I'm broadcasting the love to you all.

Frankly I've been walking this walk, while feeling simultaneously fearful, pissed, optimistic, lonely, loved by many, freaked out, calm, muderous rage, and serene love.

I'm constantly open to the divine, open to guidance and facing all this hardship head on. I'm not sure what to do next.

I have a woman i have loved passionately for half my life in desperate need yet is ravaging everthing around her, everyone around her. Its a study in
Posted By: purgatory Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:27 AM
I think you've discovered what living with 'unconditional love' feels like. My hat is off to you, sir.
(((((Rick))))))
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:34 AM
Sorry...it posted itself! I was going to say its all contradictory. There's just enough hope every now and then to keep it from being a true black hole.

I focus on me.....and I'm really in the midst of self evaluation....and I'm not in any way a prisoner to her sitch. I wonder how long one goes....missing a partner.....watching your kids suffer....?
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:42 AM
Hey man, your going to get frog marched off to DB jail if you don't start a new thread soon. wink
Posted By: labug Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:45 AM
Never Rick, he just has to whip out that ... Speedo and all is forgiven.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:45 AM
Purg...what does unconditonal love mean to you? If I move forward into a new life stage....and a new relationship....then did I fail her...fail me...fail my sons...and the divine? Maybe this is my test in this time on earth....can I/should I lay down my remaining days for her....be a strong as I can be...and live by a vow I didnt make lightly?
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:46 AM
Too funny!!!!! laugh
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:51 AM
Buggy....ha ha.....scuse me while I whip this out (Blazing Saddles). How are you my good friend?
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 03:57 AM
2Pac - how do you know when to start a new thread? Frog Marched? What's that? So much to learn in this lifetime!
Posted By: 2thepoint Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 04:05 AM
Hey Mr Goofball McSpeedo, when you hit 100 posts you need to start a new thread.

I don't think any of us want to see a frog wearing a speedo! laugh
Posted By: purgatory Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 04:27 AM
First off- labug's comment made me laugh to where I almost cried, just sayin'!!

To me, Unconditional love is choosing to continue loving your spouse in spite of their faults. It's choosing to *give* even if you don't receive. But there does come a point when you can choose to walk away for your own sanity and dignity, but it doesn't mean you stop loving them.

Example: let's go with the assumption that parents love their children unconditionally, agreed? Ok, so if one of your S became addicted to drugs and went on a downward spiral- taking his health to the gutter, stealing your money and belongings to finance his habit, abandoning all relationships with his loved ones and basically having no regard for himself- to the point that you have to separate yourself from their life to protect yourself from the pain of watching him slowly kill himself (and I know this would never happen so please don't think that I think your kids are capable of this... They all seem like wonderful kids (even the one who threw the crazy party smile but I digress...) Would you 'love' them any less?

Just b/c you decide to give yourself permission to move on from this M, doesn't mean you've forsaken your vows or that you have let down the man upstairs. You can love just as strongly from afar. The simple fact that you've put up with this as long as you have already- proves that you knew what you were saying when you vowed "for better or for worse" and "in sickness and in health".

You have to take care of yourself before you can take care of others. Only you can feel when this sitch has drained too much from you and when you need to step back so you can be fulfilled again. Did you ever think that you would still be 'fighting' for your M this long after the bomb? You don't have to prove if you have the strength to stand for you M, been there, done that.

I think prayers and/or meditation will hopefully illuminate which path you're supposed to take right now. The only person you have to worry about answering to, is yourself. Because regardless of who you share the rest of your days with, you have to live with yourself for the rest of your life. I know that I wouldn't want to make any choices that would haunt me everytime I looked in the mirror or laid down at night.

You've given yourself lots of time and energy contemplating your next move.... But you're still not ready to throw in the towel. You've given half your life to this M and your W- it's no small task to decide to leave that behind. I "tipped my hat" to you earlier b/c I admire and respect *how* much thought and reflection you've already given to your sitch, and that you continue to do so.
Posted By: rickb89 Re: DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 4) - 02/28/12 06:14 PM
Starting a new thread "DB'ing is sooooo hard (part 5). Yes, Mach in many ways I am feeling better as this thread ends, lots of confusion and weighing things, but better overall. Mission accomplished to a degree.
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