Rough Start, New Day - DivorceBusting.com

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New day, New attitude.

My complete and total breakdown last night was obviously necessary. I went to sleep, and for the first time in weeks, slept.

I woke up this morning to go for my walk (yeah, me! For the first time went over 2 miles without stopping!!!) and cried like a baby during much of it.

I was crying because for the first time, I realized just how weak H is. He wasn't there for me emotionally when I needed him to be. He chose to get angry with me instead. Instead of working to hold our family together and make a better marriage, he chose to walk away. Instead of admitting to any of his faults, he chose to blame the reasons for D on me to the children.

Weak, weak, weak! He used to be a man of good character, now he's a bully and a weakling. Again, he CHOSE to do this, so he could be free to play with his "friends". He is unwilling to even meet me part of the way, not even for the benefit of our children.

I've clearly shown my willingness to make changes. He's clearly shown he lacks the fiber to do it.

I think this is what last night had to have been about. I needed to break, so that I could be made stronger. Funny thing is, I'm not even mad...just heartbroken and tired.

I'll let him know if he's willing to grow up and be a man, we can start with counseling. If not, he's talking to my lawyer. I deserve and will insist on something better than this.

Thank you, friends, for helping me get this far. You were clearly part of a larger plan, and I am so thankful for you all.

Judy, I am so sorry to hear about these difficult conversations with your children.

A couple of suggestions - I would (maybe sit them down together so you don't have to do this 5 times) tell them that nobody except the two parties to a relationship can fully know what goes on. That both you and H have made mistakes, but one person is not to blame and they should not takes sides against him or against you, but leave the two of you to sort it out. And be the adult and reassure them that you will never feel differently about them, your mother-child relationship will not change.

And I would talk to H and ask him to not talk to the kids about this situation, as they are going through a painful time as well and are not his friends or peers, but children (even if they are older) who should be protected against this pain.

Judy, it's wonderful when you finally sleep! Good for you on the walk. I have been getting more active also. I does help.

I can really identify with what you are saying. My H chose to "fall out of love with me" instead of fighting for our marriage. He chose to open himself up to OW. He is willing choosing a sinful path. He was not willing or able to make any changes. He was completely done with the marriage before I even new he had doubts. And there in nothing I can do about it except move on.

Judy, I am with you 100%, my husband is extremely weak too. He left me on the day that my children lost their 13 year old friend and neighbor, while my 13D was on the floor hysterical crying about this and my 11S was not crying but "confused" and suffering because this girl was one of his good friend's sister. He called me downstairs from where I was comforting my children because their friend died THAT day, within a few hours, and told me "I hate you I am leaving." I had to have that conversation with him and then go upstairs and continue to comfort my children.

The very definition of weakness.

But let me give you a word of advice. If you tell him to "be a man" it will NOT go over well. It will have the exact opposite effect that you want and will cause him to lash out in anger and be an even bigger jerk. Men can NOT handle being told to be a man.

You need to find a better way to tell him, through your actions, be a strong woman, and don't put up with BS from him. You need to just be "a man" yourself and choose words that will not destroy him.

Although, yes, I agree with you, he needs to man up. You can tell us that, but not him.

Originally Posted By: JudyL

I'll let him know if he's willing to grow up and be a man, we can start with counseling. If not, he's talking to my lawyer. I deserve and will insist on something better than this.

You can say the bolded, but Im pretty sure it will be a waste of your breath.

Also, great job with walking! I am up to 3 miles a day now and trying to increase my speed. Its hard to do because I walk with friends and run my mouth off, so I need to STFU on my walks and try to increase my speed. It feels good, doesn't it?

Walking is keeping me sane...I remember when 1/4 mile was a struggle.

Understood on the telling him to be a man. I know I will be much more kind than that. Just kind of venting here. Not even sure when this conversation is taking place...just know I'm fine.

No more laundry, food, space in MY bathroom...all done.

I wonder if my sadness for the loss of my dreams is going to be longer and harder to work through than the loss of M. I realize today I'm reeling more from disappointment more than I ever did for BD/betrayal.

It's such a bitter truth that one person's selfishness cost our entire family the loss of shared holidays, family reunions, and our family's future together.

I have to start with nothing...at my age! Maybe I am beginning to hate. Need to do some heavy praying...

Hey JudyL, yes I agree a bitter truth of ones selfish behavior can cost so much. But they will never see it that way. In their mind, they are doing what is best for everyone.. So illogical.

I have been going through this for a little over a year and it is barely starting to really crumble but I had to make that choice since I was literally hanging by a thread.

I also continue to pray to keep them away from me as it still brings so much pain and jealousy on my part along with anxiety, I run into W too often...

I have H in the house nearly every day. He works from home. I'm okay with that for now, but as my disappointment builds...not sure how long I can keep this up.

He's going to be one unhappy person tomorrow. I was letting him use the master bath...decided I'm done with that. He can share if he wants to be married...otherwise, he can use kid's bathroom.

Wish me luck!

you wont need luck.

just privacy.

if you want to rehearse we are here.

V

Love you, V! You are such an encouragement.

I think I've got this. I'm becoming more detached every hour. Since I realized how very weak he is in character, my feelings have been less conflicted and less intense. I feel sorry for him more than anything now. I'm moving forward, and he's moving backward. He could have been great, and may be one day. But as long as he is where he is now, he'll be there without me.

Good job Judy, you can do this! You are a great person, and deserve to be treated that way

Treated great, that is... sorry if you took it any other way.

Originally Posted By: dday

Treated great, that is... sorry if you took it any other way.

LOL D! I know you would never be mean to me.

Thanks for the support.

Judy,

You are correct. He is weak. You are strong. You deserve better. Maybe one day our Hs will see that, but maybe not. I totally understand how you feel about having to start all over at our age. How disappointing it is that they are choosing to start over instead of choosing to fight to keep their families together.

I believe in my H's case, he has refused for a long time to take care of a depression problem. I think it's difficult to admit that you are depressed. It takes great strength and courage to ask for help. So instead he blames everyone and everything else. It's too difficult to look inward. I think it's fear of what they may find.

Happy you are doing better. Keep exercising and praying.

{{{hugs}}}

Gr8ful

Judy - you r not starting with nothing u have your beautiful children!!!! That is my comfort all 5 of my children know my commitment and love and loyalty and they love and respect me for that. Their dad ? Not so much.

Gr8ful - I think that may be the case with my H too, but because he masks it so well (always the up party guy) not even he would consider that he is depressed

My kids are under their father's spell at the moment. Just have to wait it out. I did more damage trying to tell my side. Keeping my mouth shut for now and just letting it play out.

If you were enthralled to WH, then the kids likely so. Each will need their own spell break. However as the first stander you stand alone to the bullies might.

Have you seen the film The Dead Poets Society and the "O captain, my captain" moment (Alt Whitmans ode to Abe Lncoln) as the kids stand on the desks to support the Robin Williams character as a sacked teacher?

Recommended if you can. I am minded of this.

V

Judy, you are going to be ok. Your kids will come around in their own time. '

Oh, wow, V! That is such a good point. Enthralled is absolutely correct.w

Thanks, Photo...I really do believe I will be ok.

That said, I've made a decision that is going to rock HIS world for a change. I've said before, he has controlled every aspect of my life for years. The one I'm getting most tired of at the moment is having to beg for money. It is humiliating to be questioned about how much and why.

I'm throwing off the chains he uses to control me. I'm not asking to hurry up the divorce, but I am going to take care of myself with the help of my lawyer.

I've made an appointment on Tuesday to set up formal temporary spousal support. V said something last week about if he does get laid off, he will receive a severance package. I started thinking...left up to him, I would not see a penny. I believe I am entitled, by law, to a good portion of that.

He will be furious. I do not care. Well, I am a bit scared, but I'm coming out from under his thumb. I still would prefer MC over D, but I'm not willing to accept the status quo any longer.

Now, I just need to keep my mouth shut.

I'm just trying to catch up on your thread now. V mentioned that I might want to chime in. Your sitch seems very similar to mine and I think you are doing a great job. But remember to be careful. Men like this don't like when they feel that they are losing control and it could get ugly. My H had me removed from the home by coming up with a bogus order of protection, that quickly turned into a separation agreement under the guise of an order of protection. He did this when I decided to reclaim my home by not hiding in my bedroom to avoid him anymore. He played the game dirty and smart and had been recording every conversation we had. He would instigate conversations that he knew would make me defensive, and when I started ranting about the topic he would say "you are harassing me." "You are cornering me (even when I wasn't)" "You are following me". Every time we have to appear in court for it the date gets pushed off. The way it stands now it really is more of a separation agreement, but it is against me--so if I violate it I could be arrested, whereas if he does it is just a ding in a divorce case. Very unfair, dirty, nasty, and honestly I have lost all respect for a man who used to be full of integrity and kindness (or so I believed).

It was a terrifying experience and one that still has me reeling--even though I think in some ways it was very good for me. He looks like the DBag that he is, and it forced me to get the distance that I really needed. Also, having to leave with only things I could gather up in 15 minutes while officers escorted me through my home made me reevaluate the things that really matter--I am not the one stuck sorting through the physical baggage we have collected, I am the one asking for only the things I truly value.

However, it is far from an ideal situation. So definitely make sure you have an attorney that has your back. And don't be afraid to protect yourself. If you ever feel he is bullying you in anyway, don't hesitate to get your own order. Especially if he is threatening you.

I am now rebuilding, and it is a very cathartic, yet humbling experience.

Remember DB is for you. I sense that you understand that, but I reiterate it because sometimes we slip. Sometimes we are DBing so well that our WAS start to take notice and start to come back, and it is easy then to believe that we are on the right track to saving our marriage. When that happens it is really important to stop, and remember we are DBing to save ourselves. There have been many times when my DBing was effective to the point of H telling me he loves me and wants to fix our marriage, only to run away again the second I start to let my guard down. Each time he acted more cruel that the last. It is a power trip. I realize that now.

Your marriage is over. A new one (with him or with someone else is possible) but this marriage is OVER so reclaim your own life. Don't let him back in. When he really, really wants to be back in he will be the one doing all the work. And who knows, at that time maybe you won't even want him anymore. That's where you need to be. Keep the focus on YOU, not on your marriage, and definitely not on him or OW.

Oh, my. Thanks for the warning. I've been e-mailing my attorney quite a bit, and she's already brought up the issue of an OoP. I dismissed the very idea, but I could tell she hasn't. I wonder how many awful things these poor family lawyers see?

I really believe I have a great lawyer. She's been nothing but supportive, and I haven't even officially hired her yet!

I appreciate, more than you know, you chiming in. I'm learning and growing so much, and it's truly thanks to the good people I've met here. I'm honestly terrified...but I'm determined. I will do what my attorney recommends. She's obviously seen it all before.

I feel badly for H. I truly believe this is part of MLC. He is such a different, almost opposite, man from the sweet, kind man I married. I hope the "real" H returns one day. I really miss him.

Hi Judy,

Thanks for stopping in my thread. You have only been here for a month and made more progress than I have made in a year. Kudos to you. You are empowering yourself, and protecting yourself. You deserve the best. I just wanted to offer you encouragement.

Best,

RAI

Make sure you have a recorder app on your phone and evicted and computer.

Be safe, and prepared. If not needed, no harm no foul.

V

Tonight? Just awful. There I was thinking I'm well on my way to detachment...I allowed him to bait me into a furious argument about both MR and OW!!!

So many awful things were said...I have no hope we will ever come back from this. I'm not as broken as I've been before...just really, really sad.

I did have just a smidgen of hope that one day it would be ok. Now? Feeling pretty hopeless...

One event matters so little in the grand scheme of things. Learn from it and keep moving forward, Judy!

Learning...but I think I'm learning to HATE him. He kept trying to convince me his skank didn't break up our marriage, me and all my failings as a human caused it.

Now, I know it's just part of the script; but, I have to confess it got to me. He's known me for 21 years. He knows how to get me where it hurts.

Unfortunately, it's easy for them to get us if they try. That's why there's no good that can come from these discussions or arguments. All it does is cause pain in us and they walk away thinking were the bad guy.

Like I said, a lesson for next time.

I tipped my hand during the argument, darn it. All the incriminating evidence has been taken off Facebook before I had the chance to hit print screen!

Will it make a difference, do you think?

JudyL,

Hi, I'm am sorry that you are experiencing this. As a matter of fact I am sorry that anyone here is. I am in no position to give advice, but I do want to be able to uplift by sharing with you and everyone here.

Today I was driving to work and I was listening to one of my AM Stations.

Have you ever felt when going through rough times that God is speaking to you? It happens to me a lot when in troubled times.

Well, today listening to the radio station, a woman being interviewed was speaking on her breakthrough. The Pastor asked her:

"Do you believe that "God" took that dead man out of the ground and raised him to life so that he can save you?"

"You think God can take a dead man raise him to life again to save you, but you don't think God can save your marriage?"

Everything is possible if God is in it!

JudyL, If you can't love yourself how can you love somebody else?

The biggest Hugs from me to you right now.

Thank you, Strongr. I really needed that tonight. I'm reacting very emotionally and need to stop.

I've done some awful things tonight I'm going to regret in the morning.

I removed him from my Amazon Prime account. He asked why and I told him I did it so that he couldn't buy his skank gifts on our family account.

I made a post on Facebook about Midlife Crisis and Affair Downs, but deleted it right away...I thought.

2 hours later one of the kids contacted me to take it down. It was up for 2 hours!!!

Clearly, I need to stop, pray, and breathe.

Judy,

It will be okay. A good lesson in STFU and not allowing him to bait you into a fight. It takes some time, but You will start to notice the signs of when he is baiting you for a fight. There is still hope. As Azzork said, it's only one incident. But you must not fight with him. It will give him more justification for his terrible actions and why he is asking for a divorce. Do NOT give that to him.

Next time he baits you, walk out of the room and take a walk.

Sorry you had a bad evening.

{{hugs}}

Gr8ful

He's already filed for D. I told him tonight I was not lifting one finger to help him. If he wants to D, he will go through my lawyer. He's madder than a hornet right now.

Originally Posted By: JudyL

I tipped my hand during the argument, darn it. All the incriminating evidence has been taken off Facebook before I had the chance to hit print screen!

Will it make a difference, do you think?

He tipped his hand too, by telling you he had filed. I for one am glad you stood your ground, maybe not in quite the full on way you did, but hey I will encourage what I see that's positive for you.

I am not negative about a screaming banshee experience, for me there was enormous growth in it. In learning to manage that aspect of my behaviour and atoning.Your screaming banshee is protecting you, learn from it.

You know that it makes a difference, to stick up for yourself? So does he now, good for you.

It's further shift , to be angry and fight back. Use that anger to move forwards.

Yes, it makes a difference. Has the skank (she now has a name) taken down her FB stuff? And he won't be in charge of other posters, go seek out evidence if you can find some. Especially if you can get hold of his phone bills and/or emails. You are looking for Intel. I have witness statements too.

Did you record your discussion/disagreement?

V

Vanilla-He caught me by surprise. I did not record the argument. I think this will be the last time he is able to manipulate me, though. I caught on towards the end and called him on it.

Skank has disabled her Facebook, too. I don't think they realize that disabling both accounts at the same time is incriminating as heck. I believe the biggest thing I have is the forwarded e-mails, which my attorney already has. If it gets nasty, I think a computer forensics person can pull all that stuff back out anyways.

During the text war, I made a statement. I said do you really think it didn't occur to me to hit print screen? Totally bluffing, but H doesn't know that. It took him a bit, but he finally caught on.

I would have thought since he was throwing me away, it would not matter one way or the other if he lost control of me...you were right, I was mistaken. Turns out my sudden show of spine is ruining his life. I had a talk with my sons tonight...unpleasant, but necessary. They won't be leaving me alone in the house anymore with him.

He threatened to throw my (ahem) out in the street. I laughed in his face and said attorney will answer with a restraining order, go ahead. He really, really wanted to harm me, I could see it. I told him he could have been great, too bad...

I changed all my passwords on everything I could think of, including the bank. That's going to drive him insane. I didn't tell him I have an appt with L on Tuesday, thank goodness. I'm saving that for a nasty surprise of my own.

I prayed for a long time tonight. I gave H over to God. I realize I cannot help him. He is lost and broken right now. I'm on a new path. No more fighting...just walking away. Maybe he will come around, maybe not.

I'm sure there will be more yet to come. I'm already tired of it all. God willing, I will keep my cool from now on.

Ooooooh, I think I see spunk rising up!

Hi judy... hugs to you tonight... say a prayer it will help you.

Originally Posted By: sandi2

Ooooooh, I think I see spunk rising up!

Yes, a bit. I'm not buying into his delusion that he was forced to leave me because I'm a terrible person. I didn't make the choice to find someone else, end a marriage, and destroy a family. He did.

I'm not going to help him in any way at all. I'm going through the attorney. I'd love to see him try and bully her. I'm ready for this all to be over, so that I can heal.

I feel a bit more detached, kind of numb...

I think that's a good thing.

Originally Posted By: overcom

Hi judy... hugs to you tonight... say a prayer it will help you.

Thanks, O! I've prayed quite a bit after I calmed down. I'm feeling better, calmer...

Judy remember you are the prize. ♡

I read this as part of my affirmations and prayers this morning, this is my current praye r book, and I open at random.

It's from a book my orange wed friend gave me "how to be normal" a guide for the perplexed by Guy Browning. She says my writing is like his, I was soooooo flattered, he is so witty in an English way.

I wanted to share as this struck me as apt for you too:

How to critique

If all the world's a stage, then there must be a hell of a lot of critics. Which means that every time you do or say anything in life, someone else is mentally composing scathing reviews, none of which you will ever read. The only two exceptions are the love letter and the P45, which are the two sincerest forms of criticism.

In life the ratio of people criticing to people actually doing something is generally around ten to one. Many people see themselves as life management consultants; they are always available to tell you how to do anything better than you are currently doing it. Often they are so busy with consultancy work that they don't have any time to do anything constructive themselves.

They say you shouldn't throw stones if you live in a glass house. But often the only way you find out that you are in a glass house is to throw stones and hear that shattering noise. That's the beginning of self knowledge and the continual learning mechanism in any relationship.

Similarly it is said " let he without sin cast the first stone' That is a wonderful thought but would mean saints would hold back from criticing virtual nazis. Sometimes you have just got to put the pot blacking and glass avoiding on one side and let rip with both barrels. If you are still worried about criticing other people with a bit of mud-slinging, look on it as fertiliser for their personal growth.

Verbal critique comes in two flavours, with and without comma. "you have cut the grass short" and "you have cut the grass short, you b****** idiot". The first is for discussion, the second the high road to violence.

Giving criticism is almost as difficult as taking criticism. If you have the confidence to pull it off, be harsh but fair. Harsh and unfair will just upset people, whereas fun and fair comes across less as criticism and more as funfair.

Well delivered criticism works on the basis that the offender (don't call them the offender obviously) has the very best of intentions but their chosen actions delivered precisely the opposite of the desired effect. If only the offender would change his actions, then everyone old achieve a higher and simultaneously deeper level of happiness and he would be able to avoid being such a b******** idiot.

It spoke to me today.

If you haven't read ..., my reading book for this weekend. I have read this book about 6 times. When I was being abused, having the dark days, this book gave me 'spunk' as incidentally did Sandi.

If you are reading Sandi thank you, I have a votive with your name and prayers for your H and D.

For non UK world citizens P45 is given to you when your employer says go away, don't work here any more.

V

Originally Posted By: Vanilla

Well delivered criticism works on the basis that the offender (don't call them the offender obviously)
V

Vanilla - That was perfect! Thank you for sharing.

The reason I quoted the above, is because that little bit cracked me up! I am now going to look at H and think of him as "the offender". Totally makes me smile!

The Offender and the skank...sounds like a B movie, don't you think?

LOL

Wow. What a difference a good night's sleep can make!

I feel so much stronger today. I've come to several realizations and have started to make some decisions.

I've realized that MLC crisis or not, H is wayward. As long as he is involved with OW, there is nothing for me to do in regards to him. I'm better off stepping away, leaving him to God, and moving on with my life. I believe this is what everyone means by detachment. I thought I understood, but didn't really grasp it until now.

I control nothing in regards to him. I've realized just how very much I've allowed him to control and manipulate me. I'm taking my life back...I've already put the steps in play, although I wasn't aware of the significance while I was doing it.

Once I get the financials set up, I am putting some belongings in storage and taking a bit of a personal break. I will focus on healing: health, mental, and emotional. I'm going to train to be a court reporter during that time as well. I may take a course to work as a Phlebotomist (6 week training) during this time, so I can work part-time and still be able to have plenty of time for physical training and career training. I could do administrative work, but it bores me to death. Something new is called for.

I want to be in a coastal area...strongly drawn to Washinton state. California would be my 1st choice, but who can afford to live there?

I'll miss my kids, but with their current state of enthrallment to H, some space might be best. We can heal our R' s over the phone when they come to realize what really happened. I'll keep in touch with them, for sure.

I'm cutting H out of all areas of my life for now. I hope and pray he comes back to reality one day. If he doesn't...sheesh! I'll be sad for him, for our family - but I will never allow myself to be in this position again.

Judy's growing up. Need to change my screen name. I don't want him to be able to find me until I'm ready.

So, just have to get things set up and let my lawyer handle him for now. I'm sure there will be more things happen between now and when I'm finally able to move, but I will do my best to grit my teeth, STFU, and get through it with dignity.

I've seen Skank. Affair Down is a very good way to describe her. Not my problem...he'll have his hands full getting rid of her. She's got that hard, bitter look to her.

I feel excited about my new adventure! A bit nervous, sure, but it feels "right". Must be my higher power, right?

Right on.

V

V - bought the book, .... I'm starting with the first one.

Had fantastic talks with both daughters today. Told them my plans. They are beginning to realize how many lies H has told.

All in all, a very good day.

I haven't read abandonment to healing, I will look it up.

Things will slowly change, your own bravery O Captain, My Captain will initiate new thoughts. Let it unfold in its own time.

Hugs

V

I got up this morning to two very angry teenagers. H had called them last night and told them his version of events. I'd told him I told the kids who skank was so that when he officially began dating her they would know she's been in the picture all along (that was during the blowout Fri night.) Now he's doing damage control. Admits to dating her, but not the timeline.

I realized he is relating to the teenagers on a peer to peer level. All the drama, poor me, etc. I was able to take a step back, let the boys know I understood why they felt the way they did (mad at me) and apologized for my part in their anger. Told them I loved them and always would.

I let them know part of my plans (keeping most secret from H) and that I loved their dad enough to want him to be happy, and that I was letting him go. I'm moving on.

Good news is they're not angry with me anymore. Bad news is I'm sitting here crying. H has done so much DAMAGE. I'm glad I already knew the conflict wasn't over yet...that helped. I'm really looking forward to having this part over with...and yet, even it takes time.

Tears are good, they are cleansing, a great release.

Cry away, let the tears fall, the lacrimal fluid is toxic, every tear wrings bitterness from the outside in. They are tears you need never cry again.

You handled your teenagers well.

Be aware WH will be steaming, great care needed, be safe, be very safe. I hope you recorded the convo.

V

I've got a question for those of you have forgiven an affair. I was thinking tonight about different outcomes and possibilities. What if H ever gets his head straight and wants to build something better?

I've seen his skank. Gross. I shuddered all over and thought "it would never work. There is no way I could ever let him touch me again after he's been with that.

I cannot be the only person whose spouse has gone for an affair down. How on earth do people get past that? I'm really curious, and would like to understand.

First,... is a deep & profound book that should be read at some point in one's life after they have enough life experience with difficulty but still have some time live life after having the opportunity to let it work on them.

On the can you get over it questions: yes, you can. I haven't had to deal w/ an A, but people do, just like they wonder if they can ever go back after they've sworn that there was no going back. Can you now? Of course not. Should you go back if you get the opportunity? Who knows. Should you hold out hope for your M? There is a difference between holding out hope and not slamming,locking, and barring the door shut. Can you just accept that you just can't know the future, but that you do know that what is healthy for you and your kids is to move ahead with your life & let your H deal with the mess he has made of his?

Your question is really asking whether you should hold out hope or move on, isn't it? We can't answer that for you. I suspect your gut is telling you later, but you have that little nagging doubt and want permission to move along. So, move along and let the future take care of itself. There are too many ifs there to worry about. If your H comes to his senses, if he really recognizes and acknowledges what he has done and the price you and the kids have paid, if he is willing to work on your R under whatever conditions you set, if he sticks to that, and if that is sufficient to regain trust, respect, affection, and love for him. Cheeseless tunnel in my opinion. Just make the best decision you can. If the future presents you with new information, evaluate it then.

In the meantime, give yourself permission to feel what you feel. The anger, disgust, hurt of betrayal and disrespect,etc. At some point, you'll want to let go of the anger, as it really is hurting you not him. But otherwise, you are showing yourself some self-care by recognizing that you are worth a whole lot more than he is valuing you for, and that your value has nothing to do with his actions and choices.

Wow, Asitis. You blew me away with that response. It was dead on.

I will follow your advice and leave it for another day. I will also take care not to permanently bar the door.

I feel good about my decisions, but now I'm as bad as H. I want it done now...lol

I miss the friend he used to be, you know? I could talk to him about anything. This loneliness is awful.

Wow judy I'm so.happy you are.moving on.. I need to.get my head straight too. I not letting him get to me anymore. I will continue to use you as my inspiration.
I've always wanted to go to school for court report but it's really expensive. So I'm just gonna stick to being a legal secretary for now. I wish I can move out of California I hate it here but my kids would hate me if I took them far from their dad. So I'm stuck here maybe amd definitely an idea to move further away but I'm not ready to go there just yet. I hate the loneliness too. He used to be my soul supporter in everything. You think you've seen ugly. Ha you haven't seen the ow my h is with....
ANYWAY WE ARE THE PRIZE. HUGS HUN

Thanks so much, Overcome. I'm doing the best I can.

Today I came to the realization I owe H an apology for mistakes I made early on. The apology is not for him, or in hopes of R. I just know I need to do it. I was overwrought, emotional, and did my fair share of damage right after BD.

I know who I am, and those actions do not reflect well on me at all. I'm not expecting much from him in return...but I need to do it for myself.

I'm tired of the drama. I'm not adding to it anymore.

Wish me luck, guys!

Great.

The apology went fine. Then I let him bait me into R talk, and ended with me lecturing him about Skank before I ended with "have a nice life."

Ugh. Not happy with myself right now.

This afternoon another talk. (This is Judy...Changed my screen name, Ancaire = Irish for Anchor.) Went a lot better. I told H some of my plans. He knows I'm leaving to take some time (6 mos to a year) to heal. He looked so sad. I told him I would be arranging temporary spousal support, but not D. If he wanted D, he'll have to handle through attorney. Told him I was in no shape to deal with any of it right now. We talked about possible MC in the future.

Not feeling very hopeful. He's involved with Skank right now. I told him we couldn't even work on anything as long as she is in the picture, and he's not even willing to meet me part way. Reiterated I want no part of old marriage. Not willing to settle. If we don't go to MC, we won't be together again.

All in all, I'm okay with it. I have no idea how people think I've come a long way. I can't get through a day without crying. I just know what I want and am willing to do what it takes to get there...with (hopefully) or without him. I want to be fine either way. He was once a good man. He could be again if he works at it.

I will never allow myself to be this hopeless and lost again. It's the worst feeling in the world.

So much to do now that I've made decisions. I want very little from the house, going to let kids get what they want and sell the rest...massive yard sale. I call it the house of broken dreams. Traveling light. :-)

Ancaire - see I found you!

You will get there, I promise. It takes a lot of self care along the way. I learned that right off the bat from my IC. I stayed in the marriage and 'the victim' after BD at my emotional expense. No more! I still cry and like Sunny said on my thread, it is ok to cry. We need to cry! The crying will get fewer and farther between and for shorter periods of time. I find that I only tear up now and can usually stop it before it gets to tears. Because I am awesome! I will be adored! If not by H then by a really, really, good man. You will too!

Thanks EP! I'm having to make decisions much faster than I'd prefer because lease is up on our house, price is going up, and H wants no part of me moving with him..lol

I would much rather have been in a position to take my time, but that's not what I got.

Since crying is so good for me, I'll just keep it going.

What I dislike most is breaking down when I'm out and about. Sobbing at a red light, sheesh! I must look insane.

You are doing amazing compared to day one you were on here. You have made great strides in a short amount if time. I bet you were crying non-stop back then and it is probably less than half that now. Maybe once or twice a day? Considering what you are going through, that is progress. Keep going!

BT- you know what? You're right. When I first came here I was a shell. All I wanted was to fix my marriage. Now, I don't want that anymore. I want a better one.

I found my spine, too. I'm doing just fine stating my position and sticking to it. I still can't stop crying during these conversations, but I don't bend.

I smile a lot. I reach out to others. I've made a plan for my immediate future that doesn't involve H.

I guess I am doing better. Just really lonely. Maybe that will pass, too.

You are doing sooooo better, not just better, you are doing great. It seems each day you make more progress than I have in a year

. Anyway I'm curious about new name choice, does it have any meaning??

Oops just read your post explaining new name. Anchor I love it!!

Originally Posted By: Ancaire

I guess I am doing better. Just really lonely. Maybe that will pass, too.

This will all pass. Its a question of what you and your life will look like when you emerge out the other side. We'll all get there - its just a matter of time.

Keep moving toward your goals and stay patient. Thats all you can do!

Ugh. I am so unhappy about something I would have been thrilled about a month ago.

Due to pressure from the children, H has suddenly and reluctantly decided to go to marital counseling. His attitude is awful, but I can hardly refuse to go. I owe it to the kid's efforts to get him to slow down and go to counselling before divorce to participate myself.

H is in full poor pity me mode. No remorse, no real interest, but I feel trapped into trying.

I suppose the worst that can happen is we'll get divorced...lol
It's just so ironic that I am underwhelmed. I would have been doing cartwheels last month.

Any advice?

Originally Posted By: Ancaire

Ugh. I am so unhappy about something I would have been thrilled about a month ago.

Due to pressure from the children, H has suddenly and reluctantly decided to go to marital counseling. His attitude is awful, but I can hardly refuse to go. I owe it to the kid's efforts to get him to slow down and go to counselling before divorce to participate myself.

H is in full poor pity me mode. No remorse, no real interest, but I feel trapped into trying.

I suppose the worst that can happen is we'll get divorced...lol
It's just so ironic that I am underwhelmed. I would have been doing cartwheels last month.

Any advice?

Well, that should be interesting. I think it is very important who you pick. There is a website dedicated to marriage friendly therapists. I also think that many will not take you on if there is an active A.

He may very well be giving it a go and not put in the effort, but to have the excuse that you tried everything.

Ancaire,

Michele has an excellent article regarding Choosing a Marital Therapist. It is here on her website so please read it.

"Make sure your therapist has received specific training and is experienced in marital therapy. Too often, therapists say they do couples therapy or marital therapy if they have two people sitting in the office. This is incorrect. Marital therapy requires very different skills than doing individual therapy. Individual therapists usually help people identify and process feelings. They assist them in achieving personal goals. "How do you feel about that,?" is their mantra."

Is your husband doing this just so he can check off a box to make the kids happy? Your being underwhelmed is good because you recognize that he is in victim mode.

Consider working with a DB Telephone Coach. Each of you would do a session individually before having one together. The advice you will receive will be invaluable.

Regards,
Cristy

Well, found a MC (pro-marriage) and set up for Retrouvaille in October. I'm sure I'll be checking in soon. Headed out of town to go to class to be able to draw blood.

Nice, right? Still doing my own thing.

My view is quite different An, until WH is willing to give up the skank, MC is just a manipulation, just to say, "you see I tried" or to arrange an easy let down for you.

I think MC will offer you false hope that WH will R.

If it were me then I would say "MC is appropriate if you have given up the skank for good, and you want an R with me, if not wait until you are ready to propose it"

Just my view

V

Btw love the new name

What did your kids to your H to convince him to go to MC ?

You're definitely not insane. You're in touch with your emotions and not afraid to let them out. I don't look like I would be found crying but I and have found myself many times crying while driving. I couldn't even wait for the stop light. I say let those tears flow just not in front of H.

I just though I would share my major collapse, this was 7 months in

Distraught Vanilla

V

Jpeg...they totally shamed him. Called him on the carpet for lying. Asked what kind of woman would be dating a married man. Said if she was in the picture, they wouldn't be. Reminded him about his former high standards and asked if he would be okay with THEM making those choices. Told him his behavior was disrespectful to everyone.

That's just what I know. My kids speak their minds. That's why I tattled on him...now I'm kind off wishing I hadn't...lol

He broke up with Skank today. It [censored] having to watch him be sad about it. He is being pretty open to suggestions...but I don't trust him. One day at a time.

Oh my goodness, V! That is awful! I can honestly tell you H didn't treat me like that. He did a lot of judging and let me know I could improve, whereupon I rebelled with passive aggressive tactics. He turned into the monster at BD. He's been upset today, but not mean.

I don't know what is going on. Will just have to wait and see.

Wow. Everything is moving so quickly for you. So many ups and downs and changes from day to day. I wish a nice peaceful vacation for you somewhere in the Caribbean.

Wow!!!!!! Great kids.

Vanilla, I read that thread and I am amazed at how you handled your very difficult situation. Your sense of humor remained intact and it seems like you had this amazing ability to truly detach and actually analyze your husband without letting emotions overrule your intellect. (I do like your screamin banshee analysis though) your a very strong woman, and this board is lucky to have you here.

Julie - I agree completely. I have situational whiplash! I cannot believe this drama. I'm boring. I like "normal". I must be in training for something coming up...the very idea scares me to death.

The next two days will be spent in accelerated, intensive training for phlebotomi. No fake arms...I'll be full of needle holes since students practice on each other. I'll come out with a National Certification, so can get the part-time job I've been planning right away.

I'm sticking with my plan. Just not getting to move to the beach yet. Will keep an eagle eye on H. I truly have found my spine again!

You guys would have been so proud of me this morning. He said he was ready to try counseling. I unenthusiastically asked why. He said after talking to the kids he'd reconsidered. I thought for a very long time. H was squirming. Then I said I would be willing to try, but H had to get rid of skank today. Non-negotiable. He said ok. He left to go take care of it a bit later. Honestly, that infuriated me. She got the news in person. I got an e-mail. Makes my blood boil.

I have this dread that they see themselves as Romeo and Juliet (Offendero and Skankiet.) That makes me the villain. Nice. Deep breaths. MLC. Resist the urge to claw out H' s eyes, choke him to death, and stomp on his remains....BREATHE!

I don't think he really knows how to deal with the new me. He's being respectful, asking permission, knocking on my door...crazy. Once I reached the point I didn't really care anymore and decided to get on with my life and let him catch up later, all our old relationship dynamics changed. This is very much in line with DB, but I'm surprised that it's not an intentional LRT. I really will be okay if it doesn't work out. He broke my heart and it changed me.

I'm getting good at catching him attempting to manipulate me or control me, and call him out on it immediately. I call BS when I know I'm being lied to. I warned him my head was clear and he'd best watch himself. He's beginning to understand what I meant.

In the meantime, I will have to constantly bite my tongue, sit on my hands, and watch my 50 year old teenager get over his break-up, listen to his poor pitiful me speeches while validating, and do my best to remember I actually loved this man once.

It will be worth it if I get the marriage I'm longing for. If not, we can be peaceful knowing that we actually tried. I'm dragging him to MC weekly, signing us up for every workshop I can afford, and we've already agreed to just talk for at least 30 minutes daily. I need to come up with conversation starters. No talking about R or OW without counselor.

Working on my goals daily. Journaling. Definitely so much stronger. Just working on me. I'm really beginning to enjoy it!

I adore Vanilla! We are lucky to have her. She helped open my eyes and gently pointed me in the right direction.

She's one of those people God uses.

How blessed we are.

Thank you, Vanilla. You helped change my life.

Yes your situation has moved fast and so did you. Taking on career training so quickly amidst This emotional roller coaster is pretty amazing. I hope you give yourself lots of credit. My situation is quite opposite as it is moving snails pace. I read your posts and there is constant change and action. I reread mine and recognize that it's pretty stagnant. This might be better for you, as limbo land is an awful place to be. You are moving on and making some very impressive changes,

I understand your anger, but sometimes anger is great energy and It sounds like your anger really helped drive you. Use it.

Good luck with your training. I think that your medical history will help you to empathize with and perhaps offer some comfort to patients that are coming in for bloodwork. A kind word from a busy health care worker can mean so much for people undergoing testing due to health issues. Sometimes I think the best way to deal with depression and sadness is by helping others. Having some financial independence will change dynamics as well.

Ancaire, sounds like you are doing very well. Stronger, healthier, and making positive changes. I am jealous that your H agreed to work on your M! Keep up the good work, it is definately worth it. I hope H has realized what he has done, and truly is ready to make amends.

Good luck! I wish you the best!

D...H very reluctantly agreed to counseling due to pressure from kids. I don't know how committed he is to working on M, if at all. I will be fine either way. I do not want old marriage back. I want something better. I'm unconvinced he's up to the task.

However, he is a grown man. I doubt he would have gone if he were not just a tiny bit confused. Don't get jealous yet...lol

I'm still faithfully applying DB techniques. Working on myself, 180's, LRT, being the best me I can. I'm doing things that work and dropping things that don't. If it doesn't work out, I believe the journey has been worthwhile. I'd lost myself in the old M. Now I remember who I am. I want to be loved and appreciated, and won't settle for less.

I'll keep updating. Still out of town. One more intensive day of training. Who will let me stick them? I need practice...willing to travel.

Ancaire, I am jealous of you too. You are making tons of moves and improvements. You are a great strong person, and a model for the rest of us. I truly mean that. Keep up the good work, and show the rest of us the way!

Good luck, and wishing you the best!

I have news...Guess who has her National Certification for Phlebotomi?

Think I did well on the test...scored 107. Missed one answer, but got the bonus.

So, I'm now an official bloodletter!!! (Phlebotomist)

Job hunting starts Monday at the latest. Staying tonight in the hotel and relaxing.

I am so excited. You were my first stop with the news. You all helped get me here.

Originally Posted By: dday

Ancaire, I am jealous of you too. You are making tons of moves and improvements. You are a great strong person, and a model for the rest of us. I truly mean that. Keep up the good work, and show the rest of us the way!

Good luck, and wishing you the best!

Wow! Thanks, D! I'll keep sharing. It helps keep me focused, too. Besides that, I'm pretty attached to my friends on this board. I am beyond blessed with the friendship and support I've found here.

Bumping so I can brag...I'm kind of proud of me!

Awesome news Ancaire, keep up the positive changes!

Omg yayyyy congrats. If we lived closer I'd take you out for drinks. Huggggssss

Good for you!

Ancaire, congratulations on reach in your goal and getting certified. Taking the extra energy we have and using it to improve ourselves is always good thing. Thank you again for your support yesterday. Be well

I have to leave the hotel today and go home. H is living there again. I think it's pretty hilarious I'm dragging my feet this morning!

Guess I'd better jump in the shower and face my own issues...lol

Originally Posted By: Ancaire

I have news...Guess who has her National Certification for Phlebotomi?

Think I did well on the test...scored 107. Missed one answer, but got the bonus.

So, I'm now an official bloodletter!!! (Phlebotomist)

Job hunting starts Monday at the latest. Staying tonight in the hotel and relaxing.

I am so excited. You were my first stop with the news. You all helped get me here.

Excellent!! Congrats on your accomplishment.

Congratulations on your achievement.

Now you are trained in blood letting, are you going to practice on your H when you get a chance? >:->

I am reading a book currently and one of the things it recommends is a for a healthy relationship you should have a really good argument every once in a while. We are all so conditioned that showing anger is week that we bottle stuff up and keep ourselves under control, when a really good rant at one another can clear so much air as it's a time when issues get aired rather than stored up and aggregated.

I can't help but wonder if your recent arguments have cleared out a lot of the pent-up-ness in your R...

Not saying you are out of the woods just that a lot of the past is now done with and so moving forward to a new R is potentially that bit easier...

Congratulations on your certification! That is fantastic news. As for the MC, I am glad you are being cautious about it, and expecting to get yourself to a better place, with or without him. Don't stop DBing. That's where I went wrong. When he mentioned counseling and wanting to work it out I started pushing too hard. Of course, he still had his "very good friend" and a facebook account under a psuedonym. I wanted openness and everything out on the table right away, and he went running. This was coming from a man who came to me when I was ready to let go--telling me he wanted to fix us. You are probably even in a better place than I was because you know this wasn't his plan.

I am pulling for you and wish for the best for you and your marriage, but I do like to throw out the caution there, because I experienced how things can quickly fall apart once our guard is down.

Congratulations Ancaire! That is great news!

Really good points, MS and Avanti.

The calmer arguments have helped resolve some issues. I'm saving the really thorny stuff for MC. But, we have had far more dialog about R issues in the past two months than we ever did in the past 21 years. Your book may have a very good point!

MS, I absolutely will not stop being cautious! For one, there has been no apology - and he owes me one. I am nowhere near ready to trust him. I question his motivation, too.

I'm content to wait and see while I carry on with my life. As I say, the worst that can happen is we get divorced. I've already made plans for that. LOL

Of course, I hope for the best. I wouldn't be human if I didn't. I'm just not pinning anything to my hopes. One day at a time...

Keep it up Ancaire, sounds like you are headed the right direction, no matter H decisions!

Off to create a new thread!

Link to new thread

I recommended this series of threads

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2611982#Post2611982

V