http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2844081#Post2844081LH - I agree. For me, at minimum....they have to cuss and like to drink. I tried to go on a date with someone that was a non-drinker and the only option was organizing a coffee date. We ended up not meeting but it just felt kind of weird from the start.
Women I know that showed in their inbox with tons of messages from men. Even G said she got like 20 some matches 1 day on Bumble. I maybe got like 1 message a week and if I was lucky 1 single match every other week on Bumble.
Ok.so you do realize that when you match on Bumble that involves a man and a woman so there are the same amount of men matching as woman. So based on the GInger theory she is matching with men who are in her league while you are selecting women out of your league.
I asked the DR the question and she told me she only would keep her profile up for a few days at the most because she would get tons of messages to weed through. She showed me one from a guy at our gym who said "I see you over their on the stair master with a winking emoji".
Isn't this the same woman who tried to make you jealous with the patient? I have no doubt there are male creepers on OLD. That's why I was a woman I may not do it.
- I agree. For me, at minimum....they have to cuss and like to drink. I tried to go on a date with someone that was a non-drinker and the only option was organizing a coffee date. We ended up not meeting but it just felt kind of weird from the start.
Totally agree. At times my life is like an episode of Californication so if you find that disturbing we probably won't be a match lol.
LOL.....too funny. It's definitely things like that which you might not think about initially which could end up being a big deal as you get to know someone.
One thing I like about the DR. is that our schedules are very well aligned. She is not a party animal, needing to stay out until midnight partying the night away. While I like to drink and go out we are very much early to bed and early to rise kind of people.
Yep. 80% of my life is bed at 9:30 up at 4:30.
I also like the fact that she has a son and not a daughter as well. I didn't think about stuff like that before but I could see having kids around the same age and the same sex could be problematic. Especially girls.
Yeah my best friend and his ex girlfriend broke up and one of the reasons was because their girls who were the same age didn't get along well.
Right...I hear that can cause issues. My mom was the one that actually pointed that out to me as one of the girls I went on a couple of dates with had a daughter that was in 6th grade and in competitive cheer. When I was telling my mom about the girl she made the comment that she would be concerned for my 2 daughters and how they would handle it.
She brought up a good point and something that I hadn't thought about before.
When I talk to my mom about the DR she just tells me I am afraid and trying to fight my feelings.
It's tough. I mean just two years ago you thought you were happily married and now you have to decide if you are going to get locked down again maybe for the rest of your life. Crazy right?
Yes......it is very hard to describe. I know my XW is not going to return so it's not about her at all. I think the Dr. has really helped me process her and move on in the last 2 months or so. I met my XW in a bar in Chicago and when we started dating I wasn't thinking of anything else, it was just dating and morphed into something more. Heck I wasn't even sure if I liked her at the time however my feelings grew. When you throw kids in the mix it seems like that makes it a little more difficult these days since me being a father and her being a mom is a big component of who we are as people. I am only getting to see part of her in action and the same for her to me.
I just never expected to be faced with something soo soon. I wasn't prepared.
From what I have read and talked to a few people about there is a meme that describes OLD for men and to a lesser degree women.
Rule 1. Be Attractive
Rule 2. Don’t Be Unattractive
I just never expected to be faced with something soo soon. I wasn't prepared.
LOL - You done gone fishin with a pole and no net there sonny!
Lol....well it feels like. When we were out on Saturday I made a comment about my favorite band coming to town in August and possibly getting tickets. She said....why wouldn't you do you plan on dumping me before then? I didnt know what to say.
Part of my issue is my job, always having to toe the line, be careful with my words, stay neutral, be diplomatic, dont commit, just listen then formulate a response. That translates over into my personal life with being non committal.....
I didnt know what to say.....
How about: Why would I dump you? Wait for her response. Then say no way. Now why don't you bring your sey self over and I will turn my head and cough for you lol.
What's your favorite band?
Smashing pumpkins......I was like a deer in headlights. It touched on my commitment issues.
Yep and also a sign she’s insecure.
Yep....maybe it's a lack of expressing my feelings like the coach said
Working from home today as my oldest woke up with a slight fever and is congested. I swear they always get sick on my week and this is the second time in the last month she has come down with something. SMH.
I currently feel very much at peace with the Dr and the situation I am in. I don't have any intensions of ending it with her so I guess I am in until something comes up that is a deal breaker, she ends it with me or something else comes up that would cause it to end.
The conversation of kids has not come up again so I believe that has been put to rest for the time being. If she was mad or disappointed she never expressed it to me nor pushed me to waiver from what I told her about 6 months.
I was like a deer in headlights. It touched on my commitment issues.
I've had those moments as I am sure has the lady I'm dating. They're the "WTF - this is real" moments where you know it's no longer a game. We've actually talked and told each other that we are both finding it hard to completely trust again. Not just trusting the other person, but also that where we are is real.
Not sure if that made sense to you or not.
There is an apocryphal story that the chief engineer at NASA had a sign over his desk that said "At some point in any project it is necessary to shoot the engineers and begin production."
Oh yes makes perfect sense it is crazy
Well today is the 1 yr anniversary of my D being final and almost 2 years since we have been under the same roof. What a ride it has been. I can honestly say that my daughters are doing extremely well and that even though my marriage didnt work out I am a very blessed individual. The xw sent me an email yesterday asking for some prior years tax document's as she is planning to go back to school for something and was applying for financial aid. I provided her with the information but felt no inclination to ask.
I have not seen the dr since Sunday morning and our next date is coming up this Saturday. I am starting to feel more comfortable, more stable, and do sense that my feelings are growing.
You're doing just fine. I don't really remember the date my ex left but my anniversary with him usually blows by without me remembering anymore - and that's a very good thing! Sounds like you and the doctor are having a nice time and learning about each other at an appropriate (not crazy love bombing) pace. Good for you!
I know you feel like maybe you wish you had dated around a bit more before getting into a relationship - and there is validity to that, but at the same time has its own disadvantages. Sometimes I do wish that things had worked out with the first guy I dated after my ex left. He has his flaws, to be sure, but I might have been happier with him over the last 10 years than with all the dating "adventures" I've had since. (We broke up because his long lost high school girlfriend found him on facebook - they're still together after all these years so I don't feel slighted by it).
I guess what I'm saying is - when you find someone compatible with you, that's really valuable and harder to come by than you would think. I've only dated one other guy since my divorce who was similarly compatible (and he was a serious Love Avoidant who really wasn't capable of being in a relationship, unfortunately). So you've met someone you are compatible with, who appears capable of being in a relationship, the sex is good, and she doesn't appear to be crazy - I'd call that a win. Just keep taking time to get to know her.
Btw, I'm not saying CMM isn't compatible in some ways - just not maybe as totally comfortable a fit as those two other guys, but also better at being available for a relationship, so everything is a trade-off.
You're doing just fine. I don't really remember the date my ex left but my anniversary with him usually blows by without me remembering anymore - and that's a very good thing!
The same thing may actually be happening with Joseph or BS or whatever it is this month
because his bio says:
"Divorce Final: 4/12/2018"So it may actually be another week yet BS? Or do you just need to change/update your bio? Either way, the date is already elusive - and that IS a good thing! I can remember both of my dates (bomb drop and divorce) but they often pass by several days or more before I say "Oh yeah, Monday was the anniversary of...
I’ll never forget the day of BD. It was Father’s Day and it just fits with everything about my ex. At least now, ex Actually has to spend the day with his son! But I don’t really remember the date of our divorce and if I’m busy i usually forget about our anniversary.
I remember BD day and divorce day as though they were yesterday. Somehow, I think those dates will be forever ingrained in my memory. BD was Sept. 29 and I remember that one vividly because it was exactly one month before our wedding anniversary (Oct. 29). Our D was final on 12/17 which I remember because it was the week before Christmas, so Merry f#@$@!$# Christmas to me that year. Having said that, though I remember the specific dates, they have become just another day to me. I do occasionally think of the significance of Sept. 29 on that day, when I realize the date, but I rarely even think about 12/17 anymore. It gets wrapped up in the hustle and bustle of Christmas and has become about happy family time for me again, so that one usually goes by without so much as a thought.
I do think that the farther that you get away from those dates, year-wise, the easier it will be to not think about it. This year will be 5 years out for me (both BD and D were in 2014) and those days are really more just a day on the calendar than anything at this point.
It is starting to fade some I guess that is obvious since I did forget the actual day. For me coming to the board is a constant reminder and I have found myself coming here less and less. I just dont have the energy or desire any more. I go over to the newcomers section and I feel like my gas tank is empty and I have nothing to offer.
Still going slow with the dr....I will see her tomorrow. I will say it is hard to go 6 days without seeing her and keeping the momentum going. We talk or text daily but it still feels that some of the connection gets lost. I am looking forward to spending time with her but after going so long I feel like it takes me a minute to get back in the saddle physically. Just as I start to get comfortable I have to start all over again. Not from scratch but just the initial of being in her presence.
I would consider it a win and we are going slow. No more talks about kids meeting so it seems that we both are on the same page and it is shocking to her that she has not found a reason to disqualify me and the same for me to her so being vulnerable again is challenging. I do know that I am very lucky to have met her as our lives and lifestyle are that of two peas in a pod.
It is starting to fade some I guess that is obvious since I did forget the actual day. For me coming to the board is a constant reminder and I have found myself coming here less and less. I just dont have the energy or desire any more. I go over to the newcomers section and I feel like my gas tank is empty and I have nothing to offer.
Hey J9,
There were some key events around and on my BD so I doubt I will ever be able to forget those days.
As far as the board goes I found that once I popped out of the LBS fog my desire for newcomers has gone pretty close to nil. I think once the majority of sitch land here the R is over. You can almost smell the despair in people's sitches. I do believe in MWD anti-D philosophies, but I think modern society has values and ethics that encourage weakness and the easy way out. It is a big uphill battle to overcome with what I am guessing is a very low success rate esp for LBH. Anyway people like LH, AS, R2C, and Steve are amazing people as they continually help the LBS fight the good fight.
I really like the post-D board because you all show how you are moving on and dealing with life post-D. I wish more people came here to post.
Sad to say, but I remember the details of bomb day like the details of 9/11.
It was pretty eventful. And from that night on, Me, my 6 month old baby girl and him never lived under the same roof at the same time again.
And while I am probably one of the most farthest moved on and longest at this ( I only say farthest as I am cordial woth my ex and OW and we are kind to each other and help each other out) the thought of that day still evokes some big emotions. But I love my life now.
Sad to say, but I remember the details of bomb day like the details of 9/11.
I have to say that I really relate with this. Clearly, I don't think about 911 much if at all other than if something pops up on television or I happen upon an artifact showing or something. Yet it's still clear in my head where I was, what I was doing, etc. It's the same with BD. It's even more-so, three or perhaps four days later, Bomb drop happened on a Monday in June after my ex W got home from work. The previous weekend was tense and I knew something was up but would have never guessed what. But I remember most everything that happened.
What is REALLY burned into me is a meeting with a councilor that we met with three or four days later - on a Thursday or Friday afternoon. ExW had used the "services" of the employee assistance at the hospital she worked for. Did these people have specific training? I have zero idea. I'm nearly positive they supported or even encouraged her leaving. I had hoped we were going to see a "real" councilor and this might be the start of fixing things - you know how it is 72-hours in - you think you can fix it. It then dawned on me either earlier that day or the night before... this might be a "trap." This might only be another way to say she wanted a divorce - which had not been said previously. I got there, came in, we started and within a few minutes I breathed a sigh of relief, even telling them that phewwwwww I thought this was going to be a meeting to set the end. It was then that she confirmed what I suspected. "Don, I do want a divorce," she said. I totally lost it. And this "councilor" looked at me and said, "is this how you really want to be acting now?" I almost could not believe my ears. No I'm sorry, no, it's going to be okay, no, let's get you some help - just "scolding" me for not acting the way she thought I should act when your wife tells you she wants a divorce. It was surreal. I HATED that lady - and still do. Of course she was trying in her un-trained feeble way to say what we have learned here about how to act in a bomb drop. To me it was adding insult to injury - not only was I getting divorced but I was not acting like one should act when they are given such news. I remember going out to the parking lot and I could not find my way out. I could see planes taking off and landing at the airport where I had based my plane for many years yet I had no clue how to get out of the parking lot. That's how messed up my brain was.
The very next day I met with a different "councilor" from the office who suggested I might want to read Divorce Busting. It will be 14 years this June since that happened and you can still see how clearly I remember it - if I think about it. Thing is, I rarely think about it anymore and I'll bet it's at least a 50-50 chance that June 21st or 22 or 23rd will hit before i go "Oh, wow, it's the 14th anniversary of BD." The actual occurrence fades away. The damage it did stays - I'm sure of it. No doubt, at least part of how I'm living my life today is still rooted in what happened to me after I trusted someone - something I had rarely if ever done before (and since). If this still sticks with me now 14-years later, I'm sure it has to be at least a little bit of why you are hesitant to commit more to the doctor. How could it not be.
Since mine is only a year old I remember it like it was yesterday. Memorial Day 2017 we were at our gym watching the kids swim. I could tell she had been off for several weeks but I thought it was just married life and since we had never spoken about D before or really had any huge fights for that matter I had no clue.
We were sitting there in the lawn chairs talking about something and she just looked at me, told me she was done, and wanted a Divorce. I think I was in a state of shock. I remember asking her if she wanted to go to therapy and she said no it wouldn't do any good. I think I got like 3 hours of sleep that night the most, she immediately went and slept in the spare bedroom herself and then she flip flopped a couple of times before finally moving out of the house.
At first she wanted to stay in the house until the summer was over with. I remember she called me one day saying she had been out looking at apartments. I told her if that is what she wanted to do then go ahead and sign the lease because I could not go on living together for 3 more months knowing that I was Walking The Green Mile.
She did cry quite a bit, was emotional, etc. but as soon as she moved out and got into her apartment her attitude changed quite a bit.
Anyway soccer today, date with the DR tonight. I have not seen her since Sunday so it will be nice to spend some time together. Last night while we were talking she mentioned our kids meeting in the future and hoping they would get along. It does seem that we are both on the same page, not wanting to rush things, scared, afraid of being vulnerable and both finding someone that we don't have a reason yet to disqualify. So it does feel that we are very much on the same page with neither one of us putting pressure on the other.
Just like many of you - I doubt if i will ever forget BD. I don't remember the exact date anymore, but it was in early May. Probably around the same time as you J if I remember correctly.
Came home from work, made dinner and we had a great evening. And then kids were put to bed and dishes done and exW sat me down at the dinner table and told me that she wanted a separation. It hit me like Whoaaaaa!! What a whirlwind of an evening, and the next weeks that followed. It all kinda became a blur. I do also remember the exact conversations I had with her about trying to make it work. The last one was in October 2017 - she had long moved out and I was just waiting for our house that we had purchased a year ago to be possessed by the new owners by the end of that month. I had gone over to her place and sat in her small backyard and had a glass of wine and poured my heart out and said I was willing to put in the work. Her exact words - this separation is permanent. I had been DBing by then and I told her straight up that I was taking her words exactly as she was saying them - no subtext, no reading between the lines. She said she was done - no second chance, no nothing.
I walked out of her place that day and didn't look back. I sometimes still wonder if I had done something differently, maybe we would've had a chance. But I know it's all futile thinking and the ball was in her court and she didn't blink.
I know that I did everything I could and so I have zero regrets. I have carried myself with dignity and self-respect.
SAL, what have you done with J9? Couldn’t find him on the ship...
Nick Sabin on sports center:
"People who make emotional decisions undoubtedly suffer the consequences in the future"
Nick Sabin on sports center:
"People who make emotional decisions undoubtedly suffer the consequences in the future"
Now Saban is a coach I can definitely appreciate.
The Dr and I had fun last night. We were with each other from about 4 yesterday afternoon until about 10 am this morning. We will see each other again on Tues. No major developments....just hangng out, hooking and having fun. Her longest post D relationship has been 3 months so we are coming up on a record for her. It is actually really nice that both of us are on the same page, not pushing each other and just letting things develop. Her D was final in Sept of 2017, mine April 2018 so our timelines are very much alike. I am learning that with post D relationships to be successful there is much more involved than just compatibility so I can see why post D is so hard. Well maybe not dating but entering into a R with so many other things to consider and at stake. As mentioned in JU thread and earlier in mine I might have hit it off quicker with other ladies but since we were not on the same page nothing developed.
Sounds like you guys are really enjoying ea bothers company. Which is good and what you should be doing at the 3 month mark. Really, there is no rush. M and I weren’t this cosmic connection when we met. I’ve had those, but nothing else was ever aligned and really, those are a bunch of BS when life gets real. And yup, much more is at stake and involved having an R with kids post divorce .
Enjoy it, don’t rush it. You guys actually do get to see each other often. And yup, 2 times a week is often with all the variables. M and I can go over a week. Twice a week are good weeks for us. Your pace is good, just go with the flow
I hear ya G....I would say that there is sexual chemistry but the emotional connection is not off the charts however our lifestyles are very similar. The weeks that I have my girls I only get to see her once. On my off weeks I usually get to see her twice. Our weekend are currently aligned so that has cut into some of our time as well. The saving grace is that she only lives 3 miles away which makes seeing her much easier.
J9, what kind of events do y'all do on the weeks when you have your kids? I'm getting to a point where I need to figure this out for myself, since I have my kids for a week at a time. It's looking like I'd have to just do an early dinner one night, but I don't think that'd be enough if I got serious about someone.
And my BD, yep I still remember that vividly. There are actually 3 of them in my mind. BD1 was when I got fooled into attending an IC session with her, when she blurted out "I've been thinking about leaving". BD2 was a few months later, the day she told me she wanted a D. I had to force the words out of her because she was too chickensh!t to say it. And BD3 was about a week later, when we told the kids and she played the role of ice queen who made the kids brownies afterwards. BD3 was the worst, as I didn't want my kids to have to suffer, and there was nothing I could do to stop it from happening.
H....her mom lives in town so her kid will spend the night with her and mine will go to a mutual family friends and spend the night. I have also hired a sister as well but usually we just go out to dinner and back to her house for a sleep over.
I got nothing new going on right now. Will see the Dr tonight at 8 pm after her son goes to bed for a little almost mid-week action. Then I won't see her again until Saturday. She asked her XH if he would be willing to take their son on the 5th weekends of the month so our schedule would not get off. I guess he is going to think about it and let her know.
She really is a good girl, I am lucky to have met her and in many ways is the polar opposite of my XW. My feelings still ebb and flow, maybe have deepened some but I don't feel this maddening feeling of love. Everyone just tells be to be patient with myself and there is no rush, timetable or need to hurry anything. I also don't feel any pressure from her either so I suppose that helps.
The Dr. literally goes from home, to work, to gym and then back home again. She does not have a huge, wide circle of friends and is not meeting anyone out for happy hours, book clubs, birthday parties or any social events like that. I know with my XW she always seemed to have something going on with her friends which took her away from home. If the DR. did those things I think it would certainly make her more intriguing. Her entire life between her office, gym and kids school is all contained within a 5 mile bubble of where she lives.
In 7 days it will be 3 months of dating. I do find myself getting more comfortable, not as anxious or nervous before going over to her house. I suppose that is a good thing. I still find myself needing and wanting my own space and autonomy. I guess that is a good thing. I do like her and I am attracted to her but I am not all spun up over her, having this maddening feeling of needing to be around her 24 x 7. I feel very comfortable with enforcing my boundaries, doing what I want to do, and she allows me to do so. I don't find myself just agreeing to things to placate her or make her happy. Maybe this is a more mature R IDK. Don't get me wrong I am attracted to her I just feel emotionally stable, very much in control.
I write all of that to say this. I have met women that I felt more of an immediate connection with right from the start and it was very intense. Those failed just as quickly as they got started. Maybe this slow, getting to know each other, getting comfortable with each other, and learning one another is how it's supposed to be????
I don't feel this maddening feeling of love
That's not love, it's infatuation.
And yes, I think it's harder to feel that once you grow up and understand he difference That's not a bad thing - infatuation can lead you down the wrong path.
Sounds to me like you like the Dr., enjoy her company, and that's all you really need to know for now. That's what dating is for - to get to know the person better and see if you are really a match.
As for her not having much of a social life outside of work - well, you wanted someone who was a gym rat like yourself, between that, single motherhood and a high powered job, she's gonna be short on time for other things. Do you get the feeling her social life was always this limited, or is it a result of post-divorce circumstances? Perhaps you should make more of an effort to introduce her to your friends and encourage her to introduce you to hers - you might learn more valuable information about her by seeing her interact with others.
I've felt a variety of ways about the men I've dated since my divorce - but not so much that giddy infatuation, because I feel my eyes are wide open now. Some I was just very fond of - loved them as they were, that they existed in the world, while knowing they were not right for me for a long term relationship. Some were just friendly flings and remain friends now (without benefits). Crazy ex-BF I ended up feeling more like his mom.
I'm more willing to accept relationships as they are without feeling the need to shoehorn them into some expectation. This is easier maybe because my kids are grown and I don't care to remarry.
I do like her....I am just not sure what I should be feeling at this point in time. I am sure her social life is more of a product of being a single mom, a demanding job, and not having a lot of time on her hands.
I do think meeting some friends is the next step. I am not opposed to it there just has not been a good time yet to where it has worked out.
While I am not looking to get married tomorrow obviously finding someone that is a good mom, good role model, etc. for my girls is very important and so far there is no indication that she would not be outstanding. While I have not met her son or have seen her parent he appears like a very happy, healthy, normal 7 yr old boy. She seems to be a very loving, caring, devoted mother who loves her son very much.
I am actually kind of glad I don't feel that giddy infatuation feeling where the other person takes over your life. This seems much more healthy to me.
Yup, infatuation is very different from love. I don’t think I have wanted to be around someone 24/7 except when I was 19. I love being with M, I think he loves being with me, but when we have our own homes and responsibilities, just being in our own space feels good. M could have stayed over Monday night, but he was ready to go home. He went for the last day of the snowboarding season then chilled at home. I get it.
I mean, not having ANY friends or doing anything social with them is a little..... off. I have a very nice tight circle of friends and we like to hang together. But we have lives, careers, children to raise, etc and it doesn’t happen nearly as often as we hope. I imagine if I had a full week without my child every other week, I would be spending much more time with my friends or doing hobbies I enjoy. But I don’t have that time. A bunch of friends got to get her from my old job and I had my D. Couldn’t go. They texted me into their dinner conversation, lol.
Don’t focus on what you think k you should feel. What do you actually feel and does it make you feel good? That’s all that matters.
So, are you having time with your friends or have you been skipping out I. That too? What do you do outside of kids, gym, and the doctor? Are you keeping up with that stuff?
J9 - We're still on a similar path in some ways. I'm not feeling the head over heels thing either and yes - it's confusing to me too. It's like I've got a little observer sitting on my shoulder guarding the last few doors.
I know it's tough to make the time, but is there an upcoming opportunity for something with friends? For me it would be something like a charity dinner (I'm fancy doncha know) or just out and about social activities like a festival (that was this past weekend) or concert like what Dawn and Sparky like doing.
If she's not interested then that's something you'll have to judge as to if she is indeed a good match for you. She likes her ranch and shooting stuff but does seem to be someone who doesn't really need or perhaps want others around. You know her better than a random internet observer though.
I agree with those who posted before me that infatuation and love are two entirely different animals. I am with Ginger...stop worrying about how you are SUPPOSED to feel/think and just feel/think. Everyone is on a different timeline so you don't have to have certain feeling benchmarks that you have to hit (i.e. 3 months this feeling, 6 months this feeling, etc.).
Sometimes being overly-analytical is not necessarily a good thing.
What about the coach's motto of hang out, hook up, have fun. I don't think there is a 4th part to it that says to do those things and then over-think it all to the nth degree. Just relax and enjoy.
Smooth stop spinning! 3 Hs baby.
Thanks all will do. I hooked up 3 times on sat night and once Sunday morning. Will keep it going.
All with the same woman? You stud lol.
Um....yeah the Dr had a high drive.
Do you think that maybe because she doesn’t have hobbies that compete with you it means less of a challenge and she gets less value (not logically - just emotionally)? Like you know exactly where she is, you don’t have to worry that she’s gonna go for another guy so you don’t have that feeling of competition hence the value of the girl goes down even though you logically know she’s got value to her. But there’s no real chase. Can that be part of what your feeling?
She’s insatiable huh. You poor baby lol.
I recognize it cause I am similar. I notice ex bf stopped putting effort and my ex husband did as well cause they felt no threat, no jealousy. Once I am with a guy, I don’t feel a need to flirt or get dressed up and go out. I feel more settled and loyal. But I’m realizing guys don’t appreciate women like that. They need the girl that’s more like your ex wife.
Well look what my xw got me ju. I am trying to change it up.
I remember once when me and my ex were much younger, we went out to a bar with a bunch of his frat buddies while we were away for a wedding. He was hanging out with his friends and I was talking to his friend’s girlfriends. I remember these 2 guys (looked like motorcycle guys) came in and and one was aggressively flirting with me. Like he kept playing with my hair while He was sitting behind me. I was ignoring him and not encouraging, And another girl made this comment about how my ex husband would get upset if he saw...
I got up and walked over to my ex husband and did not tell my ex husband anything. Just made it clear to the other guy I was with a boy friend. The reason was, I loved my ex husband and didn’t want him to feel the need to get into a bar fight with scary looking characters so he wouldn’t look bad in front of his friends. I wanted him to be safe. I know damn well that other women at our age at the time would use that cause they would like the attention of men fighting over them. They would know that the drama would add value. i know that too. I am not stupid when it comes to male/female dynamics. But I have brothers and I always try to treat people - especially the guys I am with - with loyalty and respect. I didn’t want to ruin my ex’s time with his friends or have him risk getting hurt.
Anyway, one thing I do notice is that the women that do make a big deal about stuff like that certainly don’t have more then me in terms of looks or intelligence. But they end up with guys that are more doting. I think that a lot of guys don’t appreciate stuff like that. Maybe on a logical side they do. But emotionally they are gonna feel more attraction for the girl that’s not a sure thing. For the girl they have to fight for.
Like when that guy pointed out to you how lucky you were with the dr - it made you a bit more worried about losing her. But the fact that she would rather hang out with you in her limited time then go out for drinks with her friends makes you less attracted.
Now I’m not putting you down for this. Most guys are like this. I’m just asking you, cause I am realizing that things haven’t worked out for me in the past cause I don’t play those games. Obviously, at my age guys are not gonna fight over me in a bar anymore. But I think there’s something to not being so available. Not being a sure thing.
If your dr girlfriend chose going out for drinks with her friends on a Saturday night, instead of hanging out with you (for a girls night) would that be more appealing? To me, a woman that has young children and chooses at our age to stay with her young children is more appealing then like the ex wife who works all day and skips out on them to socialize and do tons of “me activities”. Why don’t you guys see that?
Hi JuJu - I'm going to disagree with you on this.
For reasons that are unclear to me, some women - certainly not all - are attracted to me. The two serious relationships I had before I was married, my ex, and two of the ladies who I have dated since divorce including the one I am dating now all made great efforts to attract me to them.
The last time I was in a bar fight has to be over 30 years ago - and while there was a girl at the root cause of it, it was one who was being disrespected, not one I wanted to impress.
Now, I'm a very doting guy. Opening doors, sending flowers, making sure that any woman in my life knows that she is cared about and it seems to work and I enjoy doing it. Other than with "CL" it has always served to bring me closer to the woman who I was attracted to and visa versa. As another example, there's Ginger1's relationship with M. He also seems to be a kind and caring man and probably always has been and that works for them too.
On the other hand Gordie's W was upset at him because he didn't "fight for her". Some women perhaps get off on that and get validation that they are valuable. I honestly don't know much about J9's back story as it seemed to come in and end pretty darned quick compared to many. I did hear earlier this week that B's daughter creeped my ex's Facebook feed and even though I fought hard for my marriage, I never entered in to a competition against OM but there I am, prominently featured on her social media still with little or no visibility of the guy she left me for.
Is that a function of being older? I don't think so. Thinking hard about it, perhaps it's more about social status within a group than the dynamics between two people. I'm certainly not smart enough to know though.
Just my 2 cents - sorry for the partial thread-jack J9.
Ju.....I will preface by saying that I have never been in a bar fight. I think most men like a challenge and I know if the dr had more of a social life, got dressed up and had a night out with her friends etc. I would find that appealing. It is a wierd thing I want someone who is loyal, a great mom, many of the things you describe about yourself but they also need to have an edge about them.
Andrew - my point was that I’m the type (and maybe the dr too) that would intentionally make sure there was not a bar fight. I shut that sh!t down -‘and it’s easy to do. But other girls will love the attention of being the cause of one or getting to be the damsel in distress. They know what they are doing and they play on that.
The bar example is meant to be similar to a female putting herself in a position of flirting or encouraging attention from other men...In a subtle way that puts boyfriend or husband on alert. I was curious why guys don’t appreciate the women that avoid drama (they say they do) but they end up taking her for granted and as a sure thing. They seem to be drawn to the women that encourage attention from other men. As J said - he wants the edge to them. Betty is just as attractive as Veronica if not more. Yet they go for the Veronica’s.
I am giving you guys on here insight on the Veronicas (most of them your ex”s and basically telling J it seems like he has a Betty and that’s why he’s not as attracted)
I don’t know Gordies situation. Waywards say crazy stuff cause they want to be right. But you say you doted on your wife. I wonder if guys dote more on the women that are not sure things. Your wife wasn’t a sure thing. Most of the wives on these forums weren’t yet you guys doted. Usually aggressive women do not end up being Betty’s. They usually have a sense of targeting nice guys. That’s just my opinion though.
My boyfriends don’t dote because I am loyal and a sure thing. I see that. And just like I am giving you guys insight, you are giving me insight as well and I am taking this in. For my personal sitch, I realize I lose my edge.
Thanks ju....I may just have a Betty on my hands. Funny thing is I wished my xw was more of a Betty because if she was I probably would not be on this board. So if the dr was a Veronica early on and then transitioned into more of a Betty then that would be perfect however she would still need to maintain some of that Veronica.
So what are things that would appeal to you? You mentioned hearing that she’s going out with her friends on a weekend she doesn’t have her son. What else? What gives an edge?
I notice that guys usually like me a lot in the beginning and give a lot of attention and then as soon as I become more attached they slowly slide. Which eventually makes me detach. I hate this dynamic. I notice the less interested I am, the more interested in me they are. Once I become interested they start with doubts or laziness.
Just a social life in general, meeting friends out for a movie, maybe a happy hour, girls night out, etc. I used to love it when my XW would go out drinking with her girlfriends then come home and wake me up for sex when she was a little tipsy.
Open sexually as well. I don't need someone to be all freak nasty but being spontaneous, open to new things, actually enjoys sex, giving and receiving, etc.
Hobbies, outside interests. My XW was always dabbling in something, she tried to start her own photography business, then started working with a friend on organizing catered events for people. Granted it all takes time and obviously as a single parent hard to do but I found it attractive.
Going out shopping, new clothes, getting nails and toes done, going to the gym, getting her hair done, lotions, scrubs, perfume, etc. is also very attractive. Sure I understand that we will be laying around in our pajamas at times but I find feminine women, who can be submissive and take care of themselves very attractive.
Also be energetic, wanting to try new things, getting out of the house, exploring the city, enthusiastic about life, positive energy, outgoing etc. is also very attractive.
What gives an edge? For me it's a woman who can not only be a loving mom, loving partner, caring etc. but she also has a hidden little nasty side to her. For example, lets take the Dr. She is a Dr. by day, seeing patients, is respected, smart, successful etc. but between the sheets she lets its all go and behaves in a way that no one would probably expect.
I get to see a side of her that no one else gets to see and she trusts me and allows it to happen.
So while she may not have the social outlets, etc. that is what has given her an edge for me.
Juju - I know what you're talking about. There's a book called Why Men Love Bitches about that very thing.
It used to annoy me when I was in college. I had my fair share of dates and boyfriends and was honestly quite pretty at that age, but I never got the adoring extravagant behaviors and presents that some of my more superficial female acquaintances got. Of course, I can see now that they were often using men and I was just very straightforward. But I also didn't make men work hard enough to win me. I saw that all as duplicitous games (and much of it was) but also know as an adult that confidence is attractive. If I'm taking my time getting to know someone and evaluating whether I think they are for me, rather than focused on "will they like me?", it's more likely that the guy will put out more energy trying to woo me. It just is that way.
The challenge for the guys here is to distinguish between quality women who are just taking their time deciding about you and the manipulative women.
Very fascinating discussion - as many on this thread is (where the cool kids hang out - well mostly LOL) I find the best way, heck perhaps the only way, to address many things is to try to put yourself in the other person's shoes. In don't that I think I get where you are at and what you are thinking Joseph. I'm not sure it's as simple and as cut and clear as you are trying for it to be JuJu. Hopefully I can explain this.
For BS, I get the feeling that other than in bed, the doctor is kinda boring. I've thought this for a bit already and don't mean it to be mean at all, but even the two of you together seems to already be in a somewhat boring rut - and I place much of that on the doctor. I remember early on you tried to take her to ax throwing and got push-back. So now it's dinner and sex, dinner and sex, dinner and sex, dinner and sex. Unless it's a weeknight thing then it's just sex. It's hard to build a true R on that. It's fun and I'd be THRILLED to have it - not really wanting a huge R - but I also think back, way, way back, like 30-35 years back and it was when things got stale and boring that I found myself in a dinner and movie on a Sunday rut. You seem to be there early on. And she doesn't seem to have a lot else going on. That also tends to put more pressure on the other person.
I agree with the others, you are only at three months, just let this play out and show itself - and it will. You are doing a lot of thinking about the future rather than just enjoying the present. Something just tells me you like her, she's fun, there is really nothing wrong, she's just not "the one." And that's okay. Again, i could well be wrong, that's just how I see it.
JuJu, I think you just have not dated enough. I'd hate to see you change who you are to "play the game" but I do think you are onto some basic points. Guys will take advantage of - which is really not their goal but it just happens - women who they know are not going anywhere. One of the reasons I think that I enjoyed Wild Girl is she was a challenge. I get turned off rather quick if I sense I can do anything I want and the girl will still be there. "Whatever you want to do honey" it's just not fun. Anyhow, to my point JuJu, while I think it's great that you are trying to look at this, I really think casually dating a dozen guys will give you far more insight. Then blending the two together will likely give you the most intel.
There is also something to be said for the chemistry of it all. It's the part that really can't be explained. It's why I really enjoyed someone that I know was not good for me long term nor a long term match - yet the chemistry was there and therefore my enjoyment level was huge. Then I'll meet and date 6 others that might on paper be much better for me (or anyone) yet the chemistry is not there. I think with both of you it was as much the lack of chemistry as it is anything.
Like Don, I find this to be a fascinating discussion. I agree with Juju that men do tend to pull back when a woman is kind of "locked down" for lack of a better description. I kind of think that it is an unfair assessment to say that Juju just hasn't dated enough. It has nothing to do with how much someone dates, it is a human nature thing. To me, all of this goes back to a discussion sometime ago and I don't remember for sure if it was on J9's thread or someone else's, but one of the men (don't remember who so I won't call anyone out), said ALL women play games. Me and several others jumped in and said no, that isn't true and of course, we were told oh but it is because everyone does. Now, here Juju is basically saying yet again that not all women play games. If she's interested in someone and they are mutually interested in her and she starts seeing that person and gets comfortable with them she exhibits a certain level of loyalty and respect. I do the same thing. I, like Juju, don't want men fighting over me or any of that dramatic crap. I'm low-key...I don't need to be patted like a dog and paraded about like a show pony. Some women do need that and I'm not saying they are wrong, I'm just saying that there are truly women who do NOT need that and I think it has a lot to do with how we were raised. Men say all the time that they want a nice, loyal woman and then they hook up with these snotty women and they like that because these women are a "challenge" (whatever the h3ll that means). Same can be said for women. Women SAY they want a nice guy, but then they go for men who treat them poorly and walk all over them. These are generalizations, of course, and obviously every single man and every single woman on the planet does not fall into them. These are just the average or norms.
Just because a woman is loyal and respectful and doesn't play games does not mean that she will allow the man to do whatever he pleases or to walk on her. I'm very loyal and respectful to Sparky, but I can promise you that he will NOT walk on me and he does not do as he pleases and flaunt it in my face. I encourage him to go fishing with his buddies or play cards or whatever else without me, but we also enjoy spending time together. In the same vein, he encourages me to spend time with my friends and go do things without him, which I do on occasion, just like he does. To me, that is a respect thing. When you care about your partner, respect them, and are loyal to them, you can have separate interests and still be very much together, if that makes sense. We don't have to ask each other's permission to do things, as we shouldn't because I'm not his mom and he's not my dad and we are both adults, but if a friend asks me to do something, I will check with him to make sure we didn't already have plans that I have forgotten and he offers me the same courtesy. We don't blow each other off to spend time with others, but we are respectful of each other's plans and schedules. I recently asked a dear friend to serve as the officiant for our wedding and this is someone who does not know Sparky well, so he asked if we would have dinner with he and his wife, just so they could get to know Sparky better before the wedding. I absolutely said yes, without even talking to Sparky, but when it came to actually selecting a date for the dinner, I certainly talked it over with him because it is a plan for both of us. I think people have to learn basic respect in relationships and I think boundaries are important as well.
J9, what I find particularly interesting about what you are saying in your most recent posts is that it seems to me, if I remember correctly, in one of your previous threads, one of the issues you had about your XW was that she had too much girl time, but then just a couple of posts back on this thread, you talk about all the stuff your XW did in a very positive light and almost seem to wish the dr. was more like that. That seems contradictory to me. I may well be misremembering or misunderstanding, but it just seems odd to me. The dr is all these positive things and the one thing that seems to bother you is her lack of social life outside of you. Maybe that just isn't her thing. Don't get me wrong, I love my friends and doing things together, but I'm a homebody and I'm also naturally an introvert, so I'm just as good hanging out at home alone as I am going to do things with friends. And, when we all get older and have more responsibilities, it can be much harder to have time for social activities, particularly as a single parent with a demanding job. it's still very early in your relationship and there is no rush to decide what it is going to be. For now, just relax and enjoy the ride (no pun intended) and see what happens moving forward. Remember that your XW and the dr. are different people and that they behave differently.
I know it is interesting, I enjoyed the ride twice last night
Maybe I am just looking for reasons to disqualify as she told me once...….looking for reasons to disqualify her previous partners is what she does best. Fear of intimacy maybe on both sides. It will be the 3 month mark in 6 days which will have marked her longest post divorce R so we shall see what happens.
I do feel that she is growing on me...……
Well I forgot to pay my water bill so that really sucked. I had to heat up some water I got from the store and take wash cloth bath Wow that was fun!
The good Dr sent me a text earlier today telling me she missed me and was sad she was going to have to wait until Sat to see me. Since I am such an upstanding citizen I told her I could come over tonight so she took me up on the offer. The three H's were in full effect and I have determined I have commitment anxiety. It's weird in her presence I enjoy her company, etc. etc. but when I go home I seem to go in my shell. Not sure why that is. She putting absolutely no pressure on me what so ever and I have no intentions of ending things but I guess there is no time table for these things and there is no rush I guess. I assume as long as feels that I am not going to bail or end things that is really all that matters. It is just a slow roll for me. I think she also knows its just a matter of time, she does refer to me as her BF and I don't have any problems with that.
I saw the xw tonight at my daughters soccer practice and I felt no desire for her. Tomorrow does mark the 1 yr of my D being final and I feel really good about where I am at with her. She texted me today and told me she was going with a GF of hers to Florida in a couple of weeks on a buddy pass to help her friend do some work (its a long story). She wanted me to know just in case her plan crashed. I told her she would be just fine and left it at that.
Anyway I guess that's about it!
I had the electric guy come and try to [censored] off my electricity yesterday. I’m not not normally home at that hour, thank his I was. There was a mix up between my old house. Luckily the guy was incredibly kind and he never shut it off.
Anyways, I’ve been following along on these qualities that would make you more attracted. My mindreading? For someone to settle down with, I think the doctor would suit you just fine. I do however think hobbies and time of your own with your own friends is important in a relationship . She likes to shoot guns, so that’s a hobby. Her lack of friends is a little odd She seems to have no friends. Friends are important. You don’t have to hit the club with them, but I feel a woman needs her girlfriends and time with th then.
But I digress. The party girl that is the life of the party and goes out and does all these things is the woman you tinitially desired because you were just dating. Those types are lots of fun when you are just dating and not looking for commitment.
But you are now with a woman who has her life in order and is searching for the husband to complete it. It might have come a bit early for you. You have to see if this is what you truly want in your life right now. Or if you truly need that push pull exciting exhilarating dating game.
Oh, and I am that woman JUju is too and kind of have the same problem in dating. I am fiercely loyal, you never have to question me as a partner and I do nothing for the chase. If I’m with you, I’m woth you and that’s that. I’ll treat you like a king too. And this has caused guy to maybe get bored or not feel the trill of the chase. The only one who chased was FF and I think i that’s because he was 9 years younger than me. He definitely pursued me. And he got jealous.
7 months for M and I and he still is excited to see me, still plants a big one on me every time. Still does for me, as you can see. But he isn’t jealous and I think that’s because he knows he doesn’t have to be. I am loyal and don’t play games. I remember when I went to the beer fest with my ladies when I was dating FF he was acting ridiculous. He pretended he had friends there so I wouldn’t do something “stupid” and pretty much texted me every 5 minutes the whole time. M told me to have fun and be careful, sent me a few texts, and that was that.
I have that book, “why men love bitches” and I began reading it a few years ago. I am just not a bitch. Seriously, I get the dynamic, but it’s just not me. I guess sometimes we just have to wait until we find someone compatibility. ( lord knows I waited a long time”
Thanks G for the perspective. Here is the funny thing. My neighbor across the street has 3 kids, with a 4th one on the way. His W is a teacher as well and is a devoted W and mother. Her life is her husband and kids, she doesn't feel the need to go out and do all of these other things that I had described as being attractive. I remember when my XW left she flat out told me that she was not built like my neighbors wife across the street. When this was all going down for me a 2 years ago I wished that my XW was more like my neighbors W.
What I think I want and what I actually need might be too different things.
When I talk to my mom about all this she thinks I am an idiot
It’s true, you may actually want something different than what you need RIGHT now.
I think there is balance in people. People who just devote their lives to their kids and husband. Well, that’s extreme. I mean, to each his own, but I don’t want a husband like that and I don’t want to be a wife like that.
If I give myself any credit in this world, it ‘s for striking a healthy balance. I’m usually pretty good at it, but the scale at times tip one way or another, but I am not an extremist. Being a divorced mom at 28 taught me a whole lot. That I have interests, I love my friends and they are family to me, and I like spending time woth a partner, but not dedicating my whole self to them.
You’ll figure it out in due time. But neither way is wrong or right.
I am not a fan of the Rolling Stones but dont they have a song that says essentially the same thing? You might not get what you want but you'll get what you need???? Your right I will figure it out. Life is a really crazy thing.
It’s actually “you can’t always get what you want, but if you try real hard you just might get what you need”.
Well, I´m a bass player after Bill Wyman from the Rolling Stones. Let me tell you I´m really dissapointed with you not being a fun. ;-)
Well I´m slowly catching up with the forum. I´m glad for what I read. Good for you J9.
Hung out with the dr sat night. She had her kid until 7ish so we just went out to dinner and I spent the night. I will see her again on Thursday. Nothing new to report. She loves to bake cupcakes and when she goes out marketing she takes the primary care physicians cupcakes that she makes homemade to give to them so when they need to make a referral they will refer to her. They are actually really good so she made my daughters Strawberry as that is my oldest favorite flavor. Of course she then asked who made them and I just told her a friend. My oldest loves to bake so she said that maybe she could bake with her some day. I just said maybe. I told the dr this info and she told me she would love to bake with her. Truthfully it feels as though the dr is a little nervous and scared about me meeting her son as well. She talks about him quite a bit and sends me pictures of him but is not pushing anything either. It really does feel like we are both in the same place of if not being easy to be vulnerable.
The 3 H's are in full effect!
I know I talked a lot about my son with ex bf and a bf before him (who I had no intention of introducing) it’s not a pushing for commitment thing. I think it’s cause my life is my son right now. I have him the majority of the time as does the dr. I’m sure it also has to do with limited contact with my sons dad. I don’t talk to him about anything beyond logistics. So it’s nice to have someone to talk about him with.
J9 - My situation is very very different in that my kids are adults. I was wondering if it's perhaps becoming time to let your girls know that you are going on dates while setting their expectations that Dad - who loves them very much - is also looking at forming a new relationship.
At their age they should know what dating is. That way when you reach a point with a possible new partner where they could be introduced there is no real surprise as it is just an extension of what they already know. Perhaps those with younger kids could opine. You undoubtedly want to avoid suddenly showing up with a new step-mother with three ugly daughters and yours having to do all the cleaning with the help of random woodland creatures.
Makes sense Ju...she has her son 90% of the time so he is her life as well. Today marks 3 months with the Dr. and she commented to me this morning that "Thankfully it has been easy". I will agree that it has been very easy and I know there are many things that can complicate or make things difficult.
I will see her on Thursday night for a bit but then after that I am not sure as her sister is in town this weekend and obviously Easter Sunday as well. Neither one of us seem concerned about it and I do get the sense that we are on the same page. 3 months as been her longest post D relationship so I guess we shall see if we make to the "$hit it about to get real stage". I don't feel any pressure but I do feel pressure if that makes sense. It is still hard for me to be vulnerable.
I feel very calm and in control of emotions. I am not worrying, obsessing, analyzing her intentions, etc. and that does bring a feeling of comfort. She has been who she said she has been all along. Her D was final in Sept of 2017 and mine in April of 2018 so we are not that far apart in timeline. I don't feel pressure from her to do anything other than what we are currently doing which is hanging out and having fun. She has never once forced me into a conversation I didn't want to have, question me on why I am in no rush to introduce children, or pressured me into a commitment. She has let me take the lead on just about everything.
I do get the sense that she wants to meet my girls and I would like to meet her son however that does scare the crap out of me just because of what that signifies. Based on what I have seen out of her, pictures of her son, videos, etc. I have no reason to believe that she would be nothing but a positive influence in my daughters lives and a good role model.
Do I like her....yes. Am I all spun up emotionally wanting to spend every waking moment with her....no. Do I still question if I should have or needed to date around more...yes but I am not sure why as she is a good woman and I know I am a lucky man.
Andrew I think when the kids are little it’s enough to just say daddy’s friend. Explanations are too complicated. They don’t really understand boyfriend/ girlfriend. With my ex bf after about a year l, my son told me “I think ... has a crush on you mommy” and then we broke up 6 months later. My son still doesn’t really know or care and that’s perfect.
Also, if your still questioning... I know you like her. But maybe questioning timing or desire to commit or overall compatibility. . Don’t introduce kids. It’s still really early after both divorces were finalized. 3 months is nothing and reveals nothing.
I think it's my own fears. I am just trying not to think too much and just let it flow. Sometimes I feel really good and other times I feel myself pulling away.
I had a lot of mixed feelings too. Sometimes it felt unnatural... sharing time, watching tv, sleeping over someone’s house that was not my ex husband. (My ex left us in 2015). It felt like an alternate reality that really wasn’t supposed to be occurring. Like a dream you wake up from and your so happy when you realize it was just a dream. (My ex husband was also a pos that was lying and basically stealing family funds from his wife and preschooler and living off my parents so it makes little sense) There were times I would just leave ex bfs house in the middle of the night cause I couldn’t be there (and also the snoring).
Now in my case, Ex boyfriend was definitely the wrong person. I look back and just don’t know what the hell i was thinking when it came to compatability. But it could have also been too soon for me. Or me thinking I could just replace a role that was now missing in my life with the first person that fit a certain criteria.
I pulled away a lot too. The crazy thing is people like you more when your like that. I bet Dr senses that and it’s part of why she seems to be very interested in you. But we talked about that already in earlier posts.
So it could be time, or maybe your guts seeing something that you might not cognitively recognize for another 6 months or a year.
I don’t have answers, just that I know that up and down feeling. I think its what happens to damaged people and hopefully resolves with time.
I hope it does because she is a really good person.
M told me that he was alot more nervous about meeting my daughter than before our first date. Even when you are ready, it is scary. I was scared too. I am thankful that it went so well.
M’s son Just thinks I’m daddy’s friend. He’s an excitable little 5 year old boy. He doesn’t know one way or another . We don’t PDA in front of him. He will sneak a kiss when his back is turned.
My daughter, on the other hand is an 11 year old highly emotionally intelligent little girl whom you can’t pull the friend stuff with. Since 7 years old I couldn’t pull that off. She knows I’ve dated. She’s told me a while back that she thinks I should go on match.com because I could find a nice boyfriend there. I let her know when I had dates. I explained along the way that dates help you get to know someone to see if they would be a good boyfriend . My daughter knows very well we are in a relationship. She even told me “M is a great boyfriend to you, he treats you well”
You can say “you are going to meet daddy’s friend” but if they ask if she is your girlfriend, you should be honest. That’s my opinion.
As far as you. I hate to break it to you, but that spun out need to spend every minute with the one you are dating is a thing of the past, of your late teens early 20’s. That doesn’t happen anymore. Because you are more of your own person with your own life and your own kids, job, hobby, etc. you’ve fulfilled yourself enough that you don’t have that desire and need anymore. Your desires and needs are more mature than that now.
There is something about place and time on your life. What do you wish to find by dating around? Is it sex without commitment and freedom? Say you decided to go and end things with the DR tomorrow and then went and dated around? What purpose would that hold for you?
Deep questions, but maybe if you answer them, you’ll have more clarity
That helps G.......I guess I thought I was supposed to be all spun up and since I am not that something was wrong. My mom tells me I am an idiot. She always thinks of my girls first and tells me that I have much more to think about now than just my own feelings. She likes the fact that the dr has a young boy instead of girls and also likes that she adopted her son which shows she has the capacity to love a child that is not her own blood if that makes any sense.
I'm SO glad someone finally said that to you! I feel like I always make negative comments to you and I didn't want to come off negative yet again by saying something (and by the way I do NOT think what G said was negative...I just know she words stuff better than I do and she seems to have a better rapport with most of y'all than I do, so maybe it comes better from her), but I just kept thinking why does a grown man NEED to feel all spun up in someone. To me, that seems like an "emotion" or a feeling that a much younger and likely never-married person would have. More of a feeling of infatuation than genuine emotional connection, if that makes sense. I'm not saying someone can't be excited about their partner when they are more mature and have been through a divorce because obviously people can be, but that super emotional, almost out of control feeling seems to be, at least in my mind, more a product of young lust than emotional maturity about relationships.
I totally get what your mom said about the dr having an adopted child. I have told this story before, but I have never had children of my own because it was just, sadly, never in God's plan for me. But, I have 3 lovely, wonderful, amazing daughters just the same. When I married my XH, his daughters became my daughters and I still have a very big role in their lives despite him not being a part of my life at all anymore. And, when I get married to Sparky, I will "inherit" a 4th daughter and I will love her just as much as I love my other 3. Being a step-parent can be a VERY difficult job but it can also be a very rewarding one. It is all in how you develop a rapport with the kid(s). Not everyone can take someone else's child and love them as their own and that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but clearly the dr. can since she's already done it. It's early yet for all the lovey dovey stuff, but I think the dr is a keeper.
Just remember the last R that I was in lasted 17 years and got started when I was in my 20's so that spun up feeling is all I know from back in those days. Truthfully I don't want to feel that way and I am glad that what I am feeling is normal or at least how I am supposed to feel.
The Dr. is a keeper and I think that scares me as well. There are so many things about her that make sense but after being hurt like I was it is very hard to let go and be vulnerable again. Some days the pain was almost unbearable and the thought of opening myself up again brings tears to my eyes. I know it is part of healing and moving on but it is tough.
When I was dating on-line I don't know that I ever really thought that I would meet someone "normal" through that medium. I actually thought OLD was just a way to meet people and pass away the time and that I would actually meet someone through a mutual friend, my daughters school, the gym or rather more of the organic way. TBH the Dr. completely caught me by surprise. She will be 47 in May, has a 7 yr old son, and just opened up her own practice.
She is a busy mom just trying to do her best in this world just like the rest of us.
Yes, that was kind of my point. For those who married young, relationships and marriage did likely start with that whole spun up thing. And, for those that were married for any length of time longer than a few years, they don't likely know anything different. I do think, though, as we grow and mature in ourselves, we realize that feeling is likely more infatuation and lust than real feelings. It may have become real as the relationship/marriage grew, but initially it was just all in your face. Lots of posters here have alluded to that need for a lot of sex at the beginning of a relationship, but for most, that high level of sex a relationship has in the beginning is not sustainable over a longer period so the lust/infatuation dies down and the real emotion sets in.
Now that you are older and have gone through a D, you can grow and realize that you can feel for someone (and even be sexually attracted to them) without being out of control emotionally. Being vulnerable is hard, especially if you are the LBS. It is hard to put yourself out there. I totally understand what you mean about being caught by surprise by meeting someone "normal" online. I didn't think I would either, but here we are. LOL
I didn't mean anything negative by anything I said and I get that you are just going with what you know, so to speak, but I was hoping at some point, someone that you like/respect would say what G did so that you would think about it because when you kept posting about not feeling spun up I kept wondering why you would want to feel that way. From the outside looking in, you appear to have a mature (dare I say "age appropriate") relationship with the dr and I couldn't be happier for you. You seem look a decent guy and you deserve a good, "normal" woman to share your life with when you are ready to have that. When you first got married to your XW, y'all were young and it was just the 2 of you. Now, you not only have to worry about yourself, but you also have to worry about your daughters. And, like most good parents, you seem to embrace the idea of putting your children first. That makes for a very different dynamic in a relationship than being young and being able to get naked and have sex in the middle of the living room at 2:00 in the afternoon....know what I mean? LOL
I guess G was the first one who put it in words that I could understand. I think I am finally starting to understand how it's not all about looks, beauty, etc. Not that I am not attracted to the dr. and obviously that does exist but there are certainly more important things at my age that I should be focused on.
I think that is why my mom thinks i'm being stupid.
I think that is the age-old style vs. substance debate, isn't it? There are all sorts of theories and quotes about it and the one that usually jumps out in my mind is something about beauty fades, but personality goes on forever. LOL There is SO much more to someone than their physical appearance. And, you can and should totally be physically attracted to your partner. I am not advocating that you shouldn't. I'm just saying that maybe, as we mature in our selves and in our relationships we begin to realize that both things are more important (both style and substance) rather than just being drawn solely to someone's "style".
I have known some REALLY good looking guys who were complete a$$hats and some not nearly as physically attractive guys who had amazing personalities. Give me the average looking guy with the great personality ANY day over the one who is "pretty" to look at, but is a douche. The one time in my life I have really been spun up over someone was when I was young and by "normal" standards, most people would say he's kind of cute, but not hot or gorgeous or anything, but he's got this AWESOME sense of humor, he's super smart and he's a nice guy. He is BY FAR the sexiest guy I have ever known in my whole life. And, I would bet if I showed his picture to most women, they would go "yeah, he's ok, I guess...I've seen worse" or something along those lines. But dude has substance for days and I still think he's the hottest man on the planet. It's all in how we perceive people, if that makes sense.
I have no doubt that the dr is a very physically attractive woman. But, she must have some smarts in her head to be an actual doctor and she doesn't seem to be flighty or a game player or any of those things, so she has both style and substance. Good for you on that one.
The Dr. has been pretty much what she has advertised since day 1. I know she is falling in love with me and I think in some respects I am starting to feel my emotions be engaged as well.
Granted we have not had our first fight yet nor have spent entire days or weekends together yet either. Our weekend schedules have not be aligned in about a month so we usually only get 3 to 12 hour stretches (12 hours including sleeping time) once or twice a week.
Since she just opened her own practice 6 months ago and she is the only Dr. she can't travel or leave town for extended periods of time.
She is very smart, very nerdy, very practical, very down to earth. Maybe she played a few games early on but ever since we got through the initial stages she hasn't waivered. She will text me in the mornings, she texts me good night, and if I text her and she can't respond right away she apologizes when she responds later.
She appears to be in it for the long haul. Has told me more than once that she really, really likes me, thinks that I am keeper, etc.
Well, as several of us ladies have tried to tell you all before, not all women are game players. Looks like you are finally dealing with one who isn't, so maybe you'll believe us when we say it from now on.
Seriously, I hope it all works out the way you both want it to.
Give me the average looking guy with the great personality ANY day over the one who is "pretty" to look at, but is a douche.
Amen!
That being said - it IS a little different dating as an adult after a long marriage. I've had guys I had crushes on who weren't really available (the Love Avoidant ones). I've had guys who were available but not totally my cup of tea (in retrospect, while there were enough good things about my relationship with crazy exBF, I can see that I was just settling there and probably shouldn't have).
The thing is, at my point in life, I don't expect any one person to be everything I want and I don't NEED them to be everything. In fact, I don't NEED them at all. I WANT someone in my life but don't experience that need like I did in my 20's, and I know if I miss that bus another one will come along in 20 minutes.
So what do I want in a relationship? Sexual desire is pretty important. Intellectual companionship. Common values. Can I find the best of all three in one person - probably not. Best two out of three is sufficient I think.
Funny thing is I didn't think I wasn't available until I realized this had the potential for something more. When I realized that I then realized that whoa I might not be ready for all this.
I can see now how sensitive post D relationships are and it appears that all the stars need to be aligned in order to work.
I don't want to be Love Avoidant but it definitely has been a process to work through. All things considered (most of which are my emotions) the Dr. is a catch and I have been very blessed to have crossed her path.
I’m glad I was able to word it in a way that would get through. We are adults now. Life is a heck of a lot different now.
Sure, back in the day You wanted the hottest chick on your arm. You wanted that feeling of wanting to be together all the time. That’s who and infatuation which teens and 20 somethings have .
Now you are a dad! You have a college education and a career, and two beautiful daughter, a house, and interests that have developed over the years. Your needs and wants in life in general now are way different than way back when. So your needs and wants in life and relationships should have evolved too.
Outter beauty fades for both sexes. I’ve seen way too many naked old people in my time. Trust me, none of hay stuff matters if you want the long haul. The person who is considerate, loving, will care for you as you care for them, who you like to spend time with, and also spend time apart with, who treats your kids with love, has respect for you...... all that is what matters in the end.
Granted, you are still only 3 months in! You are not committed for life. Things might not work out. But they are working out now and you can water the relationship as you go along. But you do recognize she makes a good partner. You guys have lots of sex and you are attracted to her. She may not be a party girl, but what the heck are you going to do with a party girl at 45? We have those 45 year old single party girls around here who dress up like 20 year olds with their overly tanned boobs exposed except the nipples , and act that way, and they aren’t exactly picking up the quality ( very jersey housewife around here) what are you going to do with that? She likes to have fun with you, she doesn’t just hide in her house all the time.
Time to change perspective. It really is a matter of perspective. If you aren’t ready to be in a relationship, I don’t judge that. But when you are, I would rethink what kind of woman you want as a life partner.
Also? What makes her so “nerdy”? She’s smart? She likes science? I’m curious. I haven’t heard anyone use that term in a while and I still don’t even know what that encompasses
Well I don't know if I was really 100% ready for a R but I would be very stupid to walk away from her. I am getting there but it's just taking me some time. She wants to make my oldest D a Llama cake for her birthday. That's my oldest's favorite animal.
Actually she is a self described nerd. To me she is kind of nerdy because she doesn't like sports, likes to read Harry Potter books, is a word smith, and is very formal in the way she talks. She is just so insanely intelligent and independent. I often wonder what in the heck see she in me
That said it is still so very early and anything can happen, change, etc. As I start to warm up more to her she could move in the opposite direction so I just need to be aware. This is her longest post D relationship so as things continue to progress she could freak out as well.
She is just so insanely intelligent and independent. I often wonder what in the heck see she in me smile
Insanely intelligent independent women can have a hard time with men. Many men unfortunately cannot cope with a woman who might be smarter than them. My ex had an issue with this, even though he was a famous surgeon in his field. He knew that I did better than he did on standardized exams when we were in medical school. I personally never thought of myself as smarter than him - I was better at some things, he was better at other things. We just had DIFFERENT types of intelligence. But he always had a little bit of a chip on his shoulder about it (and is now married to a much younger woman who acts like a little girl).
So long as you are secure in yourself and not threatened by her type of intelligence you will do fine with her. Remember there are many types of intelligence and you are likely better at certain things than she is.
J9 - I'm going to ask you a really tough question and you perhaps may not know the answer.
Will you be ready for a relationship with the Dr within the next couple of months?
I read a lot of doubt and second guessing going on which is perfectly understandable. I have similar struggles that I'm going through myself.
In a few ways it seems like your biggest issues with the Dr are that she's not like your XW. She's not likely to change either. How well do you feel that you know her so far? You talk about how your mother likes her (have they met?), how she would be good for your girls, but how about you? Is she good for
you? I binge-watched Tidying Up recently - does she
Spark Joy. There's a scene in an earlier episode where you take an object and hold it tight and decide on how it makes you feel.
The other part of this is that you seem to have been expecting a fair period of hedonism and gettin' your smooth on. As if you've gotten on the train and unexpectedly got on the express and arrived far earlier than expected without multiple passes of the tea trolley (Harry Potter reference
) Do
you know what it is that you are looking for in a relationship beyond blond hair and fake boobs? Hair can fall out and boobs deflate.
You're not too late to change trains if that's what you need to do. And just because you are pretty happy with what you found doesn't mean that there's not other women out there at some future date if you're not ready.
Anyway - just something perhaps for you to think about like I am myself.
Hi A....yes I will be. A huge weight has been lifted off my shoulders now that I know I am not supposed to feel all spun up and have that feeling of needing to see her every day, etc. I was concerned that because I didnt feel that way that something was wrong with me or the R. The dr. checks off a lot of my boxes, prob the only one is not being blonde
I have felt myself moving closer to her over the last couple of days, being excited to see her. When I am with her I feel very relaxed and happy.
My mom has not met her, she just likes the algorithm.
I am obviously still getting to know her and I realize this. It's by no means a done deal like you suggested A but I am getting excited to see where happens and obviously she could pull the plug as well.
So I am assuming I have earned myself an invite to the wedding?
And I can attest to what Andrew said. Boobs sure do deflate .
Lol...as long as you bring a gift. You have no idea I feel all the pressure has lifted.
Lol...as long as you bring a gift. You have no idea I feel all the pressure has lifted.
I am happy I could help.
And I only bring gifts if there is open bar
Why don’t you just ask her to dye her hair blonde lol?
Lol L.....well she just left my house and I thought about suggesting but decided it probably wasnt in my best interest.
It is actually really crazy to be with someone that enjoys sex and gets pleasure from it. I will see her again on Sunday night.
On a side note I will be spending Easter with my girls, my xw and our family friends. This will be the first time we have been together as a family, with mutual friends, in a large group setting like this. Outside of our kids birthdays. I feel good about it and think I have healed enough and moved on that it wont be impactful emotionally. Not sure if her boyfriend will be there or not but I think I will be ok. If I get there and think I bit off more than I can chew I will just leave
They are having a big Easter egg hunt and brunch. The more I thought about it I just didnt want to miss spending time with friends and my girls.
The first family encounter I had with XH after our D was final was nearly a year after the D at our grandkid's birthday party. It was hard, but I got through it and I know you will too. If it is any comfort, it does get easier. The first one was definitely the hardest. I think it is great that you are putting the girls first and not missing out on this fun activity with them. I know your kids are still young, but I don't think we can ever underestimate the influence we have on kids and seeing you and their mom behave like mature adults and come together for their sake will go along way to making sure your girls have a solid foundation for good relationships later.