Just a bit of an update in my little corner of the world … (this will be longggggg) ...
I know I should likely be posting in “Piecing,” but – I dunno – I feel better posting here because this is where my friends are … and I'm still dealing with the aftermath of Infidelity nearly every minute of every day.
The good news, my friends, is that y'all were right: time starts to heal wounds. The pain comes fewer times in a day now. And it isn't as intense. And just like HS said, my H has started earning back trust … sometimes little bits (and sometimes large chunks) at a time.
I'm still living one day at a time – and I have absolutely back-slidden a time or two. Or five. But my H, for the most part, has been completely understanding.
I've learned that I have a very difficult time sympathizing with where HE is on this journey. Since he cheated twice during our marriage – about eight years apart – I have pretty much rejected the notion that he can feel guilt or shame for what he's done. My mind thinks: He did it once, and he knew the pain it caused me. And he did it again. So how can he “get” my pain? How can he really be sorry?
I'm TRYING to shake my insecurities and my anger. I vacillate between feeling I'm keeping things bottled up and finally understanding that I'll NEVER be given the answers I need. I've blown a gasket a handful of times, even – I'm ashamed to say – as recently as Saturday. For two months, I have bottled up the fact that H took to a scrap-yard the gift he made/welded for me for our 10th anniversary, just five days before I busted him cheating again. He had welded a frame around a piece of wood that had my phone numbers on it. He had saved that piece of wood, and it had hung in his shop, since we met and he asked for my number. To commemorate our 10th year together, he gave it a more permanent home, framing it with metal and putting it on a stand. It was displayed in my house for a total of five days before I chucked it out my back door when I discovered he was cheating and he refused to end the A. Not only did he take it and dump it in a scrap yard, but he texted a photo of it lying in a pile of metal and sent the photo to OW, writing in a text: “Think I should send this photo to Train and tell her a junkyard dog might be calling her? At least he'll know he'll get 10 years outta her. Lol!!”
I have been seeing RED over that and hadn't said anything to H about it, hoping I could figure out how to deal with my anger over it on my own – knowing nothing H did during that time made any sense … and there's NO WAY he will be able to make it make sense to me now. But I couldn't let it go, and it came out on Saturday, after we concluded another great date night that H planned. (Ouch.)
He gets frustrated that no answers he provides seem to even TOUCH my wounds or satisfy my curiosity.
The fact is: that's more of the same of how we operated before all this happened. And I don't want that. Neither does he. Though sometimes I wish he could peer inside my heart and soul and FEEL what he made me feel, that's impossible. And I don't even know that I want him to know how badly he hurt me. I think, in his current state of mind, it would send him over an edge to know the extent of that pain.
Our M, right now, is better than it's ever been. I've realized that we have NEVER put our relationship first. We are learning each other, and enjoying one another, like never before. As I posted in someone else's thread yesterday, we've enjoyed live music at a nearby whitewater rafting center, drinking beer and watching people ride the waves as the sun was setting. We've gone to a live raggae band, which I secretly thought I wouldn't really enjoy … but I LOVED it! We're planning a zip-line trip and a paddle-board excursion (neither of which H and I would have done before), and as part of a beer tour at the whitewater center, we are planning a moonlit canoe tour, which will take us to a deserted island, where a chef will prepare a meal for us! H loves to plan our dates, and we are both immensely enjoying the variety and adventure of trying and learning new things.
H is listening to me without reacting. Before? He would take my “venting” about the kids personally; he basically thought I was transferring my stress onto him, and he would absorb it and end up stressed, too. Instead, as I've now explained to him, I'm just telling him how my day went; I'm venting to get it off my chest. I'm not asking for help. If I wanted help, I'd ask for it. So now, H meets me outside every afternoon for a cocktail - and no kids - and we talk about how our day went. He calls it our "20-minute afternoon vent session." Lol.
It has made things sooooo much better around here.
I've also realized that I had dipped into a bit of depression before H cheated and left. That DOES NOT mean I excuse what he did to me. But I felt so overwhelmed with the house; I'm a perfectionist, of sorts, about my house. As I've written before, I'm pretty crafty, and most everything in my house is handmade/hand-painted. It looks like it stepped off a Pinterest page. But being a SAHM of two – and homeschooling my son – this house is lived in EVERY MINUTE OF EVERY DAY. It's a full-time job just to follow behind D3 and clean up after her. And I got to the point that I felt so overwhelmed with everything … and all that was unfinished by way of my own projects ... that I completely shut down. I barely got off the couch. I went from cooking five dinners a week to nothing. I was depressed and overwhelmed and didn't even realize it. I made every excuse for why – the anniversary of my dad's death, the house was a mess, my son needed my attention for school, etc.
But what I realized when H left is that I can control 90% of the things that overwhelm me. Mad because D16 keeps leaving the gate open and the dog escapes EVERY time? Quit nagging about it, Train, and just check the stupid gate before ya let the dog out. Easy. Upset that the bathroom isn't clean and no amount of nagging the teen girls isn't working? Quitcherbitchin and pick up the freaking Pine Sol, sister. Upset that D3's closet looks like butt? Stop depending on D17 to do it for ya. Get up and organize that closet the way you want it! Simple things. And it keeps me off the couch. It has kept me busy, yes, but it's helping my PMA. My H said: “I had no idea that your unfinished projects made you feel so overwhelmed that you shut down. I just thought you didn't want to do anything!”
We've also established a calendar. H hates yard work. Come to find out, he hates having yard work sprung on him. If we schedule yard/house work on the calendar, he's expecting it, and that is helping him predict it, which makes him hate it not as badly. Plus, I get out and push-mow the parts of the yard he can't reach. Teamwork makes him happy, and the exercise and sunshine make ME happy. Win-win.
Though I battle insecurities every day – I've even decided I'll take the LSAT in December and start law school in the fall of 2015 to make sure I can have a career that will provide for my children in the event H ever cheats and/or leaves again – I'm learning that this time, H and I are doing it right. Curious to go back and read real-live data (if it still existed) that would remind me how H and I handled things last time, I Googled my old DB name and read back through all my posts in 2005/06. I was MORTIFIED, going all the way back to my very first posts, before I even knew H was cheating on me (all I knew is he had left). I cringed as I saw how I took the DB principles and turned them into “doormat principles” once I discovered H had an OW. I even told him I understood and couldn't say anything about it since we were separated! Talk about a lack of self-respect! And I have NO doubts that I lost a lot of respect in my H's eyes by handling things that way.
He told me just the other day: “We NEVER got this far when I came back last time.”
And it's true. I swept everything under the rug. I never showed him my pain. All he saw was my relief to have him back. We didn't work on anything.
To be honest? I can't really say that H and I are “re-discovering” one another and our relationship. I think, actually, we are JUST NOW *discovering* each other and the relationship we never knew we could have.
It's still new. But we've developed many tools that I feel confident will help us not only maintain but improve our marriage from this point forward. H says he now knows exactly how happy we can be together, and he doesn't intend to EVER let us get back to the old way of doing things. We have committed to at least one date-night a week. That's a minimum of what we will do to keep our connection going. We are sleeping together. We are parenting together – he's pitching in with discipline more and backing me up. Though he had started to be wishy-washy about my homeschooling S8 (brought on, in part, by OW), he stands behind it now and supports it wholeheartedly. He is also being extremely supportive of me going back to school. But when I told him the other night that the primary reason I'm going back is to support the kids in the event he left again – and when I told him I would RATHER homeschool our kids right now than go to school myself – he said he would support me no matter what I decided but that I did not have to go back to school out of fear that he would be leaving again.
I've found myself slipping a little on some of the changes I'd made. But here's the good news: I've caught it quickly and pulled myself up and together. I've said “I'm sorry” when I've needed to. I've listened to what my H has said his needs are, and I've woken up every day, deliberately setting out to meet those needs, and I will continue to do that until it becomes a natural part of who I am. I've gone well outside my comfort zone on several things to make my H happy. And I've found that those things make me happy, too. Something unexpected through my H cheating on me (and this could be TMI – my bad): I've learned to like and embrace my body because, as flawed as I think it is, and as insecure as I am about it after carrying four children, my H LOVES every inch of it. And he makes no secret about it. The other day, I attended an all-day work-event with him (which I would never have done before), and he was all smiles the entire time. He told me that night: “We really turned a corner today, Train. I LOVED having you there with me, on my arm. I LOVE showing you off as my wife.” We've decided to build a Rat Rod together, pulling together his passion (building cars) and mine: upcycling/repurposing crap. I know I'm beating this to death, but it's so fundamental: we are bringing fun back to our marriage, and it's making such a huge difference.
I'm not gonna lie: I'm still guarded. A little hesitant and cynical and untrusting, deep-down inside. But I'm doggone happy. Happier in my M, in fact, than I've ever been. And H is, too.
So, yeah, this Train rolls on, y'all …
Congrats :-) so happy for you.
Train- It is so great to read how well things are going for you and your H! My WH and I are in the process if reconciling. We are separated but are working on moving him back home. Tonight's our first date night since the OW is finally out of our lives. I want to build on the positive times together since we often dwell on the negative things that have happened. I too went through depression and didn't realize how bad it was. Your post gives me a lot if hope! Thank you for sharing how you are making things work!
Train,
Your story inspires me as always
. Keep up the slow steady progress, and congrats!!
Dev
That is truly a wonderful and inspirational story. I'm glad you posted it here as I would have never read it in the other forum.
Great recap, Train. Thanks for taking the time to post it here for us.
I didn't know your story but it's good to hear things can and do turn around.
--GG
Train, I was so surprised to realize where you were in your journey.
While I was still lurking, before I started posting, I followed your story for a while. This was when you were still talking about defaulting on the house, etc.
I was so amazed to read your recap above that I went back and reread your earlier threads to see how things changed for you. What was the thread after Loot & Lawyers? I want to see the rest of this story unfold.
Thanks so much for sharing, and I'm glad things are so much better for you & your family.
Hey, guys! Thank y'all so much for your support and sweet words.
Hope you all enjoyed your holiday weekend as much as possible.
Maybell, here's a link to all my Train threads:
Take Two Mondays for days ... Loot and lawyers Looking up at the mountain ahead ... Strangely, there are *some* of my old "pregnant&DBing" posts in 2005/2006 still floating out in cyberspace. I haven't found my posts in Separated or Piecing from back then, but I found the ones in Infidelity. These are old, but they're good for me to put here ... and, if you're really bored and want to go back through them and identify all the ways I went wrong back then (ha!) ... here they are:
I'm pregnant ... he's sleeping with OW Not for the faint of heart More rantings and ravings from Preggo If Courts had Contractions (later titled "The bombs keep falling!!! Look out below!") On Labor and Little Man ... no Lawyers this time (later titled "Oh, the fun times ...") I *think* that's it. Hopefully all those links will lead where they're supposed to
Not much to update on here. Things are still moving along, slowly and steadily.
H and I went out July 3rd to watch fireworks, just the two of us. We had a wonderful time and stayed after everyone had left and had a great talk. I, for the most part, am letting him bring up anything that has to do with his time away. And I'm finally at a place where I can listen without growing angry; I listen without lashing out ... or even feeling like it. H says - over and over - "this time is so different." And I've decided to take him at his word.
We did talk a little about how I've tried to change so much in response to some of his pre-A complaints (and some complaints that I can *imagine* he might have had, though he hasn't verbalized them) ... and how he hasn't seemed to change much except for his attitude/outlook and spending more time with me. In fact, since he's been home, I've taken MORE on around the house ... which means he's had to do LESS. BUT, I learned - through our discussion - that the biggest problem is that I have been expecting him to mind-read, when I should have outright said, "Hey, Love: You remember that my love language is acts of service? Would you mind helping me hang clothes sometimes? And how about that pesky curtain rod I need made for the pantry? Think maybe you could find the time to throw that together for me in the next little while?"
All it took was a little conversation, and this weekend, he was hanging up clothes, helping me outside, straightening up, etc., all without me even asking.
And today? He promised he'd work on digging my pond, which is something I've been begging for him to do for at least three years for my birthday.
In the back of my mind, I start to freak out a little, thinking:
Maybe he feels like this is mostly stuff I should handle at home since I'm a SAHM, and he's already building resentment against me for asking for his help when he stays so busy working.I'm trying really hard to do what's mine to do around here ... and to let go of my insecurities. I *still* need to focus on myself and improvements I need to make in MY life. I do not want to ever be completely dependent on him again; I've learned that isn't healthy. At the same time, I don't want to live my life with it in the back of my head that I need to be self-sufficient because he may leave again. It's a delicate dance. But isn't it all?
What's strange is that he tells *me* that he lives every day in fear that *I* will leave *him* now. I think that's insane, considering our history. But I also have to understand that he has fears and insecurities, too.
But the good news is that things seem to be "better" far more than they're "worse" right now.
I still have the "he's gonna eventually do this again" thing permanently standing in my mind. But I guess - after being cheated on twice - that's probably to be expected. I don't know that it'll ever go away completely. But perhaps it'll diminish in time.
My job is to wake up every day and sweep my side of the street. How HE responds to that makes me happy to meet his needs.
So far, so good ...
We took the kids to "A Revolutionary Fourth" in a town about 45 minutes away on July 4th. It was AMAZE-BALLS! Seriously the best fireworks show I've ever seen. It lasted 30 minutes and was set to music, and it followed a mini-reenactment of the Revolutionary War. S8 is a huge history nut, so it was a perfect thing for us to do as a family. And it was seriously crazy cool. H found the place in an online search. I tell ya: he keeps impressing the heck outta me with the plans he makes and the places he finds for us to visit. And I'm pretty sure it's making him very happy that I'm up to taking a chance and trying new things, site-unseen.
We still have plenty of things to stress about, but it feels so much better to share the load ... and to kick back at the end of a week, knowing we did our best (even if we fell short on some things) and FORCE ourselves to take a time-out for a little fun ... and each other.
Train,
So glad to hear that things are progressing for you! I promise that if you keep deliberately meeting each others needs that you will be in a better marriage than you could have ever dreamed of a couple of years from now.
I'm also glad to see that you have become consistent at asking for what you want.
Don't worry about your husband's resentment- focus instead on the reality that YOUR resentment isn't being built up. It is your husband's responsibility to argue (not in a bad way) for what he does or does not want to do. Resolving those conflicts together will ultimately bring you closer.
Keep up the good work!!
-HS
P.S. In the spirit of "asking for what you want", would you mind stopping by "Meghan"'s thread in the Newcomers forum?
I've also asked her to read your thread, I think you could be of some real help to her.
HS,
I could hug your neck.
It's always such a pleasure to hear from you, the very first person who came to my rescue when I found myself back here. I honestly credit you, Starsky and Wonka for saving my M. And YOU, kind sir, believed in me and my M from the very first day. I think of you, with a grateful heart, at least once a day.
I will absolutely head over and look for Meghan's thread! Thanks for the heads up!
Big hugs, and I hope you're doing well!
Train,
What a wonderful thread with cool updates and activities! The war recreation with the fireworks sounds a lot of fun.
Hey...have you taken to patting your H's bum frequently now?!
Hahahahaha, Wonka!
Why, yes! Yes, I have!
Hi train, I have spent the past couple of days reading your threads, my sitch resonates with me, my H had his first a 5 years ago, we "worked it through"(read ignored it, pretend it never happened) he began s 4 months ago, officially moved into his own place 2 months ago, had 2nd a Nov last year, he's just said he's stated seeing same ow last wweek, Umm yep that's the official line! could you do me a huge favor and check out my threads, it's be nice to hear your take on it all
Train, when you get a moment, can you check out a poster named Sam3 over on the Newcomers forum? I think she could really benefit from your experience, and she sounds to my (entire untrained) ear to have the "moxie" to be able to pull this off, too. In other words, she strikes me as someone who would really apply the advice without fear.
thx,
Starsky
Just saw this. Whew! Crazy day on the boards,eh? I'm on it, Starsky.
My pleasure. Thank YOU.
Starsky (and HS if you're reading ... and Wonka if you have an opinion and, hell, anyone else out there, too),
I've hit a minor snag. Not a snag, per se. I don't know what to call it. This is a piecing issue. A personal issue. Hells bells. I don't know WHAT it is, but I've been struggling with it and need some perspective, and y'all give that to me at my weirdest moments, so here goes ...
Okay, you know how I've posted about my decision to move forward with law school? I've always thought I'd be really good at it and would enjoy it (especially if I can work in a DAs office with a focus on white-collar crime). And before I became a SAHM, it was just a pipe dream. Yet here it is: a potential reality.
But once I became a SAHM, I started liking being a SAHM. I have spent the better part of this week planning my S8's curriculum this year, and it always energizes me sooooo much. I LOVE building my own curriculum and teaching him things. I also love watching him learn things (like how to read and multiply) and thinking:
Dang! I did that! (You should also know that my first "declared major" in college was Elementary Education, but once I discovered that teachers had to teach to a test and couldn't really build their own curriculum, I bowed out and declared English as my major. I know, I know. English? WTF? But I was a good writer and just wanted good grades ... and CLEARLY had NO good guidance in the process ... but I digress ...)
H says ("says") he not only supports me being a SAHM and homeschooling our kids but he will encourage me to continue doing it. In fact, he says it makes him happy to see me with the kids and to come home to a hot meal every afternoon.
But he said post-BD that I "let myself go" as a SAHM. And he left me.
As I've started studying for the LSAT and have gotten more serious about law school and (eventually) long hours at a firm, I've found myself growing quite sad ... and even angry. (I'll explain in a minute.)
Yes, I've always thought I'd do well in law. Yes, there's a side of me that feels fulfilled when I'm kicking butt and taking names. (Picture it: in my former career, my newspaper/blog investigations brought not only the SBI but the *FBI* into our town to investigate on SEVERAL occasions ... and, at one point not too long ago, resulted in the firing of our police chief).
There's this one side of me that loves exposure and conflict ... when I put my head on a pillow every night, knowing I've done something positive for my community. Thinking back, those were some of the best days of my life.
And my H says ("says") he will not only support me but ENCOURAGE me going to law school and eventually kicking butt and taking names again. In fact, he says it makes him SO proud to see me doing that, and he knows it makes me feel fulfilled and happy.
But some of those "kicking-butt" days are also the days when I put my career before my H. And he left me. The first time.
It took me probably a year to settle into a SAHM role. It's what I wanted. And now I adore it. Mainly, I adore educating my son and watching him learn and grow. I love developing his curriculum, pairing classic literature to a particular region we're studying. I make family meals/desserts that also pair with that region.
So I have the ball-busting me ... and I have this OTHER side of me that's totally creative and domestic.
I've never found balance with the two.
So the other day, I talked to H about maybe me getting my licensure to teach instead of piling on $90K in school loans to pay for law school. Teaching wouldn't pay well, and it wouldn't get me in touch with that "ball-busting Train," but I'd be able to bring the kids with me to work and make money at the same time, etc. He said he'd fully support "whichever" I wanted to do.
But here's the kicker: I don't HAVE to work. And he says he doesn't care about me bringing in income. He says he likes being the provider ... and even WANTS me to go out and buy myself a nice outfit every once in a while to go on a date with him. He says, "that's WHY I work so hard."
Literally the only reason I feel compelled to go back to school/work right now is to be able to secure a job that makes enough money to provide for my kids and me in case H ever leaves again. Or dies, I guess. But that seems too morbid to consider, sooo ...
I have a stupid English degree. Like, WTH can I do with THAT?!? I have to have SOMETHING on top of it to secure a decent job.
But I *LOVE* staying home with my babies and homeschooling S8 (and, soon, D3).
I know this is asking for advice that is wayyyyy beyond the scope of DBing. But I'm not asking for career advice at all, actually.
I guess my question is: am I crazy for making such huge decisions - that will potentially have huge financial, familial impacts - based solely on the presumption that H may leave again?
And, yes, it makes me sad and angry. It makes me so sad and SO angry that my life can't just be simple: me doing what makes me happy and knowing that WHICHEVER path I chose would make H happy, too.
When he came back in 2006, he said he has an internal conflict: he, on the one hand, wants me to be "June Cleaver" (like his mom), but he is also very much attracted to the I-don't-give-a-crap, ball-busting attitude that I, Train, used to have. And he said that my "confidence" in that regard is what drew him back THIS time. When I told him, just a few days after BD, that I had sent out an email to former colleagues and received hits on a freelance job within 10 minutes, H PHYSICALLY got excited ... even when he was completely involved with OW.
When asked later about that? He said: "I don't know. I think it was the confidence you showed. You got that 'old Train' back."
So WTH?!? June Cleaver? Or ball-buster?
I can be BOTH. EITHER. I'm happy with EITHER. Or BOTH.
But I'm sitting here, deathly afraid that if I pick the one I love RIGHT NOW (homeschooling my children), H will leave again, and I'll be RIGHT BACK where I was.
Keep in mind: I've been cheated on twice. Also keep in mind: I have ABSOLUTELY NO reason to believe, right now, he'll leave again. He says he is BLISSFULLY happy.
But I'm still walking on eggshells here.
Not necessarily asking for advice ... but maybe for some understanding (?) of where I am in this process? I know I've asked before, but I'll ask again: Am I normal for feeling this way?!? Any suggestions/advice for how to help me work myself out of this tangle?
I wish it were as simple as, "Hey, Train, do what makes YOU happy." It's just not that simple anymore. What makes ME happy is staying home with my kids. But I'm fearful H will leave again. I've gone through this TWICE. I have to think of the pattern of behavior and plan accordingly, right? Or no?
Y'all don't leave me hanging now that it seems I have this DB stuff in the bag ... I will "bump" this SOS question until someone responds. (Actually I might not since that would be rude, but I'm sending up an SOS here! Help, please!)
xoxo
Train, I'll respond later when I'm on a normal keyboard. I'm at the hospital with the fetching Mrs. Starsky for her sinus surgery this morning.
Starsky
Train, I'm not a vet, but I also have an English degree and I'm a SAHM looking at going back to work. Mind if I chime in?
There is middle ground. Lots of it. You can be a SAHM and a ball-buster at the same time.
Rather than going to law school you could get a paralegal certification through the local community college and be at work much more quickly. Paralegals do a lot of what attorneys do, especially as they progress in their careers. And you have the option of finding part-time work. I had a minor in accounting and just kept accumulating classes till I qualified for the CPA exam, and then went to work for a CPA firm doing litigation support. I did white collar crime support working with the FBI. (This was only part of my role there, it was general litigation support, so if I'd stayed I could have found myself on both sides of the legal fence, depending on the client). There are a lot of angles to the sort of work that draws you.
You could do advocacy work, starting as a volunteer. You can get high-profile work very quickly and parlay it into paid work over time. You can use your English degree and your blog experience as an in for what you have to offer and do as much or as little as you can balance with your home responsibilities.
You could follow through with your freelance opportunities and do as much or as little of that as you can balance with your SAHM life. You have a ton of middle ground available. You could teach at a private school that has a freer curriculum.
What I'm hearing you say is that what you want is to feel powerful. It makes you feel more secure and it is attractive to your H. So instead of thinking in binary terms, SAHM or lawyer, what if you thought in terms of balance in yourself? As I prepare my own job search I'm learning that just picking a box to crawl into is a terrible way to choose a profession. There is more out there than we realize.
Best of luck to you. It's a tricky needle to thread at the best of times. You've been a real inspiration and support to many here and I hope that makes you feel powerful too.
Starsky,
Prayers for a speedy surgery and recovery!!!!
Maybell,
THANK YOU. You gave me some GREAT ideas! I've thought about the paralegal route. And even the private-school route.
I definitely don't want to be a "paper pusher." But, if I go back to work, I do want to create change.
I guess my biggest fear is that the one thing I love to do is not attractive to my H. I could spend the rest of my life as a SAHM and be fine. (Or at least until D3 graduates and moves out.) But I'm afraid H will leave again.
Lots to consider there. But you've given me some GREAT leads, Maybell. Thank you sooooo much. xoxo
Train,
Maybell has given you some really good pointers on some choice career tracks for you to consider.
Also would suggest checking out Opportunity Nocs website for they have some really wonderful NPO jobs that fit around SAHM schedules.
You can even start up your own PI business with your FBI contacts.
Thank you, Wonka.
I will absolutely check that website.
I'm just a little off-balance right now, I think. Maybe not off-balance.
I'm just struggling with the fact that I'm even having to worry about this at all right now. I mean, I shouldn't focus on how unfair it all is, I know. Because it is what it is. But I shouldn't have to be sitting here, debating a career - or NOT - based on whether my H is going to leave again. And based on what HE finds "attractive." I mean, that's just plain ridiculous, huh?
But, alas, that's where I find myself these days ...
It's insecurity.
Train, I'll throw in too. Maybe give you some perspective from your H's point of view. Sorry it's *me* related, but I hope it gives you something to chew on.
My WAW had just quit working and was going back to school when she became pregnant with D13, our first. It was a very difficult, life-threatening pregnancy, and she was unable to continue school.
We both valued the SAHM. We both thought it best that the kids have someone at home, rather than being put in day-care. (no offense to those who choose daycare, we felt strongly otherwise) We both thought it best that mommy would be waiting for them when the school bus brought them home.
We knew it would be a challenge living on one income, but we thought it was worth it. I can't emphasize enough that we were both in full agreement on the choices. We both knew that W would go back to work eventually, but we never set those specific conditions up.
W was a very good mother. She is highly organized, and got involved in all kinds of extra-curricular things for the kids. But I don't think it was enough for her.
W just went back to work this winter, as part of her WAW exit plan.
Looking back now, I see nothing but red flags.
W had always been insecure. She was always afraid I would leave her. I never gave her any reason for this and never understood it. I now believe it was because I was successful, well educated, mobile, and she was less educated -- she was afraid I would eventually tire of her. When she became a SAHM, I think this worsened. She felt even less secure, no independent income, out of touch with the job market. [ringing a bell with you?] She was totally dependent on me.
Personally, I didn't think I would mind the SAHM. But now, I realize, that sub-consciously, there was stuff going on. My W was totally dependent on me. I guess I was always a bit of a father figure to her - nothing weird, but W's father passed when she was 18, and I am 9+ years older than W. W's total dependence on me as a SAHM probably made that worse. She commented to a friend recently that her big fear in even trying to R with me is that we'll never break the parent/child financial relationship we have and be equals in the M.
Now I also realize that by staying at home, she saw less of the world, and her universe shrank. We had less to talk about when I came home from work. She progressively understood less and less about what I did for a living, and was more intimidated by people who worked with me. Again, sub-consciously, she became less interesting to me, and I started pouring more time into hobbies and less into her.
So, knowing of her insecurities and need for independence and need to engage with people (she's very social) I celebrated her going back to work this winter. Of course, she was "done" by then, in an A, and took all my encouragement and happiness for her as insincere. Now she has all kinds of work related stories and angst that we could share - but she's not into talking to me about it.
And now, when she comes home at night, dressed for work, having put in a hard day, it's just damned sexy. I find it very attractive, (like clear the table!) and I realize now just how much I value and respect her independence.
So looking back now, if W had gone back to work 18 months earlier, I think we would not be where we are today, and I think half of our problems have already been solved by her returning to work.
But I digress...
So, my advice, from my perspective, is that yes, you should resume a career, at least part time. You have an inkling of insecurity and doubt about H leaving again. That's something you have to deal with separately, but if you at least have your toe into an independent outside career, you won't be sub-consciously feeding that fear, you'll be starving that fear.
And H says he will support your decision either way - that's great. Know that men have this innate "I'm the provider" need. Some might be intimidated by an independent W, some find it attractive. Being part time might let you get the best of this without pushing it too far either way with H.
Wow. Great, great wisdom there, zew. Cannot thank you enough for chiming in.
I've recently started thinking that maybe I'm so gung-ho about this homeschooling thing not necessarily because I love it soooo much ... but because maybe it's the one thing I do at home - in, as you said, my "shrunk" universe - that makes me feel accomplished.
But maybe getting back out there would give me a different perspective.
Your sitch sounds so familiar. Sigh. Hugs to you ...
But thank you for this; it gives me GREAT stuff to chew on.
Interesting thread.
I always worked outside the home but at times I think it worked against H and I because sometimes I think we were a bit competitive about it. We work in a similar field. At times I was very opinionated about his job when I probably should have just listened (actually, I know I should have, he's told me as much).
I think the confidence piece is so important. While I was confident at work there's a lot at home that I'm not confident about. We brought this huge, beautiful home a couple of years ago and while I love it it really kind of overwhelms me. I think at times I annoyed H because I was always depending on him for house things when I could probably easily deal with some stuff myself. Anyway, just thinking about needing to build up my self-esteem today and I think taking on more house tasks, especially with H gone, would go a long way. I seriously need a personal organizer.
Train
You have given me tons of great advice. I would like to share my perspective, which perhaps will only confuse you.
You need to be happy. But you also need to make sure that you are working on improving your marriage, which also will make you happy. If you H loves your confidence when you are doing your own thing, planning to study to be a lawyer, etc., then think about what specifically you are doing that he finds attractive. What is it about Train that is different? As stated above, it simply could be that you are independent and know that if this M did not work out, you would be fine. But when you go back to the SAHM scenario, perhaps your confidence wanes because you no longer have financial independence and come to rely on your H too much. There has to be a middle ground.
About my sitch...my W has worked always and I love that she does. I know she would not like being a SAHM. So I want her to be happy. I always have supported her in her career. I believe the happiness is very attractive. If my wife was a SAHM, I believe that it would hurt our R (let's ignore for now that she asked for a D and is having a EA/PA to which she will not admit).
So what does this mean for you? Find the middle ground. Do freelance work from home AND stay home with the kids? Go become a teacher? Will give you summers off with your kids but also allow you to teach, which appears to be something that you love.
Not sure if my ramblings are helpful or just creating more confusion.
You guys are seriously the best. And you've each given me something to consider.
The fact that there's maybe no "clear-cut" path for me validates my feelings and concerns a little.
I *do* think that whatever I do, I should embrace it and do it to the best of my ability. That way, I have confidence in me.
I'm just deathly afraid I'll add up to $90K of debt to our lives (by way of school loans ... and I'm still paying my undergrad loans!!) and then decide I'd rather stay home. It'll take me four years to get through law school in the part-time/evening program I would start.
I NEVER would have assumed I'd find peace and happiness in being a SAHM. But here I am.
I'll talk to H a little more about it, too. I guess another issue is that I feel every time I talk to him about it (and we have opened up our lines of communication quite a bit, though it still takes me asking questions to get him to talk sometimes), I feel this particular subject is so intertwined with our past (I'm making this decision based on his history) that maybe he feels like I'm constantly reminding him of our past.
I dunno. Kinda confusing.
I heart all y'all. You provide the best support - and ask the best questions - in the world. You really have my brain thinking.
Train,
I'll talk to H a little more about it, too. I guess another issue is that I feel every time I talk to him about it (and we have opened up our lines of communication quite a bit, though it still takes me asking questions to get him to talk sometimes), I feel this particular subject is so intertwined with our past (I'm making this decision based on his history) that maybe he feels like I'm constantly reminding him of our past.
Put all of it on the table. Be true and authentic to yourself when discussing this topic...especially your inner peacefulness being a SAHM. It is very important to stay true to yourself. Maybe you don't need to go to a law school. There might be other ways to balance yourself by engaging in volunteer work that fills up your soul.
I have family members who volunteer at the food bank, pet charities, and the like that fulfills their sense of service to others.
This post, Wonka, is really helping me turn my thinking "inward."
And you know what just kinda "snapped" up in my noggin?
Part (A majority?) of this struggle may really be less about my H ... and more about ME.
*I* am the one who let myself go as a SAHM, which caused a huge hit in the confidence-department. I have power over that. I can choose not to let myself go. I can choose to keep myself healthy and fit. And H and I *are* going on dates now, and that gives me chances to pretty myself up a little and spend some time with him. I can choose to get out in the sunshine a little with my kids instead of staying all cooped up. There ARE plenty of volunteer opportunities out there. In fact, S8 and I will be volunteering for the homeless shelter as part of our "Christmas Around the World" studies in November and December.
I mean, I still freak out a little at the prospect of H leaving us high-and-dry again, with me having no income.
BUT, as long as we are actively working on ourselves and our M - and I'm keeping my finger on the pulse of our M - I shouldn't have to have that fear so prevalent in my mind anymore.
And, there ARE ways I can make money if I want to *right now*. They're all just so "domestic" feeling, which leaves sort of a "busting-balls" void in my life.
I've thought about freelancing again - and even recently had the opportunity to do so - but I feel that chapter of my life is over. I'm not sure I would enjoy it anymore.
I'll keep perusing part-time/at-home jobs that may give me my fix in that regard. I can even take the LSAT later this year just to see how I do. It doesn't mean I'm committing to anything. And I'll talk to H, too, and really strive to put it all out there. (But I'll probably wait a little while; the poor fella was diagnosed with a small hernia just yesterday, so we've got some bigger-than-small things on the ol' plate right now. Yikes.)
Thank you, as always, Wonka. <3
Just a note:
I went to court today with my sister to be a witness in her uncontested D. Husband number 2. I was basically just there to say, "Yes, Your Honor, they've been separated a year. No, sir. There's no hope for reconciliation here."
I sat there and watched as couples sat together, angry or disinterested. One couple in particular had a lawyer sitting between them. I later overheard the H say: "there's nothing happy about this situation." And the W scoffed and said: "We never should have gotten married. We knew it wasn't right. I was outside the church doors and said, 'I don't want to go through with this.' But he said, 'Well, we have to. We've already filled out the paperwork'."
A judge asked a couple questions and signed the divorce decree. It took 15 minutes.
15 minutes?!?
15 MINUTES!!!!Guys, I can't tell y'all how surreal it was for me to sit there and watch that. Sad. Marriages broken. Families destroyed. Just like that.
It made me appreciate these boards, and all you people, that much more. I mean, even if the Ms here don't work out in the end, the fact that there are people out there like you guys who are willing to fight so hard, and for so long, for Ms and families is really quite awe-inspiring and inspirational.
Just wanted to let you know I thought of you all today, and my hat's off to ALL of us here.
But now that I have you on the hook, I want opinions (I know, I know, you're all likely thinking:
Here's ol' Train and one of her "questions" again); lol:
What, to you, does forgiveness look like? What does it mean? Is it a verb/an action? Is it FEELING the pain of an A, for example ... but never mentioning it again? Never holding it over the XWAS's head? Does it mean never bringing up bad things someone has done to us, even if those things still cause us to hurt?
I know forgiveness is mostly for the person who *offers* it. But what
is forgiveness, really?
I can only answer for myself, Train.
To me, forgiveness is realizing that as "black-and-white" as I saw my wife's transgression against me as being, I have my own shortcomings . . . they are just in OTHER areas. That doesn't make me any better . . . or any worse.
It's the whole "all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" thing.
So to me, forgiveness in my marriage means walking humbly in constant awareness that Starsky ain't all that either.
So that's part of it.
The other part is this TOTALLY humbling realization of, "If GOD HIMSELF -- THE CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE -- didn't give up on my marriage . . . who the frick was *I* to? I saw things -- and still do! -- that show He is fighting for my family, so I just kinda figure "Who am I to do any less?"
But to answer your question, I do think it's a DECISION . . . or even an OBEDIENCE (to God) thing. The feelings will then follow, in time -- at least they did for me.
Starsky
I found this to be the most helpful article on forgiveness that I've ever read --
Forgiveness is a Gift You Give Yourself
By Michele Weiner-Davis
Are you someone who walks around feeling angry with your spouse or loved one much of the time? Do you have a little inner voice that constantly reminds you of all of his or her wrongdoings? Have you become expert at remembering all the minute details of past injustices just so that you can keep score? If this describes you at all, you better read what I'm about to say and take it to heart.
Lack of forgiveness imprisons you. It takes its toll on your physical and emotional health. It keeps you stuck in the deepest of relationship ruts. No matter how justified you feel about your point of view regarding your partner's insensitive behavior, you still are miserable. When you wake up each morning, a gray tint shadows your life. You walk around with a low-grade depression. You can't feel joy because you're too busy being angry or feeling disappointed.
In the face of these fairly obvious disadvantages, you hang on to your belief that, since you feel let down, you must not "give in." To you, giving in means forgiving, letting go, making peace. To do so, would be tantamount to giving up your soul. So, you keep your distance. You interact in perfunctory ways, never allowing your partner to step over the emotional line you've drawn. And though the distance often feels intolerable, forgiveness is not on your short list of solutions to your dilemma.
I have worked with so many couples who say they want to heal their relationships. And yet, when they're offered the tools, they can't seem to move forward. These are the couples who, instead of finding effective ways to get beyond blame, continue to repeat their mantra, "Our problems are your fault and you must pay." As long as they maintain this mindset, they are doomed to failure. How very sad. Even sadder are their children who, on a day-by-day basis observe their parents being "right" but "miserable." What lessons are they learning about love?
If any of this strikes a chord with you (and you wouldn't be reading this if it didn't), you need to internalize that forgiveness is a gift you give yourself. Letting go of resentment can set you free. It can bring more love and happiness into your life. It opens the door to intimacy and connection. It makes you feel whole. Forgiving others takes strength, particularly when you feel wronged, but the fortitude required to forgive pales in comparison to the energy necessary to maintain a sizable grudge. The person most hurt by holding out or blaming is YOU, no matter what the circumstances.
"All this sounds good," you tell yourself, "but how can I ever forget what my partner did to me?" Good question. You don't! Forgiveness is not the same as forgetting. You will probably always remember the particular injustice(s) that drove you into your corner. But what will happen is that when you forgive, the intense emotions associated with the event(s) begin to fade. You will feel happier, lighter, more loving. And these renewed positive feelings won't go unnoticed. Others will be drawn to you.
Just keep in mind that forgiveness isn't a feeling. It is a decision. You decide that you are going to start tomorrow with a clean slate. Even if it isn't easy, you make the determination that the alternative is even harder, and that you are going to do what you must to begin creating a more positive future.
So promise yourself, that no matter what the reason, you will not go another day blaming your partner and feeling lonely. Make peace. Make up. Make love. I promise you that the benefits of deciding to forgive go far beyond anything you can picture in your mind's eye at the moment. Your decision to forgive will create a ripple effect of exponential changes in your life.
Train, for me forgiveness is a decision. It is bring joy and love into your heart and moving forward. As Starsky said, we all make mistakes. While we may look at someone who has an A as making the biggest mistake of his or her life, in reality, they may see things that we did to be just as bad. I am not saying that they are and that we are not to blame when someone has an A, but none of us our perfect.
I also think life is too short and we all need to forgive and move on. Holding on to grudges is dangerous for your help and soul.
I think in the case of the Ds that you witnessed, I am not sure whether or not a lack of forgiveness was the root cause. I see it as one or both spouses just not deciding to work at marriage. I believe that any M can be awesome through W. But not if one spouse does not want to be married.
I feel good/better when I bring God's love into my heart and view the world with that lens. I pray that my W makes the decision to work on our M. That is all that I can do. But I already have forgiven her. I just cannot go through life holding onto a grudge.
train, I just wanted to say I just re read all your threads and you are amazing, some of your story seems so similar to mine and I'm trying to see how you got to where you and your h are now. my h seems so entrenched with the ow, that I can't see sometimes that it will ever end, but then I see how your sitch changed so dramatically so quickly, perhaps if you have time could you have a look at my sitch and see what think. Thank you
Thank you guys so much for chiming in with your own experiences and thoughts.
Really loved this, Starsky:
To me, forgiveness is realizing that as "black-and-white" as I saw my wife's transgression against me as being, I have my own shortcomings . . . they are just in OTHER areas. That doesn't make me any better . . . or any worse. I've always been the type of person who looks at MY role in a disagreement/relationship breakdown before looking at the other person's contributions. Granting forgiveness has, then, always been pretty easy for me. In fact, sometimes, I've been accused of giving it too freely. I just don't want to hold grudges. What's the point of living with that kind of anger? At the same time, being "too" forgiving, I guess, could suggest other issues, like conflict-avoidant stuff ... or codependency.
I just brought the question up because it's something about which I had a discussion with a friend this week. She asked if I had forgiven H. And I had to say, "I don't know." I don't even know what it looks like to forgive ... or to NOT forgive someone ... I guess.
I've identified what/where I screwed up. I continue to work on myself and my responses/reactions. I'm not shoving what happened down H's throat; in fact, on the rare occasions we talk about it, the conversations are very civil and quite productive, with both of us sharing turns to speak ... and neither getting frustrated to the point of shutting down or playing a blame game.
I'm having trouble moving forward with his family, which is likely going to cause some awkwardness and friction. H and I had a chat earlier this week about that. My teenage girls don't want to visit them, 8 hours away, when the rest of the family is going. And I confided in my H that I will feel very awkward being there, but obviously I'd still go.
His parents and I had a little falling-out just before I discovered how in-depth H's PA had become. His dad, on a phone conversation with me (while MIL was listening in on another line), was trying to help and point-out the different roles H and I both had played in the breakdown of our M. He essentially told me I placed my kids as a priority over H. (Which is true.) He mentioned that H and I weren't sleeping together. (Which is true.) And then went a little further and said, "When a farmer's field dries up, the farmer moves to a different field." THEN, he started talking about how attractive of a woman I am, going on and on about one of my bridal pictures. And then followed that up with: "But, you know, you have a tendency to let yourself go. You wear sweatpants and t-shirts, and, frankly, that makes you unattractive." I bit my tongue. And then, after finding H's texts with OW, flew way off the handle with his parents, asking why - if a farmer notices his field is drying up - he wouldn't think to water his own d@mn field before buying a different one. I asked if they thought my SAHM pony-tailed hair and my make-up (or lack thereof) meant I deserved my H sending a text to his new love interest, asking if she'd like him to "f--- the sh!t out of her in Train's bed."
Their feelings were hurt because it's the first time they've ever seen "that" side of Train. But I had a lot of left-over resentment from 2005/06, when they not only abandoned ME when H left, but also my unborn son ... and then they moved back into our lives, nary a word said, when H and I reconciled back then.
This time, they tried to remain present in my life, and the kids' lives, mainly through e-mail because they live several hours away. But when they visited for a weekend - supposedly to see with their own eyes that everyone was okay (and a special emphasis on my teenage DDs) - they really didn't hang much with us. They (and H) took the little kids for a day. Said "hello," essentially, to the big girls and me, and that was about it.
I found out later that MIL was trying to help H outfit his apartment. I guess it seems they really just rallied behind him. And when H came home, he told me he was flabbergasted that his parents would tell him that they support him no matter what.
I understand it, don't get me wrong. But I don't think I could use the word "support" if I were the parent of a child who had walked away from his M and family - twice. I will LOVE my kids unconditionally. But support them "no matter what"? Nope. Don't think so. I don't support them when they make a C in a class in which they've made As and Bs all year; I certainly wouldn't support them creating a family and walking away from it for grass they think is greener. I would love them no matter what. But I wouldn't support them no matter what. And I doubt I'd help them outfit their new apartments.
Since H and I have been piecing, I haven't heard from his parents except for once, I think, when his mom called about birthday-gift ideas and just said, "You're somethin' else, Train, to take him back after all that." They call H every Sunday, but they don't speak to the kids or to me. I *did* apologize to his parents, shortly after I flew off the handle. I asked them to TRY to understand my position: I felt my appearance and my relationship with my kids was being blamed for H cheating. At that point, I was looking for ANY help from any of them since H has no family around here. (It's before I re-joined the boards.) Fact is: our families just operate so incredibly differently.
H got upset during our convo about it the other night; he *seemed* more upset about the fact that his family has hurt DDs and me - again. And he said he blames himself "because they act this way due to the trash I talked about you when I was doing what I was doing." He said he would "handle" it, but I actually asked him not to. I told him I wasn't asking for him to jump in and fix anything. I was just picking his brain about how, or if, *I* should handle anything with them to make our FAMILY transition a little more smooth, especially when DD16&17 want little or nothing to do with his family now. (It was hard enough watching them struggle to accept H back into the fold; they're still working hard on it.)
So, wow. I just vented way off in left field, didn't I?
All that to say: assuming I'm understanding the concept of forgiveness, I feel I am working toward forgiving H (though it's MUCH harder this time, with it being the second time he has betrayed me). I'm not sure why I'm having a more difficult time forgiving his parents. Maybe because we haven't put any "work" into repairing our relationship. And, to be frank, we probably won't.
Add all that together - and stick it in the same week as I'm sitting in a courtroom, watching families be destroyed - and it's just been a pretty emotionally-draining week.
I'll just never be able to resolve in my mind how things as precious as families can be destroyed so quickly. But *I* need to figure out what forgiveness is ... and work on forgiving people. Including myself.
watto, I'll take a look on your thread, for sure! I don't post much (unless I feel I have something worthwhile to add). But I'll keep an eye out!
Thanks again, y'all!
Train, as you know, I almost NEVER do this, but all I can say right now is:
(((((hug)))))
Starsky
Thank you, Starsky.
Sometimes that's all I really need.
Typical woman. God, you're all so easy.
j/k. Men are easy too! "Feed us and sex us," as Dr. Laura would say. Women? Hear them (REALLY hear them), hug them and give them chocolate.
Starsky
And wine. Don't forget the wine, Starsky. I'd take it over chocolate ANY day!
But that whole sex thing about men? Can I give you an "amen"? I mean, is it REALLY gonna stay THAT easy?!? Lol.
And wine. Don't forget the wine, Starsky. I'd take it over chocolate ANY day!
NOW yer' talkin' my language!!! So is that the feminine side of me or something?
Give me a nice, complex cab or a good spicy Shiraz. Mmmmmm . . . LOVE the grape.
I'm a dry white person myself. I like to pucker.
Hey, will you do me a favor? Our friend, Sam, is at a little crossroads, I think. I haven't responded to some questions she just posted. But she's got some doozies. I'd feel more comfortable tag-teaming this one.
But that whole sex thing about men? Can I give you an "amen"? I mean, is it REALLY gonna stay THAT easy?!? Lol.
For the most part. We really are simple creatures. But I would throw in "words of affirmation." This is very high on many of our LLs lists. I counsel my daughters to look for sincere ways to praise their husbands, especially in front of others, and especially about their COMPETENCE. Too many women neglect this, IMHO, and when they do hand out a compliment -- like most of us erroneously do with LLs, where we "give what we want to get" -- it's about their man's LOOKS (or body). Instead, tell him that you notice
what he's good at.When the fetching Mrs. Starsky would say, after one of our son's youth baseball games where I was the manager, "You're a really good coach, you know that?"
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh . . . .
Ooooo. GREAT tip!
H and I took the LL quiz back in 2006. You could likely guess that he scored highest on Physical Touch and WOA. You can also imagine, then, how we ended up back "here" this year. I withheld sex (I didn't want to be with him) because he wasn't meeting MY needs. (How ridiculous and stubborn, looking back, that *I* was the one with all the "tools" to get our R back on track but was too self-absorbed to use them!)
Anyway, I actually greatly appreciate the tip on complimenting him - especially publicly - about his competence. That's great stuff!!
It is SO outside my comfort zone to praise people. When someone praises me, it makes me want to crawl in a hole. It's just not my thing. And it's been super-hard for me to provide it to others. I've always said: When I praise someone, I'm afraid they then feel they have to live up to some expectation that I have of them instead of living for themselves. What's it matter if *I* am proud of you when all that matters is if you're proud of *yourself*?!
It was my brother who pointed out to me that people think differently. And he NEEDS to hear "I'm proud of you" from the people he respects most in life.
So I've tried to do better. But outward praise is sometimes still kinda forced from me. And I don't know WHY. It's easy for a friend. Why not for my family members?
Train- hate to hijack. I need your wisdom. Can you please stop by my thread & catch up on the latest. Thanks!
I gotchuuuuu, girl.
Okay, troops. I need some guidance. I'm hoping to punt this out before the weekend gets here because I know the boards will slow down a little.
Things are going pretty good here. I don't want to say we've lost any momentum. But for some reason (maybe it's just a phase?), I'm in a rut.
Doubts. Intense, dark, overwhelming doubts. That's what's wrong.
I have the "TimeHop" app. Yesterday, there was a picture that popped up from exactly one year ago. It was of H and his new tattoo, which he got last year to represent my D17 (his step-daughter). (He has each of our kids represented by a tattoo on his arm.) Everything was FINE at the time I pulled up the picture; in fact, H and I had just returned from a date. (It was by no means our best date; actually our worst since getting back together, but it wasn't for the company. The date-spot blew balls). So we get back home, I look at my TimeHop pictures before the day (and thus pictures) changed, I noticed the picture and the month it was taken (last September, obviously) and WAM! I hit rock-bottom. I showed H the picture and said, "See? This is where I get confused. Were you miserable in our M in this picture? D3 and I stopped by the tattoo place while you were getting your tattoo - I remember it vividly - we all were happy and hanging out. Were you miserable here? Because you went out, three months after this photo, and actively asked another woman for her phone number at a grocery store."
H said: "No. I don't think I was miserable there."
And I said: "So then, I'm hearing you say you were miserable in our M for less than three months and then actively went out looking for another woman. Is that right?"
He gets all confused and stutter-y ... and then he tried to start reassuring me: "It's not going to happen again, Train. I've changed."
And then, in my mind, I kinda lose it. Changed? Really? It hasn't been even five months since he came home. *Changed*?
What gets me EVERY TIME, y'all, is that this happened to me twice in eight years. I.cannot.get.over.it. I've told H that the A itself isn't my obstacle; it's my own doubts because he has put me through this hel! twice.
Am I expecting too much of myself too soon? Am I expecting too much from him? The impossible? Should I even be having those conversations with him? Showing him pictures and asking how he might have been feeling at that time? Am I looking for too much information? Answers I'll never get? Or at least answers that will never satisfy me? Or have I hit a fork in the road here?
I mean, I still know I can keep my side of the street clean and continue to try piecing our relationship back together. We are still working very hard. But will this doubt EVER begin to lift? It's standing in my way. It is starting to impact my outlook and my mood when we are alone together. It feels so heavy and burdensome.
How do I start letting go of that? And how can I shove it in the back of my brain long enough to try to interact with H in a more forgiving, forward-looking, solution-focused way? If I can't drop this doubt, I'm going to end up pushing H away. And - if I'm being honest - when I'm in the throes of my REALLY doubtful times, there are moments when I don't care if I do. I know that's not me and that's not what I want. But I'm living each day right now, actually assuming in the back of my head that H will do this to me again, even if I'm trying to do everything right. It makes me sad. And mad.
I miss the comfort of security and the feeling of carefree happiness - of being wildly in love with my H, knowing he's my life partner and best friend. And I don't know that I will ever have that with him again. It feels so unfair. Like I've been robbed.
Train, I have those same feelings when I look back at pictures or mementos from trips, vacations, school functions. Times when I thought we had so much fun together and we seemed so happy. Were they really conflicted inside and just putting on a show?
I know this is going to come across as a little leaguer giving a professional tips since you're a lot further along than I am, but the one word that I kept thinking of the whole time I read that post was- TIME.
I can only imagine that over time, those feelings you described will eventually be replaced with comfort and security.
Thank you so much, Tar.
You're right, of course.
But it's what I *do* in that time that has me worried. Know what I mean?
I could easily push him away with my pestering doubts and moments of anger.
Ugh!!!
(PS When I say anger, I don't mean angry outbursts. I usually just start crying my brains out. Which is so out of character for me. And it freaks H out.)
I think in the example above, your H handled your actions as best as he could- by attempting to reassure you. He could have easily gotten offensive or shut down on you. If you are both in this R as a team, he needs to understand that you are going to have these feelings/flashbacks and help you through them.
You're allowed to have anger/sadness over H's past actions. It's good to get it out now so the two of you can move forward.
I'm wishing you the best and thanks for all your input on my thread!
It's my pleasure to pitch in on your thread, Tar. Thank YOU.
I think it's sort of a tightrope walk at this stage. I know I need to be honest with H and to tell him what I need. But I don't want to give myself permission to just unload on him all the time, realizing that maybe he "deserves" it. I need him to comfort and reassure me. But I don't want to be a victim, either. More importantly, I don't want to give myself permission to feel like one.
Seems to be a fine line between being open and honest and asking for what I need and then maybe showing TOO much of my pain and confusion.
And I said: "So then, I'm hearing you say you were miserable in our M for less than three months and then actively went out looking for another woman. Is that right?"
This cross-examination was not cool, Train.
You know I'm not speaking from personal experience here, but I've worked through a lot of "Given x, how could I ever..." situations just to try to figure out where I would stand on a lot of issues. (I don't like catching myself off guard!)
I think the security and trust will come from addressing the root causes to the demise of your R. If you have openly and honestly and exhaustively gone through the issues you each had, and if you see them regularly being addressed, then you regain that sense that you are
caring for each other. And I don't mean that you kinda think the issues are addressed, but you explicitly see that he's not pushing the wrong buttons, and he is pushing the right ones, and that couldn't happen randomly by accident, so he must be consciously making the effort.
And again, it's the root causes that you're watching, not the crap that happened during the A - that's all mindless fluff.
Remember the whole consistent changes over time thing? It doesn't just apply to the LBS getting the WS back; it applies to the WS getting the trust of the LBS back.
Help any?
Yep. It does, zew. A whole bunch. Thank you.
And you're saying exactly something else I've been thinking: get OUT of the A and my feelings of being betrayed. And stay IN the problems that got us there.
It is THE hardest thing I've ever had to do.
And the doubts I'm feeling constantly nag at me and make me second-guess everything.
I've managed to maintain most every change and wake up every day, determined to meet H's needs. And he's meeting mine.
At some point, I gotta cut my tethers loose and just decide to fly with faith.
And you're saying exactly something else I've been thinking: get OUT of the A and my feelings of being betrayed. And stay IN the problems that got us there.
EXACTLY what my W thinks my focus is and will always be should we R...
Train,
I'm sorry I can't offer you much good advice here, as I'm reeling a bit today myself. But no, I don't think what you're feeling is unusual or should alarm you or anything. Is it that . . . your marriage suddenly feels very . . . tenuous? Like "Oh my, if you weren't in a bad place then, then how -- just 3 months later -- could you come and crash my world down??!" THAT sort of thing?
I also get the heebie-jeebies about how thin the line is between joy and despair. All I can tell you is to trust in your process, and keep working it. Marriages are like debt and compound interest -- they can build or they can spiral, depending on which way you work 'em. NOTHING is permanent! (which is both good and bad).
But I'm not making sense today I'm afraid. How about . . . (((((hugs)))))
Starsky
EXACTLY what my W thinks my focus is and will always be should we R...And (sigh), to her credit, it's really hard to keep the focus OFF of it. (Obviously.)
Is it that . . . your marriage suddenly feels very . . . tenuous? Like "Oh my, if you weren't in a bad place then, then how -- just 3 months later -- could you come and crash my world down??!" THAT sort of thing?Does it tell you anything that when I read this part of your post, Starsky, I started crying? Yes, yes. That's EXACTLY it.
I know it may not seem like it, but I felt - in that moment - that I *was* trying to get to the root of one of our pre-A issues. I didn't feel I was trying to punish him. However, I was, looking back, off the mark. Or maybe it's the way I handled it. I need to learn to STFU, but then I feel like I'm becoming a robot, denying myself my feelings ... or rug-sweeping ... and constantly trying to figure out the next thing to say in a validating way. I'm tired of feeling like a robot. I'm tired of having to suck-up my feelings. I'm tired of walking on eggshells and watching everything I say.
I wanted to be able to think back to the time period ... and for him to give me something - ANYTHING - that was going wrong in our M at that time while I was clearly out in LaLa Land thinking everything was okay (not blissfully happy, but at least okay). I thought that might give me an indication of something - ANYTHING - for me to know this time around. I mean, I feel now the same way I felt then. He's acting now, for the most part, just like he was acting then, as far as seeming content.
So, yes, you hit the nail on the head. As always.
I'm reeling a bit today myself.You? Reeling? Are you trying to tell me - after all this time - that you're actually human?
Seriously, Starsky, you alright, man?
How about . . . (((((hugs)))))(((((Hugs))))) right back to you, brother.
I'm OK. Just found out that the apple of my eye -- my precious little 4 year old granddaughter, who's lived either WITH us or right NEAR us ever since she was born -- is moving with my daughter and her husband 1,000 miles away in a couple of months. Navy deployment. My wife doesn't even know yet; it's going to KILL her. She's like a 2nd mother to her.
Oh no!!!!! It makes me so sad to hear that, Starsky. I don't know first-hand yet, but from what I know based on what so many others say about their feelings for their grandchildren, this MUST be breaking your heart.
Are you going to be the one to tell your wife? I'm sure she will be devastated.
I am so sorry.
Yes, when I get home. It's going to be gut-wrenching. She knows it's a possibility, but we'd been praying so hard about it and holding out hope. With everything going on with her dad's health (we recently moved her 92/93 year old parents in with us, and her dad has some worsening dementia and other issues) our little munchkin has been the one constant source of joy.
This "Pa" is just heartbroken today.
Sorry for the hijack. I've known since last Friday and haven't been able to say anything yet, as my daughter was waiting for some final details and I didn't want my other daughter's baby shower to be spoiled last Sunday. We do have the birth of that granddaughter -- due Sept. 30th -- to look forward to. But the whole family is so close, and my pregnant daughter is going to just bawl like a baby when she finds out her little niece is moving 1,000 miles away.
No apologies, mister. This isn't a hijack in the least!
Your family sounds so close that *any* distance is too far. But 1,000 miles is a huge move. I bet your granddaughter isn't going to take the news well, either. My daughters and I lived with or near my parents the first four/five years of their lives. So I know EXACTLY what you mean when you say your wife is like a second mom to your granddaughter. And I'm betting you're like a second dad. Those bonds are intense and amazing. And I could see my (now grown) kids moving away from ME before moving away from my mom.
Dang, Starsky. Another sh!t sandwich!
I'll think of you - and say a prayer for you and your family - tonight. I know you're right: breaking the news won't be easy.
Thanks, Train. Actually I'm more like a FIRST dad, since her biological dad is barely in her life and my daughter's new husband has only been around a year and a half or so. The first 3 years of her life, I basically was the father figure in her life.
Yep. Exactly how my dad was with the girls. Their dad was absent, too.
So that makes it even HARDER on you and your granddaughter.
In what state will they be stationed?
Great Lakes, in north Chicago.
Train, there's a new poster in newcomers named Bitzie who could use your unique expertise. Thanks!
Train,
What you are really raging against here is the loss of "innocence" and the fact that your M is forever altered by your H's affair. I get that totally. We cannot ever recapture that innocence. And that stinks!!!!
As for you asking H about his affair(s), I think it is within your right to do so as you are not yet fully confident and secure. Perfectly understandable.
I'd suggest that you print off some articles from DearPeggy.com for the wayward spouse to read so your H can understand why you have those moments and feelings. I think H can stand reading these short articles. This isn't War & Peace, y'know.
Chin up, honey!
Got it handled, Maybell! Thanks for the heads up!
Wonka, thank you so much for the validation. And yes. I think the loss of innocence is absolutely at the root of a lot of it. That and questioning if this is just a character flaw in H that pops up every eight years even though between those years he is largely amazing and loving and attentive.
It's so funny you mentioned Dear Peggy, because that's exactly where I turned yesterday evening. I had read a lot there during our S (thanks to your recommendation), but it was the perfect place that I had forgotten to go to read about the piecing stage. It helped put my mind at ease a lot. And I think you're right: H can read short paragraphs and (I believe) would really welcome that right now! He's being so patient and understanding and keeps saying, "I am willing to deal with the consequences of what I've done for as long as it takes you to trust me again." He walks on eggshells, too, but he's doing it because he's afraid he's going to trip my trigger or make me so mad that I leave. But I told him the other day it isn't healthy for either of us to walk on eggshells; OTOH, it's GOOD to stop and think about what we are going to say before we say it. That's a habit we can both develop and be better for it.
I rebounded a bit last night. H needed to go to the place he works to work on his car. I hadn't gone to a "garage date night" in a while, so I offered to go along. He lit up like a light bulb, smiling ear to ear. So I went and helped him out in ways I could. At one point, I mentioned that something he had said the other day in one of our conversations really resonated with me. Just hearing that made him perk up. That's because it's well known that I'm the one who reasons more and has "all the answers" around here; he's more spontaneous and adventurous and knee-jerky about things (and he lacks some social common sense - lol). He, unfortunately, feels very "inferior" to me, intellectually, which has sometimes presented a challenge in our relationship; he feels like he can't "measure up" to me and/or my interests, like religion and politics. (His insecurities are absolutely not my doing, just for the record; I ALWAYS tell him that he complements me beautifully and that he's the person who keeps my feet on the ground and reminds me to chill-out and have a little fun instead of keeping my panties in a wad all the time.) So anyway, I told him what he had said that caused me to really stew on some things in my life, like which direction I want my life to go (specifically, work vs. staying at home). And I said, "You were absolutely right." I'm not sure I've ever told him that something he said had caused me to think ... and that what he had to say was really powerful and valuable. I could tell it made him feel really proud of himself. And it took practically zero effort on my part to do it; I was just speaking the truth.
We left his work, and he said, "Thank you, Train, so much for going with me tonight. That was fun, and you helped me out a whole lot."
I actually just stood there and worked an air-gun to blow off all the shavings from his metal screw holes as he drilled. Lol. But, hey, if that's "helping a whole lot," then I'm happy to help!
So for future reference, I really need to remember that I can post here for help, too, even though I'm in piecing. I think it helps me find my center. Puts my head back in the game ... or at least keeps it screwed on a little straighter.
For that, I thank all of you.
Now Starsky, if you're still reading way down here, I've been thinking of you for 24 hours straight. How did yesterday go? How's your W handling the news of the move?
Train,
Isn't your H a QT person? I can see how his love tank can be filled up that way with "garage dates"... etc.
Starsky...how are you holding up with the "talk" to your W about your GD?
He's actually PT and WOA. Recently, though, I've heard him mention that he's starting to feel lonely when he works at night (he's usually the only one there). He said he has started to really miss the family while he's there. He said the other day he has found he is more productive when someone is there with him - it lifts his spirits and keeps him awake and motivated to have folks around. (He's definitely an extrovert.) So I need to make sure I am remembering this and staying on top of it.
The bonus: it gets me out of the house! I could even take a book or something to do so I'm not so bored.
I swear by the time I leave those shops, you could eat off the floor. I sweep and sweep and sweep ... just to have something to do!
Train,
Isn't your H a QT person? I can see how his love tank can be filled up that way with "garage dates"... etc.
Starsky...how are you holding up with the "talk" to your W about your GD?
It ended up being late this afternoon. Hurting REAL bad here ladies, no hiding it. She can't stop sobbing and neither can I. Empty the dishwasher and I see her little Dora forks and spoons in the drawer. Go upstairs and I see her toys. I ache.
Starsky,
My heart is breaking WITH yours. Haven't stopped thinking of y'all.
I'm just so sorry. I have no words.
Starsky I am so sorry you and W are hurting. My ex husband and I moved to NC from (right outside of) Chicago and it was REALLY hard for my grandma. She missed my oldest son so much she ended up coming to visit for what was supposed to be a week and turned into 2 months
Important disclaimer: Starsky, before you (and your formerly-pleasing-sorta-codependent-self) try to use the word "hijack" right now while this topic is being discussed, and people are commenting to you on this thread, I just want you to know that if you say such a thing, I will hunt you down and beat you.
Accept that you have changed the lives of countless strangers for the better. And accept they want to do the very least they (we) can in return, and that is to let you know we hold you in our thoughts while you are hurting.
Now, everyone can carry on ...
I am so sorry to hear you and your wife are hurting so much, Starsky. Big hugs to you both.
Train,
I haven't been piecing as long as you have but your post I could have typed myself. I feel these internal demons of will it happe again and if it happened after only a short time of unhappiness will we both let it get to that point again? And if you couldn't tell me there was anything THAT wrong before will you tell me if it happens again? Ugh! Sorry not trying to rub salt in the wound but I just want you to know I feel the struggle with you.
For me lately it has been H's lack of pursuing me as much as he did in the beginning. We are both super busy and he recently changed jobs so he's settling in but I wonder okay what's going on what's changed?
And starsky so sorry to hear!
Hey, T0! I was so happy to hear from you!!
Didn't I tell ya piecing would be harder than re-attracting?? Whew lawdy! We are on a wild ride, sista!!
As Starsky said, all we can do is keep working the process.
I make sure I'm consistently telling H what I need. I'm learning to do that in a non-bratty, non-whining way. Lol.
We are in the same boat as far as everything being chaotic and so our time spent together these days isn't what it was when H first came home. We still insist on one date-night per week. Otherwise, H is still working to pull us out of the financial hole that was created when he was paying for two households ... and then stopped, making it impossible for me to pay two months of mortgage payments.
So I guess in some ways we are still paying for what happened ... in a couple different ways.
But we are both "working the process" and changing the way we communicate and enjoying one another during the times we can spend together. So onward we go!
Here's hoping the same for you and your H.
You know I'm a fan.
Train, your posts inspire me. Many of us need to see and hear about the success stories. Keep up the great work.
I am so glad, sho!
And thank you so much!
Lord, have mercy.
Like, seriously. I wish He would.
I feel like a stranger here all a sudden ... and like a lifetime has happened during my hiatus.
Good news: H and I are still doing well. But in the past two weeks, we have been literally bombarded with challenges that almost make our marital problems seem like small potatoes. Which tells ME that this is the time I should REALLY pay attention to *us*. Usually, with the back-to-back blows we've been delivered the past couple weeks, I would lose my crap and stay so focused on myself and my problems ... and would expect H - who either isn't in touch with his feelings or doesn't share them - to practically cater to me and take loads off my plate.
Not now. This is when I can really practice my personal changes.
Two weeks ago - which now seems like an eternity - H and I were on a date. We had a great time and were headed home to the kids. We were on the interstate, stopped behind another stopped vehicle because of wrecks in both directions. Before we knew it, we were hit from behind - with that person going about 65 mph, no brakes - and that catapulted us into the car ahead. My SUV was demolished, a total loss. Thank God, H and I both walked away, largely unharmed. Just whiplash and a few knots/bruises/scratches for me and a bruised rib (seatbelt) for H.
Three days after that - and amid wrangling, inwardly AND outwardly, with my own emotions and demons (primarily because my dad died in a tragic wreck about 8 years ago) ... and wrangling with insurance companies and bouncing around doctors and chiropractors - H had to have emergency surgery for a hernia. The same day, he had sent his mom a really hateful email about how she and FIL have not contacted me, personally, to find out how I've been feeling and handling things since the wreck. They only communicate with him these days. H later showed me the email; I've never seen him be so harsh with ANYONE ... and especially his mother. He adores her. He didn't tell me about the communication until after his surgery when I was about to call MIL to fill her in; he said he didn't tell me he was going to send it because he didn't want me to tell him NOT to send it. She responded back to his e-mail with an e-mail of her own, which was a little hostile and (strangely) addressed primarily to me. So I spent two days working on a response to that, which actually cooled the situation for everyone.
Then one week, almost to the minute, after our wreck, I discovered D18 - my busy, no-time-for-dating, family-loving, typically-traditional, little-feminist daughter - is (I still cringe to hear myself say it:) seven weeks pregnant.
I cannot tell you all what a blow that was and is. I have been all over the place. I'm seething. I'm sad. I have so many feelings swirling around mainly because she has walked WITH me as I've walked that road; I had *her* when I was 19. I can't even talk (or type) anymore about it right now; I'm just so exhausted with it all. She's an adult now. This is her life, her path, her responsibility. I love my children unconditionally. But I don't have to support their choices unconditionally.
Now that I am finally starting to settle down about it (by focusing on what's *mine* to do and what's NOT mine to do), I'm starting to utilize the same tools I learned during H's A (and since he's been home) in dealing with D18 ... and in passing along "tools" and words of wisdom about how she deals with her child's father, who is 19, doesn't have a job, and is now asking her to abort (D18 refuses). I've never met him; he has never come around here even though D18 has begged him to, even before finding out she's pregnant. He's bailing on her and this child. And I am sad. I am frustrated at BOTH D18 *and* her "baby daddy." No matter what he decides, my DD has just guaranteed a long, hard road ahead for herself and her child.
I feel catapulted back to the days when I first found out H was having an A: I'm a ball of stress and not eating well. I've been up 'til the wee-hours of the morning, talking with D18.
H and I haven't been able to really connect except to talk about each blow as it happens ... and any of the "only-the-facts-ma'am" that surround each blow on a daily basis. There are insurance settlements, doctor's appointments, decisions on a vehicle, my emotions because this has brought up a bunch of crap I never faced after my dad died, decisions on how to handle baby-daddy, decisions on how to best support D18 while not interfering or coddling, etc. etc. etc. H is saying he's miserable at work right now, and I have to believe he has A LOT on his mind that he's not sharing. Maybe he feels he doesn't have the space to share because I'm running around like a chicken with my head cut off and can't STOP talking.
When he texted today from work and told me that he's - out of the blue - miserable at BOTH his jobs right now, I put the brakes on. Woahhhh, Betty! And I pitched: Hey. You have A LOT on your mind and on your plate right now. You've done so well at supporting me these past two weeks, but I imagine everything must be weighing on you, too, PLUS you're trying to comfort *me*, which means you're dealing with even *more* than I am! Let's hit the town tonight and chat. It's your turn to vent.
So we'll be heading out on a long overdue date-night tonight. I will NOT worry about another accident on the way home. I'm going to shake off all this CRAP for just a little while and re-connect with my H, my partner in this crazy life. That's what I'm focused on: making sure my life-partner and I don't ignore or forget one another during these trying times. That's what's mine to do.
To those who are the praying kind: I could use a prayer or two for my struggling family. It's been a really, really rough year over here. Hugs.
Train, I am sorry how life has turned for you. How is your H doing after the car accident and surgery? Are you doing ok after the accident?
Do you have the support of others to help you in dealing with d18? I can't imagine going through all that you are facing right now. Prayers, yes. But you need others to help you to surround you and support you.
Train, I'm sorry that all of this has happened. Thankfully no one was seriously injured! Getting hit from behind at 65 mph does not usually end so well. Challenges can pull people together if they think and act the right way. It sounds like you are leading your family in that direction. My thoughts and prayers are with you.
OMG Train, so sorry to read all of this. Amazed by your strength and wisdom. Big hugs and prayers to you!
Train, you're in my prayers. And especially your daughter.
Oh my dear sweet tough Train. My heart goes out to you. I am SO glad you are all ok though!!!!
I will write you more later, when I'm on a real keyboard. I've had my own waves lately, and I can empathize. Your response to your husband's needs, and your self-awareness during this horribly challenging time, is so admirable. Those tools -- and your family's love for each other -- WILL see you through this.
"I Will Praise You in This Storm" -- look it up on YouTube. And "Blessings," by Laura Story. And "Higher Ways" by Stephen Curtis Chapman. Those songs have gotten me thru some of my toughest patches.
Lean into it, and ((((hugs))))
Starsky
Train, you and your family are in my thoughts and prayers!
saying a prayer for your family! So glad everyone is ok
thinking of you, train. so, so, so much.
i am inspired and impressed by your turning toward your husband during this chaotic time. what a great opportunity to put into practice all you've hoped to present. you are facing A LOT but your ability to empathize and jump into the puddle with your H and daughter really says volumes about YOU.
All that work is paying off. You're doing it. Seriously. I am so proud and honored to read your story, as hard as it is right now. You're doing everything right even though I KNOW you disagree with me, you really, really are.
Honor yourself. Honor what you've been through and know that it has prepared you for this. All of this.
Sending you strength and light.
Thank you all so much for your kind thoughts and words of support and encouragement.
I'm feeling a little like Humpty Dumpty. Physically, I'm doing okay. But I'm mentally beat to he!l.
H and I were able to go out this weekend and have a fine time, despite the circumstances. We went together (along with D18) last night to baby-daddy's house (after a day-trip to the mountains) to confront him and tell his parents about the pregnancy, after he failed to show up here by a deadline we imposed. I'm just so thankful for H's support and backbone right now.
The drama has definitely begun. But I'm trying to make good decisions in spite of it to help build a solid foundation for my DD. Lord knows I have had enough experience with *that* in my life.
Thank you all, again. Your words truly uplifted me.
And Starsky, I'm going to check out those lyrics.
You all are the best.
Hi Train,
Wow. Been away for a while and I had to catch up; you've had a tough go lately!
First of all, I'm glad that you and your H are ok after the accident. It's horrible and scary, but rest assured that a year from now it will be a distant memory. Just make sure to take no medical shortcuts in getting yourselves back to 100%.
I'm sorry to hear about your D :-(. The saddest part is that the father isn't taking any responsibility. I wish that I had some sage advice, but I have no experience here. I'm sure that after what you and your H have survived together that you will be very supportive of your D and will steer her right.
In regards to your H and his unhappiness at work, I'm glad that with everything else going on that you are taking this seriously. While women tend to feel depression if their relationships aren't going well, most men tend to get depressed when their work isn't satisfying for them. Now that he knows that you will back him in whatever career changes that he may decide to make, you've put yourself on "his side", rather than being another concern that he may have- if that makes any sense. Once his work life is happier, he will be happier in general.
I don't know how you feel about it, but an anti-depressant, for both of you, may help you keep it together with everything that you are going through. I am making NO suggestion that you are weak, far from it, but it IS a stressful time for the both of you, and you are recovering your relationship through it all, too. Your family doctor can prescribe, no need to see a shrink ;-).
I'm very happy to see that you are recovering your life so well! The universe has a way of adding challenge to our lives just when everything seems to be moving along smoothly. I know that you'd like a break, just a solid drama-free year, from life's little plot twists. Then again, that's what makes it interesting....
Warm regards,
-HS
Hey Train,
Thinking of you and your family. I'm sure you will have the strength to pull through whatever you face. Good job on recognizing some of the things you were doing, and making corrections. Sometimes life throws you curve balls, but I know you'll knock them out of the park. Stay strong!
Dev
Train,
Been away for a while and read now that there's a new, fast moving sitch in your family's life. Wow. That takes guts to confront the baby's daddy and his parents. What a great way to start as grandparents.
Glad to see that your H was a rock for you and stood by you with the news of D18 being pregnant. You two have come a long way and I think H is right there beside you for the long haul. One cannot help wonder if how H would have handled it differently if he was still deep into his affair. Shudder!
Not trying to ignore everyone's awesome words of support ... I've read and absorbed and cherished them all ... but I'm not in a good place, y'all.
H is trying to support my "pull-back" approach to pregnant D18 (my one daughter with whom his personality has always kind of clashed). But Baby-Daddy has pulled out and is saying he wants to relinquish his paternal rights, which has been my own personal benchmark for jumping in and helping D18.
Tonight, 24 hours after Baby-Daddy said he's "out," I emptied my soul to H, who balked a little at me providing support to D18.
And my buried, never-talked-about anger and resentment from 2005/06 reared its ugly head. H left ME high-and-dry, pregnant with his son, for another woman. He tried to have his lawyer kick me, our unborn son and my daughters out of our home. How DARE HE insinuate I should withdraw support from my daughter when her child's father has withdrawn support from her?!????
I am so mad I can't see straight right now.
(IF there's good news, I told H that nothing good was going to come from that conversation, and he went immediately to bed. Now I have at least a day to calm myself and approach this differently. But I am so mad I could scream.)
Oh. And I should add: the 17-year-old son of longtime family friends was killed in a car crash Saturday on his way to take the SAT. Planning to drive to his funeral tomorrow, a couple hours away, so I likely won't be on the boards ... again ... for a couple days.
I swear, when it rains, it really does pour.
I think I am officially broken.
Wow Train, my heart bleeds for you. I have followed your thread but never posted. You are a strong woman with strong conviction.when it rains it does pour. I can understand why you vented and had reason. Don't know how much you take until you have been in the valley, but the mountains will be your reward.
Thank you so much, igit. I swear my life isn't usually this ridiculous even though it seems like a complete circus this year.
I just want to come up for air for a month or 12. Preferably more ...
I appreciate - beyond words - the village of support I have here.
Train,
I have been praying for you often, and will continue to do so. I'm sorry I haven't had more time to respond to you, but my own life has been kind of crazy lately.
7 1/2 years ago, as you know from my sitch, I aggressively "affair-busted" my wife's affair, and we reconciled. Our piecing stage had fits and starts, as you probably also know, and it really didn't even look like we were going to make it as late as early 2009. We almost lost our house to foreclosure -- THREE TIMES. My wife's father's health began declining, our finances were in a hot mess, and even our two adult daughters always seemed on the edge of financial disaster.
It was also in 2009 that our then 20 year old daughter -- who was dating an alcoholic drug addict who was emotionally abusive -- sent us a next one night when she was out: "Are you guys still up?" Then "Go look in my room on my desk -- I wrote you a letter."
My wife and I instantly and instinctively knew what it was: she was pregnant.
She was at her sister's apartment, afraid to face us, and terrified about her future. I didn't handle it well, began freaking out about the financial and other ramifications of it all and shouted to my wife "SHE CAN'T AFFORD INSURANCE, OURS ISN'T GOING TO COVER THIS . . . WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO?"
My wife, who's normally the "flipper-outer" in our family, was calm and strong, looked me in the eye and said "We're going to go over there, we're going to hug our daughter and tell her that we love her and that everything's going to be okay, and then we're going to take everything one day at a time."
And we did, and she was right.
Through our continued challenges these past four years (my wife's parents ailing health including her father's dementia, them moving in with us, two weddings, multiple job scares, the loss of two beloved pets, legal proceedings over the custody of my granddaughter when her baby-daddy suddenly appeared after 2 years of no contact wanting 50% custody, etc. etc. . . . that little munchkin has been our source of constant joy and strength. They lived with us off and on while my daughter finally got the courage to leave her boyfriend and she has since met a great guy (US Navy, good job, very responsible, takes AWESOME care of the two of them) and we've won at least "Round 1" of the custody battle. But now we found out a month ago that our soon-to-be-son-in-law got Navy orders to go to Chicago for 3 years, and you could've just ripped our heart out. 1,000 miles away.
My wife sobbed to me one night "I lost my cat, I feel like I'm losing my dad and now I'm losing my granddaughter. What else is God going to take from me??!"
I don't know why some things happen, Train. Sometimes I can see the wisdom, the divine "plan" in it all and other times I only see it much later. Sometimes we never see it at all. I DO know that life is all about "chapters," and you are in a rough one right now. Storms. All we can do is steel ourselves, bow our head (in both prayer and a posture of resolve) and begin to push ourselves into it and -- hopefully -- THRU it.
Be there for your daughter, and your grandchild. Be patient with your husband, but make your wishes known and fulfill them. This is one of those "N.U.T.S." in life -- Non-negotiable Unalterable Terms. Use what you've learned here, pray DAILY for wisdom, clarity and strength and keep pressing forward.
When you hold that precious little grandchild of yours it will all be worth it.
((((hugs))))
Starsky