hello everyone,
i'm Jae.
my story is long and involved as we've been married 14 years now. my story is complicated, a lot more complicated than many i've read here so please bear with me as i lay out the main factors in what has proven to be my undoing.
i suffer from PTSD and Dissociative Identity Disorder, used to be called multiple personality disorder, and for the past three years one of my self states has been forward presenting as a female so much so that we were diagnosed as being Transgendered as well.
the issues that we're dealing with revolve around those three things...hmm...not sure how to say it other than i didn't deal with my issues prior to getting married and thought i could work through them during the course of our marriage however, rather than doing that she and i (as we both have issues to resolve) hid ourselves in drugs, sex and alcohol. a poor investment of time and money as it turns out... therapy sooner would have been a far better investment. in any case, i didn't resolve those issues and am working through them in therapy now.
issue 1) i haven't focused much on the relationship as i should have. she's always been very controlling and i, needed someone to control me, so it worked out for the most part yet there were areas that i disliked it and would withdraw from her and spend more time online than in talking with her.
issue 2) the DID means that every so often a different self state will be present (look it up on Wiki if you're interested, if not just go with it) and (until just 6 weeks ago) i would have no memory of what that self state had done. some of the self states behaved very poorly and did a great deal of emotional and psychological damage to my wife. i finally entered into a Trauma Unit specializing in these things and changed my life there. it's not important for this conversation however everything about my life is different than it was before i entered into the program.
issue 3) we've always helped friends out if they needed a place to crash during a bad fight or even a break up and so i met a young transgender girl online that convinced me she was in mortal danger from her parents, my wife and i together (though she claims she had no choice, i disagree) moved her to our house. once we discovered it was all lies, we moved her out. she was here for 28 days. she and i didn't have sex nor did i have any romantic interest in her at all though i did love her courage and bravery for enduring what she had endured.
issue 4) i'm a trans woman. as it turns out my wife was right about that and i realized that i was not during my treatment for the ptsd/DID. i've been trying to tell her that for 6 weeks however nearly every time we have a conversation she starts with personal attacks and insults, knowing just which buttons to push, and i've been responding. she doesn't want to be married to a woman and i discovered i was wrong about why i felt like i was trapped in the wrong body.
in any case, that's about the long and the short of it. couple that along with the usual stuff that builds up in a relationship and she's basically just had enough. three days before i left the inpatient treatment center it "clicked" for her that she didn't want to be with me any more. she didn't tell me until we got home and i've been trying to deal with the issues brought up during the hospital stay and dealing with the impending divorce.
i'm emotionally all over the place. i read the book and have noticed some changes however she's retained an attorney (her parents are paying for it, i can't retain one of course with just my income) and reports every angry word that i say to her without reporting anything which she says. she threatened to take my son (who's going to be 5 in Dec) to another country and i'd never find them. i was horrified, frightened and reacted poorly.
i live in the basement until we can sell our house (went on the market yesterday) and then she plans on moving out with our son (she'll decide when he can stay with me) and i'll be going wherever i go. she needs to get a job first so i don't know what's going to happen. if we sell our house and she doesn't have a job, then my income would get a small place for us and still pay our bills.
i would die for her and so i will do anything it takes to show her that i've changed and that i can be the husband, partner and father for my son that she wants.
thanks for reading.
~j
I'm so sorry you've experienced so much pain. I'm sure there is no way that we could know everything you've gone through. Have you ever tried to write about your experiences?
I wanted to let you know that you're not being ignored but I, for one, am not qualified to give the advice you are needing. It would seem, to me, that your situation is more complicated than most, and therefore, would need a professional to guide you. I certainly don't speak for anyone but myself.
The DB board is full of folks who will give their support. Many people read what you have to say without making a single comment.....but you are heard!
Newcomers are monitored for a few days, so don't give up if your posts are slow to show up.
thank you Sandi,
i'm at my wit's end. my whole world, my whole life was built around my wife and son and now without any hope or desire for mediation or counseling it's going to be over.
i'm so distraught... i can hardly go 10 mins without crying.
thank you for the encouragement to continue writing.
~j
my son was sick today (he's going to be 5 on Dec 30) and today was the first Open House for our home to sell. Even if we stay together without her working we cannot afford the home. in any case, we all stayed in one of the small bedrooms today. as we were getting it ready, she rushed into my arms to hug me... i started to cry and said "i love you" and she replied "i know". i'm sort of devastated by that yet it is what i've come to expect. she'll send me an email saying how much she still loves me and wants me to be a fully participating parent...once she decides it's ok for me to be so. then she'll purposefully do things to push my buttons...my therapist thought that she was actually trying to provoke me enough to make me strike her! i've never done anything like that in my life with her!
it was an ok afternoon...she used my bankcard (she doesn't have a job and no money in her account) to buy some lunch for us...and i fixed a few little things around the house without her having to ask me more than once. we used to get into arguments about that all the time. when we first were married, she'd ask me to do something and i'd stop, immediately, doing what i was doing and do as she asked. she didn't like that. we talked about it and it basically boiled down to i didn't have to do it right when she mentioned it but she didn't want to have to mention it again. i admit that i've got some issues with follow through on certain things yet when she claims that i don't do anything, i look around the house at all that i've built, repaired, maintained, installed and created and wonder what she's talking about... as it turns out, that isn't it. she's talking about me making phone calls to Doctors or whatever. i've dealt with Doctors for a very long time and i'm simply uncomfortable doing those sorts of things.
she took control of our finances from the first week that we met and it's remained that way until i closed our joint bank account and now i'm paying the bills. she gave me a spreadsheet and then, a few hours later, wanted to know if i had logged on to my bank account to check it. since i hadn't spent *any* money from it yet i told her "no" and she said "why am i not surprised" and i didn't know why she was surprised... i've never liked online banking in the least little bit and i argued with her about doing it...being and IT geek makes me quite wary of online banking and bill paying. in any case, when i did check it i found it to be exactly as i had left it a few days earlier.
i find it really hard to disengage from her as my therapist is suggesting. when we have a conversation, if it gets heated and i leave the room she accuses me of "just leaving when i don't like having to answer the question" trying to guilt me into staying. if i stay in those situations i find myself unable to remain calm and say things which i later regret and which she shames me with later.
she's my best friend...i'm losing all that i've considered important in my life even though i've got a whole slew of personal challenges to face, i never thought that in my hour of need my love and friend would desert me. i'm simply devastated at what has gone on.
indeed, i was in an in patient trauma unit dealing with these issues (finally) and three days before my release she tells me that she is done...whereas just the day before it was "i love you forever and don't worry it'll be ok."
i'm hurt and humiliated. i've moved into the basement since i returned home and i've not really been able to work on any of the things which i was supposed to work on from the hospital due to the toxic environment which i'm in now...it's just anger and recrimination all the time which makes it impossible for me to get things quiet inside my head enough to focus on doing what i need to do to fix me.
i've tried to put myself in her shoes and i keep coming back to the same answer. i promised her i would never leave, sickness or health, for better or for worse. i realize most people aren't as serious about their promises as i am however i've only made 6 promises in my life and i've never broken a single one of them. they can take everything from you however your honor and integrity are something that you have to choose to give away and *won't* yet i'm faced with having to break one of them or two of them.
when we first were married my wife made me promise that if i came home one day and she was gone that her dad had had her kidnapped and not to stop looking for her. i told her i would never stop until i found her. now i'm looking at having to break that promise too...for she will be gone one day when i get home and it won't be because she's been kidnapped, and i promised to her that we would always be together... JnR 4 Ever is what we both used to say. i have a card from her on our anniversary and it says, in her words, "i love you forever no matter what." i suppose forever has gotten a lot shorter than i thought it was and "no matter what" means until i feel like i'm done.
she said it just clicked i her head and she has to follow her gut.. her heart and mind keep telling her to stay but she claims to have ignored her gut for so long that she's not going to do that any longer. no facts or logical discussion can penetrate that.
i feel as if everything in my life is being taken from me by someone that took over my wife's body...like in V or something...she's so, completely, different than she was just two and a half months ago that i hardly recognize her.
she's got her own share of issues, major ones at that, which she has neglected for so long. i feel that IF she is able to come to some resolution for them she would be able to be with me again regardless of what my body looks like.
i don't have a mental disease, i'm suffering from trauma caused by someone else. this is fixable with effort and time. i *know* i can do it, others recover from this all the time whilst some others do not and as far as i can tell the difference is self belief. i have had a large amount of self confidence yet now my wife claims that i have lacked it and have only been pretending to have it. i'm a combat veteran with jump master wings, air assault badge and all the rest...i can survive in just about any condition or situation... yet i never expected or imagined that this would be the one where i'm having to do it.
in some ways, i feel like i just want to give in and let her go on about her life. this is my second marriage and her first. she thought i knew all about it, though i never made that claim, and says that her ideas about it were all wrong and she was too young (29) to get married et al. however my sense of honor will not let me walk away. i still wear our ring though she has removed hers. she says she kept hers on when i first got home because she was afraid that i would freak out. she's taken "important" papers from our son's folder (i haven't asked about them yet though i feel i'm entitled to a copy at least) and didn't tell me about that, either, because she was afraid that i'd freak out.
my room in the basement is like a shrine to her and my son, their pictures are up everywhere.... it was because of them and wanting to be better for them that i finally got the level of stabilization that i did at the hospital and now it seems like something of a waste. don't get me wrong, it's helpful for me in any event, still it's as if my motivation was taken as well.
i'm just a mess. her parents are paying for her lawyer whilst on my disability income i cannot even afford the retainer fee. when the paperwork comes then i'll do what i can which will mean not paying some bills which will work to my disadvantage but what else is there? the pro bono attorneys i've contacted have all said "no".
Hi Jae.
Have you read the DR book?
Your therapist offers good advice, it's time to start to disengage from your W as best you can. All the triggers are going to keep triggering you until you can get yourself emotionally stable enough to deal with things, one at a time...
There's never any guarantee, but generally speaking a D doesn't happen over night. It takes time. For that reason, you have time to work on yourself which is a big part of what DBing is about.
While I'm sure your W would say you've "changed" and you may be inclined to believe her, I'd submit that the biggest thing to show the world is you HAVE NOT changed... in the sense that you are still... you...
Yes, you will need to adjust to your new found and accepted self. But that doesn't mean you're any less than the caring H and father and that you are still physically and emotionally capable of carrying on your job as well as the day to day routine or upkeep of the home and other duties that a H performs...
I am not a psychologist so what I say is unqualified, but consider the trigger for your PTSD. You W just had a major "shock" with your prognosis. It reads as though she thinks your new revelations have somehow changed you. Of course you may live your life a little different, perhaps you will (and you should) conduct yourself in a more confident manner now that you better understand your original confusion about yourself.
But that doesn't change YOU in any large degree if you feel how you behaved and who you were is any different than who you want to be and how you want to behave once you've adjusted your inner self with your outer self.
And your W and those around you are going to need time to get to know you again, and know that you are that same, lovable and helpful person they've always known...
Read the DR book and get to working on yourself to the best of your ability and shine through as the best you that you can be. You have an opportunity to REALLY step up and BE YOU and hopefully your W will understand that "no matter what" and "forever" are still as relevant for her as ever.
hi Kaffe,
i've read one of the books, probably DB.
i've also started reading a book called "Healing the Shame which binds you" and that she commented that was the first "non divorce" related book that i've checked out from the library. i've been reading about how to be civil during them, DB of course, how to be a family afterwards and things like that.
you're right, it's about changing myself. i have recently learned a lot of good, helpful skills to do that very thing however the bomb couldn't have been dropped at a worse time for me personally. it's completely thrown me off.
you are also right in your assessment that she often comments that she doesn't even know me any longer, i tell her i understand and that i'm not saying she accept my word or anything like that, just get to know me and see that i'm still the "me" that you fell in love with all those years ago.
next time i'm at the library i'll get the DR book. thank you for your feedback and suggestions, they are appreciated.
it's been a bit better yet every time it gets better she makes a point of saying that she thinks we act like "things are getting better" when she acts like she cares or is still in love, which she freely admits she is. we've both got our issues, no doubt about it, and mine are trickier than many others however regardless of what i look like i'm still "me".. that essential being which was drawn to her and she to me. she's changed as well...as we all do in 14 years.
*sigh*
Just a quick note about her "notice" regarding the book you're currently reading...
The point being... she noticed... and this is VERY important...
The DR book is more like a "workbook" in that you can look specifically at chapters that may suit your more specific situation.
It may feel like your W's bomb couldn't have come at a worse time. I and others can probably attest there is NEVER a good time. Still, I completely understand how the bomb could compound your stress.
One thing you will find we often say around here is it is ACTIONS not WORDS that makes a difference. You can give your W a lot of words to suggest that you are still you and that your R or M can be great. It will be your consistent actions that will show your W that you are a great person and someone she would be a fool to leave.
This could be a great opportunity for both you and your W to get to know you, all over again...
Find your inner peace and keep your chin up and keep on... keeping on... no matter what... it gets better...
hi Kaffe,
thank you once again for the information regarding DR, i'm going to make sure to read it once i have an opportunity.
i would tend to agree, there is never a good time to receive news like this unless, perhaps, you were also of the mind to get divorced.
last night she complained that my changed actions i.e. being upstairs during bath, clean up, brush need... basically "need too" time it's like i'm stalking them and it's making her uncomfortable. it's unusual in a sense. she has complained that she doesn't like doing those things alone or all the time...we did talk about how i should volunteer to take him up for bath time and all...then before he's done with dinner and we're all at the table she get's up, announces his bath and that she's going upstairs to draw it.
i'm not given the chance and when i try to participate it's making her, maybe him too a little bit, feel uncomfortable. that doesn't mean i'm going to stop doing what i can to address the specific things that she's had going on.
she's seeing a therapist she likes and seems to be making good progress on her feelings but she says they mostly spend the time talking about me and what is going on with me...i've been encouraging her for a long time, which she admits, yet claims that i've never been supportive.
it's a tricky, stressful situation to say the least. combine that with the rest of the things going on with me and it doesn't surprise me that i have hit rock bottom and finally... maybe..start to understand myself a bit more and why i do what i do and how i can change those aspects of myself which have sabotaged my own efforts at happiness and fulfillment.
i'll take your word for it that it gets better...when your in the middle of the storm all directions are equally full of bad weather.
~j
oh my god...
i'm just now wondering if my wife is having an EA with someone she met online. i have a horrible chill running down my spine and a huge cold pit in my stomach... i'm suddenly so panicked that i want to go ask her about it now... i feel like i've really, really worked hard at changing myself, my actions and my trauma issues.
i'm horrified...this must be what you call a panic attack...
i heard a beep on her cell when she was upstairs and i just glanced to see if it was her parents calling but it was not, it was a man she had met when she and i were both online on the same social/dating site (it's complicated....
strange... my son suddenly cried out and we both went to help him.. she startled when she saw me there... i am living in the basement, and they are two floors up.
i'm also in a real bind because of my physical disability, it's been surgically corrected as much as it could be however i'm still disabled from it. fortunately, it's not a mobility related issue so i'm pretty ambulatory and can do most things provided i don't have to stand, sit in any one position or place and all the rest of that crap.
we both see individual therapists, she's met all of mine and even been to sessions with me with them...i asked if i could go with her to meet her therapist and she said no...it hurt me because she's been so familiar and included with all of my things that, while i have no desire to attend all or even any more than one, i would think that he would at least like to meet me given that, apparently, i am all they talk about.
it seems that i am the abuser in this relationship. i've never struck her or threatened to do so, in fact the opposite is true, she's kicked me in the head several times...i tried to make jokes of it and eventually she stopped. nevertheless, on my first visit to a renowned in patient PTSD and trauma disorder program, she played a song for me which deals with lots of personal challenges for me and claims that she didn't know what the song was about yet wanted to emphasize the positive aspects whilst it seems that i had focused on the negative ones. the chorus says "even if i say it'll be alright, still i hear you say you want to end your life. now and again we try to just stay alive, cause it's not too late, it's never too late." she's pledging her love to me and i'm stuck in issues which have only, just recently, become things which are properly diagnosed and fixable. it's been like a mental health episode of "House" and they have finally figured it out and it's fixable, it may take a few years to heal but i've healed from lots of physical injuries before and this one i can heal from as well.
in any case...the next day we had a huge fight and i had gotten in my car she had stood between the door and the car so i couldn't close it on her...shoving her face down within inches of mine and screaming at me. i asked (probably screamed) back at her that she needed to move so i could close the door, she didn't want that so i turned off the ignition and told her to move so i could get out, she didn't. i picked her up and moved her out of the way. i closed the door and went into the house with her following and screaming at me..something snapped...the ptsd rage crap, i spun quickly and she was inches from my face again, i picked her up and couldn't find a place to put her, i turned right and she bumped the cabinet, i turned right again and then put her on the dryer and walked out of the house. whenever i've been really ptsd raging i always try to walk away which infuriates her to no end so she will pursue me, screaming often.
i've put her though such an emotional hell that i can understand, finally, why she's leaving me. what i can't understand, really, though, is why she's not going to give me a chance to be with her and our son (who is 5 on Dec 30) when i am finally healthy? we've been together since Sept 27, 1997 and got married on May 1, 2000. her mother died on May 1 and so we haven't celebrated an anniversary since. we did this year, we moved it to Sept 27 however by then things were very difficult between us.
i think that i've done myself in by my own hand. the loving, warm hearted person that i knew is gone and a cold, angry person is in her place and directing that towards me.
she dropped the bomb on me when i had three days left before discharge from the in patient program...so i'm dealing with trying to resolve that trauma and the trauma of losing my wife and son (she will decide when i can see him, if i'm healthy enough...my therapist wants to know when she got her PhD) and, honestly, i've been really struggling with the timing of her telling me...she could have waited a bit, that program changed my life and i think will continue to play a huge role in the future shape of my life in the near future. in some ways, that's good as it gives us some physical separation however it will more than likely mean i miss xmas and my son's birthday. it's even possible that our home would sell before then...and then i would have no where to be discharged too... her parents are paying the mortgage so the house is up for sale. my disability pays the bills and her old job was more than enough to pay the mortgage....
i've decided to stop typing about this now... if you read this far, you have a stamina of an super human, and my great thanks.
Jae...
I'm going to post on the birthday / christmas thing here, right now...
In some cases it might be OK to treat these things like just any other event previous...
In other cases, such as when the LBS needs to step out and take a good, long look at their sitch from a distance... these events are mere distractions that detract from the personal work that needs to be done FIRST, by the LBS...
From what you're describing above, Jae... it is my opinion that you truly need to remove yourself from what appears to be quite a toxic and potentially volatile sitch... both for your own safety as well as that of your family...
It could be IMPERATIVE that you do everything in your power to emotionally remove yourself and if need be, physically remove yourself from the environment when and as needed...
I am worried for you and your family, from what you've described.
Do what ever it takes to settle yourself emotionally so that you can think through things. It's all you need is an excuse for your wife to petition for a restraining order.
No one can mind read, but it does appear your W may be trying to bait you. And I would hate for you to bite on the bait...
If what you are saying is true... If your W DID kick you in the head (literally), then things (IMHO) are WAY out of control.
It's up to YOU to take charge and control OF YOU. Protect yourself from the sitch...
OK?
Then... get back into DBing...
Keep posting here and you will get as much support as the good people can provide, regarding your M...
I also wanted to comment on what you posted in the b-day / Xmas post:
she was angry with me today and curt but she apologized later. she said she didn't want to talk about OR any longer and that if she didn't say "you're getting a second chance" i wouldn't start doing the things to improve myself to show her that i deserve a second chance.
As you mentioned in your previous post on this thread, your W gets "angry" with you a lot... I'll touch on that in a bit...
I'm not sure if I'm reading the above correctly, what she said is what would be considered "script". It's also controlling... your description of her verbal abuse above and in previous posts is concerning... again, I'll touch further on this in a bit...
she's entitled to that view, of course, but i would disagree. i've done a huge amount of personal growth and am changing decades old habits as quickly as i can...i'm sure they could be faster with some folks but that's just not how it is for me right now.
The above statement suggests growth, although it will take time for the changes to be convincing. There's also a bit of "victim" language in your comment. Not sure if you FEEL yourself a victim and out of control, just something for you to think how language often reflects subtle or sometimes unconscious feelings and beliefs...
~~~~~~~~~~~
OK, back onto the topic of your description of your W's episodes of anger...
It's said two wrongs don't make a right. Just because you deal with rage outbursts, does not give your W permission to do the same. Here's the thing, though...
First, I get that it takes a "STRONG" woman to put up with men who deal with anger issues... From many relationships like those, I often see the women can "hold their own"...
Here's where the sitch might be a little sticky or confusing...
Is your description of her anger outbursts, simply reflections of what you THINK she is doing based on what could be your own anger episode?
ie. Is it her getting in your face, or is it you raging, so she goes into attack mode?
Can you see patterns to this? Are you triggering, which then triggers your W?
Having said that, while you might have PTSD and rage episodes... well, your W could have something going on, as well... I'm not suggesting you try to figure out what is "wrong" with her... I only mention it because the variables might add up to something that could get ugly...
So again, I just wanted to add the above and will restate:
Take charge and control of yourself, protect yourself from the sitch, and once you've emotionally settled yourself... get back to DBing at "a safe distance"...
I think both your couselors should talk.
Don't move out, Aliens tell you to go, but don't mean it.
See PARENT TRAP.
Find out her LOVE LANGUAGES.
Woman consider nite time routine theirs, don't intrude.
As you get well, you can do mom things with kid.
Best and easist is to baby sit while she goes shopping.
Little steps.
Maintain a journal.
thank you for the heart felt advice Kaffe, i great appreciate it. she has kicked me a few times but that was a very long time ago...years ago now.
you are spot on, however, when you suggest that it would be somewhat of a distraction, i'll just help my son with his card and that will be all. she's already said that she doesn't give a crap about our relationship any longer so i suppose i need to start detaching from it as well.
i know that she has feelings for me and wants me to be happy and all of that, which i want for her as well. i confess that i think it would be fairly awful for my son but then again, there's a chance of my staying which could make it awful for him too and, in that case, then it would be better were i gone.
i walk away when i get really angry, and always have when i'm able to do so. i don't like the feeling of being angry or the things that i may say when i am. i usually end up regretting it in some manner.
gah...i would hate to be hitting that bait.
i know i have to do so and for the life of me i wonder why it seems so bloody hard to do! other issues are clouding this and it's probably going to be a tricky thing to pull the roots out of this but i'm working on it every day.
i'll post as often as i can though it becomes problematic as my online activity is one of the things which she doesn't care for very much, due to my own previous actions i want to make clear.
Good stuff, Jae...
With the card, as your son is just turning five, try to be "age appropriate" with his card to your W. IOW, "think like a five year old"...
As far as your own anger, has your therapist or other support channel provided you with any tools other than "flight" when you feel your anger welling up? ie. Do you have any "thought stopping" techniques or deep breathing or similar...?
Because like your W coming after you and being in your face when you were in your car, one can't always rely on flight to remove oneself from a bad sitch...
Be well. Believe in yourself. Be the best dad and male role model you can be for your son, however that works and looks...
Start there... yes... it's all hard to do... that's normal for all LBS... it gets easier...
hi Kaffee,
yes, we've been working on all manner of things to deal with the ptsd anger stuff and it's mostly working, oh i still get angry but i'm not yelling or anything like that. by the same token, she's not been up in my face screaming though that may change some tonight... she's really pissed off at me for my online activity, again.
i keep wondering why it is that i feel like i've been beaten and simply want to give up. she said she didn't give a crap about the relationship any longer and then gets upset at me being online...so does she care or not? i tend to think that she does, on some level, and is wanting me to demonstrate that i'm the person that she wants me to be.
the problem with that is that i *have* to be the person that i am not the person that she needs me to be or wants me to be for that matter. ideally, we'd both accept each other as we are rather than only accepting each other if we conform to what each other wants or would like.
i think that i finally felt her being detached from me the other night and i've been grieving this for the better part of 60 days now... i suspect i will for some time to come regardless of how things work out for me personally...that said, i think i am getting to a place where i can accept the reality of her statements and don't have any particular desire to try to dissuade her of her ideas to leave.
i'm a good person, with good qualities and i'm worth a second chance. if she chooses not to allow that, then so be it.
the fact is being a good role model to my son means that i have to stick to my principles and do what i need to do to show him, demonstrate for him, that one must be who they are and pursue their dreams despite the cost involved for, in the end, we each come into this world alone and will leave it alone.
she screamed at me today that i was a liar and that she couldn't trust anything that came out of my mouth...of course she's said this on several occasions since i've been home from the trauma unit so it's not like anything particularly new in that regard and she's only accusing me of it because she didn't really listen to what i was saying to her and thought i said something that i didn't. it's been like that for years though.
oh yes, the proverbial brown stuff hitting the swiftly moving rotary blades was the scene tonight. arguing if i'm a liar, mocking, ridiculing, shaming and blaming for everything. indeed, she cannot recall a single thing that i've done which was for her benefit in 14 years and thus it's all be wasted. she blames me for making her have our son!
i didn't make her do anything, of any sort, at any place. she claims that she felt like she had to or i'd leave her, playing on her abandonment issues. i've got those of my own! the last thing i want is to be abandoned!
it's just horrible here now. it was cold between her and i today and it's going to get worse, quickly. at this point, right before she went to bed, she said "i don't want to work it out with you." cursed a lot at me and went upstairs to bed. i had my dinner (was in the garage fixing the garage door and didn't get told dinner was ready and then they went up for bath and bed before i was even done) went down to the basement and cried for about 15 mins, yelled at myself in the mirror, behind four closed doors, that i shouldn't tell her things any more that are sensitive cause she uses them against me.
they are legitimate personal insights and breakthroughs regarding the nature of my being and the tone and tenor of my character and revealing them requires a great deal of trust...and i have no idea why i still give that to her. i suppose that she has me fairly convinced that this was all my fault...every bad thing or misfortune in our lives was directly or indirectly my fault and she went along with them because she was high, we both we're... we're both dealing with a great deal of personal trauma and it got her off alcohol...it's a main part of our work to stop numbing our feelings and actually experience them.
so. i feel like that's it. i've never seen her change her mind once it's made up and i've never been on the receiving end of her anger like this. it is hard for me to deal with actually, i'm still very much in love with her and find her to be very beautiful. i get intimidated around women i find attractive *sigh* makes it hard to be present and mindful about what is going on and... suddenly....
i wonder if she knows me well enough (and she does) to know that she can guilt trip me in such a devastatingly hard manner if she chose to...and i hope she isn't doing that but it sure is difficult not to feel as if this has all been my fault.
just a quick update...
this weekend was both good and bloody terrible. it was good for a lot of it in that i was included in the various craft projects and things, making ornaments for our tree etc. terrible in that our exchange of emails kept getting worse...well... her's kept getting worse. my last email was something like "i'm sorry that you feel that way." and nothing more which caused her to blast another one at me saying that i was just waving away her concerns, dismissing them and avoiding responsibility for my actions. so then i sent a long one address most of the points which she raised in her tirade, some things i simply didn't address since there could be nothing positive which comes from them... and i don't suspect anything positive will come of the last one, either. the main point which she's making is that a)she started losing respect for me from the 3rd month of our marriage, b) it's my fault that this happened, c) i'm not motivated to change my circumstances, d) she deserves something/someone better...yet i'm the one denying my responsibility for my actions?!
i felt some connection between us a few times since i've been back though she says that's all in my head and that she hasn't touched me in months. of course she threw herself into my arms for a hug not more than two weeks ago (three now) when our home had it's first open house which i pointed out to her. didn't go over so well but then at this point i'm thinking that "going over well" is the least of my concerns.
i need to detach from her and this life and start dealing with my emotional states so that i can be a good father to my son regardless of where i live or how i live.
journaling:
worst email from her yet. this email seemed like the woman that i married...and it broke my heart to hear her suffering and pain coming to the decision she has. she said that i deserve someone that will love me for who i am and that is not her. she must let me go because of how much hurt and humiliation she feels, how shamed and discounted. she cannot forgive nor forget.
i'm more devastated than when she's yelling and screaming at me...this is someone that you could talk to the other person wasn't. it's all so terribly screwed up... she concluded her email saying she was sorry for how this turned out and neither one of us deserved it.
journaling:
responded to the aforementioned email after lunch today with her. it was just as devastating and i ended up sobbing as i was typing.. even behind three closed doors and towel over my mouth, i can be heard. the only place left for me to go is somewhere else and that is kind of impractical at the moment.
i think i've been in denial about the whole thing...she's been telling me and telling me and i keep kind of not talking about it too much though did at first and before i read DB. i've been really working on such hugely important personal changes however she can only see me now when she looks back rather than the present and future. i don't want the relationship we had, either. i wasn't going to leave it though. don't get me wrong, i've behaved in reprehensible ways and have, i think, brought this all upon myself.
i thought the holidays sucked before! i had no idea they could be this bad!
i need to detach from her and this life and start dealing with my emotional states so that i can be a good father to my son regardless of where i live or how i live.
That is HUGE... it is ok to journal and let stuff out... well, truth is there's no wrong or right in how you behave or what you do, that is true to you...
except that in order to move forward and take care of what needs taking care of (yourself and your son), you do need to detach your emotions from her.
It will show up in your writing style and who you journal about and it will take whatever time it takes for you...
It starts with stepping back and changing focus on you. Have you read the LRT and the 37 rules? Hopefully someone else can post them for you, I don't have them handy...
hi Kaffee,
yes, i've read the rules... just read them again on wiz10's thread.
fortunately or not, depending on your point of view i suppose, he asked many of the same questions that i have been having and wondering about the answers seem to be good ones for me as well.
i've been thinking about posting her latest email (edited to protect identities) and my response, or at least the main parts of it. one of the things i'm having trouble with is that she says my emails are very different than when we talk face to face.
i don't disagree. when we talk face to face, seeing her anger and loathing often cause me to turn away so i don't tear up or get angry and respond in a manner which would only escalate things.
clearly a selective memory of mine from her email was that she was afraid to touch me again because she didn't want to let go but that she must because she cannot forgive nor forget what has happened.
i understand her feelings and feel not too dissimilar, i seem not to be able to forgive myself either. i feel that my mistakes don't define me yet that is how i think she is defining me. i've tried to be very honest about my history and about myself with her always fearful that if the fullness of what had transpired came to light it would effect our relationship, it has always done so in the past.
other selective memory bit is that she feels i deserve someone that will love me for who i am and that isn't her. she's been trying to tell me but i'm not listening, she claims. i hear her. i believe her. i tell her that i respect her decision and that i can respect her decision and still hope for my marriage to remain intact. not the old one, a new one. neither of us like how the old one had become. we both have work to do and we are both doing it. one of the harder parts for me to reconcile is that now, after all this time of riding the storm, when it's finally ending... we can see the end in sight...she cannot continue.
i've not been served yet so i find that a positive.
i know the three main areas that i need to work on.
a) when she's crying she wants me to come and comfort her. when i cried i didn't want that at first. i wanted to cry it out and then talk with her. i came home from walking and she was crying a day after telling me she didn't want to speak with me. i didn't say anything. she said "hi" sarcastically from her desk and i walked into the living room and asked her if she wanted to talk. she then explained that this has always been an issue in our relationship. she wants me to come and offer succor when she is crying and because i don't want that for me i don't do that for her. she's right. i'm better at it now...well...until she told me she didn't want to talk with me any longer. it's difficult to know how to respond to that.
b) when the girl moved into our house. she's convinced that i have feelings for her and does not believe me when i say that i don't. i don't. i didn't. there is a book called The Four Loves by C.S. Lewis, one of his best imo. in any case, he talks about Agape Love, love of your fellow human just for being a fellow human. i have explained to my wife that i felt that way due to the all the things i've already spelled out earlier. however, W is demanding "all the details" and thinks i won't give them to her because it won't save the marriage and nothing i can do will save it.
c) she thinks i need to get a job. i'm trying. do you have any idea how hard it is to get a job in the IT field when you're disabled and been out of work for 5 years? it's bloody hard. it's not really possible to do lots of jobs that i could probably get in a large store or something like that since i'm restricted in weight and certain accomodations (sitting/standing for long durations is a no go) and so it's even harder. fortunately, i collect disability and the job i had before i lost it due to that disability was pretty good so i get a decent amount of money. if she had a job we'd probably not have any money worries. we're fairly frugal however she's lately been expressing her dismay that i'm not motivated to succeed in the corporate world etc. not willing to do what a real man would do to support his family.
c) well... h3ll, i forgot what this is now as i'm kind of tired. enough for now anyway...when i think about it i feel myself become terribly sad. i'm so desperately lonely and alone and so is she. moreso than me perhaps. this is the worst thing that i've ever had to go through as an adult.
have to attend to sleep so not able to post much right now.
Just a reminder that detaching doesn't have to mean NC. It is as much about getting yourself off the emotional roller coaster. If you can be in her presence and have convo with her without getting sucked in, that is the goal...
It doesn't seem you're 100% there, yet. Not sure how many really do get to that point. We can't be ambivalent, we have history with our spouses.
Keep working at it, it gets easier.
As far as IT work, I understand. I'm not disabled, but having primarily a independent consultant for the past 15 years, it's hard to impress a company that you can be a long term, capable and quality empolyee... I'm looking at job alternatives...
Good luck with that. Something will come up for you.
journaling:
so strange today...she spoke like there was a future, that she wanted one with me and that we're working through things... she instantly interrupted me and told me that she's not further along the healing path, she just realized that she had a choice and she was choosing something other than me. in some ways it's like she's acting out her anger at her father whom is a loathsome individual and uses his money to control people, her in particular. in any case, i'm blamed for her asking him to help us all during our marriage though when it could have really been helpful to us she and he were not speaking and i never pressured her to do anything especially ask for money. i figured we'd always survive somehow... something always comes up.
@Kaffee. oh, we have contact everyday as we live in the same house, have breakfast and dinner and sometimes lunch together. it just depends on if she's pouring her anger and rage out at me or not on what happens. unfortunately i'm not able to endure much of that before i have to leave or i'll respond angrily. i did the other day and she followed me, screaming and yelling all the way... i went down into the basement and closed the door behind me, she opened it continuing to scream and then slammed it shut and left the house. she got her in her car and was doing down the driveway when i opened the front door and asked her where she was going... she backed up and rolled down her window and said "f you" and my response was "i'd love to, come get some." probably not the best thing to say and though i feel like i was pretty restrained i can see how that may not have gone over well.
she sent a huge email, the one previously mentioned, where she apologized for all of that and was surprised at how she had acted.
you know.. the thing is...i don't want our relationship like it had become, either. we talked about that today and she was glad to hear that i recognized that it hadn't been good for us in a while. she's right. she said that she could accept me as a person, which is a nice change, but she couldn't accept being with me. so many mixed messages i can't really tell what the hell is going on. i know that she hasn't served me yet because the attorney has told her that we can't be living together for that to happen and her parents can't figure out why she hasn't served me yet. i wonder if i'll get served at the trauma unit...that may not be a bad place for it but it would be pretty awful at the same time.
Interesting turn for you JaeC. Stay the course!
hi Autumn,
i don't think i can do anything other than that, really. she's convinced herself of a few things which aren't really how things are between us. she's been using a great deal of absolutist language "always" "never" "everyone" and things like that and then she's confiding in me and expressing herself in a reasonable manner that can be constructive for us.
when we had our first "this is the end" issue it was me going to leave her unless she did certain things which i explained. in my case, she won't explain it and thinks i should know. i was willing to tell her what it would take to restore my trust and yet she is unwilling to do the same. *sigh*
it's like a whirling, twisting open ended thrill ride without a seat belt. i suppose that, on the other side of everything, i'll be a healthier person, better parent and better partner than i have been previously. it's hard to keep looking at the future when you're hanging your head in shame and embarrassment though.
hi Autumn,
when we had our first "this is the end" issue it was me going to leave her unless she did certain things which i explained. in my case, she won't explain it and thinks i should know. i was willing to tell her what it would take to restore my trust and yet she is unwilling to do the same. *sigh*
Is it possible that she doesn't know what it will take, she may not know exactly what she needs from you yet. It may be some time before you get to that point. Try to be patient if you can. I know that it is much easier said than done.
that's possible however i have the feeling that she's told me over these many years and yet somehow i wasn't able to connect the dots or wasn't motivated to do so...i'm not sure. perhaps i'm just blaming myself out of habit...though i've been listening to her saying a few things but, to me, they aren't really accurate.
for instance, when she gets into an argument with someone she wants/expects my defense of her. while that makes sense to me if anything were to get physical it doesn't make a lot of sense to me for me to interject into an argument between her and another woman that we know. she is quite capable of holding her own in those things but she feels that my not doing so means i won't defend her.
i've been working really hard to be able to change my behavior with regards to when she cries...coming to her instead of letting her be, as i've preferred most often. hard to do that now, of course.
she said that she won't let anyone have access to her again. i'm not entirely sure what it means but she said the same to me in "the email" that she can't let me have access to her. i suppose that's a particular term that has a meaning that i'm just unaware of.
her birthday is Friday and my son is looking forward to it. i'm glad that i'll get to be here on Friday to celebrate it with her though she said there is nothing to celebrate. *sigh*
journaling:
interesting conversation tonight for me not to focus too much on the future about where i'll live or where she'll live etc. she said that it was hard because she wanted to hug me. eventually we were in the kitchen looking at pictures of my son from school to figure out which ones to buy and i put my hand on her shoulder and left it there for a moment. she sighed and turned and put her arms around me and we hugged for about 4 mins. it was nice, really nice. i haven't had an affectionate touch in nearly 10 months so i'm savoring it, as brief as it was and as much as i may read into it.
Lucky you!
I wonder, since she's yearning for touch too, if this might work for you. What if you tell her how good it felt to hug and just let her know you won't read anything into it but goodwill in the moment or something. Suggest that if she was holding back because she didn't want you to misunderstand, that she doesn't need to worry about that.
If you can be honest about that, you might be able to show more affection to each other and build on that.
hi Adinva,
thank you for the suggestion. this morning we hugged in the kitchen and my son asked "mom, why are you hugging dad?" and she responded "because we love each other." she also told me that if she could have figured out how to make the intercom work she would have asked me to join her in bed last night since it was cold here. she couldn't and didn't want to get out of bed however i think that is a positive development.
i told her that i dreamed about her last night, she and i and our son were camping on an island where wild ponies lived and as our son went to sleep we stayed awake by the campfire waiting to see the dolphins swimming up the coast at dawn.
perhaps that was a bit too much but overall, the past few days have seemed more positive than negative.
journal:
we had lunch today. it was pleasant and we joked and chatting in the car casually on the way there. based on the things from the past two days i felt that things were getting better... perhaps they are though it is sometimes hard to tell...and i suspect that "better" probably means different things to different folks.
she told me she wanted to be my friend but she couldn't be my friend until i had done more healing and figuring out who/what i am and all the rest. kind of a let down i suppose but better than her saying she didn't want to be my friend.
then again, when i got home last time she was angry at herself for thinking that we'd end up friends after all this was said and done. i am not sure how i could be her friend after all, if we weren't married i would never, ever, be friends with someone that could hurt me and did hurt me so deeply...that doesn't mean i don't want to be her friend just that i don't know how and, honestly, i don't want that as the primary relationship between us. i have friends, i would like to have my wife and son and marriage back.
When my first husband and I split up. I didn't think we could be friends because he so many hurtful things to me. We have been divorced 6 1/2 years now and he is still my best friend. It took approx 2 years to get there, but we did. He has been a great friend to me while I am going through my separation with my second husband. I don't see myself getting back with my first husband, why ruin a good friendship. I wouldn't give that up for nothing.
hi Hopeful,
thank you for the post. i think i'd rather have a spouse and family than just another friend...and i think, though i don't know, that i wouldn't be able to be friends. as you said, though, it could take years and how i feel now isn't how i'm going to feel later.
journal:
had my son stay home from school today so we could climb trees and make mom a birthday cake and card. she had a job interview today and that's both bad and good... bad in the sense that if she gets the job then i think she's moving out and good because if she gets the job AND we can reconcile THEN we get to stay in our home.
last night she massaged a hurt part of my neck which was remarkable. in the languages of love, i'm a physical touch person so i'm wondering if i'm getting the wrong ideas because of our touching now. on her way to her interview today she leaned forward and gave me a kiss on the cheek and then, as she was driving away i made the sign for "i love you" as did my son and she looked at me and signed back "i love you".
we were talking last night and her shoulders are so sore and aching but she's afraid for me to rub them because, as she said "two people that love each other and haven't been intimate in 6 months and we both know what massages lead to." well... it's true enough what she said but not all massages lead to intimacy.
i've very confused.
at the same time she's making it clear to me that she doesn't see a way forward for us however she did comment that she notices i'm doing more around the house, even though i'm not. she's just noticing it now (though i am being more purposeful about helping her with things that she decides to do i.e. rake leaves or what have you whereas before we'd both do our own sort of yard projects at the same time.)
in any case, i'm going to the trauma unit tomorrow (Sat) at 3pm and i'll probably be there for about a month or so, which means i miss, potentially, our last Christmas and my son's birthday as a family. i'm actually thinking that she's going to serve me when i'm in the unit. i suppose that would be ok though not at the same time.
i'm back. she didn't serve me but made it clear that she cannot and does not trust me. i have come to accept the writing on the wall at this point and, honestly, i cannot devote any more energy into doing what she asks of me. IF, as she suggests, everything i say is different from my actions (which doesn't seem to be the case for anyone else that knows me) then i'm pretty stuck.
i'm doing far better on a personal level though and i'm ready to get on with the rest of my life.
just a quick update.
she would like me to leave and go to something like a halfway house or anything that would get me out of the house, really. i'm not so keen on that idea in the least bit.
i have, however, concluded that for her to heal and for me to heal we do need to be separated from each other physically and thus i plan to leave in Feb. where i'll go in Feb remains to be seen but i'm tired of the animosity, the outright hostility and the demeaning and shaming way in which she speaks to me.
i still wear my wedding band because i don't feel like she does and she mocks me for it. sure, she's entitled to her opinion but that doesn't give her license to shame or humiliate me for expressing my own views on the matter.
we've both said that if this marriage didn't work out that we'd not get married again. if you saw Independence Day, i feel like the Jeff Goldbloom character that kept his wedding band on for the entire time they were divorced since he didn't want that divorce.
i don't want it either so i'm wearing my band.
i suppose sometimes not knowing the truth is more comforting than knowing it... turns out, and i acquired this information through means which are unethical, she is projecting all of her issues onto me so that she doesn't have to face and deal with them, blaming and shaming me and actively wants me to suffer my my trauma disorder so that she can feel better about herself. it's disgusting since she knows exactly how that trauma disorder arose. i can't believe it really. even were there some possibility of repairing this relationship it is clear now that i've been played all along in some manner... controlled, used and manipulated and when i wouldn't or couldn't play the role any longer, she was done with me and delights in my suffering so that she feels better about herself. i'm appalled.
there is another man involved, perhaps not physically yet as he lives in California and she in Maryland but i saw a text from her to him saying "did you read about my crazy dream last night? see what you are doing to me already?"
there's this horrible sinking feeling in my stomach even relating those words. everything i've read says she's either been planning to do this for a long time, which she says she hasn't, or there is another person involved which, now, is clear.
...and i have no idea why i would want to try to fix this or stay with someone like her....yet i do.
Jae- I am feeling the same way. Someone posted on my thread that trying to save my marriage shows integrity and strength. Haven't gotten that into my head yet though.
Hi RoRoinMD,
i don't know... i suppose that it may show that...perhaps it shows that i'm just desperate not to be alone or that i'm incapable of taking care of myself...or that i've been duped by someone with Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
for me, at least, i still feel married, i still feel the love that i've always felt though, in truth, it's not being mirrored back in the least bit and so i think i'm kind of foolish and that she laughs about it with her friend.
all i can do is change myself and that's what i'll have to do. i can't believe that this is happening...it's still like some sort of horrible nightmare from which i just cannot awaken and, sometimes, in the dark, cold of the night, i just wish i had never been born.
finally talked to my lawyers today.. two of them, one will be the lead and the other an adviser on the case. in any event, they have told me how what is happening right now is my SBE maneuvering to ensure that she gets custody of our son. they asked me why i couldn't and, frankly, it just never occurred to me. i think i was intimidated by the fact that i didn't have legal counsel and that her parents are wealthy and could easily outspend me in any sort of litigation.
they are taking my case pro bono or i'd be still having to do this by myself. i don't want anything unrealistic, i just don't want to lose my son or only have one night a week with him. he'd never make friends where i live and thus, as he got older, would be less and less inclined to come visit. i would like to be fair and share custody of him and keep him in his school with his friends and teachers that form his support network rather than making things easier for my SBE's commute.
by the same token, i know that watching me undergoing my transition will be hard for him and that's the last thing that i want to do; hurt my son even more than this divorce is going to hurt him.
thus i'm torn... really, really torn and i don't know what's best for him. clearly, staying in his school is hugely beneficial to help him adjust to the divorce which means i've got to find a place near his school to live, not the easiest thing on a disability income.
of course the lawyers are asking me why she wouldn't have to pay child support since she makes more than 2x what i do or alimony to keep in the lifestyle to which i've become accustomed. that will lead to all hell breaking loose to be certain.
there is just nothing easy at all about this when kids are involved, not one damned thing.
the countdown has begun. 29 days until our house closes and i'm officially homeless. i cannot afford to live in the area unless the SBE helps me (which she won't) and thus i'll lose any claim to physical custody of my son. if i stayed in the area i'd have to live in my car or in such a poor and distant locale that he wouldn't be safe or within the nominal distance for physical custody to be granted.
i hate what has happened to my life and wonder why she just couldn't be honest with me.
my wife had the movers show up at 8am and they were packed and ready to go by 945am. my son was very upset and so was I. my wife even said this was the worst day of her life but i had hurt her so badly that this didn't hurt as it should.
she's blamed me for so many things and despite my apologies and changes of behavior she continued to assert that i wasn't taking responsibility for my actions.
now... i'm all alone. the last bit of my family is gone. my son is gone and my wife along with him. the house is empty except for my belongings and some things that, i think, she's coming back to pick up later.
i have hardly been able to stop crying today, the tears are simply flowing and flowing... she promised and she broke them all; her sacred vow to me and her promise not to take my son.
i feel ruined. i feel like there's no point to anything, no reason to fight any longer, no feeling of joy or happiness just a gaping maw of black sadness where my spark of life used to be.
today my family was destroyed and i along with it.
Hi JaeC, you are having such a horrible time of it, but you are not destroyed. You need to somehow gather yourself up and think into the future. Things are not always going to be this way. Think long term, think about your son. He needs you. I'm new to this, but rely on the people here, esp. the vets. They can give you a ton of help. Don't despair.
Maybe you can contact some social service agencies, or a church, there are alot of caring souls out there if you can ask for the help. Take care.
thank you for the kind response. i feel completely alone and bereft, no family or friends that live anywhere close to my son are able to or willing to help me and so i have to move out of state to live, and that tears me apart as well. i never thought it would end like this, her having an emotional affair and just walking out of my life and leaving me behind and taking my son. she broke every promise that she's made to me...and i would still crawl on my belly like a worm to have her back if only i had the chance.
well...
after she left the house and took what she wanted, i was left with the rest of the stuff. i put a lot into storage and then loaded up my car and left as well. i drove to the only place that i was offered a couch to sleep upon, San Francisco California a journey of some 2778 miles.
i'm here now. alone, bereft and sad though resolved that i will heal and be a whole, healthy parent for my son.
I am so sorry for your pain.
thank you scaredsilly,
i could never have imagined this would happen in all my years, i've lost everything and have no where to live other than on couches that friends are kind enough to offer.
i feel so completely devastated and betrayed, so used and thrown away as if i were a broken tool or piece of garbage and having served my purpose i can be discarded.
i believe that i tried everything that was recommended here and elsewhere and nothing helped. i hope that, in time, perhaps things will change but for now this is how they are. my family is in Maryland and i'm a roving vagabond sleeping on couches.
i know how you feel. i feel so disposable. how can someone who once professed to love me more than he ever loved anyone (and still says this) not want to figure out how to make it work? it's so unbelievable...
i have to try to stop thinking about the good in him and think more about what it was about him that made me unhappy in our relationship. maybe that will help you, too?
i have no idea what happened... one day she just said "i don't have to live with you" and that was it. of course, that is her choice...she didn't have to. we vowed to be together, always and she swore to follow me to the ends of the universe and beyond. seems the universe got a whole lot smaller and "forever" is not nearly as long as i thought.
i don't want to think bad things about her, it makes me feel bad too. if there was something that i could do more than what i have, i'd do it.
we had our ups and downs and most of our issues were related to crap that happened to us in our childhood that we never had resolved till we met each other and, i suppose, once that happened neither of us felt like we had to work on those things.
we were wrong. i've been healing and recovering for more than a year now and she hasn't been and that makes it harder for her to ignore what is going on with her and, in some way, makes it hard for her to be with me.
i miss her and my family so much but i'm worth more than that, i'm not a piece of garbage to be thrown away. i was willing to do whatever i could to make it work and, ultimately, she was not. perhaps some day she'll come to realize what she threw away but by then i don't know if i'd be able to go back...and that makes me profoundly sad.
I don't know if you were asked or you mentioned this already, but what are you doing for yourself to keep busy?
things have changed pretty dramatically for me in the past few weeks. right now, i'm engaging in the social and cultural network in the San Fran area, i've met a few new friends here and that's been nice.
it can be really rough during the day but i'm still trying to find work which is mixed... it takes my time but hasn't resulted in a job yet.
update.
seems that we have agreed on the terms of the divorce. i can't believe it's really come to this and i feel so terrible about the whole thing. i know it's not all my fault but i feel devastated by my own contribution to this. i honestly thought that it would be forever and despite the divorce she is still *the One*.
i miss my son terribly. it's hard to call and talk to them on the speaker phone.. it reminds me so poignantly of my exclusion from the family. it's one of the hardest things i've ever had to endure.
i'm sad all the time even when i'm out and laughing...it's just a mask for the terrible feeling of abandonment that i feel. i cry every day, multiple times a day and i feel like my life is meaningless now.
Its not meaningless. Younhave a young oynthat needs you no matter what you are feeling. You are meaning to him. You have to make meaning out of all of this for him. even if you can't for yourself right now. He has to feel safe and know that he can look towards you for the security he will need more than ever now.
update.
she's incredibly mean and hostile to me now and hardly a civil word passes between us. my heart, though broken into millions of pieces, loves her still. i always will. she will always be The One. i wish i could have done better with the opportunity i was given.
give her space, space, space. when they're spewing, that's what they need.
whenever you interact, don't talk about the sitch. be polite and upbeat. only discuss what needs to be spoken about and don't drag things on hoping to get more.
be a great dad. you and your son need that.
wishing you the best.
thank you for your kind words of encouragement. i don't often visit here as i find it just too difficult.. too open..too raw...talking about things i can do to save a relationship that only one of us wants to save. i don't even think it would be that difficult if there was any desire on her part to talk and try.. but there is none at this point. will it be that way for the rest of my life? i don't know.
it's been almost 10 months now. only 6 months without my son and i feel as if my heart or, more accurately, some tender loving part of my heart, has been ripped out and is hidden from me. i miss my son so much and i can hardly call and talk to him. he doesn't talk to me and i understand that.
whenever i call and i hear their life going on.. just their talking and the interaction it reminds me so powerfully of how i've been ostracized from the family, cut off and abandoned. it effects me for days until i have recovered enough to call the next time. it's horrible. i've never really felt anything like this in my life.
i could never, ever, in my life have imagined this happening to us.
her most recent text message to me accused me of lying to her for all our time together and she said "[censored] you. forever."
just sad. always sad. so much of my music reminds me of her and us. so many things do. so much is lost. it's all gone. it's all pointless. she mentions that often...my responses to her txts and emails is pointless and that's mostly because i don't agree with how she characterizes me or the nature of our relationship these past 15 years.
i suppose that i just don't understand why she didn't even want to try... well... i guess i do but i don't want to. if i read this whole thread again i'll read things i have mostly forgotten or don't want to remember.
her most recent text message to me accused me of lying to her for all our time together and she said "[censored] you. forever."
Someone, likely got in her ear... I guess someone "proved" that you have been lying to her this whole time.
Back up a bit. How often do you see your son? What was the terms of the D?
i'd have to think you're right. of course her father is paying for her attorney and never liked me. he always thought that she was supporting me financially which even if that were the case (it wasn't) shouldn't be a big deal anyway. what i meant was that she was supporting me through my disability and subsequent surgery to fix it.
still... our whole history seems like it was someone elses life that she was living. it's strange. if there were 10 negative and 100 positive things all she is remembering is the negative things. i'm afraid of what that level of animosity will do to my son. he already calls me the "telephone parent".
we're still negotiating the terms of the settlement. in our home state the divorce takes 12 months from the day of separation. i've not seen my son since they left. i didn't have anywhere to stay nor any means to acquire it on my own. i had a few friends that offered me places and that's where i am, staying with a friend. that friend lived in Seattle and my son is near Baltimore.
our agreement, however, spells out that i can see him during the day 8am-8pm provided it's not interfering with school/holidays etc that are already planned. no over nights. he can't come see me in Seattle.
separation agreed upon. 15 years, to the very day, from when we met. it's tragic on so many levels. i'm so sad. i thought this day would never come. i really tried and am still trying to work on myself and be a good partner. i miss my family. i haven't seen my son in 7 months.
i'm so alone and lonely.. i miss my son so much... i miss my wife so much... i miss my family. i don't understand and, on some level, i sort of hope that i never do. it's all just a cycle, now, between soul crushing depression and over the top self destructive behavior. i've lost it all except for my life and it's harder and harder figuring out why that has any value now other than as an example of what not to do.
Jaec, it's been seven months now, what have you done for you? What have you done to try to be able to rent closer to your son?
You need to pick yourself up, dust yourself off and live for you. Set very small goals and then when you reach them, celebrate and set some more. Baby steps.
Sorry if this sounds harsh but you basically have two choices, wallow in self pity or pick yourself up and live.
Have you read DR?
I know it's hard but right now hard is the only choice you have.
You need to stop asking why and how! You need to think about anything you done to contribute to this and do 180s, you need to forgive both yourself and your wife. Change what you can, accept what you can't.
Do you still have any form of contact with your W or S?
I'm sorry to hear that you're having such a hard time. What are you doing to take care of yourself? That's your most important job, both for yourself and for your family, though it might not be apparent at the moment.
Set some goals. Get help if you need it. You are capable of improving your life. Of course it's difficult. All of this comes with plenty of heartache.
Are you reading other threads here? There's lots to be gained by seeing how others handle things.
Cadet wisely says that our uncooperative partners have given us the gift of time and we must use it wisely. Take it to heart. Improve yourself so that you are a partner that only a fool would leave. Small steps are fine. Just keep moving in the right direction.
I wish you all the best.
JaeC, I am sorry too that you're going thru what so many of us are. I miss my husband so much. It hurts almost all the time. I have some better moments. I have my really down moments. Having a huge down moment tonight. I admit that I had a really self destructive action, it put me in the ER. I've been trying very hard to keep myself going. I luckily get to see my Ds. We're very close. I can't imagine I would keep going without them. I haven't talked to my H in over three weeks. I got an email today. One sentence. It was about money. I just don't know him anymore. I love him and want our marriage. But, sometimes it seems impossible and I don't feel like I have the strength that it takes to keep going. I wish there were magic words that would help you. I understand how you feel.
TJP...I wanted to say Hello and tell You I have read most of your sitch. Im sorry what we are going through. I also have 2 daughters, younger than yours, that are going through h*ll. My H is with OW at this point and Im am struggling very much about it. You can read my story to get the whole thing, but this weekend was terrible and it has affected all of us terribly.
H confessed his love to OW to my girls and I and I have been a basket case ever since:( Im having a hard time also because I am 5 months pregnant and my emotions are all over the place. I am trying to keep it together for my kids, unborn baby and myself but its hard. I see that you are struggling too and looking for answers and hopeful posts. I also want to hear the success stories, but I have come to know that everyone is different and my H is pretty "real" on being done. I want to have hope, but its so very hard.
JaeC..im sorry you are also feeling so down and havent seen your son:(
I wanted to give good vibes your way...I know exactly what you're feeling. I cannot give advice, as Im new, but at least I can give hugs!
SB
i do have contact with both of them, i'm allowed to call a few times a week around 7pm. i try to do things, get out and socialize...these are the first holidays that i'm going to be without them and i'm simply distraught. it's even hard to talk about it any more... on some level... it's like it can't be real.
i'm simply terrified. i can't sleep without dreaming about them, all the time, everywhere and it constantly wakes me up in tears. my day mostly consists of crying or doing things to take my mind off of it so i don't spend day after day in a dark room sobbing.
Christmas. My son is being showered with presents, more than ever... so much so that mine will be moved to his birthday in a week. Nothing to be said so i say nothing. i miss them so much. i... love them. i hope they have a good life.