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New thread time as I hit the magic number. Here's the last page of the old thread: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2202927&page=11

Not really much to report other than that I just did my taxes and saw what I spent in cat care over the past year, and I really should have asked for some sort of payoff or ongoing "pet support" but didn't, c'est la vie....I work extra hours but it's all paying for the meows and I can't afford a vacation of any type...boo hoo :-)

Ok pity party over...anyway, no contact with XH and that's the way I like it. I am happy an awful lot, and not in his drama. I don't know much if anything about his life other than that he's back to hating his job and trying to pretend that he's not about to turn 45 and looks a lot older than he used to :-)


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
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"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
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Hit submit before I was done!

Ok my only real issue now is dealing with my best friend who I've written about before, who is still having this EA with a coworker. I had said months ago that I didn't want to be hearing about this as I made my opinion known and she wasn't hearing me. Well as the months have crept on, and as I've been more or less "over" the demise of my marriage, she has seen fit to start introducing info about her meetings with this guy to me again. Case in point, the other day she was supposed to have dinner with the guy at some Italian restaurant where their kiss and "I love you" had taken place 6 years ago (and she was married then to the guy she's married to now) and at the last minute he called it off as he had some repair guy coming to work on his apt., and he asked if she wanted to reschedule or have drinks at his apt....she picked the apt. and then spent hours with him having drinks and food and such, and then said on her way home, she just cried her eyes out and didn't know what that "meant."

I mean, I try very hard to help her see that her relationship with herself is just awful. She has zero self-esteem, her health is worse by the year, but she does nothing to try to fix anything. She drinks too much. She hides things constantly from everyone in her life BUT for me. She is not attracted to her husband and claims she never has been. She is only attracted to this coworker, a twice-divorced man who is a bit of a trainwreck but I guess to her a sexy trainwreck, and she just PINES for him. She keeps saying to me she wonders why he doesn't make a move on her because years ago he did, and she was married then too.

She is not able to see that happiness comes from inside yourself first and she is desperate for his attention. No matter what I say about consequences to her spouse if this continues, or the wrongness of it, or whatever, she does nothing but stay put, in this weird world where she refuses to admit that what she's doing is having an affair of the emotional sort. I mean, the night she went to the guy's apt. she claimed she wouldn't tell her spouse as "he might be angry he wasn't invited." Another lie.

So what I did was to say I loved her and hoped she would find her way but that I cannot be part of this anymore. I can't be the person who gets told the sordid details of what goes on in her head or for real. I am FRIENDS with her spouse. I feel like I am betraying him.

She is not happy with me. But what can I do. I feel like there are people in life who can't seem to be moral--and they want to use other people because it's easier than actually facing themselves. And just like my XH, this woman can't be helped by me. In fact, the more I try to help, the more she seems to defend what she is doing. So I'm walking away from her.

I feel like my life has come down to this. I meet many people, and I end up having to weed out who is selfish and hurts others for their own gain vs. who is genuinely good and caring and empathetic, and the ones who aren't empathetic I just have to detach from. Because my instinct is to try to TEACH them empathy or model it for them, and in every case, I fail. I can't model it. They just turn a blind eye.


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
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"Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
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Antonia,

I feel like there are people in life who can't seem to be moral--and they want to use other people because it's easier than actually facing themselves. And just like my XH, this woman can't be helped by me. In fact, the more I try to help, the more she seems to defend what she is doing.

This is what I see my ex doing exactly. The funny thing is she knows she is making mistake after mistake and they just can’t seem to stop. My ex even had the nerve to tell me that she knows we should put our family back together, how much she misses and loves me and the next day she starts dating another guy. I got tired of the lies and I have learned that no matter what they say, they just can’t seem to do anything against their thoughts. My ex was good and said all the right things to make me think she was really trying to do the work to fix her issues. The best thing for me was to remove myself from the drama. When they finally figure this stuff out, I think they see all the damage and just can’t look at themselves in the mirror. My ex was the most non selfish person that I had ever met now she is the most selfish person on this planet. Even my kids complain about how selfish she is in life.

I have met plenty of divorced women and I see several that seem to be going through this same thing. It’s like an epidemic or something and I just don’t understand how these people can’t see it in themselves. It’s sad that I see it in men and women alike. The need it now thing really disgusts me as I look at society. What they really need is to fix what’s broken inside. Self medicating and OP are never going to fix what’s wrong. It’s sad that most LBS learn this and the WAS just pinball through life.

Cool thread have a nice day.


Me 44
W 38
M 18
D 18
D 13
Bomb 10/21/2010
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A few updates: my friend I talked about above is still not really talking to me much. Even though the info about her EA was only a small part of our conversation, it's like she's shut down entirely and is only replying to posts on the alt and not really responding much to emails. Oh well. I know that I did the right thing and she's going to have to live with her own decisions. I cannot fix her. She doesn't want solutions.

Update 2, the guy that I talked about way back in Dec. that I met at an art gallery that I went to at the last minute for a show is now dating me...long story but we got to know one another a bit as friends first and decided as of Friday that we are officially "dating" though not ready to define it as "in a relationship." But we're also not dating other people...anyway the biggest issue for me is trying to get a handle on how ecstatic I am. I know it's the dopamine and I know I'm deeply infatuated and a lot of this is biochemical. Just trying to take it slow and not get carried away as much as I want to, but also trying to embrace living in the moment. It's a tough line to walk.

I will say that I am so glad I waited till XH was pretty well out of my system before something like this. I worried a lot about thinking I'd feel I was betraying XH if I started something with someone and I don't feel that at all, honestly. I feel like I'm in the right place at the right time in my life and I was supposed to meet this guy and have "something" with him.

I don't know anything about XH other than that his posts on the alt show a drastically different person than he ever was and he's still in this weirdly defiant bragging about OW phase and it's nearly 2 years that he's with her and he's still doing it. There are also many indicators that suggest he is not as "masculine" as he used to be. I told a friend I'm predicting a change in his sexual preference in 5 years. I just think this is more evidence of his identity confusion and I simultaneously feel sorry for him and feel I am so much better off without him in my life.

So I'm hoping things go well with new guy. I told him that if someone had really been able to make me believe that 650-odd days after the bomb that I'd be dating someone so wonderful, I'd have been a whole lot less distraught ;-)

Oh yeah: the plus with the new guy is that he is divorced 3 years and seems to have been married to a female version of my XH...we are very open about the past and very committed to keeping the changes we both made in ourselves in any future relationships.

So life is really good and even if new guy doesn't end up being someone long-term, I do know that there are fantastic men out there and that I can be in another relationship, which is HUGE for me to come to that realization :-)


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
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Oh, A, I'm happy for you. Happy that you have realized there are decent men out there, happy that you are out of the mindset that you will always be alone.

It is hard, isn't it, to try not to get too excited?

Here's the thing. Often times, the first person we are with are very different than our exes. That's natural. Been there, done that, right?

Not always, but, sometimes we really should be with someone somewhere in the middle.

You are way smarter now. You know what you don't want.

So, take this real slow. Become good friends. Be honest, open, your wonderful self.

Try not to get ahead of yourself so as not to risk getting hurt or hurting him.

Just enjoy this next part of your journey.

I'd love to see you not look at your xh's facebook. Who cares if he's bragging about the ow or what the heck he is doing? Not you, because you are busy living YOUR life, ya know?

Good on you, A, that you allowed yourself to let someone in.

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Hey Brookie, thanks!!

I've really looked at this guy and found that he's not the opposite of my XH at all...he's really nothing like him or the polar opposite...in fact I think the reason I like him is that he reminds me so much of myself, and I'm so awesome, haha!! Our interests are different and in some ways overlapping, our goals and dreams and lifestyle choices in sync, and our approach to trying to improve ourselves post-divorce is very congruent.

I think I feel pretty strongly that if something doens't work it's not going to make me nuts and have terrible self-esteem. I feel like I am reminding myself constantly that I am a great person and if things work well it's just because he and I are both in the same "place" right now and it isn't because I manipulated or seduced him into being with me (because if I did and he wasn't with me I'd blame myself).

I actually don't look at the XH's fb---that's a friend who has looked and occasionally tells me things. I honestly don't care when she does. It just sort of validates what I already know, that I don't know him at all. I pray for him sometimes that he finds his way. But it's like he's a very distant memory now. I have had him blocked for awhile.

I almost told that same friend to leak the news that I was seeing someone to one of her mutual friends with XH. Then I stopped myself. I think the only reason I wanted to do it was because I know on some level that it will hurt him to know I moved on in that way. And so I decided forget it, not his business.

But thanks for posting to me Brookie...nice to have the support. I'm in a really good place (with or without new guy).


M45
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Ahhhh.. So nice to hear that Antonia. Glad you don't think all men are evil and out to do harm. wink

Seriously though, glad you are able to find somebody you can open up to. Reminds me of another friend who, after changing her perspective to be more positive (she's a great lady but had an xh similar to yours), texted me the other day to tell me "it's raining good men. not sure why :)"

I honestly couldn't have been happier for her. I was waiting for that moment for her. When she would look up and see that men are better than what she was dating. Funny story: she actually called me once from the bathroom at a restaraunt where she was trying to get away from her current date. I laughed so hard she barely spoke to me for a few days until we could both laugh at it.

She had a hard time finding good men until she realized it was her perspective. Until she was ready to see the good people.

Good stuff, Antonia. Made my day to see this post!

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
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AntoniaB!

I have been reading your old threads. Don't know how I got there..... I follow random paths thru here when I am really down.

Anyway, I wanted to tell you that as a child I read every fairy tale book in the library. And those were where I got my lifes instructions. (Maybe that is what is wrong with me....)

Like in one fairy tale there was a little girl who always fed her animals first before she feed her family. That became how I did things. Still do. I was in 4th grade when I read that.

My parents were uninvolved, at best. Funny, I need to read your book. I am not a literary smart gal. I am over-smart under-educated. My BA is in graphic arts. According to my SAT's I should have been an engineer. Oh Well!

YES, I was crying when you asked were we crying yet about your cat, X and the funeral. I will tell a really funny dead cat story to you all someday. Or maybe it will be in the book of my life story that I write to get it out of my system.

I was thinking about the dating thing. Tough world we live in. And a successful match is going to be one where the guy has equal intelligence as you. (I read that somewhere, but really believe it!)

I tried to do some stuff with a meet-up group here locally. One guy in the group chatted with me, and then tried to get me to become his "Activity Partner". Seems his wife is too old to kayak, go to the gym etc. Anyway, I really think he wants something else, so I'm avoiding him.

But what I was trying to get to was the need for the physical touch is strong. And we can sleep with out cats and dogs, but they are not what we need.

My girlfriends get me through a lot. My best friend is facing her double masectomy and she holds my hand a lot. I hug her a lot. She is so scared. When she had the bad panic attack at the beach a few months back I held her standing in the parking lot for about 10 minutes, to get her calm enough to drive her to the hospital.

She was funny, she said: "Don't let me go, I don't care what anyone thinks." Her kids also come up to me and give me hugs. Maybe you should find a touchy feely family to hang out with?

Sorry to backtrack on your current thread. I just want you to know I am learning stuff from all of you. Most importantly to DB all the people in our lives. I do my brother, mother, anyone else who is making unreasonable demands of me and my time, brain space.

Hope you have a wonderful day!

Wendy


Me 57 XH 58 Sons age 32 & 27 M:32
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Hey Wendy!! Glad to hear from you. I've been only sporadically checking the board so I only just now saw your post above. I'm glad that things I've written down here have helped you.

On the fairy tale stuff I am so glad I read it all and believed in it all because it put me on the path in my research...but I'm also glad I moved beyond the classic stuff and started to read the contemporary which consistently points out the flawed logic or grandiose ideas that we attach to...I mean it's all a part of me...if Disney weren't around I wouldn't have 3/4 of my students, who then really get their eyes opened in class!

I'm still coming to terms with the physicality that I missed when single as it seemed like the one thing that really stood out a lot. Now that I am seeing someone there is a lot of physical contact in my life, which I embrace, but I also think I rely on it too much, some times to the exclusion of (or putting on the backburner) the emotional connection. I have come to think that XH and I were physically connected for the last 5 or more years of our marriage prior to his MLC but I don't think emotionally we were connected anymore.

So I'm working on that.

I'm seeing the guy from the art show for about a month now--and this is really good for me in that because he works a lot of hours and because he has a lot of interests of his own (just like I do) that we are not able to spend an enormous amount of time together. My instinct would be to do that very thing, because that's what my marriage was like. But it's not healthy, ultimately, because I'm still too "new" in my new life to get sucked back into codependency on some level if I am in a rel. with a codependent. I think this is why any time I met guys in the past few year who had any trace of codependency I really ran from them or turned them down if they were interested. Just my instinct to stay away.

This guy is very grounded and not codependent at all, good at coompartmentalizing his work and relaxation time. So basically we work all week and we both are writers on the side, so we do things with our books, and then on the weekend, either Friday or Sat., we get together around dinnertime and spend till the next day at noon together. And he's fully present in that time, not distracted by his other stuff or work (nor am I).

You know it's at the point where I really do, most of the time, wish my XH well (in my own mind as I don't see him). OW has now moved in with him and just like everything else he's done regarding her, he's bragging about it all over FB (I'm not connected to him but have been told this by a friend who is). I don't really care, to be honest. It's his life. I can see that he's repeating the same patterns with this woman as he did with me. For a person who was starting to say at the end that he thought we needed to be more individualized and have our own lives and not be so wrapped up in someone else, well, I've broken (or am breaking) that pattern in my relationship now, and he's right back in the thick of it. Only worse. Not only has he given up all his hobbies/interests to follow OW around and be interested only in what she does, but they work at the same place and now live together. So think about it. 24-7, he's with her. Goodness, he and I at least worked at two different places. It's just not healthy to be joined at the hip to someone 24-7.

I'm sorry he is so codependent and can't see it. I do feel like he is in for a rude awakening some day and I feel badly that he hasn't seemed to have learned a thing from all the mess. But it's not my concern anymore. I just pray for him.

Meanwhile I'm almost finished writing my book...and I have an idea for a 3rd book and new research area...and I'm starting to write some creative pieces (poetry, short fiction, memoir) and just trying to stay grounded and centered and ok with the fact that I don't know where my life is going. But I can say that right now I'm enjoying it immensely for a ton of different reasons.

Bottom line is that my XH's MLC and the divorce was the most tragic and yet single best thing that ever happened to me and if I had to do it over, I'd accept this turn of events again and not fight them so hard...


M45
Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11
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Hey A, so glad you updated as I have thought of you often.

Whenever I tell someone new to this that they will one day feel as you do if they do the work, they cannot believe it.

I always say I wish I could have learned these lessons in a far easier way, but, boy am I glad I learned them.

You sound great! Good for you in being able to see what your patterns were and trying not to get back into them.

And congrats on your writing.

The world is your oyster. Just enjoy and see where life takes you.

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